Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".

Recommendations?
--
pyotr filipivich
TV NEWS: Yesterday's newspaper read to the illiterate.

6" is sufficient for that span. If you have 8" 2Xs, use that.

Sonny

On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?
How long is the span that you are creating ?
.... has this one already been discussed .. to death ?
John T.

On 8/12/2020 8:45 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?

With a shed I would say a 2x6's would be plenty, you will be using 2
side by side.

On 8/12/2020 9:13 AM, Sonny wrote:
6" is sufficient for that span. If you have 8" 2Xs, use that.

Sonny

I would think that more information is needed. How big is the shed?
You have said there are lofts. Are they over the windows? or is the
window in the side under the loft. Is it the gable end or a side?

On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

How long is the span that you are creating ?

I guess that would depend on whether new king studs are added or if the jack
studs are secured to the existing studs once the 2 for the window opening are
removed. It could approach 48" if no new king studs are added.

... has this one already been discussed .. to death ?

Sort of. We went around in circles but never really got the details of what
size header was actually required since we never - just like now - never
got the full details as to size of the opening.

Here we go again. ;-)

On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 1:24:43 AM UTC-4, pyotr filipivich wrote:
Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".

Recommendations?
--


In my mind I'm imagining someone with a camera, like maybe the one in a cell
phone, taking pictures and then posting links to them here in the group. Then
we wouldn't have to keep asking questions trying to figure what you have.

You said: "...there is a loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs..."

I assume you mean "joists" not joist.

What I don't understand is what you mean by "attached to the studs". The
joists are attached directly to the studs? They're not sitting on the top
plate of the wall? Is the sheathing the only thing that has kept the wall
from racking itself to it's death?

Maybe this will you help you understand (and explain to us) what you have
and what you should be doing.

https://www.finehomebuilding.com/200...ud-framed-wall

on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 09:45:27 -0400 typed in
rec.woodworking the following:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

If I am going to do a "proper frame up" I need at least 23 1/2" +
2* 1.5" = 26 1/2". Due to the original construction, cutting the one
stud leaves me with a gap 26 1/4". (Cutting the other stud give me ~
45" and I can fit something in there.)

How long is the span that you are creating ?
... has this one already been discussed .. to death ?

Yes.

John T.
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

knuttle on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 10:22:49
-0400 typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On 8/12/2020 9:13 AM, Sonny wrote:
6" is sufficient for that span. If you have 8" 2Xs, use that.

Sonny

I would think that more information is needed. How big is the shed?
You have said there are lofts. Are they over the windows? or is the
window in the side under the loft. Is it the gable end or a side?

Due to code issues, that is not a "second story" or an "attic" but
a "storage loft" It just looks like an attic, but it is not.

The studs I want to cut have the joists hung from them, so I
consider them load bearing.

Next year, maybe, I'll be able to get to the other (North) wall
and that wall is the gable end, no load."

If I'd known all this when I was refurbishing the original, I'd
have done everything completely different.
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 08:59:07 -0500 typed
in rec.woodworking the following:
On 8/12/2020 8:45 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?

With a shed I would say a 2x6's would be plenty, you will be using 2
side by side.

That is what I discovered after I posted. 2x6 I got.
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

DerbyDad03 on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 08:07:51 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

How long is the span that you are creating ?

I guess that would depend on whether new king studs are added or if the jack
studs are secured to the existing studs once the 2 for the window opening are
removed. It could approach 48" if no new king studs are added.

... has this one already been discussed .. to death ?

Sort of. We went around in circles but never really got the details of what
size header was actually required since we never - just like now - never
got the full details as to size of the opening.

Here we go again. ;-)

Size of the opening is 2 feet wide by 2 feet high ("a two foot
square window"). Two studs 24" OC, with a second stud 3" to the left
of 'that one over there on the left:":

|...|.......................|

Plan A is to figure where the T-1 panels on the outside meet, and
work from there.
Plan B is just hack a hole and make it fit. Okay, maybe not "hack"
but work from the inside out ... details to be determined. "We'll
just see how it all flows organically."
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 12:52:22 PM UTC-4, pyotr filipivich wrote:
DerbyDad03 on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 08:07:51 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

How long is the span that you are creating ?

I guess that would depend on whether new king studs are added or if the jack
studs are secured to the existing studs once the 2 for the window opening are
removed. It could approach 48" if no new king studs are added.

... has this one already been discussed .. to death ?

Sort of. We went around in circles but never really got the details of what
size header was actually required since we never - just like now - never
got the full details as to size of the opening.

Here we go again. ;-)

Size of the opening is 2 feet wide by 2 feet high ("a two foot
square window"). Two studs 24" OC, with a second stud 3" to the left
of 'that one over there on the left:":

|...|.......................|

Plan A is to figure where the T-1 panels on the outside meet, and
work from there.
Plan B is just hack a hole and make it fit. Okay, maybe not "hack"
but work from the inside out ... details to be determined. "We'll
just see how it all flows organically."
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

You didn't address my question about how the joists are "attached to the
studs". Are they really not sitting on the top plate of the wall? Are you
really depending on the shear strength of screws/nails to support the loft?

