Living in Quebec which supposedly has the cheapest hydro rates in
North America I'm considering changing from an old oil fired boiler to
an electric boiler.
I have a relatively small house and the much smaller boiler unit, no
more oil tank, cleanliness and apparently faster heating time really
appeals me.
Anyone have thoughts on this?
Thanks in advance

" wrote in message
ups.com...
Living in Quebec which supposedly has the cheapest hydro rates in
North America I'm considering changing from an old oil fired boiler to
an electric boiler.
I have a relatively small house and the much smaller boiler unit, no
more oil tank, cleanliness and apparently faster heating time really
appeals me.
Anyone have thoughts on this?
Thanks in advance

Run the cost comparisons. If oil is 2.40 a gallon, electric would have to
be down to about .075 per kWh to give the same Btu at the same cost.
Remember, oil is about 75% to 80% efficient. This web site uses 78%
http://hearth.com/econtent/index.php...on_calculator/

In article . com, " wrote:
Living in Quebec which supposedly has the cheapest hydro rates in
North America I'm considering changing from an old oil fired boiler to
an electric boiler.
I have a relatively small house and the much smaller boiler unit, no
more oil tank, cleanliness and apparently faster heating time really
appeals me.

Faster heating time with an electric boiler than with oil? No way.

Any faster heating that you might see is due *solely* to the "smaller boiler
unit". Older units were frequently oversized. Compare heating times on
electric and oil units of the same size.

Anyone have thoughts on this?

Considered natural gas?


--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

"Meat Plow" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 May 2007 07:23:11 -0700, wrote:

Living in Quebec which supposedly has the cheapest hydro rates in
North America I'm considering changing from an old oil fired boiler to
an electric boiler.
I have a relatively small house and the much smaller boiler unit, no
more oil tank, cleanliness and apparently faster heating time really
appeals me.
Anyone have thoughts on this?
Thanks in advance

Pretty much a no brainer isn't it?

Not from the numbers I've seen. At 2.40 a gallon for oil, electric has to
be 7.5¢ to break even. Removing and replacing the heating system and
electric service upgrade will cost $3000 to $5000? At 5¢ a kWh, the
payback will probably be 10 years. OK, I agree, it is a no brainer. Leave
it alone.

Another possibility is to add some electric baseboard heaters and leave the
oil system in place. If the difference between the fuels changes, so does
the use.

On May 16, 11:06 am, Meat Plow wrote:
On Wed, 16 May 2007 15:02:38 +0000, Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"Meat Plow" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 16 May 2007 07:23:11 -0700, wrote:

Living in Quebec which supposedly has the cheapest hydro rates in
North America I'm considering changing from an old oil fired boiler to
an electric boiler.
I have a relatively small house and the much smaller boiler unit, no
more oil tank, cleanliness and apparently faster heating time really
appeals me.
Anyone have thoughts on this?
Thanks in advance

Pretty much a no brainer isn't it?

Not from the numbers I've seen. At 2.40 a gallon for oil, electric has to
be 7.5¢ to break even. Removing and replacing the heating system and
electric service upgrade will cost $3000 to $5000? At 5¢ a kWh, the
payback will probably be 10 years. OK, I agree, it is a no brainer. Leave
it alone.

Exactly.

Thanks for the fast replies.
My present oil furnace is kaput so I have about the same replacement
costs whether oil or electric anyway.
No gas in my area of Montreal.
Another thing about switching to electric is we don't have the big
fluctuations in prices that oil does. FWIW I see oil prices rising a
lot faster than electricity prices.

In article .com,
Bri in Mtl wrote:

FWIW I see oil prices rising a
lot faster than electricity prices.

An interesting consideration. How do they generate electricity up there?

" wrote in message
ups.com...
Living in Quebec which supposedly has the cheapest hydro rates in
North America I'm considering changing from an old oil fired boiler to
an electric boiler.
I have a relatively small house and the much smaller boiler unit, no
more oil tank, cleanliness and apparently faster heating time really
appeals me.
Anyone have thoughts on this?
Thanks in advance


Unless you have a big enough hydro service now, don't forget to include an
upgrade to probably a 200 amp. supply in your cost calculations. An
indoor/outdoor reset controller would also save on operating costs.

On May 16, 12:19�pm, Smitty Two wrote:
In article .com,
*Bri in Mtl wrote:

*FWIW I see oil prices rising a
lot faster than electricity prices.

