I posted a similar inquiry to the home repair newsgroup and would appreciate
any suggestions for other, active, newsgroups where it would get a good
response.
===
I have a lifelong background in real estate and am now retired. I'd enjoy
discussing the differences in upscale single family residences found in
various parts of the country, if anyone is interested.

I am now retired to NV. Here, after looking at various custom and
semi-custom homes, I was surprised to learn I'd not "seen it all," yet.
Besides the expected features and amenities found in most upscale homes
today, such as commercial appliances in kitchens, media wiring, built in
vac, granite counters, cabinetry in the closets and multiple car garages, I
have seen some new things. These include a separate sink for vegetable
preparation, usually located near the one or two refrigerators, two
dishwashers, pot filler faucet by the cooktop, outlets inside bathroom
drawers for curlers and hair dryers, fireplaces in major bathrooms and the
master suite, steam showers and (always) an in-ground pool with spa.

Upscale flooring in Nevada is typically Travertine in most areas and carpet
in the bedrooms, with large tile being acceptable if it matches the theme of
the home. Ceilings are usually 10' in the "lower" semi-custom homes and 12'
to 15' in the better custom ones. Doors are almost always 8', solid, and
have Baldwin or Emco hardware. Windows are low E double pane, of course,
and insulation is extensive. Exterior walls are 6" and the better homes have
5/8" drywall throughout. In some of the better custom homes, the front
door(s) are massive iron with swing out leaded glass inserts, weighing in
around 400# each.

Another feature seen in the upscale homes is stepped, or coffered, ceilings-
many with crown mold as well on the vertical portions. Pot shelves are
found in even the tract homes. Drywall corners are rounded, rather than
square, and there is every conceivable finish to the drywall other than flat
and smooth. Even in the multi million dollar homes, though, trim and
baseboards are almost always painted and of man-made material, rather than
hardwood. Hardwood trim and doors are simply not evident.

What amenities, features and the like do you find in your own area of the
country, such as the above?

Nonny

On Aug 11, 6:02*pm, "Nonnymus" wrote:
I posted a similar inquiry to the home repair newsgroup and would appreciate
any suggestions for other, active, newsgroups where it would get a good
response.
===

Hey Nonny. Crossposting, in general, is bad newsgroup etiquette, but
when it's the same question, and applicable to a few newsgroups, it's
better to have all of the answers in the one question/thread.
Otherwise people will have to read the responses in each newsgroup
separately, and if it's an active thread, you'll get a fair bit of
duplication of responses. That just wastes people's time.

R

Currently My wife and I are preparing to build a new home. Certainly not
high end but it will most likely have most of what you have mentioned. I
suppose it is all relative as a for instance your mention of 10' ceilings
being in lower custom homes. Our 30 year old "starter home" has 10 foot
ceilings. Rounded corner sheet rock has been the norm in all new
construction for 15 + years. Hard wood trim is common but typically a
marginal up grade. What is a Pot Shelf? Skupltured/stepped ceilings and
crown molding are available in starter homes. Fancy front doors are common.
Starting to see fire places offered in the back yard patio. Granite is
common place and a 3 car garage is becoming a common neighborhoow sighting
for homes in new neighborhoods. Our new home will have a 3 car garage.

At the moment the home we are most interested in and appointed the way we
want will have, 10" ceilings, Island kitchen, extra study room, 3 bedrooms,
formal dining, breakfast nook, 3 car garage, brick 3 sides, extral high roof
line, tile in all rooms except bedrooms, oval tub and seperate shower,
remote controlled fire place, radient barrier decking, double pained low-e
windows, Cat 5 media wiring to name the most obvious and just under 2100 sq.
ft. single story. $148K.





"Nonnymus" wrote in message
...
I posted a similar inquiry to the home repair newsgroup and would
appreciate any suggestions for other, active, newsgroups where it would get
a good response.
===
I have a lifelong background in real estate and am now retired. I'd enjoy
discussing the differences in upscale single family residences found in
various parts of the country, if anyone is interested.

I am now retired to NV. Here, after looking at various custom and
semi-custom homes, I was surprised to learn I'd not "seen it all," yet.
Besides the expected features and amenities found in most upscale homes
today, such as commercial appliances in kitchens, media wiring, built in
vac, granite counters, cabinetry in the closets and multiple car garages,
I have seen some new things. These include a separate sink for vegetable
preparation, usually located near the one or two refrigerators, two
dishwashers, pot filler faucet by the cooktop, outlets inside bathroom
drawers for curlers and hair dryers, fireplaces in major bathrooms and the
master suite, steam showers and (always) an in-ground pool with spa.

Upscale flooring in Nevada is typically Travertine in most areas and
carpet in the bedrooms, with large tile being acceptable if it matches the
theme of the home. Ceilings are usually 10' in the "lower" semi-custom
homes and 12' to 15' in the better custom ones. Doors are almost always
8', solid, and have Baldwin or Emco hardware. Windows are low E double
pane, of course, and insulation is extensive. Exterior walls are 6" and
the better homes have 5/8" drywall throughout. In some of the better
custom homes, the front door(s) are massive iron with swing out leaded
glass inserts, weighing in around 400# each.

Another feature seen in the upscale homes is stepped, or coffered,
ceilings- many with crown mold as well on the vertical portions. Pot
shelves are found in even the tract homes. Drywall corners are rounded,
rather than square, and there is every conceivable finish to the drywall
other than flat and smooth. Even in the multi million dollar homes,
though, trim and baseboards are almost always painted and of man-made
material, rather than hardwood. Hardwood trim and doors are simply not
evident.