On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 12:52:22 PM UTC-4, pyotr filipivich wrote:
on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 09:45:27 -0400 typed in
rec.woodworking the following:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

If I am going to do a "proper frame up" I need at least 23 1/2" +
2* 1.5" = 26 1/2". Due to the original construction, cutting the one
stud leaves me with a gap 26 1/4". (Cutting the other stud give me ~
45" and I can fit something in there.)


What, in your mind, is a "proper frame up". Do you know what a king stud is?
A jack stud? A cripple stud?

When you say "Cutting the other stud give me ~ 45" and I can fit something
in there" do you know what that *something* is called?

My point here is that we (or at least me) are having a really hard time
figuring out what you understand and what you don't. Maybe you know everything
there is to know about properly adding a header in a load bearing wall but
your responses don't make that clear. If you had said "Cutting the other stud
gives me ~ 45" and I'll put king studs where I need them", then we'd have a
better idea as to your level of knowledge. However, when you say you'll fit
"something" in there, well, we certainly have to wonder if you know what the
proper "something" is.

On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 12:52:22 PM UTC-4, pyotr filipivich wrote:
knuttle on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 10:22:49
-0400 typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On 8/12/2020 9:13 AM, Sonny wrote:
6" is sufficient for that span. If you have 8" 2Xs, use that.

Sonny

I would think that more information is needed. How big is the shed?
You have said there are lofts. Are they over the windows? or is the
window in the side under the loft. Is it the gable end or a side?

Due to code issues, that is not a "second story" or an "attic" but
a "storage loft" It just looks like an attic, but it is not.


Or, more properly stated "I have an attic that does not meet code."

You can't (shouldn't) say it's *not* an attic if indeed it is. "Code issues"
don't magically turn one thing into another - unless of course the building
inspector agrees to it. ;-)

DerbyDad03 on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 10:57:20 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 12:52:22 PM UTC-4, pyotr filipivich wrote:
knuttle on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 10:22:49
-0400 typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On 8/12/2020 9:13 AM, Sonny wrote:
6" is sufficient for that span. If you have 8" 2Xs, use that.

Sonny

I would think that more information is needed. How big is the shed?
You have said there are lofts. Are they over the windows? or is the
window in the side under the loft. Is it the gable end or a side?

Due to code issues, that is not a "second story" or an "attic" but
a "storage loft" It just looks like an attic, but it is not.


Or, more properly stated "I have an attic that does not meet code."

You can't (shouldn't) say it's *not* an attic if indeed it is. "Code issues"
don't magically turn one thing into another - unless of course the building
inspector agrees to it. ;-)

It isn't closed off, so ...

My first line of defense is to not get noticed.
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

DerbyDad03 on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 10:36:41 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 12:52:22 PM UTC-4, pyotr filipivich wrote:
DerbyDad03 on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 08:07:51 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

How long is the span that you are creating ?

I guess that would depend on whether new king studs are added or if the jack
studs are secured to the existing studs once the 2 for the window opening are
removed. It could approach 48" if no new king studs are added.

... has this one already been discussed .. to death ?

Sort of. We went around in circles but never really got the details of what
size header was actually required since we never - just like now - never
got the full details as to size of the opening.

Here we go again. ;-)

Size of the opening is 2 feet wide by 2 feet high ("a two foot
square window"). Two studs 24" OC, with a second stud 3" to the left
of 'that one over there on the left:":

|...|.......................|

Plan A is to figure where the T-1 panels on the outside meet, and
work from there.
Plan B is just hack a hole and make it fit. Okay, maybe not "hack"
but work from the inside out ... details to be determined. "We'll
just see how it all flows organically."
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

You didn't address my question about how the joists are "attached to the
studs". Are they really not sitting on the top plate of the wall? Are you
really depending on the shear strength of screws/nails to support the loft?

Yes.
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

DerbyDad03 on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 09:52:08 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:

What I don't understand is what you mean by "attached to the studs". The
joists are attached directly to the studs? They're not sitting on the top
plate of the wall?

Nope.

Is the sheathing the only thing that has kept the wall
from racking itself to it's death?

Yep. And OSB on the inside.

Maybe this will you help you understand (and explain to us) what you have
and what you should be doing.
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

DerbyDad03 on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 10:49:05 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 12:52:22 PM UTC-4, pyotr filipivich wrote:
on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 09:45:27 -0400 typed in
rec.woodworking the following:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

If I am going to do a "proper frame up" I need at least 23 1/2" +
2* 1.5" = 26 1/2". Due to the original construction, cutting the one
stud leaves me with a gap 26 1/4". (Cutting the other stud give me ~
45" and I can fit something in there.)


What, in your mind, is a "proper frame up". Do you know what a king stud is?
A jack stud? A cripple stud?

Yep.

When you say "Cutting the other stud give me ~ 45" and I can fit something
in there" do you know what that *something* is called?

