For the first time in 20 years of using a table saw, I got nailed by the
kickback genie. I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. When I use the TS, I never stand directly
in front of the blade. On this cut, I was on the right side of the
blade, feeding the work by hand. On cut number 4,I must have turned the
board a fraction and the blade kicked that sucker back on an angle and
it caught me right in the heart. Scared the crap out of me. On
reflection, I shoulda used my featherboard and a push stick. Lesson
learned.

On 8/30/2011 7:49 PM, Z3Driver wrote:
For the first time in 20 years of using a table saw, I got nailed by the
kickback genie. I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence...

Bad call...

W/L = 1 w/ small pieces is recipe for causing what happened.

Use a sled instead.

--

On Tue, 30 Aug 2011 19:49:48 -0500, Z3Driver wrote:

For the first time in 20 years of using a table saw, I got nailed by the
kickback genie. I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. When I use the TS, I never stand directly
in front of the blade. On this cut, I was on the right side of the
blade, feeding the work by hand. On cut number 4,I must have turned the
board a fraction and the blade kicked that sucker back on an angle and
it caught me right in the heart. Scared the crap out of me. On
reflection, I shoulda used my featherboard and a push stick. Lesson
learned.

Featherboard, holddown piece, and pushstick.

Congrats on your luck.

--
The problem with borrowing money from China is
that thirty minutes later, you feel broke again.
--Steve Bridges as Obama

On 8/30/2011 7:49 PM, Z3Driver wrote:
For the first time in 20 years of using a table saw, I got nailed by the
kickback genie. I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. When I use the TS, I never stand directly
in front of the blade. On this cut, I was on the right side of the
blade, feeding the work by hand. On cut number 4,I must have turned the
board a fraction and the blade kicked that sucker back on an angle and
it caught me right in the heart. Scared the crap out of me. On
reflection, I shoulda used my featherboard and a push stick. Lesson
learned.

No splitter?

Still, a warning shot is good thing.

(And 5" violates my rule regarding proximity of body parts as a push stick).

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Aug 30, 8:49*pm, Z3Driver wrote:
For the first time in 20 years of using a table saw, I got nailed by the
kickback genie. *I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. *I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. *When I use the TS, I never stand directly
in front of the blade. *On this cut, I was on the right side of the
blade, feeding the work by hand. *On cut number 4,I must have turned the
board a fraction and the blade kicked that sucker back on an angle and
it caught me right in the heart. *Scared the crap out of me. *On
reflection, I shoulda used my featherboard and a push stick. *Lesson
learned.

You used a coupon........and you get only so many....

On 8/30/2011 7:49 PM, Z3Driver wrote:
For the first time in 20 years of using a table saw, I got nailed by the
kickback genie. I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. When I use the TS, I never stand directly
in front of the blade. On this cut, I was on the right side of the
blade, feeding the work by hand. On cut number 4,I must have turned the
board a fraction and the blade kicked that sucker back on an angle and
it caught me right in the heart. Scared the crap out of me. On
reflection, I shoulda used my featherboard and a push stick. Lesson
learned.

Glad to hear that you were not badly hurt. And as a reminder that
standing anywhere behind the blade is in the danger zone.

"Z3Driver" wrote

by the
kickback genie. I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. When I use the TS, I never stand directly
in front of the blade. On this cut, I was on the right side of the
blade, feeding the work by hand. On cut number 4,I must have turned the
board a fraction and the blade kicked that sucker back on an angle and
it caught me right in the heart. Scared the crap out of me.

I have a rule for avoiding this type of problem, that I teach my students...
Might be good for you, too.

With the blade set at the right minimum height, measure the distance along
the blade that is above the table. Let's say 5 inches is what that
measures. I say that the board being cut has to be the length of the blade
plus half of that distance added back on, so 5 plus 1/2 (2.5), so the wood
needs to be 7.5 inches long, against the fence. The fence also must not be
set much further from the blade than the length of the board.

Use the miter gauge if it does not fit the above conditions, and of course,
never use the rip fence and the miter gauge at the same time.

-- Jim in NC

Z3Driver wrote in :

For the first time in 20 years of using a table saw, I got nailed by the
kickback genie. I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. When I use the TS, I never stand directly
in front of the blade. On this cut, I was on the right side of the
blade, feeding the work by hand. On cut number 4,I must have turned the
board a fraction and the blade kicked that sucker back on an angle and
it caught me right in the heart. Scared the crap out of me. On
reflection, I shoulda used my featherboard and a push stick. Lesson
learned.

