On Mon, 25 Apr 2016 07:09:44 -0700, Fredd Wright wrote:

What would be the downside if i just decided to level the ground and
put pavers right on top of it? Do you put anything between the pavers in
the cracks (i.e. like grout in bathroom tiles)?

Hew, it's a crawl space storage area, not a patio :-). Just lay them
down. But if anything you'll store under there could be hurt by dampness
I'd put the plastic sheeting under them,

--
When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and
carrying a cross.

On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 1:46:49 PM UTC-4, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 1:20:57 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 12:56:59 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On Mon, 25 Apr 2016 07:42:27 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:23:41 AM UTC-4, dadiOH wrote:
Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 7:56:03 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 7:39:04 AM UTC-4, dadiOH wrote:
Fredd Wright wrote:
On Sunday, April 24, 2016 at 9:00:08 PM UTC-4, whit3rd wrote:
On Saturday, April 23, 2016 at 3:01:51 PM UTC-7, Fredd Wright
wrote:
I have a crawlspace in the basement that has a dirt floor right
now. I'd like to lay some sheets of 4x8 plywood (or other
material) on it to make a surface suitable for crawling on or
putting things on.

For crawling, a few planks of 1/2" plywood (exterior) would be
useful.
For storage, consider that you'd like ventilation around the
stored
items; I'd try some old pallets, with optional 'wood preservative'
painted on (they won't weather, so stain or real paint are a
waste).
I'm lazy, I just strap on some knee pads and a hard hat when it's
time to crawl.

Good ideas here. I have to admit that when i first posted, i
wasn't
thinking about the termite angle. I like the idea of the concrete
but i have a feeling i'd make a mess of it as i don't know what i'm
doing. However, the paver idea sounds interesting. I priced it and
the pavers cost the same per square foot as 3/4" plywood and they
would last indefinitely. However, that's also something i've never
done. Do i just level the ground and lay the pavers on top letting
gravity keep them in place or is there something else i need to do
to
secure them?

Use pressure treated ply and termite concerns go away.

Around here - central Florida - a sheet of PT 1/2" x 4' x 8' is
about 25
bucks. That's about $0.78 sq/ft; pavers run from about $2.00 sq/ft
up. An
exception is a 12" x 12" x 1 3/4" concrete "stepping stone"' that
is $1.31.

My experience with PT ply is that it will cup unless well secured.
Pavers are a great idea. Place over a vapor barrier such as 6mil
visqueen on leveled grade. You could always spread sand or quarry
fines on top of the existing soil to make leveling more easy, but in
your application, I really don't see where that is necessary. I
would keep an eye on your local craigslist for pavers. Around here
they are pretty plentiful...

I'm in NJ. 1' square pavers (or "step stones") are about $1.56 each.
Not out of the question. visqueen will add about $100. What does
the plastic do? What would be the downside if i just decided to
level the ground and put pavers right on top of it? Do you put
anything between the pavers in the cracks (i.e. like grout in
bathroom tiles)?

You don't need visqueen. You don't need anything under the stepping
stones...just use the back side of a rake to level the ground to a
reasonable degree. You don't need anything in the joints, they aren't going
to move; the exception might be those along an edge if you push them while
crawling around. In that case, just put them back. Or, cut some rebar into
1' lengths and hammer one into the ground at the side of and below the top
side of each stepping stone (I wouldn't bother).

Somone mentioned that ply would warp. It will. So?

"So" will depend on how much warpage, the use of the space, what is stored
on it, etc.

If there is a need to slide items to get them in or out or get to items
behind other items, raised edges (or middles) of warped plywood could make
that very difficult.

Excessive warpage could certainly make crawling around more difficult.

Fredd Wright wrote:

On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:42:32 AM UTC-4, DerbyDad03 wrote:
That makes me think that the plastic might be a good idea after all.
if for no other reason, it could keep dirt and weeds from coming up
through the cracks.

