You know who you are, ehem! Karl, Leon, etc.
Wake up, pay attention. Actual advice wanted here!!! :-D

So I have a client who runs a retail store and the contractor who built
it out did a "decent' job with the cabinets but used those $3, stamped
white metal drawer slides on 32" wide, 5"-ish high, 24" deep, 3/4"
plywood, solid wood fronted drawers. Nice, strong, heavy drawers...
with terrible slides. They are having all kinds of problems so I'm
replacing them with good ones, meant for that size drawer in a
commercial environment.

I'll not only take advice on what make/model slides you like, but also
on the best way to retrofit them because there are some issues I'll
explain.... right now...

First, they used these spacers on the drawers because none of the
openings are the same exact size. The spacers are different sizes on
different drawers and some have none at all.
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/vAyMyOgXdFa3SqRY3qceENMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink

This is the recess behind the face-frame and the box. It is uniform
(apx. 1/8") on all boxes. At the very bottom of the picture you can see
a portion of the cheap slide mounted with a shim.
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Sg6TPhq4EjtReWgqmBJ2TNMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink

This is what I'm dealing with inside the cabinets. It's a fuzzy pic,
but you get the deal.
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/1uOYbU5G8U6WfCiY52qv8tMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink

The drawer boxes are 32" wide x 23.5" deep. The interior of the cabinet
boxes average 33-1/4" wide +/- 1/4". So I'm either going to need
spacers attached to the insides of the cabinet boxes or to the sides of
the drawers, and they will all be different thicknesses.

So do you think I should put spacers on the cabinet or the drawers?
And what slides do you recommend? I would prefer full extension, soft
close.

Thanks!

--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 2/2/2016 9:49 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
You know who you are, ehem! Karl, Leon, etc.
Wake up, pay attention. Actual advice wanted here!!! :-D

So I have a client who runs a retail store and the contractor who built
it out did a "decent' job with the cabinets but used those $3, stamped
white metal drawer slides on 32" wide, 5"-ish high, 24" deep, 3/4"
plywood, solid wood fronted drawers. Nice, strong, heavy drawers...
with terrible slides. They are having all kinds of problems so I'm
replacing them with good ones, meant for that size drawer in a
commercial environment.

I'll not only take advice on what make/model slides you like, but also
on the best way to retrofit them because there are some issues I'll
explain.... right now...

First, they used these spacers on the drawers because none of the
openings are the same exact size. The spacers are different sizes on
different drawers and some have none at all.
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/vAyMyOgXdFa3SqRY3qceENMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink


This is the recess behind the face-frame and the box. It is uniform
(apx. 1/8") on all boxes. At the very bottom of the picture you can see
a portion of the cheap slide mounted with a shim.
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/Sg6TPhq4EjtReWgqmBJ2TNMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink


This is what I'm dealing with inside the cabinets. It's a fuzzy pic,
but you get the deal.
https://picasaweb.google.com/lh/photo/1uOYbU5G8U6WfCiY52qv8tMTjNZETYmyPJy0liipFm0?feat=d irectlink


The drawer boxes are 32" wide x 23.5" deep. The interior of the cabinet
boxes average 33-1/4" wide +/- 1/4". So I'm either going to need
spacers attached to the insides of the cabinet boxes or to the sides of
the drawers, and they will all be different thicknesses.

So do you think I should put spacers on the cabinet or the drawers?
And what slides do you recommend? I would prefer full extension, soft
close.

Thanks!


Commercial application....

I would build a cabinet insert to slide into the opening and build new
drawers to fit those inserts. In other words measure the openings and
build the whole thing in your shop. Then return and do a quick install
of the assembly.
You can sell it as in and out of their hair in the minimum amount of time.


It is hard to fix something that is done wrong.

I have been using these side full extension soft close slides for about
5 years. I think they will ship.

http://www.cabinethardware.com/G-Sli...ose-p/1012.htm

On 2/2/16 11:44 PM, Leon wrote:

Commercial application....

