Shop boiler has turned up it's toes after almost 18 years abuse.
It's a valiant TurbomaxPlus 828E which has been kettling for a while and
now come up with F20 (overheat) code preceded earlier with by mechanical
bangs and crashes.

Thing is, it's never had any issues and runs at least 16 hours a day, 5
days a week from Autumn to Spring so I'm wondering whether to fix or
replace with a new-fangled condensor boiler which I know won't be as
maintenance free.

Just going to see if it's the pump that's gone. (never been replaced in
all this time) but what would be a suitable "commercial" alternative?

Cheers
Pete

On 11/12/2017 10:29, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
Shop boiler has turned up it's toes after almost 18 years abuse.
It's a valiant TurbomaxPlus 828E which has been kettling for a while and
now come up with F20 (overheat) code preceded earlier with by mechanical
bangs and crashes.

Thing is, it's never had any issues and runs at least 16 hours a day, 5
days a week from Autumn to Spring so I'm wondering whether to fix or
replace with a new-fangled condensor boiler which I know won't be as
maintenance free.

Just going to see if it's the pump that's gone. (never been replaced in
all this time) but what would be a suitable "commercial" alternative?

Update, Pup is spinning fine. Temperature from burner to pump inlet is
hot but nthing is flowing past the outlet of pump to heat exchanger.

Is there a chance the heat exchanger could be blocked?

Cheers
Pete

On 11/12/2017 10:29, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
Shop boiler has turned up it's toes after almost 18 years abuse.
It's a valiant TurbomaxPlus 828E which has been kettling for a while and
now come up with F20 (overheat) code preceded earlier with by mechanical
bangs and crashes.

Thing is, it's never had any issues and runs at least 16 hours a day, 5
days a week from Autumn to Spring so I'm wondering whether to fix or
replace with a new-fangled condensor boiler which I know won't be as
maintenance free.

Just going to see if it's the pump that's gone. (never been replaced in
all this time) but what would be a suitable "commercial" alternative?

Cheers
Pete

My ecotec plus 637 has been completely trouble free for several years
(much better than a Vaillant combi about 20 years ago). Make sure
condensate drain is properly installed so that it can't freeze: had to
bail out a friend a couple of months ago and just waiting for another
call now that it has got cold again.

On 11/12/2017 12:28, Chris Hogg wrote:

Similar experience here. Our Vaillant ECOmax VU226E LPG boiler went
tits up last month, after 18 years. Water on the floor underneath it,
smelling of 'iron' (IYKWIM), and fan not working. Service engineer
said the leak was caused by corrosion (I know it's been slowly
progressing for several years now, so no real surprise), and it
probably shorted out and blew the electrics that controlled the fan.
Parts no longer obtainable, so condemned as unsafe and unrepairable.

I'm trying to get the service contract people, Domestic & General, to
tell me how much, if anything, they'll contribute to a new boiler, but
no response after three phone calls. 'We'll ring you back tomorrow,
sir' or 'we'll send you a letter in two days time, sir', but it never
happens. TBH I'm not actually expecting them to pay anything. After
all, you don't expect your car insurance to contribute to the cost of
a new car when your old banger finally packs up. But I didn't want to
miss out if there is a chance they'll pay something.

Meanwhile, it's COLD, and we've got fan heaters running everywhere. At
least the noise from the fans drowns the whirring from the electricity
meter as it clocks up the kWh!

I just phoned Valliant and took out their D&G 6 month plan at £49.98 a
month which includes Heat Exchanger. As I know diverter valve packed up
a good 10 years ago H/E, Diverter valve, all the manky joints to break
apart and rock-hard O-Rings to replace and labour I'm sure will rack up
far more than that if I was to attempt to purchase them myself and DIY it.

Plus if it's beyond economical repair at least it won't cost me
anything. Only issue is I have to wait until Thursday for engineer to
visit!
I dislike D&G and their appliance insurances but on this occasion I
think it could work in my favour as long as I cancel on time.

Might need to dig out the old gas heater to keep us going.
The Infra-red halogen heater thing can only be pointed at one person so
naturally I'm the one that's having to do without...
Hope the boiler is repairable as it's been so reliable without all that
condenser nonsense to break down.

On 11/12/2017 12:28, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 11/12/2017 10:29, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
Shop boiler has turned up it's toes after almost 18 years abuse.
It's a valiant TurbomaxPlus 828E which has been kettling for a while and
now come up with F20 (overheat) code preceded earlier with by mechanical
bangs and crashes.

