k wrote:
I can't seem to find a consistent answer. I see so-called 'standard' bulb
bases called both E26 and E27, and I'd really like to know if they are one
and the same. The reason? I see fixtures advertised with one or the other
type socket. I have googled myself blue, and stood in the lighting dept at
Home Depot for half an hour on Sunday. Of course, the kid working lighting
that day had no clue.

Bulb packages say things like 'candelabra' base, or 'intermediate' base or
'standard' base, no E26 or E27. Yet, try to buy a fixture on Ebay, and it
will require either E26 or E27.

Which is it to be?

tia,
Keith



Wikipedia says that they are the same, it just depends on which side of
the pond you're on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incande...b#Screw_thread

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
The speed of light is 1.8*10^12 furlongs per fortnight.

I can't seem to find a consistent answer. I see so-called 'standard' bulb
bases called both E26 and E27, and I'd really like to know if they are one
and the same. The reason? I see fixtures advertised with one or the other
type socket. I have googled myself blue, and stood in the lighting dept at
Home Depot for half an hour on Sunday. Of course, the kid working lighting
that day had no clue.

Bulb packages say things like 'candelabra' base, or 'intermediate' base or
'standard' base, no E26 or E27. Yet, try to buy a fixture on Ebay, and it
will require either E26 or E27.

Which is it to be?

tia,
Keith

k wrote:

I can't seem to find a consistent answer. I see so-called 'standard' bulb
bases called both E26 and E27, and I'd really like to know if they are one
and the same. The reason? I see fixtures advertised with one or the other
type socket. I have googled myself blue, and stood in the lighting dept at
Home Depot for half an hour on Sunday. Of course, the kid working lighting
that day had no clue.

Bulb packages say things like 'candelabra' base, or 'intermediate' base or
'standard' base, no E26 or E27. Yet, try to buy a fixture on Ebay, and it
will require either E26 or E27.

Which is it to be?

tia,
Keith



I just reminded myself that when I first moved to Red Sox Nation in the
1950s I discovered that the "standard looking" incandescents used for
interior lighting in the subway cars had left handed threads.

DAMHIKT, but they were that way to discourage "bulb snatching".

And they still make them:

http://www.sunshinelighting.com/item-12530-3218.htm

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
The speed of light is 1.8*10^12 furlongs per fortnight.

"Jeff Wisnia" wrote in message
...
k wrote:
I can't seem to find a consistent answer. I see so-called 'standard'
bulb bases called both E26 and E27, and I'd really like to know if they
are one and the same. The reason? I see fixtures advertised with one or
the other type socket. I have googled myself blue, and stood in the
lighting dept at Home Depot for half an hour on Sunday. Of course, the
kid working lighting that day had no clue.

Bulb packages say things like 'candelabra' base, or 'intermediate' base
or 'standard' base, no E26 or E27. Yet, try to buy a fixture on Ebay,
and it will require either E26 or E27.

Which is it to be?

tia,
Keith

Wikipedia says that they are the same, it just depends on which side of
the pond you're on:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incande...b#Screw_thread

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
The speed of light is 1.8*10^12 furlongs per fortnight.


Wow, thanks Jeff. I can't tell you how much time I've wasted trying to find
that out. I don't yet have wikipedia in my mental list of info sources.

thanks

On Nov 13, 10:55 pm, "k" wrote:
I can't seem to find a consistent answer. I see so-called 'standard' bulb
bases called both E26 and E27, and I'd really like to know if they are one
and the same. The reason? I see fixtures advertised with one or the other
type socket. I have googled myself blue, and stood in the lighting dept at
Home Depot for half an hour on Sunday. Of course, the kid working lighting
that day had no clue.

Bulb packages say things like 'candelabra' base, or 'intermediate' base or
'standard' base, no E26 or E27. Yet, try to buy a fixture on Ebay, and it
will require either E26 or E27.