I would build a cabinet insert to slide into the opening and build new
drawers to fit those inserts. In other words measure the openings and
build the whole thing in your shop. Then return and do a quick install
of the assembly.
You can sell it as in and out of their hair in the minimum amount of time.


It is hard to fix something that is done wrong.

I have been using these side full extension soft close slides for about
5 years. I think they will ship.

http://www.cabinethardware.com/G-Sli...ose-p/1012.htm


I don't think building cabinet inserts is the answer in this situation.
1. I don't think they'd go for the cost.
2. Despite your valued and trusted opinion, I don't think it's necessary.

I do, however, see the wisdom in being as "in and out" as possible,
especially in a retail store where renovation may have an adverse effect
on customers.



--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Tue, 2 Feb 2016 21:49:42 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

snip

The drawer boxes are 32" wide x 23.5" deep. The interior of the cabinet
boxes average 33-1/4" wide +/- 1/4". So I'm either going to need
spacers attached to the insides of the cabinet boxes or to the sides of
the drawers, and they will all be different thicknesses.

So do you think I should put spacers on the cabinet or the drawers?
And what slides do you recommend? I would prefer full extension, soft
close.

Now you know I am not the guy to answer this all. LOL, and Leon made a
suggestion I thought was great, for both you and the customer.

But I did want to ask you this.

Did you check the drawers for squareness? From your descriptions none
of it, or not much is squared and you would need to know this right up
front.

Just out of curiosity, you mentioned a gap of 1/8" or so between the
FF and the carcass (sp) by that did you mean between the groove/dado
in the FF and the panel that was supposed to sit tightly in it?

If that is the case, then how the cabinets are mounted could over a
short time cause the whole thing to loosen up, I would think, like all
the crappy cabinets in LA after an earthquake.

Just a couple thoughts.

I am betting that your client would not like to see you rebuild his cabinets, drawers, etc., and just wants better working drawers. Yes? No?

Most of my clients (especially my commercial guys) always cast a strong eye towards the balance of utility to price equation and will almost always take what they perceive is the best bang for he buck.

Just a thought here, another look at the situation.

If they are happy with the drawers (heavy built, doing the job) and aren't interested into making their sack drawer into a piece of cabinetry, why don't you replace the slides and be done with it?

They sell these slides

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Liberty-2...ZP-W/202200646

under different names, but the ones that they sell at HD and Lowes are now branded as "Richelieu" and "Liberty" and almost all the upper end products from those two companies branded as such are the old Accuride products. I like KV, but also like Accuride and have used their products for years as we had a supplier here for years. I used the Accuride products in kitchens and some commercial and never had a kick about their durability.

And if you leave the spacers on the drawers, you could like a hero to your client if you can find a slide with the same dimensions that would be a direct replacement. With a purchase from the big box, you could simply return the slides if they don't work.

Personally, having run into the situation you are in now, I left the spacers on the drawers as somebody else took the time and effort to shim out the sides (reason to me unknown, I think they didn't plan for or get the right slides) to make the drawer slides fit. I did a straight replacement and was done with six drawers in less than a half day as I had to put a couple of blocks in the backs of the drawers to receive the end of the slide that was inside the cabinet.

My client was pleased with the drawers and pleased with the price.

Robert

On 2/3/2016 4:48 AM, wrote:
I am betting that your client would not like to see you rebuild his
cabinets, drawers, etc., and just wants better working drawers. Yes?
No?

Most of my clients (especially my commercial guys) always cast a
strong eye towards the balance of utility to price equation and will
almost always take what they perceive is the best bang for he buck.

Just a thought here, another look at the situation.

If they are happy with the drawers (heavy built, doing the job) and
aren't interested into making their sack drawer into a piece of
cabinetry, why don't you replace the slides and be done with it?