Thing is, it's never had any issues and runs at least 16 hours a day, 5
days a week from Autumn to Spring so I'm wondering whether to fix or
replace with a new-fangled condensor boiler which I know won't be as
maintenance free.

Just going to see if it's the pump that's gone. (never been replaced in
all this time) but what would be a suitable "commercial" alternative?

Update, Pup is spinning fine. Temperature from burner to pump inlet is
hot but nthing is flowing past the outlet of pump to heat exchanger.

Is there a chance the heat exchanger could be blocked?

Cheers
Pete

It's a combi, isn't it? So there are in effect two heat exchangers, the
one built into the "firebox" which heats the radiator water, and the DHW
secondary heat exchanger. When you call for hot water, the diverter
valve puts the "radiator water" through this secondary HX to heat cold
water coming from the rising main.

It's not uncommon for this secondary HX to block, but that affects the
DHW rather than the heating.

Kettling and an overheat alarm does sound consistent with blockage of
the HX which sits above the burners.

I'd be inclined to think you've done well to get 18 years out of a
combi. These have quite a few other "bits" to go wrong.

On 11/12/17 13:31, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 11/12/2017 12:28, Chris Hogg wrote:

Similar experience here. Our Vaillant ECOmax VU226E LPG boiler went
tits up last month, after 18 years. Water on the floor underneath it,
smelling of 'iron' (IYKWIM), and fan not working. Service engineer
said the leak was caused by corrosion (I know it's been slowly
progressing for several years now, so no real surprise), and it
probably shorted out and blew the electrics that controlled the fan.
Parts no longer obtainable, so condemned as unsafe and unrepairable.

I'm trying to get the service contract people, Domestic & General, to
tell me how much, if anything, they'll contribute to a new boiler, but
no response after three phone calls. 'We'll ring you back tomorrow,
sir' or 'we'll send you a letter in two days time, sir', but it never
happens. TBH I'm not actually expecting them to pay anything. After
all, you don't expect your car insurance to contribute to the cost of
a new car when your old banger finally packs up. But I didn't want to
miss out if there is a chance they'll pay something.

Meanwhile, it's COLD, and we've got fan heaters running everywhere. At
least the noise from the fans drowns the whirring from the electricity
meter as it clocks up the kWh!

I just phoned Valliant and took out their D&G 6 month plan at £49.98 a
month which includes Heat Exchanger. As I know diverter valve packed up
a good 10 years ago H/E, Diverter valve, all the manky joints to break
apart and rock-hard O-Rings to replace and labour I'm sure will rack up
far more than that if I was to attempt to purchase them myself and DIY it.

That sounds like an expensive plan. We have a 'whole system' plan - it
covers everything - with a local company. They replaced our boiler about
10 years ago (give or take) and we took out the plan after the warranty
expired. We've just renewed it- £210 per year. We've availed ourselves
of their services when the boiler 'died'- the heat exchanger failed.
They not only repaired it with no fuss but also replace the radiator
valves which they decided were past their sell by date- even though they
were part of the original system. They've also fixed other items- eg the
thermostat, which was part of the original system. The only 'quibble'
was the electric water heater thermostat- that was specifically
excluded. However, it was only a few pounds and a doddle to replace.

The £210 includes an annual service/safety check. They check the boiler
etc and even the gas fire in the sitting room, also not fitted by them.

On Monday, 11 December 2017 12:29:06 UTC, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 11/12/2017 10:29, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
Shop boiler has turned up it's toes after almost 18 years abuse.
It's a valiant TurbomaxPlus 828E which has been kettling for a while and
now come up with F20 (overheat) code preceded earlier with by mechanical
bangs and crashes.

Thing is, it's never had any issues and runs at least 16 hours a day, 5
days a week from Autumn to Spring so I'm wondering whether to fix or
replace with a new-fangled condensor boiler which I know won't be as
maintenance free.

Just going to see if it's the pump that's gone. (never been replaced in
all this time) but what would be a suitable "commercial" alternative?

Update, Pup is spinning fine. Temperature from burner to pump inlet is
hot but nthing is flowing past the outlet of pump to heat exchanger.

Is there a chance the heat exchanger could be blocked?

Cheers
Pete

blockage might be anywhere, including in the pump, or filter if it has one. Maybe try some cleaner chemical (F3). If no joy, time to dismantle stuff.


