Authorities find that grandparents, 46 and 59, are "too old" to care
for their grandson, and handed the young boy a couple of male
homosexuals instead. Details below.


http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/arti...adoption.html#

'They say we're too old to care for our grandchildren': Social workers
hand brother and sister to gay men for adoption

By Graham Grant and Marcello Mega
Last updated at 4:14 PM on 28th January 2009

* Comments (488)
* Add to My Stories

Embrace for comfort: The grandparents yesterday were distraught

Embrace for comfort: The grandparents yesterday were distraught

Two young children are to be adopted by a gay couple, despite the
protests of their grandparents.

The devastated grandparents were told they would never see the
youngsters again unless they dropped their opposition.

The couple, who cannot be named, wanted to give the five-year-old boy
and his four-year-old sister a loving home themselves. But they were
ruled to be too old - at 46 and 59.

For two years they fought for their rights to care for the children,
whose 26-year- old mother is a recovering heroin addict.

They agreed to an adoption only after they faced being financially
crippled by legal bills.

The final blow came when they were told the children were going to a
gay household, even though several heterosexual couples wanted them.

When the grandfather protested, he was told: 'You can either accept
it, and there's a chance you'll see the children twice a year, or you
can take that stance and never see them again.'

The man said last night: 'It breaks my heart to think that our
grandchildren are being forced to grow up in an environment without a
mother figure. We are not prejudiced, but I defy anyone to explain to
us how this can be in their best interests.'

Social workers themselves have admitted that the little girl is 'more
wary' of men than women.


More...

* MELANIE PHILLIPS: To place children with two gay men when an
adoptive mother and father are available, just to uphold a brutal
dogma, is a sickening assault on family life

The case, in Edinburgh, raises worrying issues about state
interference in family life.

It will also fuel concern over the practice of gay adoption, which has
been promoted by Left-wing ministers and council bosses.

Some local authorities forbid adoption by smokers and obese people but
actively support gay fostering and adoption - even though research
shows overwhelmingly that children are best brought up by a mother and
father.

The grandparents first stepped in because the children's mother was
unable to look after them.

But council social workers became worried that the grandparents' ages
and health problems meant they would also be unable to care for the
children properly.

The 59-year-old grandfather, a farm worker, has angina while his wife
is receiving medication for diabetes.

The children were taken into foster care during the two years of court
hearings.

When the grandparents eventually conceded defeat, they were assured by
social workers that they would still have regular contact with them.

The fostering arrangement worked well, but the council decided that
the children should be adopted, to give them a permanent home.

The grandparents agreed - as long as they could be assured that the
adoptive parents would be a loving mother and father.

The couple were then told an adoption had been arranged - but the
grandfather 'hit the roof' when he discovered that the adoptive
parents were two gay men.

Social workers dealing with the case admitted that heterosexual
couples who were approved as adoptive parents had also been keen to
adopt the children.

The decision was taken even though a confidential social work report -
now part of the court records held by the grandparents - contained
that the little girl is generally not as happy around men.

The report says she 'has tended to be more wary of males in general.'

Her grandparents insist they are not homophobic.

But they reject the view of social workers that the decision to allow
the gay couple to adopt the children was made 'in accordance with who
can best meet their needs.'

When they made their opposition clear, however, the couple were told
that social workers would 'certainly look' at allowing them access to
the children 'when you are able to come back with an open mind on the
issues'.

The grandfather was told by a social worker: 'If you couldn't support
the children [in the gay adoption], if you were having contact and
couldn't support the children, and were showing negative feelings, it
wouldn't be in their best interests for contact to take place.'

He said last night: 'The ideal for any child is to have a loving
father and a loving mother in their lives.

'But in our society the mother is generally the cornerstone of the
family and the most important person for a young child.'

His wife added: 'It's so important for children to fit in, and I feel
our grandchildren will be marked out from the start when they draw
pictures of their two dads.'