The smaller the pieces you're cutting, the greater the danger. I cut a
small piece of 1/4" luan plywood a few years back and the cutoff hitched a
ride over the top of the sawblade, and crossed from right to left side
until middle and index fingers of my left hand stopped it (I'm right-
handed). I needed a bit of plastic surgery to repair a tendon. Not quite
as good as new now, but serviceable. Just didn't like the whole
experience.

--
Best regards
Han
email address is invalid

Standing anywhere behind the **wood**. I would love to see you stand in
front of the blade.

---------------
"Leon" wrote in message
...

Glad to hear that you were not badly hurt. And as a reminder that
standing anywhere behind the blade is in the danger zone.

On Aug 31, 12:56*am, "Morgans" wrote:
"Z3Driver" *wrote

by the
kickback genie. *I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. *I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. *When I use the TS, I never stand directly

I have a rule for avoiding this type of problem, that I teach my students....
Might be good for you, too.

With the blade set at the right minimum height, measure the distance along
the blade that is above the table. *Let's say 5 inches is what that
measures. *I say that the board being cut has to be the length of the blade
plus half of that distance added back on, so 5 plus 1/2 (2.5), so the wood
needs to be 7.5 inches long, against the fence. *The fence also must not be
set *much further from the blade than the length of the board.

Use the miter gauge if it does not fit the above conditions, and of course,
never use the rip fence and the miter gauge at the same time.


Teach your students to make and use a crosscut sled.

"Morgans" wrote in message
...
"Z3Driver" wrote

by the
kickback genie. I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. When I use the TS, I never stand directly
in front of the blade. On this cut, I was on the right side of the
blade, feeding the work by hand. On cut number 4,I must have turned the
board a fraction and the blade kicked that sucker back on an angle and
it caught me right in the heart. Scared the crap out of me.

I have a rule for avoiding this type of problem, that I teach my
students... Might be good for you, too.

With the blade set at the right minimum height, measure the distance along
the blade that is above the table. Let's say 5 inches is what that
measures. I say that the board being cut has to be the length of the
blade plus half of that distance added back on, so 5 plus 1/2 (2.5), so
the wood needs to be 7.5 inches long, against the fence. The fence also
must not be set much further from the blade than the length of the board.

Use the miter gauge if it does not fit the above conditions, and of
course, never use the rip fence and the miter gauge at the same time.

-- Jim in NC



Jim in NC,

I don't quite get the "The fence also must not be set much further from
the blade than the length of the board." Assume you are ripping a 2X4 that
is a foot long. The fence distance could not possibly be even close to the
length of the board. If you are cross cutting, setting the fence at the
board length would mean the board misses the blade.

Where did I get it wrong and what is the correct interpretation?

TIA.

On 9/1/2011 12:06 PM, Baron wrote:
wrote in message
...
"Z3Driver" wrote

by the
kickback genie. I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. When I use the TS, I never stand directly
in front of the blade. On this cut, I was on the right side of the
blade, feeding the work by hand. On cut number 4,I must have turned the
board a fraction and the blade kicked that sucker back on an angle and
it caught me right in the heart. Scared the crap out of me.

I have a rule for avoiding this type of problem, that I teach my
students... Might be good for you, too.

With the blade set at the right minimum height, measure the distance along
the blade that is above the table. Let's say 5 inches is what that
measures. I say that the board being cut has to be the length of the
blade plus half of that distance added back on, so 5 plus 1/2 (2.5), so
the wood needs to be 7.5 inches long, against the fence. The fence also
must not be set much further from the blade than the length of the board.

Use the miter gauge if it does not fit the above conditions, and of
course, never use the rip fence and the miter gauge at the same time.

-- Jim in NC



Jim in NC,

I don't quite get the "The fence also must not be set much further from
the blade than the length of the board." Assume you are ripping a 2X4 that
is a foot long. The fence distance could not possibly be even close to the
length of the board.


If you are cross cutting, setting the fence at the
board length would mean the board misses the blade.

You would Not cross-cut a twobyfour using a fence--at least not during
the cut. Someone else may be better able to describe your options.


Where did I get it wrong and what is the correct interpretation?

TIA.