NT

On 11/12/2017 13:43, Brian Reay wrote:

That sounds like an expensive plan. We have a 'whole system' plan - it
covers everything - with a local company. They replaced our boiler about
10 years ago (give or take) and we took out the plan after the warranty
expired. We've just renewed it- £210 per year. We've availed ourselves
of their services when the boiler 'died'- the heat exchanger failed.
They not only repaired it with no fuss but also replace the radiator
valves which they decided were past their sell by date- even though they
were part of the original system. They've also fixed other items- eg the
thermostat, which was part of the original system. The only 'quibble'
was the electric water heater thermostat- that was specifically
excluded. However, it was only a few pounds and a doddle to replace.

The £210 includes an annual service/safety check. They check the boiler
etc and even the gas fire in the sitting room, also not fitted by them.

Ah yes but I'm guessing you pay yours annually whereas I'll be
cancelling after the 6 months and won't be renewing nor have I paid
anything other than 1 diverter vale previously since 2001 when the
boiler was installed so £300 seems like a fair balance. I don't do the
"annual boiler service" scam and do most maintenance myself so I'm
treating it as a £300 1-off all-inclusive repair.
Given that the last part I bought for my boiler at home was half that
price and I had to fit it myself I think it's economically sound.

On 11/12/2017 14:07, Jethro_uk wrote:
On Mon, 11 Dec 2017 12:28:40 +0000, Chris Hogg wrote:

From recent experience, I'd check the AAV on the pump housing first.

Checked mine, barely a whisper of air came out.

replying to www.GymRatZ.co.uk, Iggy wrote:
Positively go for replacing the heat exchanger if descaling and flushing
aren't getting rid of the fault and kettling. A real cheap quick fix compared
to a new unit that may give you a decade more of use. Even replacing the pump
would only roughly double your meager repair costs.

--
for full context, visit https://www.homeownershub.com/uk-diy...g-1255907-.htm

In article ,
www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
Thing is, it's never had any issues and runs at least 16 hours a day, 5
days a week from Autumn to Spring so I'm wondering whether to fix or
replace with a new-fangled condensor boiler which I know won't be as
maintenance free.

What do you think needs maintence on a condensing boiler that doesn't need
doing on a non condensing one?

Condensing are more complicated than a very basic non-condenser, so
*might* need more repairs. But a good condenser is going to be more
reliable than a poor non-condenser. And will certainly save any repair
costs due to the much higher efficiency, so lower bills.

It's more difficult to decide whether it is worth the capital outlay if
your non-condenser is still OK.

--
*Why does the sun lighten our hair, but darken our skin?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 11/12/2017 13:32, newshound wrote:

It's a combi, isn't it? So there are in effect two heat exchangers, the
one built into the "firebox" which heats the radiator water, and the DHW
secondary heat exchanger. When you call for hot water, the diverter
valve puts the "radiator water" through this secondary HX to heat cold
water coming from the rising main.

It's not uncommon for this secondary HX to block, but that affects the
DHW rather than the heating.

Kettling and an overheat alarm does sound consistent with blockage of
the HX which sits above the burners.

I'd be inclined to think you've done well to get 18 years out of a
combi. These have quite a few other "bits" to go wrong.

Indeed. Diverter valve was replaced after a few years but didn't bother
when it packed up 2nd time round as only really use it for heating.

Last year was the first time I've had to do anything to it. Fault code
showed as burner not igniting when it was but was then going out.
That just required a quick clean of the flame sensor thermocouple, that
was it so all in all it's been fantastic given the amount of use it's
had over the years.

It's a bit strange that the pump is running and hot water is coming from
the burner side into the pump but nothing coming out of the pump.
It had been slowing down over the last few weeks with water flow to the
C/H must have been slowing down as boiler would burn and temp would rise
quickly then shut down so I think a flow blockage somewhere or pump
impeller has done something strange. end of pump shaft is spinning and
srewdriver on the ear certainly sounds like it's pumping.

I have 2 motorised port valves, 1 for upstairs on c/h timer and one for
downstairs on H/W timer. I don't think they could both have stopped
working.... Hmm... just off to see if they're both opening...
If timer isn't firing either of them then the water has no-where to go...

On 11/12/2017 14:48, Chris Hogg wrote:
On Mon, 11 Dec 2017 13:31:10 +0000, "www.GymRatZ.co.uk"
wrote:

I just phoned Valliant and took out their D&G 6 month plan at £49.98 a
month which includes Heat Exchanger.

That's quite a lot more than I pay D&G, @ £26.04 PM. Covers an annual
service, and breakdowns/repairs up to £1500. But I don't think the
scheme was taken out via Vaillant but directly with D&G when we first
had the boiler, but it was 18 years ago...

