In article ,
IMM wrote:
Anyone with half a brain cell still intact would realise it's not
possible for a 'new' electric motor to use 10% of the energy of
others.


Course it is if it develops 5% of the power...

Put a 20:1 box on it and HEY PRESTO. IT HAS ASMUCH TORQUE AS THE BIGGER
ONE!!!

How long have you been flying kites?

Forget flying kites, prat, try answering the question. As if.

--
*Be nice to your kids. They'll choose your nursing home.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...

I am not so sure. The thought of filling up for a couple of quid is
attractive, and lets face it, it need not be every night.

The sad reality is that you already fill up for a few quid... the bulk
of the extra cost you pay is tax. You can soon see some bright spark of
a chancellor decreeing that electricity used for cars will be taxed at
300%...

..and how would he know that?

They do it with home produced bio-fuels for vehicle use. You have to send
them about 23p for every litre you make.

John Rumm wrote:

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

The sad reality is that you already fill up for a few quid... the
bulk of the extra cost you pay is tax. You can soon see some bright
spark of a chancellor decreeing that electricity used for cars will
be taxed at 300%...



..and how would he know that?


Aproved charging sockets that print a receipt for charge delivered (and
upload this information and bill electronically), coupled with onboard
monitoring by the car that tracks the total charge used. Tee two sets of
records could be cross checked at MOT time (or failing every time that
you drive past a road side beacon) and the difference charged to you.


FAR too complex.

I would suggest that some other form of taxation wold be introduced.

Massive road tax for example.

Capitol wrote:



The Natural Philosopher wrote:

http://www.unipros.com/cbpsite/lipod...sion_id=111428

You are not allowed to airfreight larger Lithium batteries because
of the explosion risk!

Asfar as distribution infrastructure goes, I am sure that a single 3Kw
overnight load on every household is within current (sic!) capabilites..


I doubt it, say 22M households = 30 M cars. 270M extra KW required
overnight. I suspect we might need a few new real power stations, not
wind generators.

That's assuming everyone does 300 miles a day.
Besides peak charge rate is only 3 kW, so 30M cars is 90,000 MW only.

Would not be surprised if you could not get that back by switching off
all the street lamps. And traffic lights.

In reality I am fairly sure that most drivers would charge about once a
week, dividing that by 7, to get 13GW as the total extra burden.

A GW is about what a large power station produces. So 13 power stations
would keep most of the country on the roads by day,and the 3KW per
household is not a bad estimate for what is drawn by a given household
on average anyway. I would estimate 1-2KW is the average draw, most by
day, which sort of means peak capacity is probably 2-4Kw/household.

Adding - for a once a week charge - another 450W to overnight demand is
not a huge increase.

Anyway, maths aside, the grid could almost certainly cope as long as
most charging is off peak, which it would be, and I suspect the only
impact on power stations would be that some that are shut down overnight
would stay up all night. And a few more base load stations would need to
be constructed. I'd say half a dozen big nuclear sets could supply
nearly all that was needed.











Regards
Capitol

Capitol wrote:



Roger wrote:


There is of course an easy way round that problem. Design the car for
easy battery removal and get a battery transplant instead of a charge.

This of course is what was proposed for Zinc/air batteries in the
1960's. I haven't seen any other worthwhile low cost battery solutions
in the intervening years. Power electrics changes very slowly, I doubt
we'll see worthwhile electric vehicles in the next 25 years.


Power electronics has changed a LOT in te last 25 years actually.

The availability of low cost high power MOSFET for sitching has made it
far easier to regulate DC morors or use AC motrs from DC sources. The
adbvent of microprocessors has made it easy to use much more omplex
algorithms to control as well.

Lithium bareies have really only arrived in bulk post the cell phone and
laptop market, in the same way that Nickel technolpogy was driven by the
portable power tool market.

No one invests huge money in car batteries when there are no electric
cras. No one invets money in electric cars when there are no bartteries.

Stalemate.

HOWEVER ther are now batteries that ARE suitable for electric cars,
albeit in small sizes more suitable for laptops etc. Fast charging is
definitely possible - theaverage fast charge should take about 40
minutes if teh right gear is available, so battery removal and
replacement is not really necessary.

