I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

Thanks!

Dean

"dean" wrote in message
oups.com...
I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

Uhm... bug lights are supposed to ATTRACT bugs. You put them out away from
where you want to be. At least that's how all the ones I've seen work.

On Jun 4, 1:12 am, "Noozer" wrote:
"dean" wrote in message

oups.com...

I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

Uhm... bug lights are supposed to ATTRACT bugs. You put them out away from
where you want to be. At least that's how all the ones I've seen work.

That's a bug zapper. A bug light is a yellow light of some kind that
insects can't see (supposedly, they can only see UV and blue, which is
filtered out).

On Jun 4, 12:15 am, dean wrote:
On Jun 4, 1:12 am, "Noozer" wrote:

"dean" wrote in message

roups.com...

I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

Uhm... bug lights are supposed to ATTRACT bugs. You put them out away from
where you want to be. At least that's how all the ones I've seen work.

That's a bug zapper. A bug light is a yellow light of some kind that
insects can't see (supposedly, they can only see UV and blue, which is
filtered out).

That's theory, as you've discovered, it isn't all that effective of
one...

I'm unaware of any that emit any usable visible light that don't also
attract at least some -- as in enough as to not be of much value as
compared to an ordinary incadescent bulb. I suspect the only thing
that would be effective would be so far to one end of the spectrum or
the other that it wouldn't produce enough light that humans could see
in it either. After all, the insects fly around during the daylight
hours in the same light we wander around in -- would be somewhat
surprising if what light sensitivity they have weren't in similar
response frequencies...

--

In .com, dean wrote:
I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

I think it takes a more amber deeper yellow to really cut the
attractiveness to flying insects. They see blue-green/green-blue well
and appear to me to be attracted to that, most light yellow plastic lets
that through, and compact fluorescents have spectral content there. Some
yellow plastic passes more UV and/or more deep blue or violet than one
suspects.

Along these lines, I think low pressure sodium should work well.
Problem is, its spectrum is monochromatic, and things look an
orange-yellow version of black-and-white with most colored objects
appearing dark.

If you have an enclosed fixture with glass panes and you have time and
are handy with this sort of thing, try replacing the glass panes with
yellow acrylic such as yellow "lucite" or "plexiglas". Or someone who is
handy with acrylic can build you a yellow enclosure.

For more extreme reduction of insect attractiveness, try orange acrylic
instead of yellow.

Insects also see yellow light but supposedly do not well see red light.
They have four color vision receptors - UV, blue, blue-green and yellow
(or yellow-green-peaking maybe). I suspect the theory is that having
light not doing much stimulation of the three shorter wavelength ones
makes the light less attractive to most light-attracted flying insects.

- Don Klipstein )

On Jun 4, 3:59 pm, (Don Klipstein) wrote:
In .com, dean wrote:
I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

I think it takes a more amber deeper yellow to really cut the
attractiveness to flying insects. They see blue-green/green-blue well
and appear to me to be attracted to that, most light yellow plastic lets
that through, and compact fluorescents have spectral content there. Some
yellow plastic passes more UV and/or more deep blue or violet than one
suspects.

Along these lines, I think low pressure sodium should work well.
Problem is, its spectrum is monochromatic, and things look an
orange-yellow version of black-and-white with most colored objects
appearing dark.

If you have an enclosed fixture with glass panes and you have time and
are handy with this sort of thing, try replacing the glass panes with
yellow acrylic such as yellow "lucite" or "plexiglas". Or someone who is
handy with acrylic can build you a yellow enclosure.

For more extreme reduction of insect attractiveness, try orange acrylic
instead of yellow.

Insects also see yellow light but supposedly do not well see red light.
They have four color vision receptors - UV, blue, blue-green and yellow
(or yellow-green-peaking maybe). I suspect the theory is that having
light not doing much stimulation of the three shorter wavelength ones
makes the light less attractive to most light-attracted flying insects.

- Don Klipstein )

I'll try the LPS light - I have one that I can plug in and test. Will
report back anon.

Also I've seen CF's that have a yellow pigment and actually emit
yellow light, rather than a white CF inside a yellow cover or glass. I
suspect they will do a better job but I dunno if they emit in the blue/
green at all.

