This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation for
an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to install
and I notice (based purely on the text stamped on the outlet face) that the
text on the outlet is upside down if you put the ground prong on the bottom,
but the text on the outlet is rightside up and readible, the ground prong is
on top of the hot and neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a reason
why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad thing - if
only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd have to always
twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.

"Eigenvector" wrote in message
...
This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation
for an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to
install and I notice (based purely on the text stamped on the outlet face)
that the text on the outlet is upside down if you put the ground prong on
the bottom, but the text on the outlet is rightside up and readible, the
ground prong is on top of the hot and neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a
reason why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad
thing - if only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd
have to always twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.


Ground lug up, for the reason that if a metal cover plate comes off it hits
the ground first. Left to right orientation the hot goes up.

Rich

"Rich" wrote in message
. ..

"Eigenvector" wrote in message
...
This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation
for an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to
install and I notice (based purely on the text stamped on the outlet
face) that the text on the outlet is upside down if you put the ground
prong on the bottom, but the text on the outlet is rightside up and
readible, the ground prong is on top of the hot and neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a
reason why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad
thing - if only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd
have to always twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.


Ground lug up, for the reason that if a metal cover plate comes off it
hits the ground first. Left to right orientation the hot goes up.

Rich
Alright, I hadn't thought of that.

Most molded "wall hugger" plugs are orientated with the ground on the
bottom, i install the outlets to comply + the look like a face going
ooooh, which I prefer/

Eigenvector wrote:
This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation for
an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to install
and I notice (based purely on the text stamped on the outlet face) that the
text on the outlet is upside down if you put the ground prong on the bottom,
but the text on the outlet is rightside up and readible, the ground prong is
on top of the hot and neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a reason
why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad thing - if
only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd have to always
twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.


This has been discussed many times here. You can
orient the plug any way you want including
horizontally. Most plugs seem to be oriented with
the hole (ground) on the bottom, but other houses
have the ground on the top. Flat plugs are often
formed so that a plug with the ground on the
bottom is best. Orient it any way you want, you
can always turn it over later if you want a
different orientation.

George E. Cawthon wrote:
Eigenvector wrote:


snipped

This has been discussed many times here. You can orient the plug any
way you want including horizontally. Most plugs seem to be oriented
with the hole (ground) on the bottom, but other houses have the ground
on the top. Flat plugs are often formed so that a plug with the ground
on the bottom is best. Orient it any way you want, you can always turn
it over later if you want a different orientation.

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?

Jeff
--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
"What do you expect from a pig but a grunt?"

Eigenvector posted for all of us...

This might sound like a dumb question,

And it is because once again you have done NO research on this often asked
question. WHEN WILL YOU LEARN?????
--
Tekkie "There's no such thing as a tool I don't need."

"Tekkie®" wrote in message
. ..
Eigenvector posted for all of us...

This might sound like a dumb question,

And it is because once again you have done NO research on this often asked
question. WHEN WILL YOU LEARN?????
--
When will you stop responding to posts you don't like?

That's what I thought.

Jeff Wisnia wrote:
George E. Cawthon wrote:

This has been discussed many times here. You can orient the plug any
way you want including horizontally. Most plugs seem to be oriented
with the hole (ground) on the bottom, but other houses have the ground
on the top. Flat plugs are often formed so that a plug with the ground
on the bottom is best. Orient it any way you want, you can always turn
it over later if you want a different orientation.

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?

I can confirm that the metal cover plate reason makes no sense,
regardless of who's bought into the logic and written code to comply.

By the time the ground prong is far enough out of the receptacle hole
to make contact with the cover plate, the other two prongs are far
enough out that the cord is no longer energized.

R

I dont think the NEC stipulates either way. Authority having
jurisditction could answer that.

If you have the ground down and the receptacle is loose and the cord
end starts to fall out the ground will still be in. First make last
break.

If you have the ground down and some how or another something metal
falls across the hot and neutral if the cord is not plugged all the
way in it will obviously short it.