Which is it to be?

tia,
Keith

http://www.traderscity.com/board/pro...ving-cfl-9866/

go there and check out

it says e26/e27 that means the just are call'd diffrent in USA than
Europe...

had the same problem

replying to k, AMJAY wrote:
keithblakeslee wrote:

"Jeff Wisnia" wrote in message
...
Wow, thanks Jeff. I can't tell you how much time I've wasted trying to
find
that out. I don't yet have wikipedia in my mental list of info sources.
thanks



JEFF ,

E 26 AND E27 ARE INTERCHANGEABLE , ACTUALLY E26 AND E27 DENOTES DIAMETER
OF BULB FITTING THREAD AS 26 MM AND 27 MM RESPECTIVELY.

E26 BULB ARE USED IN US AND CANADA WHILE E27 ARE USED IN EUROPE.

HOPE I HAVE CLARIFIED.


AMJAY CHANA

--

In my experience, having lived in both Germany and the US, they are not the same. They are a millimeter different.

E27 bulbs (German) worked fine in our E26 (US) fixtures. But the reverse was not always true. I have a couple of German lamps that do not reliably turn on with a US bulb. Sometimes US bulbs fit, sometimes not. The manufacturing variation is apparently enough to allow some but not all US E26 bulbs to work in E27 fixtures. I do not recall ever having an E27 bulb not work in an E26 fixture.

Yes, I know bulb is an incorrect term, but I stayed with the terms of this thread.

And yes, I know voltage is different, but that's easily solved.

On Tuesday, November 13, 2007 at 3:56:06 PM UTC-6, Jeff wrote:
k wrote:

I can't seem to find a consistent answer. I see so-called 'standard' bulb
bases called both E26 and E27, and I'd really like to know if they are one
and the same. The reason? I see fixtures advertised with one or the other
type socket. I have googled myself blue, and stood in the lighting dept at
Home Depot for half an hour on Sunday. Of course, the kid working lighting
that day had no clue.

Bulb packages say things like 'candelabra' base, or 'intermediate' base or
'standard' base, no E26 or E27. Yet, try to buy a fixture on Ebay, and it
will require either E26 or E27.

Which is it to be?

tia,
Keith



I just reminded myself that when I first moved to Red Sox Nation in the
1950s I discovered that the "standard looking" incandescents used for
interior lighting in the subway cars had left handed threads.

DAMHIKT, but they were that way to discourage "bulb snatching".

And they still make them:

http://www.sunshinelighting.com/item-12530-3218.htm

Jeff

--

I worked for a supply house that sold the left hand thread bulbs and the construction lights that are strung around work sites. The bulb cages used to be made from metal wire but I think most of them have plastic guards now. The idiot thieves who tried to steal the left hand thread bulbs started stealing the whole light strings. O_o

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster

On 7/1/2015 2:20 AM, Uncle Monster wrote:

I worked for a supply house that sold the left hand
thread bulbs and the construction lights that are strung
around work sites. The bulb cages used to be made from
metal wire but I think most of them have plastic guards
now. The idiot thieves who tried to steal the left hand
thread bulbs started stealing the whole light strings. O_o

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster


Years ago, I heard the left thread bulbs were
started in NYC subway. The loss of light bulbs
got expensive.

I'd guess the folks there stole the entire RR
cars, socket and bulb and all.

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
..
..

replying to Jeff Wisnia, Keith wrote:
jwisnia wrote:

Wikipedia says that they are the same, it just depends on which side of
the pond you're on:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incande...b#Screw_thread
Jeff


An E27 socket is probably rated for at least 220VAC that many countries
use and certainly would be adequate for the 110VAC in the US. E26 sockets
are rated for the lower 110VAC US standard. The diameters of the bulb
sockets are 26 and 27 millimeters (for E26 and E27) which are "close
enough for government work" (i.e. interchangeable).


