Southern California Edison has finally announced the San Onofre
nuclear plant will be permanently shut down.

The arrogance of SCE was typical of the "We know best" attitude
of the utility industry found in some parts of the country.

The San Onofre nuclear plant was an inferior design according to
industry watchdogs that SCE tried to get recertified when it leaked
without submitting to the certifying process.

They were finally brought into submission.

To put things in perspective, there are over 8 million people living
with in 50 miles of San Onofre.

Now for the plant's demolition, but leaving accumulated nuclear
waste within 100 yards of the Pacific Ocean is not an option.

There is still a lot of work ahead to properly dispose of all the
waste
material accumulated over the years and not allow San Onofre to
become an ocean side nuclear dump after the plant's demolition.

SCE will try to cut corners, that is their track record.

Vigilance to keep them under control will be vital.

Off the stump.

Lew

On 6/8/2013 1:03 AM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
Southern California Edison has finally announced the San Onofre
nuclear plant will be permanently shut down.

The arrogance of SCE was typical of the "We know best" attitude
of the utility industry found in some parts of the country.

The San Onofre nuclear plant was an inferior design according to
industry watchdogs that SCE tried to get recertified when it leaked
without submitting to the certifying process.

They were finally brought into submission.

To put things in perspective, there are over 8 million people living
with in 50 miles of San Onofre.

Now for the plant's demolition, but leaving accumulated nuclear
waste within 100 yards of the Pacific Ocean is not an option.

There is still a lot of work ahead to properly dispose of all the
waste
material accumulated over the years and not allow San Onofre to
become an ocean side nuclear dump after the plant's demolition.

SCE will try to cut corners, that is their track record.

Vigilance to keep them under control will be vital.

Off the stump.

Lew


Thank GOD, we have people in the Carolinas that are not afraid of
Nuclear Energy and have trained knowledgeable people to run them in a
safe manner. We have several plants that are online producing clean,
environmental-friendly energy. They are not killing birds, creating
noise in all frequencies. They are not taking up acres and acres of
sunbaked land with no trees.

We recently had a power plant problem. They found a small crack in a
pipe going to the reactor. They shut the plant down, fixed it and
restarted it.

Several years ago we lived within 10 miles of one. Never did it affect
our lives in a negative way. The large lake created for the cooling
system was leased to the city and was a beautiful park with waking
trails, picnic areas, etc. The lake itself was one of the best fishing
lakes in the area.

It is nice to know we have a reliable source of energy to run our air
conditioners this summer, that will run day and night. That is not
dependent on the wind which may be blowing over 100 mph during a
hurricane one day, and the next be so weak that they will not move my
small sailboat.

"Lew Hodgett" wrote:
Southern California Edison has finally announced the San Onofre
nuclear plant will be permanently shut down.

The arrogance of SCE was typical of the "We know best" attitude
of the utility industry found in some parts of the country.

The San Onofre nuclear plant was an inferior design according to
industry watchdogs that SCE tried to get recertified when it leaked
without submitting to the certifying process.

They were finally brought into submission.

To put things in perspective, there are over 8 million people living
with in 50 miles of San Onofre.

Now for the plant's demolition, but leaving accumulated nuclear
waste within 100 yards of the Pacific Ocean is not an option.

There is still a lot of work ahead to properly dispose of all the
waste
material accumulated over the years and not allow San Onofre to
become an ocean side nuclear dump after the plant's demolition.

SCE will try to cut corners, that is their track record.

Vigilance to keep them under control will be vital.

Off the stump.

Lew

I wonder if California's over the top restrictions and regulations are the
source of the problems. I mean really, my new yard sprinkler which is also
sold in California has to have cancer warning labels because something in
it may or may not cause cancer in "1 in 1,000,000,000,000" test critters.

The regulations seem to be so far fetched and absurd that a "legitimate"
producer simply can not operate and make a profit. So what you end up with
is a business environment that is too hostile for production. As a result
it appears that the ones that do operate under the "California
restrictions" and are producers of "whatever" probably hide the fact, or
not, that they have to cut corners at every possible step. And because of
the over bearing restrictions the businesses that could possibly do a
better job and make a sustainable profit simply feel that life is too
short to do business in California. This leaves you with the type of
businesses you rant about, those that don't care about their image, those
that will lie and hide what is really going on, those that do what ever it
takes to make a profit and ride that pony for all it is worth until it gets
caught.

I believe for many years Californians have believed that they live in
heaven, a place where every thing can be made perfectly safe, clean, and
with out hazard.

