I have a large shop and want to subdivide a section dedicated to
woodworking.

The shop already has separately framed area that is 24ft. x 11ft. I have a
chance to extend this 11 foot width for an additional 12 feet. Total would
be 36 feet by 11 feet.

Question!!

Is 11 feet width adequate. If needed the addition could be broadened to 13
feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of width
being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? Can you do a decent layout within
11 feet?

All comments greatly appreciated. Would like to start framing within a
week.

The bonus in all of this is that whatever I add on creates extra 'mezzanine'
storage on top. Also a great place for the shop cat.

Ivan Vegvary

Ivan Vegvary wrote:
I have a large shop and want to subdivide a section dedicated to
woodworking.

The shop already has separately framed area that is 24ft. x 11ft. I
have a chance to extend this 11 foot width for an additional 12 feet.
Total would be 36 feet by 11 feet.

Question!!

Is 11 feet width adequate. If needed the addition could be broadened to
13 feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of
width being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? Can you do a decent layout
within 11 feet?

All comments greatly appreciated. Would like to start framing within a
week.
....

W/O knowing what you do or what you have or intend to have in the shop,
specifics aren't possible. I'll simply say that more room is always
useful so if it's all the same essentially, I'd go for larger...

--

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
...
I have a large shop and want to subdivide a section dedicated to
woodworking.

The shop already has separately framed area that is 24ft. x 11ft. I have
a chance to extend this 11 foot width for an additional 12 feet. Total
would be 36 feet by 11 feet.

Question!!

Is 11 feet width adequate. If needed the addition could be broadened to
13 feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of width
being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? Can you do a decent layout
within 11 feet?

All comments greatly appreciated. Would like to start framing within a
week.

The bonus in all of this is that whatever I add on creates extra
'mezzanine' storage on top. Also a great place for the shop cat.

Ivan Vegvary

Bigger is better. Are you going to build jewelry boxes or entertainment
centers? There was a guy here some years ago working out of a 10 x 8 shed
so I'm sure you can get by too.

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
...
I have a large shop and want to subdivide a section dedicated to
woodworking.

The shop already has separately framed area that is 24ft. x 11ft. I have
a chance to extend this 11 foot width for an additional 12 feet. Total
would be 36 feet by 11 feet.

Question!!

Is 11 feet width adequate. If needed the addition could be broadened to
13 feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of width
being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? Can you do a decent layout
within 11 feet?

All comments greatly appreciated. Would like to start framing within a
week.

The bonus in all of this is that whatever I add on creates extra
'mezzanine' storage on top. Also a great place for the shop cat.

Ivan Vegvary


To paraphrase Parkinson a bit; Your tool inventory will expand to so as to
use whatever space has been provided.
There's no such thing as too much space.

Max

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
...
I have a large shop and want to subdivide a section dedicated to
woodworking.

The shop already has separately framed area that is 24ft. x 11ft. I have a
chance to extend this 11 foot width for an additional 12 feet. Total would
be 36 feet by 11 feet.

Question!!

Is 11 feet width adequate. If needed the addition could be broadened to 13
feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of width
being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? Can you do a decent layout within
11 feet?

All comments greatly appreciated. Would like to start framing within a
week.

The bonus in all of this is that whatever I add on creates extra 'mezzanine'
storage on top. Also a great place for the shop cat.

Ivan Vegvary


I agree with Lew and would definitely go for the 13' width.

Any chance of adding an elevator so that mezzanine would be truly
useful for heavy stuff?
Art

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? Can you do a decent layout
within
11 feet?

Repeating others:

More is better.
Depends on your use.

Thatt said, I view shop layout as a series of "lanes".

Feeding a board into a table (ripping) defines a lane for infeed and outfeed
from the saw. If you cross cut at a table saw you have "so much" space for a
longish board to extend beyond either wing of the saw. This too defines a
lane.

Lanes exist for all all machines even if the workpiece remain stationary
i.e. the area left and right if a chop saw.

Each machine has a "lane" and you need to decide what is the biggest
workpiece you want to accomodate. As previously alluded to, the 4x8 sheet of
plywood is one of the workpieces that you may want to accomodate.

Lanes and be stacked vertically. Machines can share lanes. Lanes can be
temporarily extended with an open door. Machines can be placed on mobile
bases to make you lanes dynamic. Assembly counts too; you are the machine.

Storage is important, but secondary to the "lanes". Storage should be fit
under/over/between the lanes.

