Home |
Search |
Today's Posts |
|
Electronics Repair (sci.electronics.repair) Discussion of repairing electronic equipment. Topics include requests for assistance, where to obtain servicing information and parts, techniques for diagnosis and repair, and annecdotes about success, failures and problems. |
Reply |
|
LinkBack | Thread Tools | Display Modes |
#1
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
What's the latest in Desoldering gadgets?
Back in the 70s, I used a red bulb with a special plastic tip that did
not melt. They were cheap and did a fair job. Then there was solder wick. That worked well on PC boards, but not real well on terminal strips and tube sockets. Plus is was fairly costly. So, what's the latest in desoldering gadgets? I need to get something for recapping, and am not sure what to buy. I see both of the (above) are still sold. One other thing, I should pick up some pot and switch cleaner. I know this has greatly changed due to clean air laws. Where do I even begin getting something that works well, and is not overly priced? (Brand name)? I hope they have not made useless cleaners, like they have done with auto products. (I remember when carb cleaner actually cleaned!!! ) Since it appears that most online stores have a rather large minimum order as well as high shipping fees, I am limited to Radio Shack, unless there is some smaller online source that sells in small quanties, or maybe ebay. But buying online I need to know what I am ordering ahead of time. I'll be using this almost entirely on 40 to 60 year old tube type electronics. |
#2
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
What's the latest in Desoldering gadgets?
On 2/20/2017 6:37 AM, wrote:
So, what's the latest in desoldering gadgets? One of these. http://www.ebay.com/itm/381865048840 One other thing, I should pick up some pot and switch cleaner. https://www.radioshack.com/products/deoxit-d5s-6-spray-contact-cleaner-and-rejuvenator -- Jeff-1.0 wa6fwi http://www.foxsmercantile.com |
#3
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
What's the latest in Desoldering gadgets?
On Monday, February 20, 2017 at 7:38:10 AM UTC-5, wrote:
Back in the 70s, I used a red bulb with a special plastic tip that did not melt. They were cheap and did a fair job. Then there was solder wick. That worked well on PC boards, but not real well on terminal strips and tube sockets. Plus is was fairly costly. So, what's the latest in desoldering gadgets? I need to get something for recapping, and am not sure what to buy. I see both of the (above) are still sold. One other thing, I should pick up some pot and switch cleaner. I know this has greatly changed due to clean air laws. Where do I even begin getting something that works well, and is not overly priced? (Brand name)? I hope they have not made useless cleaners, like they have done with auto products. (I remember when carb cleaner actually cleaned!!! ) Since it appears that most online stores have a rather large minimum order as well as high shipping fees, I am limited to Radio Shack, unless there is some smaller online source that sells in small quanties, or maybe ebay. But buying online I need to know what I am ordering ahead of time. I'll be using this almost entirely on 40 to 60 year old tube type electronics. For through hole type stuff I love my DP-100. It pays to clean up the o-ring every now and then. George H. |
#4
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
What's the latest in Desoldering gadgets?
On Monday, February 20, 2017 at 7:38:10 AM UTC-5, wrote:
So, what's the latest in desoldering gadgets? I need to get something for recapping, and am not sure what to buy. I see both of the (above) are still sold. Well, you are certainly asking a lot of good questions! I keep a number of things on the bench - and my wife, entirely unsolicited, purchased a fancy solder & rework station for me with hot air and such. Yes, it is from China, but she even as she is aware of my resistance to things from China, she also a very practical individual, and spending many hundreds vs. less than $80 does appeal. The hot air wand does a great job on boards, and the 'tunable' soldering iron can get hot enough for even 50-50 solder to liquefy. https://images-na.ssl-images-amazon....wL._SX342_.jpg Is an excellent tool for fine work. https://cdn.shopify.com/s/files/1/07...g?v=1431988566 What my wife got me. A bulb is fine in most cases, but manipulating it can be awkward. Soldering braid is critical for board work. Note that for years, I got away with a simple 38-watt pencil, a bulb, dental picks and patience. But when I became more seriously involved with audio and boards, I got fancy. As to pot and switch cleaner - there are several schools of thought on this - and Jeff is a purist. Rather than start a dead debate all over again, DeOxit in the quantities you will use (with care) is just fine. Peter Wieck Melrose Park, PA |
#5
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
|
#6
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
What's the latest in Desoldering gadgets?
