Installation of 13HPD heat pump and CB26UH air handler completed
yesterday. The air handler motor has the expected hum but somewhere in
the system is a higher pitched noise. I'm thinking possibly fan bearing
or maybe resonance in the ductwork. Installer said noises were normal,
but the high pitched noise is so irritating that I shut the system down
last night and went back to using the space heaters so I could get some
sleep. Is the Lennox an inherently noisier system than others? After
spending $6000, I'm not entirely happy with the system. Installer says
it's not his problem. Should I contact Lennox or is this as good as it
gets with this type of system?

Bob

"RobertM" wrote in message
...
Installation of 13HPD heat pump and CB26UH air handler completed
yesterday. The air handler motor has the expected hum but somewhere in
the system is a higher pitched noise. I'm thinking possibly fan bearing
or maybe resonance in the ductwork. Installer said noises were normal,
but the high pitched noise is so irritating that I shut the system down
last night and went back to using the space heaters so I could get some
sleep. Is the Lennox an inherently noisier system than others? After
spending $6000, I'm not entirely happy with the system. Installer says
it's not his problem. Should I contact Lennox or is this as good as it
gets with this type of system?

Bob

You spent 6k and your going to let the guy tell you it is normal? I would
be on the phone to him and have the owner back out and work it out. Your
warranty is with the installer first. Lennox will just tell you to call the
guy that put it in.

Air movement noises are normal. High pitched "sounds", are not.
Guessing where the problem is impossible.
Did you or the installer put in the old filter?

SQLit wrote:
"RobertM" wrote in message
...
Installation of 13HPD heat pump and CB26UH air handler completed
yesterday. The air handler motor has the expected hum but somewhere in
the system is a higher pitched noise. I'm thinking possibly fan bearing
or maybe resonance in the ductwork. Installer said noises were normal,
but the high pitched noise is so irritating that I shut the system down
last night and went back to using the space heaters so I could get some
sleep. Is the Lennox an inherently noisier system than others? After
spending $6000, I'm not entirely happy with the system. Installer says
it's not his problem. Should I contact Lennox or is this as good as it
gets with this type of system?

Bob

You spent 6k and your going to let the guy tell you it is normal? I would
be on the phone to him and have the owner back out and work it out. Your
warranty is with the installer first. Lennox will just tell you to call the
guy that put it in.

Air movement noises are normal. High pitched "sounds", are not.
Guessing where the problem is impossible.
Did you or the installer put in the old filter?



There was no old filter. This is a completely new system to replace old
propane space heaters. New ducts, new filter, new everything. This
installer is listed on the Lennox web site as one of their preferred
whatever they call them that has special training and knowledge. I'm not
overly concerned at this point because it has to pass a TVA inspection
in order for the installer to get his money. I realize a system with
moving air isn't going to be a quiet as a space heater and I don't want
to be a ball buster, but I'm thinking this noise isn't normal. I'll call
the owner and try to get him out here to look at it.

Bob

SQLit wrote:
"RobertM" wrote in message
...
Installation of 13HPD heat pump and CB26UH air handler completed
yesterday. The air handler motor has the expected hum but somewhere in
the system is a higher pitched noise. I'm thinking possibly fan bearing
or maybe resonance in the ductwork. Installer said noises were normal,
but the high pitched noise is so irritating that I shut the system down
last night and went back to using the space heaters so I could get some
sleep. Is the Lennox an inherently noisier system than others? After
spending $6000, I'm not entirely happy with the system. Installer says
it's not his problem. Should I contact Lennox or is this as good as it
gets with this type of system?

Bob

You spent 6k and your going to let the guy tell you it is normal? I would
be on the phone to him and have the owner back out and work it out. Your
warranty is with the installer first. Lennox will just tell you to call the
guy that put it in.

Air movement noises are normal. High pitched "sounds", are not.
Guessing where the problem is impossible.
Did you or the installer put in the old filter?


Aha, you are a genius. I was going to take the new filter out to see if
the noise would change. When I opened the grille in front of the filter,
the noise disappeared. I then tapped the grille with the edge of a
screwdriver, and sure enough, the grille rings like a bell at that
frequency. I'll jam some rubber in the sides of the grille to dampen the
vibration.