What machines do you plan to have? What size workpieces do you wich to
accomodate? That should drive your shop size and layout.

Good luck.

-Steve

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in
:

*snip*

Is 11 feet width adequate. If needed the addition could be broadened
to 13 feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of
width being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? Can you do a decent layout
within 11 feet?

*snip*

Ivan Vegvary


Something to think about is whether or not the additional corners from
going wider will cause problems with layout later. If you had to center
the extra 2' on the existing, so it's 1' on either side, I wouldn't
bother. The corners would cause you to lose almost as much space as
you'd gain.

However, if you can put the 2' off to one side, then that's plenty of
room for many stationary tools or a work bench.

Puckdropper
--
Never teach your apprentice everything you know.

On Apr 30, 9:57*am, "dadiOH" wrote:
Ivan Vegvary wrote:
I have a large shop and want to subdivide a section dedicated to
woodworking.

The shop already has separately framed area that is 24ft. x 11ft. *I
have a chance to extend this 11 foot width for an additional 12 feet.
Total would be 36 feet by 11 feet.

Question!!

Is 11 feet width adequate. *If needed the addition could be broadened
to 13 feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of
width being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? *Can you do a decent layout
within 11 feet?

All comments greatly appreciated. *Would like to start framing within
a week.

The bonus in all of this is that whatever I add on creates extra
'mezzanine' storage on top. *Also a great place for the shop cat.

Ivan Vegvary

Lots of good advice so far..."lanes"...bigger is better"..."break down 4x8
sheet of plywood". *Keep in mind that a "lane" for a table saw (and some
other tools) needs to be at least 16' long. *Minimum.

At *least*. Note that "lanes" can overlap in a home shop. In some
cases tools may also be placed in "lanes" (bench/vice under a SCMS
"lane", for instance).

In a long, narrow shop such as you are talking about the natural inclination
would be to string tools along both long sides. *Allowing 2' for each row of
machines, you would have a 7' or 9' area between hem. *Plus a lot of length.

My advice is to go here...http://www.grizzly.com/workshopplanner.aspx
and play around with the planner trying different shop layouts.

Cool. Didn't know about that one.
___________

Personally, I prefer a more square room. *Mine is 24 x 20.

I would, too, but you take what you can get (mine will end up carving
out the "attic" over the garage and laundry, about 15x30 but three
sides will be knee walls. :-(

...

Puckdropper wrote:
....

Something to think about is whether or not the additional corners from
going wider will cause problems with layout later. If you had to center
the extra 2' on the existing, so it's 1' on either side, I wouldn't
bother. The corners would cause you to lose almost as much space as
you'd gain.

How could he lose space by adding dimensions, wherever they were...

I agree the 2-ft offset could be handy for a SCMS station, RAS station,
bench, etc., but the 1-ft corners would be great nooks for storage,
etc., too...

Plus, simply having the extra width will make that portion of the shop
much more open-feeling and pleasant regardless of whether it's split on
both sides or all on one.

As noted I'd go for the width/space irregardless...

--

dpb wrote in
:

Puckdropper wrote:
...

Something to think about is whether or not the additional corners
from going wider will cause problems with layout later. If you had
to center the extra 2' on the existing, so it's 1' on either side, I
wouldn't bother. The corners would cause you to lose almost as much
space as you'd gain.

How could he lose space by adding dimensions, wherever they were...

I agree the 2-ft offset could be handy for a SCMS station, RAS
station, bench, etc., but the 1-ft corners would be great nooks for
storage, etc., too...

*snip*

It all depends on what would need to go there. If you have tool like a
saw that needs a long lane, you'd have to have it a foot away from the
wall to extend the lane to the narrower section.

The space wouldn't be "lost", but just difficult to use. It may not be
worth the extra hassle to make things slightly bigger.

Puckdropper
--
Never teach your apprentice everything you know.

Puckdropper wrote:
dpb wrote in
:
....
How could he lose space by adding dimensions, wherever they were...

....
The space wouldn't be "lost", but just difficult to use. It may not be
worth the extra hassle to make things slightly bigger.

Even if he doesn't put a thing additional in the space over what would
be in the smaller (a highly unlikely scenario in a shop ) imo the
extra feeling of spaciousness of a 13x instead of an 11x area will be
such he'll naturally gravitate to that area of the shop and that alone
would be worth the minimal amount of effort in finishing two 1-ft wall
sections and two extra corners even in the (imo unlikely) event the
space were split rather than contiguous.

