Am attempting to map out a pretty simple through hole PCB. It's the
central locking controller for late Rover SD1, and the complete unit NLA
as NOS. Made by Kiekert. Basically, two standard micro switches, a SPST
relay, and this timer PCB. The idea being to write a repair article for
the car club mag.

The PCB is potted in a blue material. Soft, and does cut off quite easily.
I'd guess something like PVC. But not sure. Removing it where it has
moulded round the components, a bit more tricky with a knife.

Anyone know of a solvent that would make it easy to remove - without
damage to any of the components or markings on them?

--
*It sounds like English, but I can't understand a word you're saying.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) laid this down on his screen :
Am attempting to map out a pretty simple through hole PCB. It's the
central locking controller for late Rover SD1, and the complete unit NLA
as NOS. Made by Kiekert. Basically, two standard micro switches, a SPST
relay, and this timer PCB. The idea being to write a repair article for
the car club mag.

The PCB is potted in a blue material. Soft, and does cut off quite easily.
I'd guess something like PVC. But not sure. Removing it where it has
moulded round the components, a bit more tricky with a knife.

Anyone know of a solvent that would make it easy to remove - without
damage to any of the components or markings on them?

Probably silicone, try WD40.

On Fri, 03 Jul 2020 14:07:45 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

Am attempting to map out a pretty simple through hole PCB. It's the
central locking controller for late Rover SD1, and the complete unit NLA
as NOS. Made by Kiekert. Basically, two standard micro switches, a SPST
relay, and this timer PCB. The idea being to write a repair article for
the car club mag.

The PCB is potted in a blue material. Soft, and does cut off quite easily.
I'd guess something like PVC. But not sure. Removing it where it has
moulded round the components, a bit more tricky with a knife.

Anyone know of a solvent that would make it easy to remove - without
damage to any of the components or markings on them?

When I was in commercial third party repair, a lot of potted circuits
could be cleared and cleaned with Nitromoors.

A lot of care was needed as some of the components were not totally
immune, so selective washing and scraping was still required.

Nitromoors might be more component friendly now, maybe more potting
compound friendly too :-(

AB

From the well pummelled keyboard of Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq

On 03/07/2020 14:55, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq wrote:
On Fri, 03 Jul 2020 14:07:45 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

Am attempting to map out a pretty simple through hole PCB. It's the
central locking controller for late Rover SD1, and the complete unit NLA
as NOS. Made by Kiekert. Basically, two standard micro switches, a SPST
relay, and this timer PCB. The idea being to write a repair article for
the car club mag.

The PCB is potted in a blue material. Soft, and does cut off quite easily.
I'd guess something like PVC. But not sure. Removing it where it has
moulded round the components, a bit more tricky with a knife.

Anyone know of a solvent that would make it easy to remove - without
damage to any of the components or markings on them?

When I was in commercial third party repair, a lot of potted circuits
could be cleared and cleaned with Nitromoors.

A lot of care was needed as some of the components were not totally
immune, so selective washing and scraping was still required.

Nitromoors might be more component friendly now, maybe more potting
compound friendly too :-(

AB

From the well pummelled keyboard of Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq


Nitromors no longer contains Methylene Chloride though, thanks to the
EU.

Have you tried it for de-potting since 2016 when it was reformulated ?

In article ,
Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Dave Plowman (News) laid this down on his screen :
Am attempting to map out a pretty simple through hole PCB. It's the
central locking controller for late Rover SD1, and the complete unit NLA
as NOS. Made by Kiekert. Basically, two standard micro switches, a SPST
relay, and this timer PCB. The idea being to write a repair article for
the car club mag.

The PCB is potted in a blue material. Soft, and does cut off quite easily.
I'd guess something like PVC. But not sure. Removing it where it has
moulded round the components, a bit more tricky with a knife.

Anyone know of a solvent that would make it easy to remove - without
damage to any of the components or markings on them?

Probably silicone, try WD40.

Yes - it could be silicone. Did try WD40 - perhaps it needs to be left
longer.

--
*The beatings will continue until morale improves *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Fri, 3 Jul 2020 16:03:49 +0100, Andrew
wrote:


Nitromors no longer contains Methylene Chloride though, thanks to the
EU.