On 2017/02/20 5:46 AM, Foxs Mercantile wrote:
On 2/20/2017 6:37 AM, wrote: So, what's the latest in desoldering gadgets? One of these. http://www.ebay.com/itm/381865048840 If you are going to recommend a desoldering pump I suggest you stick with the Solda-Pullet (made in USA). I have used the no-name knockoffs and they don't last a month in our shop, whereas I have three Solda-pullets that I bought over ten years ago that see daily duty and other than replacing the tip from time to time just last and last. We bought a fourth one recently and it too is running fine. The knockoffs are just a waste of money. One other thing, I should pick up some pot and switch cleaner. https://www.radioshack.com/products/deoxit-d5s-6-spray-contact-cleaner-and-rejuvenator De-Oxit is pretty good for what it does I hear. We use Nu-trol from MG Chemicals and it gives long term repair to pots and contacts. John :-#)# -- (Please post followups or tech inquiries to the USENET newsgroup) John's Jukes Ltd. 2343 Main St., Vancouver, BC, Canada V5T 3C9 (604)872-5757 or Fax 872-2010 (Pinballs, Jukes, Video Games) www.flippers.com "Old pinballers never die, they just flip out." |
#7
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 13:20:55 -0600, oldschool wrote:
http://www.ohgizmo.com/2006/03/06/th...ofer-ever-made Didn't ElectroVoice sell a 30 inch speaker? It wasn't as big but you could actually buy one. -- Jim Mueller To get my real email address, replace wrongname with dadoheadman. Then replace nospam with fastmail. Lastly, replace com with us. |
#8
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Monday, February 20, 2017 at 4:18:03 PM UTC-5, Jim Mueller wrote:
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 13:20:55 -0600, oldschool wrote: http://www.ohgizmo.com/2006/03/06/th...ofer-ever-made Didn't ElectroVoice sell a 30 inch speaker? It wasn't as big but you could actually buy one. -- Jim Mueller To get my real email address, replace wrongname with dadoheadman. Then replace nospam with fastmail. Lastly, replace com with us. Our church has a pipe organ that uses electronics for the lowest notes as they don't have room for the length required for a pure pipe bass. That sub would be perfect.. |
#10
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
|
#11
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 13:20:55 -0600, wrote:
http://www.ohgizmo.com/2006/03/06/th...ofer-ever-made Not even close. The approx 4 story tall horn that NASA built to reproduce the sound of an Apollo launch will take that honor. The speaker was used to test sound mitigating techniques. I believe it is located at Redstone. John John DeArmond http://www.neon-john.com http://www.tnduction.com Tellico Plains, Occupied TN See website for email address |
#12
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Tue, 21 Feb 2017 12:33:12 -0500, Neon John wrote:
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 13:20:55 -0600, wrote: http://www.ohgizmo.com/2006/03/06/th...ofer-ever-made Not even close. The approx 4 story tall horn that NASA built to reproduce the sound of an Apollo launch will take that honor. The speaker was used to test sound mitigating techniques. I believe it is located at Redstone. John John DeArmond I did not find that one on the web, but I did find THIS: http://alex-audio.com/en/prod/world-biggest-speaker/ The Woofers are 80 inches each.... Handle 5000 watts per channel. Heck, that would involve a power amp with around 200 6L6 or 807 tubes in Push-Pull Parallel-Parallel-Parallel-Parallel etc... For EACH channel...... (And an output transformer about 3 foot big, weighing close to the weight of a Harley motor cycle, and costing 10X the price for a brand new Harley)..... |
#13
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On 20 Feb 2017 21:18:00 GMT, Jim Mueller wrote:
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 13:20:55 -0600, oldschool wrote: http://www.ohgizmo.com/2006/03/06/th...ofer-ever-made Didn't ElectroVoice sell a 30 inch speaker? It wasn't as big but you could actually buy one. I do recall hearing about such a speaker..... I recall in the early 70's when 15" was the biggest speaker sold, that some company came out with an 18". Of course I wanted a pair of them until I saw the price.... |
#14
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
What's the latest in Desoldering gadgets?
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 06:37:49 -0600, oldschool wrote:
Back in the 70s, I used a red bulb with a special plastic tip that did not melt. They were cheap and did a fair job. The red bulb ones don't work very well; the bulb is too small. The ones with a larger blue bulb are much better. But the main problem with bulb type solder suckers is cleaning them. You can shake a fair amount of the old solder out of the bulb but quite a bit remains. You have to be imaginative and patient to get it out. -- Jim Mueller To get my real email address, replace wrongname with dadoheadman. Then replace nospam with fastmail. Lastly, replace com with us. |
#15
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
What's the latest in Desoldering gadgets?
