HELP!!!!!
OK, now I'm stuck.
DeVilbiss Model EGA touchup spray gun.
Sprayed primer, everything worked great.
Cleaned spray gun with "gun wash" (laquer thinner). Gun was disassembled
for the cleaning. No indication of any primer was visiable anywhere on the
gun.
Reassembled gun.
The next day I went to spray the top coat, and all I got was the spray gun
back feeding into the paint cup.
The gun, when the trigger was depressed, pumped air into the paint cup,
instead of sucking the paint out of the cup and spraying it onto the item.
I have disassembled and reassembled this gun about 6 times, even left it
soaking in "gun wash" over night (only the metal parts). Still it only
blows back into the cup.
I've been trying to spray water, rather than paint, until I can get this
problem fixed. Varing the airpressure makes no differance.
This gun is so clean, you can see your reflection in the aluminum.

Ray

On Mar 28, 11:59 pm, Nirodac wrote:
HELP!!!!!
OK, now I'm stuck.
DeVilbiss Model EGA touchup spray gun.
Sprayed primer, everything worked great.
Cleaned spray gun with "gun wash" (laquer thinner). Gun was disassembled
for the cleaning. No indication of any primer was visiable anywhere on the
gun.
Reassembled gun.
The next day I went to spray the top coat, and all I got was the spray gun
back feeding into the paint cup.
The gun, when the trigger was depressed, pumped air into the paint cup,
instead of sucking the paint out of the cup and spraying it onto the item.
I have disassembled and reassembled this gun about 6 times, even left it
soaking in "gun wash" over night (only the metal parts). Still it only
blows back into the cup.
I've been trying to spray water, rather than paint, until I can get this
problem fixed. Varing the airpressure makes no differance.
This gun is so clean, you can see your reflection in the aluminum.

Ray

Was the primer water-based? If so, the thinners just made mud, which
you probably can't see.
Thinners and emulsion-based products make neat stringy stuff. Very
hard to get rid of.

"Robatoy" wrote in
oups.com:

On Mar 28, 11:59 pm, Nirodac wrote:
HELP!!!!!
OK, now I'm stuck.
DeVilbiss Model EGA touchup spray gun.
Sprayed primer, everything worked great.
Cleaned spray gun with "gun wash" (laquer thinner). Gun was
disassembled for the cleaning. No indication of any primer was
visiable anywhere on the gun.
Reassembled gun.
The next day I went to spray the top coat, and all I got was the
spray gun back feeding into the paint cup.
The gun, when the trigger was depressed, pumped air into the paint
cup, instead of sucking the paint out of the cup and spraying it onto
the item. I have disassembled and reassembled this gun about 6 times,
even left it soaking in "gun wash" over night (only the metal parts).
Still it only blows back into the cup.
I've been trying to spray water, rather than paint, until I can get
this problem fixed. Varing the airpressure makes no differance.
This gun is so clean, you can see your reflection in the aluminum.

Ray

Was the primer water-based? If so, the thinners just made mud, which
you probably can't see.
Thinners and emulsion-based products make neat stringy stuff. Very
hard to get rid of.



Nope, oil based, thinned with Xylene. The resulting material sprayed
fine and coated well.
Top coat is also petroleum based.
Ray

On Mar 28, 10:11 pm, "Robatoy" wrote:
This gun is so clean, you can see your reflection in the aluminum.

Ray

Now get the schematic for the gun and break the gun all the way down.
Take it down to the seals, O rings, and packings and return springs.
Don't worry about taking this gun apart; it is a great gun, and made
to be used hard and rebuilt. You won't hurt a thing.

Check the needle when you pull it out. If there is the smallest
amount of anything on it, it is almost a sure indicator that something
is in the barrel. You need to make sure you have the gun cleaning kit
around to get this done properly. BTW, in case one didn't come with
your gun, it is a tiny bottle brush, something that looks like a small
toothbrush, and probably some toothpick looking pieces of wood to
clean the pressure cap assembly.