They sell these slides

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Liberty-2...ZP-W/202200646

under different names, but the ones that they sell at HD and Lowes
are now branded as "Richelieu" and "Liberty" and almost all the upper
end products from those two companies branded as such are the old
Accuride products. I like KV, but also like Accuride and have used
their products for years as we had a supplier here for years. I used
the Accuride products in kitchens and some commercial and never had a
kick about their durability.

Just an observation, the link I provided for the KV distributed G-Slide
soft close slides goes to Cornerstone Hardware here in Houston. They
are a very nice store/supplier to the trades. They have been around for
decades and family owned. BUT I noticed that their receipts followed by
a news letter a few days ago indicated that they have been bought by
Richelieu hardware. I'm hoping that their service remains the same as
they were always informative and always offer to carry the purchases out
to the car for Kim. AND they almost with out exception offered equal
and better quality than Rockler and Woodcraft and pricing up to 40%
lower. I think we are going to begin seeing a lot more Richelieu
hardware in the future.


And if you leave the spacers on the drawers, you could like a hero to
your client if you can find a slide with the same dimensions that
would be a direct replacement. With a purchase from the big box, you
could simply return the slides if they don't work.

Personally, having run into the situation you are in now, I left the
spacers on the drawers as somebody else took the time and effort to
shim out the sides (reason to me unknown, I think they didn't plan
for or get the right slides) to make the drawer slides fit. I did a
straight replacement and was done with six drawers in less than a
half day as I had to put a couple of blocks in the backs of the
drawers to receive the end of the slide that was inside the cabinet.

My client was pleased with the drawers and pleased with the price.

Robert

On 2/3/16 4:48 AM, wrote:
I am betting that your client would not like to see you rebuild his
cabinets, drawers, etc., and just wants better working drawers.
Yes? No?


That was my read and that's what I recommended because the cabinets and
drawers are actually pretty decent despite somewhat neanderthal joinery.
The cheap, underrated slides are the weakest link.


Most of my clients (especially my commercial guys) always cast a
strong eye towards the balance of utility to price equation and will
almost always take what they perceive is the best bang for he buck.

Just a thought here, another look at the situation.

If they are happy with the drawers (heavy built, doing the job) and
aren't interested into making their sack drawer into a piece of
cabinetry, why don't you replace the slides and be done with it?

They sell these slides

http://www.homedepot.com/p/Liberty-2...ZP-W/202200646



under different names, but the ones that they sell at HD and Lowes
are now branded as "Richelieu" and "Liberty" and almost all the
upper end products from those two companies branded as such are the
old Accuride products. I like KV, but also like Accuride and have
used their products for years as we had a supplier here for years. I
used the Accuride products in kitchens and some commercial and never
had a kick about their durability.

And if you leave the spacers on the drawers, you could like a hero
to your client if you can find a slide with the same dimensions that
would be a direct replacement. With a purchase from the big box,
you could simply return the slides if they don't work.

Personally, having run into the situation you are in now, I left the
spacers on the drawers as somebody else took the time and effort to
shim out the sides (reason to me unknown, I think they didn't plan
for or get the right slides) to make the drawer slides fit. I did a
straight replacement and was done with six drawers in less than a
half day as I had to put a couple of blocks in the backs of the
drawers to receive the end of the slide that was inside the cabinet.

My client was pleased with the drawers and pleased with the price.

Robert


I see great wisdom in the reasoning behind your suggestion to use the
spacers already on the drawers.
In this particular case (pun!) I may end up replacing the existing
spacers but using them as a measurement for the thickness of the new
ones. I don't think the existing ones are high enough, nor attached as
securely as I'd prefer.

If I can get slides similar to your suggestion that are soft close and
attach to the face-frame in front and use a strong enough rear socket,
that may be the easiest solution for slides.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 2/3/16 2:42 AM, OFWW wrote:
On Tue, 2 Feb 2016 21:49:42 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

snip

The drawer boxes are 32" wide x 23.5" deep. The interior of the cabinet
boxes average 33-1/4" wide +/- 1/4". So I'm either going to need
spacers attached to the insides of the cabinet boxes or to the sides of
the drawers, and they will all be different thicknesses.