Damn, you beat me to it.

On 03/07/2020 16:03:49, Andrew wrote:
On 03/07/2020 14:55, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq wrote:
On Fri, 03 Jul 2020 14:07:45 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

Am attempting to map out a pretty simple through hole PCB. It's the
central locking controller for late Rover SD1, and the complete unit NLA
as NOS. Made by Kiekert. Basically, two standard micro switches, a SPST
relay, and this timer PCB. The idea being to write a repair article for
the car club mag.

The PCB is potted in a blue material. Soft, and does cut off quite
easily.
I'd guess something like PVC. But not sure. Removing it where it has
moulded round the components, a bit more tricky with a knife.

Anyone know of a solvent that would make it easy to remove - without
damage to any of the components or markings on them?

When I was in commercial third party repair, a lot of potted circuits
could be cleared and cleaned with Nitromoors.

A lot of care was needed as some of the components were not totally
immune, so selective washing and scraping was still required.

Nitromoors might be more component friendly now, maybe more potting
compound friendly too :-(

AB

Â*From the well pummelled keyboard of Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq


Nitromors no longer contains Methylene Chloride though, thanks to the
EU.

Have you tried it for de-potting since 2016 when it was reformulated ?

It's trivial to buy the stuff separately if you really have the need.
You can always mix it back in if you're so inclined.

On 03/07/2020 14:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Am attempting to map out a pretty simple through hole PCB. It's the
central locking controller for late Rover SD1, and the complete unit NLA
as NOS. Made by Kiekert. Basically, two standard micro switches, a SPST
relay, and this timer PCB. The idea being to write a repair article for
the car club mag.

The PCB is potted in a blue material. Soft, and does cut off quite easily.
I'd guess something like PVC. But not sure. Removing it where it has
moulded round the components, a bit more tricky with a knife.

Anyone know of a solvent that would make it easy to remove - without
damage to any of the components or markings on them?



If you have a small piece already cut off, does it melt or soften with a
hot air gun?

--
mailto : news {at} admac {dot} myzen {dot} co {dot} uk

On Fri, 3 Jul 2020 16:03:49 +0100, Andrew
wrote:

On 03/07/2020 14:55, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq wrote:
On Fri, 03 Jul 2020 14:07:45 +0100, "Dave Plowman (News)"
wrote:

Am attempting to map out a pretty simple through hole PCB. It's the
central locking controller for late Rover SD1, and the complete unit NLA
as NOS. Made by Kiekert. Basically, two standard micro switches, a SPST
relay, and this timer PCB. The idea being to write a repair article for
the car club mag.

The PCB is potted in a blue material. Soft, and does cut off quite easily.
I'd guess something like PVC. But not sure. Removing it where it has
moulded round the components, a bit more tricky with a knife.

Anyone know of a solvent that would make it easy to remove - without
damage to any of the components or markings on them?

When I was in commercial third party repair, a lot of potted circuits
could be cleared and cleaned with Nitromoors.

A lot of care was needed as some of the components were not totally
immune, so selective washing and scraping was still required.

Nitromoors might be more component friendly now, maybe more potting
compound friendly too :-(

AB

From the well pummelled keyboard of Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq


Nitromors no longer contains Methylene Chloride though, thanks to the
EU.

Have you tried it for de-potting since 2016 when it was reformulated ?

No, I suspected it may be the case that it was tamed a little, hence
my cautionary final sentence.

I have been out of third party repair for thirty years BTW.

Nitromors was doomed from the time that idiot in the papers a few
years back thought it was a good joke to cover her partners face in it
while in a drunken sleep.

Darwin triumphed once again!

AB


From the well pummelled keyboard of Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq

On Fri, 3 Jul 2020 16:03:49 +0100, Andrew
wrote:

snip

Nitromors no longer contains Methylene Chloride though, thanks to the
EU.

Let me re write that for you:

'Thanks to the EU banning it for general sale in paint strippers in
2011, Nitromors no longer contains the carcinogen and otherwise
dangerous chemical, Methylene Chloride (although Member State
authorities can derogate from this restriction allowing, subject to
conditions, continued supply to, and use by competent professional
users in their territories).'

If we let stupid people vote, then we also have to stop them killing
themselves by using Methylene Chloride / DCM indoors.