On 21 Feb 2017 21:03:51 GMT, Jim Mueller wrote:
On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 06:37:49 -0600, oldschool wrote: Back in the 70s, I used a red bulb with a special plastic tip that did not melt. They were cheap and did a fair job. The red bulb ones don't work very well; the bulb is too small. The ones with a larger blue bulb are much better. But the main problem with bulb type solder suckers is cleaning them. You can shake a fair amount of the old solder out of the bulb but quite a bit remains. You have to be imaginative and patient to get it out. I've never seen the blue ones, but I remember having a lot of problems with the tip getting clogged in the red one. |
#16
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
In article om,
Jim Mueller wrote: On Mon, 20 Feb 2017 13:20:55 -0600, oldschool wrote: http://www.ohgizmo.com/2006/03/06/th...ofer-ever-made Didn't ElectroVoice sell a 30 inch speaker? It wasn't as big but you could actually buy one. ElectroVoice did briefly offer a 30" woofer. It didn't sound very good and didn't last very long on the market. Here's the backstory: Paul Klipsch (father of the Klipschorn) had cut a deal with EV where EV provided 15" woofers with special characteristics to Paul to use in the 'Horns, and in exchange Klipsch licensed EV to produce both kits and ready-built versions of a modified K-Horn. (It was the EV "Georgian" in case you're interested). The mods EV had made offended Klipsch, so he was already ****ed at them (picky, he was), and then when the woofers they were sending started showing up with cracked magnets Paul cancelled the agreement and found another source for his woofers. EV, no longer able to offer an enclosure with the bottom end provided by a horn woofer, tried to replace it with that 30" behemoth in a more "standard" enclosure. Didn't work out. Later, EV tried a scaled-up version of the horn, using an 18" woofer (the "Patrician IV"). Paul told them that wouldn't sound right but they didn't listen. As usual, he was right. Isaac |
#17
Posted to rec.antiques.radio+phono,sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
|
#18
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 16:11:20 -0600, Jon Elson wrote:
wrote: On Tue, 21 Feb 2017 12:33:12 -0500, Neon John wrote: The Woofers are 80 inches each.... Handle 5000 watts per channel. Heck, that would involve a power amp with around 200 6L6 or 807 tubes in Push-Pull Parallel-Parallel-Parallel-Parallel etc... For EACH channel...... (And an output transformer about 3 foot big, weighing close to the weight of a Harley motor cycle, and costing 10X the price for a brand new Harley)..... No, certainly not! You use the modulator from an old AM broadcast transmitter. I was at a Grateful Dead concert in 1969 and they wheeled out this THING on the stage with big glass globes, and when they lit up I realized they were TUBES (valves to the British)! Not sure of the type, but at least several thousand Watts. I borrowed a set of ear muffs and sat back for a show! Jon I was at several Grateful Dead concerts in the late 60's and afterwards. I never saw any such thing. Are you sure you were not "tripping"? That may have just been a common 6L6 tube in a guitar amp, and your hallucinations made it look really BIG.... Who ever heard of wearing earmuffs at a Grateful Dead concert..... And since you mentioned it. What the hell is wrong with them British? Valves are plumbing parts. Tubes are electronic parts!!! Seriously, I have heard of using AM transmitter tubes for audio amps. I dont know what those tubes are numbered, or how much power they output, but I know that many AM radio stations have power output in the thousands of watts range. But to use that kind of tube would require custom output transformers that would likely mimic the pole transformers used to feed our homes.... And just for historic value, the original 1969 Woodstock concert ran Somewhere between 3500 watts to 12,000 watts, using Mcintosh mi350 monoblock tube amps for their PA system. The article below seems to conflict whether it was 3,500W or 12,000W. Either way, that PA system had to cover a very large area, and apparently it did the job. http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100811 These Mcintosh MC3500 power amps have EIGHT power output tubes 6LQ6/6JE6B. These amps had an output of 350W. (mono). |
#19
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Sat, 25 Feb 2017, wrote:
On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 16:11:20 -0600, Jon Elson wrote: wrote: On Tue, 21 Feb 2017 12:33:12 -0500, Neon John wrote: The Woofers are 80 inches each.... Handle 5000 watts per channel. Heck, that would involve a power amp with around 200 6L6 or 807 tubes in Push-Pull Parallel-Parallel-Parallel-Parallel etc... For EACH channel...... (And an output transformer about 3 foot big, weighing close to the weight of a Harley motor cycle, and costing 10X the price for a brand new Harley)..... No, certainly not! You use the modulator from an old AM broadcast transmitter. I was at a Grateful Dead concert in 1969 and they wheeled out this THING on the stage with big glass globes, and when they lit up I realized they were TUBES (valves to the British)! Not sure of the type, but at least several thousand Watts. I borrowed a set of ear muffs and sat back for a show! Jon I was at several Grateful Dead concerts in the late 60's and afterwards. I never saw any such thing. Are you sure you were not "tripping"? That may have just been a common 6L6 tube in a guitar amp, and your hallucinations made it look really BIG.... They went through various