£26 a month for 18 years.... You could have had a new boiler every 3
1/2 years for the same price. Think I know which I'd rather do.

www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:

I just phoned Valliant and took out their D&G 6 month plan at £49.98 a
month which includes Heat Exchanger.

HFM? That's five times more per month than I've spent in the last 27
years on my cast iron lump.

It was on from 7am to 11pm yesterday and managed to burn 90kWh of gas,
so just under £3, would I like to change it to a condenser to save maybe
1/3 of that gas? No thanks.

On 11/12/2017 14:47, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

What do you think needs maintence on a condensing boiler that doesn't need
doing on a non condensing one?

It's just got more "stuff" to go wrong.

Condensing are more complicated than a very basic non-condenser, so
*might* need more repairs. But a good condenser is going to be more
reliable than a poor non-condenser. And will certainly save any repair
costs due to the much higher efficiency, so lower bills.

It's more difficult to decide whether it is worth the capital outlay if
your non-condenser is still OK.

My non-condenser has an efficiency rating of 79.7% a new Valliant ecotec
is rated at 91.5% 12% saving on bills would take quite a long time to
balance off savings against initial outlay.
I'll see what the verdict is on Thursday after engineer visit.

On 11/12/2017 16:35, Andy Burns wrote:
www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:

I just phoned Valliant and took out their D&G 6 month plan at £49.98 a
month which includes Heat Exchanger.

HFM?Â* That's five times more per month than I've spent in the last 27
years on my cast iron lump.

It was on from 7am to 11pm yesterday and managed to burn 90kWh of gas,
so just under £3, would I like to change it to a condenser to save maybe
1/3 of that gas?Â* No thanks.

I know.
Insurance price is reflective of age no doubt. Like pet insurance, there
comes a point when the premium outweighs the risk. I'm hoping as well
as the diverter valve it needs a new heat exchanger, a new pump would be
nice too and I still get the rest of the winter to catch any other
failing parts.

The other option they gave me was a "1 payment fix" which would include
all parts and labour but wouldn't include heat exchanger or expansion
vessel Price quoted was...... same as the 6 month insurance plan.

Other option is over £1K + a few hundred quid fitting no doubt so
£1500ish for a domestic condenser which still might be useless in less
than 5 years time. but it would save 12% on current gas spend...
Hmmmmmm That's last resort I think.

Presumably you mean the shaft is spinning. There's no guarantee that the impeller is.
Grundfos pumps had a nasty habit of shearing the shaft at the impeller end.

GymRatZ wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

HFM?

I know.
Insurance price is reflective of age no doubt.

But they're happy for you to take the insurance and then immediately
make a claim? I thought the AA/RAC sussed out that that was likely a bad
risk years ago ...

On 11/12/2017 17:55, Andy Burns wrote:
GymRatZ wrote:

Andy Burns wrote:

HFM?Â*

I know.
Insurance price is reflective of age no doubt.

But they're happy for you to take the insurance and then immediately
make a claim? I thought the AA/RAC sussed out that that was likely a bad
risk years ago ...

Apparently so. I phoned to ask for details of any authorised engineers
in my area thinking they'd be more likely to hold spares and they
offered me single price full fix or same price D&G cover ALL parts.

I expect they know for the vast majority of cases the cost of cover
would out-weigh cost of fix and although it's compulsory 6 month cover
after which you can leave it's also set up on the assumption of on-going
monthly charge so someone only needs to forget to cancel for a few
months or more and there's the big money... Like gym membership being
paid for years by people who only went 2 or 3 times but don't cancel
"just in case"

On 11/12/2017 17:47, Cynic wrote:
Presumably you mean the shaft is spinning. There's no guarantee that the impeller is.
Grundfos pumps had a nasty habit of shearing the shaft at the impeller end.

Indeed, that was one of my thoughts too but if I whipped that off and it
was OK I've delayed the repair even longer and at the moment I don't
have time to tinker & fix.

On 11/12/2017 15:00, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 11/12/2017 13:32, newshound wrote:

It's a combi, isn't it? So there are in effect two heat exchangers, the
one built into the "firebox" which heats the radiator water, and the DHW
secondary heat exchanger. When you call for hot water, the diverter
valve puts the "radiator water" through this secondary HX to heat cold
water coming from the rising main.

It's not uncommon for this secondary HX to block, but that affects the
DHW rather than the heating.

Kettling and an overheat alarm does sound consistent with blockage of
the HX which sits above the burners.

I'd be inclined to think you've done well to get 18 years out of a
combi. These have quite a few other "bits" to go wrong.