The last time the couple saw their grandchildren was shortly after the
agreement for them to be adopted but before the decision to place them
with a gay couple.

They took dozens of photographs and tried, for the sake of the
youngsters, not to break down.

'Granny, I'm not going to see you for a very long time,' said the
five-year-old boy. 'Maybe when I'm in Primary Seven I'll be able to
see you.'

'We'll try our very hardest to see you soon,' said his grandmother,
choking back tears.

The boy told his grandfather: 'Grandad, if you want to see me you will
have to pick me up because I will be a very long way away.'

Then he added innocently: 'We are getting a new mummy and daddy.'

A spokesman for the Roman Catholic church condemned the council's
decision last night, warning that the children's welfare could be
jeopardised.

Peter Kearney said: 'This is a devastating decision which will have a
serious impact on the welfare of the children involved.

'There is an overwhelming body of evidence showing that same-sex
relationships are inherently unstable and reduce the life expectancy
of those involved.

'With this in mind, the social work department has deliberately
ignored evidence which undermines their decision and opted for
politically correct posturing rather than providing stability and
protection.

'It is impossible to see how this decision is in the best interests of
the children.'

The City of Edinburgh Council said last night that it could not
comment on individual cases.

Adoption by gay couples in Scotland was approved by MSPs in 2006 -
despite an official consultation process which showed that nearly 90
per cent of people opposed it.


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Comments (488)

Here's what readers have had to say so far. Why not add your thoughts
below?


Absolutely outrageous Scotland!! get it sorted.......NOW!!!!! It's
sooooo simple, the babies belong with their family, END OF!!!!!!
Click to rate Rating 1429

- ellie j, birmingham, 28/1/2009 10:48


I urge citizens of UK take to the streets on this matter. People power
works wonders. It's a noted fact, and I know from friends who work in
Social Services that firstly, they always act in the best interests of
the child, and secondly, they make every effort always to place a
child with extended family members and not foster out to
strangers. The grandparents are not too old to care for the children,
given the fact statistics tell us women nowadays are deferring having
children 'til much later in life. Would someone please help the
grandparents to fight this injustice and win. The poor children
deserve their granparents, not strangers.
--
Due to extreme spam originating from Google Groups, and their inattention
to spammers, I and many others block all articles originating
from Google Groups. If you want your postings to be seen by
more readers you will need to find a different means of
posting on Usenet.
http://improve-usenet.org/

I'd like to be adopted by 2 lesbians myself. Come on 1 of the 2 gay guys
would make a good mother figure I'm sure.
I'm not sure what is worse being gay or being over 40 years old.

I'm more worried about the economy.

"Ignoramus2885" wrote in message
...
Authorities find that grandparents, 46 and 59, are "too old" to care
for their grandson, and handed the young boy a couple of male
homosexuals instead. Details below.

Snip

Iggy, you are "this close" to joining the rest of the kooks in the round file.

"cavelamb" wrote in message
m...
Iggy, you are "this close" to joining the rest of the kooks in the round
file.


LOL

JC

On Wed, 28 Jan 2009 13:29:25 -0600, Ignoramus2885
wrote:

Authorities find that grandparents, 46 and 59, are "too old" to care
for their grandson, and handed the young boy a couple of male
homosexuals instead. Details below.

IMO, it's unusual, but I don't have a problem with it, personally..
There seems to be a general assumption that being gay means that you're a child
molester... I don't think gender preference has anything to do with predators..


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

"mac davis" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 28 Jan 2009 13:29:25 -0600, Ignoramus2885
wrote:

Authorities find that grandparents, 46 and 59, are "too old" to care
for their grandson, and handed the young boy a couple of male
homosexuals instead. Details below.

IMO, it's unusual, but I don't have a problem with it, personally..
There seems to be a general assumption that being gay means that you're a
child
molester... I don't think gender preference has anything to do with
predators..


mac

The problem is the taking away from grandparents. If this is a true story,
it is really sad and the "too old" does not cut it. Courts should not even
be involved in a family matter.