Still nothing? The next culprit is the pickup tube and its connection
to the gun body/barrel. Remove it from the gun and look inside the
housing. Remove any debris, looking carefully at the hole where the
fluid enters the barrel before atomizing. This is where mine gets
gunked on occasion.

Then check the pickup tube itself. Make sure it is as clean as
possible inside.


Was the primer water-based? If so, the thinners just made mud, which
you probably can't see.
Thinners and emulsion-based products make neat stringy stuff. Very
hard to get rid of.

Too true. If the above happened, then you will have have to opt for
manual removal of all debris. No solvents or cleaners will work.

But there is another thing that could raise its ugly head. Water base
or no, you may have cooked your own goose by using lacquer thinner as
your gun wash.

If you used solvent based Kilz or Bullseye, or any other shellac based
primer, you are in for a nice cleaning session. I personally haven't
had any luck with those being easily cleaned out of my guns with
lacquer thinner. On solvnet primers I have the best luck cleaning
out the gun with regular paint thinner as it is not nearly as hot, and
doesn't cook the primer.

The lacquer thinner is so hot (high VOC) that is literally catalyzes
the shellac based primer in some cases on contact. I found this out
the hard way personally a few years ago by turning a batch of KILZ in
my gravity fed conversion HVLP into white plaster. I don't remember
the primer, but I had thinned it with the lacquer thinner and didn't
have any problems shooting it. However, after about 20 ozs of
material, it was time to clean.

It was starting to set up in the gun and I didn't really think that
much about it. But then when I hit it with the GW, it was disaster.
It literally took about 2 hours to get the gun clean. It turned to
plaster everywhere in the gun that the primer could go. Called my
paint at Coronado and he confirmed my stupidity.

If it isn't a water based problem, I think it is a problem caused by
using an incorrect cleaning solution. The good news is, you could
have your gun up and running pretty quickly, with no permanent damage
if you are a patient cleaner.

Let us know if you get it cleaned or need more info.

Robert

wrote in message
oups.com...
On Mar 28, 10:11 pm, "Robatoy" wrote:
This gun is so clean, you can see your reflection in the aluminum.

Ray

Now get the schematic for the gun and break the gun all the way down.
Take it down to the seals, O rings, and packings and return springs.
Don't worry about taking this gun apart; it is a great gun, and made
to be used hard and rebuilt. You won't hurt a thing.

Check the needle when you pull it out. If there is the smallest
amount of anything on it, it is almost a sure indicator that something
is in the barrel. You need to make sure you have the gun cleaning kit
around to get this done properly. BTW, in case one didn't come with
your gun, it is a tiny bottle brush, something that looks like a small
toothbrush, and probably some toothpick looking pieces of wood to
clean the pressure cap assembly.

Still nothing? The next culprit is the pickup tube and its connection
to the gun body/barrel. Remove it from the gun and look inside the
housing. Remove any debris, looking carefully at the hole where the
fluid enters the barrel before atomizing. This is where mine gets
gunked on occasion.

Then check the pickup tube itself. Make sure it is as clean as
possible inside.


Most pickup problems like this are the result of clogs in the gun head which
require exactly the procedure Robert describes. Pay particular attention to
the pickup tube and pathways associated with it. The gun relies on a
venturi effect to pull the material out of the cup and problems like this
are almost always caused by obstructions.

--

-Mike-

" wrote in
oups.com:

On Mar 28, 10:11 pm, "Robatoy" wrote:
This gun is so clean, you can see your reflection in the aluminum.

Ray

Now get the schematic for the gun and break the gun all the way down.

Yup, found the schematic and broke the gun all the way down, even pulled
out the packing.

Take it down to the seals, O rings, and packings and return springs.
Don't worry about taking this gun apart; it is a great gun, and made
to be used hard and rebuilt. You won't hurt a thing.

Check the needle when you pull it out. If there is the smallest
amount of anything on it, it is almost a sure indicator that something
is in the barrel.