Indeed. Diverter valve was replaced after a few years but didn't bother
when it packed up 2nd time round as only really use it for heating.

Last year was the first time I've had to do anything to it. Fault code
showed as burner not igniting when it was but was then going out.
That just required a quick clean of the flame sensor thermocouple, that
was it so all in all it's been fantastic given the amount of use it's
had over the years.

It's a bit strange that the pump is running and hot water is coming from
the burner side into the pump but nothing coming out of the pump.
It had been slowing down over the last few weeks with water flow to the
C/H must have been slowing down as boiler would burn and temp would rise
quickly then shut down so I think a flow blockage somewhere or pump
impeller has done something strange. end of pump shaft is spinning and
srewdriver on the ear certainly sounds like it's pumping.

I have 2 motorised port valves, 1 for upstairs on c/h timer and one for
downstairs on H/W timer. I don't think they could both have stopped
working.... Hmm... just off to see if they're both opening...
If timer isn't firing either of them then the water has no-where to go...

I pulled a pump from my parents' system many years ago, and when I
opened it up I found that the impeller had completely corroded away.
Could this have happened to you?

On Monday, 11 December 2017 16:57:05 UTC, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 11/12/2017 16:35, Andy Burns wrote:
www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:

I just phoned Valliant and took out their D&G 6 month plan at £49..98 a
month which includes Heat Exchanger.

HFM?Â* That's five times more per month than I've spent in the last 27
years on my cast iron lump.

It was on from 7am to 11pm yesterday and managed to burn 90kWh of gas,
so just under £3, would I like to change it to a condenser to save maybe
1/3 of that gas?Â* No thanks.

I know.
Insurance price is reflective of age no doubt. Like pet insurance, there
comes a point when the premium outweighs the risk.

the premium always outweighs the risk by a large margin. If it didn't the insurer would go out of business


NT

"Chris Hogg" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 11 Dec 2017 15:41:42 -0800 (PST), wrote:

On Monday, 11 December 2017 16:57:05 UTC, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 11/12/2017 16:35, Andy Burns wrote:
www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:

I just phoned Valliant and took out their D&G 6 month plan at £49.98
a
month which includes Heat Exchanger.

HFM? That's five times more per month than I've spent in the last 27
years on my cast iron lump.

It was on from 7am to 11pm yesterday and managed to burn 90kWh of gas,
so just under £3, would I like to change it to a condenser to save
maybe
1/3 of that gas? No thanks.

I know.
Insurance price is reflective of age no doubt. Like pet insurance, there
comes a point when the premium outweighs the risk.

the premium always outweighs the risk by a large margin. If it didn't the
insurer would go out of business


NT

That's what I tell myself every time I take out insurance. But I still
go ahead!

I don't and only do the compulsory car insurance.

On 12/12/2017 09:07, Rod Speed wrote:

That's what I tell myself every time I take out insurance. But I still
go ahead!

I don't and only do the compulsory car insurance.

Same here.
Long gone are the days when everyone would make a claim on their
household insurance every few years to get back their insurance premium
+ a bit extra. Now insurance companies have no intention of paying
anything whether a legitimate claim or not and they'll do everything in
their power and add every bit of small-print one couldn't be bothered to
read to get out of paying.

On 11/12/2017 19:18, newshound wrote:

I pulled a pump from my parents' system many years ago, and when I
opened it up I found that the impeller had completely corroded away.
Could this have happened to you?

I think this is what's happened as the pump is the original from when
the boiler was installed in 2001. So cost of pump + replacement faulty
diverter valve and an hour or 2 fitting. I may end up paying a tad more
than DIYing it but but I won't have the hassle of the un-known and it's
a business expense anyway and I already have too many jobs backing up at
home.

In article ,
Chris Hogg wrote:
the premium always outweighs the risk by a large margin. If it didn't
the insurer would go out of business


NT

That's what I tell myself every time I take out insurance. But I still
go ahead!

I'm not quite sure why you'd insure your boiler, but not other things in
the house like the cooker, or whatever. If a boiler breaks down there are
alternate methods of heating the house and water - for the time needed to
get it repaired.

--
*After the game, the King and the pawn go into the same box.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 13/12/2017 01:03, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Chris Hogg wrote:

the premium always outweighs the risk by a large margin. If it didn't
the insurer would go out of business

That's what I tell myself every time I take out insurance. But I still
go ahead!

I'm not quite sure why you'd insure your boiler, but not other things in
the house like the cooker, or whatever. If a boiler breaks down there are
alternate methods of heating the house and water - for the time needed to
get it repaired.

Doesn't boiler insurance exclude "wear and tear"? "Landlord" insurance
advertised does. But if it isn't wear and tear, what is it?
Manufacturing faults would be covered by the original guarantee.

--
Max Demian

On 12/12/2017 11:14, www.GymRatZ.co.uk wrote:
On 12/12/2017 09:07, Rod Speed wrote:

That's what I tell myself every time I take out insurance. But I still
go ahead!

I don't and only do the compulsory car insurance.

Same here.
Long gone are the days when everyone would make a claim on their
household insurance every few years to get back their insurance premium
+ a bit extra. Now insurance companies have no intention of paying
anything whether a legitimate claim or not and they'll do everything in
their power and add every bit of small-print one couldn't be bothered to
read to get out of paying.

I had the opposite experience only a few years ago.

Long ago, I was rinsing an oil burner when it slipped from my hands,
flew across the bathroom and cracked the rim of the toilet. It was okay
like that, so I left it. Then some years later, my wife picked up a
plant pot from a shelf in the bathroom and the "dish" underneath came
with it, then dropped off into the washbasin, cracking that.

At that point I figured that we would not be able to replace the
washbasin and toilet and would need an complete new suite and decided
that an insurance claim would make sense.

The insurance company (Direct Line) said that as it was two separate
events, there would be two excesses to pay (2 x £50). They also put me
in touch with a company that specialised in out of production stock and
actually managed to get me a replacement washbasin and toilet bowl.

I said I would fit it myself rather than them paying for someone to come
out and they said that they could only pay me minimum wage for the job!
I told them that I wasn't interested in being paid and not to bother
with it.

They then paid for the items to be delivered, but never charged me
either excess - I presume it would have cost them at least that much to
do the paperwork and send someone to do it, but even so, a good result.

SteveW

In article ,
Steve Walker wrote:
The insurance company (Direct Line) said that as it was two separate
events, there would be two excesses to pay (2 x £50). They also put me
in touch with a company that specialised in out of production stock and
actually managed to get me a replacement washbasin and toilet bowl.

I said I would fit it myself rather than them paying for someone to come
out and they said that they could only pay me minimum wage for the job!
I told them that I wasn't interested in being paid and not to bother
with it.

They then paid for the items to be delivered, but never charged me
either excess - I presume it would have cost them at least that much to
do the paperwork and send someone to do it, but even so, a good result.

Never understood insurance companies. A skip lorry hit my car. Only a tap
really, with damage restricted to a rear door. Which still opened and
closed OK and window etc still fine. Just a dent. The loss adjuster
decided the door had to be replaced with a new one. On a 12 year old car -
but in very good nick. And the total cost of doing that exceeded the
value. A good used door - in the correct colour - could be bought for
about £70 - not the £700 plus of the repair.

--
*I never drink anything stronger than gin before breakfast *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Thursday, 14 December 2017 01:11:29 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Steve Walker wrote:
The insurance company (Direct Line) said that as it was two separate
events, there would be two excesses to pay (2 x �50). They also put me
in touch with a company that specialised in out of production stock and
actually managed to get me a replacement washbasin and toilet bowl.

I said I would fit it myself rather than them paying for someone to come
out and they said that they could only pay me minimum wage for the job!
I told them that I wasn't interested in being paid and not to bother
with it.

They then paid for the items to be delivered, but never charged me
either excess - I presume it would have cost them at least that much to
do the paperwork and send someone to do it, but even so, a good result.

Never understood insurance companies. A skip lorry hit my car. Only a tap
really, with damage restricted to a rear door. Which still opened and
closed OK and window etc still fine. Just a dent. The loss adjuster
decided the door had to be replaced with a new one. On a 12 year old car -
but in very good nick. And the total cost of doing that exceeded the
value. A good used door - in the correct colour - could be bought for
about �70 - not the �700 plus of the repair.

If an insurance company ever starts being sensible they'd capture much of the market. It's normal for garages to charge much higher prices to insurers.. ISTR there was one that had its own car repair centres.


NT

In article ,
wrote:
If an insurance company ever starts being sensible they'd capture much
of the market. It's normal for garages to charge much higher prices to
insurers. ISTR there was one that had its own car repair centres.

Not so sure about that. Most main dealers don't do bodywork etc themselves
on an insurance claim. Their hourly rates are far too high. They farm the
work out to a dedicated bodyshop with an hourly rate the insurance
companies will pay.