An interesting consideration. How do they generate electricity up there?

much is hydro.

but check the costs to upgrade your electric service, power company
will need to replace the wires to your home, new meter, meter can and
main panel.

do call your power company they may offer some incentives.

do note comparing 2 hot water tanks gas vs electric both same size,
the gas tank will have twice the recovery of a identical electric one.

if your going all electric double at least the hot water tanks size

On May 16, 12:19 pm, Smitty Two wrote:
In article .com,
Bri in Mtl wrote:

FWIW I see oil prices rising a
lot faster than electricity prices.

An interesting consideration. How do they generate electricity up there?

Huge hydro electric dams north of Mtl. Electricity rates are pretty
tightly Gov't controlled here. If rates go up it's very low.

On May 16, 12:41 pm, "kool" wrote:
" wrote in message

ups.com...

Living in Quebec which supposedly has the cheapest hydro rates in
North America I'm considering changing from an old oil fired boiler to
an electric boiler.
I have a relatively small house and the much smaller boiler unit, no
more oil tank, cleanliness and apparently faster heating time really
appeals me.
Anyone have thoughts on this?
Thanks in advance

Unless you have a big enough hydro service now, don't forget to include an
upgrade to probably a 200 amp. supply in your cost calculations. An
indoor/outdoor reset controller would also save on operating costs.

What's an indoor/outdoor reset controller?? I know there's an
optional outdoor sensor on some models that heats the water
temperature relative to the outside temperature -dunno if that's what
you're referring to.
Yes have the entrance upgrade factored in. (about $1400 Cdn)

"Bri in Mtl" wrote in message
oups.com...
On May 16, 12:41 pm, "kool" wrote:
" wrote in message

ups.com...

Living in Quebec which supposedly has the cheapest hydro rates in
North America I'm considering changing from an old oil fired boiler to
an electric boiler.
I have a relatively small house and the much smaller boiler unit, no
more oil tank, cleanliness and apparently faster heating time really
appeals me.
Anyone have thoughts on this?
Thanks in advance

Unless you have a big enough hydro service now, don't forget to include
an
upgrade to probably a 200 amp. supply in your cost calculations. An
indoor/outdoor reset controller would also save on operating costs.

What's an indoor/outdoor reset controller?? I know there's an
optional outdoor sensor on some models that heats the water
temperature relative to the outside temperature -dunno if that's what
you're referring to.
Yes have the entrance upgrade factored in. (about $1400 Cdn)

"In hydronic heating systems -- also known as hot-water systems -- a
single-stage reset control device can sense changes in outdoor temperature
and adjust the temperature of the hot water that circulates through the
system. The result increases the efficiency of the boiler without
sacrificing comfort.

These control devices, also called indoor-outdoor reset controls, cost from
about $500 installed, and studies show that they can reduce annual fuel
costs anywhere from 5 to about 25 percent. The most common range of savings,
however, is in the 12 to 15 percent range."

Reset controls have been popular in Europe, which has experienced high fuel
costs for more than 30 years. The technology has been common in commercial
heating in the United States for nearly as long. With the cost of home
heating fuel skyrocketing, these controls are becoming more popular in
residential applications.

"They're excellent," says Ed Schoen of Prestige Heating Service Inc. in
Massapequa. "Most of the time, I find people are buying them with the
installation of a new boiler. ...Really, the control is part of an
energy-efficient package, which includes everything from a high-efficiency
boiler and a digital, programmable thermostat to a well-insulated home."

Richard Levi, part owner of Comfort Specialists in Oceanside, also is a fan
of the indoor-outdoor reset controls. "In a new boiler installation, it's a
no- brainer," Levi says. "Oil and gas, the prices are not going down, and
over the long haul this saves on fuel."

Levi, however, says recent technology is the reason the controls are
beginning to make a dent in the residential market. "Years ago, these
controls were not very reliable because they were made of big boxes with
mechanical relays that broke down frequently," he says. For the past 10
years, Comfort Specialists has been installing reset controls for commercial
heating systems. "I've never had one go bad on me yet," Levi says.

