Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.

Except the Express. A headline about overseas aid. They certainly know
their target market.

--
*The more people I meet, the more I like my dog.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

I don't know what the great problem is with tax avoidance, its been going on
for as long as there have been taxes, its seen as good sport by many. I have
little sympathy with rrich companies getting caught myself, some individuals
have to actually maximise their funds so they will last.
Brian

--
----- -
This newsgroup posting comes to you directly from...
The Sofa of Brian Gaff...

Blind user, so no pictures please!
"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.

Except the Express. A headline about overseas aid. They certainly know
their target market.

--
*The more people I meet, the more I like my dog.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.

Except the Express. A headline about overseas aid. They certainly know
their target market.

I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.
Until such times as these aggressive schemes become re-defined as Tax
Evasion and therefore illegal, the rich and big business will act to
avoid paying more than they have to and the moral argument will rarely
be enough to make them change their ways.

On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Furthermore using ISAs is still being encouraged by increasing the
limits, widening the types of product allowed to be ISA wrapped and the
extra flexibility of IFISAs

On 07/11/17 13:51, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.

Except the Express. A headline about overseas aid. They certainly know
their target market.


The guardian knows their target market as well.

It's the money grabbing views of the advertisers and proprietors of the
freely distributed papers and websites, and talk radio, that sway the
conscious of the morning asleep with their mostly right wing ideals,
that need watching ....

Occasionally do they get get pulled up (good), and then Metro starts
welcoming advertising from strange quarters like UNISON, and subtle
changes in slant for that day - often having a dig at other media groups
to look just great :-|

--
Adrian C

On 07/11/17 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Anyone who has bought duty free as well..


--
"It is an established fact to 97% confidence limits that left wing
conspirators see right wing conspiracies everywhere"

"Dave Plowman (News)" wrote in message
...
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.

If it's not illegal what's the problem?
I see your mate Steptoe is looking to send the Queen to the tower.
Stupid *******.
He's scared ****less of talking brexit.

Except the Express. A headline about overseas aid. They certainly know
their target market.

On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could
send my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me
free of tax, with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the
notice of HMRC.

However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so
how come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

On 07/11/2017 15:10, The Natural Philosopher wrote:
On 07/11/17 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Anyone who has bought duty free as well..


Even in the Canary Islands :-)

"Andrew" wrote in message
news
On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could
send my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me
free of tax, with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the
notice of HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at people just
like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got large tax
bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so
how come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

tim

On 07/11/2017 13:51, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.

Except the Express. A headline about overseas aid. They certainly know
their target market.


No Maddie or Di news then?

--
Adam

On 07/11/17 18:28, Tim Streater wrote:
In article , Bob Minchin
wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.

Except the Express. A headline about overseas aid. They certainly know
their target market.

I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.
Until such times as these aggressive schemes become re-defined as Tax
Evasion and therefore illegal, the rich and big business will act to
avoid paying more than they have to and the moral argument will rarely
be enough to make them change their ways.

I don't think the moral argument applies. I assume they have a legal
duty to their shareholders to minimise tax.

Indeed.

What is going on is an attempt to redefine the Law in moral terms. Its
standard lefty**** stuff really.




--
"Anyone who believes that the laws of physics are mere social
conventions is invited to try transgressing those conventions from the
windows of my apartment. (I live on the twenty-first floor.) "

Alan Sokal

Andrew wrote:

when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could
send my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me
free of tax, with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the
notice of HMRC.

However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant

It was probably suggested /by/ their accountants

On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news
On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could
send my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me
free of tax, with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the
notice of HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at people just
like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got large tax
bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so
how come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive accountant can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people spring to mind.

On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 03:19:10 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news
On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could send
my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me free of tax,
with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the notice of HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at people
just like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got
large tax bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so how
come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive
accountant can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people spring
to mind.

No. See above: TESSA, ISA, Duty Free, and I do not nor have ever had an
accountant.

Other measures that can be put in place are ways to avoid Inheritance
Tax. Again its not complicated and no accountant is needed.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news
On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could
send my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me
free of tax, with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the
notice of HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at people
just
like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got large
tax
bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so
how come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive accountant
can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people spring to mind.