--

dpb wrote:
....

would be worth the minimal amount of effort in finishing two 1-ft wall
sections and two extra corners even in the (imo unlikely) event the
space were split rather than contiguous.
....
And, actually of course, it's only one _additional_ short wall section
and corner...

Just my $0.02 for the OP on the size altho he seems to have
disappeared...

--

On Apr 29, 9:58*pm, "Ivan Vegvary" wrote:
I have a large shop and want to subdivide a section dedicated to
woodworking.

The shop already has separately framed area that is 24ft. x 11ft. *I have a
chance to extend this 11 foot width for an additional 12 feet. *Total would
be 36 feet by 11 feet.

Question!!

Is 11 feet width adequate. *If needed the addition could be broadened to 13
feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of width
being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? *Can you do a decent layout within
11 feet?

All comments greatly appreciated. *Would like to start framing within a
week.

The bonus in all of this is that whatever I add on creates extra 'mezzanine'
storage on top. *Also a great place for the shop cat.

Ivan Vegvary

Definately depends on what you do. If your'e like most you do a mix
of residential construction and furniture size and down wood working.
So a 4 x8 is something you might use as an aid to your layout. Don't
forget that many construction goods come in large sizes now than 4
x8...sheet rock I've heard of 8 x 15, base board moodings..12
ft..etc.

If your happy with your current tool set, then you can use that to
figure out the layout you need. If not, get one of those "How to set
up your Shop" books...they have many points to consider before
building your workshop(or adding to it)...things like electrical and
HVAC...plus workflow considerations that some others have touched
upoun already. I went from a 10 x 12 garage to a 24 x 32 steel
building workshop and I wish I had more after 3 years (but of course I
added a unisaw and scms too)...so think about expansion.

One of things I didn't do well is storage...you tend to accumulate a
lot of jigs, parts, hardware, wood scraps, special tools, paint,
finish supplies, etc Where are you going to put it all,so that you
can get to it when you need it (or more importantly "might be able to
use it").

Also, some make the table saw the center of the wood shop, I think a
better view, is the workbench should be you center piece...you really
end up spending more time around the work bench than you do the table
saw (unless you use the table saw for a workbench)

Anyway...good luck and have fun...that's what its about.

Al

On Sat, 1 May 2010 09:39:32 -0700 (PDT), "fallen.morgan (at) gmail.com"
wrote:

On Apr 29, 9:58*pm, "Ivan Vegvary" wrote:
I have a large shop and want to subdivide a section dedicated to
woodworking.

The shop already has separately framed area that is 24ft. x 11ft. *I have a
chance to extend this 11 foot width for an additional 12 feet. *Total would
be 36 feet by 11 feet.

Question!!

Is 11 feet width adequate. *If needed the addition could be broadened to 13
feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of width
being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? *Can you do a decent layout within
11 feet?

All comments greatly appreciated. *Would like to start framing within a
week.

The bonus in all of this is that whatever I add on creates extra 'mezzanine'
storage on top. *Also a great place for the shop cat.

Ivan Vegvary

Definately depends on what you do. If your'e like most you do a mix
of residential construction and furniture size and down wood working.
So a 4 x8 is something you might use as an aid to your layout. Don't
forget that many construction goods come in large sizes now than 4
x8...sheet rock I've heard of 8 x 15, base board moodings..12
ft..etc.

If your happy with your current tool set, then you can use that to
figure out the layout you need. If not, get one of those "How to set
up your Shop" books...they have many points to consider before
building your workshop(or adding to it)...things like electrical and
HVAC...plus workflow considerations that some others have touched
upoun already. I went from a 10 x 12 garage to a 24 x 32 steel
building workshop and I wish I had more after 3 years (but of course I
added a unisaw and scms too)...so think about expansion.

One of things I didn't do well is storage...you tend to accumulate a
lot of jigs, parts, hardware, wood scraps, special tools, paint,
finish supplies, etc Where are you going to put it all,so that you
can get to it when you need it (or more importantly "might be able to
use it").

Yes, storage is always a problem. I need more storage for my tools. :-(
Working on that, but without a proper shop, yet, it's tough going.