iterations, and sound people. SOmeone got hooked in at one point, maybe it was Bob Heil but maybe it was the soundman for Quicksilver Messenger Service (who was also a ham), there was s story of someone having an Electrovoice "Voice of the Theatre" or whatever it was adapting that. Owsley was involved, leading to the Wall of SOund, which almost as soon as they finally got it going right, they abandoned. They were using McIntosh amplifiers for a while, there's a story, maybe about Woodstock, where they blew them out and had to hurry to find replacements, finding a "close" dealership and getting them to open up on a Sunday or something. Things were evolving, and bands like the Dead helped that developemnt. So they went to that Wall of SOund to adapt to the much bigger venues, then dropped it because it was too much trouble to move, but I thought the work helped other things to develop. So they may have been using just about anything at some point, including home built equipment. If you paralleled enough tubes, the output impedance would go down, so no matching transformer for 8ohm speakers. I'm not sure if that was ever done with audio, but I have seen it done with radio amplifiers, a bunch of tubes in parallel so the output impedance is 50 ohms to match the coax. Michael |
#20
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Sat, 25 Feb 2017 12:12:56 -0500, Michael Black wrote:
On Sat, 25 Feb 2017, wrote: On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 16:11:20 -0600, Jon Elson wrote: wrote: No, certainly not! You use the modulator from an old AM broadcast transmitter. I was at a Grateful Dead concert in 1969 and they wheeled out this THING on the stage with big glass globes, and when they lit up I realized they were TUBES (valves to the British)! Not sure of the type, but at least several thousand Watts. I borrowed a set of ear muffs and sat back for a show! Jon I was at several Grateful Dead concerts in the late 60's and afterwards. I never saw any such thing. Are you sure you were not "tripping"? That may have just been a common 6L6 tube in a guitar amp, and your hallucinations made it look really BIG.... They went through various iterations, and sound people. SOmeone got hooked in at one point, maybe it was Bob Heil but maybe it was the soundman for Quicksilver Messenger Service (who was also a ham), there was s story of someone having an Electrovoice "Voice of the Theatre" or whatever it was adapting that. Owsley was involved, leading to the Wall of SOund, which almost as soon as they finally got it going right, they abandoned. They were using McIntosh amplifiers for a while, there's a story, maybe about Woodstock, where they blew them out and had to hurry to find replacements, finding a "close" dealership and getting them to open up on a Sunday or something. Things were evolving, and bands like the Dead helped that developemnt. So they went to that Wall of SOund to adapt to the much bigger venues, then dropped it because it was too much trouble to move, but I thought the work helped other things to develop. So they may have been using just about anything at some point, including home built equipment. If you paralleled enough tubes, the output impedance would go down, so no matching transformer for 8ohm speakers. I'm not sure if that was ever done with audio, but I have seen it done with radio amplifiers, a bunch of tubes in parallel so the output impedance is 50 ohms to match the coax. Michael This is a good article about the "Wall of Sound". It was (and probably still is) the greatest sound system ever built, but it nearly bankrupt the Dead, and moving all that equipmnt from show to show does seem very impractical. Those mcintosh MC3500 amps are still the best anps ever built. More powerful solid state amps have been built, but none can match that tube sound. https://motherboard.vice.com/en_us/a...-wall-of-sound I dont doubt that there were fried amps, blown speakers and so on at those concerts. Everything was being run at Max power and much of this was still in development stages. Paralleled tubes like you said, dont seem real practical for audio amps. Having that high DC voltage on the speaker leads seems very dangerous. |
#21
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
wrote:
Seriously, I have heard of using AM transmitter tubes for audio amps. I don't know what those tubes are numbered, or how much power they output, but I know that many AM radio stations have power output in the thousands of watts range. But to use that kind of tube would require custom output transformers that would likely mimic the pole transformers used to feed our homes.... A pole pig would wave been useless, since they weren't designed to pass DC, and they aren't center tapped on the primary. On top of that, they would have a horrible frequency response, because they were designed to operate at 60Hz. A 25KW, plate modulated AM transmitter would produce 12.5 KW of audio but you would have needed to a hundred amps of three phase 480VAC to power it. Something I doubt that was available on that farm, or from portable generators. You could move the modulator from a 5KW AM transmitter, but the modulation transformer weighed over a ton. We had to abandon one from a Gates transmitter that was bought from WQBQ for spate parts. Sadly, it was only a couple years old, and one of the premium replacements from Peter Dahl. And just for historic value, the original 1969 Woodstock concert ran Somewhere between 3500 watts to 12,000 watts, using Mcintosh mi350 monoblock tube amps for their PA system. The article below seems to conflict whether it was 3,500W or 12,000W. Either way, that PA system had to cover a very large area, and apparently it did the job. Those Mcintosh amps were not designed for that type of service. http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100811 These Mcintosh MC3500 power amps have EIGHT power output tubes 6LQ6/6JE6B. These amps had an output of 350W. (mono). The RCA TTU-1/TTU-25 UHF TV transmitters used 16 6146 tubes in parallel for a video amp with a response from DC to over five MHz. It was a 'Distributed Amplifier'. -- Never **** off an Engineer! They don't get mad. They don't get even. They go for over unity! ;-) |