So do you think I should put spacers on the cabinet or the drawers?
And what slides do you recommend? I would prefer full extension, soft
close.

Now you know I am not the guy to answer this all. LOL, and Leon made a
suggestion I thought was great, for both you and the customer.

But I did want to ask you this.

Did you check the drawers for squareness? From your descriptions none
of it, or not much is squared and you would need to know this right up
front.


I did not measure for square because they actually did function properly
without a load.
when any kind of lateral force was applied (ie: pulling or pushing
drawer from a side instead of center) they easily slipped out of the
rails. That type of cheap slide has too much twist in it to suffice for
drawers that big and heavy.


Just out of curiosity, you mentioned a gap of 1/8" or so between the
FF and the carcass (sp) by that did you mean between the groove/dado
in the FF and the panel that was supposed to sit tightly in it?

If that is the case, then how the cabinets are mounted could over a
short time cause the whole thing to loosen up, I would think, like all
the crappy cabinets in LA after an earthquake.

Just a couple thoughts.


No, I mean the face-frame is wider than the cabinet box sides.
I would guess the frames are 1-3/4" and the two box sides, being 3/4"
each makes 1-1/2" leaving 1/4", giving me the 1/8" on each side.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On Tue, 2 Feb 2016 21:49:42 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

You know who you are, ehem! Karl, Leon, etc.
Wake up, pay attention. Actual advice wanted here!!! :-D

So I have a client who runs a retail store and the contractor who built
it out did a "decent' job with the cabinets but used those $3, stamped
white metal drawer slides on 32" wide, 5"-ish high, 24" deep, 3/4"
plywood, solid wood fronted drawers. Nice, strong, heavy drawers...
with terrible slides. They are having all kinds of problems so I'm
replacing them with good ones, meant for that size drawer in a
commercial environment.
snips
Thanks!


Would they be Blum brand or a copy ?
If they are a cheap copy - might the Blum be better ?
If they are Blum they are rated for 75 - 100 lbs and
have a lifetime guarantee ..
http://www.leevalley.com/en/Hardware...614,43616&ap=1
I'd love to see a trial comparison - retrofit a few of the worst
drawers with Blum - and see how they last ..
Just a thought. - before a more difficult retro-fit.
John T.



--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: ---

On 2/3/2016 5:49 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 2 Feb 2016 21:49:42 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

You know who you are, ehem! Karl, Leon, etc.
Wake up, pay attention. Actual advice wanted here!!! :-D

So I have a client who runs a retail store and the contractor who built
it out did a "decent' job with the cabinets but used those $3, stamped
white metal drawer slides on 32" wide, 5"-ish high, 24" deep, 3/4"
plywood, solid wood fronted drawers. Nice, strong, heavy drawers...
with terrible slides. They are having all kinds of problems so I'm
replacing them with good ones, meant for that size drawer in a
commercial environment.
snips
Thanks!


Would they be Blum brand or a copy ?
If they are a cheap copy - might the Blum be better ?
If they are Blum they are rated for 75 - 100 lbs and
have a lifetime guarantee ..
http://www.leevalley.com/en/Hardware...614,43616&ap=1
I'd love to see a trial comparison - retrofit a few of the worst
drawers with Blum - and see how they last ..
Just a thought. - before a more difficult retro-fit.
John T.



--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: ---


The biggest problem with the style slide he is going to replace is that
it does not lock together. If the tracks are slightly out of alignment
they can jump off track and get jammed. With wide drawers it is always
a task for slides to keep "wide" drawers running true, wide drawers can
wobble back and forth, but slides that capture their components tend to
work better and not get jammed up.