Thanks,
Bob

RobertM wrote:
SQLit wrote:
"RobertM" wrote in message
...
Installation of 13HPD heat pump and CB26UH air handler completed
yesterday. The air handler motor has the expected hum but somewhere in
the system is a higher pitched noise. I'm thinking possibly fan bearing
or maybe resonance in the ductwork. Installer said noises were normal,
but the high pitched noise is so irritating that I shut the system down
last night and went back to using the space heaters so I could get some
sleep. Is the Lennox an inherently noisier system than others? After
spending $6000, I'm not entirely happy with the system. Installer says
it's not his problem. Should I contact Lennox or is this as good as it
gets with this type of system?

Bob

You spent 6k and your going to let the guy tell you it is normal? I would
be on the phone to him and have the owner back out and work it out. Your
warranty is with the installer first. Lennox will just tell you to call the
guy that put it in.

Air movement noises are normal. High pitched "sounds", are not.
Guessing where the problem is impossible.
Did you or the installer put in the old filter?


Aha, you are a genius. I was going to take the new filter out to see if
the noise would change. When I opened the grille in front of the filter,
the noise disappeared. I then tapped the grille with the edge of a
screwdriver, and sure enough, the grille rings like a bell at that
frequency. I'll jam some rubber in the sides of the grille to dampen the
vibration.

Thanks,
Bob



If it is a high efficiency pleated or washable filter, it will have a
higher than normal resistance to air flow. Try replacing that with a
fiberglass filter.

BTW, your noise is part of the installation, not part of the equipment.
It is the installers fault, not the fault of Lennox. Call Lennox at
1-800-453-6669 in Dallas, TX. Wade through their automated answering
system to get to consumer complaints and leave a complaint. Something
should happen. I have been a Lennox dealer for years, it guggs me when
I see other dealers of any brand pull a line like that. Also call the
BBB and any state or local licensing authority in your area. HE should
fix it, NOT YOU!

Stretch

Stretch wrote:
RobertM wrote:
SQLit wrote:
"RobertM" wrote in message
...
Installation of 13HPD heat pump and CB26UH air handler completed
yesterday. The air handler motor has the expected hum but somewhere in
the system is a higher pitched noise. I'm thinking possibly fan bearing
or maybe resonance in the ductwork. Installer said noises were normal,
but the high pitched noise is so irritating that I shut the system down
last night and went back to using the space heaters so I could get some
sleep. Is the Lennox an inherently noisier system than others? After
spending $6000, I'm not entirely happy with the system. Installer says
it's not his problem. Should I contact Lennox or is this as good as it
gets with this type of system?

Bob
You spent 6k and your going to let the guy tell you it is normal? I would
be on the phone to him and have the owner back out and work it out. Your
warranty is with the installer first. Lennox will just tell you to call the
guy that put it in.

Air movement noises are normal. High pitched "sounds", are not.
Guessing where the problem is impossible.
Did you or the installer put in the old filter?


Aha, you are a genius. I was going to take the new filter out to see if
the noise would change. When I opened the grille in front of the filter,
the noise disappeared. I then tapped the grille with the edge of a
screwdriver, and sure enough, the grille rings like a bell at that
frequency. I'll jam some rubber in the sides of the grille to dampen the
vibration.

Thanks,
Bob



If it is a high efficiency pleated or washable filter, it will have a
higher than normal resistance to air flow. Try replacing that with a
fiberglass filter.

BTW, your noise is part of the installation, not part of the equipment.
It is the installers fault, not the fault of Lennox. Call Lennox at
1-800-453-6669 in Dallas, TX. Wade through their automated answering
system to get to consumer complaints and leave a complaint. Something
should happen. I have been a Lennox dealer for years, it guggs me when
I see other dealers of any brand pull a line like that. Also call the
BBB and any state or local licensing authority in your area. HE should
fix it, NOT YOU!

Stretch


The problem is not the filter itself, but the grille that covers the
filter. I took the grille off and everything is quiet. The vanes of the
grille are such that the air whistles as it goes through. I'm making a
wooden grille to replace the cheap metal grille and that should fix the
problem. If it were something big, I'd go to the BBB and all of that,
but since this is not some major part of the system, I'm not going to
make a supreme court case out of something that I can easily repair in
one evening. Yeah, I could fight them and win. Yes, it should have been
done correctly and yes, the installer is at fault, but it'll be more of
a hassle to fight them than to fix it myself. I am going to call Lennox,
though, and try to get an owner's manual.

Bob

Al Moran wrote:
On Sun, 12 Feb 2006 21:00:01 -0600, RobertM
wrote:


The problem is not the filter itself, but the grille that covers the
filter. I took the grille off and everything is quiet. The vanes of the
grille are such that the air whistles as it goes through. I'm making a
wooden grille to replace the cheap metal grille and that should fix the
problem. If it were something big, I'd go to the BBB and all of that,
but since this is not some major part of the system, I'm not going to
make a supreme court case out of something that I can easily repair in
one evening. Yeah, I could fight them and win. Yes, it should have been
done correctly and yes, the installer is at fault, but it'll be more of
a hassle to fight them than to fix it myself. I am going to call Lennox,
though, and try to get an owner's manual.

Bob


How many tons is the system? What is the size of the return duct? I
have seen a lot of whistling grates be caused by undersized ducts. I'd
be concerned about that if I were you. You may have a larger problem
than you realize.

It's a 1.5 ton and the return filter size is 16 x 20.

Bob

Bob,

Be careful of using a wood return grille. The net free opening is not
as large as a metal grille of the same size, that restricts air flow.
If the fins are 1/3 inch apart, replace it with one that has fins that
are 1/2 inch apart. the further apart the fins, the less likely it is
that it will whistle. Aluminum grilles with 2/3 inches between fins
are even better and look nicer. Sometimes you can bend the fins with
needle nose pliers to make the air go straiget in so the air does not
change direction after going through the grille. Or flip the grille
around 180 degrees for the same reason. If the air is moving across
the fins of the grille before or after it goes through, the grille is
likely to whistle. Hope this helps.

Stretch

Stretch wrote:
Bob,

Be careful of using a wood return grille. The net free opening is not
as large as a metal grille of the same size, that restricts air flow.
If the fins are 1/3 inch apart, replace it with one that has fins that
are 1/2 inch apart. the further apart the fins, the less likely it is
that it will whistle. Aluminum grilles with 2/3 inches between fins
are even better and look nicer. Sometimes you can bend the fins with
needle nose pliers to make the air go straiget in so the air does not
change direction after going through the grille. Or flip the grille
around 180 degrees for the same reason. If the air is moving across
the fins of the grille before or after it goes through, the grille is
likely to whistle. Hope this helps.

Stretch


I called the installer and told him he has a problem and that he'll
either have to increase the duct size or else replace the grille with
something that doesn't whistle. He said he has a heavier grille with the
fins farther apart. I asked him why his crew didn't know this while they
were here installing it. He weaseled around with some bs explanation,
but the real reason of course, is that he used the cheapest grille he
had. Lennox won't send me an owner's manual. They said I have to get it
from the installing dealer. I called a second dealer and told them I
just bought a house that has this model number Lennox in it and I want
to buy a set of owner's manuals. They said they'd be happy to send them
to me for nothing and they'd also like to be the one to do the
maintenance on it and they hope I'll be one of their good customers. I
know I have the warranty, but it doesn't cover routine maintenance. At
this time, without an owner's manual, I don't even know what routine
maintenance is but for sure, I'll go with the 2nd company, not the
installer. I'm assuming any Lennox dealer is authorized to do warranty
repairs.

Bob

Robert M wrote:

I called the installer and told him he has a problem and that he'll
either have to increase the duct size or else replace the grille with
something that doesn't whistle. He said he has a heavier grille with the
fins farther apart. I asked him why his crew didn't know this while they
were here installing it. He weaseled around with some bs explanation,
but the real reason of course, is that he used the cheapest grille he
had. Lennox won't send me an owner's manual. They said I have to get it
from the installing dealer. I called a second dealer and told them I
just bought a house that has this model number Lennox in it and I want
to buy a set of owner's manuals. They said they'd be happy to send them
to me for nothing and they'd also like to be the one to do the
maintenance on it and they hope I'll be one of their good customers. I
know I have the warranty, but it doesn't cover routine maintenance. At
this time, without an owner's manual, I don't even know what routine
maintenance is but for sure, I'll go with the 2nd company, not the
installer. I'm assuming any Lennox dealer is authorized to do warranty
repairs.

Bob



Bob, The labor warranty is covered by the installer. The parts
warranty is covered by Lennox. If anything goes wrong the first year,
use the installer. After that use the second Lennox dealer as the 1
year labor warranty will be gone (assuming the labor warranty is one
year). Hope this helps.

Stretch

Stretch wrote:
Robert M wrote:

I called the installer and told him he has a problem and that he'll
either have to increase the duct size or else replace the grille with
something that doesn't whistle. He said he has a heavier grille with the
fins farther apart. I asked him why his crew didn't know this while they
were here installing it. He weaseled around with some bs explanation,
but the real reason of course, is that he used the cheapest grille he
had. Lennox won't send me an owner's manual. They said I have to get it
from the installing dealer. I called a second dealer and told them I
just bought a house that has this model number Lennox in it and I want
to buy a set of owner's manuals. They said they'd be happy to send them
to me for nothing and they'd also like to be the one to do the
maintenance on it and they hope I'll be one of their good customers. I
know I have the warranty, but it doesn't cover routine maintenance. At
this time, without an owner's manual, I don't even know what routine
maintenance is but for sure, I'll go with the 2nd company, not the
installer. I'm assuming any Lennox dealer is authorized to do warranty
repairs.

Bob



Bob, The labor warranty is covered by the installer. The parts
warranty is covered by Lennox. If anything goes wrong the first year,
use the installer. After that use the second Lennox dealer as the 1
year labor warranty will be gone (assuming the labor warranty is one
year). Hope this helps.

Stretch


Yep, that's a big help. I don't have a copy of the warranty, nor a
sales receipt, nor an owner's manual yet. The only thing i have is the
proposal and some good work done and some questionable work done.

Bob

"RobertM" wrote in message
...

had. Lennox won't send me an owner's manual. They said I have to get it
from the installing dealer.

Boy, that chaps me when factories do that. I've got a Bryant myself and
when
I bought it I had them put in a Bryant humidifier. The first time I went to
order a media pad for it I called the installer several times and he never
called me back, finally after repeated calling his cell # over weeks of
time,
he tells me Bryant says the part# is obsolete and he can't order it. So
I called Bryant and they said yes, it's been obsoleted, but there's a cross
to a new number and gave me that. So I call back the installer and bitch
him out for being a lazy ass, give him the new number, and he gets the media
pad.

The second time a few years later that I replaced the pad now the installers
phone is disconnected, and he's no longer listed in the phone book. So I
call another dealer, give them the new part number, and I get the same
damn runaround again, that new number has been obsoleted and they
can't order it. So I called Bryant again and now they
had gone like Lennox and were referring every query to the dealers. I
called
every local dealer and they were not willing to get a part number for me
even
when I asked them to order the media filter for me. (which none of them
did,
claiming that Bryant didn't sell any such media filter)

Finally I dug around on the Internet and found an online dealer of
aftermarket
furnace parts, and they had the new, new part# online. I called back the
same
dealer that had claimed Bryant didn't make such a part and gave him the
new part number and told him to look it up. Wonder of wonders now
it's available. The dealer then asked me how many I wanted to buy and
I told him None, and explained exactly why I wasn't going to buy anything
from him. Then I hung up and ordered it from the online place and got
it a week later. And not only that but it was 1/3 of the cost the dealer
quoted. (BTW, Carrier = Bryant)

It's the old story of the dealers are quick to service you when they smell
a $500 sale somewhere, but call them for a small $30 item and they
just want you to go **** off.

I just wish the damn furnace factories would realize that the dealers screw
them over just as much as help them, and that customers who are calling
the factory are not stupid, and are deliberately going around the dealer
chain
because the dealer chain isn't doing anything for them. I'm a person who
swaps engines and repairs my own appliances, and I'm not ever going to be
calling a dealer service department to come out and replace a humidifier
filter, so why does the factory think that if they try to shut me out that
I'm
going to go spend money at their dealers? The dealer chain doesen't want
to hear from people like me anyhow, they want to hear from the little old
lady who is willing to pay $200 on a service call to replace a $30 media
pad. Well, if I can't get an answer from the factory, that's just going to
push me right into the 3rd party suppliers and once I start buying my parts
from them, the factory will never see a dime of my money again.

Ted