6 of this and half a dozen of the other.

On Mon, 16 Oct 2006 17:11:08 -0700, "Eigenvector"
wrote:

This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation for
an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to install
and I notice (based purely on the text stamped on the outlet face) that the
text on the outlet is upside down if you put the ground prong on the bottom,
but the text on the outlet is rightside up and readible, the ground prong is
on top of the hot and neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a reason
why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad thing - if
only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd have to always
twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.

On Tue, 17 Oct 2006 00:51:57 GMT, "George E. Cawthon"
wrote:

Eigenvector wrote:
This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation for
an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to install
and I notice (based purely on the text stamped on the outlet face) that the
text on the outlet is upside down if you put the ground prong on the bottom,
but the text on the outlet is rightside up and readible, the ground prong is
on top of the hot and neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a reason
why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad thing - if
only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd have to always
twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.


This has been discussed many times here. You can
orient the plug any way you want including
horizontally. Most plugs seem to be oriented with
the hole (ground) on the bottom, but other houses
have the ground on the top. Flat plugs are often
formed so that a plug with the ground on the
bottom is best. Orient it any way you want, you
can always turn it over later if you want a
different orientation.

I change mine every week. I like changes in my life and this is my
way to achieve change.

I think I like the ground down better though. It looks more like a
face.

On Mon, 16 Oct 2006 19:28:52 -0500, "Rich"
wrote:


"Eigenvector" wrote in message
...
This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation
for an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to
install and I notice (based purely on the text stamped on the outlet face)
that the text on the outlet is upside down if you put the ground prong on
the bottom, but the text on the outlet is rightside up and readible, the
ground prong is on top of the hot and neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a
reason why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad
thing - if only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd
have to always twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.


Ground lug up, for the reason that if a metal cover plate comes off it hits
the ground first. Left to right orientation the hot goes up.


Are you sure about that last thing? It seems inconsistent when
orienting it for safety. You want the metal cover plate to touch hot?

Rich

--
69 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

On 16 Oct 2006 20:57:57 -0700, "RicodJour"
wrote:

Jeff Wisnia wrote:
George E. Cawthon wrote:

This has been discussed many times here. You can orient the plug any
way you want including horizontally. Most plugs seem to be oriented
with the hole (ground) on the bottom, but other houses have the ground
on the top. Flat plugs are often formed so that a plug with the ground
on the bottom is best. Orient it any way you want, you can always turn
it over later if you want a different orientation.

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?

I can confirm that the metal cover plate reason makes no sense,
regardless of who's bought into the logic and written code to comply.

By the time the ground prong is far enough out of the receptacle hole
to make contact with the cover plate, the other two prongs are far
enough out that the cord is no longer energized.


Even a really thin metal cover plate? Some of these might make contact
even if the plug is only an eighth of an inch out.

R
--
69 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation for
an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to install

There are a lot of people with habitual ways of doing it,
and a lot of rationalization to support those ways, but
no particularly compelling reasons.

Ground up means falling conductors hit the ground first.
Ground down means that if the plug falls out under it's
own weight, the ground is the last to go.
Ground down means it looks like a smiley face and
attracts children. Ground up means that the
short prongs are on the bottom where it's
harder to see them when plugging things in.

I go with ground down because that's what
I'm used to.

If you're not consistant about it, it looks sloppy
and irritates the end-user. Was it me, I'd
pick one direction for normal convenience outlets,
and flip them upside down when I wanted to
signal some special-case ones.
(Like switched outlets, or outlets on a generator,
or something.)

next time you grab a grounded cord to plug it in,
look at it and see which way you've turned it.
That's how the recepticle should go.

--Goedjn

Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 16 Oct 2006 20:57:57 -0700, "RicodJour"
wrote:

Jeff Wisnia wrote:
George E. Cawthon wrote:

This has been discussed many times here. You can orient the plug any
way you want including horizontally. Most plugs seem to be oriented
with the hole (ground) on the bottom, but other houses have the ground
on the top. Flat plugs are often formed so that a plug with the ground
on the bottom is best. Orient it any way you want, you can always turn
it over later if you want a different orientation.