Yep. King studs, jack studs, an header, and a framing for a
window wider than 2 feet and less than 4 feet.

My point here is that we (or at least me) are having a really hard time
figuring out what you understand and what you don't. Maybe you know everything
there is to know about properly adding a header in a load bearing wall but
your responses don't make that clear. If you had said "Cutting the other stud
gives me ~ 45" and I'll put king studs where I need them", then we'd have a
better idea as to your level of knowledge. However, when you say you'll fit
"something" in there, well, we certainly have to wonder if you know what the
proper "something" is.

Sorry I didn't go into excruciating detail. Do you need to know
all the size nails I'll be using too?
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

You didn't address my question about how the joists are "attached to the
studs". Are they really not sitting on the top plate of the wall? Are you
really depending on the shear strength of screws/nails to support the loft?

Yes.



Relax people ..
.... from the previous thread - it's a 10 x 10 ft. shed
with a 6 ft. extension tacked on ... I think ?
John T.

On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".

Recommendations?

Sooner or later someone is going to tell you to get an engineer to
look at it.

On Wed, 12 Aug 2020 19:31:40 -0500, swalker wrote:

On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings
I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Sooner or later someone is going to tell you to get an engineer to
look at it.


Yep - garden shed engineers dot com - :-)
John T.

On 8/12/2020 8:31 PM, swalker wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".

Recommendations?

Sooner or later someone is going to tell you to get an engineer to
look at it.

Somewhere in this thread it the OP said that the shed was about 10'X10'.

At that size what ever he uses for a header should be OK.

If we were talking about shed twice the size, then load stress and load
bearing walls would obviously need to be consider as there is a lot more
weight on the side wall.

I forget if he said the shed was permanent, ie water electricity, on a
foundation or other; but in our area the only way the building inspector
becomes involved is if the shed is greater the 10'X12' and permanent.

On 8/12/2020 10:07 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

Because????

On 8/12/2020 12:57 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 12:52:22 PM UTC-4, pyotr filipivich wrote:
knuttle on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 10:22:49
-0400 typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On 8/12/2020 9:13 AM, Sonny wrote:
6" is sufficient for that span. If you have 8" 2Xs, use that.

Sonny

I would think that more information is needed. How big is the shed?
You have said there are lofts. Are they over the windows? or is the
window in the side under the loft. Is it the gable end or a side?

Due to code issues, that is not a "second story" or an "attic" but
a "storage loft" It just looks like an attic, but it is not.


Or, more properly stated "I have an attic that does not meet code."

You can't (shouldn't) say it's *not* an attic if indeed it is. "Code issues"
don't magically turn one thing into another - unless of course the building
inspector agrees to it. ;-)


Are there really code requirements for a "shed"?

On Thursday, August 13, 2020 at 10:37:20 AM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 8/12/2020 10:07 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

Because????

I'm not quite sure what you are asking about.

For simplicity let's take a 4 foot wall. Studs at each end, with 2 in the
field, everything at 16" OC. I want to center a 24" window in that wall,
i.e. 12" from each corner. That 24" opening is going span the 2 studs in the
field, so they both have to be cut.

On Thursday, August 13, 2020 at 10:39:27 AM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 8/12/2020 12:57 PM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 12:52:22 PM UTC-4, pyotr filipivich wrote:
knuttle on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 10:22:49
-0400 typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On 8/12/2020 9:13 AM, Sonny wrote:
6" is sufficient for that span. If you have 8" 2Xs, use that.

Sonny

I would think that more information is needed. How big is the shed?
You have said there are lofts. Are they over the windows? or is the
window in the side under the loft. Is it the gable end or a side?

Due to code issues, that is not a "second story" or an "attic" but
a "storage loft" It just looks like an attic, but it is not.


Or, more properly stated "I have an attic that does not meet code."

You can't (shouldn't) say it's *not* an attic if indeed it is. "Code issues"
don't magically turn one thing into another - unless of course the building
inspector agrees to it. ;-)


Are there really code requirements for a "shed"?

There are in my town. Not only setbacks from the property line and location
on the lot, but size, construction method, foundation, power, etc.

We also have some pretty onerous fence codes too.

They don't want people going out to Home Depot, buying an 8 x 10 shed
kit and setting it up in the front yard. In addition, they don't want
people gathering every piece of scrap wood, plywood, particle board, etc.
and building a rickety eyesore, even if the location of the shed meets
code.

I could build a shed that looks really nice for a few years, but if my
construction methods are a bit lax, such as nailing loft joists to the
sides of studs like some people we know, things could get ugly real soon.

It's mainly about property values. Would you to have this in your neighbor's
yard when you try to sell your house? ;-)

https://i.imgur.com/8zHGUVn.jpg

On Wed, 12 Aug 2020 09:52:55 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

DerbyDad03 on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 08:07:51 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

How long is the span that you are creating ?

I guess that would depend on whether new king studs are added or if the jack
studs are secured to the existing studs once the 2 for the window opening are
removed. It could approach 48" if no new king studs are added.

