On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 11:15:50 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


Don¢t get anything like that here.

LOL Senile auto-contradicting asshole!

--
about senile Rot Speed:
"This is like having a conversation with someone with brain damage."
MID:

On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 11:14:03 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


Fark, makes much more sense to use a mobile now.

Shove it up yours, senile pest!

--
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cretin from Oz:
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On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 11:18:35 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


Doesn¢t here.

Of course it doesn't, you auto-contradicting clinically insane asshole! LOL

--
Kerr-Mudd,John addressing senile Rot:
"Auto-contradictor Rod is back! (in the KF)"
MID:

On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 11:11:23 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


Nope

LOL

--
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cretin from Oz:
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On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 12:58:47 +1100, Ray wrote:

Mobiles yes but not proper VOIP calls. Unless you are trying to
use
VOIP over an iffy mobile data link rather than a stable
ADSL/VDSL/FTTP connection but even then it's just drop outsrather
than the mangled donald duck noises that mobiles produce.

Never ever get any mangled donald duck noises with my mobile and I use
it for all calls now.

Presumably you live in an area with a good signal no matter where you
are inside or out. Here you have to be upstairs, by a window, on the
right side of the house to stand a chance of being able to make a
phone call without, donald duck noises, drop outs or the call just
disconnecting.

A lot of people don't seem to notice these issues or the delay all of
which I find very distracting.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On 21/11/2019 10:16, Graeme wrote:

Keep seeing stories regarding BT's planned switch off of analogue phone
lines in 2025 but, knowing little about telephony, and having no
particular interest in the subject, don't know what this really means
for the average home phone user.

Thoughts?

When I was working on the future BT network they were still going to
have POTS but all the exchanges were going to be removed and replaced by
cards in the green cabinet and a softswitch to run it all.

We were developing the stuff to do it when Gordon Brown bankrupted Marconi.

dennis@home wrote:

When I was working on the future BT network they were still going to
have POTS but all the exchanges were going to be removed and replaced by
cards in the green cabinet

The huawei and eci MSANs in the green cabinets support pots/isdn/adsl
cards but openreach only fit vdsl cards ...

In article l.net,
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 12:58:47 +1100, Ray wrote:

Mobiles yes but not proper VOIP calls. Unless you are trying to
use
VOIP over an iffy mobile data link rather than a stable
ADSL/VDSL/FTTP connection but even then it's just drop outsrather
than the mangled donald duck noises that mobiles produce.

Never ever get any mangled donald duck noises with my mobile and I use
it for all calls now.

Presumably you live in an area with a good signal no matter where you
are inside or out. Here you have to be upstairs, by a window, on the
right side of the house to stand a chance of being able to make a
phone call without, donald duck noises, drop outs or the call just
disconnecting.

A lot of people don't seem to notice these issues or the delay all of
which I find very distracting.

have you tried somethink like Vodaphone "Sure Signal". The box connects to
your internet router and provides a local cell within the house. I've been
using one for about 6 years (when I first discovered it). Phone works
anywhere in the house. I think other Phone operators can provide something
similar.
But there's now "connect by WiFi" which probably achieves a similar result.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 22/11/2019 11:25, charles wrote:
In article l.net,
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 12:58:47 +1100, Ray wrote:

Mobiles yes but not proper VOIP calls. Unless you are trying to
use
VOIP over an iffy mobile data link rather than a stable
ADSL/VDSL/FTTP connection but even then it's just drop outsrather
than the mangled donald duck noises that mobiles produce.

Never ever get any mangled donald duck noises with my mobile and I use
it for all calls now.

Presumably you live in an area with a good signal no matter where you
are inside or out. Here you have to be upstairs, by a window, on the
right side of the house to stand a chance of being able to make a
phone call without, donald duck noises, drop outs or the call just
disconnecting.

A lot of people don't seem to notice these issues or the delay all of
which I find very distracting.

have you tried somethink like Vodaphone "Sure Signal". The box connects to
your internet router and provides a local cell within the house. I've been
using one for about 6 years (when I first discovered it). Phone works
anywhere in the house. I think other Phone operators can provide something
similar.
But there's now "connect by WiFi" which probably achieves a similar result.

The problem with phone by internet is when the internet goes down

either as a power cut or as a thing in itself.





--
The theory of Communism may be summed up in one sentence: Abolish all
private property.

Karl Marx

On Friday, 22 November 2019 11:34:47 UTC, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
The problem with phone by internet is when the internet goes down
either as a power cut or as a thing in itself.