Cheers, T i m

On 03/07/2020 14:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Am attempting to map out a pretty simple through hole PCB. It's the
central locking controller for late Rover SD1, and the complete unit NLA
as NOS. Made by Kiekert. Basically, two standard micro switches, a SPST
relay, and this timer PCB. The idea being to write a repair article for
the car club mag.

The PCB is potted in a blue material. Soft, and does cut off quite easily.
I'd guess something like PVC. But not sure. Removing it where it has
moulded round the components, a bit more tricky with a knife.

Anyone know of a solvent that would make it easy to remove - without
damage to any of the components or markings on them?


Very likely it's polyurethane resin or PUR...

https://uk.farnell.com/electrolube/u...ethane%20resin

This is supposed to remove it, to some extent...

https://uk.farnell.com/electrolube/r...-5l/dp/2786026


--
Cheers
Clive

On Fri, 03 Jul 2020 18:19:40 +0100, T i m wrote:

On Fri, 3 Jul 2020 16:03:49 +0100, Andrew
wrote:

snip

Nitromors no longer contains Methylene Chloride though, thanks to the
EU.

Let me re write that for you:

'Thanks to the EU banning it for general sale in paint strippers in
2011, Nitromors no longer contains the carcinogen and otherwise
dangerous chemical, Methylene Chloride (although Member State
authorities can derogate from this restriction allowing, subject to
conditions, continued supply to, and use by competent professional
users in their territories).'

If we let stupid people vote, then we also have to stop them killing
themselves by using Methylene Chloride / DCM indoors.

Cheers, T i m

I thought this when the statement cropped up. I didn't even bother to
comment!


I did actually point out to the lesser able of this NG some time ago
that it was not difficult to buy the 2kW vacuums, the sodium chlorate
and all the other garbage they seem to think has been snatched from
their mitts by the EU.

Strangely enough, they didn't even ask where they could go for all
these desireable goodies that they are willing to screw the UK in
order to own.

I am reminded of Trumps morons demanding the freedom to go shopping
and have haircuts yet having no qualms about spreading the infection
and killing their fellow citizens to do it.

Same stupidity, same outcome.

America is finding the truth faster than the Brexit mob though.

AB
From the well pummelled keyboard of Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq

In article ,
Clive Arthur wrote:
On 03/07/2020 14:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Am attempting to map out a pretty simple through hole PCB. It's the
central locking controller for late Rover SD1, and the complete unit NLA
as NOS. Made by Kiekert. Basically, two standard micro switches, a SPST
relay, and this timer PCB. The idea being to write a repair article for
the car club mag.

The PCB is potted in a blue material. Soft, and does cut off quite easily.
I'd guess something like PVC. But not sure. Removing it where it has
moulded round the components, a bit more tricky with a knife.

Anyone know of a solvent that would make it easy to remove - without
damage to any of the components or markings on them?


Very likely it's polyurethane resin or PUR...

That sounds a bit modern for a 40 year old part. ;-)

https://uk.farnell.com/electrolube/u...ethane%20resin

This is supposed to remove it, to some extent...

https://uk.farnell.com/electrolube/r...-5l/dp/2786026

--
*I like cats, too. Let's exchange recipes.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Fri, 03 Jul 2020 20:24:35 +0100, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq
wrote:

snip

'Thanks to the EU banning it for general sale in paint strippers in
2011, Nitromors no longer contains the carcinogen and otherwise
dangerous chemical, Methylene Chloride (although Member State
authorities can derogate from this restriction allowing, subject to
conditions, continued supply to, and use by competent professional
users in their territories).'

If we let stupid people vote, then we also have to stop them killing
themselves by using Methylene Chloride / DCM indoors.

I thought this when the statement cropped up. I didn't even bother to
comment!

Nope, it's not worth it most times, they (the anti EU fanatics) aren't
interested in facts and good sense and most of the rest know who they
are and just ignore them.

I did actually point out to the lesser able of this NG some time ago
that it was not difficult to buy the 2kW vacuums, the sodium chlorate
and all the other garbage they seem to think has been snatched from
their mitts by the EU.

Of course. Most of what they cite as being down the EU bogyman (that
they (alone) seem petrified of) is only partially true.