What amenities, features and the like do you find in your own area of the
country, such as the above?

Nonny

On Wed, 11 Aug 2010 17:37:59 -0500, "Leon" wrote:

Currently My wife and I are preparing to build a new home. Certainly not
high end but it will most likely have most of what you have mentioned. I
suppose it is all relative as a for instance your mention of 10' ceilings
being in lower custom homes. Our 30 year old "starter home" has 10 foot
ceilings. Rounded corner sheet rock has been the norm in all new
construction for 15 + years. Hard wood trim is common but typically a
marginal up grade. What is a Pot Shelf? Skupltured/stepped ceilings and
crown molding are available in starter homes. Fancy front doors are common.
Starting to see fire places offered in the back yard patio. Granite is
common place and a 3 car garage is becoming a common neighborhoow sighting
for homes in new neighborhoods. Our new home will have a 3 car garage.

When I looked at new homes in the Des Moines, IA area *every one* had a
three-car garage. Only one of the several tens of new homes here in Alabama
had one, and that one was almost the identical size as a normal two-car, only
with three doors. The trickery wasn't evident until I measured. ;-) I would
certainly go for a three-car garage, if I built.

At the moment the home we are most interested in and appointed the way we
want will have, 10" ceilings, Island kitchen, extra study room, 3 bedrooms,
formal dining, breakfast nook, 3 car garage, brick 3 sides, extral high roof
line, tile in all rooms except bedrooms, oval tub and seperate shower,
remote controlled fire place, radient barrier decking, double pained low-e
windows, Cat 5 media wiring to name the most obvious and just under 2100 sq.
ft. single story. $148K.

10" ceilings? ;-)

Our house isn't "high end" by any means, but it's certainly not a starter,
either. We have 2600ft^2, 3 bedroom, 3-1/2 baths. There are granite tops
everywhere except the laundry (5 surfaces in the kitchen, living room shelves,
and the four bathrooms). Fireplace, formal dining, great room (kitchen,
living, and breakfast separated by a bar area). The master suite is about 1/3
of the main floor, with two bedrooms upstairs. 9' ceilings, with cathedral
ceilings over the great room (not kitchen or breakfast areas).

The master suite is connected by two hallways to the great room, with the
master bath on one end of the second and to walk-in closets leading to the
bedroom at the other end of the hall. Whirlpool tub and 6'x6' shower, with
rain head, in master bath, all tiled. The master bath is about 12'x15'. The
other two full bathrooms have the crappy one-piece fiberglass tubs and
surrounds. This sort of master suite setup is quite common here. Almost all
new homes had similar.

The other nice feature was the screened in porch and a space big enough over
the garage to build a shop (current project ;-).

"Leon" wrote in message
...
Currently My wife and I are preparing to build a new home. Certainly not
high end but it will most likely have most of what you have mentioned. I
suppose it is all relative as a for instance your mention of 10' ceilings
being in lower custom homes. Our 30 year old "starter home" has 10 foot
ceilings. Rounded corner sheet rock has been the norm in all new
construction for 15 + years. Hard wood trim is common but typically a
marginal up grade. What is a Pot Shelf? Skupltured/stepped ceilings and
crown molding are available in starter homes. Fancy front doors are
common.
Starting to see fire places offered in the back yard patio. Granite is
common place and a 3 car garage is becoming a common neighborhoow sighting
for homes in new neighborhoods. Our new home will have a 3 car garage.

At the moment the home we are most interested in and appointed the way we
want will have, 10" ceilings, Island kitchen, extra study room, 3
bedrooms, formal dining, breakfast nook, 3 car garage, brick 3 sides,
extral high roof line, tile in all rooms except bedrooms, oval tub and
seperate shower, remote controlled fire place, radient barrier decking,
double pained low-e windows, Cat 5 media wiring to name the most obvious
and just under 2100 sq. ft. single story. $148K.

Sounds like that would take care of my needs too. That's a lotta house
for 148K, at least in my neck of the woods. I assume that's no basement and
not including the lot?

I think all these architects, designers, etc. read the same books.

Here, for upscale, Interior: stone and solid wood exposed beams
(cypress being one of the premiums) are favorites. Stucco exterior.
Quite a few arched windows & doors, rather than squared. Landscape:
Italian & Greek themes are popular... some western/ranch (USA), but
often a combo of different ones, for particular areas of the lawn.

For moderate housing, 250K - 500K, similar amenities as above, but
many of the homes are built 10' apart, in many subdivisions (as with
100K-250K homes)... no lawn to speak of. Packed in, this way, takes
away from all the expense put into the home, in my opinion.... It's
not a home, but simply a house.

For some with a bit of land, 2 - 5 acres in town or immediate
outskirts, the classic barn (smartly painted), for an outbuilding,
hasn't completely disappeared, yet, but its function is now for boat
storage, small tractor/mower, maybe a small flatbed trailer, air
compressor, misc storage, etc. .... electricity, plumbing....

Sonny

On Aug 11, 6:37*pm, "Leon" wrote:
Currently My wife and I are preparing to build a new home. *Certainly not
high end but it will most likely have most of what you have mentioned. *I
suppose it is all relative as a for instance your mention of 10' ceilings
being in lower custom homes. *Our 30 year old "starter home" has 10 foot
ceilings. *Rounded corner sheet rock has been the norm in all new
construction for 15 + years. *Hard wood trim is common but typically a
marginal up grade. * What is a Pot Shelf? *Skupltured/stepped ceilings and
crown molding are available in starter homes. *Fancy front doors are common.
Starting to see fire places offered in the back yard patio. *Granite is
common place and a 3 car garage is becoming a common neighborhoow sighting
for homes in new neighborhoods. *Our new home will have a 3 car garage.