On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 22:35:32 -0700, dpb wrote:

On Jun 4, 12:15 am, dean wrote:
On Jun 4, 1:12 am, "Noozer" wrote:

"dean" wrote in message

roups.com...

I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

Uhm... bug lights are supposed to ATTRACT bugs. You put them out away from
where you want to be. At least that's how all the ones I've seen work.

That's a bug zapper. A bug light is a yellow light of some kind that
insects can't see (supposedly, they can only see UV and blue, which is
filtered out).

That's theory, as you've discovered, it isn't all that effective of
one...

I'm unaware of any that emit any usable visible light that don't also
attract at least some -- as in enough as to not be of much value as
compared to an ordinary incadescent bulb. I suspect the only thing
that would be effective would be so far to one end of the spectrum or
the other that it wouldn't produce enough light that humans could see
in it either. After all, the insects fly around during the daylight
hours in the same light we wander around in -- would be somewhat
surprising if what light sensitivity they have weren't in similar
response frequencies...

It wouldn't be surprising. In fact all of us** assumed it was the
case until we heard about bug lights. But it wouldn't be necessary
either.

**Didn't we? Once we found out other animals had eyes, didn't we
assume they were just like our eyes? Dogs have ears but they can hear
dog whistles.

On Mon, 04 Jun 2007 20:28:40 -0000, dean
wrote:

Also I've seen CF's that have a yellow pigment and actually emit
yellow light, rather than a white CF inside a yellow cover or glass

I happen to subscribe to the notion of using yellow bulbs for bugs.

A bulb with a *dense* yellow pigment (inside) is what I use. They cost
out the wallet

In Las Vegas nuisance bugs are attracted to the Strip and eaten by
thousands of bats living at the airport structures.

--
Oren

...through the use of electrical or duct tape, achieve the configuration in the photo..

On Jun 4, 4:49 pm, mm wrote:
On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 22:35:32 -0700, dpb wrote:
On Jun 4, 12:15 am, dean wrote:
On Jun 4, 1:12 am, "Noozer" wrote:

"dean" wrote in message

roups.com...

I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

Uhm... bug lights are supposed to ATTRACT bugs. You put them out away from
where you want to be. At least that's how all the ones I've seen work.

That's a bug zapper. A bug light is a yellow light of some kind that
insects can't see (supposedly, they can only see UV and blue, which is
filtered out).

That's theory, as you've discovered, it isn't all that effective of
one...

I'm unaware of any that emit any usable visible light that don't also
attract at least some -- as in enough as to not be of much value as
compared to an ordinary incadescent bulb. I suspect the only thing
that would be effective would be so far to one end of the spectrum or
the other that it wouldn't produce enough light that humans could see
in it either. After all, the insects fly around during the daylight
hours in the same light we wander around in -- would be somewhat
surprising if what light sensitivity they have weren't in similar
response frequencies...

It wouldn't be surprising. In fact all of us** assumed it was the
case until we heard about bug lights. But it wouldn't be necessary
either.

**Didn't we? Once we found out other animals had eyes, didn't we
assume they were just like our eyes? Dogs have ears but they can hear
dog whistles.

The point was that the yellow bug light isn't very effective if the
plan is to have a light that doesn't attract bugs so something is
attracting them -- maybe they hear the filament, I don't know. What I
was driving at was that by the time one shifted the spectrum to
whatever is the most effective if it isn't something in our range the
light might be effective at not attracting them, but it won't help you
see, very effectively it at all, either...

--

On Jun 4, 8:21 pm, dpb wrote:
On Jun 4, 4:49 pm, mm wrote:





On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 22:35:32 -0700, dpb wrote:
On Jun 4, 12:15 am, dean wrote:
On Jun 4, 1:12 am, "Noozer" wrote:

"dean" wrote in message

roups.com...

I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

Uhm... bug lights are supposed to ATTRACT bugs. You put them out away from
where you want to be. At least that's how all the ones I've seen work.

That's a bug zapper. A bug light is a yellow light of some kind that
insects can't see (supposedly, they can only see UV and blue, which is
filtered out).

That's theory, as you've discovered, it isn't all that effective of
one...