The thrust of my argument is that there is now very little standing in
the way of all this. The technology is not now 'unobtainable' or at the
other side of a massive development investment.

Electrc cars of this nature, not only COULD be built, they CAN be built
and one or two HAVE been built.

Even the use of small battery cells is possibly not such a disadvantage,
as I have been sndidering teh cots impliactions of self monitoring
arrays of cells, that could be isloated and exchanged as single cells,
this eliminating the need for total battery replacement. In practice,
yoy simply pull teh cells with te red lights on at teh srevice interval,
run some diagmostics, and charge the owner for e.g. 30 or 40 new cells.

Bearing in mind that apart from tyres and brakes, and maybe a bit of oil
here and there and hydraulic fluid, there are NO regular services needed
for this car at all....no oil flters, no air filters, no oil changes, no
new spark plugs, no transmission top ups...you are talking about a car
that should be able to do 100,000 miles between battery changes and
would probably need a 20,000 mile inspection for brake wear and general
lubrication.

This sort of car makes sense in EVERY respect. It solves every vehicle
problem except the final one. Where to get the electricity from. If
nuclear power were adopted, or massive windfarms the you could have a
totally carbon neutral transport infrastructure, and zero city and
mortorway pollution.

Everybody is tinkering with these cars - there are dozens of 'concept
cars' out there.

I suspect the first you may see in volume will be a Smart - its already
the right sort of size and shape, and equipping one with a battery will
not be hugely onerous.

This technology may be 25 years from de facto standard, but you will see
these in the showrooms in less than 5 years is my guess.


Frankly, i could use one rght now, ecven if it cots 20 grand, it wouild
save overall in a few years on servicing and fuel costs.




Regards
Capitol

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:


In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:


And in the meantime, advancements in the good ol' IC engine will continue
to improve its efficiency. And there's plenty of room for that.




I think not Dave.


Not the engine itself. Definitely lighter vehicles though, and better
management of power. But these are only stopgaps.


The physics of heat engines make it hard to exceed more than 50%
efficiency even in a huge stationary heat engine like a power station.


Well, yes, but we're nowhere near 50% on the average car engine yet -
especially under light loading.



Exactly., And its very hard to get there. Thats one of the reasons the
hybrid has some promise - run the engine where its efficient, or shut it
down.


You can shut down an IC engine as well when it's not in use. But of
course, cars are used for all sorts of things - not only commuting in
heavy traffic. And once you talk about 'motorway' use, the electric
vehicle looses all its benefits. The losses in charging a battery become
equally as significant as the losses in an IC engine.


No, they don't actually.

Battries are not 50% efficient - they are far better than that.

There are issues in the overall GENERATION and TRASMISSION efficiency,
but these are o worse, and, if you repalce carbon fulled generators with
wind or nuclear, the pollution aspect goes way down.




Hard to say what an electric can do efficiency wise. At best rated
state, over 95% is on, but at part throttle is a lot more problematic.
Of course at traffic lights they use nothing at all.


But the losses in charging the battery?


say 15%?


But my guess is that the overall fossil fuel to power station to
transmission loss to battery loss to controller loss to motor loss is
better than IC, but not hugely.


Yup.


The real gains come if you don't burn fossil fuels in the power
generating sets. And on the streets which are quieter and cleaner.


Yes. If all you want to do is move pollution from one area to another...


No. Because electricity can be generared by carbon neutral means.

- hydro
- wind
- nuclear
- biomass if you must...

The iverall energy equations of such a setup are hat no more energy is
used - in practice possibly less - and it can be generated by other
means than teh burning of fossil fuels - which is the greatest
environmental danger.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
John Rumm wrote:

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

The sad reality is that you already fill up for a few quid... the
bulk of the extra cost you pay is tax. You can soon see some bright
spark of a chancellor decreeing that electricity used for cars will
be taxed at 300%...



..and how would he know that?


Aproved charging sockets that print a receipt for charge delivered (and
upload this information and bill electronically), coupled with onboard
monitoring by the car that tracks the total charge used. Tee two sets of
records could be cross checked at MOT time (or failing every time that
you drive past a road side beacon) and the difference charged to you.


FAR too complex.