May I assure you, they are not in heaven and they are the recipients of
enormous amounts of deception.. They have been sold a bill of goods which
they cannot afford.

Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 6/8/2013 1:03 AM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
Southern California Edison has finally announced the San Onofre
nuclear plant will be permanently shut down.

The arrogance of SCE was typical of the "We know best" attitude
of the utility industry found in some parts of the country.

The San Onofre nuclear plant was an inferior design according to
industry watchdogs that SCE tried to get recertified when it leaked
without submitting to the certifying process.

They were finally brought into submission.

To put things in perspective, there are over 8 million people living
with in 50 miles of San Onofre.

Now for the plant's demolition, but leaving accumulated nuclear
waste within 100 yards of the Pacific Ocean is not an option.

There is still a lot of work ahead to properly dispose of all the
waste
material accumulated over the years and not allow San Onofre to
become an ocean side nuclear dump after the plant's demolition.

SCE will try to cut corners, that is their track record.

Vigilance to keep them under control will be vital.

Off the stump.

Lew


Thank GOD, we have people in the Carolinas that are not afraid of
Nuclear Energy and have trained knowledgeable people to run them in a
safe manner. We have several plants that are online producing clean,
environmental-friendly energy. They are not killing birds, creating
noise in all frequencies. They are not taking up acres and acres of
sunbaked land with no trees.

We recently had a power plant problem. They found a small crack in a
pipe going to the reactor. They shut the plant down, fixed it and
restarted it.

Several years ago we lived within 10 miles of one. Never did it
affect our lives in a negative way. The large lake created for the
cooling system was leased to the city and was a beautiful park with
waking trails, picnic areas, etc. The lake itself was one of the
best fishing lakes in the area.

It is nice to know we have a reliable source of energy to run our air
conditioners this summer, that will run day and night. That is not
dependent on the wind which may be blowing over 100 mph during a
hurricane one day, and the next be so weak that they will not move my
small sailboat.

So you let them bury the nuclear waste in your backyard?


--
PV

If you could choose one characteristic that would get you through life,
choose a sense of humor. -Jennifer Jones

On Sat, 08 Jun 2013 08:34:00 -0400, Keith Nuttle wrote:

Thank GOD, we have people in the Carolinas that are not afraid of
Nuclear Energy and have trained knowledgeable people to run them in a
safe manner.

I used to be a strong supporter of nuclear power. Then I did some
software for a couple of nuclear plants. After listening to the managers
and watching the "trained" people for a couple of months, I changed my
mind.

--
When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and
carrying a cross.

On Sat, 8 Jun 2013 15:35:58 +0000 (UTC), Larry Blanchard
I used to be a strong supporter of nuclear power. Then I did some
software for a couple of nuclear plants. After listening to the managers
and watching the "trained" people for a couple of months, I changed my
mind.

So, what did you see? People lurching from one problem to another?

On 6/8/2013 10:09 AM, PV wrote:
Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 6/8/2013 1:03 AM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
Southern California Edison has finally announced the San Onofre
nuclear plant will be permanently shut down.

The arrogance of SCE was typical of the "We know best" attitude
of the utility industry found in some parts of the country.

The San Onofre nuclear plant was an inferior design according to
industry watchdogs that SCE tried to get recertified when it leaked
without submitting to the certifying process.

They were finally brought into submission.

To put things in perspective, there are over 8 million people living
with in 50 miles of San Onofre.

Now for the plant's demolition, but leaving accumulated nuclear
waste within 100 yards of the Pacific Ocean is not an option.

There is still a lot of work ahead to properly dispose of all the
waste
material accumulated over the years and not allow San Onofre to
become an ocean side nuclear dump after the plant's demolition.

SCE will try to cut corners, that is their track record.

Vigilance to keep them under control will be vital.

Off the stump.

Lew


Thank GOD, we have people in the Carolinas that are not afraid of
Nuclear Energy and have trained knowledgeable people to run them in a
safe manner. We have several plants that are online producing clean,
environmental-friendly energy. They are not killing birds, creating
noise in all frequencies. They are not taking up acres and acres of
sunbaked land with no trees.

We recently had a power plant problem. They found a small crack in a
pipe going to the reactor. They shut the plant down, fixed it and
restarted it.

Several years ago we lived within 10 miles of one. Never did it
affect our lives in a negative way. The large lake created for the
cooling system was leased to the city and was a beautiful park with
waking trails, picnic areas, etc. The lake itself was one of the
best fishing lakes in the area.

