I just bought a Walker Turner saw. It's wired for 220. I need 120 to
get it to work in my shed. Anyone know how this is done?

sibosop wrote:
I just bought a Walker Turner saw. It's wired for 220. I need 120 to
get it to work in my shed. Anyone know how this is done?


What's the horsepower rating of the motor?

If it's over 1.5 HP the motor may not be able to be changed.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA

Nova wrote:
sibosop wrote:
I just bought a Walker Turner saw. It's wired for 220. I need 120 to
get it to work in my shed. Anyone know how this is done?


What's the horsepower rating of the motor?

If it's over 1.5 HP the motor may not be able to be changed.

And if it's a dual-voltage motor the nameplate will say so explicitly
and have a wiring diagram for the internal connections.

Far better to run a 220V circuit for the saw instead.

--

On Nov 8, 7:02*pm, sibosop wrote:
I just bought a Walker Turner saw. It's wired for 220. I need 120 to
get it to work in my shed. Anyone know how this is done?

I still have the paperwork from a really old WT table saw.
Not sure if it will help, but here's the diagram.
http://tinypic.com/r/xpv7ev/4

R

The motor itself might be dual winding.

If you don't know - call an electrician - or take it to a motor repair place.
They know motors.

Likely the label on the end or top indicates multi-voltage.

Martin

Nova wrote:
sibosop wrote:
I just bought a Walker Turner saw. It's wired for 220. I need 120 to
get it to work in my shed. Anyone know how this is done?


What's the horsepower rating of the motor?

If it's over 1.5 HP the motor may not be able to be changed.

On Nov 8, 6:41*pm, "Martin H. Eastburn"
wrote:
The motor itself might be dual winding.

If you don't know - call an electrician - or take it to a motor repair place.
They know motors.

Likely the label on the end or top indicates multi-voltage.

Martin

Nova wrote:
sibosop wrote:
I just bought a Walker Turner saw. It's wired for 220. I need 120 to
get it to work in my shed. Anyone know how this is done?

What's the horsepower rating of the motor?

If it's over 1.5 HP the motor may not be able to be changed.

I just found the manual online (model 2221). On the parts lists it
lists:
110 power cord assembly
220 power cord assembly

Also, thanks for all the suggestions.
I'm hoping to avoid having to rewire my shed, but I guess I will do so
if necessary.

I love the internet.
b

sibosop wrote:
On Nov 8, 6:41 pm, "Martin H. Eastburn"
wrote:
The motor itself might be dual winding.

If you don't know - call an electrician - or take it to a motor repair place.
They know motors.

Likely the label on the end or top indicates multi-voltage.

Martin

Nova wrote:
sibosop wrote:
I just bought a Walker Turner saw. It's wired for 220. I need 120 to
get it to work in my shed. Anyone know how this is done?
What's the horsepower rating of the motor?
If it's over 1.5 HP the motor may not be able to be changed.

I just found the manual online (model 2221). On the parts lists it
lists:
110 power cord assembly
220 power cord assembly

Also, thanks for all the suggestions.
I'm hoping to avoid having to rewire my shed, but I guess I will do so
if necessary.
....

What's the nameplate FLA rating? Is your 110 circuit up to the task
anyway? You may need to go from 20A to 30A to avoid tripping breaker
every time run anything of real size thru it anyway.

Had that problem w/ first saw I ever had--a B&D 10" RAS that was 110V
only--was in a rental location at that time and was real pita owing to
that happening a lot since landlord didn't want any modifications.

Another thing to think about is voltage drop. All in all, it may just
be more satisfactory w/ the 220 but if the motor is, in fact, dual
voltage it should have all the right poop on the nameplate and under the
connections cover. If so, can't hurt to try and see how it goes, of
course, then go back and run the other circuit if it doesn't suit.

--

On Nov 9, 8:58*am, dpb wrote:
sibosop wrote:
On Nov 8, 6:41 pm, "Martin H. Eastburn"
wrote:
The motor itself might be dual winding.

If you don't know - call an electrician - or take it to a motor repair place.
They know motors.

Likely the label on the end or top indicates multi-voltage.