On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 11:19:25 -0500, "Edwin Pawlowski" wrote:


"mac davis" wrote in message
.. .
On Wed, 28 Jan 2009 13:29:25 -0600, Ignoramus2885
wrote:

Authorities find that grandparents, 46 and 59, are "too old" to care
for their grandson, and handed the young boy a couple of male
homosexuals instead. Details below.

IMO, it's unusual, but I don't have a problem with it, personally..
There seems to be a general assumption that being gay means that you're a
child
molester... I don't think gender preference has anything to do with
predators..


mac

The problem is the taking away from grandparents. If this is a true story,
it is really sad and the "too old" does not cut it. Courts should not even
be involved in a family matter.

I agree, on the info provided... Hell, I have friends that had kids in their
late 40's and did fine..
the g-parents... Are they healthy, "normal" folks and able to raise the kid?
I'm thinking that more than just age had to be in the mix.. and how did the
g-parents end up with the boy?
Are the parents alive? In prison or something?


mac

Please remove splinters before emailing

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"mac davis" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 28 Jan 2009 13:29:25 -0600, Ignoramus2885
wrote:

Authorities find that grandparents, 46 and 59, are "too old" to
care
for their grandson, and handed the young boy a couple of male
homosexuals instead. Details below.

IMO, it's unusual, but I don't have a problem with it, personally..
There seems to be a general assumption that being gay means that
you're a child
molester... I don't think gender preference has anything to do with
predators..


mac

The problem is the taking away from grandparents. If this is a true
story, it is really sad and the "too old" does not cut it. Courts
should not even be involved in a family matter.

It was published in the Daily Mail, which is a rather large
newspaper--how accurate they are is another story.

Note also that it was in Scotland.

"Social worker" is becoming a synonym for "commissar" in many parts of
the world. Another bunch like the lawyers and politicians for which
there should be an open season with no bag limit.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

mac davis wrote:
On Fri, 30 Jan 2009 11:19:25 -0500, "Edwin Pawlowski"
wrote:


"mac davis" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 28 Jan 2009 13:29:25 -0600, Ignoramus2885
wrote:

Authorities find that grandparents, 46 and 59, are "too old" to
care for their grandson, and handed the young boy a couple of
male
homosexuals instead. Details below.

IMO, it's unusual, but I don't have a problem with it,
personally..
There seems to be a general assumption that being gay means that
you're a child
molester... I don't think gender preference has anything to do
with
predators..


mac

The problem is the taking away from grandparents. If this is a
true
story, it is really sad and the "too old" does not cut it. Courts
should not even be involved in a family matter.

I agree, on the info provided... Hell, I have friends that had kids
in their late 40's and did fine..
the g-parents... Are they healthy, "normal" folks and able to
raise the kid? I'm thinking that more than just age had to be in the
mix.. and how did the g-parents end up with the boy?
Are the parents alive? In prison or something?

According to the newspaper article the mother's a drug addict. The
grandfather has angina, the grandmother is diabetic. The big issue
for me is that the kid for some reason is uncomfortable around men, so
they give her to two men and she has no safe haven. While I can
visualize a Politically Correct objective of socializing the kid or
kill her trying, I can't really see how this was the right decision.

Survival 101--NEVER do anything to get yourself above the Youth
Services radar. The IRS is warm and cuddly by comparison.


--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
...


The problem is the taking away from grandparents. If this is a true
story, it is really sad and the "too old" does not cut it. Courts should
not even be involved in a family matter.

Hmmm... like when the parents are neglectful (like drug addicts or drunks),
or abusive (physical, psychological, or sexual). Or when there is an
abusive spouse, or relative... or spousal abuse, or when the parents or
next of kin are physically unable to care for the child(ren).

In a world where these things don't exist, or in a world where other parts
of society would take up the slack, maybe we wouldn't need the courts to
intervene. Please get back to me when we get to that world.