And VoIP is fussy to set up. I went a year with no VoIP on the phone but VoIP on the tablet because of Sky's router not playing nicely.

Owain

On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 11:34:44 +0000, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 22/11/2019 11:25, charles wrote:
In article l.net,
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 12:58:47 +1100, Ray wrote:

Mobiles yes but not proper VOIP calls. Unless you are trying to
use
VOIP over an iffy mobile data link rather than a stable
ADSL/VDSL/FTTP connection but even then it's just drop outsrather
than the mangled donald duck noises that mobiles produce.

Never ever get any mangled donald duck noises with my mobile and I
use it for all calls now.

Presumably you live in an area with a good signal no matter where you
are inside or out. Here you have to be upstairs, by a window, on the
right side of the house to stand a chance of being able to make a
phone call without, donald duck noises, drop outs or the call just
disconnecting.

A lot of people don't seem to notice these issues or the delay all of
which I find very distracting.

have you tried somethink like Vodaphone "Sure Signal". The box connects
to your internet router and provides a local cell within the house.
I've been using one for about 6 years (when I first discovered it).
Phone works anywhere in the house. I think other Phone operators can
provide something similar.
But there's now "connect by WiFi" which probably achieves a similar
result.

The problem with phone by internet is when the internet goes down

either as a power cut or as a thing in itself.

Agreed. But both can be mitigated (as I have). UPS and 3G fallback.



--
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In article , The Natural Philosopher
wrote:
On 22/11/2019 11:25, charles wrote:
In article l.net,
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 12:58:47 +1100, Ray wrote:

Mobiles yes but not proper VOIP calls. Unless you are trying to
use
VOIP over an iffy mobile data link rather than a stable
ADSL/VDSL/FTTP connection but even then it's just drop outsrather
than the mangled donald duck noises that mobiles produce.

Never ever get any mangled donald duck noises with my mobile and I
use it for all calls now.

Presumably you live in an area with a good signal no matter where you
are inside or out. Here you have to be upstairs, by a window, on the
right side of the house to stand a chance of being able to make a
phone call without, donald duck noises, drop outs or the call just
disconnecting.

A lot of people don't seem to notice these issues or the delay all of
which I find very distracting.

have you tried somethink like Vodaphone "Sure Signal". The box connects
to your internet router and provides a local cell within the house.
I've been using one for about 6 years (when I first discovered it).
Phone works anywhere in the house. I think other Phone operators can
provide something similar. But there's now "connect by WiFi" which
probably achieves a similar result.

The problem with phone by internet is when the internet goes down

either as a power cut or as a thing in itself.

Yes, and the cell phone won't work if the cell goes down. But, for 99%
time it is a lot better than hanging out of an upstairs window.

The only time I lost internet was when some scroates stole the cable. Then
BT put all my call throuht to my mobile - which was getting a
rotten/nonexistant signal. But that was 5 years ago.

--
from KT24 in Surrey, England
"I'd rather die of exhaustion than die of boredom" Thomas Carlyle

On 21/11/2019 16:16, Andy Burns wrote:
Dave Liquorice wrote:

I think most cabinets have batteries to
bridge short mains interuptions without the kit rebooting. They may
have enough capacity to keep the cabinet alive for 3 hours or so
which is (IIRC) about the time that the batteries in a FTTP box last.

I thought FTTP was GPON, so no active kit in the cabinets?

It will be in the cabinet as they are selling the exchange buildings at
some time.

dennis@home wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

I thought FTTP was GPON, so no active kit in the cabinets?

It will be in the cabinet as they are selling the exchange buildings at
some time.

Maybe they'll have a few powered 'master' cabinets for the other passive
ones to feed off?

On 22/11/2019 10:37, Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 12:58:47 +1100, Ray wrote:

Mobiles yes but not proper VOIP calls. Unless you are trying to
use
VOIP over an iffy mobile data link rather than a stable
ADSL/VDSL/FTTP connection but even then it's just drop outsrather
than the mangled donald duck noises that mobiles produce.

Never ever get any mangled donald duck noises with my mobile and I use
it for all calls now.

Presumably you live in an area with a good signal no matter where you
are inside or out. Here you have to be upstairs, by a window, on the
right side of the house to stand a chance of being able to make a
phone call without, donald duck noises, drop outs or the call just
disconnecting.

A lot of people don't seem to notice these issues or the delay all of
which I find very distracting.


Same problem I have trying to get DAB radio

On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 16:43:52 +0000, Andrew wrote:

Never ever get any mangled donald duck noises with my mobile and
I use
it for all calls now.