... has this one already been discussed .. to death ?

Sort of. We went around in circles but never really got the details of what
size header was actually required since we never - just like now - never
got the full details as to size of the opening.

Here we go again. ;-)

Size of the opening is 2 feet wide by 2 feet high ("a two foot
square window"). Two studs 24" OC, with a second stud 3" to the left
of 'that one over there on the left:":

|...|.......................|

Plan A is to figure where the T-1 panels on the outside meet, and
work from there.
Plan B is just hack a hole and make it fit. Okay, maybe not "hack"
but work from the inside out ... details to be determined. "We'll
just see how it all flows organically."
With 24 inch centers I'd just "move 2 studs" and "king" them - and
put the window between them Double the head plate between the studs,
or better yet put a "header" there - no need for jack studs. Put the
moved wall studs UNDER the doubled head plate or header. Or do like
they did in my house at the patio door. The joists are not hung on the
rim joist, but on a "floating rim joist" suspended between the outer 2
full joists which are doubled. 4 "short joists" are hung on a
displaced double "rim joist" displaced 24 inches in from the deleted
rim joist on top of the concrete foundation, nailed through the
doubled joists on each side

====!! !!=======
! !! !! !
! !!==========!! !
! !!==========!! !
! !! ! ! ! !! !
! !! ! ! ! !! !

On Wed, 12 Aug 2020 15:06:33 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:

DerbyDad03 on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 10:36:41 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 12:52:22 PM UTC-4, pyotr filipivich wrote:
DerbyDad03 on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 08:07:51 -0700
(PDT) typed in rec.woodworking the following:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

How long is the span that you are creating ?

I guess that would depend on whether new king studs are added or if the jack
studs are secured to the existing studs once the 2 for the window opening are
removed. It could approach 48" if no new king studs are added.

... has this one already been discussed .. to death ?

Sort of. We went around in circles but never really got the details of what
size header was actually required since we never - just like now - never
got the full details as to size of the opening.

Here we go again. ;-)

Size of the opening is 2 feet wide by 2 feet high ("a two foot
square window"). Two studs 24" OC, with a second stud 3" to the left
of 'that one over there on the left:":

|...|.......................|

Plan A is to figure where the T-1 panels on the outside meet, and
work from there.
Plan B is just hack a hole and make it fit. Okay, maybe not "hack"
but work from the inside out ... details to be determined. "We'll
just see how it all flows organically."
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?

You didn't address my question about how the joists are "attached to the
studs". Are they really not sitting on the top plate of the wall? Are you
really depending on the shear strength of screws/nails to support the loft?

Yes.
Then whatever you do is unlikely to make the structure much less
stable than it already is. Nail or better yet screw and glue a 2x6 or
2x8 across the face of the studs ACROSS THE FULL WIDTH OF THE WALL
underneath the joists to support the joists, and double that across
the top of the window cut out whatever you need to cut out for the
window, plate it top and bottom (nailed into the plate ends through
the last uncut studs, and intro the ends of the cut studs, top and
bottom)
The resulting structure will be stronger than what you currently
have, in regards to supporting the "loft"

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 10:29:57 -0400, knuttle
wrote:

On 8/12/2020 8:31 PM, swalker wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".

Recommendations?

Sooner or later someone is going to tell you to get an engineer to
look at it.

Somewhere in this thread it the OP said that the shed was about 10'X10'.

At that size what ever he uses for a header should be OK.

If we were talking about shed twice the size, then load stress and load
bearing walls would obviously need to be consider as there is a lot more
weight on the side wall.

I forget if he said the shed was permanent, ie water electricity, on a
foundation or other; but in our area the only way the building inspector
becomes involved is if the shed is greater the 10'X12' and permanent.
He still doesnt want to walk into the shed one morning to find
everything that was in the loft yesteray is now somwhere between where
the loft WAS and the floor - - - - or the siding has popped off the
one wall and everything has slid out the end to the ground below, or
is dangling somewhere between.

Somewhere between full code compliance and a total disaster, things
need to be done to SOME sort of a "standard". Joists nailed to the
studs of a "balloon framed" building without some sort of support
heping support the load is not a terribly good idea. The last old
balloon framed building I saw stripped to the walls had blocking of
some sort between the studs where the joists were supported. That was
about 10 or 15 years ago up in Sault St Marie - and the studs were
FULL 2X6 fir or hemlock old growth lumber, and harderthan the hubs of
hell!! Picture straight grain fir lumber 20 feet long,on 12 inch
centers all around a 20X30 ft house, and on the gable ends, up to 36
feet for the peak of the gable - - - -. The place was likely worth
almost as much for the recycled lumber as it was as a house in"The
SOO" back then -- -

On Thursday, August 13, 2020 at 3:40:43 PM UTC-4, Clare Snyder wrote:

....snip...

The place was likely worth almost as much for the recycled lumber as it
was as a house...