Martin

Nova wrote:
sibosop wrote:
I just bought a Walker Turner saw. It's wired for 220. I need 120 to
get it to work in my shed. Anyone know how this is done?
What's the horsepower rating of the motor?
If it's over 1.5 HP the motor may not be able to be changed.

I just found the manual online (model 2221). On the parts lists it
lists:
110 power cord assembly
220 power cord assembly

Also, thanks for all the suggestions.
I'm hoping to avoid having to rewire my shed, but I guess I will do so
if necessary.

...

What's the nameplate FLA rating? *Is your 110 circuit up to the task
anyway? *You may need to go from 20A to 30A to avoid tripping breaker
every time run anything of real size thru it anyway.

Had that problem w/ first saw I ever had--a B&D 10" RAS that was 110V
only--was in a rental location at that time and was real pita owing to
that happening a lot since landlord didn't want any modifications.

Another thing to think about is voltage drop. *All in all, it may just
be more satisfactory w/ the 220 but if the motor is, in fact, dual
voltage it should have all the right poop on the nameplate and under the
connections cover. *If so, can't hurt to try and see how it goes, of
course, then go back and run the other circuit if it doesn't suit.

--

I'm getting the picture here.
It's a 2.5 horsepower motor. I'll probably blow the 110 circuit.


I've found out that I have two unused 220V circuits in my house (I now
use gas).
Looks like I got some crawl space time to rewire the shed.

thanks for all the good answers.
b

sibosop wrote:
....
I'm getting the picture here.
It's a 2.5 horsepower motor. I'll probably blow the 110 circuit.

Oh my, yes...

At the roughly 750 W/hp, that would equate to ...let's see,
1500+375=1875 and back that off a little so say 1850W. At 110V that's
10% less than 18.5 or say 17A if it were 100% efficient. Given this is
an old Walker-Turner, it's of 50's vintage or earlier so you'll be lucky
if the combination of efficiency and power factor are 0.5 so a
reasonable guess of FLA would be something otoo 30-35A. That'll
undoubtedly be iffy at best on a 20A circuit.

Here's a pretty good explanation of motor nameplate data meanings that
might be of interest/use...

http://www.bacharach-training.com/norm/electric.htm

I've found out that I have two unused 220V circuits in my house (I now
use gas).
Looks like I got some crawl space time to rewire the shed.
....
I'd venture you'll be glad you did when done...

--

On Nov 9, 9:50*am, dpb wrote:
sibosop wrote:

...

I'm getting the picture here.
It's a 2.5 horsepower motor. I'll probably blow the 110 circuit.

Oh my, yes...

At the roughly 750 W/hp, that would equate to ...let's see,
1500+375=1875 and back that off a little so say 1850W. *At 110V that's
10% less than 18.5 or say 17A if it were 100% efficient. *Given this is
an old Walker-Turner, it's of 50's vintage or earlier so you'll be lucky
if the combination of efficiency and power factor are 0.5 so a
reasonable guess of FLA would be something otoo 30-35A. *That'll
undoubtedly be iffy at best on a 20A circuit.

Here's a pretty good explanation of motor nameplate data meanings that
might be of interest/use...

http://www.bacharach-training.com/norm/electric.htm

I've found out that I have two unused 220V circuits in my house (I now
use gas).
Looks like I got some crawl space time to rewire the shed.

...
I'd venture you'll be glad you did when done...

--

Thanks for that info. I was searching around for it. I'm out of my
denial phase...

b

sibosop wrote:
....
Thanks for that info. I was searching around for it. I'm out of my
denial phase...



How far a run you have to make? I'd suggest going w/ 10ga minimum even
thought 12 for 20A on 220V will be plenty; the extra size will cut the
voltage drop significantly if it's any distance to run at all.

And, the side benefit is that you'll have enough capacity down the road
if add dust collection to run 'em both simultaneously as just one
example of the extra load possible not thinking of at the moment.

--

On Nov 9, 1:17*pm, dpb wrote:
sibosop wrote:

...

Thanks for that info. I was searching around for it. I'm out of my
denial phase...



How far a run you have to make? *I'd suggest going w/ 10ga minimum even
thought 12 for 20A on 220V will be plenty; the extra size will cut the
voltage drop significantly if it's any distance to run at all.

And, the side benefit is that you'll have enough capacity down the road
if add dust collection to run 'em both simultaneously as just one
example of the extra load possible not thinking of at the moment.