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?

I can confirm that the metal cover plate reason makes no sense,
regardless of who's bought into the logic and written code to comply.

By the time the ground prong is far enough out of the receptacle hole
to make contact with the cover plate, the other two prongs are far
enough out that the cord is no longer energized.


Even a really thin metal cover plate? Some of these might make contact
even if the plug is only an eighth of an inch out.

The cover plate has nothing to do with the orientation. Nothing. The
grounding plug is a bit longer than the other two. Like the other guy
said, first to make, last to break.

Unless there's a new and stupid plug with flexible prongs, the hot and
neutral can't be made to touch the cover plate unless the receptacle is
recessed well behind the face of the plate.

Why is it that nobody's mentioned a polarized plug? Since there's no
ground, does that make the plug more dangerous?

This whole thing is like someone complaining about the dangers of an
air bag while they're driving around drunk. The mechanical/electrical
systems aren't to blame, it's the nut behind the wheel.

R

"RicodJour" wrote in message

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?

The cover plate has nothing to do with the orientation. Nothing. The
grounding plug is a bit longer than the other two. Like the other guy
said, first to make, last to break.

I was told by an electrician that the practice was changed to ground up a
few years ago. The reason is that if a plug is not all the way into the
receptacle, something dropped, like a paperclip off a desk, will not cross
the two prongs and come to rest. It would most likely slide off.

I've also notice that a lot of new appliance cords, as air conditioner, are
made in such a way that they will hang better ground up.

In article NbbZg.4316$Z46.1529@trndny05, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:

I was told by an electrician that the practice was changed to ground up a
few years ago. The reason is that if a plug is not all the way into the
receptacle, something dropped, like a paperclip off a desk, will not cross
the two prongs and come to rest. It would most likely slide off.

Now *that* makes sense!

However, I don't think I'm gonna reinstall/invert all of the outlets
in my home.

--
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~|
| Malcolm Hoar "The more I practice, the luckier I get". |
| Gary Player. |
| http://www.malch.com/ Shpx gur PQN. |
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ ~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

RicodJour wrote:
Jeff Wisnia wrote:

George E. Cawthon wrote:

This has been discussed many times here. You can orient the plug any
way you want including horizontally. Most plugs seem to be oriented
with the hole (ground) on the bottom, but other houses have the ground
on the top. Flat plugs are often formed so that a plug with the ground
on the bottom is best. Orient it any way you want, you can always turn
it over later if you want a different orientation.

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?


I can confirm that the metal cover plate reason makes no sense,
regardless of who's bought into the logic and written code to comply.

By the time the ground prong is far enough out of the receptacle hole
to make contact with the cover plate, the other two prongs are far
enough out that the cord is no longer energized.

R


So think about what you just wrote, RicodJour.

With the most often seen "alien face" receptical orientation, if the
plug were pulled out of the receptical maybe 1/16" and if a metal plate
securing screw was missing and the moon was in its correct phase,
vibration might cause the plate to move away from the wall and drop down
so the upper edge of one of it's holes fell across the still connected
hot and neutral plug prongs. That could cause arcing and possibly a
spark ignited fire.

If the receptical were installed in the "cowgirl position" AND a
grounded plug was "slightly uninserted", the loose plate would fall onto
the plug's ground pin and no problem would ensue. Of course, that would
only happen if the plug HAD a ground pin. It wouldn't help squat with a
two prong (ungrounded) plug.

Capice now?

Jeff
--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
"Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength."

Jeff Wisnia wrote:
RicodJour wrote:
Jeff Wisnia wrote:

George E. Cawthon wrote:

This has been discussed many times here. You can orient the plug any
way you want including horizontally. Most plugs seem to be oriented
with the hole (ground) on the bottom, but other houses have the ground
on the top. Flat plugs are often formed so that a plug with the ground
on the bottom is best. Orient it any way you want, you can always turn
it over later if you want a different orientation.

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?