Strangely enough, they didn't even ask where they could go for all
these desireable goodies that they are willing to screw the UK in
order to own.

Nope, why would they, that would show their cause for the fools errand
it has always been (with the total absence of any evidence otherwise).

I am reminded of Trumps morons demanding the freedom to go shopping
and have haircuts yet having no qualms about spreading the infection
and killing their fellow citizens to do it.

Yup, and him going to a fireworks display, with no mask or social
distancing and allowing everone else to do the same. It's as if he
doesn't care about the socially deprived, ethnic minorities and
elderly (the most vulnerable groups)? ;-(

Same stupidity, same outcome.

Quite.

America is finding the truth faster than the Brexit mob though.

I'm afraid this is when 'The cause' (Black Lives Matter, 4Th July etc)
are more important than common sense, like either aren't going to be
around again? It really should be 'live to fight / celebrate another
day', not 'fools rush in ...'.

Wind people up with bogus promises, the classic fanatic Brexiteer
'everything will be ok' bs and these days it seems some really can't
see though it to the reality. I guess when the red mist falls ... ;-(

Cheers, T i m

p.s. As an aside on the subject of staying safe, daughter just went
past our local cafe and noticed the staff (one is from Latvia and she
is brilliant / extra friendly) were struggling without much in the way
of PPE etc. She offered them more visors FOC so I've currently got the
3D printer going, knocking out a batch of visor frames and daughter
has the remains of the pack of acrylic sheets and the 4 hole punch to
finish them. We hope to get them to them tomorrow. ;-)

I did 40 for the Isabel Hospice and 10 for the local doctors surgery.
;-)

On Sat, 04 Jul 2020 13:09:51 +0100, T i m wrote:

On Fri, 03 Jul 2020 20:24:35 +0100, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq
wrote:

snip

'Thanks to the EU banning it for general sale in paint strippers in
2011, Nitromors no longer contains the carcinogen and otherwise
dangerous chemical, Methylene Chloride (although Member State
authorities can derogate from this restriction allowing, subject to
conditions, continued supply to, and use by competent professional
users in their territories).'

If we let stupid people vote, then we also have to stop them killing
themselves by using Methylene Chloride / DCM indoors.

I thought this when the statement cropped up. I didn't even bother to
comment!

Nope, it's not worth it most times, they (the anti EU fanatics) aren't
interested in facts and good sense and most of the rest know who they
are and just ignore them.

I did actually point out to the lesser able of this NG some time ago
that it was not difficult to buy the 2kW vacuums, the sodium chlorate
and all the other garbage they seem to think has been snatched from
their mitts by the EU.

Of course. Most of what they cite as being down the EU bogyman (that
they (alone) seem petrified of) is only partially true.

Strangely enough, they didn't even ask where they could go for all
these desireable goodies that they are willing to screw the UK in
order to own.

Nope, why would they, that would show their cause for the fools errand
it has always been (with the total absence of any evidence otherwise).

I am reminded of Trumps morons demanding the freedom to go shopping
and have haircuts yet having no qualms about spreading the infection
and killing their fellow citizens to do it.

Yup, and him going to a fireworks display, with no mask or social
distancing and allowing everone else to do the same. It's as if he
doesn't care about the socially deprived, ethnic minorities and
elderly (the most vulnerable groups)? ;-(

Same stupidity, same outcome.

Quite.

America is finding the truth faster than the Brexit mob though.

I'm afraid this is when 'The cause' (Black Lives Matter, 4Th July etc)
are more important than common sense, like either aren't going to be
around again? It really should be 'live to fight / celebrate another
day', not 'fools rush in ...'.

Wind people up with bogus promises, the classic fanatic Brexiteer
'everything will be ok' bs and these days it seems some really can't
see though it to the reality. I guess when the red mist falls ... ;-(

Cheers, T i m

p.s. As an aside on the subject of staying safe, daughter just went
past our local cafe and noticed the staff (one is from Latvia and she
is brilliant / extra friendly) were struggling without much in the way
of PPE etc. She offered them more visors FOC so I've currently got the
3D printer going, knocking out a batch of visor frames and daughter
has the remains of the pack of acrylic sheets and the 4 hole punch to
finish them. We hope to get them to them tomorrow. ;-)

I did 40 for the Isabel Hospice and 10 for the local doctors surgery.
;-)

Well done!