Ed

Ed Edelenbos wrote:
"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
...


The problem is the taking away from grandparents. If this is a
true
story, it is really sad and the "too old" does not cut it. Courts
should not even be involved in a family matter.

Hmmm... like when the parents are neglectful (like drug addicts or
drunks), or abusive (physical, psychological, or sexual). Or when
there is an abusive spouse, or relative... or spousal abuse, or
when
the parents or next of kin are physically unable to care for the
child(ren).

In a world where these things don't exist, or in a world where other
parts of society would take up the slack, maybe we wouldn't need the
courts to intervene. Please get back to me when we get to that
world.

When social workers come calling and keep notes on things like "crumbs
on the table" the pendulum has swung too far.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

"J. Clarke" wrote in message
...
Ed Edelenbos wrote:
"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
...


The problem is the taking away from grandparents. If this is a
true
story, it is really sad and the "too old" does not cut it. Courts
should not even be involved in a family matter.

Hmmm... like when the parents are neglectful (like drug addicts or
drunks), or abusive (physical, psychological, or sexual). Or when
there is an abusive spouse, or relative... or spousal abuse, or
when
the parents or next of kin are physically unable to care for the
child(ren).

In a world where these things don't exist, or in a world where other
parts of society would take up the slack, maybe we wouldn't need the
courts to intervene. Please get back to me when we get to that
world.

When social workers come calling and keep notes on things like "crumbs
on the table" the pendulum has swung too far.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)


And when the police come and unchain a kid from the bed or let them out of a
closet or dog cage or when it goes so far they bring in the medical examiner
to remove the body, how far has it swung?

I don't think anyone here is close enough to this case or has enough
information to make an informed judgment. Besides, what the hell does it
have to do with woodworking? It seems to me, like it belongs in the
rec.insecure.in.my.sexuality newsgroup.

Ed

Ed Edelenbos wrote:
"J. Clarke" wrote in message
...
Ed Edelenbos wrote:
"Edwin Pawlowski" wrote in message
...


The problem is the taking away from grandparents. If this is a
true
story, it is really sad and the "too old" does not cut it.
Courts
should not even be involved in a family matter.

Hmmm... like when the parents are neglectful (like drug addicts
or
drunks), or abusive (physical, psychological, or sexual). Or when
there is an abusive spouse, or relative... or spousal abuse, or
when
the parents or next of kin are physically unable to care for the
child(ren).

In a world where these things don't exist, or in a world where
other
parts of society would take up the slack, maybe we wouldn't need
the
courts to intervene. Please get back to me when we get to that
world.

When social workers come calling and keep notes on things like
"crumbs on the table" the pendulum has swung too far.

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)


And when the police come and unchain a kid from the bed or let them
out of a closet or dog cage or when it goes so far they bring in the
medical examiner to remove the body, how far has it swung?

Was this kid changed to a bed or kept in a closet or dog cage?

Your argument is essentially along the lines of "the Gulag is OK
because some of the people in it are criminals".

I don't think anyone here is close enough to this case or has enough
information to make an informed judgment. Besides, what the hell
does it have to do with woodworking? It seems to me, like it
belongs
in the rec.insecure.in.my.sexuality newsgroup.

It's in the same category as the case in NY where kids were taken from
their grandparents after their parents died because the kids were
overweight.

Ed

--
--
--John
to email, dial "usenet" and validate
(was jclarke at eye bee em dot net)

Although Older folks may have more woodworking experience, younger gay
males may have an artistic flair and atention to detail that would
allow for equally good results. Espeacially with the more delicate
projects - thinking filigre work here.

And, of course, the grandparents raised at least one crackhead and the
court might have considered that "tracks record" a significant
negative.

I would hope the grandparents would share their shop and tools when
asked so as to assure the woodworking goes as well as can be expected.

Better to spend money on a Foley Belsaw, for instance, than legal
fees. Maybe a new lathe and some primo turning tools?