You mean a 1000 SF workshop, right? Or is SWMBO reading over your
shoulder?

At the moment the home we are most interested in and appointed the way we
want will have, 10" ceilings, Island kitchen, extra study room, 3 bedrooms,
formal dining, breakfast nook, 3 car garage, brick 3 sides,

What's the fourth side?

If I might make an observation about siding...
Around here you'll see some homes which I call Colorform homes.
Remember those plastic sticky things where kids would put a sticky
dress cutout on the two dimensional figure of a girl? They were just
applied. When they do that with siding - just apply it like it's
painted on - it becomes analogous to a Colorform toy.

Brick and stone are the bones of the house and usually show the best
when they are designed to work that way. Some house styles, like
Federalist houses, pretty much require all brick veneer. But if the
house is not such a style, having the brick/stone closer to the ground
and edges and corners, then transitioning to another style of siding
(such as stucco) between and above the brick/stone, can look sharper
and more distinctive than just having it all one way of the other.

Tudor houses, when well done, are good examples (though this link
isn't the best it does give the idea)
http://www.tulsapreservationcommissi...s/mcbirney.jpg
This is a remodeled box of a house that's been broken up with the
stone - it's on the way, but not quite there yet.
http://www.peakstuccoandstone.com/im...-SandStone.jpg
and another from that site:
http://www.peakstuccoandstone.com/im...MtColumbia.jpg

Here's a what not to do picture - too busy and arbitrarily done
siding:
http://gzcontracting.info/images/stu...wood%20str.jpg

R

On Aug 11, 6:37*pm, "Leon" wrote:

Currently My wife and I are preparing to build a new home. *Certainly not
high end but it will most likely have most of what you have mentioned. *I
suppose it is all relative as a for instance your mention of 10' ceilings
being in lower custom homes. *Our 30 year old "starter home" has 10 foot
ceilings. *Rounded corner sheet rock has been the norm in all new
construction for 15 + years. *Hard wood trim is common but typically a
marginal up grade. * What is a Pot Shelf? *Skupltured/stepped ceilings and
crown molding are available in starter homes. *Fancy front doors are common.
Starting to see fire places offered in the back yard patio. *Granite is
common place and a 3 car garage is becoming a common neighborhoow sighting
for homes in new neighborhoods. *Our new home will have a 3 car garage.

At the moment the home we are most interested in and appointed the way we
want will have, 10" ceilings, Island kitchen, extra study room, 3 bedrooms,
formal dining, breakfast nook, 3 car garage, brick 3 sides, extral high roof
line, tile in all rooms except bedrooms, oval tub and seperate shower,
remote controlled fire place, radient barrier decking, double pained low-e
windows, Cat 5 media wiring to name the most obvious and just under 2100 sq.
ft. single story. *$148K.

I'm assuming that that $148K is for the house built on your lot,
right?
This is what $140K gets you around he
http://www.redfin.com/NY/Elmont/1485.../home/20469891
Around here meaning about ten miles away - closest I could find, and
not exactly what you'd call a good area, but at least it includes all
1/8 acre!

This one really hurts:
http://www.redfin.com/NY/Huntington-.../home/21092286
It's on the market for less than half of what it sold for four years
ago. This one's about 15 miles away.

R

"Leon" wrote in message
...
Currently My wife and I are preparing to build a new home. Certainly not
high end but it will most likely have most of what you have mentioned. I
suppose it is all relative as a for instance your mention of 10' ceilings
being in lower custom homes. Our 30 year old "starter home" has 10 foot
ceilings. Rounded corner sheet rock has been the norm in all new
construction for 15 + years. Hard wood trim is common but typically a
marginal up grade. What is a Pot Shelf? Skupltured/stepped ceilings and
crown molding are available in starter homes. Fancy front doors are
common.
Starting to see fire places offered in the back yard patio. Granite is
common place and a 3 car garage is becoming a common neighborhoow sighting
for homes in new neighborhoods. Our new home will have a 3 car garage.

At the moment the home we are most interested in and appointed the way we
want will have, 10" ceilings, Island kitchen, extra study room, 3
bedrooms, formal dining, breakfast nook, 3 car garage, brick 3 sides,
extral high roof line, tile in all rooms except bedrooms, oval tub and
seperate shower, remote controlled fire place, radient barrier decking,
double pained low-e windows, Cat 5 media wiring to name the most obvious
and just under 2100 sq. ft. single story. $148K.

What area of the country would this be in? The price is a bit lower than
found here in NV, but not my much. We have actual new starter homes
advertised in the $80/sf range, but by the time you are ready to live in
them, completing what's left off, you're at $100. To get to where you're
talking, it'd be $150/sf or more.

FWIW, a pot shelf, as they're called here, is a decorative "step" about 30"
or so from a dinette, dining room or living room wall, presumably to set
greenery, decorative plates or pots, or vases on. It's near the ceiling and
usually reached by a step ladder.

"d.williams" wrote in message
...

"Leon" wrote in message
...
Currently My wife and I are preparing to build a new home. Certainly not
high end but it will most likely have most of what you have mentioned. I
suppose it is all relative as a for instance your mention of 10' ceilings
being in lower custom homes. Our 30 year old "starter home" has 10 foot
ceilings. Rounded corner sheet rock has been the norm in all new
construction for 15 + years. Hard wood trim is common but typically a
marginal up grade. What is a Pot Shelf? Skupltured/stepped ceilings
and crown molding are available in starter homes. Fancy front doors are
common.
Starting to see fire places offered in the back yard patio. Granite is
common place and a 3 car garage is becoming a common neighborhoow
sighting for homes in new neighborhoods. Our new home will have a 3 car
garage.