It is nice to know we have a reliable source of energy to run our air
conditioners this summer, that will run day and night. That is not
dependent on the wind which may be blowing over 100 mph during a
hurricane one day, and the next be so weak that they will not move my
small sailboat.

So you let them bury the nuclear waste in your backyard?


Probably ends up in NM or Washington State.

On 6/8/2013 10:35 AM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Sat, 08 Jun 2013 08:34:00 -0400, Keith Nuttle wrote:

Thank GOD, we have people in the Carolinas that are not afraid of
Nuclear Energy and have trained knowledgeable people to run them in a
safe manner.

I used to be a strong supporter of nuclear power. Then I did some
software for a couple of nuclear plants. After listening to the managers
and watching the "trained" people for a couple of months, I changed my
mind.



Ever think it might have been the software? :~)

Leon wrote:
On 6/8/2013 10:09 AM, PV wrote:
Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 6/8/2013 1:03 AM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
Southern California Edison has finally announced the San Onofre
nuclear plant will be permanently shut down.

The arrogance of SCE was typical of the "We know best" attitude
of the utility industry found in some parts of the country.

The San Onofre nuclear plant was an inferior design according to
industry watchdogs that SCE tried to get recertified when it leaked
without submitting to the certifying process.

They were finally brought into submission.

To put things in perspective, there are over 8 million people
living with in 50 miles of San Onofre.

Now for the plant's demolition, but leaving accumulated nuclear
waste within 100 yards of the Pacific Ocean is not an option.

There is still a lot of work ahead to properly dispose of all the
waste
material accumulated over the years and not allow San Onofre to
become an ocean side nuclear dump after the plant's demolition.

SCE will try to cut corners, that is their track record.

Vigilance to keep them under control will be vital.

Off the stump.

Lew


Thank GOD, we have people in the Carolinas that are not afraid of
Nuclear Energy and have trained knowledgeable people to run them in
a safe manner. We have several plants that are online producing
clean, environmental-friendly energy. They are not killing birds,
creating noise in all frequencies. They are not taking up acres
and acres of sunbaked land with no trees.

We recently had a power plant problem. They found a small crack in
a pipe going to the reactor. They shut the plant down, fixed it and
restarted it.

Several years ago we lived within 10 miles of one. Never did it
affect our lives in a negative way. The large lake created for the
cooling system was leased to the city and was a beautiful park with
waking trails, picnic areas, etc. The lake itself was one of the
best fishing lakes in the area.

It is nice to know we have a reliable source of energy to run our
air conditioners this summer, that will run day and night. That is
not dependent on the wind which may be blowing over 100 mph during a
hurricane one day, and the next be so weak that they will not move
my small sailboat.

So you let them bury the nuclear waste in your backyard?


Probably ends up in NM or Washington State.

It's always great to have a "reliable source of energy" when you can pawn
the waste off on another place. Waste that will be hot for a long long
time.

--
PV

If you could choose one characteristic that would get you through life,
choose a sense of humor. -Jennifer Jones

"Leon" wrote:

I wonder if California's over the top restrictions and regulations
are the
source of the problems.
-----------------------------------------------------------
This was driven by the feds (NRC).

SCE finally realized they were not going to be able to stonewall
this one away.
-----------------------------------------------------------
I mean really, my new yard sprinkler which
is also
sold in California has to have cancer warning labels because
something in
it may or may not cause cancer in "1 in 1,000,000,000,000" test
critters.

The regulations seem to be so far fetched and absurd that a
"legitimate"
producer simply can not operate and make a profit. So what you end
up with
is a business environment that is too hostile for production. As a
result
it appears that the ones that do operate under the "California
restrictions" and are producers of "whatever" probably hide the
fact, or
not, that they have to cut corners at every possible step. And
because of
the over bearing restrictions the businesses that could possibly do
a
better job and make a sustainable profit simply feel that life is
too
short to do business in California. This leaves you with the type
of
businesses you rant about, those that don't care about their image,
those
that will lie and hide what is really going on, those that do what
ever it
takes to make a profit and ride that pony for all it is worth until
it gets
caught.

I believe for many years Californians have believed that they live
in
heaven, a place where every thing can be made perfectly safe, clean,
and
with out hazard.

May I assure you, they are not in heaven and they are the
recipients of
enormous amounts of deception.. They have been sold a bill of goods
which
they cannot afford.
-------------------------------------------------------------
Is there an echo chamber in here?

That's the standard line we keep hearing from the chief idiot sitting
in your
governor's chair, when he trys to raid a few marginal businesses under
the
guise of a "trade junket".