I'm unaware of any that emit any usable visible light that don't also
attract at least some -- as in enough as to not be of much value as
compared to an ordinary incadescent bulb. I suspect the only thing
that would be effective would be so far to one end of the spectrum or
the other that it wouldn't produce enough light that humans could see
in it either. After all, the insects fly around during the daylight
hours in the same light we wander around in -- would be somewhat
surprising if what light sensitivity they have weren't in similar
response frequencies...

It wouldn't be surprising. In fact all of us** assumed it was the
case until we heard about bug lights. But it wouldn't be necessary
either.

**Didn't we? Once we found out other animals had eyes, didn't we
assume they were just like our eyes? Dogs have ears but they can hear
dog whistles.

The point was that the yellow bug light isn't very effective if the
plan is to have a light that doesn't attract bugs so something is
attracting them -- maybe they hear the filament, I don't know. What I
was driving at was that by the time one shifted the spectrum to
whatever is the most effective if it isn't something in our range the
light might be effective at not attracting them, but it won't help you
see, very effectively it at all, either...

--- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

To be fair, I did read in multiple school books that bees can't see
anything but blue and UV. But then they are not mosquitos, and it was
only a school book.

On Jun 5, 11:10 am, dean wrote:
On Jun 4, 8:21 pm, dpb wrote:



On Jun 4, 4:49 pm, mm wrote:

On Sun, 03 Jun 2007 22:35:32 -0700, dpb wrote:
On Jun 4, 12:15 am, dean wrote:
On Jun 4, 1:12 am, "Noozer" wrote:

"dean" wrote in message

roups.com...

I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

Uhm... bug lights are supposed to ATTRACT bugs. You put them out away from
where you want to be. At least that's how all the ones I've seen work.

That's a bug zapper. A bug light is a yellow light of some kind that
insects can't see (supposedly, they can only see UV and blue, which is
filtered out).

That's theory, as you've discovered, it isn't all that effective of
one...

I'm unaware of any that emit any usable visible light that don't also
attract at least some -- as in enough as to not be of much value as
compared to an ordinary incadescent bulb. I suspect the only thing
that would be effective would be so far to one end of the spectrum or
the other that it wouldn't produce enough light that humans could see
in it either. After all, the insects fly around during the daylight
hours in the same light we wander around in -- would be somewhat
surprising if what light sensitivity they have weren't in similar
response frequencies...

It wouldn't be surprising. In fact all of us** assumed it was the
case until we heard about bug lights. But it wouldn't be necessary
either.

**Didn't we? Once we found out other animals had eyes, didn't we
assume they were just like our eyes? Dogs have ears but they can hear
dog whistles.

The point was that the yellow bug light isn't very effective if the
plan is to have a light that doesn't attract bugs so something is
attracting them -- maybe they hear the filament, I don't know. What I
was driving at was that by the time one shifted the spectrum to
whatever is the most effective if it isn't something in our range the
light might be effective at not attracting them, but it won't help you
see, very effectively it at all, either...

--- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

To be fair, I did read in multiple school books that bees can't see
anything but blue and UV. But then they are not mosquitos, and it was
only a school book.

I recall that too, now that reminded..I don't know where they found
the bee that had learned names for colors and could either write them
down for us or tell us, but...

I was thinking the question had more to do w/ the nuisance moths and
that sort of thing than 'skeeters which aren't that light-attracted
anyway, from what I've read. They're mostly scent-/temperature-driven
iiuc.

My ploy is to keep a couple of the UV bug-zappers running 24/7, one
fairly close to the front porch to draw as much away as possible.
These make a very noticeable reduction in the nuisance bugs but aren't
particularly helpful for mosquitos, either. I spray the barns/lots
regularly for flies anyway, so when have load of malathion ready, will
do the grass in the yard then if they're being a problem. That pretty
much knocks 'em down for quite a while. For the entrance light we
have a 2nd-story-mounted flood so it's far enough away that what it
attracts isn't a direct nuisance and that provides enough light to
find one's way from the garage to the door and so rarely try to use
the direct porch light at the front door during warm weather.

Don't know if any of those ideas/remedies are of any use or not, but
consider the cost...

--

dpb wrote in
oups.com:


I was thinking the question had more to do w/ the nuisance moths and
that sort of thing than 'skeeters which aren't that light-attracted
anyway, from what I've read. They're mostly scent-/temperature-driven
iiuc.