I can confirm that the metal cover plate reason makes no sense,
regardless of who's bought into the logic and written code to comply.

By the time the ground prong is far enough out of the receptacle hole
to make contact with the cover plate, the other two prongs are far
enough out that the cord is no longer energized.

R


So think about what you just wrote, RicodJour.

With the most often seen "alien face" receptical orientation, if the
plug were pulled out of the receptical maybe 1/16" and if a metal plate
securing screw was missing and the moon was in its correct phase,
vibration might cause the plate to move away from the wall and drop down
so the upper edge of one of it's holes fell across the still connected
hot and neutral plug prongs. That could cause arcing and possibly a
spark ignited fire.

If the receptical were installed in the "cowgirl position" AND a
grounded plug was "slightly uninserted", the loose plate would fall onto
the plug's ground pin and no problem would ensue. Of course, that would
only happen if the plug HAD a ground pin. It wouldn't help squat with a
two prong (ungrounded) plug.

Capice now?

You left out the tinder under the receptacle from a nearby pencil
sharpener, Jeff.

Why wouldn't the circuit breaker wouldn't trip in that situation? If
that's not safe enough, put the receptacles with the loose cover plates
and near the paper clip dispenser on a GFI. Hell, put the whole house
on a GFI - that would actually do something to improve safety.

I could dream up a scenario that would compromise any system. Doesn't
mean that it's going to happen, ever did happen, or that my time
dreaming was well spent. This is the alt.home.repair version of how
many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

R

On 17 Oct 2006 13:33:16 -0700, "RicodJour"
wrote:

Mark Lloyd wrote:
On 16 Oct 2006 20:57:57 -0700, "RicodJour"
wrote:

Jeff Wisnia wrote:
George E. Cawthon wrote:

This has been discussed many times here. You can orient the plug any
way you want including horizontally. Most plugs seem to be oriented
with the hole (ground) on the bottom, but other houses have the ground
on the top. Flat plugs are often formed so that a plug with the ground
on the bottom is best. Orient it any way you want, you can always turn
it over later if you want a different orientation.

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?

I can confirm that the metal cover plate reason makes no sense,
regardless of who's bought into the logic and written code to comply.

By the time the ground prong is far enough out of the receptacle hole
to make contact with the cover plate, the other two prongs are far
enough out that the cord is no longer energized.


Even a really thin metal cover plate? Some of these might make contact
even if the plug is only an eighth of an inch out.

The cover plate has nothing to do with the orientation. Nothing. The
grounding plug is a bit longer than the other two.

I had forgotten about that, but just checked about a dozen cords and
found that to be true for all of them.

Like the other guy
said, first to make, last to break.


Even if the receptacle is installed with the ground hole up, and the
cord is falling out (plug angled down as far as possible)?

Unless there's a new and stupid plug with flexible prongs, the hot and
neutral can't be made to touch the cover plate unless the receptacle is
recessed well behind the face of the plate.


If does seem like a small thing to worry about. I suppose if the screw
holding the plate on came loose, and the plate slipped.

Why is it that nobody's mentioned a polarized plug? Since there's no
ground, does that make the plug more dangerous?


Sounds like you're comparing non-grounding and grounding plugs. There
would be some difference in safety if the appliance had any exposed
metal parts.

Considering non-grounding receptacles, I suppose there's no real
safety advantage. There would be a convenience advantage, considering
that if the receptacle was installed upside down, you would have to
turn the plug differently than you thought.

This whole thing is like someone complaining about the dangers of an
air bag while they're driving around drunk. The mechanical/electrical
systems aren't to blame, it's the nut behind the wheel.


Of course, that doesn't mean that air bags are of absolutely no
importance.

R
--
69 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

On Tue, 17 Oct 2006 20:39:09 GMT, "Edwin Pawlowski"
wrote:


"RicodJour" wrote in message

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?

The cover plate has nothing to do with the orientation. Nothing. The
grounding plug is a bit longer than the other two. Like the other guy
said, first to make, last to break.