--

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 10:44:07 PM UTC-6, Keith wrote:
replying to Jeff Wisnia, Keith wrote:
jwisnia wrote:

Wikipedia says that they are the same, it just depends on which side of
the pond you're on:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incande...b#Screw_thread
Jeff

An E27 socket is probably rated for at least 220VAC that many countries
use and certainly would be adequate for the 110VAC in the US. E26 sockets
are rated for the lower 110VAC US standard. The diameters of the bulb
sockets are 26 and 27 millimeters (for E26 and E27) which are "close
enough for government work" (i.e. interchangeable).
--

That's not the experience me and my brother had working on housing units that were built in Australia. American made light bulbs were so tight in the light sockets that we put some Noalox on the threads to get them to screw in. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 1:21:00 AM UTC-5, Uncle Monster wrote:
On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 10:44:07 PM UTC-6, Keith wrote:
replying to Jeff Wisnia, Keith wrote:
jwisnia wrote:

Wikipedia says that they are the same, it just depends on which side of
the pond you're on:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incande...b#Screw_thread
Jeff

An E27 socket is probably rated for at least 220VAC that many countries
use and certainly would be adequate for the 110VAC in the US. E26 sockets
are rated for the lower 110VAC US standard. The diameters of the bulb
sockets are 26 and 27 millimeters (for E26 and E27) which are "close
enough for government work" (i.e. interchangeable).
--

That's not the experience me and my brother had working on housing units that were built in Australia. American made light bulbs were so tight in the light sockets that we put some Noalox on the threads to get them to screw in. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster

And it's not the experience I had living in Germany, either. There is a difference, and sometimes a bulb will fit and sometimes it won't.

On Wed, 18 Nov 2015 22:20:56 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 10:44:07 PM UTC-6, Keith wrote:
replying to Jeff Wisnia, Keith wrote:
jwisnia wrote:

Wikipedia says that they are the same, it just depends on which side of
the pond you're on:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incande...b#Screw_thread
Jeff

An E27 socket is probably rated for at least 220VAC that many countries
use and certainly would be adequate for the 110VAC in the US. E26 sockets
are rated for the lower 110VAC US standard. The diameters of the bulb
sockets are 26 and 27 millimeters (for E26 and E27) which are "close
enough for government work" (i.e. interchangeable).
--

That's not the experience me and my brother had working on housing units that were built in Australia. American made light bulbs were so tight in the light sockets that we put some Noalox on the threads to get them to screw in. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster
That strikes me as rather strange, since American bulbs are E26
(small) and Euro bulbs are E27 (large). I could see you having trouble
putting E27 Euro 240 bulbs into American E26 sockets - THAT would make
sense. And those "american" bulbs would be 120 volts too.
An e26 bulb in an E27 socket should go in like butter - but once
tightened the threads could ride up a bit, making them a bit ornery
about coming back out.

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 5:38:30 PM UTC-5, wrote:
That's not the experience me and my brother had working on housing units that were built in Australia. American made light bulbs were so tight in the light sockets that we put some Noalox on the threads to get them to screw in. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster
That strikes me as rather strange, since American bulbs are E26
(small) and Euro bulbs are E27 (large). I could see you having trouble
putting E27 Euro 240 bulbs into American E26 sockets - THAT would make
sense. And those "american" bulbs would be 120 volts too.
An e26 bulb in an E27 socket should go in like butter - but once
tightened the threads could ride up a bit, making them a bit ornery
about coming back out.

We took American E26 lamps to Germany and bought E27 German bulbs. The power was 240 and 50 Hz. The German bulbs worked fine in the lamps. Of course the plug needed an adapter but those were cheap.

We brought a German E27 lamp back and used it in the US with US E26 bulbs. I cut the plug off and put a US plug on. About half the US E26 bulbs won't work in the German lamp. But apparently there's enough manufacturing variability some of them will.