And CO2.(your breath)

My ploy is to keep a couple of the UV bug-zappers running 24/7, one
fairly close to the front porch to draw as much away as possible.
These make a very noticeable reduction in the nuisance bugs but aren't
particularly helpful for mosquitos, either. I spray the barns/lots
regularly for flies anyway, so when have load of malathion ready, will
do the grass in the yard then if they're being a problem. That pretty
much knocks 'em down for quite a while. For the entrance light we
have a 2nd-story-mounted flood so it's far enough away that what it
attracts isn't a direct nuisance and that provides enough light to
find one's way from the garage to the door and so rarely try to use
the direct porch light at the front door during warm weather.

Don't know if any of those ideas/remedies are of any use or not, but
consider the cost...

--




I hear that the bug zappers with the propane burner to generate CO2 work
very well,but you situate them AWAY from where you want bug-free.

--
Jim Yanik
jyanik
at
kua.net

Jim Yanik wrote:
dpb wrote in
oups.com:


....
I hear that the bug zappers with the propane burner to generate CO2 work
very well,...

Not from what I've read -- all the tests I've seen showed essentially
no preferential kill rate w/ CO2 as opposed to w/o ...

--

On Jun 5, 5:24 pm, dpb wrote:
Jim Yanik wrote:
dpb wrote in
roups.com:

...
I hear that the bug zappers with the propane burner to generate CO2 work
very well,...

Not from what I've read -- all the tests I've seen showed essentially
no preferential kill rate w/ CO2 as opposed to w/o ...

Actually, I got to thinking that had been a while since I last looked
so thought I'd recheck..

As before the U of Md 2001 test was what I remembered -- "useful for
catching surveillance specimens but claims for control of manufacturer
could not be corroborated". Some more recent results w/ newer devices
seem somewhat more positive but even one of the manufacturer's own
claims notes "Some protection extends up to 20 feet from the unit.
Protection is greatest within 7.31 feet from the unit..." That's a
pretty small area unless one has a very tiny area or simply wants an
area around a patio alone covered. (I like the "7.31" precision,
too... )

So, I guess I'll say they may have their uses, but I still think the
claims are far overblown as compared to the actual effectiveness,
particularly on large areas such as I have and also with our very
windy conditions.

--

On Tue, 05 Jun 2007 15:47:39 -0700, dpb wrote:

On Jun 5, 5:24 pm, dpb wrote:
Jim Yanik wrote:
dpb wrote in
roups.com:

...
I hear that the bug zappers with the propane burner to generate CO2 work
very well,...

Not from what I've read -- all the tests I've seen showed essentially
no preferential kill rate w/ CO2 as opposed to w/o ...

Actually, I got to thinking that had been a while since I last looked
so thought I'd recheck..

As before the U of Md 2001 test was what I remembered -- "useful for
catching surveillance specimens but claims for control of manufacturer
could not be corroborated". Some more recent results w/ newer devices
seem somewhat more positive but even one of the manufacturer's own
claims notes "Some protection extends up to 20 feet from the unit.
Protection is greatest within 7.31 feet from the unit..." That's a
pretty small area unless one has a very tiny area or simply wants an
area around a patio alone covered. (I like the "7.31" precision,
too... )

So, I guess I'll say they may have their uses, but I still think the
claims are far overblown as compared to the actual effectiveness,
particularly on large areas such as I have and also with our very
windy conditions.


The military; as I understand, has worked for years on methods to
kill "skeeters" The device emits *something* (gases (?) I can't
really say for lack of information. We do get things like GPS from the
developed technology. Maybe even QVC taunted this bug killer?

--
Oren

...through the use of electrical or duct tape, achieve the configuration in the photo..

In . com, dean wrote:

EDIT for space

To be fair, I did read in multiple school books that bees can't see
anything but blue and UV. But then they are not mosquitos, and it was
only a school book.

IIRC, the specific insects that I read as having 4 distinct color
receptors (UV, blue, blue-green, and yellow that I think could be
yellow-green) were bees.

- Don Klipstein )

dean wrote:
I just put in a couple of pale-yellow plastic encased CF bulbs (bug
lights, supposedly) outside on my deck, and there are piles of bugs
flying all around them. Not as bad as a daylight bulb, but still,
they're crap. Are there any that really work?