It's clear that the people who design these schemes pay backhanders to the
accountants that recommend them

were you suggesting something more sinister?

tim

On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 06:22:23 -0600, Mark Allread
wrote:

On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 03:19:10 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could send
my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me free of tax,
with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the notice of HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at people
just like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got
large tax bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so how
come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive
accountant can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people spring
to mind.

No. See above: TESSA, ISA, Duty Free, and I do not nor have ever had an
accountant.

Billionaires aren't going to bother with those; they don't save
'enough' tax.

Other measures that can be put in place are ways to avoid Inheritance
Tax. Again its not complicated and no accountant is needed.

I guess most people would still need advice, which could be expensive,
relative to the amount of money they have.

--
If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around to hear him, is he still wrong?

"Mark Allread" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 03:19:10 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could send
my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me free of tax,
with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the notice of HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at people
just like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got
large tax bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so how
come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive
accountant can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people spring
to mind.

No. See above: TESSA, ISA, Duty Free, and I do not nor have ever had an
accountant.

Other measures that can be put in place are ways to avoid Inheritance
Tax. Again its not complicated and no accountant is needed.

the PP was specifically referring to schemes of the type that Mrs. Brown's
Boys took advantage of

These schemes are complex in nature and usually questionable in
effectiveness

They are only obtainable via an intermediately that recommends them to you

they are not diy-able

tim

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 12:22:26 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 03:19:10 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could send
my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me free of tax,
with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the notice of HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at people
just like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got
large tax bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so how
come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive
accountant can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people spring
to mind.

No. See above: TESSA, ISA, Duty Free, and I do not nor have ever had an
accountant.

Other measures that can be put in place are ways to avoid Inheritance
Tax. Again its not complicated and no accountant is needed.

So why are they hired by the rich ?

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 13:16:13 UTC, tim wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could
send my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me
free of tax, with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the
notice of HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at people
just
like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got large
tax
bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so
how come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive accountant
can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people spring to mind.

It's clear that the people who design these schemes pay backhanders to the
accountants that recommend them

were you suggesting something more sinister?

More sinsister than breaking tax laws for money ?

Or are yuo saying Lewis Hameltons ex was a prostitute ?
sorry can't remmeber her name but he took here on his own airplane/jet for a holiday.

On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 08:06:51 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 12:22:26 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 03:19:10 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping
today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA
is/was seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could
send my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me free of
tax, with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the notice of
HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at
people just like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got
large tax bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so how
come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive
accountant can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people
spring to mind.

No. See above: TESSA, ISA, Duty Free, and I do not nor have ever had
an accountant.

Other measures that can be put in place are ways to avoid Inheritance
Tax. Again its not complicated and no accountant is needed.

So why are they hired by the rich ?

Perhaps because the wealthy are too busy/not skilled enough to look into
options for themselves and consider it is worth them employing someone to
look into it for them[+]. I dunno but I do know that I can/have taken
legally permitted steps to mitigate my tax liability. Anyone who does
not is an idiot.

[+] I use a gardener from time to time because his hourly rate is less
than my hourly rate. I could do the garden myself but it is not worth my
time/cost to do so.

I do not have an accountant/bookkeeper or whatever as I can do those
things myself and it effectively costs me less to do so. Were I far
wealthier then I may decide my time is worth more than hiring someone to
do it for me (gardener, above).

I expect that a large number of people who need to will have various tax
avoidance measures in place without seeking advice from an accountant or
tax lawyer.

I'm surprised if you don't for example.

"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 12:22:26 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 03:19:10 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA is/was
seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could send
my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me free of tax,
with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the notice of HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at
people
just like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got
large tax bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so how
come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive
accountant can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people
spring
to mind.

No. See above: TESSA, ISA, Duty Free, and I do not nor have ever had an
accountant.

Other measures that can be put in place are ways to avoid Inheritance
Tax. Again its not complicated and no accountant is needed.

So why are they hired by the rich ?

Because they need more complicated stuff done and generally
pay people to do even the most basic stuff like clean the dunnys.

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 16:31:16 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 08:06:51 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 12:22:26 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 03:19:10 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping
today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity..

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA
is/was seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could
send my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me free of
tax, with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the notice of
HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at
people just like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got
large tax bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so how
come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive
accountant can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people
spring to mind.

No. See above: TESSA, ISA, Duty Free, and I do not nor have ever had
an accountant.

Other measures that can be put in place are ways to avoid Inheritance
Tax. Again its not complicated and no accountant is needed.