Garages here are incredible. In the Midwest, a good 2-car would be 22 X 22
or even 24' deep. Here, if you get 20', it's considered a jumbo. Doors for
a 2-car are almost always 16' wide and singles are 8' wide. It's common to
see a single and double door side by side. However, the single garage is
only 14' or so deep and really intended for storage. Since storage isn't
something builders think will sell for much, it's absolutely minimal in
tract and even semi-custom homes. We see many whole subdivisions where
people park on the drive so that they can use the garage for storage. I've
seen homes advertised with 4-car garages, only to see a single 16' door.
The person will explain that "the garage is extra deep, so I'm calling it a
4-car." grin

Nonny

"Sonny" wrote in message
...
I think all these architects, designers, etc. read the same books.

Here, for upscale, Interior: stone and solid wood exposed beams
(cypress being one of the premiums) are favorites. Stucco exterior.
Quite a few arched windows & doors, rather than squared. Landscape:
Italian & Greek themes are popular... some western/ranch (USA), but
often a combo of different ones, for particular areas of the lawn.

For moderate housing, 250K - 500K,

What part of the country?

similar amenities as above, but
many of the homes are built 10' apart, in many subdivisions (as with
100K-250K homes)... no lawn to speak of. Packed in, this way, takes
away from all the expense put into the home, in my opinion.... It's
not a home, but simply a house.

I seem to see that home exteriors remain a bit static, while the extra money
is spent on inside and back yard amenities, here in NV.



For some with a bit of land, 2 - 5 acres

A half acre lot in Las Vegas/Henderson is considered huge, and usually
includes a parking area for an RV. We had 6 wooded acres previously, so the
difference is appalling.
\
\
Nonny


in town or immediate
outskirts, the classic barn (smartly painted), for an outbuilding,
hasn't completely disappeared, yet, but its function is now for boat
storage, small tractor/mower, maybe a small flatbed trailer, air
compressor, misc storage, etc. .... electricity, plumbing....

Sonny

What part of the country?



Lafayette, Louisiana

Sonny

On Wed, 11 Aug 2010 18:26:48 -0700, Sonny wrote:


What part of the country?



Lafayette, Louisiana

Sonny

Oh, damn Sonny,

I've had some odd connections with Lafayette,
once back in the eighties, me and a cohort were
threatened at gunpoint by a robber that had just knocked
off a gas station in Lafayette, fortunately, neither of
us or the gas station attendant were injured.

Then some years later my (ex)wife ran off with a Cajun
from there. I don't hold it against Cajuns or Lafayette,
best thing that ever happen to me.

basilisk



--
A wink is as good as a nod to a blind horse

On 8/11/2010 7:21 PM, Nonnymus wrote:

What area of the country would this be in? The price is a bit lower than
found here in NV, but not my much. We have actual new starter homes
advertised in the $80/sf range, but by the time you are ready to live in
them, completing what's left off, you're at $100. To get to where you're
talking, it'd be $150/sf or more.

Houston suburbs.

A good time to buy a house in this area. Since this last tax break
expired, sales have slowed considerably and volume builders are starting
to feel the pinch, again.

I've looked at Leon's floor plan and it is an excellent deal, and a sign
of the times. And Leon certainly knows more than enough about
construction to be comfortable with the build quality.

I certainly can't build a comparable home in the near SW area for that
sf price. Then again, I couldn't give away a single story house where I
build, even though I would prefer one myself and think it is a smarter
choice.

AAMOF, if it weren't for SWMBO, who's business is her passion and
extremely location sensitive, I'd consider selling and following Leon's
"upgrade" to a four car garage.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 4/15/2010
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"d.williams" wrote in message
...

"Leon" wrote in message
...
Currently My wife and I are preparing to build a new home. Certainly not
high end but it will most likely have most of what you have mentioned. I
suppose it is all relative as a for instance your mention of 10' ceilings
being in lower custom homes. Our 30 year old "starter home" has 10 foot
ceilings. Rounded corner sheet rock has been the norm in all new
construction for 15 + years. Hard wood trim is common but typically a
marginal up grade. What is a Pot Shelf? Skupltured/stepped ceilings
and crown molding are available in starter homes. Fancy front doors are
common.
Starting to see fire places offered in the back yard patio. Granite is
common place and a 3 car garage is becoming a common neighborhoow
sighting for homes in new neighborhoods. Our new home will have a 3 car
garage.

At the moment the home we are most interested in and appointed the way we
want will have, 10" ceilings, Island kitchen, extra study room, 3
bedrooms, formal dining, breakfast nook, 3 car garage, brick 3 sides,
extral high roof line, tile in all rooms except bedrooms, oval tub and
seperate shower, remote controlled fire place, radient barrier decking,
double pained low-e windows, Cat 5 media wiring to name the most obvious
and just under 2100 sq. ft. single story. $148K.

Sounds like that would take care of my needs too. That's a lotta house
for 148K, at least in my neck of the woods. I assume that's no basement
and not including the lot?

Living in the Houston area there are no basements but yes the price is on a
lot in a 2 year old neighborhood. Actually about 30 miles SW of down town
Houston. We currently live about 12 miles SW of down town.