I was told by an electrician that the practice was changed to ground up a
few years ago. The reason is that if a plug is not all the way into the
receptacle, something dropped, like a paperclip off a desk, will not cross
the two prongs and come to rest. It would most likely slide off.


I suppose it's not enough of an advantage that it's worth changing
existing receptacles that need no other work.

I've also notice that a lot of new appliance cords, as air conditioner, are
made in such a way that they will hang better ground up.


Yes. That applies to my dryer (240V 30A) as well at 120V plugs.

Also. if you have 2 of those for one receptacle, how may have a
problem since the cord on one plug can cover up the other outlet. They
COULD make the cord come out the side, so you'd never have that
problem. BTW, this applies to wall warts (power supplies, remote
control modules, etc...) too.
--
69 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

On Tue, 17 Oct 2006 15:11:32 -0400, Goedjn wrote:



This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation for
an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to install

There are a lot of people with habitual ways of doing it,
and a lot of rationalization to support those ways, but
no particularly compelling reasons.

Ground up means falling conductors hit the ground first.
Ground down means that if the plug falls out under it's
own weight, the ground is the last to go.
Ground down means it looks like a smiley face and
attracts children. Ground up means that the
short prongs are on the bottom where it's
harder to see them when plugging things in.

I go with ground down because that's what
I'm used to.

If you're not consistant about it, it looks sloppy
and irritates the end-user. Was it me, I'd
pick one direction for normal convenience outlets,
and flip them upside down when I wanted to
signal some special-case ones.
(Like switched outlets, or outlets on a generator,
or something.)


I've seen red receptacles in hospitals. I think they do that to
indicate those connected to the emergency generator.

next time you grab a grounded cord to plug it in,
look at it and see which way you've turned it.
That's how the recepticle should go.

--Goedjn


--
69 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

Eigenvector wrote:
"Rich" wrote in message
. ..
"Eigenvector" wrote in message
...
This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation
for an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to
install and I notice (based purely on the text stamped on the outlet
face) that the text on the outlet is upside down if you put the ground
prong on the bottom, but the text on the outlet is rightside up and
readible, the ground prong is on top of the hot and neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a
reason why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad
thing - if only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd
have to always twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.

Ground lug up, for the reason that if a metal cover plate comes off it
hits the ground first. Left to right orientation the hot goes up.

Rich
Alright, I hadn't thought of that.


Most people haven't because (1) most plates in a
house aren't metal (metal usually found only in a
shop or industrial applications)and (2) plates are
screwed on and don't often come off, especially if
a plug is in the socket. Probably have a 1 in
10,000,000 chance of a plate falling off.

In article NbbZg.4316$Z46.1529@trndny05, says...

"RicodJour" wrote in message

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?

The cover plate has nothing to do with the orientation. Nothing. The
grounding plug is a bit longer than the other two. Like the other guy
said, first to make, last to break.

I was told by an electrician that the practice was changed to ground up a
few years ago. The reason is that if a plug is not all the way into the
receptacle, something dropped, like a paperclip off a desk, will not cross
the two prongs and come to rest. It would most likely slide off.

That may be new as a code requirement some places, but as a reason for
putting the ground pin up, it's been around a long time. I recall
reading it in a home workshop guide from the 1950s, can't recall which,
that I got at a used book fair years ago.

--
is Joshua Putnam
http://www.phred.org/~josh/
Braze your own bicycle frames. See
http://www.phred.org/~josh/build/build.html

"Mark Lloyd" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 17 Oct 2006 15:11:32 -0400, Goedjn wrote:



This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation
for
an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to
install

There are a lot of people with habitual ways of doing it,
and a lot of rationalization to support those ways, but
no particularly compelling reasons.

Ground up means falling conductors hit the ground first.
Ground down means that if the plug falls out under it's
own weight, the ground is the last to go.
Ground down means it looks like a smiley face and
attracts children. Ground up means that the
short prongs are on the bottom where it's
harder to see them when plugging things in.

I go with ground down because that's what
I'm used to.