Presumably you live in an area with a good signal no matter where
you
are inside or out. Here you have to be upstairs, by a window, on
the
right side of the house to stand a chance of being able to make a
phone call without, donald duck noises, drop outs or the call just
disconnecting.

A lot of people don't seem to notice these issues or the delay all
of
which I find very distracting.

Same problem I have trying to get DAB radio

What's DAB?

--
Cheers
Dave.

In article , Andrew
writes
On 21/11/2019 13:07, NY wrote:
No, although as the UK moves gradually towards FTTP

LOL.

At glacial speed.
But but I thought if I voted labour I would have it instantly for free.
--
bert

In article l.net,
Dave Liquorice writes
On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 16:43:52 +0000, Andrew wrote:

Never ever get any mangled donald duck noises with my mobile and
I use
it for all calls now.

Presumably you live in an area with a good signal no matter where
you
are inside or out. Here you have to be upstairs, by a window, on
the
right side of the house to stand a chance of being able to make a
phone call without, donald duck noises, drop outs or the call just
disconnecting.

A lot of people don't seem to notice these issues or the delay all
of
which I find very distracting.

Same problem I have trying to get DAB radio

What's DAB?

A sophisticated system for delaying radio broadcasts so if you try
listening to Test Match Special commentary whilst watching cricket on TV
you are about 3 deliveries behind the actual play. It also makes the
time pips totally superfluous.
--
bert

In article , Michael Chare
writes
On 21/11/2019 10:16, Graeme wrote:
Keep seeing stories regarding BT's planned switch off of analogue
phone lines in 2025 but, knowing little about telephony, and having
no particular interest in the subject, don't know what this really
means for the average home phone user.
Thoughts?

With the first two phones I had installed, all I had to do to use them
was to pick up the receiver.

These days I now have VOIP which is much cheaper but to make it work I
have to know how to install and configure my router and home network
wiring. I also have to understand how to configure the VOIP equipment
itself. I need a PC or maybe a mobile phone to do all this.

Were I to use BT or Vonage VOIP equipment which might be configured for
me, I would probably have to pay much more for phone calls.

My landline wired phones will work in a power cut. The power supply
company likes to send me text messages about power cuts. Thankfully my
mobile phone is able to receive these so long as the battery is charged.


Have them sent to your landline.
--
bert

On 22/11/2019 19:42, bert wrote:
In article l.net,
Dave Liquorice writes
On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 16:43:52 +0000, Andrew wrote:

Never ever get any mangled donald duck noises with my mobile and
I use
it for all calls now.

Presumably you live in an area with a good signal no matter where
you
are inside or out. Here you have to be upstairs, by a window, on
the
right side of the house to stand a chance of being able to make a
phone call without, donald duck noises, drop outs or the call just
disconnecting.

A lot of people don't seem to notice these issues or the delay all
of
which I find very distracting.

Same problem I have trying to get DAB radio

What's DAB?

A sophisticated system for delaying radio broadcasts so if you try
listening to Test Match Special commentary whilst watching cricket on TV
you are about 3 deliveries behind the actual play. It also makes the
time pips totally superfluous.

I have found te reverse: test match special is about 3 balls ahead of te tV


--
€œProgress is precisely that which rules and regulations did not foresee,€�

€“ Ludwig von Mises

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
idual.net...
On Fri, 22 Nov 2019 12:58:47 +1100, Ray wrote:

Mobiles yes but not proper VOIP calls. Unless you are trying to
use
VOIP over an iffy mobile data link rather than a stable
ADSL/VDSL/FTTP connection but even then it's just drop outsrather
than the mangled donald duck noises that mobiles produce.

Never ever get any mangled donald duck noises with my mobile and I use
it for all calls now.

Presumably you live in an area with a good signal no matter where you
are inside or out.

No I don't, particularly with the one carrier where you
have to be very careful where you put the phone down.

And a mate of mine is sometimes in a very poor reception area
as was again just a week ago. Certainly wasn't possible to be
sure what he was saying, but no mangled donald duck noises,
just words that were not recognisable, but sounded normal.

Here you have to be upstairs, by a window, on the
right side of the house to stand a chance of being
able to make a phone call without, donald duck
noises, drop outs or the call just disconnecting.

I certainly get dropouts and call just disconnecting at times
but have never had any mangled donald duck noises

A lot of people don't seem to notice these issues
or the delay all of which I find very distracting.

Yeah, some handle it a lot better than others.

I am a light aircraft pilot and never have any
problem with the radio comms but I don't
think I have ever had any passenger who
wasn't also a pilot who has ever been able
to make any sense of the communication.