Spotless needle, not shiny but a dull luster, no scratches or nicks.
Nice snug fit in the packing. Inside of the barrel is shiney

You need to make sure you have the gun cleaning kit
around to get this done properly. BTW, in case one didn't come with
your gun, it is a tiny bottle brush, something that looks like a small
toothbrush, and probably some toothpick looking pieces of wood to
clean the pressure cap assembly.

Got that too. Used it, also used a q-tip to clean the barrel.

Still nothing? The next culprit is the pickup tube and its connection
to the gun body/barrel. Remove it from the gun and look inside the
housing. Remove any debris, looking carefully at the hole where the
fluid enters the barrel before atomizing. This is where mine gets
gunked on occasion.

Clean, no product. Can also feel slight pressure here (fluid inlet on
barrel)when pressing trigger (schematic calls this the "fluid Inlet")

Then check the pickup tube itself. Make sure it is as clean as
possible inside.


Was the primer water-based? If so, the thinners just made mud, which
you probably can't see.
Thinners and emulsion-based products make neat stringy stuff. Very
hard to get rid of.

Too true. If the above happened, then you will have have to opt for
manual removal of all debris. No solvents or cleaners will work.

But there is another thing that could raise its ugly head. Water base
or no, you may have cooked your own goose by using lacquer thinner as
your gun wash.

If you used solvent based Kilz or Bullseye, or any other shellac based
primer, you are in for a nice cleaning session. I personally haven't
had any luck with those being easily cleaned out of my guns with
lacquer thinner. On solvnet primers I have the best luck cleaning
out the gun with regular paint thinner as it is not nearly as hot, and
doesn't cook the primer.

Primer was "Crown Rust Paint" containing petroleum distillates. Thinned
with Xylene.

The lacquer thinner is so hot (high VOC) that is literally catalyzes
the shellac based primer in some cases on contact. I found this out
the hard way personally a few years ago by turning a batch of KILZ in
my gravity fed conversion HVLP into white plaster. I don't remember
the primer, but I had thinned it with the lacquer thinner and didn't
have any problems shooting it. However, after about 20 ozs of
material, it was time to clean.

It was starting to set up in the gun and I didn't really think that
much about it. But then when I hit it with the GW, it was disaster.
It literally took about 2 hours to get the gun clean. It turned to
plaster everywhere in the gun that the primer could go. Called my
paint at Coronado and he confirmed my stupidity.

If it isn't a water based problem, I think it is a problem caused by
using an incorrect cleaning solution. The good news is, you could
have your gun up and running pretty quickly, with no permanent damage
if you are a patient cleaner.

Let us know if you get it cleaned or need more info.

Cleaned it several times now, once after reading this post. Same thing
no change. Still bubbling air into the fluid pot.

The fluid path up from the pot to the fluid needle chamber in the barrel
and then out the barrel past the air cap is as clean as it can be.
It's almost like the venturi effect isn't working.

Robert

Usually I read the instructions on the can (don't tell my wife I read
instructions)and thin the fluid with whatever the manufacturer
recommends.

Thanks for the help so far
Ray

On Mar 29, 11:23 pm, Nirodac wrote:

Primer was "Crown Rust Paint" containing petroleum distillates. Thinned with Xylene.

If it is a Crown product, it is pretty generic stuff, so there weren't
any high powered solvents needed. I don't know that it would make
much differnce since metal primers are mostly solvent anyway, but why
did you use Xylene?
Cleaned it several times now, once after reading this post. Same thing
no change. Still bubbling air into the fluid pot.

WTF, over? How would you know that? Are you sure this is the gun you
have?

http://tinyurl.com/355cnk

Don't look at the stuff the guy did to the gun, just the starting
pic. Like any other high pressure gun that sucks the paint up the
pickup tube, you would never, ever see any bubbling unless you had a
clear can on it.