A few years ago SWMBO and I were driving through rural Massachusetts and
came across an area full of tobacco farms and their drying barns.

https://i.imgur.com/AB6j5f9.jpg

Some of the barns were really old and some were almost brand new. We stopped
to chat with a local resident who was walking along the road and learned that
the new barns were the result of the "reclaimed wood" trend.

Furniture companies and home builders would negotiate with the farm owners and
come to an agreement related to the barns. I don't know the exact details, but
it was basically "I'll replace all the wood on the outside of that barn if
you'll let me have the old planks."

The "reclaimed wood" trend is profitable enough for the companies to supply
the labor and parts to rebuild the barns so they can resell the old wood.
I'm sure that there are lots of details behind all that, such as the quality
of the wood, the condition of the barn's bones, etc. but that's the general
concept.

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 13:07:33 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Thursday, August 13, 2020 at 3:40:43 PM UTC-4, Clare Snyder wrote:

...snip...

The place was likely worth almost as much for the recycled lumber as it
was as a house...

A few years ago SWMBO and I were driving through rural Massachusetts and
came across an area full of tobacco farms and their drying barns.

https://i.imgur.com/AB6j5f9.jpg

Some of the barns were really old and some were almost brand new. We stopped
to chat with a local resident who was walking along the road and learned that
the new barns were the result of the "reclaimed wood" trend.

Furniture companies and home builders would negotiate with the farm owners and
come to an agreement related to the barns. I don't know the exact details, but
it was basically "I'll replace all the wood on the outside of that barn if
you'll let me have the old planks."

The "reclaimed wood" trend is profitable enough for the companies to supply
the labor and parts to rebuild the barns so they can resell the old wood.
I'm sure that there are lots of details behind all that, such as the quality
of the wood, the condition of the barn's bones, etc. but that's the general
concept.




My father-in-law once told me that the big main beams in his
100 + year old barn were basswood.
... in my thoughts many years later - when the subsequent owner
tore-down the barn - not sure if anyone re-claimed anything or not.
- a big truck-load of basswood for the carving crowd, maybe ?

I don't recall any rush to re-claim tobacco kilns' wood in our area -
they rotted away when the ginsing craze took over.
.... I wonder if it would stink forever ?
John T.

On 8/13/2020 2:40 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
....

about 10 or 15 years ago up in Sault St Marie - and the studs were
FULL 2X6 fir or hemlock old growth lumber, and harderthan the hubs of
hell!! Picture straight grain fir lumber 20 feet long,on 12 inch
centers all around a 20X30 ft house, and on the gable ends, up to 36
feet for the peak of the gable - - - -. The place was likely worth
almost as much for the recycled lumber as it was as a house in"The
SOO" back then -- -

I've still got a stack of clear 20-ft Doug fir 2x8, -10, and 12's from
the bins we built in the back of the barn for the feedmill in late '50s...

The barn framing itself is old-growth SYP with some built-up columns of
2x6 and 2x8 as long as 24-ft. Nothing 36', though.

Purchased about 25,000 bdft of what turned out to be walnut from the
demolition of an old school in Lynchburg, VA, built in the late 1840s to
not long after Civil War when last major wing added. It varied from 2x8
to 4x16 in lengths from 16-ft to almost 40-ft.

It was just stacked the morning they opened for the sale; I had gone
down to get a piece of slate blackboard for the kids' room when saw
stuff sitting there that looked like something other than just old,
dirty lumber...a little whittling on the corner of a few revealed just
what it actually was...

Offered $5K on the spot for the lot and they took the check! (And threw
in the blackboard section, gratis...)

Called Mr Davis at Davis Paint to send one of the flatbeds with the
forklift...we stored it in the 3rd-subbasement where he had set up a
shop for friend turning out decoupage plaques in that craze period in
late '60s/early 70s....we ended up running up to 40,000 bd-ft/year of
soft maple through the shop making the wood 2" thick bottoms for
Craddock-Terry shoe company a few years later.

https://www.jamestdavis.com/about/

--

On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 15:48:45 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 8/13/2020 2:40 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
...

about 10 or 15 years ago up in Sault St Marie - and the studs were
FULL 2X6 fir or hemlock old growth lumber, and harderthan the hubs of
hell!! Picture straight grain fir lumber 20 feet long,on 12 inch
centers all around a 20X30 ft house, and on the gable ends, up to 36
feet for the peak of the gable - - - -. The place was likely worth
almost as much for the recycled lumber as it was as a house in"The
SOO" back then -- -

I've still got a stack of clear 20-ft Doug fir 2x8, -10, and 12's from
the bins we built in the back of the barn for the feedmill in late '50s...

The barn framing itself is old-growth SYP with some built-up columns of
2x6 and 2x8 as long as 24-ft. Nothing 36', though.

Purchased about 25,000 bdft of what turned out to be walnut from the
demolition of an old school in Lynchburg, VA, built in the late 1840s to
not long after Civil War when last major wing added. It varied from 2x8
to 4x16 in lengths from 16-ft to almost 40-ft.

It was just stacked the morning they opened for the sale; I had gone
down to get a piece of slate blackboard for the kids' room when saw
stuff sitting there that looked like something other than just old,
dirty lumber...a little whittling on the corner of a few revealed just
what it actually was...