Quite a bit of that is knowing what they will be saying.

"dennis@home" wrote in message
...
On 21/11/2019 10:16, Graeme wrote:

Keep seeing stories regarding BT's planned switch off of analogue phone
lines in 2025 but, knowing little about telephony, and having no
particular interest in the subject, don't know what this really means for
the average home phone user.

Thoughts?

When I was working on the future BT network they were still going to have
POTS but all the exchanges were going to be removed and replaced by cards
in the green cabinet and a softswitch to run it all.

That varys by jurisdiction. NZ has also chosen to do it that way but
Australia has chosen to scrap the POTS service completely and that
has the advantage that the highest VDSL2 speeds are better.

And in theory the copper back to the exchange can all be ripped out
and sold off, but it remains to be seen if they will actually do that.
Might not be viable when you need to ensure no disruption of the
fibre that is still in those ducts.

The new Labor opposition leader has just proclaimed
that everyone needs a FTTP service, but he has been
deliberately vague about whether that means they
will be paying for the replacement of all the current
FTTC/VDSL2 and HFC services. Very unlikely that even
Labor will be silly enough to be providing FTTP to the
more rural customers with out immense distances.

And imo **** all chance of Labor getting to be the
govt here again any time soon. He's the first left
federal labor leader we have had since the war.

We were developing the stuff to do it when Gordon Brown bankrupted
Marconi.

wrote
The Natural Philosopher wrote

The problem with phone by internet is when the internet
goes down either as a power cut or as a thing in itself.

And VoIP is fussy to set up.

Not with a decent voip service it isnt. The one
I used on the adsl2+ service was trivial to setup,
plug the preconfigured ata into the router,
plug the phone into that, all just works.

The one that came with the FTTC service was even
easier, new router, plug the phone into that.

I went a year with no VoIP on the phone but VoIP on
the tablet because of Sky's router not playing nicely.

Ray used his keyboard to write :
But not for long, nothing like as long as an exchange can do that.

I agree, the size of batteries in a big exchange used to be vast back
in the GPO days. Entire basements filled with massive banks of
batteries. 3 x 1 copper busbars run around the racks.

"Harry Bloomfield"; "Esq." wrote in
message ...
Ray used his keyboard to write :
But not for long, nothing like as long as an exchange can do that.

I agree, the size of batteries in a big exchange used to be vast back in
the GPO days. Entire basements filled with massive banks of batteries. 3 x
1 copper busbars run around the racks.

And usually with an on site generator that is used
when the mains is not available for long enough.

On Sat, 23 Nov 2019 14:19:12 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


Not with a decent voip service it isnt.

LOL

--
Kerr-Mudd,John addressing senile Rot:
"Auto-contradictor Rod is back! (in the KF)"
MID:

On Sat, 23 Nov 2019 13:27:23 +1100, Ray, better known as cantankerous
trolling senile geezer Rodent Speed, wrote:

No I don't

LOL

--
Kerr-Mudd,John addressing senile Rot:
"Auto-contradictor Rod is back! (in the KF)"
MID:

On Sat, 23 Nov 2019 13:50:03 +1100, cantankerous trolling geezer Rodent
Speed, the auto-contradicting senile sociopath, blabbered, again:


When I was working on the future BT network they were still going to have
POTS but all the exchanges were going to be removed and replaced by cards
in the green cabinet and a softswitch to run it all.

That varys by jurisdiction. NZ has also chosen to do it that way but
Australia has chosen to scrap

This is a UK ng, in case you haven't noticed yet, senile Ozzie pest!

--
The Natural Philosopher about senile Rot:
"Rod speed is not a Brexiteer. He is an Australian troll and arsehole."
Message-ID:

Ray was thinking very hard :
And usually with an on site generator that is used
when the mains is not available for long enough.

Yes!

On Sat, 23 Nov 2019 19:57:17 +1100, Ray, better known as cantankerous
trolling senile geezer Rodent Speed, wrote:


And usually with an on site generator that is used
when the mains is not available for long enough.

What are you now smartassing about again, lonely senile wisenheimer? BG

--
Website (from 2007) dedicated to the 85-year-old trolling senile
cretin from Oz:
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In article , rft453
@gmail.com says...


I am a light aircraft pilot and never have any
problem with the radio comms but I don't
think I have ever had any passenger who
wasn't also a pilot who has ever been able
to make any sense of the communication.

Quite a bit of that is knowing what they will be saying.

Many years ago I worked with a light aircraft pilot who had
visited the control tower at Southend.