I guess your actions are almost as beneficial to the UK as waving a
union jack and bellowing like an insane moron at a pro Brexit rally
:-)


AB
From the well pummelled keyboard of Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq

On 04/07/2020 12:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Clive Arthur wrote:

snipped

Very likely it's polyurethane resin or PUR...

That sounds a bit modern for a 40 year old part. ;-)

I remember using it - light blue two part mix stuff from RS - probably
38 years ago.

--
Cheers
Clive

On 03/07/2020 14:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
for late Rover SD1

Good man. I had an SD1 V8 on a V-plate. Great when working but not the
world's most reliable car. It was always the minor stuff that failed.
Mine had a long term oil leak resulting in the base of the car being
continuously rust proofed. Floor and sills was in perfect condition but
the arches and door bottoms decayed in front your eyes. It did about
175k miles before the engine started making expensive noises such that
it was cheaper to put a 50k mile lump out of a rear-end collision in it.

Is the potting similar to what is used around the window motors? All
four of mine eventually failed. The potting compound was not 100%
impervious and if you didn't use the windows all the time, the motors
eventually seized. It was a bugger to cut off but you just needed to
get enough off that you get some WD40 the lubricant in to free off the
motor and gears etc. I did all four and never resealed. I took the door
cards off every 6months and squirted WD40 in to lube them up.

From memory there was a capacitor that was charged up, took a few
seconds, that was used to drive all the door solenoids. Simple way of
limiting the current and hence dissipation in the locking solendoids.

In article ,
mm0fmf wrote:
On 03/07/2020 14:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
for late Rover SD1

Good man. I had an SD1 V8 on a V-plate. Great when working but not the
world's most reliable car. It was always the minor stuff that failed.
Mine had a long term oil leak resulting in the base of the car being
continuously rust proofed. Floor and sills was in perfect condition but
the arches and door bottoms decayed in front your eyes. It did about
175k miles before the engine started making expensive noises such that
it was cheaper to put a 50k mile lump out of a rear-end collision in it.

Mine is over 200,000 and still going strong. Has had a cam change, though.

Is the potting similar to what is used around the window motors? All
four of mine eventually failed. The potting compound was not 100%
impervious and if you didn't use the windows all the time, the motors
eventually seized. It was a bugger to cut off but you just needed to
get enough off that you get some WD40 the lubricant in to free off the
motor and gears etc. I did all four and never resealed. I took the door
cards off every 6months and squirted WD40 in to lube them up.

Oddly, the motors themselves seem pretty reliable. But not sure if yours,
being an S1 had the same as the S2. The control for the window motors was
very different on S2 cars.

From memory there was a capacitor that was charged up, took a few
seconds, that was used to drive all the door solenoids. Simple way of
limiting the current and hence dissipation in the locking solendoids.

Again, that was the early central locking. Later cars used motors rather
than solenoids. In some ways a retrograde step, as there was no motor in
the drivers door. That's where the controller is. Making remote locking
impossible without modification. Mine is totally non standard with newer
more powerful motors, my own design controller, and remote locking.

--
*Growing old is inevitable, growing up is optional

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 05/07/2020 00:30, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
mm0fmf wrote:
On 03/07/2020 14:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
for late Rover SD1

Good man. I had an SD1 V8 on a V-plate. Great when working but not the
world's most reliable car. It was always the minor stuff that failed.
Mine had a long term oil leak resulting in the base of the car being
continuously rust proofed. Floor and sills was in perfect condition but
the arches and door bottoms decayed in front your eyes. It did about
175k miles before the engine started making expensive noises such that
it was cheaper to put a 50k mile lump out of a rear-end collision in it.

Mine is over 200,000 and still going strong. Has had a cam change, though.

Is the potting similar to what is used around the window motors? All
four of mine eventually failed. The potting compound was not 100%
impervious and if you didn't use the windows all the time, the motors
eventually seized. It was a bugger to cut off but you just needed to
get enough off that you get some WD40 the lubricant in to free off the
motor and gears etc. I did all four and never resealed. I took the door
cards off every 6months and squirted WD40 in to lube them up.

Oddly, the motors themselves seem pretty reliable. But not sure if yours,
being an S1 had the same as the S2. The control for the window motors was
very different on S2 cars.

From memory there was a capacitor that was charged up, took a few
seconds, that was used to drive all the door solenoids. Simple way of
limiting the current and hence dissipation in the locking solendoids.

Again, that was the early central locking. Later cars used motors rather
than solenoids. In some ways a retrograde step, as there was no motor in
the drivers door. That's where the controller is. Making remote locking
impossible without modification. Mine is totally non standard with newer
more powerful motors, my own design controller, and remote locking.

Ah, sounds like they did plenty of improvements on these items. If I had
somewhere to keep one I'd love another. Mine was an amazing
mile-muncher and was effortless to drive.

In article ,
mm0fmf wrote:
Again, that was the early central locking. Later cars used motors
rather than solenoids. In some ways a retrograde step, as there was no
motor in the drivers door. That's where the controller is. Making
remote locking impossible without modification. Mine is totally non
standard with newer more powerful motors, my own design controller,
and remote locking.

Ah, sounds like they did plenty of improvements on these items. If I had
somewhere to keep one I'd love another. Mine was an amazing
mile-muncher and was effortless to drive.

I'd guess the later Kiekert CL was cheaper. The early system could be
locked/unlocked from either front door and even with a button inside the
car. The Kiekert only from the driver's door. And the motors - especially
for the rear doors which have a longer linkage - a bit marginal power
wise.

But it's still a nice car to drive, and mine has the injection engine, so
still quite quick. And at least you can always find it in a car park. ;-)

--
*It's a thankless job, but I've got a lot of Karma to burn off

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sat, 04 Jul 2020 13:14:23 +0100, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq
wrote:

snip

p.s. As an aside on the subject of staying safe, daughter just went
past our local cafe and noticed the staff (one is from Latvia and she
is brilliant / extra friendly) were struggling without much in the way
of PPE etc. She offered them more visors FOC so I've currently got the
3D printer going, knocking out a batch of visor frames and daughter
has the remains of the pack of acrylic sheets and the 4 hole punch to
finish them. We hope to get them to them tomorrow. ;-)

I did 40 for the Isabel Hospice and 10 for the local doctors surgery.
;-)

Well done!

I guess your actions are almost as beneficial to the UK as waving a
union jack and bellowing like an insane moron at a pro Brexit rally
:-)

Well, hopefully a bit more beneficial than that. Well, except the
chances are the recent batch for the care (than now seems to be two
batches for two cafes) may be protecting the health / lives of the
'foreigners' who work there so I doubt that would appreciated by some
of the fanatical Brexiteers. ;-(

Well, until they wanted their 'Full English' breakfast that is (made
from Danish bacon, Dutch tomatoes, French potatoes and Polish
mushrooms, with only the eggs likely to come from the UK).

Cheers, T i m

On Sun, 05 Jul 2020 12:20:40 +0100, T i m wrote:

On Sat, 04 Jul 2020 13:14:23 +0100, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq
wrote:

snip

p.s. As an aside on the subject of staying safe, daughter just went
past our local cafe and noticed the staff (one is from Latvia and she
is brilliant / extra friendly) were struggling without much in the way
of PPE etc. She offered them more visors FOC so I've currently got the
3D printer going, knocking out a batch of visor frames and daughter
has the remains of the pack of acrylic sheets and the 4 hole punch to
finish them. We hope to get them to them tomorrow. ;-)

I did 40 for the Isabel Hospice and 10 for the local doctors surgery.
;-)

Well done!

I guess your actions are almost as beneficial to the UK as waving a
union jack and bellowing like an insane moron at a pro Brexit rally
:-)

Well, hopefully a bit more beneficial than that. Well, except the
chances are the recent batch for the care (than now seems to be two
batches for two cafes) may be protecting the health / lives of the
'foreigners' who work there so I doubt that would appreciated by some
of the fanatical Brexiteers. ;-(

Well, until they wanted their 'Full English' breakfast that is (made
from Danish bacon, Dutch tomatoes, French potatoes and Polish
mushrooms, with only the eggs likely to come from the UK).