So... are you using the gun with the 6 or 8 oz cup, or are you
actually using a another resevoir? If you are using a resevoir, the
little venturi on this gun was never made to suck finish through three
feer of line to get to the gun.

And bubbling is not good - something isn't set up right. I don't have
a clue how you could see that on a high pressure gun/can combo.

The fluid path up from the pot to the fluid needle chamber in the barrel
and then out the barrel past the air cap is as clean as it can be.
It's almost like the venturi effect isn't working.

Let's take this a little further, too. After a good cleaning to make
sure I have the gun ready to go, I always spray some kind of thinner
through it. When for the last time wash it is clear, I am happy.
Have you tried this? Will yours spray thinner, or are you trying to
spray a finish when you are testing?

Usually I read the instructions on the can (don't tell my wife I read
instructions)and thin the fluid with whatever the manufacturer
recommends.

That's good news. A few years ago I finally decided that I had made
such time consuming, costly mess out of so many things I always read
now. It elminated so many uncessary problems I do it all the time
now. It's a dirty little secret of mine.

I'm willing to hang with you on this to see if we can get it solved if
you want. Please make sure you have the exact model of gun you
described. The post more detailed info addressing the bubbling (??),
type of finish you are trying to spray, whether or not you tried plain
clear thinner, and what type of paint resevoir you have on the gun.

Ray - everyone that sprays has problems like this from time to time.
I have a small Binks knockoff that I cleaned front to back too many
times to count when it was acting up, and every time there was just a
tiny little spec of something stuck where I couldn't see it that
screwed me up.

This is just part of it, as annoying it is. This is why it is
important to clean the guns as well as you can after every use. I see
folk's guns that look like they have been spraying black weed killer
and battery acid out of them, and they can't figure out why they don't
work better.

My little detail gun isn't spotless, but pretty close, and until I
went to my HVLP system I used it for everything for years. So you are
certainly on the right track there.

Let me know.

Robert

"Nirodac" wrote in message
.74...
" wrote in
oups.com:




Cleaned it several times now, once after reading this post. Same thing
no change. Still bubbling air into the fluid pot.

You've got my attention with this comment. I think both Robert and I
assumed this gun was being used in a syphone set up and not in a pressure
setup. Touchup guns are really best suited for small work and most times
don't warrant a pressure setup. If you're using a pressure setup then
you've got to go back to step one. You've got an entire system to look at
for cleanliness, proper functioning, etc. If you're not delivering both air
and fluid to the spray head then you've got to look further back in the
pressure chain. How is your pot? (I know that one is going to open
Pandora's box...). If indeed you are using a pressure setup, then throw
your cup on and the suction aircap, and see how it draws in suction. Any
difference?

Maybe you should take a stab at clearing this point of confusion up for us.

But let's go back to basics here for a second... When you trigger the gun,
can you feel that you are delivering air out through the fluid tip at a
partial trigger pull? When you regulate both the air control and the fan
control, do you feel a difference in what the gun is doing when you put your
hand in front of the tip?



--

-Mike-

" wrote in
ps.com:

On Mar 29, 11:23 pm, Nirodac wrote:

Primer was "Crown Rust Paint" containing petroleum distillates.
Thinned with Xylene.

If it is a Crown product, it is pretty generic stuff, so there weren't
any high powered solvents needed. I don't know that it would make
much differnce since metal primers are mostly solvent anyway, but why
did you use Xylene?
Cleaned it several times now, once after reading this post. Same
thing no change. Still bubbling air into the fluid pot.

WTF, over? How would you know that? Are you sure this is the gun you
have?

http://tinyurl.com/355cnk

Don't look at the stuff the guy did to the gun, just the starting
pic. Like any other high pressure gun that sucks the paint up the
pickup tube, you would never, ever see any bubbling unless you had a
clear can on it.

So... are you using the gun with the 6 or 8 oz cup, or are you
actually using a another resevoir? If you are using a resevoir, the
little venturi on this gun was never made to suck finish through three
feer of line to get to the gun.