An aircraft had left their airspace earlier without contacting
them. During the visit he contacted the tower asking for
permissoion to enter. The droll response was "Oh, we didn't
know you'd left!"

The pilot then gave his altitude as flight level 5,000!

He was asaked if he was requesting permission to land or for
re-entry!

--

Terry

On 23/11/2019 09:30, Harry Bloomfield wrote:
Ray was thinking very hard :
And usually with an on site generator that is used
when the mains is not available for long enough.

Yes!

That's handy. They could plant a windmill on the roof and use
the genny to supply power to the grid when the wind doesn't blow
(or blows too strongly)

On Thursday, 21 November 2019 10:16:52 UTC, Graeme wrote:
Keep seeing stories regarding BT's planned switch off of analogue phone
lines in 2025 but, knowing little about telephony, and having no
particular interest in the subject, don't know what this really means
for the average home phone user.

Thoughts?
--
It is happening. We are getting FTTP next week and that should see an end to our copper. Not sure if they actually remove it?

Some further info:

Openreach (BT) plan to launch a new symmetric €œlow speed€� 500Kbps (0.5Mbps) tier on their UK Fibre-to-the-Premises (FTTP) broadband ISP network, which might seem odd until you realise that its part of their transition away from the old phone services (WLR / PSTN). Elsewhere FTTP on Demand is being trialled in apartment blocks.

At present a lot of work is going on behind the scenes in order to prepare the market for two major changes. Firstly, the gradual migration of traditional voice services to all-IP technology (e.g. VoIP) by December 2025 €“ essential on full fibre lines where electrical signals are no longer used €“ and, secondly, the complete switch-off of the copper network in favour of €œfull fibre€� / FTTP (phased €“ fully completing some years after 2025).

https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.ph...buildings.html

On 26/11/2019 13:00, polygonum_on_google wrote:
It is happening. We are getting FTTP next week and that should see an end to our copper. Not sure if they actually remove it?

They didn't remove ours. (though that was 5 years ago...)

The POTS port still doesn't take incoming calls. Must go VOIP.

Andy

In article ,
polygonum_on_google scribeth thus
On Thursday, 21 November 2019 10:16:52 UTC, Graeme wrote:
Keep seeing stories regarding BT's planned switch off of analogue phone
lines in 2025 but, knowing little about telephony, and having no
particular interest in the subject, don't know what this really means
for the average home phone user.

Thoughts?
--
It is happening. We are getting FTTP next week and that should see an end to our
copper. Not sure if they actually remove it?

Some further info:

Openreach (BT) plan to launch a new symmetric €œlow speed€� 500Kbps (0.5Mbps) tier
on their UK Fibre-to-the-Premises (FTTP) broadband ISP network, which might seem
odd until you realise that its part of their transition away from the old phone
services (WLR / PSTN). Elsewhere FTTP on Demand is being trialled in apartment
blocks.

At present a lot of work is going on behind the scenes in order to prepare the
market for two major changes. Firstly, the gradual migration of traditional
voice services to all-IP technology (e.g. VoIP) by December 2025 €“ essential on
full fibre lines where electrical signals are no longer used €“ and, secondly,
the complete switch-off of the copper network in favour of €œfull fibre€� / FTTP
(phased €“ fully completing some years after 2025).

https://www.ispreview.co.uk/index.ph...bps-fttp-tier-
and-trial-fod-for-mdu-buildings.html

Had VoIP here for what, 10 years now over VM broadband..

Also its now on the mobile as an extension line via Zoiper works very
well indeed and what's best of all is there no fecking Bee Tee involved
in that system

--
Tony Sayer


Man is least himself when he talks in his own person.

Give him a keyboard, and he will reveal himself.

Yeah, some handle it a lot better than others.

I am a light aircraft pilot and never have any
problem with the radio comms but I don't
think I have ever had any passenger who
wasn't also a pilot who has ever been able
to make any sense of the communication.

Quite a bit of that is knowing what they will be saying.


Language of its own isn't it;?..
--
Tony Sayer


Man is least himself when he talks in his own person.

Give him a keyboard, and he will reveal himself.

On Tue, 03 Dec 2019 17:59:11 +0000, tony sayer wrote:

Had VoIP here for what, 10 years now over VM broadband..

Also its now on the mobile as an extension line via Zoiper works very
well indeed and what's best of all is there no fecking Bee Tee involved
in that system

Same here, but relatively recent for VoIP *only*.

I pay my ITSP for a bare line, no number. A block of landline VoIP
numbers for different purposes, and Zoiper on phone and tablet.

--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor