My compressor use is limited to using a carry tank for filling tires
and very small brad-nailing jobs. The tank used to scare me, thinking
of the energy contained in 125 lb of compressed air. And now I see
that my tank has an "expiration date" (already passed) embossed on it.
And I'll get rid of it if it is a danger. But I was thinking--what
does happen if the tank fails? It's not like a bomb, where there is a
near-instantaneous increase in pressure that tears the tank apart. It
seems to me that what is likely to happen is rust will create a thin
spot that will eventually fail, releasing rather unspectacularly all
the air in the tank.

Is there any safety risk in using an "expired" tank?
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.

"alexy" wrote in message

Is there any safety risk in using an "expired" tank?
--

Depends on the condition of the tank. If it is solid, no internal rust, it
can last for many more years. I can't see it from here, nor do I know the
condition and past use so I'm not going to give my OK. I'd tap it with a
hammer at the very least to feel for rust spots. Proper testing is either
using ultrasonic equipment or pressure testing.

"alexy" wrote in message
...
My compressor use is limited to using a carry tank for filling tires
and very small brad-nailing jobs. The tank used to scare me, thinking
of the energy contained in 125 lb of compressed air. And now I see
that my tank has an "expiration date" (already passed) embossed on it.
And I'll get rid of it if it is a danger. But I was thinking--what
does happen if the tank fails? It's not like a bomb, where there is a
near-instantaneous increase in pressure that tears the tank apart. It
seems to me that what is likely to happen is rust will create a thin
spot that will eventually fail, releasing rather unspectacularly all
the air in the tank.

Is there any safety risk in using an "expired" tank?
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked
infrequently.


I have never heard of an expiration date on a tank. Sounds more like a
tactic to generate sales down the road. Typically a tank will eventually
rust inside and a pin hole will developed. The hole will leak and it will
get bigger.

Leon wrote:

I have never heard of an expiration date on a tank.

All three of my 12 gallon storage tanks have expiration dates stamped
near the valve. 20 lb. Propane tanks have had them even longer.

Sounds more like a tactic to generate sales down the road.

Possibly...

More likely, someone sued and stupidity ensued.

"B A R R Y" wrote in message
t...
Leon wrote:
I have never heard of an expiration date on a tank.

All three of my 12 gallon storage tanks have expiration dates stamped near
the valve. 20 lb. Propane tanks have had them even longer.

Sounds more like a tactic to generate sales down the road.

Possibly...

More likely, someone sued and stupidity ensued.


Yeah, I am not sure what the OP has. The title talks about "compressor tank
failure". Then he mentions carrying around a tank for tires and small nail
jobs. I have carried a small tank compressor to a location with no
electricity and used it to nail a few pieces of trim. IIRC I have seen
dates on the stand alone tanks.

Leon wrote:

I have never heard of an expiration date on a tank. Sounds more like a
tactic to generate sales down the road. Typically a tank will
eventually rust inside and a pin hole will developed. The hole will
leak and it will get bigger.

If you are involved with SCUBA or hp gasses you would have heard of
them. They show when the tank needs to be inspected (anually) and
pressure tested (around every 5 years) if it is a steel tank the falure
mode is usually not explosive.

Both ally and steel tanks have been known to last well over 30 years.
However as the usual working pressure is around 200 bar they have much
stronger walls than most compressor tanks, and the fill is (should be)
0% water so less (0) rust.
--
replace spamblock with my family name to e-mail me
Pics at http://www.meekings.net/diving/index.shtml
and http://www.meekings.net/photo-groups/nui/index.shtml

"Jerome Meekings" wrote in message
...
Leon wrote:

I have never heard of an expiration date on a tank. Sounds more like a
tactic to generate sales down the road. Typically a tank will
eventually rust inside and a pin hole will developed. The hole will
leak and it will get bigger.

If you are involved with SCUBA or hp gasses you would have heard of
them. They show when the tank needs to be inspected (anually) and
pressure tested (around every 5 years) if it is a steel tank the falure
mode is usually not explosive.

No doubt, but I was refering to the Compressor tank failure mentioned in the
title of the OP thread.

Leon wrote:
....
Yeah, I am not sure what the OP has. The title talks about "compressor tank
failure". Then he mentions carrying around a tank ...

Virtually positive he's using an old propane tank as a "bubble"...

--

"Jerome Meekings" wrote

If you are involved with SCUBA or hp gasses you would have heard of
them.

Same goes for my box of Wheaties ... and, strangely enough, it has about as
much to do with the question posed.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 3/27/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"alexy" wrote in message
...
My compressor use is limited to using a carry tank for filling tires
and very small brad-nailing jobs. The tank used to scare me, thinking
of the energy contained in 125 lb of compressed air. And now I see
that my tank has an "expiration date" (already passed) embossed on it.
And I'll get rid of it if it is a danger. But I was thinking--what
does happen if the tank fails? It's not like a bomb, where there is a
near-instantaneous increase in pressure that tears the tank apart. It
seems to me that what is likely to happen is rust will create a thin
spot that will eventually fail, releasing rather unspectacularly all
the air in the tank.

Is there any safety risk in using an "expired" tank?
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked
infrequently.

My compressor, a dual tank Emglo, was purchased in 1987. About 8 years ago
it developed leakage around the bottom supports (the rails that hold it off
the ground). A friend tried to repair it using a MIG welder, to no avail.
Then I posted the problem to some newsgroup or another and someone posted
his fix: use epoxy. I did so and am still using that compressor (though I
think I'm beginning to hear another leakage hiss).

"Leon" wrote:


"alexy" wrote in message
.. .
My compressor use is limited to using a carry tank for filling tires
and very small brad-nailing jobs. The tank used to scare me, thinking
of the energy contained in 125 lb of compressed air. And now I see
that my tank has an "expiration date" (already passed) embossed on it.
And I'll get rid of it if it is a danger. But I was thinking--what
does happen if the tank fails? It's not like a bomb, where there is a
near-instantaneous increase in pressure that tears the tank apart. It
seems to me that what is likely to happen is rust will create a thin
spot that will eventually fail, releasing rather unspectacularly all
the air in the tank.

Is there any safety risk in using an "expired" tank?
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked
infrequently.


I have never heard of an expiration date on a tank. Sounds more like a
tactic to generate sales down the road. Typically a tank will eventually
rust inside and a pin hole will developed. The hole will leak and it will
get bigger.

That's what my intuition was telling me, but I wanted to test that
with the folks here. Thanks.
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.

"Leon" wrote:


"B A R R Y" wrote in message
et...
Leon wrote:
I have never heard of an expiration date on a tank.

All three of my 12 gallon storage tanks have expiration dates stamped near
the valve. 20 lb. Propane tanks have had them even longer.

Sounds more like a tactic to generate sales down the road.

Possibly...

More likely, someone sued and stupidity ensued.


Yeah, I am not sure what the OP has. The title talks about "compressor tank
failure". Then he mentions carrying around a tank for tires and small nail
jobs. I have carried a small tank compressor to a location with no
electricity and used it to nail a few pieces of trim. IIRC I have seen
dates on the stand alone tanks.


Sorry for the confusion. I have a small "carry tank" similar to this:
http://www.sears.com/shc/s/p_10153_1...0070921x00003a

I made the title more general, since I suspect the same issues apply
if you mount a compressor on top of the tank or fill it from a gas
station's air hose (except that air from the filling station is very
wet in my experience).
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.

dpb wrote:

Leon wrote:
...
Yeah, I am not sure what the OP has. The title talks about "compressor tank
failure". Then he mentions carrying around a tank ...

Virtually positive he's using an old propane tank as a "bubble"...

Virtually wrong ;-)
See link in my reply to Leon.
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.

"Lee K" wrote:

My compressor, a dual tank Emglo, was purchased in 1987. About 8 years ago
it developed leakage around the bottom supports (the rails that hold it off
the ground). A friend tried to repair it using a MIG welder, to no avail.
Then I posted the problem to some newsgroup or another and someone posted
his fix: use epoxy. I did so and am still using that compressor (though I
think I'm beginning to hear another leakage hiss).

Thanks, Lee. The important part for me is that it was a "leaking
hiss", not a catastrophic failure. My carry tank is cheap enough that
I will just replace rather than try to fix it when the time comes. But
I am cheap enough not to want to replace it just because of some date
stamp, as long as I am not creating a safety hazard.
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked infrequently.

On Sun, 20 Apr 2008 22:52:23 -0400, alexy wrote:

My compressor use is limited to using a carry tank for filling tires
and very small brad-nailing jobs. The tank used to scare me, thinking
of the energy contained in 125 lb of compressed air. And now I see
that my tank has an "expiration date" (already passed) embossed on it.
And I'll get rid of it if it is a danger. But I was thinking--what
does happen if the tank fails? It's not like a bomb, where there is a
near-instantaneous increase in pressure that tears the tank apart. It
seems to me that what is likely to happen is rust will create a thin
spot that will eventually fail, releasing rather unspectacularly all
the air in the tank.

Is there any safety risk in using an "expired" tank?


I used to manufacture tanks to ASME codes. Can't remember an
expiration date ever being part of the process. Also did due
diligence on a manufacturer of air compressors and then worked in a
tool group that included a compressor manufacturer (not the same one).
To my knowledge, no expiration dates there.

Hgh pressure dive tanks have an expiration date, that is they have to
be visually inspected periodically and then hydrostatically tested
periodically or their certification "expires". If they don't pass
either one, they are not returned to you. They are dangerous when
worn, but normally take 2000 psi or greater.

As far as failure mode on a 125-150 psi working pressure tank, if rust
occurs internally then it may cause a slow leak that will get worse
until the tank won't hold any more, but not catasrophic. I have seen
a poorly seated drain coupling blow out with force but towards the
floor.

Frank

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 10:38:18 -0400, "Lee K"
wrote:


"alexy" wrote in message
.. .
My compressor use is limited to using a carry tank for filling tires
and very small brad-nailing jobs. The tank used to scare me, thinking
of the energy contained in 125 lb of compressed air. And now I see
that my tank has an "expiration date" (already passed) embossed on it.
And I'll get rid of it if it is a danger. But I was thinking--what
does happen if the tank fails? It's not like a bomb, where there is a
near-instantaneous increase in pressure that tears the tank apart. It
seems to me that what is likely to happen is rust will create a thin
spot that will eventually fail, releasing rather unspectacularly all
the air in the tank.

Is there any safety risk in using an "expired" tank?
--
Alex -- Replace "nospam" with "mail" to reply by email. Checked
infrequently.

My compressor, a dual tank Emglo, was purchased in 1987. About 8 years ago
it developed leakage around the bottom supports (the rails that hold it off
the ground). A friend tried to repair it using a MIG welder, to no avail.
Then I posted the problem to some newsgroup or another and someone posted
his fix: use epoxy. I did so and am still using that compressor (though I
think I'm beginning to hear another leakage hiss).

If you use it in a business with other folks around, you might
consider replacing to limit your liability regardless of how well you
believe the repairs have been done. The ASME code certification is
invalidated by repair to the tank without opening a new code
certification which can be done, but not worth the cost on that type
of tank. Very small chance of any injury, but it could blow a fitting
or a glob of rust/epoxy.

if you use it for personal use then it doesn't really matter that much
if you are confident of the repairs.

Frank

Leon wrote:

I have never heard of an expiration date on a tank. Sounds more like
a tactic to generate sales down the road. Typically a tank will
eventually rust inside and a pin hole will developed. The hole will
leak and it will get bigger.

Uh, wrong, certain small sizes are exempt but larger tanks (depending on
capacity and dimensions) have expiration dates including scuba tanks, airgun
tanks and so on. Metal tanks are usually good for five years between hydro
recerts, fiber-wrapped tanks from three to five years depending on the
design. Fiber-wrapped tanks can only be recertified three times and then
have to be destroyed, but all-metal tanks are good so long as they pass
inspection and testing, I've seen fifty-pound CO2 tanks with the earliest
markings being WWII-era. In the U.S. this is federal DOT law BTW, although
you'll also find additional local requirements, e.g. there are states where
you can't get a scuba tank refilled if it doesn't have an annual interior
visual inspection sticker even if it has a current hydro-test certificate.

Tanks generally don't develop pinhole leaks that eventually get larger, when
they fail they fail suddenly and usually catastrophically. If you don't
believe any of that get down to your local scuba shop and ask them, they get
bulletins on tank failures and can show you photos.

On Mon, 21 Apr 2008 13:44:33 -0700, "DGDevin"
wrote:

Leon wrote:

I have never heard of an expiration date on a tank. Sounds more like
a tactic to generate sales down the road. Typically a tank will
eventually rust inside and a pin hole will developed. The hole will
leak and it will get bigger.

Uh, wrong, certain small sizes are exempt but larger tanks (depending on
capacity and dimensions) have expiration dates including scuba tanks, airgun
tanks and so on. Metal tanks are usually good for five years between hydro
recerts, fiber-wrapped tanks from three to five years depending on the
design. Fiber-wrapped tanks can only be recertified three times and then
have to be destroyed, but all-metal tanks are good so long as they pass
inspection and testing, I've seen fifty-pound CO2 tanks with the earliest
markings being WWII-era. In the U.S. this is federal DOT law BTW, although
you'll also find additional local requirements, e.g. there are states where
you can't get a scuba tank refilled if it doesn't have an annual interior
visual inspection sticker even if it has a current hydro-test certificate.

Tanks generally don't develop pinhole leaks that eventually get larger, when
they fail they fail suddenly and usually catastrophically. If you don't
believe any of that get down to your local scuba shop and ask them, they get
bulletins on tank failures and can show you photos.

You are talking HIGH PRESSURE tanks.
Normal compressor tanks run 150psi max and I've never had one
hydrotested. My current tank has a hydrotest date on it because it
held propane for over 20 years, then sat for several years before
being put into service as an air compressor tank.
We had a 30 year old truck fuel tank (round saddle tank)that we used
as an air tank for over 10 years that did rust through at the bottom.
It was brazed twice before we stopped using it (I think one of the
guys took it home to use - was at our car club at the time)
In the ten years I was service manager at the Toyota dealership the 80
gallon tank was never recertified, and it was the same tank that had
been hanging on the wall10 years earlier when I worked in the same
shop as a mechanic.
** Posted from http://www.teranews.com **

"DGDevin" writes:
Leon wrote:

I have never heard of an expiration date on a tank. Sounds more like
a tactic to generate sales down the road. Typically a tank will
eventually rust inside and a pin hole will developed. The hole will
leak and it will get bigger.

Uh, wrong, certain small sizes are exempt but larger tanks (depending on
capacity and dimensions) have expiration dates including scuba tanks, airgun
tanks and so on. Metal tanks are usually good for five years between hydro
recerts, fiber-wrapped tanks from three to five years depending on the
design. Fiber-wrapped tanks can only be recertified three times and then
have to be destroyed, but all-metal tanks are good so long as they pass
inspection and testing, I've seen fifty-pound CO2 tanks with the earliest
markings being WWII-era. In the U.S. this is federal DOT law BTW, although
you'll also find additional local requirements, e.g. there are states where
you can't get a scuba tank refilled if it doesn't have an annual interior
visual inspection sticker even if it has a current hydro-test certificate.

Tanks generally don't develop pinhole leaks that eventually get larger, when
they fail they fail suddenly and usually catastrophically. If you don't
believe any of that get down to your local scuba shop and ask them, they get
bulletins on tank failures and can show you photos.


Find me a typical shop compressor tank that gets anywhere near 2000PSI
and I'll worry about it. At 125PSI, there will be no catastrophic failure.

scott

"DGDevin" writes:


Uh, wrong, certain small sizes are exempt but larger tanks (depending on
capacity and dimensions) have expiration dates including scuba tanks,
airgun
tanks and so on. Metal tanks are usually good for five years between
hydro
recerts, fiber-wrapped tanks from three to five years depending on the
design. Fiber-wrapped tanks can only be recertified three times and then
have to be destroyed, but all-metal tanks are good so long as they pass
inspection and testing, I've seen fifty-pound CO2 tanks with the earliest
markings being WWII-era. In the U.S. this is federal DOT law BTW,
although
you'll also find additional local requirements, e.g. there are states
where
you can't get a scuba tank refilled if it doesn't have an annual interior
visual inspection sticker even if it has a current hydro-test certificate.

Tanks generally don't develop pinhole leaks that eventually get larger,
when
they fail they fail suddenly and usually catastrophically. If you don't
believe any of that get down to your local scuba shop and ask them, they
get
bulletins on tank failures and can show you photos.


What is up with the friggin scuba tanks????????????? We are talking low
pressure compressor air tanks. And yes those get pin hole leaks and leak,
been there done that.

"Leon" wrote

What is up with the friggin scuba tanks?????????????

ROTFL ... hell, if you know something, anything, make damn sure everyone
else knows you know it, whether it's relevant or not.

Gotta get back to those Wheaties before they're out of date.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 3/27/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Apr 21, 4:44*pm, "DGDevin" wrote:


Tanks generally don't develop pinhole leaks that eventually get larger, when
they fail they fail suddenly and usually catastrophically. *If you don't
believe any of that get down to your local scuba shop and ask them, they get
bulletins on tank failures and can show you photos.

Catastrophic tank failures usually include a fuel source.
Air pressure alone (within the range of the safety valve) is not
likely to blow a tank apart and have shrapnel fly all over the place.
There simply isn't enough stored energy to do that. It isn't a
frickin' balloon.

Scott Lurndal wrote:



Find me a typical shop compressor tank that gets anywhere near 2000PSI
and I'll worry about it. At 125PSI, there will be no catastrophic failure.

Right!

The tires on my road bicycles get filled to 125-140 PSI. I've had
plenty of flats. Nothing scary to report.

"B A R R Y" wrote in message
...


The tires on my road bicycles get filled to 125-140 PSI. I've had plenty
of flats. Nothing scary to report.



You say there was nothing scary to report,

"Me" filling the position of the typical "new" reporter on the staff at your
local news agency questions......

First off could we say that you were not on a bicycle and you were actually
in your car? That sounds soooo much more exciting.
When you had your blow out, were there any by-standers that saw what
happened? Do you think the rain we had last night contributed to the flat?
Were the road conditions treacherous? Can you tell us where you were going
when this all happened. What do you think would have happened had you run
in to a concrete wall as a result of the flat? Do you think oil prices will
cause you to buy a cheaper replacement tire? Did your ABS come into play?
Were any of the other passengers in your car injured? Are you going to sue
the tire company? Do you think the speed that you were driving at had any
contributing factors to the this catastrophic tire failure? Being near the
air port at the time were you in fear of hitting an air plane on the runway?

Conclusion:

This is "so in so" the next big reporter in "your home town" on the scene
reporting on the terrible accident caused by poor quality tires near the
airport where a vehicle" skidded into a crash" as a result of rapid air loss
in the spare tire.

Back to you Domique.

Is your e-mail working yet?




"Swingman" wrote in message
...

"Leon" wrote

What is up with the friggin scuba tanks?????????????

ROTFL ... hell, if you know something, anything, make damn sure everyone
else knows you know it, whether it's relevant or not.

Gotta get back to those Wheaties before they're out of date.

--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 3/27/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

On Apr 22, 8:54*am, "Leon" wrote:
"B A R R Y" wrote in om...



The tires on my road bicycles get filled to 125-140 PSI. *I've had plenty
of flats. *Nothing scary to report.

You say there was nothing scary to report,

"Me" filling the position of the typical "new" reporter on the staff at your
local news agency questions......

First off could we say that you were not on a bicycle and you were actually
in your car? *That sounds soooo much more exciting.
When you had your blow out, were there any by-standers that saw what
happened? *Do you think the rain we had last night contributed to the flat?
Were the road conditions treacherous? *Can you tell us where you were going
when this all happened. *What do you think would have happened had you run
in to a concrete wall as a result of the flat? *Do you think oil prices will
cause you to buy a cheaper replacement tire? *Did your ABS come into play?
Were any of the other passengers in your car injured? *Are you going to sue
the tire company? *Do you think the speed that you were driving at had any
contributing factors to the this catastrophic tire failure? *Being near the
air port at the time were you in fear of hitting an air plane on the runway?