--
*Work like you don't need the money. Love like you've never been hurt.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Friday, 15 December 2017 00:57:00 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
tabbypurr wrote:

If an insurance company ever starts being sensible they'd capture much
of the market. It's normal for garages to charge much higher prices to
insurers. ISTR there was one that had its own car repair centres.

Not so sure about that.

I am

Most main dealers don't do bodywork etc themselves
on an insurance claim. Their hourly rates are far too high. They farm the
work out to a dedicated bodyshop with an hourly rate the insurance
companies will pay.

and?

In article ,
wrote:
On Friday, 15 December 2017 00:57:00 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
tabbypurr wrote:

If an insurance company ever starts being sensible they'd capture
much of the market. It's normal for garages to charge much higher
prices to insurers. ISTR there was one that had its own car repair
centres.

Not so sure about that.

I am

Most main dealers don't do bodywork etc themselves on an insurance
claim. Their hourly rates are far too high. They farm the work out to
a dedicated bodyshop with an hourly rate the insurance companies will
pay.

and?

The notion that insurance companies pay more than others is an urban myth.
Ask those in the trade who do such work.

--
*I'm pretty sure that sex is better than logic, but I can't prove it.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Friday, 15 December 2017 10:52:43 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
tabbypurr wrote:
On Friday, 15 December 2017 00:57:00 UTC, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
tabbypurr wrote:

If an insurance company ever starts being sensible they'd capture
much of the market. It's normal for garages to charge much higher
prices to insurers. ISTR there was one that had its own car repair
centres.

Not so sure about that.

I am

Most main dealers don't do bodywork etc themselves on an insurance
claim. Their hourly rates are far too high. They farm the work out to
a dedicated bodyshop with an hourly rate the insurance companies will
pay.

and?

The notion that insurance companies pay more than others is an urban myth.

it isn't

Ask those in the trade who do such work.

I have, repeatedly. It's why one insurer set up their own repair places years ago. I forget who though.


NT

On 14/12/2017 01:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Steve Walker wrote:
The insurance company (Direct Line) said that as it was two separate
events, there would be two excesses to pay (2 x £50). They also put me
in touch with a company that specialised in out of production stock and
actually managed to get me a replacement washbasin and toilet bowl.

I said I would fit it myself rather than them paying for someone to come
out and they said that they could only pay me minimum wage for the job!
I told them that I wasn't interested in being paid and not to bother
with it.

They then paid for the items to be delivered, but never charged me
either excess - I presume it would have cost them at least that much to
do the paperwork and send someone to do it, but even so, a good result.

Never understood insurance companies. A skip lorry hit my car. Only a tap
really, with damage restricted to a rear door. Which still opened and
closed OK and window etc still fine. Just a dent. The loss adjuster
decided the door had to be replaced with a new one. On a 12 year old car -
but in very good nick. And the total cost of doing that exceeded the
value. A good used door - in the correct colour - could be bought for
about £70 - not the £700 plus of the repair.

Yes. Before I had my own car, I'd borrowed my mother's car and someone
ran into the back of me while I was stationary at a zebra. The impact
folded the rear panel flat, crumpled the boot floor and the end of each
wing. The car was a Fiat 130CL, well beyond its best and not worth
fixing. Insurance quotes for repair were £800 and we told the assessor
from his insurance company that we'd be happy to have it written off for
£500, as we were ready to replace it anyway. They insisted on repair and
it ended up costing £950. Three months later we sold it for £350!

SteveW

On Friday, 15 December 2017 21:12:47 UTC, Steve Walker wrote:
On 14/12/2017 01:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Steve Walker wrote:
The insurance company (Direct Line) said that as it was two separate
events, there would be two excesses to pay (2 x £50). They also put me
in touch with a company that specialised in out of production stock and
actually managed to get me a replacement washbasin and toilet bowl.

I said I would fit it myself rather than them paying for someone to come
out and they said that they could only pay me minimum wage for the job!
I told them that I wasn't interested in being paid and not to bother
with it.

They then paid for the items to be delivered, but never charged me
either excess - I presume it would have cost them at least that much to
do the paperwork and send someone to do it, but even so, a good result..

Never understood insurance companies. A skip lorry hit my car. Only a tap
really, with damage restricted to a rear door. Which still opened and
closed OK and window etc still fine. Just a dent. The loss adjuster
decided the door had to be replaced with a new one. On a 12 year old car -
but in very good nick. And the total cost of doing that exceeded the
value. A good used door - in the correct colour - could be bought for
about £70 - not the £700 plus of the repair.