Regardless of all the bitching, California still has an economy that
is in the
world's top six economies.

Must be doing something right.

Lew

On 6/8/2013 6:26 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
I wonder if California's over the top restrictions and regulations
are the
source of the problems.
-----------------------------------------------------------
This was driven by the feds (NRC).

SCE finally realized they were not going to be able to stonewall
this one away.


The Feds are not responsible for the restrictive regulations in
California. In my experience with Regulation, California is many times
more restrictive than the Feds or any other state regulations.

An example is trace contaminates in food and food substances. When I was
working daily with regulations, California regulations were basically if
you can detect a compound you must provide proof that it is safe. This
is counter to the American law, which is that you are innocent until
proof guilty. At least it was until 2008.

On 6/8/2013 11:09 AM, PV wrote:
Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 6/8/2013 1:03 AM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
Southern California Edison has finally announced the San Onofre
nuclear plant will be permanently shut down.

The arrogance of SCE was typical of the "We know best" attitude
of the utility industry found in some parts of the country.

The San Onofre nuclear plant was an inferior design according to
industry watchdogs that SCE tried to get recertified when it leaked
without submitting to the certifying process.

They were finally brought into submission.

To put things in perspective, there are over 8 million people living
with in 50 miles of San Onofre.

Now for the plant's demolition, but leaving accumulated nuclear
waste within 100 yards of the Pacific Ocean is not an option.

There is still a lot of work ahead to properly dispose of all the
waste
material accumulated over the years and not allow San Onofre to
become an ocean side nuclear dump after the plant's demolition.

SCE will try to cut corners, that is their track record.

Vigilance to keep them under control will be vital.

Off the stump.

Lew


Thank GOD, we have people in the Carolinas that are not afraid of
Nuclear Energy and have trained knowledgeable people to run them in a
safe manner. We have several plants that are online producing clean,
environmental-friendly energy. They are not killing birds, creating
noise in all frequencies. They are not taking up acres and acres of
sunbaked land with no trees.

We recently had a power plant problem. They found a small crack in a
pipe going to the reactor. They shut the plant down, fixed it and
restarted it.

Several years ago we lived within 10 miles of one. Never did it
affect our lives in a negative way. The large lake created for the
cooling system was leased to the city and was a beautiful park with
waking trails, picnic areas, etc. The lake itself was one of the
best fishing lakes in the area.

It is nice to know we have a reliable source of energy to run our air
conditioners this summer, that will run day and night. That is not
dependent on the wind which may be blowing over 100 mph during a
hurricane one day, and the next be so weak that they will not move my
small sailboat.

So you let them bury the nuclear waste in your backyard?


If the restrictive regulations had not been employed to drive nuclear
power out of existence, there would be no waste to bury. It is against
the law to try to reclaim nuclear waste.

If the Chemist and Physicist had been allowed to solve the problem in
the last 40 years, the raw material that we are currently are burying
from nuclear plants would be used to produce additional energy.

On 6/8/2013 7:53 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 6/8/2013 11:09 AM, PV wrote:
Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 6/8/2013 1:03 AM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
Southern California Edison has finally announced the San Onofre
nuclear plant will be permanently shut down.

The arrogance of SCE was typical of the "We know best" attitude
of the utility industry found in some parts of the country.

The San Onofre nuclear plant was an inferior design according to
industry watchdogs that SCE tried to get recertified when it leaked
without submitting to the certifying process.

They were finally brought into submission.

To put things in perspective, there are over 8 million people living
with in 50 miles of San Onofre.

Now for the plant's demolition, but leaving accumulated nuclear
waste within 100 yards of the Pacific Ocean is not an option.

There is still a lot of work ahead to properly dispose of all the
waste
material accumulated over the years and not allow San Onofre to
become an ocean side nuclear dump after the plant's demolition.

SCE will try to cut corners, that is their track record.

Vigilance to keep them under control will be vital.

Off the stump.

Lew


Thank GOD, we have people in the Carolinas that are not afraid of
Nuclear Energy and have trained knowledgeable people to run them in a
safe manner. We have several plants that are online producing clean,
environmental-friendly energy. They are not killing birds, creating
noise in all frequencies. They are not taking up acres and acres of
sunbaked land with no trees.

We recently had a power plant problem. They found a small crack in a
pipe going to the reactor. They shut the plant down, fixed it and
restarted it.

Several years ago we lived within 10 miles of one. Never did it
affect our lives in a negative way. The large lake created for the
cooling system was leased to the city and was a beautiful park with
waking trails, picnic areas, etc. The lake itself was one of the
best fishing lakes in the area.