"RicodJour" wrote in message
...
On Aug 11, 6:37 pm, "Leon" wrote:
Currently My wife and I are preparing to build a new home. Certainly not
high end but it will most likely have most of what you have mentioned. I
suppose it is all relative as a for instance your mention of 10' ceilings
being in lower custom homes. Our 30 year old "starter home" has 10 foot
ceilings. Rounded corner sheet rock has been the norm in all new
construction for 15 + years. Hard wood trim is common but typically a
marginal up grade. What is a Pot Shelf? Skupltured/stepped ceilings and
crown molding are available in starter homes. Fancy front doors are
common.
Starting to see fire places offered in the back yard patio. Granite is
common place and a 3 car garage is becoming a common neighborhoow sighting
for homes in new neighborhoods. Our new home will have a 3 car garage.

You mean a 1000 SF workshop, right? Or is SWMBO reading over your
shoulder?

LOL, no more like 540 sq ft. I am dealing with 380 now.

At the moment the home we are most interested in and appointed the way we
want will have, 10" ceilings, Island kitchen, extra study room, 3
bedrooms,
formal dining, breakfast nook, 3 car garage, brick 3 sides,

What's the fourth side?

Painted Hardi Plank, all exterior other than brick and shingles is Hardi
products.

If I might make an observation about siding...
Around here you'll see some homes which I call Colorform homes.
Remember those plastic sticky things where kids would put a sticky
dress cutout on the two dimensional figure of a girl? They were just
applied. When they do that with siding - just apply it like it's
painted on - it becomes analogous to a Colorform toy.

Brick and stone are the bones of the house and usually show the best
when they are designed to work that way. Some house styles, like
Federalist houses, pretty much require all brick veneer. But if the
house is not such a style, having the brick/stone closer to the ground
and edges and corners, then transitioning to another style of siding
(such as stucco) between and above the brick/stone, can look sharper
and more distinctive than just having it all one way of the other.


This particular bilder does not offer many options in that reguard however
he is 15-20% less expensive than his competition. We do have the option to
have brick on all 4 sides but to tell you the truth I would prefer no brick
and all Hardi.

"Nonnymus" wrote in message
news



What area of the country would this be in? The price is a bit lower than
found here in NV, but not my much. We have actual new starter homes
advertised in the $80/sf range, but by the time you are ready to live in
them, completing what's left off, you're at $100. To get to where you're
talking, it'd be $150/sf or more.

Houston metro area.



FWIW, a pot shelf, as they're called here, is a decorative "step" about
30" or so from a dinette, dining room or living room wall, presumably to
set greenery, decorative plates or pots, or vases on. It's near the
ceiling and usually reached by a step ladder.

Ohh! yes those are pretty common place, not unusual to see several in a
home. My wife refers to them as dust collectors that will be hard to get to
to vacuum. From what I have seen in most homes that I have done some work
in, her observations are correct. In fact many I have seen require more
than a common 6' step ladder to reach. They are often 3-4' deep and at
least 10' from the floor in 2 story homes. The are best viewed from a stair
way or cat walk.

On Thu, 12 Aug 2010 08:02:00 -0500, Leon wrote:

Brick and stone are the bones of the house and usually show the best
when they are designed to work that way. Some house styles, like
Federalist houses, pretty much require all brick veneer.

I still remember my father, when looking for a home back in 1950 or so,
turning up his nose at brick veneer. None of that "fake" stuff for him,
he wanted a real brick house - and he found one!

I'm guessing that the '50s were about the time that brick veneer started
being used to lower costs.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

On Aug 11, 11:01*pm, basilisk wrote:
On Wed, 11 Aug 2010 18:26:48 -0700, Sonny wrote:
What part of the country?

Lafayette, Louisiana

Sonny

Oh, damn Sonny,

I've had some odd connections with Lafayette,
once back in the eighties, me and a cohort were
threatened at gunpoint by a robber

We have our share of misfits.... and some of them aren't even
politicians, either.

that had just knocked
off a gas station in Lafayette,

North side of town?


Then some years later my (ex)wife ran off with a Cajun
from there. I don't hold it against Cajuns or Lafayette,
best thing that ever happen to me.

..... and we have our share of both of those kind, too, some having
been known to hop from neighborhood to neighborhood.

Sonny

On Aug 12, 12:24*pm, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Thu, 12 Aug 2010 08:02:00 -0500, Leon wrote:
Brick and stone are the bones of the house and usually show the best
when they are designed to work that way. *Some house styles, like
Federalist houses, pretty much require all brick veneer.

I still remember my father, when looking for a home back in 1950 or so,
turning up his nose at brick veneer. *None of that "fake" stuff for him,
he wanted a real brick house - and he found one!

I'm guessing that the '50s were about the time that brick veneer started
being used to lower costs.

Solid wall masonry construction is not a good choice in all climates,
and energy code requirements for a wall's R-value are a hang up of
plan examiners and building inspectors. It's tough to argue the
thermal mass point with them.

R

"Leon" wrote in message
...
..

Houston metro area.

In the 80's I did a bit of business in Houston and liked the suburbs. What
I "think" I recall was a lot of Tuscan style homes, but my memory is getting
old. Like the homes in Austin, I recall a bit more detail and curb appeal
from exterior detailing than in many other areas, also.





FWIW, a pot shelf, as they're called here, is a decorative "step" about
30" or so from a dinette, dining room or living room wall, presumably to
set greenery, decorative plates or pots, or vases on. It's near the
ceiling and usually reached by a step ladder.

Ohh! yes those are pretty common place, not unusual to see several in a
home. My wife refers to them as dust collectors that will be hard to get
to to vacuum. From what I have seen in most homes that I have done some
work in, her observations are correct. In fact many I have seen require
more than a common 6' step ladder to reach. They are often 3-4' deep and
at least 10' from the floor in 2 story homes. The are best viewed from a
stair way or cat walk.