Conclusion:

This is "so in so" the next big reporter in "your home town" on the scene
reporting on the terrible accident caused by poor quality tires near the
airport where a vehicle" skidded into a crash" as a result of rapid air loss
in the spare tire.

Back to you Domique.

ANNNNNND we have a winner! The NTSB was on the scene, so was Chertoff,
which rhymes with....

Back to you Glen Beck!

"Leon" wrote
Is your e-mail working yet?

Still yoyo'ing ... damn u-Verse was rock solid for 3 months, now 'suddenly
last sunday' it starting bouncing like a rubber ball. 10 hours of dealing
with technicians yesterday (they left here at 10 PM) and still no joy,
except briefly.


--
www.e-woodshop.net
Last update: 3/27/08
KarlC@ (the obvious)

"Swingman" wrote in message
...

"Leon" wrote
Is your e-mail working yet?

Still yoyo'ing ... damn u-Verse was rock solid for 3 months, now 'suddenly
last sunday' it starting bouncing like a rubber ball. 10 hours of dealing
with technicians yesterday (they left here at 10 PM) and still no joy,
except briefly.


I kinda went through the same thing back around 2000 with ATT DSL. I and
perhaps you are fortunate that it was and is new to your area and have the
benefit of a technician actually working directly with you..

Any way, I forwarded you an e-mail that I got from Christy George with
Riverway. I think it was in response to my e-mail I sent to her last week
about the contract cancellation. I pretty much let her know what I thought
about people that did not hold up their end of the bargain and mentioned
that no opt outs were mentioned on the telephone when the called me to sign
me up.
Her e-mail said,

Dear Sir or Madam,

Riverway Power values its customers and after reviewing the plan
cancellation notice sent to you earlier, we have kept your rate plan the
same and no adjustments will be made. Please disregard the previous notice.

Please accept our apologies for the inconvenience this may have caused.

Kinda looks like a form letter so you might get one too.

Also I have some drawings for you so let me know when your e-mail is working
or I can come by and show you. There are some issues I have with the posts.

On Apr 21, 11:25*pm, "Leon" wrote:
"DGDevin" writes:

Uh, wrong, certain small sizes are exempt but larger tanks (depending on
capacity and dimensions) have expiration dates including scuba tanks,
airgun
tanks and so on. *Metal tanks are usually good for five years between
hydro
recerts, fiber-wrapped tanks from three to five years depending on the
design. *Fiber-wrapped tanks can only be recertified three times and then
have to be destroyed, but all-metal tanks are good so long as they pass
inspection and testing, I've seen fifty-pound CO2 tanks with the earliest
markings being WWII-era. *In the U.S. this is federal DOT law BTW,
although
you'll also find additional local requirements, e.g. there are states
where
you can't get a scuba tank refilled if it doesn't have an annual interior
visual inspection sticker even if it has a current hydro-test certificate.

Tanks generally don't develop pinhole leaks that eventually get larger,
when
they fail they fail suddenly and usually catastrophically. *If you don't
believe any of that get down to your local scuba shop and ask them, they
get
bulletins on tank failures and can show you photos.

What is up with the friggin scuba tanks????????????? * *We are talking low
pressure compressor air tanks. *And yes those get pin hole leaks and leak,
been there done that.

Scuba tanks need to be grounded to the dust collector. Everybody knows
that much! Geeeesh....

Scott Lurndal wrote:

Find me a typical shop compressor tank that gets anywhere near 2000PSI
and I'll worry about it. At 125PSI, there will be no catastrophic
failure.

scott

Okay, good point, low-pressure systems quite possibly aren't subject to the
same regulations in terms of testing and certification, mea culpa. But I
still treat any compressed gas with respect, I've seen too many people on
their way to the hospital as a result of having too casual an attitude
towards compressed gas, same as with any power tool.