It is nice to know we have a reliable source of energy to run our air
conditioners this summer, that will run day and night. That is not
dependent on the wind which may be blowing over 100 mph during a
hurricane one day, and the next be so weak that they will not move my
small sailboat.

So you let them bury the nuclear waste in your backyard?


If the restrictive regulations had not been employed to drive nuclear
power out of existence, there would be no waste to bury. It is against
the law to try to reclaim nuclear waste.

If the Chemist and Physicist had been allowed to solve the problem in
the last 40 years, the raw material that we are currently are burying
from nuclear plants would be used to produce additional energy.


Here is a general article about the technology of processing materials
coming from a nuclear plant.

Because of Jimmy Carter, a knowledgeable democrat, it can not be used in
the US.

On 6/8/2013 8:11 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:
Here is a general article about the technology of processing materials
coming from a nuclear plant.

Because of Jimmy Carter, a knowledgeable democrat, it can not be used in
the US.
http://www.nytimes.com/cwire/2009/05...pagewanted=all

On Sat, 08 Jun 2013 13:14:03 -0500, Leon wrote:

Ever think it might have been the software? :~)

No, because it never got used. We were informed that the NRC required
it, therefore they had to have it - but they had no intention of using it.

That's when I started getting worried.

--
When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and
carrying a cross.

On Sat, 08 Jun 2013 13:09:22 -0400, none wrote:

So, what did you see? People lurching from one problem to another?

How about doors to critical areas locked with a keypad, but no way to
tell how many entered or left on a single actuation?

How about spills that were marked with tape on the floor instead of
cleaned up. They did get cleaned up shortly before a congressional visit
- at least the tape went away.

How about monitoring software whose consoles were left unmanned?

Operators were only required to have a high school diploma (or GED). Do
you know how easy it has been to get a diploma in the last 20-30 years?

--
When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and
carrying a cross.

"Keith Nuttle" wrote:

An example is trace contaminates in food and food substances. When I
was working daily with regulations, California regulations were
basically if you can detect a compound you must provide proof that
it is safe.
-----------------------------------------------
Seems perfectly reasonable to me.

Guess a majority of the 38+ million people here in California seem
to also agree.

Lew

Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 6/8/2013 8:11 PM, Keith Nuttle wrote:
Here is a general article about the technology of processing
materials coming from a nuclear plant.

Because of Jimmy Carter, a knowledgeable democrat, it can not be
used in the US.
http://www.nytimes.com/cwire/2009/05...pagewanted=all

Far from a definitive solution to the problem plus it's 4 years old, and in
the meantime the stockpile of waste continues to grow but that's okay and
you can ship it somewhere else to be disposed of while you enjoy dependable
air conditioning

--
PV

If you could choose one characteristic that would get you through life,
choose a sense of humor. -Jennifer Jones

On 6/8/2013 8:25 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Sat, 08 Jun 2013 13:09:22 -0400, none wrote:

So, what did you see? People lurching from one problem to another?

How about doors to critical areas locked with a keypad, but no way to
tell how many entered or left on a single actuation?

How about spills that were marked with tape on the floor instead of
cleaned up. They did get cleaned up shortly before a congressional visit
- at least the tape went away.

How about monitoring software whose consoles were left unmanned?

Operators were only required to have a high school diploma (or GED). Do
you know how easy it has been to get a diploma in the last 20-30 years?

If the software were any good and problems occurred, alarms would be
sent to all consoles so all consoles would not need be manned.

The problem with many people in the US is they run of and make critical
decision without a complete knowledge of the situation.

How many times have you heard people complaining about a company making
a billion dollars profit, and do not consider the fact that the company
has 50 billion in sales, or making 2% profit.

In article ,
PV edrnouser@ spam telus.net wrote:

It's always great to have a "reliable source of energy" when you can pawn
the waste off on another place. Waste that will be hot for a long long
time.



Damage and deaths from coal burning air pollution and fly ash waste
containment accidents dwarf anything caused to date from nuclear waste in
the USA.


--
Often wrong, never in doubt.

Larry W. - Baltimore Maryland - lwasserm(a)sdf. lonestar. org

On 6/8/2013 10:38 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
"Keith Nuttle" wrote:

An example is trace contaminates in food and food substances. When I
was working daily with regulations, California regulations were
basically if you can detect a compound you must provide proof that
it is safe.
-----------------------------------------------
Seems perfectly reasonable to me.