On 2/3/16 8:33 AM, Leon wrote:
On 2/3/2016 5:49 AM, wrote:
On Tue, 2 Feb 2016 21:49:42 -0600, -MIKE-
wrote:

You know who you are, ehem! Karl, Leon, etc.
Wake up, pay attention. Actual advice wanted here!!! :-D

So I have a client who runs a retail store and the contractor who built
it out did a "decent' job with the cabinets but used those $3, stamped
white metal drawer slides on 32" wide, 5"-ish high, 24" deep, 3/4"
plywood, solid wood fronted drawers. Nice, strong, heavy drawers...
with terrible slides. They are having all kinds of problems so I'm
replacing them with good ones, meant for that size drawer in a
commercial environment.
snips
Thanks!


Would they be Blum brand or a copy ?
If they are a cheap copy - might the Blum be better ?
If they are Blum they are rated for 75 - 100 lbs and
have a lifetime guarantee ..
http://www.leevalley.com/en/Hardware...614,43616&ap=1

I'd love to see a trial comparison - retrofit a few of the worst
drawers with Blum - and see how they last ..
Just a thought. - before a more difficult retro-fit.
John T.



--- news://freenews.netfront.net/ - complaints: ---


The biggest problem with the style slide he is going to replace is that
it does not lock together. If the tracks are slightly out of alignment
they can jump off track and get jammed. With wide drawers it is always
a task for slides to keep "wide" drawers running true, wide drawers can
wobble back and forth, but slides that capture their components tend to
work better and not get jammed up.

What he said. ^^^
Plus, the plastic bracket that holds the rail to the back of the cabinet
is barely suitable for a narrow cabinet, let alone 33" wide ones.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 2/2/2016 9:49 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
So do you think I should put spacers on the cabinet or the drawers?
And what slides do you recommend? I would prefer full extension, soft
close.

Occam's razor is your guiding principle.

For an RO that gives you _at least_ the 1/2" on each side required for
medium duty slides, I would prefer to shim the drawer slide on the
cabinet side of the rough opening.

For any drawers that have been previously shimmed on the drawer side,
leave the shim and add whatever you need to the height to mount your
drawer side slide, if any.

Since the old drawers used back brackets according to the photo, use
back brackets made for the new drawer slides you choose.

I would use KV8400's of the appropriate length, and they can be ordered
with back brackets.

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On 2/3/16 10:33 AM, Swingman wrote:
On 2/2/2016 9:49 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
So do you think I should put spacers on the cabinet or the
drawers? And what slides do you recommend? I would prefer full
extension, soft close.

Occam's razor is your guiding principle.

For an RO that gives you _at least_ the 1/2" on each side required
for medium duty slides, I would prefer to shim the drawer slide on
the cabinet side of the rough opening.

For any drawers that have been previously shimmed on the drawer side,
leave the shim and add whatever you need to the height to mount your
drawer side slide, if any.

Since the old drawers used back brackets according to the photo, use
back brackets made for the new drawer slides you choose.

I would use KV8400's of the appropriate length, and they can be
ordered with back brackets.


Those slides have rear brackets *and* face frame adapters so I'm liking
them already.
If they made adapters/slides that attached to the cabinet rail below the
drawer, I would've have to deal with spacers.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 2/3/2016 11:08 AM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 2/3/16 10:33 AM, Swingman wrote:
On 2/2/2016 9:49 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
So do you think I should put spacers on the cabinet or the
drawers? And what slides do you recommend? I would prefer full
extension, soft close.

Occam's razor is your guiding principle.

For an RO that gives you _at least_ the 1/2" on each side required
for medium duty slides, I would prefer to shim the drawer slide on
the cabinet side of the rough opening.

For any drawers that have been previously shimmed on the drawer side,
leave the shim and add whatever you need to the height to mount your
drawer side slide, if any.

Since the old drawers used back brackets according to the photo, use
back brackets made for the new drawer slides you choose.

I would use KV8400's of the appropriate length, and they can be
ordered with back brackets.