Dirt doesn't come up. Weeds need both water AND light to grow...does your
crawl space get those (I hope not)?

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper

On Mon, 25 Apr 2016 15:17:23 -0400, "dadiOH"
wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote:

On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:42:32 AM UTC-4, DerbyDad03 wrote:
That makes me think that the plastic might be a good idea after all.
if for no other reason, it could keep dirt and weeds from coming up
through the cracks.

Dirt doesn't come up. Weeds need both water AND light to grow...does your
crawl space get those (I hope not)?


Mushrooms?

On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat.

On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.



--
Jeff

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically. Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

On Wednesday, April 27, 2016 at 6:41:38 PM UTC-4, krw wrote:
On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically. Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What do you mean it won't be? Are you saying that no container is truly air tight and air will always get in?

In article ,
says...

On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically.

Why will you have to refresh it periodically? Once it absorbs all the
moisture in the container condensation won't be an issue.

Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What, a jar with a screw cap won't be air tight? You must be getting
some pretty crappy jars.

Now I predict that you are going to come back with some crap about "not
talking about jars". Well Earth to KRW we were talking about "airtight
containers" and jars most assuredly are "containers".

On Thursday, April 28, 2016 at 6:36:08 AM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in.. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically.

Why will you have to refresh it periodically? Once it absorbs all the
moisture in the container condensation won't be an issue.

Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What, a jar with a screw cap won't be air tight? You must be getting
some pretty crappy jars.

Now I predict that you are going to come back with some crap about "not
talking about jars". Well Earth to KRW we were talking about "airtight
containers" and jars most assuredly are "containers".

Do you really think the OP wants to cover the floor of a fairly large crawl space in order
to store jars?

So, no, we aren't talking about jars *in this case.*

On Thu, 28 Apr 2016 06:36:00 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically.

Why will you have to refresh it periodically? Once it absorbs all the
moisture in the container condensation won't be an issue.

Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What, a jar with a screw cap won't be air tight? You must be getting
some pretty crappy jars.

Now I predict that you are going to come back with some crap about "not
talking about jars". Well Earth to KRW we were talking about "airtight
containers" and jars most assuredly are "containers".
So are gasoline "containers" and
http://www.containerstore.com/s/stor...uctId=10024301
and many more like them.
As we;; as metal and plastic drums, etc, etc. MANY ways of storing
things in "air-tight" containers.

On Thu, 28 Apr 2016 04:14:03 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Thursday, April 28, 2016 at 6:36:08 AM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically.

Why will you have to refresh it periodically? Once it absorbs all the
moisture in the container condensation won't be an issue.

Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What, a jar with a screw cap won't be air tight? You must be getting
some pretty crappy jars.

Now I predict that you are going to come back with some crap about "not
talking about jars". Well Earth to KRW we were talking about "airtight
containers" and jars most assuredly are "containers".

Do you really think the OP wants to cover the floor of a fairly large crawl space in order
to store jars?

So, no, we aren't talking about jars *in this case.*
How about barrels, vac-pacs, and marine storage boxes?

Do you really think the OP wants to cover the floor of a fairly large crawl space in order
to store jars?

So, no, we aren't talking about jars *in this case.*
How about barrels, vac-pacs, and marine storage boxes?

Proof that any discussion can and will take a tanget the OP had not
intended.

On Thursday, April 28, 2016 at 8:25:42 AM UTC-4, wrote:
On Thu, 28 Apr 2016 04:14:03 -0700 (PDT), DerbyDad03
wrote:

On Thursday, April 28, 2016 at 6:36:08 AM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically.

Why will you have to refresh it periodically? Once it absorbs all the
moisture in the container condensation won't be an issue.

Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What, a jar with a screw cap won't be air tight? You must be getting
some pretty crappy jars.

Now I predict that you are going to come back with some crap about "not
talking about jars". Well Earth to KRW we were talking about "airtight
containers" and jars most assuredly are "containers".

Do you really think the OP wants to cover the floor of a fairly large crawl space in order
to store jars?

So, no, we aren't talking about jars *in this case.*
How about barrels, vac-pacs, and marine storage boxes?

Yep...I believe that those are more on topic for this discussion.

On Thu, 28 Apr 2016 09:09:43 -0700, DerbyDad03 wrote:

How about barrels, vac-pacs, and marine storage boxes?

Yep...I believe that those are more on topic for this discussion.

Sigh. A 1 line response in a 111 line message!

It appears that some of the posters here have never heard of cut and
paste. No, it's not required, but it sure is more polite.

In my newsreader, all I have to do is mouse over the part I want in my
response and click reply. Just as in the 3 lines above. Simple to do.


--
When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and
carrying a cross.

On 4/28/2016 12:40 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:

In my newsreader, all I have to do is mouse over the part I want in my
response and click reply. Just as in the 3 lines above. Simple to do.

Thank you!

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
https://www.facebook.com/eWoodShop-206166666122228
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Thu, 28 Apr 2016 09:09:43 -0700, DerbyDad03 wrote:

How about barrels, vac-pacs, and marine storage boxes?

Yep...I believe that those are more on topic for this discussion.

Sigh. A 1 line response in a 111 line message!

It appears that some of the posters here have never heard of cut and
paste. No, it's not required, but it sure is more polite.

In my newsreader, all I have to do is mouse over the part I want in my
response and click reply. Just as in the 3 lines above. Simple to do.



You're beating your head on the wall Larry. Several of us have
commented on this over the years and it goes unnoticed by the offenders.

--
-Mike-

On Sat, 23 Apr 2016 15:01:46 -0700 (PDT)
jesus christ is risen wrote:

I have a crawlspace in the basement that has a dirt floor right now.

rethought my previous advice

raise house up and safely mounted on piers

then create a proper basement matching the house floor plan

then lower house and reattach

Just as in the 3 lines above. Simple to do.
Thank you!

Didn't know that. Works in SM also.
--
GW Ross

The only thing more accurate than
incoming enemy fire is incoming
friendly fire.

On Wed, 27 Apr 2016 19:38:32 -0700 (PDT), Fredd Wright
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 27, 2016 at 6:41:38 PM UTC-4, krw wrote:
On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically. Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What do you mean it won't be? Are you saying that no container is truly air tight and air will always get in?

Google "hermetic seal". It's exceedingly difficult, particularly for
a large container.

On Thu, 28 Apr 2016 06:36:00 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically.

Why will you have to refresh it periodically? Once it absorbs all the
moisture in the container condensation won't be an issue.

Nope. Once it absorbs all the moisture in the container, more will
replace it.

Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What, a jar with a screw cap won't be air tight? You must be getting
some pretty crappy jars.

Now I predict that you are going to come back with some crap about "not
talking about jars". Well Earth to KRW we were talking about "airtight
containers" and jars most assuredly are "containers".

If he's storing canned fruit in his crawlspace, this might be an idea,
though the lids will most likely rust.

On Thu, 28 Apr 2016 18:51:31 -0400, krw wrote:

On Wed, 27 Apr 2016 19:38:32 -0700 (PDT), Fredd Wright
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 27, 2016 at 6:41:38 PM UTC-4, krw wrote:
On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically. Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What do you mean it won't be? Are you saying that no container is truly air tight and air will always get in?

Google "hermetic seal". It's exceedingly difficult, particularly for
a large container.
How DO they keep gasoline and diesel fuel in those drums?
And how DO they keep things like paint sealed in 5 gallon pails???

On Thu, 28 Apr 2016 20:23:12 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 28 Apr 2016 18:51:31 -0400, krw wrote:

On Wed, 27 Apr 2016 19:38:32 -0700 (PDT), Fredd Wright
wrote:

On Wednesday, April 27, 2016 at 6:41:38 PM UTC-4, krw wrote:
On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically. Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What do you mean it won't be? Are you saying that no container is truly air tight and air will always get in?