Guess a majority of the 38+ million people here in California seem
to also agree.

Lew


To emphasis what I said let me say: "I sorry that there are that many
people in California who think that way". Maybe the state would not be
near bankrupt if the people were more reasonable.

"Lew Hodgett" wrote:
"Keith Nuttle" wrote:

An example is trace contaminates in food and food substances. When I
was working daily with regulations, California regulations were
basically if you can detect a compound you must provide proof that
it is safe.
-----------------------------------------------
Seems perfectly reasonable to me.

Guess a majority of the 38+ million people here in California seem
to also agree.

Lew

And the answer to why the people in California are in the situation that
hey are in. I have to think that it is difficult to see the Forrest for the
trees considering all hurdles you seem to constantly have to jump.

Larry W wrote:
In article ,
PV edrnouser@ spam telus.net wrote:

It's always great to have a "reliable source of energy" when you can
pawn the waste off on another place. Waste that will be hot for a
long long time.



Damage and deaths from coal burning air pollution and fly ash waste
containment accidents dwarf anything caused to date from nuclear
waste in the USA.

Installation of scrubbing units, improvements in coal burning techniques and
using fly ash waste as a concrete reinforcment has cleaned up the coal fed
power plants in the area.

Nuclear waste would be hanging around for hundreds of years, waiting for a
mistake to happen

--
PV

If you could choose one characteristic that would get you through life,
choose a sense of humor. -Jennifer Jones

Leon wrote:
"Lew Hodgett" wrote:
"Keith Nuttle" wrote:

An example is trace contaminates in food and food
substances. When I
was working daily with regulations, California
regulations were
basically if you can detect a compound you must provide
proof that
it is safe.
-----------------------------------------------
Seems perfectly reasonable to me.

Guess a majority of the 38+ million people here in
California seem
to also agree.

Lew

And the answer to why the people in California are in the
situation
that hey are in. I have to think that it is difficult to
see the
Forrest for the trees considering all hurdles you seem to
constantly
have to jump.

And if Lew agrees with them, why does he post his rant
weekly about gas prices?
Can't have it both ways, Lew.

On 6/9/2013 1:16 PM, ChairMan wrote:
Leon wrote:
"Lew Hodgett" wrote:
"Keith Nuttle" wrote:

An example is trace contaminates in food and food
substances. When I
was working daily with regulations, California
regulations were
basically if you can detect a compound you must provide
proof that
it is safe.
-----------------------------------------------
Seems perfectly reasonable to me.

Guess a majority of the 38+ million people here in
California seem
to also agree.

Lew

And the answer to why the people in California are in the
situation
that hey are in. I have to think that it is difficult to
see the
Forrest for the trees considering all hurdles you seem to
constantly
have to jump.

And if Lew agrees with them, why does he post his rant
weekly about gas prices?
Can't have it both ways, Lew.



It must not be as rosy in California as the residents would want you to
believe. They do complain a lot and have restrictions upon restrictions.

On Sun, 09 Jun 2013 07:44:08 -0400, Keith Nuttle wrote:

If the software were any good and problems occurred, alarms would be
sent to all consoles so all consoles would not need be manned.

The problem with many people in the US is they run of and make critical
decision without a complete knowledge of the situation.

I think your second sentence explains your first one quite well :-).





--
When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and
carrying a cross.





--
When fascism comes to America, it will be wrapped in the flag and
carrying a cross.

In ,
Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet belched:
On 6/9/2013 1:16 PM, ChairMan wrote:
Leon wrote:
"Lew Hodgett" wrote:
"Keith Nuttle" wrote:

An example is trace contaminates in food and food
substances. When I
was working daily with regulations, California
regulations were
basically if you can detect a compound you must provide
proof that
it is safe.
-----------------------------------------------
Seems perfectly reasonable to me.

Guess a majority of the 38+ million people here in
California seem
to also agree.

Lew

And the answer to why the people in California are in the
situation
that hey are in. I have to think that it is difficult to
see the
Forrest for the trees considering all hurdles you seem to
constantly
have to jump.

And if Lew agrees with them, why does he post his rant
weekly about gas prices?
Can't have it both ways, Lew.



It must not be as rosy in California as the residents would want you
to believe. They do complain a lot and have restrictions upon
restrictions.

California is a beautiful state , but the folks in the capitol have ruined
it.
Companies are leaving in droves because of it, it's a shame they can't use a
little common sense, but that seems to be a trait that politicans don't
possess

"Keith Nuttle" wrote:

To emphasis what I said let me say: "I sorry that there are that
many people in California who think that way". Maybe the state
would not be near bankrupt if the people were more reasonable.
------------------------------------------------
You're working with stale data.