Offered $5K on the spot for the lot and they took the check! (And threw
in the blackboard section, gratis...)

Called Mr Davis at Davis Paint to send one of the flatbeds with the
forklift...we stored it in the 3rd-subbasement where he had set up a
shop for friend turning out decoupage plaques in that craze period in
late '60s/early 70s....we ended up running up to 40,000 bd-ft/year of
soft maple through the shop making the wood 2" thick bottoms for
Craddock-Terry shoe company a few years later.

https://www.jamestdavis.com/about/



Great story - thanks for sharing.
Some old growth is still available to be re-claimed -
but it's at the bottom of the rivers & lakes :-)
.. it doesn't sell cheap.
John T.

On 8/13/2020 4:19 PM, wrote:
On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 15:48:45 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 8/13/2020 2:40 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
...

about 10 or 15 years ago up in Sault St Marie - and the studs were
FULL 2X6 fir or hemlock old growth lumber, and harderthan the hubs of
hell!! Picture straight grain fir lumber 20 feet long,on 12 inch
centers all around a 20X30 ft house, and on the gable ends, up to 36
feet for the peak of the gable - - - -. The place was likely worth
almost as much for the recycled lumber as it was as a house in"The
SOO" back then -- -

I've still got a stack of clear 20-ft Doug fir 2x8, -10, and 12's from
the bins we built in the back of the barn for the feedmill in late '50s...

The barn framing itself is old-growth SYP with some built-up columns of
2x6 and 2x8 as long as 24-ft. Nothing 36', though.

Purchased about 25,000 bdft of what turned out to be walnut from the
demolition of an old school in Lynchburg, VA, built in the late 1840s to
not long after Civil War when last major wing added. It varied from 2x8
to 4x16 in lengths from 16-ft to almost 40-ft.

It was just stacked the morning they opened for the sale; I had gone
down to get a piece of slate blackboard for the kids' room when saw
stuff sitting there that looked like something other than just old,
dirty lumber...a little whittling on the corner of a few revealed just
what it actually was...

Offered $5K on the spot for the lot and they took the check! (And threw
in the blackboard section, gratis...)

Called Mr Davis at Davis Paint to send one of the flatbeds with the
forklift...we stored it in the 3rd-subbasement where he had set up a
shop for friend turning out decoupage plaques in that craze period in
late '60s/early 70s....we ended up running up to 40,000 bd-ft/year of
soft maple through the shop making the wood 2" thick bottoms for
Craddock-Terry shoe company a few years later.

https://www.jamestdavis.com/about/



Great story - thanks for sharing.
Some old growth is still available to be re-claimed -
but it's at the bottom of the rivers & lakes :-)
.. it doesn't sell cheap.
John T.

They've turned the old Craddock Terry building into a new boutique hotel...
http://www.craddockterryhotel.com/History.html

--

On 8/13/2020 10:32 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Thursday, August 13, 2020 at 10:37:20 AM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 8/12/2020 10:07 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

Because????

I'm not quite sure what you are asking about.

For simplicity let's take a 4 foot wall. Studs at each end, with 2 in the
field, everything at 16" OC. I want to center a 24" window in that wall,
i.e. 12" from each corner. That 24" opening is going span the 2 studs in the
field, so they both have to be cut.


He did not state exactly where the window would be, did he? If you need
to put the opening in a specific spot, you might need to cut two studs,
but not necessity.

On Friday, August 14, 2020 at 12:23:43 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 8/13/2020 10:32 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Thursday, August 13, 2020 at 10:37:20 AM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 8/12/2020 10:07 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

Because????

I'm not quite sure what you are asking about.

For simplicity let's take a 4 foot wall. Studs at each end, with 2 in the
field, everything at 16" OC. I want to center a 24" window in that wall,
i.e. 12" from each corner. That 24" opening is going span the 2 studs in the
field, so they both have to be cut.


He did not state exactly where the window would be, did he? If you need
to put the opening in a specific spot, you might need to cut two studs,
but not necessity.

That is exactly what I said way back on 12th.

John T said: "Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?"

To which I replied: "You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24"
window in a space where 2 studs exist."

Doesn't that sound almost exactly like your "If you need to put the opening
in a specific spot, you might need to cut two studs..."

I used the word *if*. I detailed the exact situation in which 2 studs would
need to be cut. I never said it was a necessity.

That's why your "Because????" question didn't make sense to me. I know you
know how to build a wall so I couldn't figure out why you were questioning
my description of when 2 studs would need to be cut. Maybe you missed my use
of the word "if"?