And bubbling is not good - something isn't set up right. I don't have
a clue how you could see that on a high pressure gun/can combo.

The fluid path up from the pot to the fluid needle chamber in the
barrel and then out the barrel past the air cap is as clean as it can
be. It's almost like the venturi effect isn't working.

Let's take this a little further, too. After a good cleaning to make
sure I have the gun ready to go, I always spray some kind of thinner
through it. When for the last time wash it is clear, I am happy.
Have you tried this? Will yours spray thinner, or are you trying to
spray a finish when you are testing?

Usually I read the instructions on the can (don't tell my wife I read
instructions)and thin the fluid with whatever the manufacturer
recommends.

That's good news. A few years ago I finally decided that I had made
such time consuming, costly mess out of so many things I always read
now. It elminated so many uncessary problems I do it all the time
now. It's a dirty little secret of mine.

I'm willing to hang with you on this to see if we can get it solved if
you want. Please make sure you have the exact model of gun you
described. The post more detailed info addressing the bubbling (??),
type of finish you are trying to spray, whether or not you tried plain
clear thinner, and what type of paint resevoir you have on the gun.

Ray - everyone that sprays has problems like this from time to time.
I have a small Binks knockoff that I cleaned front to back too many
times to count when it was acting up, and every time there was just a
tiny little spec of something stuck where I couldn't see it that
screwed me up.

This is just part of it, as annoying it is. This is why it is
important to clean the guns as well as you can after every use. I see
folk's guns that look like they have been spraying black weed killer
and battery acid out of them, and they can't figure out why they don't
work better.

My little detail gun isn't spotless, but pretty close, and until I
went to my HVLP system I used it for everything for years. So you are
certainly on the right track there.

Let me know.

Robert



Boy, you guys are just loaded with great information.

I may have found the problem.
After I sent my last post, I decided to go over everything just one more
time, with a magnifying glass (the old eyes aren't what they used to be).
Seems that I have a small crack on the fluid tip where the fluid needle
seats behind (internally) to it.
As luck would have it, there is a DeVilbiss dealer here in town, so later
today I'll drop by and get a new tip (and needle) and packing.

But to answer some of the questions you guys asked.

1. 6 oz medal cup, pressure system.
2. I can hear the bubbling in the cup (x-ray vision has failed me!)
3. Exact model is DeVilbiss EGA-502 (can only find a 503 on the net,
looks the same (even the exploded views are the same, part numbers
slightly different)).
4. Xylene was handy, and it did the trick. Normally would have used
paint thinner. Xylene I found causes the product to dry faster in colder
weather, my current shop isn't heated yet (still building my woodwork
shop).
5. I do ususally clean my guns really well, and infact that my have been
what caused my problem here. I had removed the spary tip to clean the
barrel one to many times.

Thanks for everyone's help so far. I'll let you know the outcome of the
new tip replacement.

Ray

On Mar 30, 6:25 pm, "Mike Marlow" wrote:

No you didn't Ray. Cleanliness is next to godliness with spray equipment.
Keep taking those guns apart and cleaning them thoroughly. Your guns will
love you for it.

--

-Mike-


Can I get a witness??

AMEN!!

Never clean enough.

Robert

On Fri, 30 Mar 2007 19:25:13 -0500, "Mike Marlow"
wrote:

Cleanliness is next to godliness with spray equipment.
Keep taking those guns apart and cleaning them thoroughly. Your guns will
love you for it.


I'm just replying to reiterate what Mike wrote. G

When all else fails, acetone takes almost anything out of the gun
passages.

"Nirodac" wrote in message
.78...

5. I do ususally clean my guns really well, and infact that my have been
what caused my problem here. I had removed the spary tip to clean the
barrel one to many times.


No you didn't Ray. Cleanliness is next to godliness with spray equipment.
Keep taking those guns apart and cleaning them thoroughly. Your guns will
love you for it.

--

-Mike-