CA is back in the black.

Lew

"Leon" wrote:

And the answer to why the people in California are in the situation
that
hey are in. I have to think that it is difficult to see the Forrest
for the
trees considering all hurdles you seem to constantly have to jump.
-----------------------------------------------
As posted elsewhere, you're working with stale data.

CA is back in the black.

Lew

"ChairMan" wrote:

And if Lew agrees with them, why does he post his rant weekly about
gas prices?
Can't have it both ways, Lew.
--------------------------------------------
The post simply points out the obvious, there is a better ways
to get energy than by burning hydrocarbon based fuels.

Lew

On Sun, 9 Jun 2013 15:36:44 -0500, "ChairMan"
wrote:

California is a beautiful state , but the folks in the capitol have ruined
it.
Companies are leaving in droves because of it, it's a shame they can't use a
little common sense, but that seems to be a trait that politicans don't
possess

That statement could just as easily be applied to other places. The
fist one that comes to my mind is the province of Quebec.

On 6/9/2013 6:13 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 9 Jun 2013 15:36:44 -0500, "ChairMan"
wrote:

California is a beautiful state , but the folks in the capitol have ruined
it.
Companies are leaving in droves because of it, it's a shame they can't use a
little common sense, but that seems to be a trait that politicans don't
possess

That statement could just as easily be applied to other places. The
fist one that comes to my mind is the province of Quebec.

Any government/politician that does any more than to maintain the
infrastructure and protect its borders is IN OVER IT'S HEAD.

Any privileges beyond that is a license to steal, and we all see the
proof. When politicians have special privileges that are not equal to
the people of those they govern there is an attraction of the dishonest.

If politicians had any talent other than lying and the gift of gab they
would not be in government.

On 6/8/2013 2:25 PM, PV wrote:
Leon wrote:
On 6/8/2013 10:09 AM, PV wrote:
Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 6/8/2013 1:03 AM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
Southern California Edison has finally announced the San Onofre
nuclear plant will be permanently shut down.

The arrogance of SCE was typical of the "We know best" attitude
of the utility industry found in some parts of the country.

The San Onofre nuclear plant was an inferior design according to
industry watchdogs that SCE tried to get recertified when it leaked
without submitting to the certifying process.

They were finally brought into submission.

To put things in perspective, there are over 8 million people
living with in 50 miles of San Onofre.

Now for the plant's demolition, but leaving accumulated nuclear
waste within 100 yards of the Pacific Ocean is not an option.

There is still a lot of work ahead to properly dispose of all the
waste
material accumulated over the years and not allow San Onofre to
become an ocean side nuclear dump after the plant's demolition.

SCE will try to cut corners, that is their track record.

Vigilance to keep them under control will be vital.

Off the stump.

Lew


Thank GOD, we have people in the Carolinas that are not afraid of
Nuclear Energy and have trained knowledgeable people to run them in
a safe manner. We have several plants that are online producing
clean, environmental-friendly energy. They are not killing birds,
creating noise in all frequencies. They are not taking up acres
and acres of sunbaked land with no trees.

We recently had a power plant problem. They found a small crack in
a pipe going to the reactor. They shut the plant down, fixed it and
restarted it.

Several years ago we lived within 10 miles of one. Never did it
affect our lives in a negative way. The large lake created for the
cooling system was leased to the city and was a beautiful park with
waking trails, picnic areas, etc. The lake itself was one of the
best fishing lakes in the area.

It is nice to know we have a reliable source of energy to run our
air conditioners this summer, that will run day and night. That is
not dependent on the wind which may be blowing over 100 mph during a
hurricane one day, and the next be so weak that they will not move
my small sailboat.

So you let them bury the nuclear waste in your backyard?


Probably ends up in NM or Washington State.

It's always great to have a "reliable source of energy" when you can pawn
the waste off on another place. Waste that will be hot for a long long
time.

I have often wondered why the nuclear waste is not shot off into outer
space.

On Sun, 09 Jun 2013 19:07:30 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
I have often wondered why the nuclear waste is not shot off into outer
space.

My guess would be cost. Much, Much cheaper to just stick it in a hole
in the ground.

On 6/9/2013 6:44 AM, Keith Nuttle wrote:
On 6/8/2013 8:25 PM, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Sat, 08 Jun 2013 13:09:22 -0400, none wrote:

So, what did you see? People lurching from one problem to another?