I would suggest that some other form of taxation wold be introduced.

Massive road tax for example.

Then the Pikeys get away with it yet again.











































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"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Capitol wrote:



Roger wrote:


There is of course an easy way round that problem. Design the car for
easy battery removal and get a battery transplant instead of a charge.

This of course is what was proposed for Zinc/air batteries in the
1960's. I haven't seen any other worthwhile low cost battery solutions
in the intervening years. Power electrics changes very slowly, I doubt
we'll see worthwhile electric vehicles in the next 25 years.


Power electronics has changed a LOT in te last 25 years actually.

The availability of low cost high power MOSFET for sitching has made it
far easier to regulate DC morors or use AC motrs from DC sources. The
adbvent of microprocessors has made it easy to use much more omplex
algorithms to control as well.

Lithium bareies have really only arrived in bulk post the cell phone and
laptop market, in the same way that Nickel technolpogy was driven by the
portable power tool market.

No one invests huge money in car batteries when there are no electric
cras. No one invets money in electric cars when there are no bartteries.

Stalemate.

HOWEVER ther are now batteries that ARE suitable for electric cars,
albeit in small sizes more suitable for laptops etc. Fast charging is
definitely possible - theaverage fast charge should take about 40
minutes if teh right gear is available, so battery removal and
replacement is not really necessary.

The thrust of my argument is that there is now very little standing in
the way of all this. The technology is not now 'unobtainable' or at the
other side of a massive development investment.

Electrc cars of this nature, not only COULD be built, they CAN be built
and one or two HAVE been built.

Even the use of small battery cells is possibly not such a disadvantage,
as I have been sndidering teh cots impliactions of self monitoring
arrays of cells, that could be isloated and exchanged as single cells,
this eliminating the need for total battery replacement. In practice,
yoy simply pull teh cells with te red lights on at teh srevice interval,
run some diagmostics, and charge the owner for e.g. 30 or 40 new cells.

Bearing in mind that apart from tyres and brakes, and maybe a bit of oil
here and there and hydraulic fluid, there are NO regular services needed
for this car at all....no oil flters, no air filters, no oil changes, no
new spark plugs, no transmission top ups...you are talking about a car
that should be able to do 100,000 miles between battery changes and
would probably need a 20,000 mile inspection for brake wear and general
lubrication.

This sort of car makes sense in EVERY respect. It solves every vehicle
problem except the final one. Where to get the electricity from. If
nuclear power were adopted, or massive windfarms the you could have a
totally carbon neutral transport infrastructure, and zero city and
mortorway pollution.

Everybody is tinkering with these cars - there are dozens of 'concept
cars' out there.

I suspect the first you may see in volume will be a Smart - its already
the right sort of size and shape, and equipping one with a battery will
not be hugely onerous.

This technology may be 25 years from de facto standard, but you will see
these in the showrooms in less than 5 years is my guess.


Frankly, i could use one rght now, ecven if it cots 20 grand, it wouild
save overall in a few years on servicing and fuel costs.

For once a very sensible post. Electric cars are feasible right now. There
are few problems with the Lith batteries that need further development, but
not that much. It's then a matter of manufacturing the batteries in
quality. Toyota, Ford and Honda are having problems getting suppliers to
deliver enough batteries for hybrids.

Currently, the problem is charging when away from a power point. That can
be offset by a freewheeling piston Stirling generator. The piston is the
only moving part. Once the charging setup is in place the Stirling's can be
dispensed of.

Also motor technology is still advancing. There are some claims of great
increases in efficiency, but they efficiency is still climbing the odd
percent here and there. Once electric cars come about en-mass focus will be
centred on battery and motor efficiency.

The technology is here right now, only a little refinement here and there
and we will all be driving 100% electric - at last. The smoothness and
quietness is terrific. My Prius is joy to drive when it is on full
electric.