Here's a good graphic, ignore the text:
http://www.lampholder.net/support/la...6-and-E27.html

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 4:38:30 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Wed, 18 Nov 2015 22:20:56 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 10:44:07 PM UTC-6, Keith wrote:
replying to Jeff Wisnia, Keith wrote:
jwisnia wrote:

Wikipedia says that they are the same, it just depends on which side of
the pond you're on:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incande...b#Screw_thread
Jeff

An E27 socket is probably rated for at least 220VAC that many countries
use and certainly would be adequate for the 110VAC in the US. E26 sockets
are rated for the lower 110VAC US standard. The diameters of the bulb
sockets are 26 and 27 millimeters (for E26 and E27) which are "close
enough for government work" (i.e. interchangeable).
--

That's not the experience me and my brother had working on housing units that were built in Australia. American made light bulbs were so tight in the light sockets that we put some Noalox on the threads to get them to screw in. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster
That strikes me as rather strange, since American bulbs are E26
(small) and Euro bulbs are E27 (large). I could see you having trouble
putting E27 Euro 240 bulbs into American E26 sockets - THAT would make
sense. And those "american" bulbs would be 120 volts too.
An e26 bulb in an E27 socket should go in like butter - but once
tightened the threads could ride up a bit, making them a bit ornery
about coming back out.

It could have been a slight difference in the pitch of the threads? o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster

On Fri, 20 Nov 2015 05:18:10 -0800 (PST), TimR
wrote:

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 5:38:30 PM UTC-5, wrote:
That's not the experience me and my brother had working on housing units that were built in Australia. American made light bulbs were so tight in the light sockets that we put some Noalox on the threads to get them to screw in. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster
That strikes me as rather strange, since American bulbs are E26
(small) and Euro bulbs are E27 (large). I could see you having trouble
putting E27 Euro 240 bulbs into American E26 sockets - THAT would make
sense. And those "american" bulbs would be 120 volts too.
An e26 bulb in an E27 socket should go in like butter - but once
tightened the threads could ride up a bit, making them a bit ornery
about coming back out.

We took American E26 lamps to Germany and bought E27 German bulbs. The power was 240 and 50 Hz. The German bulbs worked fine in the lamps. Of course the plug needed an adapter but those were cheap.

We brought a German E27 lamp back and used it in the US with US E26 bulbs. I cut the plug off and put a US plug on. About half the US E26 bulbs won't work in the German lamp. But apparently there's enough manufacturing variability some of them will.

Here's a good graphic, ignore the text:
http://www.lampholder.net/support/la...6-and-E27.html
You need to remember there is basically no such thing as an
"american" bulb. They are just about all either Mexican, eastern
European or chinese.philipino/vietnamese etc - far east

On Fri, 20 Nov 2015 15:15:40 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 4:38:30 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Wed, 18 Nov 2015 22:20:56 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 10:44:07 PM UTC-6, Keith wrote:
replying to Jeff Wisnia, Keith wrote:
jwisnia wrote:

Wikipedia says that they are the same, it just depends on which side of
the pond you're on:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incande...b#Screw_thread
Jeff

An E27 socket is probably rated for at least 220VAC that many countries
use and certainly would be adequate for the 110VAC in the US. E26 sockets
are rated for the lower 110VAC US standard. The diameters of the bulb
sockets are 26 and 27 millimeters (for E26 and E27) which are "close
enough for government work" (i.e. interchangeable).
--

That's not the experience me and my brother had working on housing units that were built in Australia. American made light bulbs were so tight in the light sockets that we put some Noalox on the threads to get them to screw in. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster
That strikes me as rather strange, since American bulbs are E26
(small) and Euro bulbs are E27 (large). I could see you having trouble
putting E27 Euro 240 bulbs into American E26 sockets - THAT would make
sense. And those "american" bulbs would be 120 volts too.
An e26 bulb in an E27 socket should go in like butter - but once
tightened the threads could ride up a bit, making them a bit ornery
about coming back out.