If you're not consistant about it, it looks sloppy
and irritates the end-user. Was it me, I'd
pick one direction for normal convenience outlets,
and flip them upside down when I wanted to
signal some special-case ones.
(Like switched outlets, or outlets on a generator,
or something.)


I've seen red receptacles in hospitals. I think they do that to
indicate those connected to the emergency generator.


That's correct, at least is exactly how we do it in the data centers.
Orange, in this case for emergency power.

next time you grab a grounded cord to plug it in,
look at it and see which way you've turned it.
That's how the recepticle should go.

--Goedjn

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
news:NbbZg.4316$Z46.1529@trndny05...

"RicodJour" wrote in message

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?

The cover plate has nothing to do with the orientation. Nothing. The
grounding plug is a bit longer than the other two. Like the other guy
said, first to make, last to break.

I was told by an electrician that the practice was changed to ground up a
few years ago. The reason is that if a plug is not all the way into the
receptacle, something dropped, like a paperclip off a desk, will not cross
the two prongs and come to rest. It would most likely slide off.

I've also notice that a lot of new appliance cords, as air conditioner,
are made in such a way that they will hang better ground up.
Actually that would explain a lot of things. Every so often I run across a
heavy power adapter where the bulk of the adapter points UP in an outlet. I
totally hate those things because they do flop down unless the ground is
facing up.

"Eigenvector" wrote in
:

This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper
orientation for an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that
I am going to install and I notice (based purely on the text stamped
on the outlet face) that the text on the outlet is upside down if you
put the ground prong on the bottom, but the text on the outlet is
rightside up and readible, the ground prong is on top of the hot and
neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a
reason why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad
thing - if only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd
have to always twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.




Yep it's amazing how much this subject repeats. And every time it get
dead horse beaten.

This solves the problem. An outlet with one up and one down.

http://www.gulliblesucker.com

Well, just to satisfy my own curiosity, and because I knew that continuing
this thread would **** off Tekkie and RicodJour even more, I have posed the
question to my local inspectors office. Maybe in a couple of weeks they'll
respond with a nice sensible answer?


"Jeff Wisnia" wrote in message
et...
RicodJour wrote:
Jeff Wisnia wrote:

George E. Cawthon wrote:

This has been discussed many times here. You can orient the plug any
way you want including horizontally. Most plugs seem to be oriented
with the hole (ground) on the bottom, but other houses have the ground
on the top. Flat plugs are often formed so that a plug with the ground
on the bottom is best. Orient it any way you want, you can always turn
it over later if you want a different orientation.

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?


I can confirm that the metal cover plate reason makes no sense,
regardless of who's bought into the logic and written code to comply.

By the time the ground prong is far enough out of the receptacle hole
to make contact with the cover plate, the other two prongs are far
enough out that the cord is no longer energized.

R


So think about what you just wrote, RicodJour.

With the most often seen "alien face" receptical orientation, if the plug
were pulled out of the receptical maybe 1/16" and if a metal plate
securing screw was missing and the moon was in its correct phase,
vibration might cause the plate to move away from the wall and drop down
so the upper edge of one of it's holes fell across the still connected hot
and neutral plug prongs. That could cause arcing and possibly a spark
ignited fire.

If the receptical were installed in the "cowgirl position" AND a grounded
plug was "slightly uninserted", the loose plate would fall onto the plug's
ground pin and no problem would ensue. Of course, that would only happen
if the plug HAD a ground pin. It wouldn't help squat with a two prong
(ungrounded) plug.

Capice now?

Jeff
--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
"Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength."

George E. Cawthon wrote:

Most people haven't because (1) most plates in a
house aren't metal (metal usually found only in a
shop or industrial applications)and (2) plates are
screwed on and don't often come off, especially if
a plug is in the socket. Probably have a 1 in
10,000,000 chance of a plate falling off.

I see a fair amount of metal plates in older homes and updated newer
ones, and the odds are probably higher than that. We could poll the
people on this newsgroup, mulitply by the number of outlets, on
average, they've lived with over the years, and determine a sample
incident ratio - but let's not.