Also, some make the table saw the center of the wood shop, I think a
better view, is the workbench should be you center piece...you really
end up spending more time around the work bench than you do the table
saw (unless you use the table saw for a workbench)

THe table saw is normally the "center of the wood shop" because it has the
largest "foot print". It really needs at least 8' front and back and even
right of the blade. Work benches are usually put against a wall, out of the
way. Wood is smaller by the time it gets there. ;-)

Anyway...good luck and have fun...that's what its about.

Al

I'm dealing with space issues too. No matter what
I end up with, I think my idea of putting a miter saw
and drill press on the same stand is going to save me
some space. I'm buying a portable table saw with
wheels and making a picnic table with wheels into
a shop table and putting peg board everywhere. I
put one piece on the back of an existing bookshelf
that was in the middle of the garage, so now it partitions
off part for woodshop and the rest for somehing else.
I like the idea of making all surfaces at the same height
so that my table can serve as a surface for receiving
large plywood cuts from table saw.

The main thing though is that I'm not afraid of making
mistakes. That's how I learn. Sounds very basic but for
me it wasn't that easy to realize ... easy to say.



"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
...
I have a large shop and want to subdivide a section dedicated to
woodworking.

The shop already has separately framed area that is 24ft. x 11ft. I have
a chance to extend this 11 foot width for an additional 12 feet. Total
would be 36 feet by 11 feet.

Question!!

Is 11 feet width adequate. If needed the addition could be broadened to
13 feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of width
being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? Can you do a decent layout
within 11 feet?

All comments greatly appreciated. Would like to start framing within a
week.

The bonus in all of this is that whatever I add on creates extra
'mezzanine' storage on top. Also a great place for the shop cat.

Ivan Vegvary

clamps ...
Do the flat bottom clamps really make it easier to
join right angle pieces? I'm thinking picture frames
and storage racke, bookcases ...

I've seen Bessey clamps on Woodsmith Shop, TV
show and it looks like you don't even need a square
because if the bottom of the clamp is squre then the
sides are also. Is that right? If so, why use anything
else?

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in message
...
I have a large shop and want to subdivide a section dedicated to
woodworking.

The shop already has separately framed area that is 24ft. x 11ft. I have
a chance to extend this 11 foot width for an additional 12 feet. Total
would be 36 feet by 11 feet.

Question!!

Is 11 feet width adequate. If needed the addition could be broadened to
13 feet wide by 12 feet long.
To recap, final size could be 36 feet long, with the last 12 feet of width
being 13 feet wide instead of 11 feet wide.

Is the extra two feet worth it or needed? Can you do a decent layout
within 11 feet?

All comments greatly appreciated. Would like to start framing within a
week.

The bonus in all of this is that whatever I add on creates extra
'mezzanine' storage on top. Also a great place for the shop cat.

Ivan Vegvary
THANK YOU, THAN YOU everybody !!!!
I will go with the extra width. In fact, I am thinking of possibly making
it 2.5 to 3 feet wider. This will allow me to build an exterior staircase,
2.5 to 3 feet wide, in order to easily get on top for storage. Currently
I'm hauling a ladder around.
A staircase (again, it's outside of the new addition) would slightly cramp
the 'walk-around' area for my car hoist. I'm considering a hinged staircase
that I can raise out of the way with a rope or chain.
Have any of you done this? Any ideas on how to keep it light weight?
Simply use a pulley system to reduce effort? Would probably only go up on
top maybe once or twice a month.

"Ivan Vegvary" wrote in
:

THANK YOU, THAN YOU everybody !!!!
I will go with the extra width. In fact, I am thinking of possibly
making it 2.5 to 3 feet wider. This will allow me to build an
exterior staircase, 2.5 to 3 feet wide, in order to easily get on top
for storage. Currently I'm hauling a ladder around.
A staircase (again, it's outside of the new addition) would slightly
cramp the 'walk-around' area for my car hoist. I'm considering a
hinged staircase that I can raise out of the way with a rope or chain.
Have any of you done this? Any ideas on how to keep it light weight?
Simply use a pulley system to reduce effort? Would probably only go
up on top maybe once or twice a month.



My grandpa has a hinged ladder for attic access in his garage. To drop
it down, a rope with a couple of pulleys attaches to the moving side of
the ladder. The pulleys simply change direction, I doubt there's much
mechanical advantage in that system. (It's simply not needed.)

You may want to consider a set of standard attic stairs that go inside
your shop. They only take up space in the attic, and when down only need
a minimal amount of space. They should be available at just about any
hardware store.

Puckdropper
--
Never teach your apprentice everything you know.