#22
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
wrote:
Seriously, I have heard of using AM transmitter tubes for audio amps. I don't know what those tubes are numbered, or how much power they output, but I know that many AM radio stations have power output in the thousands of watts range. But to use that kind of tube would require custom output transformers that would likely mimic the pole transformers used to feed our homes.... A pole pig would wave been useless, since they weren't designed to pass DC, and they aren't center tapped on the primary. On top of that, they would have a horrible frequency response, because they were designed to operate at 60Hz. A 25KW, plate modulated AM transmitter would produce 12.5 KW of audio but you would have needed to a hundred amps of three phase 480VAC to power it. Something I doubt that was available on that farm, or from portable generators. You could move the modulator from a 5KW AM transmitter, but the modulation transformer weighed over a ton. We had to abandon one from a Gates transmitter that was bought from WQBQ for spate parts. Sadly, it was only a couple years old, and one of the premium replacements from Peter Dahl. And just for historic value, the original 1969 Woodstock concert ran Somewhere between 3500 watts to 12,000 watts, using Mcintosh mi350 monoblock tube amps for their PA system. The article below seems to conflict whether it was 3,500W or 12,000W. Either way, that PA system had to cover a very large area, and apparently it did the job. Those Mcintosh amps were not designed for that type of service. http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100811 These Mcintosh MC3500 power amps have EIGHT power output tubes 6LQ6/6JE6B. These amps had an output of 350W. (mono). The RCA TTU-1/TTU-25 UHF TV transmitters used 16 6146 tubes in parallel for a video amp with a response from DC to over five MHz. It was a 'Distributed Amplifier'. -- Never **** off an Engineer! They don't get mad. They don't get even. They go for over unity! ;-) |
#23
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Sun, 26 Feb 2017 22:17:57 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote: wrote: Seriously, I have heard of using AM transmitter tubes for audio amps. I don't know what those tubes are numbered, or how much power they output, but I know that many AM radio stations have power output in the thousands of watts range. But to use that kind of tube would require custom output transformers that would likely mimic the pole transformers used to feed our homes.... A pole pig would wave been useless, since they weren't designed to pass DC, and they aren't center tapped on the primary. On top of that, they would have a horrible frequency response, because they were designed to operate at 60Hz. Thats right, no center tap.... Back to the drawing board A 25KW, plate modulated AM transmitter would produce 12.5 KW of audio but you would have needed to a hundred amps of three phase 480VAC to power it. Something I doubt that was available on that farm, or from portable generators. You could move the modulator from a 5KW AM transmitter, but the modulation transformer weighed over a ton. We had to abandon one from a Gates transmitter that was bought from WQBQ for spate parts. Sadly, it was only a couple years old, and one of the premium replacements from Peter Dahl. Too bad you abandoned that transformer. You should have rented a skid loader or farm tractor with a loader. My 1959 farm tractor, which is small compared to modern ones, lifts round bales of hay all the time. They weight anywhere from 650 lbs to 1800 lbs. It struggles on those 1800 lb ones, but a larger tractor could easily handle a ton or more. (I dont buy or make bales larger than 1500 lbs). And just for historic value, the original 1969 Woodstock concert ran Somewhere between 3500 watts to 12,000 watts, using Mcintosh mi350 monoblock tube amps for their PA system. The article below seems to conflict whether it was 3,500W or 12,000W. Either way, that PA system had to cover a very large area, and apparently it did the job. Those Mcintosh amps were not designed for that type of service. I thought that same thing, but they apparently can and did handle that abuse, The Greatful Dead,"Wall of Sound". Was entirely run from Mcintosh MC3500, Tube amps, and the MC2300 solid state amps, having a total of around 28,000 watts. Not the intended use, but they held up.... http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100811 These Mcintosh MC3500 power amps have EIGHT power output tubes 6LQ6/6JE6B. These amps had an output of 350W. (mono). The RCA TTU-1/TTU-25 UHF TV transmitters used 16 6146 tubes in parallel for a video amp with a response from DC to over five MHz. It was a 'Distributed Amplifier'. Im not real familiar with transmitters, but I know that tube is used in Ham transmitters and is similar to a 6L6 (or am I thinking 6LQ6?). |
#24