We're talking about convenience outlets. The proper orientation of an
outlet is that which allows the connecting cord(s) to run the best
course, lay flatest, or most concealed/accessible. In other words,
whatever is most convenient. Any other answer, whether code or
conviction, is based on immaterial and insignificant factors. That
probably helps explain why GFIs usually (always? never saw one that
wasn't) have the test and reset buttons labeled so they're readable
with the ground in either orientation.

R

Heterosexual. One outlet, and one plug. None of this plugamy, or
double male or double female nonsense. It's just not right.

--

Christopher A. Young
You can't shout down a troll.
You have to starve them.
..

"Eigenvector" wrote in message
...
This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper
orientation for
an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to
install
and I notice (based purely on the text stamped on the outlet face)
that the
text on the outlet is upside down if you put the ground prong on the
bottom,
but the text on the outlet is rightside up and readible, the ground
prong is
on top of the hot and neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a
reason
why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad
thing - if
only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd have to
always
twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.

Eigenvector posted for all of us...


"Tekkie®" wrote in message
. ..
Eigenvector posted for all of us...

This might sound like a dumb question,

And it is because once again you have done NO research on this often asked
question. WHEN WILL YOU LEARN?????
--
When will you stop responding to posts you don't like?

That's what I thought.



When YOU stop posting your idiotic questions and learn to research - you are
such an easy target because you are STUPID.
--
Tekkie "There's no such thing as a tool I don't need."

Eigenvector wrote:
Well, just to satisfy my own curiosity, and because I knew that continuing
this thread would **** off Tekkie and RicodJour even more, I have posed the
question to my local inspectors office. Maybe in a couple of weeks they'll
respond with a nice sensible answer?

With all the time you save doing half-hearted Borg searches and
avoiding Your Friend Google, why stop with a local yokel? Go straight
to NEMA. Contact AHJs worldwide and ask for their justifications for
having a panoply of receptacle configurations.

R

Eigenvector wrote:
This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation for
an outlet?

Snip

Not really.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned?

No. NEC 2005 is totally noncommital about it. In fact, GFI outlets have
the 'test' and 'rest' buttons readable in either verticle position.
However, Traister's 'Commercial Electrical Wiring' p.240 shows ground
hole up in vertical orientation and neutral (longer) slot up for
horizontal mounting as preferred practice.

Flip a coin and then just be consistant with the job as a whole.

Joe

RicodJour wrote:


I could dream up a scenario that would compromise any system. Doesn't
mean that it's going to happen, ever did happen, or that my time
dreaming was well spent. This is the alt.home.repair version of how
many angels can dance on the head of a pin.

R


Absatively right, and all of the recepticals in my home have their
ground pin holes on the bottom, and I'm not about to change them until
my home moaners insurance company says they'll cancel the policy if I don't.

Peace,

Jeff

--
Jeffry Wisnia
(W1BSV + Brass Rat '57 EE)
"Rudeness is the weak man's imitation of strength."

On Tue, 17 Oct 2006 18:03:59 -0700, "Eigenvector"
wrote:


"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
news:NbbZg.4316$Z46.1529@trndny05...

"RicodJour" wrote in message

I've heard that "ground pin up" (for the metal wallplate reason) is
required on new work in some parts of Canada.

Can anyone confirm that?

The cover plate has nothing to do with the orientation. Nothing. The
grounding plug is a bit longer than the other two. Like the other guy
said, first to make, last to break.

I was told by an electrician that the practice was changed to ground up a
few years ago. The reason is that if a plug is not all the way into the
receptacle, something dropped, like a paperclip off a desk, will not cross
the two prongs and come to rest. It would most likely slide off.

I've also notice that a lot of new appliance cords, as air conditioner,
are made in such a way that they will hang better ground up.
Actually that would explain a lot of things. Every so often I run across a
heavy power adapter where the bulk of the adapter points UP in an outlet. I
totally hate those things because they do flop down unless the ground is
facing up.