Here, they seem to run about 2' deep and are quite common in living rooms,
dining rooms and kitchens.

Something else I've noticed here is that walls have a lot of "building out."
By that, I mean a wall, either a shear wall or curtain wall, might have a
second wall built beside it, such as the old plumbing wall or wall for
ductwork. They're done as much for detail as for function. That's where
some of the pot shelves come from: a second wall built beside the real wall
to give detail to a room. Despite the cost of these walls and the small
amounts of wasted space inside them (between the walls), they seem to be
pretty popular. An example might be a master suite that has one corner
rounded, rather than square. The wall between the master suite and an
adjoining room might be straight and square, but on the bedroom side, a
second curved wall is installed, with the enclosed area either ignored or
made to hold a small alcove with shelf for a vase or statue.

Nonny

"RicodJour" wrote in message
...
On Aug 12, 12:24 pm, Larry Blanchard wrote:
On Thu, 12 Aug 2010 08:02:00 -0500, Leon wrote:
Brick and stone are the bones of the house and usually show the best
when they are designed to work that way. Some house styles, like
Federalist houses, pretty much require all brick veneer.

I still remember my father, when looking for a home back in 1950 or so,
turning up his nose at brick veneer. None of that "fake" stuff for him,
he wanted a real brick house - and he found one!

I'm guessing that the '50s were about the time that brick veneer started
being used to lower costs.

Solid wall masonry construction is not a good choice in all climates,
and energy code requirements for a wall's R-value are a hang up of
plan examiners and building inspectors. It's tough to argue the
thermal mass point with them.

Having grown up in a 1840ish-built home with 16" thick brick exterior walls,
I have to agree about the benefit of mass. However, beyond the price of
materials, solid masonry construction doesn't easily permit wires or pipe to
be installed, modified or maintained. Insulation, if required, is also a
problem, as is the cost of labor building it.

Nonny

On Thu, 12 Aug 2010 09:34:28 -0700 (PDT), Sonny wrote:

On Aug 11, 11:01*pm, basilisk wrote:
On Wed, 11 Aug 2010 18:26:48 -0700, Sonny wrote:
What part of the country?

Lafayette, Louisiana

Sonny

Oh, damn Sonny,

I've had some odd connections with Lafayette,
once back in the eighties, me and a cohort were
threatened at gunpoint by a robber

We have our share of misfits.... and some of them aren't even
politicians, either.

that had just knocked
off a gas station in Lafayette,

North side of town?

I can't recall for sure, it was close to I-10 and there was
a sugar mill close by.


Then some years later my (ex)wife ran off with a Cajun
from there. I don't hold it against Cajuns or Lafayette,
best thing that ever happen to me.

.... and we have our share of both of those kind, too, some having
been known to hop from neighborhood to neighborhood.

Sonny

"George" wrote in message
...



Having grown up in a 1840ish-built home with 16" thick brick exterior
walls, I have to agree about the benefit of mass. However, beyond the
price of materials, solid masonry construction doesn't easily permit wires
or pipe to be installed, modified or maintained. Insulation, if required,
is also a problem, as is the cost of labor building it.

Nonny

Typically concrete walls have a very low R-value when compared to typical
insulated stud walls. In 1986 the car dealer I worked for built a new state
of the art facility. Solid poured on site contrete walls. Inside the air
conditioned offices the walls were quite warm to the touch from the
afternoon sun.

"Leon" wrote in message
...

"George" wrote in message
...



Having grown up in a 1840ish-built home with 16" thick brick exterior
walls, I have to agree about the benefit of mass. However, beyond the
price of materials, solid masonry construction doesn't easily permit
wires or pipe to be installed, modified or maintained. Insulation, if
required, is also a problem, as is the cost of labor building it.

Nonny

Typically concrete walls have a very low R-value when compared to typical
insulated stud walls. In 1986 the car dealer I worked for built a new
state of the art facility. Solid poured on site contrete walls. Inside
the air conditioned offices the walls were quite warm to the touch from
the afternoon sun.

From what I read about that kind of massive wall, they almost need to be
"tuned" to the area. Ideally, the cooler night would offset the warmer day
and the overall climate wouldn't have much summer/winter swing, such as in a
desert setting. There, clear nights are cold and days are hot, but
winter-summer is not that much different. If it's much colder than warmer
or the opposite, the mass has less significance. In one city were we lived,
it was colder than the dickens and a poured concrete wall would have
required extensive thermal break and further insulation to be effective.

Nonny

On Thu, 12 Aug 2010 09:52:20 -0700, RicodJour wrote:

On Aug 12, 12:24Â*pm, Larry Blanchard wrote:

I still remember my father, when looking for a home back in 1950 or so,
turning up his nose at brick veneer. Â*None of that "fake" stuff for
him, he wanted a real brick house - and he found one!

I'm guessing that the '50s were about the time that brick veneer
started being used to lower costs.

Solid wall masonry construction is not a good choice in all climates,
and energy code requirements for a wall's R-value are a hang up of plan
examiners and building inspectors. It's tough to argue the thermal mass
point with them.


This was Louisville, KY. Not the Arctic, but not the tropics either. We
did get some snow. I lived in a similar house, although it was much
older. I can't remember the walls being cold in the winter or warm in
the summer. That dead air in between works pretty well. The one I was
renting had 12' (at least) ceilings and the gaslight fittings were still
there.

This was before residential AC was common and the house was nice and cool
in the summer - in fact it did better than my father's house.