The issue I see here is that 10Ga will allow a 30A service, but the
outlet must also then be 30A. I'm not sure it's cricket to add
multiple outlets on a 240 service, in any case, and it absolutely
isn't allowed to have outlets with lesser ampacity than the breaker.
This sort of thing is normal (special case) on a 120V service (15A
outlets are allowed on 20A service) but it isn't on a 240V circuit.
The way to do this sort of thing right is to put a sub-panel in the
shop and wire that with 10-3, or better, 8-3. Then break that out
into the individual circuits.

wrote:
....
The issue I see here is that 10Ga will allow a 30A service, but the
outlet must also then be 30A.

Of course, where would you have gotten any other idea???

... I'm not sure it's cricket to add
multiple outlets on a 240 service, in any case, ...

What in the world gives you that idea? You think every shop has a
dedicated single-outlet circuit for every machine in the shop??? Not
hardly...

....[snip rant]...

The way to do this sort of thing right is to put a sub-panel in the
shop and wire that with 10-3, or better, 8-3. Then break that out
into the individual circuits.

There are multiple ways, many of which are as "right" as any other as
far as Code and safety are concerned.

_IF_ (the proverbial "big if") OP's going to a full shop in this-here
"shed", sure. If, OTOH, the shed is simply (as I inferred altho freely
admit it's not stated) a small backyard shed it would be _way_ overkill
for a simple 240V circuit to power a tool or two to go the whole service
panel route.

Handy, perhaps; necessary, no...

A single cutoff would be potentially useful but simple enough to unplug
the saw in a small shed when need disconnect.

--

On Nov 9, 2:49*pm, dpb wrote:
wrote:

...

The issue I see here is that 10Ga will allow a 30A service, but the
outlet must also then be 30A. *

Of course, where would you have gotten any other idea???

... I'm not sure it's cricket to add
multiple outlets on a 240 service, in any case, ...

What in the world gives you that idea? *You think every shop has a
dedicated single-outlet circuit for every machine in the shop??? *Not
hardly...

...[snip rant]...

No rant at all. ...but at least every outlet on the chain *must* be
rated for the full current. This *is* an exception for 120V circuits
that is not there for 220V. That means each tool will have to have a
30A plug - messy.

The way to do this sort of thing right is to put a sub-panel in the
shop and wire that with 10-3, or better, 8-3. *Then break that out
into the individual circuits.

There are multiple ways, many of which are as "right" as any other as
far as Code and safety are concerned.

_IF_ (the proverbial "big if") OP's going to a full shop in this-here
"shed", sure. *If, OTOH, the shed is simply (as I inferred altho freely
admit it's not stated) a small backyard shed it would be _way_ overkill
for a simple 240V circuit to power a tool or two to go the whole service
panel route.

Handy, perhaps; necessary, no...

Quite handy. ...and cheap. Possibly cheaper than 30A receptacles and
plugs on each tool. As an added advantage, one can pull 120V off the
circuit (if wired with 3-conductor).

A single cutoff would be potentially useful but simple enough to unplug
the saw in a small shed when need disconnect.

wrote:
....
...That means each tool will have to have a 30A plug - messy.

How so? Each has to have a plug anyway, and we're talking stationary
equipment, not hand tools so they're not going to be being carried
around hither and yon, anyway.

....

Quite handy. ...and cheap. Possibly cheaper than 30A receptacles and
plugs on each tool. As an added advantage, one can pull 120V off the
circuit (if wired with 3-conductor).

I don't see how you would get that -- we're talking _one_ 30A plug and
socket initially for the tablesaw and a perhaps another sometime down
the road (maybe; OP hasn't anything else at all that's 240V now, anyway
or he'd already have had the power for the saw).

And he already has a 110 circuit installed.

But, yes, it is an option to switch the 110 to a circuit out of the
panel if he were to choose to do it that way.

--

On Nov 8, 7:02*pm, sibosop wrote:
I just bought a Walker Turner saw. It's wired for 220. I need 120 to
get it to work in my shed. Anyone know how this is done?

As one replid "Far better to run a 220V circuit for the saw instead. "

The motor should have a diagram on the ID Plate if it is a dual-
voltage motor.