On Thu, 1 Sep 2011 12:06:39 -0400, "Baron" wrote:

"Morgans" wrote in message
...
"Z3Driver" wrote

by the
kickback genie. I was trimming 4 short (5"x5") boards for a project,
taking 3/4" off one of the sides. I trimmed the first three against the
rip fence without a problem. When I use the TS, I never stand directly
in front of the blade. On this cut, I was on the right side of the
blade, feeding the work by hand. On cut number 4,I must have turned the
board a fraction and the blade kicked that sucker back on an angle and
it caught me right in the heart. Scared the crap out of me.

I have a rule for avoiding this type of problem, that I teach my
students... Might be good for you, too.

With the blade set at the right minimum height, measure the distance along
the blade that is above the table. Let's say 5 inches is what that
measures. I say that the board being cut has to be the length of the
blade plus half of that distance added back on, so 5 plus 1/2 (2.5), so
the wood needs to be 7.5 inches long, against the fence. The fence also
must not be set much further from the blade than the length of the board.

Use the miter gauge if it does not fit the above conditions, and of
course, never use the rip fence and the miter gauge at the same time.

-- Jim in NC



Jim in NC,

I don't quite get the "The fence also must not be set much further from
the blade than the length of the board." Assume you are ripping a 2X4 that
is a foot long. The fence distance could not possibly be even close to the
length of the board. If you are cross cutting, setting the fence at the
board length would mean the board misses the blade.

Right. The fence cannot be (usefully) set further from the blade than the
length of the board, so you're OK. If you're cross-cutting, don't use the
fence! Use a cross-cut sled, as has been said here a number of times.

Where did I get it wrong and what is the correct interpretation?

The problem arises when the board twists when it's in contact with the blade.
It's a sure way to have it come rocketing back at you. If the board isn't
longer than the distance from the blade to the fence, there isn't enough of it
on the fence to keep it against the fence.

Use the miter gauge if it does not fit the above conditions, and of
course,
never use the rip fence and the miter gauge at the same time.


Teach your students to make and use a crosscut sled.


I do, when there is a need. With two power miter saws and a 14"RAS sitting
around, there is not often a need.

-- Jim in NC

Jim in NC,

I don't quite get the "The fence also must not be set much further from
the blade than the length of the board." Assume you are ripping a 2X4 that
is a foot long. The fence distance could not possibly be even close to the
length of the board. If you are cross cutting, setting the fence at the
board length would mean the board misses the blade.

Where did I get it wrong and what is the correct interpretation?

TIA.


I will try again.

If the saw blade is out of the table top 6" along the direction of travel,
the wood being _ripped_ should be at least 9" long. Doing this keeps
enough wood on the rip fence to keep it from turning sideways while it is
beside the blade, which of course would cause a big kickback.

The second part of the rule is that if the piece being ripped is 9" long, it
should not be ripped more than 9" wide. Doing so would allow the wood to
again turn sideways, causing kickback.

I know, there are some exceptions for the experienced woodworker, but this
rule is to keep 14 to 18 year olds from doing something drastic-bad. They
can learn to ignore my rules after I am not responsible for keeping their
fingers on their hands.

That work for you? ;-)

-- Jim in NC

"Morgans" wrote in message
...


Jim in NC,

I don't quite get the "The fence also must not be set much further
from
the blade than the length of the board." Assume you are ripping a 2X4
that
is a foot long. The fence distance could not possibly be even close to
the
length of the board. If you are cross cutting, setting the fence at the
board length would mean the board misses the blade.

Where did I get it wrong and what is the correct interpretation?

TIA.


I will try again.

If the saw blade is out of the table top 6" along the direction of travel,
the wood being _ripped_ should be at least 9" long. Doing this keeps
enough wood on the rip fence to keep it from turning sideways while it is
beside the blade, which of course would cause a big kickback.

The second part of the rule is that if the piece being ripped is 9" long,
it should not be ripped more than 9" wide. Doing so would allow the wood
to again turn sideways, causing kickback.

I know, there are some exceptions for the experienced woodworker, but this
rule is to keep 14 to 18 year olds from doing something drastic-bad. They
can learn to ignore my rules after I am not responsible for keeping their
fingers on their hands.

That work for you? ;-)

-- Jim in NC




Thanks. Now I understand. I initially thought you were using the fence
during ripping. I now understand that it simply serves as a reminder to not
allow too wide of a rip, crosscut sleds not withsatnding.