Yes. Before I had my own car, I'd borrowed my mother's car and someone
ran into the back of me while I was stationary at a zebra. The impact
folded the rear panel flat, crumpled the boot floor and the end of each
wing. The car was a Fiat 130CL, well beyond its best and not worth
fixing. Insurance quotes for repair were £800 and we told the assessor
from his insurance company that we'd be happy to have it written off for
£500, as we were ready to replace it anyway. They insisted on repair and
it ended up costing £950. Three months later we sold it for £350!

SteveW

On Planet Sane, competition would wipe these companies out. Why hasn't it?


NT

"Steve Walker" wrote in message
news
On 14/12/2017 01:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Steve Walker wrote:
The insurance company (Direct Line) said that as it was two separate
events, there would be two excesses to pay (2 x £50). They also put me
in touch with a company that specialised in out of production stock and
actually managed to get me a replacement washbasin and toilet bowl.

I said I would fit it myself rather than them paying for someone to come
out and they said that they could only pay me minimum wage for the job!
I told them that I wasn't interested in being paid and not to bother
with it.

They then paid for the items to be delivered, but never charged me
either excess - I presume it would have cost them at least that much to
do the paperwork and send someone to do it, but even so, a good result.

Never understood insurance companies. A skip lorry hit my car. Only a tap
really, with damage restricted to a rear door. Which still opened and
closed OK and window etc still fine. Just a dent. The loss adjuster
decided the door had to be replaced with a new one. On a 12 year old
car -
but in very good nick. And the total cost of doing that exceeded the
value. A good used door - in the correct colour - could be bought for
about £70 - not the £700 plus of the repair.

Yes. Before I had my own car, I'd borrowed my mother's car and someone ran
into the back of me while I was stationary at a zebra. The impact folded
the rear panel flat, crumpled the boot floor and the end of each wing. The
car was a Fiat 130CL, well beyond its best and not worth fixing.
Insurance quotes for repair were £800 and we told the assessor from his
insurance company that we'd be happy to have it written off for £500, as
we were ready to replace it anyway. They insisted on repair and it ended
up costing £950. Three months later we sold it for £350!

Unlikely that any are so stupid today with other than unique cars.

wrote in message
...
On Friday, 15 December 2017 21:12:47 UTC, Steve Walker wrote:
On 14/12/2017 01:07, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Steve Walker wrote:
The insurance company (Direct Line) said that as it was two separate
events, there would be two excesses to pay (2 x £50). They also put me
in touch with a company that specialised in out of production stock
and
actually managed to get me a replacement washbasin and toilet bowl.

I said I would fit it myself rather than them paying for someone to
come
out and they said that they could only pay me minimum wage for the
job!
I told them that I wasn't interested in being paid and not to bother
with it.

They then paid for the items to be delivered, but never charged me
either excess - I presume it would have cost them at least that much
to
do the paperwork and send someone to do it, but even so, a good
result.

Never understood insurance companies. A skip lorry hit my car. Only a
tap
really, with damage restricted to a rear door. Which still opened and
closed OK and window etc still fine. Just a dent. The loss adjuster
decided the door had to be replaced with a new one. On a 12 year old
car -
but in very good nick. And the total cost of doing that exceeded the
value. A good used door - in the correct colour - could be bought for
about £70 - not the £700 plus of the repair.

Yes. Before I had my own car, I'd borrowed my mother's car and someone
ran into the back of me while I was stationary at a zebra. The impact
folded the rear panel flat, crumpled the boot floor and the end of each
wing. The car was a Fiat 130CL, well beyond its best and not worth
fixing. Insurance quotes for repair were £800 and we told the assessor
from his insurance company that we'd be happy to have it written off for
£500, as we were ready to replace it anyway. They insisted on repair and
it ended up costing £950. Three months later we sold it for £350!

On Planet Sane, competition would wipe these companies out. Why hasn't it?

It did, the worst of them went bust or were bought and asset stripped.

On Saturday, 16 December 2017 22:32:05 UTC, Rod Speed wrote:
tabbypurr wrote in message

On Planet Sane, competition would wipe these companies out. Why hasn't it?

It did, the worst of them went bust or were bought and asset stripped.

Maybe Rod lives on another planet

wrote
Rod Speed wrote
tabbypurr wrote in message

On Planet Sane, competition would wipe these companies out. Why hasn't
it?

It did, the worst of them went bust or were bought and asset stripped.

Maybe Rod lives on another planet

You seriously trying to claim that no insurance company ever went bust or
was asset stripped ?

Presumably you are that terminal a ****wit.