On Thursday, August 13, 2020 at 4:15:13 PM UTC-5, wrote:
On Thu, 13 Aug 2020 15:48:45 -0500, dpb wrote:

On 8/13/2020 2:40 PM, Clare Snyder wrote:
...

about 10 or 15 years ago up in Sault St Marie - and the studs were
FULL 2X6 fir or hemlock old growth lumber, and harderthan the hubs of
hell!! Picture straight grain fir lumber 20 feet long,on 12 inch
centers all around a 20X30 ft house, and on the gable ends, up to 36
feet for the peak of the gable - - - -. The place was likely worth
almost as much for the recycled lumber as it was as a house in"The
SOO" back then -- -

I've still got a stack of clear 20-ft Doug fir 2x8, -10, and 12's from
the bins we built in the back of the barn for the feedmill in late '50s....

The barn framing itself is old-growth SYP with some built-up columns of
2x6 and 2x8 as long as 24-ft. Nothing 36', though.

Purchased about 25,000 bdft of what turned out to be walnut from the
demolition of an old school in Lynchburg, VA, built in the late 1840s to
not long after Civil War when last major wing added. It varied from 2x8
to 4x16 in lengths from 16-ft to almost 40-ft.

It was just stacked the morning they opened for the sale; I had gone
down to get a piece of slate blackboard for the kids' room when saw
stuff sitting there that looked like something other than just old,
dirty lumber...a little whittling on the corner of a few revealed just
what it actually was...

Offered $5K on the spot for the lot and they took the check! (And threw
in the blackboard section, gratis...)

Called Mr Davis at Davis Paint to send one of the flatbeds with the
forklift...we stored it in the 3rd-subbasement where he had set up a
shop for friend turning out decoupage plaques in that craze period in
late '60s/early 70s....we ended up running up to 40,000 bd-ft/year of
soft maple through the shop making the wood 2" thick bottoms for
Craddock-Terry shoe company a few years later.

https://www.jamestdavis.com/about/



Great story - thanks for sharing.
Some old growth is still available to be re-claimed -
but it's at the bottom of the rivers & lakes :-)
.. it doesn't sell cheap.
John T.

That North Wilkesboro, NC company has another cache of reclaimed lumber up for sale.

"Revient, LLC ceases operations in North Wilkesboro, NC. Auction includes (127,000) board feet of reclaimed lumber €“ (24,000) board feet of reclaimed Chestnut lumber!€“ Huge quantity of reclaimed beams! €“ Cherry, Maple & Poplar Slabs! - Large Quantity of reclaimed Pine - Reclaimed Maple, Cherry, Oak, Cedar and other Species! €“ Reclaimed Barn Lumber! - Reclaimed Decking, Flooring and Paneling! "

https://www.irsauctions.com/lots/?pg=details&id=23628

Sonny

On 8/14/2020 11:57 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Friday, August 14, 2020 at 12:23:43 PM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 8/13/2020 10:32 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Thursday, August 13, 2020 at 10:37:20 AM UTC-4, Leon wrote:
On 8/12/2020 10:07 AM, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Wednesday, August 12, 2020 at 9:40:44 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".
Recommendations?


Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?

You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24" window in a space
where 2 studs exist.

Because????

I'm not quite sure what you are asking about.

For simplicity let's take a 4 foot wall. Studs at each end, with 2 in the
field, everything at 16" OC. I want to center a 24" window in that wall,
i.e. 12" from each corner. That 24" opening is going span the 2 studs in the
field, so they both have to be cut.


He did not state exactly where the window would be, did he? If you need
to put the opening in a specific spot, you might need to cut two studs,
but not necessity.

That is exactly what I said way back on 12th.

John T said: "Studs ? You need to cut more than 1 stud for a 2 ft. opening ?"

To which I replied: "You would if the studs were 16" OC and you want the 24"
window in a space where 2 studs exist."

Doesn't that sound almost exactly like your "If you need to put the opening
in a specific spot, you might need to cut two studs..."

I used the word *if*. I detailed the exact situation in which 2 studs would
need to be cut. I never said it was a necessity.

That's why your "Because????" question didn't make sense to me. I know you
know how to build a wall so I couldn't figure out why you were questioning
my description of when 2 studs would need to be cut. Maybe you missed my use
of the word "if"?


ok,ok,ok, ;~)

on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 18:42:08 -0400 typed in
rec.woodworking the following:


You didn't address my question about how the joists are "attached to the
studs". Are they really not sitting on the top plate of the wall? Are you
really depending on the shear strength of screws/nails to support the loft?

Yes.

Relax people ..
... from the previous thread - it's a 10 x 10 ft. shed
with a 6 ft. extension tacked on ... I think ?

Rebuilt.