--
Intelligence is an experiment that failed - G. B. Shaw

"Leon" wrote

Typically concrete walls have a very low R-value when compared to typical
insulated stud walls. In 1986 the car dealer I worked for built a new
state of the art facility. Solid poured on site contrete walls. Inside
the air conditioned offices the walls were quite warm to the touch from
the afternoon sun.


That is why you use Insulating Concrete Forms. Strength of masonry,
efficiency of good insulation.
Such as:
www.integraspec.com
www.greenblock.com

"Nonnymus" wrote

What amenities, features and the like do you find in your own area of the
country, such as the above?

Nonny

I have found that a lot of amenities in homes are overpriced and low quality
If a person is a craftsman, they are better off to find a floor plan they
like, or just a house that they like for some other reasons, and then do the
upgrades themselves, doing them exactly to order, getting probably a better
job, and getting it for less. And in the case of some really high end
amenities, (SubZero, Wolf, Dacor, Vulcan, etc.) the cost could be halved,
and moderately high quality amenities substituted without sacrificing a lot.

MHO, YMMV

Steve

visit my blog at http://cabgbypasssurgery.com

On Thu, 12 Aug 2010 22:23:57 -0400, "Ed Pawlowski"
wrote:


"Leon" wrote

Typically concrete walls have a very low R-value when compared to typical
insulated stud walls. In 1986 the car dealer I worked for built a new
state of the art facility. Solid poured on site contrete walls. Inside
the air conditioned offices the walls were quite warm to the touch from
the afternoon sun.


That is why you use Insulating Concrete Forms. Strength of masonry,
efficiency of good insulation.
Such as:
www.integraspec.com
www.greenblock.com

Yeah, ICFs and SIPs are the only way to build any more.
http://www.sips.org/content/about/index.cfm?pageId=7 example

"Nonnymus" wrote in message
...

What amenities, features and the like do you find in your own area of the
country, such as the above?

What some people call "amenities" often look like "fads" to my wife and I.
We've looked at some new homes and remodeled homes where we both saw
features we predicted would look hopelessly dated in not too many years.
And frankly some currently popular features don't appeal to us even if
they're still fashionable, e.g. granite countertops. To each his own of
course, but fashion is a fickle mistress.

"DGDevin" wrote in message
m...

"Nonnymus" wrote in message
...

What amenities, features and the like do you find in your own area of the
country, such as the above?

What some people call "amenities" often look like "fads" to my wife and I.
We've looked at some new homes and remodeled homes where we both saw
features we predicted would look hopelessly dated in not too many years.
And frankly some currently popular features don't appeal to us even if
they're still fashionable, e.g. granite countertops. To each his own of
course, but fashion is a fickle mistress.

Very true. Today, appliances are SS, where 15 years ago, the best kitchens
had the built-in look, where refrigerators and dishwashers, for instance,
had a panel to match the kitchen cabinets. The color of wood changes, also.
I saw one home that hit me as obviously '70-90's. The flooring was natural
laid oak, as were the cabinets. Even things like built-ins have decreased
in today's taste. Our first home had a built-in set of doors and drawers
between two closets in the master bedroom and also for linen in the hallway.
You don't see that anymore.

What I see in today's market are natural materials more than man-made. One
person commented that Corian and Silestone were "cheap substitutes" for the
"better" Granite and marble on counter tops. Likewise, Travertine is a very
popular flooring in upper end homes, with large tile being a close second.
It then spirals downward into the man-made things like laminates, vinyls and
even carpet is not as popular here as it once was.

OTOH, things like skylights and sky tubes are increasingly popular, and
they're something that will probably remain in fashion for a long while.

Nonny

On Aug 13, 1:20*pm, "DGDevin" wrote:
"Nonnymus" wrote in message

...

What amenities, features and the like do you find in your own area of the
country, such as the above?

What some people call "amenities" often look like "fads" to my wife and I..
We've looked at some new homes and remodeled homes where we both saw
features we predicted would look hopelessly dated in not too many years.
And frankly some currently popular features don't appeal to us even if
they're still fashionable, e.g. granite countertops. *To each his own of
course, but fashion is a fickle mistress.

Some do, I suppose to everyone. I'm not so thrilled with painted
trim, arches, or rounded drywall corners. OTOH, SWMBO loves her
granite counter tops and would never have anything else, now (well,
perhaps quartz). They're great for baking. Wood floors are another
"fad" that's back "in".

On Aug 13, 1:53*pm, "George" wrote:
"DGDevin" wrote in message

m...



"Nonnymus" wrote in message
m...

What amenities, features and the like do you find in your own area of the
country, such as the above?

What some people call "amenities" often look like "fads" to my wife and I.
We've looked at some new homes and remodeled homes where we both saw
features we predicted would look hopelessly dated in not too many years..
And frankly some currently popular features don't appeal to us even if
they're still fashionable, e.g. granite countertops. *To each his own of
course, but fashion is a fickle mistress.

Very true. *Today, appliances are SS, where 15 years ago, the best kitchens
had the built-in look, where refrigerators and dishwashers, for instance,
had a panel to match the kitchen cabinets. *The color of wood changes, also.
I saw one home that hit me as obviously '70-90's. *The flooring was natural
laid oak, as were the cabinets. *Even things like built-ins have decreased
in today's taste. *Our first home had a built-in set of doors and drawers
between two closets in the master bedroom and also for linen in the hallway.
You don't see that anymore.

You do see large walk-ins with all that stuff inside. The one thing
that our (2YO) house is missing that gripes my wife is no linen closet
on the first floor. There is one on the second, but it's mostly
useless since the master is down.