It could have been a slight difference in the pitch of the threads? o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster
Pitch is the same.

On Friday, November 20, 2015 at 8:42:55 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Fri, 20 Nov 2015 15:15:40 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 4:38:30 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Wed, 18 Nov 2015 22:20:56 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 10:44:07 PM UTC-6, Keith wrote:
replying to Jeff Wisnia, Keith wrote:
jwisnia wrote:

Wikipedia says that they are the same, it just depends on which side of
the pond you're on:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incande...b#Screw_thread
Jeff

An E27 socket is probably rated for at least 220VAC that many countries
use and certainly would be adequate for the 110VAC in the US. E26 sockets
are rated for the lower 110VAC US standard. The diameters of the bulb
sockets are 26 and 27 millimeters (for E26 and E27) which are "close
enough for government work" (i.e. interchangeable).
--

That's not the experience me and my brother had working on housing units that were built in Australia. American made light bulbs were so tight in the light sockets that we put some Noalox on the threads to get them to screw in. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster
That strikes me as rather strange, since American bulbs are E26
(small) and Euro bulbs are E27 (large). I could see you having trouble
putting E27 Euro 240 bulbs into American E26 sockets - THAT would make
sense. And those "american" bulbs would be 120 volts too.
An e26 bulb in an E27 socket should go in like butter - but once
tightened the threads could ride up a bit, making them a bit ornery
about coming back out.

It could have been a slight difference in the pitch of the threads? o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster
Pitch is the same.

Get your pitch to zero.

Pitch is out, I can't hold altitude.

(For old timers who remember Six Million Dollar Man)

On Sunday, November 22, 2015 at 5:49:08 PM UTC-6, TimR wrote:
On Friday, November 20, 2015 at 8:42:55 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Fri, 20 Nov 2015 15:15:40 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Thursday, November 19, 2015 at 4:38:30 PM UTC-6, wrote:
On Wed, 18 Nov 2015 22:20:56 -0800 (PST), Uncle Monster
wrote:

On Wednesday, November 18, 2015 at 10:44:07 PM UTC-6, Keith wrote:
replying to Jeff Wisnia, Keith wrote:
jwisnia wrote:

Wikipedia says that they are the same, it just depends on which side of
the pond you're on:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Incande...b#Screw_thread
Jeff

An E27 socket is probably rated for at least 220VAC that many countries
use and certainly would be adequate for the 110VAC in the US. E26 sockets
are rated for the lower 110VAC US standard. The diameters of the bulb
sockets are 26 and 27 millimeters (for E26 and E27) which are "close
enough for government work" (i.e. interchangeable).
--

That's not the experience me and my brother had working on housing units that were built in Australia. American made light bulbs were so tight in the light sockets that we put some Noalox on the threads to get them to screw in. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster
That strikes me as rather strange, since American bulbs are E26
(small) and Euro bulbs are E27 (large). I could see you having trouble
putting E27 Euro 240 bulbs into American E26 sockets - THAT would make
sense. And those "american" bulbs would be 120 volts too.
An e26 bulb in an E27 socket should go in like butter - but once
tightened the threads could ride up a bit, making them a bit ornery
about coming back out.

It could have been a slight difference in the pitch of the threads? o_O

[8~{} Uncle Bulb Monster
Pitch is the same.

Get your pitch to zero.

Pitch is out, I can't hold altitude.

(For old timers who remember Six Million Dollar Man)

I actually tripped over the series yesterday when I was channel surfing. The costar for that episode was Farrah Fawcett. Gawd she was young. ™¡

[8~{ Uncle Smitten Monster

replying to TimR, Mel wrote:
Smile. Yes.