Google "hermetic seal". It's exceedingly difficult, particularly for
a large container.
How DO they keep gasoline and diesel fuel in those drums?
And how DO they keep things like paint sealed in 5 gallon pails???

....and water has *never* found its way into gasoline.

On Thursday, April 28, 2016 at 1:40:22 PM UTC-4, Larry Blanchard wrote:
....snip...

In my newsreader, all I have to do is mouse over the part I want in my
response and click reply. Just as in the 3 lines above. Simple to do.


Not nearly as simple to do in GG on an iPad. In fact, it's a real pain.

But I hear ya. Sorry.

In article ,
says...

On Thursday, April 28, 2016 at 6:36:08 AM UTC-4, J. Clarke wrote:
In article ,
says...

On Tue, 26 Apr 2016 21:45:28 -0400, "J. Clarke"
wrote:

In article ,
says...

On 4/26/2016 2:42 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
On Monday, April 25, 2016 at 10:37:49 PM UTC-4, wrote:
On 25 Apr 2016 22:57:41 GMT, Puckdropper
puckdropper(at)yahoo(dot)com wrote:

Fredd Wright wrote in
:


Sorry for the confusion. I can post pictures later when i'm home, but
for now, the crawl space is on the side of the basement and goes
around the back of the house in an L shape. There are cellar doors on
the side of the house and, if i'm leaving the basement through those
doors, right before i get to the doors the crawlspace is on the left.
It's raised so the floor of the space is about chest-height. The
space is about 4 feet wide and maybe 2-3 feet high and goes back about
10 feet to the back of the house where it takes a 90 degree angle
left. I've actually never seen the crawlspace area behind the house
as i've never crawled back that far. Just planning on doing the 10
feet on the side for now. As far as water draining when i hose it,
there are plenty of holes and spaces in the side of the house where
animals have gotten in (my backyard goes right into a park) so no
problem with drainage there. I'm planning on storing things in
waterproof containers.

One thing my step father found out regarding waterproof containers is
that when the water gets high enough, they tip over. So unless the
containers seal air tight, it's a bad idea to store anything you can't
afford to lose in such a space.

Puckdropper
They don't tip if properly ballasted Load them low and heavy and
they bob around like a little tugboat

I thought of that. I may try to figure out a way to strap them in. EIther way, i'm going to try to find some good airtight containers. We always have a couple days notice before a hurricane so i can always move them upstairs in advance if i need to.

there's another issue.
if there's enough air trapped inside airtight containers, it could
condense with the cold water or cold of the basement and cause rot,
mildew ,etc.

That's why you toss in some silica gel.

You'll have to refresh it periodically.

Why will you have to refresh it periodically? Once it absorbs all the
moisture in the container condensation won't be an issue.

Unless it's *wet*, it's
better to leave it well ventilated, rather than even try to make it
air tight (it won't be).

What, a jar with a screw cap won't be air tight? You must be getting
some pretty crappy jars.

Now I predict that you are going to come back with some crap about "not
talking about jars". Well Earth to KRW we were talking about "airtight
containers" and jars most assuredly are "containers".

Do you really think the OP wants to cover the floor of a fairly large crawl space in order
to store jars?

So, no, we aren't talking about jars *in this case.*

We are talking about "watertight containers". I used a jar as an
example. There are other kinds that are equally watertight.

And yes, for all you know he's stored all his stuff in jars.

krw wrote in
:

On Wed, 27 Apr 2016 19:38:32 -0700 (PDT), Fredd Wright
wrote:

What do you mean it won't be? Are you saying that no container is
truly air tight and air will always get in?

Google "hermetic seal". It's exceedingly difficult, particularly for
a large container.

Then you have another problem: the papers or whatever is in the container
can't breath and release moisture. If you put a moisture absorbant in
there, it'll draw too much moisture out so now the things will be
excessivley dry.

So Fredd, just be aware that floating containers tip and be preparred to
take them out when the hurricane hits. If you think you'll be busy with
other things, just don't store anything you can't afford to lose in there.