Thanks!

Dean


Every few years in the Fall the crickets will accumulate by the
billions... local strip malls and shopping centers are picking them up
with snow shovels. There is a night and day difference in the numbers of
crickets in the parking lots with sodium based lighting (has a yellowish
hue) over the mercury vapor lights.

Lar

In .com, dpb wrote:

EDIT for space

I recall that too, now that reminded..I don't know where they found
the bee that had learned names for colors and could either write them
down for us or tell us, but...

I was thinking the question had more to do w/ the nuisance moths and
that sort of thing than 'skeeters which aren't that light-attracted
anyway, from what I've read. They're mostly scent-/temperature-driven
iiuc.

My ploy is to keep a couple of the UV bug-zappers running 24/7, one
fairly close to the front porch to draw as much away as possible.
These make a very noticeable reduction in the nuisance bugs but aren't
particularly helpful for mosquitos, either. I spray the barns/lots
regularly for flies anyway, so when have load of malathion ready, will
do the grass in the yard then if they're being a problem. That pretty
much knocks 'em down for quite a while. For the entrance light we
have a 2nd-story-mounted flood so it's far enough away that what it
attracts isn't a direct nuisance and that provides enough light to
find one's way from the garage to the door and so rarely try to use
the direct porch light at the front door during warm weather.

Don't know if any of those ideas/remedies are of any use or not, but
consider the cost...

There was one spring/early-summer when I deployed a homebrew bugzapper
where I tried a few various lights and found what worked best to draw bugs
into the zapper, and *later that summer* the consequences!

I found that a regular "blue" fluorescent worked better than any
blacklight. "Blue" also worked better than "cool white", "daylight", and
incandescent of 3 times the wattage of the fluorescent.
Fluorescents I also found to work better if fed smooth filtered DC
(in my experience so far required a combination resistor and inductor
ballast to both work in any stable way and to start easily) than with 60
Hz AC - apparently a significant percentage of bugs see them flickering
and/or changing color 120 times a second!

So, I run my homebrew bugzapper with a 20 watt "regular blue"
fluorescent running from steady DC through the early part of "bug season",
and it appears to me that I make my block run low on nighttime flying
insects in general, especially leafhoppers.

I think great!

So what happens in midsummer? The bat population that usually flies
over my block appears to find my block low on food, and apparently
retreats half a block or so southeastward towards an adjacent park.

My block's mosquito population, apparently in response to this, makes
that summer on the bad side as far as mosquitoes are concerned. Keep in
mind that mosquitoes are not as light-attracted as a lot of other
night-flying insects are!

- Don Klipstein )

On Jun 5, 10:46 pm, (Don Klipstein) wrote:
In .com, dpb wrote:

....

My ploy is to keep a couple of the UV bug-zappers running 24/7, one
fairly close to the front porch to draw as much away as possible.
These make a very noticeable reduction in the nuisance bugs but aren't
particularly helpful for mosquitos, either. ...

So, I run my homebrew bugzapper ...through the early part of "bug season",
and it appears to me that I make my block run low on nighttime flying
insects in general, especially leafhoppers.

....
So what happens in midsummer? The bat population that usually flies
over my block appears to find my block low on food, and apparently
retreats half a block or so southeastward towards an adjacent park.

My block's mosquito population, apparently in response to this, makes
that summer on the bad side as far as mosquitoes are concerned. Keep in
mind that mosquitoes are not as light-attracted as a lot of other
night-flying insects are!
....

We're too dry here for a bat population -- our substitute is the barn
swallow and I can't see any effect on their numbers.

I run two "standard issue" bug zappers w/ the u-tube flurorescents
made for the purpose -- one 40W, the other 80. I leave them on 24/7
from "first bug that bugs" 'til first frost. There is no shortage of
critters for them to attract although they do make a discernible
difference around the house...

Mosquitos are killed only by happenstance by them, of course. For the
most part, however, can keep them under control fairly well -- again,
being dry helps except for where the yard/garden/etc are irrigated and
some problems around the lots where cattle waterers, etc., are provide
some breeding grounds that can't be totally eliminated but can be
minimized/controlled.

Whatever one does, 'tis a never-ending battle...

--

--