Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing
gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing
pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:

Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing
gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing
pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.

https://www.wickes.co.uk/Self-Cutting-Washing-Machine-Tap/p/420510

In message , at 14:24:13 on Thu, 29
Oct 2020, Andy Burns remarked:
Roland Perry wrote:

Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those
plumbing gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through,
existing pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.

https://www.wickes.co.uk/Self-Cutting-Washing-Machine-Tap/p/420510

Many thanks, that's exactly the thing. Now all I need to do is find the
Screwfix part number.

Hurrah!

https://www.screwfix.com/p/self-cutting-tap-15mm-
x/21250?_requestid=433159
--
Roland Perry

Roland Perry wrote:

https://www.screwfix.com/p/self-cutting-tap-15mm-
x/21250?_requestid=433159

usual mixture of 5* and 1* reviews

On 2020-10-29, Andy Burns wrote:

Roland Perry wrote:

Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing
gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing
pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.

https://www.wickes.co.uk/Self-Cutting-Washing-Machine-Tap/p/420510

How well do those work? Tqhey always struck me as risking a bad seal
or loose bits of pipe inside the pipe.

Adam Funk wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

https://www.wickes.co.uk/Self-Cutting-Washing-Machine-Tap/p/420510

How well do those work?

These look a better solution if you *need* to work on live pipes

https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro

Tqhey always struck me as risking a bad seal
or loose bits of pipe inside the pipe.

And the Alladin avoids that issue

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9JS...youtu.be&t=281

On Thu, 29 Oct 2020 16:41:40 +0000, Andy Burns wrote:

These look a better solution if you *need* to work on live pipes

https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro

That is for wusses.

'e

https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro

wot has a firing pin and does steel, over 1" too if needed.


Thomas Prufer

Thomas Prufer wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro

That is for wusses.
'e
https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro
wot has a firing pin and does steel, over 1" too if needed.

Copy/paste error?

On Thu, 29 Oct 2020 18:00:57 +0000, Andy Burns wrote:

Thomas Prufer wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro

That is for wusses.
'e
https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro
wot has a firing pin and does steel, over 1" too if needed.

Copy/paste error?

Yes!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67PqOrbrz0I

They are around 100 EUR for 3/4" and 1", 350‚¬ for 2" steel pipe cutter -- prices
off amazon.

Expensive, but can save a lot of work in some circumstances, I expect.


Thomas Prufer

On 29/10/2020 16:41, Andy Burns wrote:
Adam Funk wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

https://www.wickes.co.uk/Self-Cutting-Washing-Machine-Tap/p/420510

How well do those work?

These look a better solution if you *need* to work on live pipes

https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro

Tqhey always struck me as risking a bad seal
or loose bits of pipe inside the pipe.

And the Alladin avoids that issue

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9JS...youtu.be&t=281


But it's only an isolator - it doesn't provide the 'T' connection which
the OP needs.
--
Cheers,
Roger

On Thursday, 29 October 2020 at 14:15:14 UTC, Roland Perry wrote:
Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing
gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing
pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.
--
Roland Perry
Forget it - turn the water off while you work and use a compression tee type washmac valve. Clean the pipe well before fitting.

In message , at
00:00:05 on Fri, 30 Oct 2020, John J remarked:
On Thursday, 29 October 2020 at 14:15:14 UTC, Roland Perry wrote:
Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing
gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing
pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.

Forget it - turn the water off while you work and use a compression tee
type washmac valve. Clean the pipe well before fitting.

I'm going to be fitting it to the central heating plumbing (as a drain
cock), so the concept you imply of "turning the water off" doesn't
apply.

There's a special place in hell for plumbers who install a central
heating system without a drain cock.
--
Roland Perry

On Fri, 30 Oct 2020 00:00:05 -0700 (PDT), John J wrote:

On Thursday, 29 October 2020 at 14:15:14 UTC, Roland Perry wrote:
Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing
gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing
pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.
--
Roland Perry
Forget it - turn the water off while you work and use a compression tee type washmac valve. Clean the pipe well before fitting.

Yes, use a proper T - I replaced the cutter type with a T compression and
the flow and range from the hose pipe increased dramatically.
Rather than a washing machine valve I used a full-bore ball valve and also a
check valve. The ball valve has a T-handle for ease of use.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

Roger Mills wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9JS...youtu.be&t=281

But it's only an isolator - it doesn't provide the 'T' connection which
the OP needs.

Yes, you fit an isolator without interrupting all water, so then you can
fit a proper 3/4" compression tee W/M outlet, presumably the O/P has
some reason for avoiding turning off the supply?

grin, Try useless heap of **** tap system.

Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Roland Perry" wrote in message
...
Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing
gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing
pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.
--
Roland Perry

The only ones I've encountered on other peoples stuff tend to reduce the
flow in the main pipe and if a main supply drench the fitter during the
tightening up grin. Advice, do it on a warm summers day and put something
waterproof over anything damageable. Of course it could have been the
plumber at fault, not the tap...

Brian

--

This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please
Note this Signature is meaningless.!
"Adam Funk" wrote in message
...
On 2020-10-29, Andy Burns wrote:

Roland Perry wrote:

Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing
gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing
pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.

https://www.wickes.co.uk/Self-Cutting-Washing-Machine-Tap/p/420510

How well do those work? Tqhey always struck me as risking a bad seal
or loose bits of pipe inside the pipe.

On 29/10/2020 14:12, Roland Perry wrote:
Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing
gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing
pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.

'Emergency Plumber on Christmas Day Connectors'?

That's what happened to a former colleague, the punched-out copper disc
got jammed somewhere and they couldn't turn the water off. Mind you, it
was probably 35 years ago and they may have improved. The fittings, not
the family.

--
Cheers
Clive

On Friday, 30 October 2020 08:43:10 UTC, Roland Perry wrote:
I'm going to be fitting it to the central heating plumbing (as a drain
cock),

That may be vulnerable to sludge build-up especially as it should be fitted at the lowest point - you can get special Sludge Cocks.

https://www.wolseley.co.uk/product/s...ern-15-bronze/

There's a special place in hell for plumbers who install a central
heating system without a drain cock.

I've got little drain taps on each radiator between the rad and the lockshield, so each radiator can be drained individually.

Owain

In message , at
02:06:59 on Fri, 30 Oct 2020, remarked:
On Friday, 30 October 2020 08:43:10 UTC, Roland Perry wrote:
I'm going to be fitting it to the central heating plumbing (as a drain
cock),

That may be vulnerable to sludge build-up especially as it should be
fitted at the lowest point - you can get special Sludge Cocks.

https://www.wolseley.co.uk/product/s...ern-15-bronze/

There's a special place in hell for plumbers who install a central
heating system without a drain cock.

I've got little drain taps on each radiator between the rad and the
lockshield, so each radiator can be drained individually.

Good for you. If only any other plumbers did the same.
--
Roland Perry

On 2020-10-29, Andy Burns wrote:

Adam Funk wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

https://www.wickes.co.uk/Self-Cutting-Washing-Machine-Tap/p/420510

How well do those work?

These look a better solution if you *need* to work on live pipes

https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro

Tqhey always struck me as risking a bad seal
or loose bits of pipe inside the pipe.

And the Alladin avoids that issue

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=H9JS...youtu.be&t=281

That answers the question I had after watching the first one!

Thanks.

On 2020-10-29, Thomas Prufer wrote:

On Thu, 29 Oct 2020 18:00:57 +0000, Andy Burns wrote:

Thomas Prufer wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro

That is for wusses.
'e
https://youtu.be/Cl0ZGqhI9ro
wot has a firing pin and does steel, over 1" too if needed.

Copy/paste error?

Yes!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=67PqOrbrz0I

They are around 100 EUR for 3/4" and 1", 350‚¬ for 2" steel pipe cutter -- prices
off amazon.

Expensive, but can save a lot of work in some circumstances, I expect.

Interesting. I guess it's worth checking the pipe size carefully?
ISTR that pipe sizes in France (at least) are different from here.

On 30 Oct 2020 at 10:06:02 GMT, "Roland Perry" wrote:

In message , at
02:06:59 on Fri, 30 Oct 2020, remarked:
On Friday, 30 October 2020 08:43:10 UTC, Roland Perry wrote:
I'm going to be fitting it to the central heating plumbing (as a drain
cock),

That may be vulnerable to sludge build-up especially as it should be
fitted at the lowest point - you can get special Sludge Cocks.

https://www.wolseley.co.uk/product/s...ern-15-bronze/

There's a special place in hell for plumbers who install a central
heating system without a drain cock.

I've got little drain taps on each radiator between the rad and the
lockshield, so each radiator can be drained individually.

Good for you. If only any other plumbers did the same.

IME drain cocks are great if you never use them and never get them hot. In
either case they then persist in leaking.

--
Roger Hayter

In article ,
John J wrote:
On Thursday, 29 October 2020 at 14:15:14 UTC, Roland Perry wrote:
Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those
plumbing gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through,
existing pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.
-- Roland Perry
Forget it - turn the water off while you work and use a compression tee
type washmac valve. Clean the pipe well before fitting.

Why not an end feed? Cheaper and neater. And never leak later.

--
*Time flies like an arrow. Fruit flies like a banana.*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
There's a special place in hell for plumbers who install a central
heating system without a drain cock.

I put mine in the cellar - the lowest point. Then realised you very rarely
need to drain down the entire system completely. So fitted one to a rad
convenient for outside access. That drains the system down sufficiently
for most things.

--
*I'm pretty sure that sex is better than logic, but I can't prove it.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Roland Perry Wrote in message:
Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.-- Roland Perry

If you are fitting a drain valve to empty the whole system, then
this should be one that allows good flow.
That way there's a chance the water velocity will carry crud with it .
The "pipe cutter" types will not do this for you.
--


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

In message , at 11:02:41 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, "Dave Plowman (News)" remarked:
In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
There's a special place in hell for plumbers who install a central
heating system without a drain cock.

I put mine in the cellar - the lowest point. Then realised you very rarely
need to drain down the entire system completely. So fitted one to a rad
convenient for outside access. That drains the system down sufficiently
for most things.

Yes, I'm putting my new one about a foot from the back door.
--
Roland Perry

In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 11:02:41 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, "Dave Plowman (News)" remarked:
In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
There's a special place in hell for plumbers who install a central
heating system without a drain cock.

I put mine in the cellar - the lowest point. Then realised you very rarely
need to drain down the entire system completely. So fitted one to a rad
convenient for outside access. That drains the system down sufficiently
for most things.

Yes, I'm putting my new one about a foot from the back door.

Assuming you have a rad in that room, why not a combination gate
valve/drain point. With some hose to get it outside.

--
*War does not determine who is right - only who is left.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In message , at 11:46:26 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, thescullster remarked:
Roland Perry Wrote in message:

Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those
plumbing gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through,
existing pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.--
Roland Perry

If you are fitting a drain valve to empty the whole system, then
this should be one that allows good flow.
That way there's a chance the water velocity will carry crud with it .
The "pipe cutter" types will not do this for you.

I'm using the pipe-cutter valve to empty the system, so that I can put a
more conventional bleed-valve elsewhere.
--
Roland Perry

In message , at 13:31:27 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, "Dave Plowman (News)" remarked:
In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 11:02:41 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, "Dave Plowman (News)" remarked:
In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
There's a special place in hell for plumbers who install a central
heating system without a drain cock.

I put mine in the cellar - the lowest point. Then realised you very rarely
need to drain down the entire system completely. So fitted one to a rad
convenient for outside access. That drains the system down sufficiently
for most things.

Yes, I'm putting my new one about a foot from the back door.

Assuming you have a rad in that room, why not a combination gate
valve/drain point. With some hose to get it outside.

Yes, that's the plan; but first I have to drain the rest of the system.
--
Roland Perry

On Fri, 30 Oct 2020 13:31:27 +0000 (GMT), Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 11:02:41 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, "Dave Plowman (News)" remarked:
In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
There's a special place in hell for plumbers who install a central
heating system without a drain cock.

I put mine in the cellar - the lowest point. Then realised you very rarely
need to drain down the entire system completely. So fitted one to a rad
convenient for outside access. That drains the system down sufficiently
for most things.

Yes, I'm putting my new one about a foot from the back door.

Assuming you have a rad in that room, why not a combination gate
valve/drain point. With some hose to get it outside.

Not sure that I'd want to use a gate valve anywhere, judging by their
'performance' on open systems. Had more fail to work than have worked.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

In article ,
PeterC wrote:
Assuming you have a rad in that room, why not a combination gate
valve/drain point. With some hose to get it outside.

Not sure that I'd want to use a gate valve anywhere, judging by their
'performance' on open systems. Had more fail to work than have worked.

The gate valve on a rad is only to balance the flow. Works fine for that.
Although some these days are the same valve as you get with the TRV.

--
Small asylum seeker wanted as mud flap, must be flexible and willing to travel

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Roland Perry Wrote in message:
In message , at 11:46:26 on Fri, 30 Oct 2020, thescullster remarked:Roland Perry Wrote in message: Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.-- Roland PerryIf you are fitting a drain valve to empty the whole system, then this should be one that allows good flow.That way there's a chance the water velocity will carry crud with it .The "pipe cutter" types will not do this for you.I'm using the pipe-cutter valve to empty the system, so that I can put a more conventional bleed-valve elsewhere.-- Roland Perry

As has been mentioned the "proper" one that you fit should be at
the lowest point on the system so that you can empty ground floor
mains if necessary.

Phil
--


----Android NewsGroup Reader----
http://usenet.sinaapp.com/

In message , at 21:11:37 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, thescullster remarked:
Roland Perry Wrote in message:
In message , at 11:46:26 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, thescullster remarked:Roland Perry
Wrote in message: Struggling to find the
keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing gadgets which
clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing pipework to
attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.-- Roland PerryIf
you are fitting a drain valve to empty the whole system, then this
should be one that allows good flow.That way there's a chance the
water velocity will carry crud with it .The "pipe cutter" types will
not do this for you.I'm using the pipe-cutter valve to empty the
system, so that I can put a more conventional bleed-valve elsewhere.-- Roland Perry

As has been mentioned the "proper" one that you fit should be at
the lowest point on the system so that you can empty ground floor
mains if necessary.

Yes, that's the plan; although strictly speaking the lowest point is
under the floor, so the best I can do is just above that.
--
Roland Perry

On Fri, 30 Oct 2020 18:56:25 +0000 (GMT), Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
PeterC wrote:
Assuming you have a rad in that room, why not a combination gate
valve/drain point. With some hose to get it outside.

Not sure that I'd want to use a gate valve anywhere, judging by their
'performance' on open systems. Had more fail to work than have worked.

The gate valve on a rad is only to balance the flow. Works fine for that.
Although some these days are the same valve as you get with the TRV.

Not so critical then, also any additive in the system should keep it
working.
--
Peter.
The gods will stay away
whilst religions hold sway

In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 21:11:37 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, thescullster remarked:
Roland Perry Wrote in message:
In message , at 11:46:26 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, thescullster remarked:Roland Perry
Wrote in message: Struggling to find the
keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing gadgets which
clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing pipework to
attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.-- Roland PerryIf
you are fitting a drain valve to empty the whole system, then this
should be one that allows good flow.That way there's a chance the
water velocity will carry crud with it .The "pipe cutter" types will
not do this for you.I'm using the pipe-cutter valve to empty the
system, so that I can put a more conventional bleed-valve elsewhere.-- Roland Perry

As has been mentioned the "proper" one that you fit should be at
the lowest point on the system so that you can empty ground floor
mains if necessary.

Yes, that's the plan; although strictly speaking the lowest point is
under the floor, so the best I can do is just above that.

In practice, you rarely need to drain down to the last drop. Just low
enough to allow the removal of radiators for decorating etc. The boiler
and bits are usually higher than the lowest rad too.

--
*Learn from your parents' mistakes - use birth control.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In message , at 11:18:26 on Sat, 31 Oct
2020, "Dave Plowman (News)" remarked:
In article ,
Roland Perry wrote:
In message , at 21:11:37 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, thescullster remarked:
Roland Perry Wrote in message:
In message , at 11:46:26 on Fri, 30 Oct
2020, thescullster remarked:Roland Perry
Wrote in message: Struggling to find the
keywords to guide me to buy online those plumbing gadgets which
clamp on the outside of, and pierce through, existing pipework to
attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.-- Roland PerryIf
you are fitting a drain valve to empty the whole system, then this
should be one that allows good flow.That way there's a chance the
water velocity will carry crud with it .The "pipe cutter" types will
not do this for you.I'm using the pipe-cutter valve to empty the
system, so that I can put a more conventional bleed-valve
elsewhere.-- Roland Perry

As has been mentioned the "proper" one that you fit should be at
the lowest point on the system so that you can empty ground floor
mains if necessary.

Yes, that's the plan; although strictly speaking the lowest point is
under the floor, so the best I can do is just above that.

In practice, you rarely need to drain down to the last drop. Just low
enough to allow the removal of radiators for decorating etc. The boiler
and bits are usually higher than the lowest rad too.

Yes, my boiler's upstairs. And I have no rads in the attic (you may
laugh, but a loft conversion I did 15yrs ago was supposed to, however
the builder chickened out and we had to use electric [oil filled] ones
instead).

What left a bad taste in the mouth was he initially didn't allow
anything off the bill for failing to do the wet plumbing and supply of
rads, but charged "extra" for fitting the electric ones, which I had
incidentally free issued to him.

Grade A plonker!
--
Roland Perry

In message , at 14:12:47 on Thu, 29 Oct 2020,
Roland Perry remarked:
Struggling to find the keywords to guide me to buy online those
plumbing gadgets which clamp on the outside of, and pierce through,
existing pipework to attach a dishwasher feed or something similar.

Thanks for all the comments. Although it wasn't what I was originally
asking for, I've subsequently found (the more expensive):

https://www.screwfix.com/p/self-cutting-drain-cock-type-a-15mm/9543r

Reviews a bit mixed, to say the least.

However, that was after I'd bought and used the dishwasher tap to do a
one-off emptying, and fitted a conventional drain cock.

So I now have a spare dishwasher tap; maybe it'll come in handy if I
feel the urge to fit more drain cocks in the future.
--
Roland Perry