What I see in today's market are natural materials more than man-made. *One
person commented that Corian and Silestone were "cheap substitutes" for the
"better" Granite and marble on counter tops. *Likewise, Travertine is a very
popular flooring in upper end homes, with large tile being a close second..
It then spirals downward into the man-made things like laminates, vinyls and
even carpet is not as popular here as it once was.

Corian was "cheap"? I never liked the stuff but never considered it
in any way cheap, even compared to granite. Vinyl was an immediate
'X' when we were looking a couple of years back.

OTOH, things like skylights and sky tubes are increasingly popular, and
they're something that will probably remain in fashion for a long while.

I like the looks of them but get concerned about anything poking
through the roof. The idiot builders seem to have a hard enough time
with chimneys. Giving them more to screw up seems like a bad idea.

"George" wrote in message
...


Very true. Today, appliances are SS, where 15 years ago, the best
kitchens had the built-in look, where refrigerators and dishwashers, for
instance, had a panel to match the kitchen cabinets. The color of wood
changes, also. I saw one home that hit me as obviously '70-90's. The
flooring was natural laid oak, as were the cabinets. Even things like
built-ins have decreased in today's taste. Our first home had a built-in
set of doors and drawers between two closets in the master bedroom and
also for linen in the hallway. You don't see that anymore.

Funny how region has a lot to do with thends. SS was popular in the Houston
30 years ago and coming back again.

What I see in today's market are natural materials more than man-made.
One person commented that Corian and Silestone were "cheap substitutes"
for the "better" Granite and marble on counter tops. Likewise, Travertine
is a very popular flooring in upper end homes, with large tile being a
close second. It then spirals downward into the man-made things like
laminates, vinyls and even carpet is not as popular here as it once was.

I would not necesserily consider Silestone a cheap substitute foe granite
nor would I consider granite better.



OTOH, things like skylights and sky tubes are increasingly popular, and
they're something that will probably remain in fashion for a long while.


In Houston it seems the slykights are increasingly unpopular, again back on
the 80's these were popular but leaked. Now I don't see them so much in new
construction.

"George" wrote in message
...

Even things like built-ins have decreased in today's taste. Our first home
had a built-in set of doors and drawers between two closets in the master
bedroom and also for linen in the hallway. You don't see that anymore.

Some built-ins make sense as anyone who ever lives there is going to need
certain forms of storage in certain areas. But I can see people wanting to
set up rooms as they please and thus not wanting a lot of built-ins, e.g.
built-in book cases push you towards using that room as a library or office
when maybe you'd rather it was a guest bedroom.

What I see in today's market are natural materials more than man-made.
One person commented that Corian and Silestone were "cheap substitutes"
for the "better" Granite and marble on counter tops.

When we remodel our kitchen (next on the list after a successful bedroom
renovation that is getting rave reviews from SWMBO) I'm pushing for recycled
ground glass in concrete or resin for the counters. It's as close to
bullet-proof as you can get, which granite or marble certainly are not.

Likewise, Travertine is a very popular flooring in upper end homes, with
large tile being a close second. It then spirals downward into the
man-made things like laminates, vinyls and even carpet is not as popular
here as it once was.

I can tolerate tile in the bathroom, but anywhere else I can't stand
it--cold, slippery, noisy. I like hardwood floors since they look good and
are easy to maintain. We have area rugs here and there, but wall-to-wall
carpeting (something I grew up with) is more trouble than it is worth to me
now--gimme that oak!

OTOH, things like skylights and sky tubes are increasingly popular, and
they're something that will probably remain in fashion for a long while.

Yup, they make sense because it isn't like the cost of energy is going down
over the long term.

"Leon" wrote

In Houston it seems the slykights are increasingly unpopular, again back
on the 80's these were popular but leaked. Now I don't see them so much
in new construction.

Use VeLux skylights. There will never be a leak problem, with the flashing
system they use.
--
Jim in NC

"Morgans" wrote in message
...

"Leon" wrote

In Houston it seems the slykights are increasingly unpopular, again back
on the 80's these were popular but leaked. Now I don't see them so much
in new construction.

Use VeLux skylights. There will never be a leak problem, with the
flashing system they use.
--
Jim in NC


IIRC the lens? would crack.

"DGDevin" wrote in message
m...



When we remodel our kitchen (next on the list after a successful bedroom
renovation that is getting rave reviews from SWMBO) I'm pushing for
recycled ground glass in concrete or resin for the counters. It's as
close to bullet-proof as you can get, which granite or marble certainly
are not.

Swingman built a house and used that ground glass counter top material, IIRC
it had local beer joint broken beer bottle glass in it. Much of the top has
chunks of glass on the surface, it is flat, but I have to wonder how
bullet-proof that glass is. I could see a heavy object chipping the class.
The counter top appearance reminded me of taffy, strange indeed.

"Leon" wrote in message
...

"Morgans" wrote in message
...

"Leon" wrote

In Houston it seems the slykights are increasingly unpopular, again back
on the 80's these were popular but leaked. Now I don't see them so much
in new construction.

Use VeLux skylights. There will never be a leak problem, with the
flashing system they use.
--
Jim in NC


IIRC the lens? would crack.


FWIW, we had them on our home and they were great. As Leon said, the glass
was broken by a branch on one, and another developed fogging. Outside of
those two glitches, we were pleased and would use them again if we needed a
traditional skylight.

A home we're considering has these in an inside hallway. I'm amazed at the
amount of light they give off, and there doesn't seem to be heat associated
with it.
http://www.solatube.com/

Nonny

DGDevin wrote:

Yup, they make sense because it isn't like the cost of energy is
going down over the long term.

But the cost of lighting is. Florescent... CFL... LED.