Those slides have rear brackets *and* face frame adapters so I'm liking
them already.
If they made adapters/slides that attached to the cabinet rail below the
drawer, I would've have to deal with spacers.

Since I face what you're facing on almost every remodel where the client
wants to keep the drawers but have the latest and greatest in drawer
slides; or when the cabinet RO's vary past the required 1/16" tolerance
for new drawers, I find the KV 8400 give me the most flexibility, often
allowing me to mix and match the FF and rear, or lack thereof, brackets
according the cabinet, and often the position of the drawer in the cabinets.

Looked around to find some photos to illustrate doing whatever it takes
to get a good installation and found this 2014 video ... it's short, but
you can see some "mix and match" for the same cabinets ... and this was
a fairly easy one:

https://picasaweb.google.com/1113554... 2205120220706

--
eWoodShop: www.eWoodShop.com
Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
https://www.google.com/+eWoodShop
https://plus.google.com/+KarlCaillouet/posts
http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On 2/3/16 11:30 AM, Swingman wrote:
On 2/3/2016 11:08 AM, -MIKE- wrote:
On 2/3/16 10:33 AM, Swingman wrote:
On 2/2/2016 9:49 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
So do you think I should put spacers on the cabinet or the
drawers? And what slides do you recommend? I would prefer full
extension, soft close.

Occam's razor is your guiding principle.

For an RO that gives you _at least_ the 1/2" on each side required
for medium duty slides, I would prefer to shim the drawer slide on
the cabinet side of the rough opening.

For any drawers that have been previously shimmed on the drawer side,
leave the shim and add whatever you need to the height to mount your
drawer side slide, if any.

Since the old drawers used back brackets according to the photo, use
back brackets made for the new drawer slides you choose.

I would use KV8400's of the appropriate length, and they can be
ordered with back brackets.


Those slides have rear brackets *and* face frame adapters so I'm liking
them already.
If they made adapters/slides that attached to the cabinet rail below the
drawer, I would've have to deal with spacers.

Since I face what you're facing on almost every remodel where the client
wants to keep the drawers but have the latest and greatest in drawer
slides; or when the cabinet RO's vary past the required 1/16" tolerance
for new drawers, I find the KV 8400 give me the most flexibility, often
allowing me to mix and match the FF and rear, or lack thereof, brackets
according the cabinet, and often the position of the drawer in the
cabinets.

Looked around to find some photos to illustrate doing whatever it takes
to get a good installation and found this 2014 video ... it's short, but
you can see some "mix and match" for the same cabinets ... and this was
a fairly easy one:

https://picasaweb.google.com/1113554... 2205120220706


At about the 12 second mark there's a good view of the spacers you used
to attach the slides to the face frame.
When I visited the store, yesterday, to inspect their problems, I
actually "fixed" a few of the drawers just to get them functioning well
enough to use in the mean time. This involved shimming out a couple
slides from the face frame using similar blocking.



--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 2/3/2016 11:08 AM, -MIKE- wrote:

Those slides have rear brackets *and* face frame adapters so I'm liking
them already.
If they made adapters/slides that attached to the cabinet rail below the
drawer, I would've have to deal with spacers.


Obviously I would prefer not to use any brackets, but they can come in
handy, particularly the back brackets, when the existing cabinets are
badly out of square, and you have room to mount and adjust them.

Mike already knows this, but For those following along who are not
already familiar, it's pretty much a no brainer once you've installed a
few back brackets:

You get that smooth operation, and good fit when closed, when the drawer
slides are parallel to each other, and perpendicular in all planes to
the face frame.

When mounting, simply use one screw on each back bracket, in the middle
of the horizontal screw slot, with at least one tightened just enough to
move with light pressure.

If your back brackets are close to alignment to the front to start with,
pushing the drawer in the first time will often be enough to shift the
loose bracket(s) perfectly parallel to each other.

If the drawer works easily, carefully open the drawer about half way and
tighten any loose bracket screws, and add a couple more before
completely removing the drawer.

CAVEAT: You need to insure the back brackets are close to being in the
right spot to begin with, and as close to parallel as possible.

(I'll often use a bar gauge to do that).

And don't force the drawer on the first attempt or you'll likely play
hell getting the drawer out if the back brackets are splayed.

(sometimes it helps to pull out the cabinet side slides all the way out,
and mount the drawer to those slides before closing it the first time by
clicking the interior sliders into place manually).

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Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
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KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

-MIKE- wrote in :

So do you think I should put spacers on the cabinet or the drawers?

If it were me, I think I'd put them on the cabinet. Especially
if the drawer boxes are uniform in width, because then with
luck you'd be able to move drawers between openings (which
someone, someday, is likely to try to do).

John

On 2/3/16 2:02 PM, John McCoy wrote:
-MIKE- wrote in :

So do you think I should put spacers on the cabinet or the drawers?

If it were me, I think I'd put them on the cabinet. Especially
if the drawer boxes are uniform in width, because then with
luck you'd be able to move drawers between openings (which
someone, someday, is likely to try to do).

John


The openings are not uniform, unfortunately.
And you're right about people moving them around.
It would be nice for the client if I could figure out a way to make them
universal.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 2/3/2016 5:12 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
It would be nice for the client if I could figure out a way to make them
universal.

Only way to do that is make the RO where the drawers go the same (33")
in every cabinet.

You can build out, or shim, or both. That way your drawers would then be
interchangeable in those locations ... providing the drawers are indeed
32" wide.

If you have to err, err a scooch on the wider side. You can always shim
a too wide RO, not the other way around.

It is certainly doable if the budget allows.

--
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Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
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KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On 2/3/2016 5:12 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
It would be nice for the client if I could figure out a way to make them
universal.

Similar situation you are in.

Not a single RO, side to side, top to bottom, the same in this set of 6
garage storage cabinets.

What will really frost your butt is I originally bid on the whole
cabinet job (including drawers), lost the bid, and was called back later
to fix the problem when the asshat who out bid me couldn't figure out
how to make and fit/install the damned file sized drawers the client wanted.

Boy howdy, did they have to pay through the nose for what you see in
these photos ... and I was not about to make six different size drawers.

Also had to replace the door hinges to get the needed clearance for the
specific width drawers to hold file folders.

If you look closely you can see some of the variation in "spacer"
thickness from cabinet to cabinet ... and from top to bottom drawer.

https://picasaweb.google.com/1113554...?noredirect=1#

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KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On 2/3/16 6:40 PM, Swingman wrote:
On 2/3/2016 5:12 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
It would be nice for the client if I could figure out a way to make them
universal.

Similar situation you are in.

Not a single RO, side to side, top to bottom, the same in this set of 6
garage storage cabinets.

What will really frost your butt is I originally bid on the whole
cabinet job (including drawers), lost the bid, and was called back later
to fix the problem when the asshat who out bid me couldn't figure out
how to make and fit/install the damned file sized drawers the client
wanted.

Boy howdy, did they have to pay through the nose for what you see in
these photos ... and I was not about to make six different size drawers.

Also had to replace the door hinges to get the needed clearance for the
specific width drawers to hold file folders.

If you look closely you can see some of the variation in "spacer"
thickness from cabinet to cabinet ... and from top to bottom drawer.

https://picasaweb.google.com/1113554...?noredirect=1#


Yes, I can see the spacers and that is what came to my mind at first
viewing when I was in their shop yesterday.
I think I'll go back and double check that all drawers are the same
width. If so, I may be leaning towards building out the interiors with
that type of spacer. The cabinets are very wide and open so there's
plenty of room for me to get in there with a drill/driver.

I think I could show up with stock the thickness of the widest gap and
use either a planer or jointer to take the rest down to thickness. That
would be fairy quick.