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Sun, 26 Feb 2017 22:17:57 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell"
wrote: wrote: Seriously, I have heard of using AM transmitter tubes for audio amps. I don't know what those tubes are numbered, or how much power they output, but I know that many AM radio stations have power output in the thousands of watts range. But to use that kind of tube would require custom output transformers that would likely mimic the pole transformers used to feed our homes.... A pole pig would wave been useless, since they weren't designed to pass DC, and they aren't center tapped on the primary. On top of that, they would have a horrible frequency response, because they were designed to operate at 60Hz. Thats right, no center tap.... Back to the drawing board A 25KW, plate modulated AM transmitter would produce 12.5 KW of audio but you would have needed to a hundred amps of three phase 480VAC to power it. Something I doubt that was available on that farm, or from portable generators. You could move the modulator from a 5KW AM transmitter, but the modulation transformer weighed over a ton. We had to abandon one from a Gates transmitter that was bought from WQBQ for spate parts. Sadly, it was only a couple years old, and one of the premium replacements from Peter Dahl. Too bad you abandoned that transformer. You should have rented a skid loader or farm tractor with a loader. My 1959 farm tractor, which is small compared to modern ones, lifts round bales of hay all the time. They weight anywhere from 650 lbs to 1800 lbs. It struggles on those 1800 lb ones, but a larger tractor could easily handle a ton or more. (I dont buy or make bales larger than 1500 lbs). And just for historic value, the original 1969 Woodstock concert ran Somewhere between 3500 watts to 12,000 watts, using Mcintosh mi350 monoblock tube amps for their PA system. The article below seems to conflict whether it was 3,500W or 12,000W. Either way, that PA system had to cover a very large area, and apparently it did the job. Those Mcintosh amps were not designed for that type of service. I thought that same thing, but they apparently can and did handle that abuse, The Greatful Dead,"Wall of Sound". Was entirely run from Mcintosh MC3500, Tube amps, and the MC2300 solid state amps, having a total of around 28,000 watts. Not the intended use, but they held up.... http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100811 These Mcintosh MC3500 power amps have EIGHT power output tubes 6LQ6/6JE6B. These amps had an output of 350W. (mono). The RCA TTU-1/TTU-25 UHF TV transmitters used 16 6146 tubes in parallel for a video amp with a response from DC to over five MHz. It was a 'Distributed Amplifier'. Im not real familiar with transmitters, but I know that tube is used in Ham transmitters and is similar to a 6L6 (or am I thinking 6LQ6?). |
#25
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Mon, 27 Feb 2017, wrote:
On Sun, 26 Feb 2017 22:17:57 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell" wrote: wrote: Seriously, I have heard of using AM transmitter tubes for audio amps. I don't know what those tubes are numbered, or how much power they output, but I know that many AM radio stations have power output in the thousands of watts range. But to use that kind of tube would require custom output transformers that would likely mimic the pole transformers used to feed our homes.... A pole pig would wave been useless, since they weren't designed to pass DC, and they aren't center tapped on the primary. On top of that, they would have a horrible frequency response, because they were designed to operate at 60Hz. Thats right, no center tap.... Back to the drawing board A 25KW, plate modulated AM transmitter would produce 12.5 KW of audio but you would have needed to a hundred amps of three phase 480VAC to power it. Something I doubt that was available on that farm, or from portable generators. You could move the modulator from a 5KW AM transmitter, but the modulation transformer weighed over a ton. We had to abandon one from a Gates transmitter that was bought from WQBQ for spate parts. Sadly, it was only a couple years old, and one of the premium replacements from Peter Dahl. Too bad you abandoned that transformer. You should have rented a skid loader or farm tractor with a loader. My 1959 farm tractor, which is small compared to modern ones, lifts round bales of hay all the time. They weight anywhere from 650 lbs to 1800 lbs. It struggles on those 1800 lb ones, but a larger tractor could easily handle a ton or more. (I dont buy or make bales larger than 1500 lbs). And just for historic value, the original 1969 Woodstock concert ran Somewhere between 3500 watts to 12,000 watts, using Mcintosh mi350 monoblock tube amps for their PA system. The article below seems to conflict whether it was 3,500W or 12,000W. Either way, that PA system had to cover a very large area, and apparently it did the job. Those Mcintosh amps were not designed for that type of service. I thought that same thing, but they apparently can and did handle that abuse, The Greatful Dead,"Wall of Sound". Was entirely run from Mcintosh MC3500, Tube amps, and the MC2300 solid state amps, having a total of around 28,000 watts. Not the intended use, but they held up.... http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100811 These Mcintosh MC3500 power amps have EIGHT power output tubes 6LQ6/6JE6B. These amps had an output of 350W. (mono). The RCA TTU-1/TTU-25 UHF TV transmitters used 16 6146 tubes in parallel for a video amp with a response from DC to over five MHz. It was a 'Distributed Amplifier'. Im not real familiar with transmitters, but I know that tube is used in Ham transmitters and is similar to a 6L6 (or am I thinking 6LQ6?). The 6L6 was seen in ham transmitters quite a bit. But I think you're thinking of the 807 (and there was also the 1629, I think I got that number right) which was similar, and there was a long supply of them in the surplus market well after WWII. Michael |