How about doors to critical areas locked with a keypad, but no way to
tell how many entered or left on a single actuation?

How about spills that were marked with tape on the floor instead of
cleaned up. They did get cleaned up shortly before a congressional visit
- at least the tape went away.

How about monitoring software whose consoles were left unmanned?

Operators were only required to have a high school diploma (or GED). Do
you know how easy it has been to get a diploma in the last 20-30 years?

If the software were any good and problems occurred, alarms would be
sent to all consoles so all consoles would not need be manned.

The problem with many people in the US is they run of and make critical
decision without a complete knowledge of the situation.

How many times have you heard people complaining about a company making
a billion dollars profit, and do not consider the fact that the company
has 50 billion in sales, or making 2% profit.


LOL Really, My sister and her son have both been involved in their own
small businesses. My sister gets by but her son has never been
successful. Both have bragged about their yearly sales, which BTW is
about equal to an average gross salary. What they don't realize I am
wondering is how much their cost of materials and cost of doing business
is coming out of those sales. If you have $60,000 in sales and your
cost is $45,000 can you live on $15,000 per year?

On 6/9/2013 7:11 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 09 Jun 2013 19:07:30 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
I have often wondered why the nuclear waste is not shot off into outer
space.

My guess would be cost. Much, Much cheaper to just stick it in a hole
in the ground.



At the moment it is, but not when it has to be dealt with later.

And for that matter, the cost would be countless times more reasonable
that the cost of sending astronauts up there. Shoot the waste out
there and the problem of down the rode costs is solved. We are not
really getting a worth while return on the investment of sending
astronauts up there.

I can assure you a politician is getting paid for letting his state
accept/be paid for housing the materials. Shoot the waste into outer
space and the politician gets nothing.

On Sun, 09 Jun 2013 19:24:47 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
I can assure you a politician is getting paid for letting his state
accept/be paid for housing the materials. Shoot the waste into outer
space and the politician gets nothing.

We're not prepared to make the effort to use a cleaner source of
energy and we're not prepared to keep its waste product on our planet
so the solution is to put it off planet and potentially contaminate
somewhere out of this world?

I don't know. I have a moral problem with that. Already, our nearby
space is turning into a junk field. What if all that junk and possible
nuclear waste ever comes back to home? Then we might have a REAL
problem.

One doesn't have to 'shoot' it into our star - but if we were allowed
to build a 'breeder' plant the waste would be transformed into fuel.

Other countries have them in use but our 'do stuff always wrong ECO
types' screamed to loud. Shame on them. Now store it all over the place.

The fly ash is used in cement and in 'cinder-blocks' a cement block
for building. It is a common thread with the greenees - don't solve
something, prevent it in the first place and go back to the bad old days.

Martin

On 6/9/2013 7:24 PM, Leon wrote:
On 6/9/2013 7:11 PM, wrote:
On Sun, 09 Jun 2013 19:07:30 -0500, Leon lcb11211@swbelldotnet
I have often wondered why the nuclear waste is not shot off into outer
space.

My guess would be cost. Much, Much cheaper to just stick it in a hole
in the ground.



At the moment it is, but not when it has to be dealt with later.

And for that matter, the cost would be countless times more reasonable
that the cost of sending astronauts up there. Shoot the waste out
there and the problem of down the rode costs is solved. We are not
really getting a worth while return on the investment of sending
astronauts up there.

I can assure you a politician is getting paid for letting his state
accept/be paid for housing the materials. Shoot the waste into outer
space and the politician gets nothing.

"Lew Hodgett" wrote:
"Leon" wrote:

And the answer to why the people in California are in the situation
that
hey are in. I have to think that it is difficult to see the Forrest
for the
trees considering all hurdles you seem to constantly have to jump.
-----------------------------------------------
As posted elsewhere, you're working with stale data.

CA is back in the black.

Lew

I'm sure you actually believe that.

As I heard it - it is checker-board black and red.

They dumped a lot of bills on the counties to pay and
have stolen a lot of counties money (law allows it),
taxed the fool out of folks and has a balance in this years take,
but not in the total RED mess they are into for many years.

CA is debt deep they are.

Martin

On 6/9/2013 5:18 PM, Lew Hodgett wrote:
"Leon" wrote:

And the answer to why the people in California are in the situation
that
hey are in. I have to think that it is difficult to see the Forrest
for the
trees considering all hurdles you seem to constantly have to jump.
-----------------------------------------------
As posted elsewhere, you're working with stale data.

CA is back in the black.

Lew