Started with a 10x10 shed, which had rotting floors and a roof in
need of "help". But the walls seemed sound so. the obvious thing to
do was tear off the roof & sheathing, save the trusses, separate the
walls at the NW & SW corners (leaving two walls connected. That way
they'll stand by themselves and not fall over).rip up the old
flooring, salvage the concrete 12" square stepping 'stones', make up a
new foundation using concrete rounds from the septic company's scrap
pile* as 'posts'. Lay them out in a grid pattern, "level" them to
some extent (A simple procedure involving lasers), and put the 4x4
beams length wise (16' long). Frame up PT 2x4s for the floor and glue
& nail the 5/4 (I think) flooring. Remount the walls ( a simple
procedure after repairing some of the dry rot. Realize that the
rafters aren't going to line up if I have the six foot "inserts"
catywompus from each other. Drop the East wall. No, literally, the
rig to lower the wall twisted, and it fall down go boom. No great
damage.
So now the North wall is free standing, the West and South walls
are in place and the East wall is slid south to mate with it's old
corner. For reasons of budget, the six foot panels have studs on 24"
centers. Made sense at the time. Realize that I have the wrong joist
hangers, get 'the right ones'. I'm using ten foot 2x8's because 16
footers are too expensive.
Laid down the loft flooring, mostly the old sheathing now
repurposed as "floor". Yes it leaves large gaps,they will serve as
access to the storage area.
After considering various configurations for said storage area,
and having the idea of a Gambrel roof vetoed by the property owner, I
went with a simple 3 1/2 foot knee or half wall around the perimeter,
and the rafters going on top. Unfortunately, a 10x10 shed does not
have enough rafters, and Carlin the six foot tall midget knocked out
replacements in jig time. He's good, really good.
After that it was a simple procedure to add the additional T1
sheathing to the open sides, cut and install same for the knee wall,
sheath the roof, throw a tarp on it and call the roofers.** Borrow
Rob's spray painter again, and after scoring 6 gallons of Sherwin
Williams miss-tint paint for $2 a gallon. paint it green. Then paint
the inside white: walls, floors, ceiling, (but not the loft.) Done

Left out of this was the fun of finding out how the power was
supplied, what the code required for running a formal connection to
the other outbuilding, and discovering that while I could relocate the
power to the shed from the North wall to the West wall, it didn't
leave me enough to move the outlets up where I wanted them. (it is a
shed/shop, why put the outlets at floor level?) That will get fix
someday in the future. Maybe.

In sum: 10x10 shed had the walls reused on a new 10 by 16
foundation/ floor with a three foot addition on top. I bought a
Compound Mitre saw, a second cordless drill & reciprocating saw, a
water level, laser level and "stuff" (Yes, that is a line item.)

I did not install any windows at the time, nor finish off the
interior. Just decanted two storage units into Greenwich. "It fit".
As always "If I'd known then, what I know now,I wouldn't have
done it that way, if at all".

So now, what was formerly the Storage Shed, has become the Shop
and Storage. The "office" stuff moved from Green shed to Blue shed,
the "shop" got moved out of the other Blue outbuilding, with the bench
up against the South Wall. However, I do not want to put a five foot
window on the south wall, which faces the alley. However, accessing
the north wall requires moving 5x10by7 feet of boxes etc, and there is
no place currently for doing so.
But I can now get to the west Wall, having only moved out half
the western world and there is a 2x2ft square window from a previous
acquisition.
However, about the middle of where I can access the west wall is
where the 16" OC studs meet the 24" OC studs coming the other way.
From the North: 24", 24". 24".3". 16", 16" door frame, and so on.

I'm just going to cut the 3rd (24") and 4th (3"), below the joist
hangers, stick a header below said joist hangers, with a king stud at
each end. Maybe, seeing how it goes, use the cut stud as a jack stud,
or cut it off to support the window sill. "We'll get started and see
how it flows organically." (Snerk. Yes, I have said that, but I was
trying to get the bookcases and shelving setup in a living room which
was mostly full of boxed books at the time.) Then insulate and finish
the west wall, and attempt to get to the north wall. And move
everything in the Blue building about 4" to the East, sot he Steamer
Trunk will fit in there.
Then in September ....

Of course, If I'd won the lottery anytime in the last four years,
this would be moot. I'd've torn it all down and put in a 2 1/2 car
garage. Or rent/buy commercial space.
But my rich uncle got didn't get out of the poor house, but was
transferred to the old folks home, and so I'm having to do this all on
my own. I need new hobbies.

tschus
pyotr

*when they saw holes in the side of a circular tank / pipe, they get a
core about 18" Dia & 5" thick'. Really handy for all sorts of uses.
Just watch out for the rebar.

**They have the experience, tools and could get a roof thrown up in
far less time than I could.

--
pyotr filipivich
"With Age comes Wisdom. Although far too often, Age travels alone."

swalker on Wed, 12 Aug 2020 19:31:40 -0500 typed in
rec.woodworking the following:
On Tue, 11 Aug 2020 22:25:17 -0700, pyotr filipivich
wrote:


Greetings

I'm intending to add a two foot square window to a shed which is
being converted into shop space. The wall is load bearing, there is a
loft and the joist holding that up are attached to the studs I'll have
to cut.
So, header to spread the load. I'm reading about they need to be
wide (tall) enough: And they run from six to 10".

Recommendations?

Sooner or later someone is going to tell you to get an engineer to
look at it.

With the Cornoa, that'll take too long. B-)

Normally I just take the drawing to church and talk with Petros
about it at coffee hour. (He's the one who told me about "It's not a
'deck', it is a 'wildlife observation platform'!"
--
pyotr filipivich
Next month's Panel: Graft - Boon or blessing?