The reset control devices are manufactured by companies such as Tekmar
Controls, Honeywell and Johnson Controls. Here's how they work:

The size of a heating system is calculated, in part, based on the coldest
day of the year in a given climate. "Since every day is not the coldest day
of the year, a heating system often is running 'oversized' and
inefficiently," says Don Rathe, owner of Rathe Associates Inc., a Syosset
company that distributes heating and cooling components, including reset
controls by Tekmar.

So whether the thermostat is set at 68 degrees or 78 degrees, a hydronic
heating system circulates water at a maximum temperature of between 180
degrees and 190 degrees. In mild or moderate temperatures, this output is
excessive. The boiler heats and circulates water to the hottest temperature,
even though there isn't a maximum demand for heat.

With a reset device installed, an air sensor mounted on the exterior of the
north side of the building (commonly the coldest part of the exterior)
senses any change in outside air temperature. The air sensor communicates
this outside temperature change to a control box mounted on the boiler.
Another sensor is installed on the pipe that supplies water to the boiler.
The control box is programmed to heat the water that circulates through the
boiler based on the outside temperature. So on a 40-degree day, water might
be circulated at 150 degrees instead of 180 degrees or 190 degrees.

"The boiler doesn't have to work as hard to heat the water, so there's a
savings in fuel," Rathe says. "The thermostat remains the brains of the
heating system, but the reset control provides more support-that's the
perfect word - for the thermostat and the system to work more efficiently."

Although the control box is factory programmed, it also can be re-programmed
to a homeowner's comfort and demands, Rathe says.

Levi says the bigger the heating system, the better the savings. "Systems
with large quantities of water, bigger homes, offices and apartment
complexes, this is where you see the most benefit," Levi says. "On a smaller
system, you get savings, but I think you also get a lot more comfort. You
don't have these bursts of heat coming at you and then have the system
shutting down.

"There's a more consistent output of heat."

Helps if you supply more complete information early on.

Trust your own judgement.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Bri in Mtl" wrote in message
oups.com...

Thanks for the fast replies.
My present oil furnace is kaput so I have about the same
replacement
costs whether oil or electric anyway.
No gas in my area of Montreal.
Another thing about switching to electric is we don't have the
big
fluctuations in prices that oil does. FWIW I see oil prices
rising a
lot faster than electricity prices.

California, USA, had price controls on power. Might want to net
search. I'm on the other side of the country, but as I
understand, they finally went to rolling blackouts because the
electric usage rose faster than the utilities could produce. And
the utilities were not allowed to build more power plants.
Finally the demand outstripped the supply.

This kept the masses of home owners happy for awhile, but
ultimately devistated the state.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Bri in Mtl" wrote in message
oups.com...
:
: Huge hydro electric dams north of Mtl. Electricity rates are
pretty
: tightly Gov't controlled here. If rates go up it's very low.
:

"Bri in Mtl" wrote in message

Huge hydro electric dams north of Mtl. Electricity rates are pretty
tightly Gov't controlled here. If rates go up it's very low.


That may change
http://www.iedm.org/main/show_mediar...eleases_id=142
The real cost of electricity to Quebecers is not its production cost, which
has been exceptionally low over time thanks to a bountiful natural heritage.
The true cost is the opportunity cost. In other words what could best be
done with our kilowatt-hours (kWh) if we did not consume them ourselves?
What are we giving up by consuming them as so low a price? The real cost is
around $0.10 per kWh, the amount that could be obtained by exporting them

Yes have the entrance upgrade factored in. (about $1400 Cdn)- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

you will likely need 400 amps for whhole use heating, price sounds low

Ladykins had written this in response to
http://www.www.thestuccocompany.com/...er-217798-.htm
:
Hi can anybody help me? I have lived at my house for 3 years and have a
behind the wall old fashioned boiler in the dining room, like a lot of
terraced houses! - it is a LANDIS & GYR controlled timer system. It has
always worked fine but today I switched the heating on (constant) and
behind the wall seemed to be making a loud noise and the flames were
visible and burning quite ferociously

If anyone knows what this problem is or might be, please contact me . I
have turned my heating for the radiators and water off

Thanks

-------------------------------------
wrote:


Living in Quebec which supposedly has the cheapest hydro rates in
North America I'm considering changing from an old oil fired boiler to
an electric boiler.
I have a relatively small house and the much smaller boiler unit, no
more oil tank, cleanliness and apparently faster heating time really
appeals me.
Anyone have thoughts on this?
Thanks in advance






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