Cheers, T i m

Aah! The wonderful thing about blind nationalistic patriotism is that
all the subtleties are superfluous. It boils down to flagwavers and
those" evil" bunch that are not on board.

An amazing approach, well recognised and taken full advantage of by
those that are not quite so nationalistic and move their rescourses
from tax haven to country at the drop of a hat.


I read a very interesting book recently on the production of Zyklon by
the Americans and Germans running up to WW2.

It struck me as to how amazing it is that as the troops are being
urged to sacrifice all for the sake of their country, the
industrialists on both sides are creaming cash off right left and
center.

The other thing I learned was that Adolf got his ideas for eugenics
from the US and Britain.

The con using the patriotic nationality approach has Trump and Brexit
summed up nicely. It rarely fails though :-(

I suppose the UK is actually one up on the US. Trump is the figurehead
for the catastrophe over there, yet in the UK there is no real focus
for the unfolding catastrophe. The idiot in charge now will not be
seen by most for the damaging contribution he is making to all aspects
of government action.

Methinks if Murdoch was put behind bars it would be a good move for
both countries though :-)

AB

From the well pummelled keyboard of Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq

On Sun, 05 Jul 2020 13:23:54 +0100, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp Esq
wrote:

snip

Well, until they wanted their 'Full English' breakfast that is (made
from Danish bacon, Dutch tomatoes, French potatoes and Polish
mushrooms, with only the eggs likely to come from the UK).


Aah! The wonderful thing about blind nationalistic patriotism is that
all the subtleties are superfluous.

So it seems. Like, questioning if it really was £360M/w and what the
real chances were of us actually giving the real (much lower) sum we
pay to the EU to the NHS 'instead'. Gawd bless the NHS! ;-)

It boils down to flagwavers and
those" evil" bunch that are not on board.

Yup. If you aren't with us you are against us. No room for grey in
their simplistic binary world.

An amazing approach, well recognised and taken full advantage of by
those that are not quite so nationalistic and move their rescourses
from tax haven to country at the drop of a hat.

Quite! Hypocrites.


I read a very interesting book recently on the production of Zyklon by
the Americans and Germans running up to WW2.

It struck me as to how amazing it is that as the troops are being
urged to sacrifice all for the sake of their country, the
industrialists on both sides are creaming cash off right left and
center.

Yup, disgusting, what some get others to do to further their own
cause. Spreading all sorts of lies and propaganda ...

The other thing I learned was that Adolf got his ideas for eugenics
from the US and Britain.

Yeah, he did have some good social ideas and ideals, just not all of
them or very well implemented.

The con using the patriotic nationality approach has Trump and Brexit
summed up nicely. It rarely fails though :-(

It's the same with 'celebrity, some (weak?) people seem to need
something to cling onto. Maybe it's the new 'religion?

I suppose the UK is actually one up on the US. Trump is the figurehead
for the catastrophe over there, yet in the UK there is no real focus
for the unfolding catastrophe.

Quite, luckily for Leave Coronavirus has masked it somewhat (excuse
the pun).

The idiot in charge now will not be
seen by most for the damaging contribution he is making to all aspects
of government action.

Good point. I think most people see him is a puppet (Muppet? g) and
so don't really take him seriously.

Methinks if Murdoch was put behind bars it would be a good move for
both countries though :-)

I think there should be more support for the likes of FullFact etc.
Getting people to check on what they have read on ****ter and
Farcebook and not just following it blindly.

What I find interesting is how disconnected many are from wanting real
fact. They actually seem to enjoy that disconnection, accepting what
suits them blindly and not considering anything else to any depth (or
just discounting it directly).

It's just like the Fanatic Brexiteers here, *not one* of them has
shown any sort of contrition or acceptance that *any* of the whole EU
referendum farce is anything but that. They are so single minded, so
indoctrinated on their cause, they simply don't take any serious
notice of anything that contradicts, let alone conflicts with *their*
view of the world.

Unfortunately (for them and our future) that is classic 'left brainer'
stuff. Anyone not with them or 100% in agreement with them is an / the
enemy and just another talking head to be ignored.

The irony is that those of us that are not like that, see, consider
and understand *their* POV, but can also see it for what it often is.
Just plain selfish, and worse ...

Cheers, T i m