If you can, run some 6 or 8AWG into your shop off a 220 breaker -
you'll find other uses for the 220VAC - terminate in a small breaker
box and you can get a couple 110 circuits out of the deal.

On Nov 9, 1:54*pm, dpb wrote:
wrote:

...

...That means each tool will have to have a 30A plug - messy.

How so? *Each has to have a plug anyway, and we're talking stationary
equipment, not hand tools so they're not going to be being carried
around hither and yon, anyway.

...

Quite handy. *...and cheap. *Possibly cheaper than 30A receptacles and
plugs on each tool. *As an added advantage, one can pull 120V off the
circuit (if wired with 3-conductor).

I don't see how you would get that -- we're talking _one_ 30A plug and
socket initially for the tablesaw and a perhaps another sometime down
the road (maybe; OP hasn't anything else at all that's 240V now, anyway
or he'd already have had the power for the saw).

And he already has a 110 circuit installed.

But, yes, it is an option to switch the 110 to a circuit out of the
panel if he were to choose to do it that way.

--

Oh man. Maybe that beautiful saw would make a nice doorstop...
I've currently got 12 gauge wire going out there (it's about 100
feet).
I'm going to have to pull the conduit to run the extra wire through
there.
I was thinking 12 gauge 3 conductor 220v out to the shed with a
small breakout panel in the shed for the 110 circuit with 20 amp
fuses.
I have two 220V circuits on my house box. 20 amp (for drier i guess)
and 30 amp (for stove I guess). I haven't looked under there yet.
I'm hoping that it's wired 3 conductor and not 2. The house was
rewired in the early
70s...

Or maybe I should be smart and find an electrician.
b

Oh man. Maybe that beautiful saw would make a nice doorstop...
I've currently got 12 gauge wire going out there (it's about 100
feet).
I'm going to have to pull the conduit to run the extra wire through
there.

Can't you use the existing wire that is in the conduit, to pull the new
wire through? (replace it)


I was thinking 12 gauge 3 conductor 220v out to the shed with a
small breakout panel in the shed for the 110 circuit with 20 amp
fuses.

I think another guy mentioned 6-8 gauge wire, I agree.
You should treat it like installing a subpanel.

You could come off the main breaker panel with big-ass wire to a
shut-off box.
Take more big-ass wire through the conduit to the shed, and install a
small breaker box with a couple 220 breakers and a couple 110's.


I have two 220V circuits on my house box. 20 amp (for drier i guess)
and 30 amp (for stove I guess). I haven't looked under there yet.
I'm hoping that it's wired 3 conductor and not 2. The house was
rewired in the early
70s...

Or maybe I should be smart and find an electrician.
b

That's always a smart option. :-)


--

-MIKE-

"Playing is not something I do at night, it's my function in life"
--Elvin Jones (1927-2004)
--
http://mikedrums.com

---remove "DOT" ^^^^ to reply

sibosop wrote:
....
Oh man. Maybe that beautiful saw would make a nice doorstop...
I've currently got 12 gauge wire going out there (it's about 100
feet).
I'm going to have to pull the conduit to run the extra wire through
there.
I was thinking 12 gauge 3 conductor 220v out to the shed with a
small breakout panel in the shed for the 110 circuit with 20 amp
fuses.

You could get by that way; but it really would be wiser to pull larger;
at least 10. You can still fuse it for 20A; will just have less voltage
drop as well as some added flexibility for later unanticipated needs.
The supply could be 30A, too, then if do put a fused panel in the shed,
20A there as well. If simply use an unfused distribution box in the
shed, then would need it fused for whatever is smallest on the circuit
which I'm assuming from what you've said is #12 and the 20A is ok.
Could then go to a fused panel out there at a later time if needed.
Having the #10 or greater for the supply already would leave more
flexibility w/ less additional effort at that time, obviously.

Is it conduit the whole way and if so, what size conduit and bends? As
someone else noted, it's usually easiest to use the existing to pull a
tape thru to pull the new.

For simplicity I was thinking simply pull another set of three and leave
the two circuits; you're way would actually be better.

I have two 220V circuits on my house box. 20 amp (for drier i guess)
and 30 amp (for stove I guess). I haven't looked under there yet.
I'm hoping that it's wired 3 conductor and not 2. The house was
rewired in the early 70s...