--
for full context, visit http://www.homeownershub.com/mainten...th-266061-.htm

replying to clare, Sarah wrote:
E26 (US) are one millimeter shorter and may not make contact with the base.
No contact, no light. Longer, E27 bulbs will make contact in the shorter
base. I have had the same experience. All my USA purchased lamps worked
great in Europe. None of my European lamps or ceiling lights worked in the
USA without bulb base adaptors. It has been so long since I purchased them I
can't tell you where to go.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...th-266061-.htm

On Fri, 13 Oct 2017 11:44:02 GMT, Sarah
m wrote:

replying to clare, Sarah wrote:
E26 (US) are one millimeter shorter and may not make contact with the base.
No contact, no light. Longer, E27 bulbs will make contact in the shorter
base. I have had the same experience. All my USA purchased lamps worked
great in Europe. None of my European lamps or ceiling lights worked in the
USA without bulb base adaptors. It has been so long since I purchased them I
can't tell you where to go.
The 26 and 27 refer to the thread diameter, not length. An E26 will
thread all the way into the larger E27 base with no problem, while the
larger E27 bulb MAY not thread all the way into the 1mm smaller
(nominal) E26 base.

In practice, the precision ov the thread form is so poor there is
virtually no perceptible difference in MOST sockets or bulbs. All the
Chinese crap is likely E26.5 with a tolerance of +.5 /-0 on the
sockets and +0/-.5 on the bulbs.

replying to TimR, Bridget Whitfield wrote:
I'm trying to figure out how to get my Led light/bug zapper light bulb to
change modes in a e26 fixture. The bulb is supposed to have 3 different
modes, mine stays on light & bug zapper all time. There's a mode for just the
light & a mode for just the zapper & a mode for both light & zapper. The
fixture is in the United States, so I'm assuming it's an e26 & the bulb is a
e27 for sure, it's on the pack. How can I fix this? Do they make an adapter
that'll fix it, or do I need to somehow change the voltage? Can you please
explain to me what I need to do, this is driving me crazy.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...th-266061-.htm

replying to k, Randy_M wrote:
Read this article:
https://www.waveformlighting.com/hom...nterchangeable

Contrary to popular belief, the difference is not in the screw diameter but
extra electrical insulation provided in E27 as it is designed for higher
voltages. Therefore using an E26 bulb in a E27 socket at 240V AC may present
safety issues.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...th-266061-.htm

On Monday, July 9, 2018 at 3:14:06 PM UTC-5, Randy_M wrote:
replying to k, Randy_M wrote:
Read this article:
https://www.waveformlighting.com/hom...nterchangeable

Contrary to popular belief, the difference is not in the screw diameter but
extra electrical insulation provided in E27 as it is designed for higher
voltages. Therefore using an E26 bulb in a E27 socket at 240V AC may present
safety issues.
--


Ya know, k has been sitting on his/her/its hands for almost 11 years waiting for your comment. k is so glad to be moving around again. o_O

[8~{} Uncle Sitting Monster

replying to k, emile wrote:
USA: E26,
Europe: E27

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/mainte...th-266061-.htm

On Mon, 03 Sep 2018 03:14:02 GMT, emile
m wrote:

replying to k, emile wrote:
USA: E26,
Europe: E27


No.

120 volt = E26
240 volt = E27

Generally speaking

On 9/3/2018 12:35 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Mon, 03 Sep 2018 03:14:02 GMT, emile
m wrote:

replying to k, emile wrote:
USA: E26,
Europe: E27

No.

120 volt = E26
240 volt = E27

Generally speaking

Thank you so much.Â* I've been watching my thread for almost 11 years and hoping for an answer.

k posted for all of us...



On 9/3/2018 12:35 AM, Clare Snyder wrote:
On Mon, 03 Sep 2018 03:14:02 GMT, emile
m wrote:

replying to k, emile wrote:
USA: E26,
Europe: E27

No.

120 volt = E26
240 volt = E27

Generally speaking

Thank you so much.* I've been watching my thread for almost 11 years and hoping for an answer.

I suggest that you get a real newsreader and find out what is being
discussed and previously answered on the newsgroup: alt.home.repair You may
get better results.

--
Tekkie