#26
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
In article le.org,
says... On Mon, 27 Feb 2017, wrote: On Sun, 26 Feb 2017 22:17:57 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell" wrote: wrote: Seriously, I have heard of using AM transmitter tubes for audio amps. I don't know what those tubes are numbered, or how much power they output, but I know that many AM radio stations have power output in the thousands of watts range. But to use that kind of tube would require custom output transformers that would likely mimic the pole transformers used to feed our homes.... A pole pig would wave been useless, since they weren't designed to pass DC, and they aren't center tapped on the primary. On top of that, they would have a horrible frequency response, because they were designed to operate at 60Hz. Thats right, no center tap.... Back to the drawing board A 25KW, plate modulated AM transmitter would produce 12.5 KW of audio but you would have needed to a hundred amps of three phase 480VAC to power it. Something I doubt that was available on that farm, or from portable generators. You could move the modulator from a 5KW AM transmitter, but the modulation transformer weighed over a ton. We had to abandon one from a Gates transmitter that was bought from WQBQ for spate parts. Sadly, it was only a couple years old, and one of the premium replacements from Peter Dahl. Too bad you abandoned that transformer. You should have rented a skid loader or farm tractor with a loader. My 1959 farm tractor, which is small compared to modern ones, lifts round bales of hay all the time. They weight anywhere from 650 lbs to 1800 lbs. It struggles on those 1800 lb ones, but a larger tractor could easily handle a ton or more. (I dont buy or make bales larger than 1500 lbs). And just for historic value, the original 1969 Woodstock concert ran Somewhere between 3500 watts to 12,000 watts, using Mcintosh mi350 monoblock tube amps for their PA system. The article below seems to conflict whether it was 3,500W or 12,000W. Either way, that PA system had to cover a very large area, and apparently it did the job. Those Mcintosh amps were not designed for that type of service. I thought that same thing, but they apparently can and did handle that abuse, The Greatful Dead,"Wall of Sound". Was entirely run from Mcintosh MC3500, Tube amps, and the MC2300 solid state amps, having a total of around 28,000 watts. Not the intended use, but they held up.... http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100811 These Mcintosh MC3500 power amps have EIGHT power output tubes 6LQ6/6JE6B. These amps had an output of 350W. (mono). The RCA TTU-1/TTU-25 UHF TV transmitters used 16 6146 tubes in parallel for a video amp with a response from DC to over five MHz. It was a 'Distributed Amplifier'. Im not real familiar with transmitters, but I know that tube is used in Ham transmitters and is similar to a 6L6 (or am I thinking 6LQ6?). The 6L6 was seen in ham transmitters quite a bit. But I think you're thinking of the 807 (and there was also the 1629, I think I got that number right) which was similar, and there was a long supply of them in the surplus market well after WWII. The 807 and 1625 were very similar. The 807 had a 6.3 volt filiment and the 1625 had a 12.6. They were cheap on the war suplus market after WW2. Still plenty of then around up to atleast 1975 or so. Many home built ham transmitters used them. They were also used in some high power audio equipment. Many of the commercial built transmitters of ham and public service started using the 6146 series of tubes as they were not that expensive and would go to about 200 MHz with no big problem. When color TV sets started using the 6LQ6, 6JE6 and a few other sweep tubes they were very inexpensive compaired to other power tubes and could put out a lot of power for the cost in SSB usage that was becomming popular on the ham bands. During that time many ham transceivers put out about 100 watts and it took a pair of the 6146 or 6xx6 series of tubes. As the TV sets started going all solid state and the 6xx6 series quit being made in large quanties the price started going up. About that time transistors that could put out the same power were comming down and would work off 12 volts DC were comming down in price. That killed off the market for those tubes in new equipment. Now transistors and othe solid state devices that can handle 500 and 1000 watts at RF are comming out, it is starting to kill off the market for tubes in that power range. Very few tubes are being made in the US now,and lots of replacements for the older tubes are comming from Russia, and China. |
#27
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
wrote:
On Sun, 26 Feb 2017 22:17:57 -0500, "Michael A. Terrell" wrote: wrote: Seriously, I have heard of using AM transmitter tubes for audio amps. I don't know what those tubes are numbered, or how much power they output, but I know that many AM radio stations have power output in the thousands of watts range. But to use that kind of tube would require custom output transformers that would likely mimic the pole transformers used to feed our homes.... A pole pig would wave been useless, since they weren't designed to pass DC, and they aren't center tapped on the primary. On top of that, they would have a horrible frequency response, because they were designed to operate at 60Hz. Thats right, no center tap.... Back to the drawing board A 25KW, plate modulated AM transmitter would produce 12.5 KW of audio but you would have needed to a hundred amps of three phase 480VAC to power it. Something I doubt that was available on that farm, or from portable generators. You could move the modulator from a 5KW AM transmitter, but the modulation transformer weighed over a ton. We had to abandon one from a Gates transmitter that was bought from WQBQ for spate parts. Sadly, it was only a couple years old, and one of the premium replacements from Peter Dahl. Too bad you abandoned that transformer. You should have rented a skid loader or farm tractor with a loader. My 1959 farm tractor, which is small compared to modern ones, lifts round bales of hay all the time. They weight anywhere from 650 lbs to 1800 lbs. It struggles on those 1800 lb ones, but a larger tractor could easily handle a ton or more. (I dont buy or make bales larger than 1500 lbs). We would have needed a crane to remove it from the pad. The people I moved it for were convinced that it had PCB based oil in it, even though it was built after that was NLA. They paid me to move the transmitter for another local station, for parts for the same model. They paid $150 for the old transmitter. That transformer was worth over $5,000, used. And just for historic value, the original 1969 Woodstock concert ran Somewhere between 3500 watts to 12,000 watts, using Mcintosh mi350 monoblock tube amps for their PA system. The article below seems to conflict whether it was 3,500W or 12,000W. Either way, that PA system had to cover a very large area, and apparently it did the job. Those Mcintosh amps were not designed for that type of service. I thought that same thing, but they apparently can and did handle that abuse, The Greatful Dead,"Wall of Sound". Was entirely run from Mcintosh MC3500, Tube amps, and the MC2300 solid state amps, having a total ofaround 28,000 watts. Not the intended use, but they held up.... Not if they tried to run them at full output. http://www.mylespaul.com/forums/showthread.php?t=100811 These Mcintosh MC3500 power amps have EIGHT power output tubes 6LQ6/6JE6B. These amps had an output of 350W. (mono). The RCA TTU-1/TTU-25 UHF TV transmitters used 16 6146 tubes in parallel for a video amp with a response from DC to over five MHz. It was a 'Distributed Amplifier'. Im not real familiar with transmitters, but I know that tube is used in Ham transmitters and is similar to a 6L6 (or am I thinking 6LQ6?). The 6L6 was a metal cased audio tube that was a slightly higher powered version of the 6V6. http://www.r-type.org/pdfs/6l6.pdf -- Never **** off an Engineer! They don't get mad. They don't get even. They go for over unity! ;-) |
#28
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
|
#29
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Tue, 7 Mar 2017, Jon Elson wrote:
wrote: On Fri, 24 Feb 2017 16:11:20 -0600, Jon Elson wrote: No, certainly not! You use the modulator from an old AM broadcast transmitter. I was at a Grateful Dead concert in 1969 and they wheeled out this THING on the stage with big glass globes, and when they lit up I realized they were TUBES (valves to the British)! Not sure of the type, but at least several thousand Watts. I borrowed a set of ear muffs and sat back for a show! Jon I was at several Grateful Dead concerts in the late 60's and afterwards. I never saw any such thing. Are you sure you were not "tripping"? That may have just been a common 6L6 tube in a guitar amp, and your hallucinations made it look really BIG.... Nope, this was at the Fox Theater in St. Louis. Yes, there were certainly some people tripping on various substances, but I was not. I can't prove it was an AM broadcast modulator, but I can't imagine any other package that would look like that and be available as a unit. There was even an article in the local paper about that event, and how the band had all their equipment confiscated for non-payment, and had to scramble for gear the day of the show. I seem to recall Bob Heil came to the rescue and loaned them this equipment. THere is an incident like that. SOmething happened to the equipment, I can't remember what, but since Bob Heil was local, he fixed things up for them. Maybe that's the time with the Electrovoice VOice of the Theatre speaker I think I mentioned. I've definitely read this story somewhere, and I think it was how he got connected to the band. Michael |
#30
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
On Tue, 07 Mar 2017 18:01:40 -0600, Jon Elson wrote:
And since you mentioned it. What the hell is wrong with them British? Valves are plumbing parts. Tubes are electronic parts!!! yeah, they have funny names for EVERYTHING that was invented since 1776. side curtains (side windows) bonnet (hood) accumulator (car battery) boot (trunk) gear change (gear shift) and there are plenty more... This one gets me. What we call a Horse Trailer, (or livestock trailer), they call them a FLOAT. That's just plain weird.... |
#31
Posted to sci.electronics.repair
|
|||
|
|||
Holy Crap, this is one huge speaker.....
|
Reply |
Thread Tools | Search this Thread |
Display Modes | |
|
|
Similar Threads | ||||
Thread | Forum | |||
OT Google gadgets | UK diy | |||
Gadgets for vista sidebar | UK diy | |||
latest electronics and gadgets | Electronics Repair | |||
DIY Gadgets | UK diy | |||
Gadgets and gimics | Metalworking |