MIniMee

























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The Natural Philosopher wrote:

new spark plugs, no transmission top ups...you are talking about a car
that should be able to do 100,000 miles between battery changes and

Sounds rather OTT IMO. You are lucky to get 500 recharge cycles out of
even the best Li-Ion batteries at the moment, Li-Polymer may be better
but its unlikly to be an order of magnitude - perhaps double. So if you
can do 300 mils per charge, and 1000 cycles per battery, you are talking
about 30K miles tops per set of cells.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Aproved charging sockets that print a receipt for charge delivered
(and upload this information and bill electronically), coupled with
onboard monitoring by the car that tracks the total charge used. Tee
two sets of records could be cross checked at MOT time (or failing
every time that you drive past a road side beacon) and the difference
charged to you.


FAR too complex.

I would suggest that some other form of taxation wold be introduced.

Massive road tax for example.

I was not putting that forward as a suggestion, more as a "there are
plenty of ways it could be done if they want".

Having said that, much of the technology that would support road side
comms to moving vehicles is already being rolled out (what is worse, I
built some of it!), and would be pre-existing by then anyway.


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

In article , Dr Evil
writes

For once a very sensible post. Electric cars are feasible right now. There
are few problems with the Lith batteries that need further development, but
not that much. It's then a matter of manufacturing the batteries in
quality. Toyota, Ford and Honda are having problems getting suppliers to
deliver enough batteries for hybrids.

Currently, the problem is charging when away from a power point. That can
be offset by a freewheeling piston Stirling generator. The piston is the
only moving part. Once the charging setup is in place the Stirling's can be
dispensed of.

Also motor technology is still advancing. There are some claims of great
increases in efficiency, but they efficiency is still climbing the odd
percent here and there. Once electric cars come about en-mass focus will be
centred on battery and motor efficiency.

The technology is here right now, only a little refinement here and there
and we will all be driving 100% electric - at last. The smoothness and
quietness is terrific. My Prius is joy to drive when it is on full
electric.

MIniMee

Look, John's agreeing with himself, it must be some sort of condition
--
David

In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Frankly, i could use one rght now, ecven if it cots 20 grand, it wouild
save overall in a few years on servicing and fuel costs.

See the other posts about fuel costs and tax.

--
*i souport publik edekashun.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"." wrote in message
...
In article , Dr Evil
writes

For once a very sensible post. Electric cars are feasible right now.
There
are few problems with the Lith batteries that need further development,
but
not that much. It's then a matter of manufacturing the batteries in
quality. Toyota, Ford and Honda are having problems getting suppliers to
deliver enough batteries for hybrids.

Currently, the problem is charging when away from a power point. That
can
be offset by a freewheeling piston Stirling generator. The piston is the
only moving part. Once the charging setup is in place the Stirling's can
be
dispensed of.

Also motor technology is still advancing. There are some claims of great
increases in efficiency, but they efficiency is still climbing the odd
percent here and there. Once electric cars come about en-mass focus will
be
centred on battery and motor efficiency.

The technology is here right now, only a little refinement here and there
and we will all be driving 100% electric - at last. The smoothness and
quietness is terrific. My Prius is joy to drive when it is on full
electric.

MIniMee

Look,

Bertie, I see yiu are active again. Sad but true.

MiniMee















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In article ,
Dr Evil wrote:
The technology is here right now, only a little refinement here and there
and we will all be driving 100% electric - at last. The smoothness and
quietness is terrific. My Prius is joy to drive when it is on full
electric.

Which is hardly ever. Suggesting you've never driven one, let alone own
one.

So we've got two claimed owners of the Prius on this group. Or has IMM
morphed once more?

--
*Never miss a good chance to shut up.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Dr Evil wrote:
The technology is here right now, only a little refinement here and
there
and we will all be driving 100% electric - at last. The smoothness and
quietness is terrific. My Prius is joy to drive when it is on full
electric.

Which is hardly ever. Suggesting you've never driven one, let alone own
one.

Richard, I have a Prius.

So we've got two claimed owners of the Prius on this group. Or has IMM
morphed once more?

Richard, I have gone over to the other side.

MiniMee

























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John Rumm wrote:

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

new spark plugs, no transmission top ups...you are talking about a car
that should be able to do 100,000 miles between battery changes and


Sounds rather OTT IMO. You are lucky to get 500 recharge cycles out of
even the best Li-Ion batteries at the moment, Li-Polymer may be better
but its unlikly to be an order of magnitude - perhaps double. So if you
can do 300 mils per charge, and 1000 cycles per battery, you are talking
about 30K miles tops per set of cells.


Check your maths. I made 300 cycles of 300 miles 90,000 miles.

Your figures give 300,000 miles.,

300 miles times 1000 cycles = three hundred times one thousand = three
hudred thousand...

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Dr Evil wrote:

The technology is here right now, only a little refinement here and there
and we will all be driving 100% electric - at last. The smoothness and
quietness is terrific. My Prius is joy to drive when it is on full
electric.


Which is hardly ever. Suggesting you've never driven one, let alone own
one.

So we've got two claimed owners of the Prius on this group. Or has IMM
morphed once more?

He's morphed, He's now doctor evil, presumably so he can escape killfiles.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Dr Evil wrote:

The technology is here right now, only a little refinement here and
there
and we will all be driving 100% electric - at last. The smoothness and
quietness is terrific. My Prius is joy to drive when it is on full
electric.


Which is hardly ever. Suggesting you've never driven one, let alone own
one.

So we've got two claimed owners of the Prius on this group. Or has IMM
morphed once more?

He's morphed, He's now doctor evil, presumably so he can escape killfiles.

Please put me on your killfile ASAP.


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In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:
He's morphed, He's now doctor evil, presumably so he can escape
killfiles.

So he's a doctor now. Degree obtained from the same place as his supposed
BSc? Where efficiency means just what he wants it to mean? ;-)

--
*I will always cherish the initial misconceptions I had about you

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
The Natural Philosopher wrote:

He's morphed, He's now doctor evil, presumably so he can escape
killfiles.


So he's a doctor now. Degree obtained from the same place as his supposed
BSc? Where efficiency means just what he wants it to mean? ;-)


There was a Doctor from Cheam.
Who invented a Wanking Machine
At the very fourth stroke
The ****ing thing broke
And pounded his balls to a cream.....

The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Check your maths. I made 300 cycles of 300 miles 90,000 miles.

Oops! errm, yes carry on nothing to see here....


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
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| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Power electronics has changed a LOT in te last 25 years actually.

I repeat, power electronics has changed very little in the past
25years. I hold patents on power motor drive systems from 1962, which
are still technologically valid today!! FETs are a very minor step in
the development of power switching devices. Only the pricing has really
changed. Microprocessor control replaces, in many cases the original
analogue system. A similar example is washing machine controls, which
were designed as solid state in the early 1960's and are still
mechanical switches in many cases today. Anyway, in terms of prolonging
the life of your car, I've never seen any substitute for changing the
oil regularly. Another example where there has been little real change
in 60 years!

Regards
Capitol

"Capitol" wrote in message
...


The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Power electronics has changed a LOT in te last 25 years actually.

I repeat, power electronics has changed very little in the past
25years. I hold patents on power motor drive systems from 1962, which
are still technologically valid today!! FETs are a very minor step in
the development of power switching devices. Only the pricing has really
changed. Microprocessor control replaces, in many cases the original
analogue system. A similar example is washing machine controls, which
were designed as solid state in the early 1960's and are still
mechanical switches in many cases today. Anyway, in terms of prolonging
the life of your car, I've never seen any substitute for changing the
oil regularly. Another example where there has been little real change
in 60 years!

There is no substitre for using the very best oil - fully synthetic, which
wasn't available for cars 60 years ago.



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"Dr Evil" wrote in message
...

"Capitol" wrote in message
...


The Natural Philosopher wrote:
Power electronics has changed a LOT in te last 25 years actually.

I repeat, power electronics has changed very little in the past
25years. I hold patents on power motor drive systems from 1962, which
are still technologically valid today!! FETs are a very minor step in
the development of power switching devices. Only the pricing has really
changed. Microprocessor control replaces, in many cases the original
analogue system. A similar example is washing machine controls, which
were designed as solid state in the early 1960's and are still
mechanical switches in many cases today. Anyway, in terms of prolonging
the life of your car, I've never seen any substitute for changing the
oil regularly. Another example where there has been little real change
in 60 years!

There is no substitre for using the very best oil - fully synthetic, which
wasn't available for cars 60 years ago.


And I'll say it again, Bollox.

Didn't this thread start with this ?....