It's bound to be 3-conductor, then.

Or maybe I should be smart and find an electrician.

It shouldn't be too bad unless there's a real issue on the pull.
Remember to use a wet-location-rated conductor in the conduit.

But, if your box has an opening, perhaps he could run a whole new branch
and not disturb the existing utilities outlets that might be worthwhile
eventually at not much additional effort/cost. So many possibilities,
so many choices and ways to make a five-minute task into a 3-month
project...

--

sibosop wrote:



Oh man. Maybe that beautiful saw would make a nice doorstop...
I've currently got 12 gauge wire going out there (it's about 100
feet).
I'm going to have to pull the conduit to run the extra wire through
there.
I was thinking 12 gauge 3 conductor 220v out to the shed with a
small breakout panel in the shed for the 110 circuit with 20 amp
fuses.
I have two 220V circuits on my house box. 20 amp (for drier i guess)
and 30 amp (for stove I guess). I haven't looked under there yet.
I'm hoping that it's wired 3 conductor and not 2. The house was
rewired in the early
70s...

Or maybe I should be smart and find an electrician.
b



Calling an electrician might be a good idea. It sounds as if you are
planning to leave the existing 110V service in place and run the 220V
service through the existing 110V conduit. To meet code there are
"conduit fill" requirements that have to be met and the existing conduit
may not be large enough.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA

On Nov 10, 9:44*am, Nova wrote:
sibosop wrote:

Oh man. Maybe that beautiful saw would make a nice doorstop...
I've currently got 12 gauge wire going out there (it's about 100
feet).
I'm going to have to pull the conduit to run the extra wire through
there.
I was thinking 12 gauge 3 conductor 220v out to the shed with a
small breakout panel in the shed for the 110 circuit with 20 amp
fuses.
I have two 220V circuits on my house box. 20 amp (for drier i guess)
and 30 amp (for stove I guess). I haven't looked under there yet.
I'm hoping that it's wired 3 conductor and not 2. The house was
rewired in the early
70s...

Or maybe I should be smart and find an electrician.
b

Calling an electrician might be a good idea. *It sounds as if you are
planning to leave the existing 110V service in place and run the 220V
service through the existing 110V conduit. *To meet code there are
"conduit fill" requirements that have to be met and the existing conduit
may not be large enough.

--
Jack Novak
Buffalo, NY - USA


Thanks everyone, for all the great info.
I've decided to go to an electrician. I got the name of
one with 'glowing' references.
Fooling around with 220 has pushed me beyond my
comfort level. My 'current' system is not really
upgradable.
The saw will make a nice dead flat surface till I can
get it fired up again.
Maybe that old delta benchtop isn't so bad..

b
b

b

Nova wrote:
....
Calling an electrician might be a good idea. It sounds as if you are
planning to leave the existing 110V service in place and run the 220V
service through the existing 110V conduit. To meet code there are
"conduit fill" requirements that have to be met and the existing conduit
may not be large enough.

6 #10 (or 10 #12) "T" conductors are (max) ok for 1/2" conduit per
Table. That's individual conductors not sheathed cable, of course.

--

On Tue, 10 Nov 2009 10:21:15 -0800 (PST), sibosop
wrote:

Thanks everyone, for all the great info.
I've decided to go to an electrician. I got the name of
one with 'glowing' references.

Good Luck. Let us know how it turns our. Just hope that his rates
aren't "glowing" too.

On Nov 10, 7:48*pm, Larry Jaques
wrote:
On Tue, 10 Nov 2009 10:21:15 -0800 (PST), the infamous sibosop
scrawled the following:

Thanks everyone, for all the great info.
I've decided to go to an electrician. I got the name of
one with 'glowing' references.

Ooh, ooh, a Sparky joke!

Fooling around with 220 has pushed me beyond my
comfort level. My 'current' system is not really
upgradable.

I, for one, would much rather work with 240v. It'll kick you off it
sooner than 120v will. The tingle is more of a sizzle, so that's
nicer, too. *It'll wake your sleepy arse up in a hurry. *g

240V, at least in the US, is simply two 120V lines from the opposite
sides of the transformer. It would be difficult to get across the
240V accidentally.

snip