Puckdropper

So Fredd, just be aware that floating containers tip and be preparred to
take them out when the hurricane hits. If you think you'll be busy with
other things, just don't store anything you can't afford to lose in there..

Puckdropper

OK, first i figured out the whole cut and paste thing. Second, no i'm not storing stuff in jars. Mainly junk that's cluttering up the rest of the house. I learned my lesson during Hurricane Irene when i lost my original boxed Nintendo entertainment system. The stuff i'm talking about are things that i don't want to get wet but i could potentially save if they did.

I'm liking the idea of the pavers for the floor and, for containers, i'm thinking what would be ideal would be plastic sealed containers that are a little larger at the bottom than at the top so as to prevent tipping in a flood. Not sure if those will be easy to find, though.

On Friday, April 29, 2016 at 8:06:44 AM UTC-4, Fredd Wright wrote:

So Fredd, just be aware that floating containers tip and be preparred to
take them out when the hurricane hits. If you think you'll be busy with
other things, just don't store anything you can't afford to lose in there.

Puckdropper

OK, first i figured out the whole cut and paste thing. Second, no i'm not storing stuff in jars. Mainly junk that's cluttering up the rest of the house. I learned my lesson during Hurricane Irene when i lost my original boxed Nintendo entertainment system. The stuff i'm talking about are things that i don't want to get wet but i could potentially save if they did.

I'm liking the idea of the pavers for the floor and, for containers, i'm thinking what would be ideal would be plastic sealed containers that are a little larger at the bottom than at the top so as to prevent tipping in a flood. Not sure if those will be easy to find, though.

Heavier at the bottom, not larger dimensionally (that will work against you)...the lower the center of gravity, the better

On Friday, April 29, 2016 at 8:06:44 AM UTC-4, Fredd Wright wrote:

....snip...

I'm liking the idea of the pavers for the floor and, for containers, i'm thinking what would be ideal would be plastic sealed containers that are a little larger at the bottom than at the top so as to prevent tipping in a flood. Not sure if those will be easy to find, though.

Purchase a bunch of these and fill them enough that you are comfortable
that they won't float. Place them at the bottom of your containers.

http://www.dinobags.com/usr/products...dbag-empty.jpg

On Friday, April 29, 2016 at 9:01:59 AM UTC-4, DerbyDad03 wrote:
On Friday, April 29, 2016 at 8:06:44 AM UTC-4, Fredd Wright wrote:

...snip...

I'm liking the idea of the pavers for the floor and, for containers, i'm thinking what would be ideal would be plastic sealed containers that are a little larger at the bottom than at the top so as to prevent tipping in a flood. Not sure if those will be easy to find, though.

Purchase a bunch of these and fill them enough that you are comfortable
that they won't float. Place them at the bottom of your containers.

http://www.dinobags.com/usr/products...dbag-empty.jpg

On second thought, just buy extra pavers and place *them* at the bottom
of your containers.

On 4/23/2016 5:01 PM, Fredd Wright wrote:
I have a crawlspace in the basement that has a dirt floor right now. I'd like to lay some sheets of 4x8 plywood (or other material) on it to make a surface suitable for crawling on or putting things on. It will lay right on top of dirt. It doesn't have to look good as it's in a crawlspace in an unfinished basement. I't won't be exposed to rain but there will be some moisture coming up through the dirt. Also, i'm probably going to hose it off occasionally. In addition, every 5 years or so it will be underwater for a day or two when we get a hurricane as they usually flood the basement. Can anyone recommend something that will last but not cost me an arm and a leg? Again, i don't care how it looks.



After all of this discussion and weighing the pro's and con's I think
you should move to a home with out this issue ;~)

I think it would be cheaper in the long run. LOL

"G. Ross" writes:

Just as in the 3 lines above. Simple to do.
Thank you!

Didn't know that. Works in SM also.

Do try to keep the attribution lines, however.