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

On 2/3/2016 7:43 PM, -MIKE- wrote:
I think I could show up with stock the thickness of the widest gap and
use either a planer or jointer to take the rest down to thickness. That
would be fairy quick.

The slides aren't that tall, so should be able to resaw to thickness on
the table saw for each location ... what I usually do.

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Wood Shop: www.e-WoodShop.net
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http://www.custommade.com/by/ewoodshop/
KarlCaillouet@ (the obvious)

On Wednesday, February 3, 2016 at 6:41:31 PM UTC-6, Swingman wrote:

Boy howdy, did they have to pay through the nose

LOL... no wonder we get along so well. A man truly after my own heart.

I don't like it when I get beat on a job, but I really don't like it if I get beat because someone used lesser quality materials, lesser build quality, and inferior design. Still... it happens, certainly part of the business.

But one should be aware of consequences if they call me to "fix" the work of a contractor that got the job. Pricing on repairs of that type isn't pretty, but depending on the client's attitude, it can be downright ugly.

Robert

On 2/3/16 11:44 PM, wrote:
On Wednesday, February 3, 2016 at 6:41:31 PM UTC-6, Swingman wrote:

Boy howdy, did they have to pay through the nose

LOL... no wonder we get along so well. A man truly after my own
heart.

I don't like it when I get beat on a job, but I really don't like it
if I get beat because someone used lesser quality materials, lesser
build quality, and inferior design. Still... it happens, certainly
part of the business.

But one should be aware of consequences if they call me to "fix" the
work of a contractor that got the job. Pricing on repairs of that
type isn't pretty, but depending on the client's attitude, it can be
downright ugly.

Robert


LOL!! I have one client who would always ask me to give him an
estimate for home improvement projects and then end up hiring someone
cheaper, or he'd never ask me for a quote-- just hire some cheap guy.
He would inevitably end up calling me to come fix it or do it right and
end up paying 30-40% more than he would've paid me to do it in the first
place.
One day, in the presence of his wife, I said, "Man, why don't you just
call me in the first place for this stuff?" His wife got this huge grin
on her face and said, "That's what I've been telling him!"

Now he calls me first. :-)


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

wrote:
On Wednesday, February 3, 2016 at 6:41:31 PM UTC-6, Swingman wrote:

Boy howdy, did they have to pay through the nose

LOL... no wonder we get along so well. A man truly after my own heart.

I don't like it when I get beat on a job, but I really don't like it if I
get beat because someone used lesser quality materials, lesser build
quality, and inferior design. Still... it happens, certainly part of the business.

But one should be aware of consequences if they call me to "fix" the work
of a contractor that got the job. Pricing on repairs of that type isn't
pretty, but depending on the client's attitude, it can be downright ugly.

Robert


And exactly why I suggested inserts and shop built. I'm not going to
suffer repairing someone else's screw up.

On Wed, 3 Feb 2016 21:44:23 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

On Wednesday, February 3, 2016 at 6:41:31 PM UTC-6, Swingman wrote:

Boy howdy, did they have to pay through the nose

LOL... no wonder we get along so well. A man truly after my own heart.

I don't like it when I get beat on a job, but I really don't like it if I get beat because someone used lesser quality materials, lesser build quality, and inferior design. Still... it happens, certainly part of the business.

But one should be aware of consequences if they call me to "fix" the work of a contractor that got the job. Pricing on repairs of that type isn't pretty, but depending on the client's attitude, it can be downright ugly.

Robert
Boy Howdy if this scenario didn't remind me of some past HVAC jobs.
Beat out by low ballers who were depending on change orders to make a
profit. One case in particular they bid the job for less than the
equipment cost me, and I knew I was getting a better price for the
equipment than they could.

Got a call from the customer, the contractor went belly up, they
wanted us to come finish the job. T&M, I won't even go into all the
details but we made more money off that job than if we had gotten the
contract in the first place. After the job was completed and signed
off, we threw a big party for all our guys for making a really crappy
job good.