Yes, and the adapter is likely to block the other receptacle (or
multiple receptacles).
--
68 days until the winter solstice celebration

Mark Lloyd
http://notstupid.laughingsquid.com

"God was invented by man for a reason, that
reason is no longer applicable."

On Tue, 17 Oct 2006 20:10:09 -0500, Al Bundy
wrote:

"Eigenvector" wrote in
:

This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper
orientation for an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that
I am going to install and I notice (based purely on the text stamped
on the outlet face) that the text on the outlet is upside down if you
put the ground prong on the bottom, but the text on the outlet is
rightside up and readible, the ground prong is on top of the hot and
neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a
reason why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad
thing - if only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd
have to always twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.




Yep it's amazing how much this subject repeats. And every time it get
dead horse beaten.

This solves the problem. An outlet with one up and one down.

http://www.gulliblesucker.com

Is that supposed to have the grounds pointing toward each other (so
both receptacles sort of make an X), or grounds opposite (diamond
pattern for both receptacles)? I say make them opposite.

If you REALLY want it to work, get one with the grounds on opposite
ends, install it horizontally (hot up on both receptacles), use a
shared neutral circuit and a FPE panel. Then install an automatic wet
paperclip dispenser on the wall, directly over the outlet. :-)

On Wed, 18 Oct 2006 01:25:57 GMT, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

Heterosexual. One outlet, and one plug. None of this plugamy, or
double male or double female nonsense. It's just not right.

I know someone who wanted a triple-male adapter once. Someone who got
his gender mixed up for the holidays.

RicodJour wrote:
George E. Cawthon wrote:
Most people haven't because (1) most plates in a
house aren't metal (metal usually found only in a
shop or industrial applications)and (2) plates are
screwed on and don't often come off, especially if
a plug is in the socket. Probably have a 1 in
10,000,000 chance of a plate falling off.

I see a fair amount of metal plates in older homes and updated newer
ones, and the odds are probably higher than that. We could poll the
people on this newsgroup, mulitply by the number of outlets, on
average, they've lived with over the years, and determine a sample
incident ratio - but let's not.

We're talking about convenience outlets. The proper orientation of an
outlet is that which allows the connecting cord(s) to run the best
course, lay flatest, or most concealed/accessible. In other words,
whatever is most convenient. Any other answer, whether code or
conviction, is based on immaterial and insignificant factors. That
probably helps explain why GFIs usually (always? never saw one that
wasn't) have the test and reset buttons labeled so they're readable
with the ground in either orientation.

R

Completely agree with the paragraph above. I
suppose type of plates may depend on what part of
the country you live in. And certainly people use
all types of material, wood, rock, etc. to make
fancy plates.

The NEC does not care

As a practical matter there is one exception to "it does not
matter" - if you have two or more duplets receptacles side by side it
makes sense to install them in *alternating orientations*, this makes
it more likely you will able to optimize your insertion of a
combinations of plugs and "wall-wart" transformers.

Everyone will make fun of your "sloppy" work, though 8^)

On Mon, 16 Oct 2006 17:11:08 -0700, "Eigenvector"
wrote:

This might sound like a dumb question, but is there a proper orientation for
an outlet? I'm looking at the replacement outlet that I am going to install
and I notice (based purely on the text stamped on the outlet face) that the
text on the outlet is upside down if you put the ground prong on the bottom,
but the text on the outlet is rightside up and readible, the ground prong is
on top of the hot and neutral prong.

Does the orientation matter so far as code is concerned? Is there a reason
why having the ground tap on the top would be necessarily a bad thing - if
only because the cords wouldn't stay in the outlet or you'd have to always
twist the cord 180 degrees when you plugged in.


I have one outlet in each of several rooms that are switched outlets
for lamps. These are oriented opposite the other outlets in the same
rooms (cowgirl position - thanks for the nugget). At a fast glance I
can tell it is switched (builder made). Other homes, switched like
this were all oriented all the same, but the builder put a sticker on
the plastic cover plate - I guess to indicate the switched outlet.
--
Oren

"Well, it doesn't happen all the time, but when it happens, it happens constantly."