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...

Battries are not 50% efficient - they are far better than that.

There are issues in the overall GENERATION and TRASMISSION efficiency,
but these are o worse, and, if you repalce carbon fulled generators with
wind or nuclear, the pollution aspect goes way down.

See:
http://greennature.com/article2298.html



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In article ,
Capitol wrote:
Anyway, in terms of prolonging the life of your car, I've never seen
any substitute for changing the oil regularly. Another example where
there has been little real change in 60 years!

Depends what you mean by regularly.

60 years ago, oil changes were at 1000 mile intervals, and the average
family car engine was clapped out at well under 50,000 miles.
Many cars now have 15,000 mile oil change intervals and engines outlast
the car - assuming things like cam belts etc don't break.

However, correct maintenance has always been the requirement for decent
life - of anything. But over frequent 'maintenance' can do more damage
than good.

--
*Two many clicks spoil the browse *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Dr Evil wrote:

The technology is here right now, only a little refinement here and there
and we will all be driving 100% electric - at last. The smoothness and
quietness is terrific. My Prius is joy to drive when it is on full
electric.


Which is hardly ever. Suggesting you've never driven one, let alone own
one.

So we've got two claimed owners of the Prius on this group. Or has IMM
morphed once more?

He's morphed, He's now doctor evil, presumably so he can escape killfiles.


He was back in mine as soon as he appeared under the latest guise

"John" wrote in message
...

"The Natural Philosopher" wrote in message
...
Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Dr Evil wrote:

The technology is here right now, only a little refinement here and
there
and we will all be driving 100% electric - at last. The smoothness and
quietness is terrific. My Prius is joy to drive when it is on full
electric.


Which is hardly ever. Suggesting you've never driven one, let alone own
one.

So we've got two claimed owners of the Prius on this group. Or has IMM
morphed once more?

He's morphed, He's now doctor evil, presumably so he can escape
killfiles.

He was back in mine as soon as he appeared under the latest guise

Make sure I stay there. I don't like incompetent people.


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"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Capitol wrote:
Anyway, in terms of prolonging the life of your car, I've never seen
any substitute for changing the oil regularly. Another example where
there has been little real change in 60 years!

However, correct maintenance has always been the requirement for decent
life - of anything. But over frequent 'maintenance' can do more damage
than good.

I have never read such garbage. Well these things you do read on the
Internet.


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In article ,
Dr Evil wrote:
I don't like incompetent people.

Self hate is sad.

--
*Those who live by the sword get shot by those who don't.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
In article ,
Dr Evil wrote:
I don't like incompetent people.

Self hate is sad.

Another witticism. Where do they come from? Duh!


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Capitol wrote:



The Natural Philosopher wrote:

Power electronics has changed a LOT in te last 25 years actually.


I repeat, power electronics has changed very little in the past
25years. I hold patents on power motor drive systems from 1962, which
are still technologically valid today!! FETs are a very minor step in
the development of power switching devices. Only the pricing has really
changed. Microprocessor control replaces, in many cases the original
analogue system. A similar example is washing machine controls, which
were designed as solid state in the early 1960's and are still
mechanical switches in many cases today. Anyway, in terms of prolonging
the life of your car, I've never seen any substitute for changing the
oil regularly. Another example where there has been little real change
in 60 years!

Regards
Capitol

Well there you are. Electronics basically hasn't changed, but the way we
use it has.

Lets agree that we agre on what's happened, but choose to describe it in
different ways.

I have been astounded to find that the analogue chips I used in the 80's
are in fact still in production today.

But if you say 'TTL' to anyone they either laugh, or think you are
referring to IP packets...

The one technology that has happened though, is that te power switching
FETS offer reliable fast switched mode voltage transformation - light
and cheap.,

That's one of the key elements of a DC car.

On Mon, 31 Jan 2005 00:49:53 -0000, a particular chimpanzee named
"Mike" randomly hit the keyboard and produced:

They do it with home produced bio-fuels for vehicle use. You have to send
them about 23p for every litre you make.

It's a good job then that these vehicles do 200 mpg ;-)
--
Hugo Nebula
"If no-one on the internet wants a piece of this,
just how far from the pack have you strayed?"