So why are they hired by the rich ?

Perhaps because the wealthy are too busy/not skilled enough to look into
options for themselves and consider it is worth them employing someone to
look into it for them[+]. I dunno but I do know that I can/have taken
legally permitted steps to mitigate my tax liability. Anyone who does
not is an idiot.

[+] I use a gardener from time to time because his hourly rate is less
than my hourly rate. I could do the garden myself but it is not worth my
time/cost to do so.

I do not have an accountant/bookkeeper or whatever as I can do those
things myself and it effectively costs me less to do so. Were I far
wealthier then I may decide my time is worth more than hiring someone to
do it for me (gardener, above).

I expect that a large number of people who need to will have various tax
avoidance measures in place without seeking advice from an accountant or
tax lawyer.

I'm surprised if you don't for example.

I've got an ISA, but I didn't know I could save £3million on a jet by claiming I was only using it for buisness and not for pleasure. I didnlt know that if I took my girlfriend on the said plane to an island for a holiday I could call it a business trip, did you klnow that ?
Did yuo klnow that if you set upm a busness on a 'tax haven' and send money to it you can then lend that money back and it's not clessed as income ?

So why doesn't everyone do that ?

On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 10:31:13 -0600, Mark Allread
wrote:

On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 08:06:51 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 12:22:26 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 03:19:10 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Tuesday, 7 November 2017 18:16:23 UTC, tim... wrote:
"Andrew" wrote in message
news On 07/11/2017 14:53, Mark Allread wrote:
On Tue, 07 Nov 2017 14:50:22 +0000, Bob Minchin wrote:

Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping
today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.


I musty admit I get fed up with all the Tax Avoidance publicity.

Me too - lets face it, anyone who has/had an ISA or a TESSA
is/was seeking to avoid tax.

Maybe, but when I was a computer programmer with my own ltd co
working through an agency, it never occurred to me that I could
send my money to Mauritious and then 'lend' it back to me free of
tax, with no obligation to pay it back, and escape the notice of
HMRC.

you may not have done but there were several schemes marketed at
people just like you and many took advantage of it

Most, if not all were unwound by HMRC and the people concerned got
large tax bills to pay.



However, it would never escape the notice of my accountant, so how
come Mrs Browns 'boys' get away with it ?.

you just employ a different accountant

yes it's strange that only those that can afford very expensive
accountant can afford to aviod tax. Backhanders to certain people
spring to mind.

No. See above: TESSA, ISA, Duty Free, and I do not nor have ever had
an accountant.

Other measures that can be put in place are ways to avoid Inheritance
Tax. Again its not complicated and no accountant is needed.

So why are they hired by the rich ?

Perhaps because the wealthy are too busy/not skilled enough to look into
options for themselves and consider it is worth them employing someone to
look into it for them[+].

Or they have enough money that it's worth them paying someone else to
reduce their tax burden. For most there isn't the savings to make it
worthwhile.

I dunno but I do know that I can/have taken
legally permitted steps to mitigate my tax liability. Anyone who does
not is an idiot.

Or is not so knowledgeable, or doesn't earn enough to reduce their tax
liability significantly.

-- snip --
I expect that a large number of people who need to will have various tax
avoidance measures in place without seeking advice from an accountant or
tax lawyer.

I expect that the majority of people have few tax avoidance measures
and save very little.

--
If a man stands in a forest and no woman is around to hear him, is he still wrong?

Mark Allread posted
Other measures that can be put in place are ways to avoid Inheritance
Tax. Again its not complicated and no accountant is needed.

Really? How do you do it then?

--
Jack

On 08/11/2017 16:50, Rod Speed wrote:
"whisky-dave" wrote in message
...
On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 12:22:26 UTC, Mark AllreadÂ* wrote:

Other measures that can be put in place are ways to avoid Inheritance
Tax.Â* Again its not complicated and no accountant is needed.

So why are they hired by the rich ?

Because they need more complicated stuff done and generally
pay people to do even the most basic stuff like clean the dunnys.

Dunny? Do you mean the proverbial?

--
Max Demian

whisky-dave wrote:

Did yuo klnow that if you set upm a busness on a 'tax haven' and
send money to it you can then lend that money back and it's not
clessed as income ?


Yes, our accountants mentioned that scheme a few years ago

So why doesn't everyone do that ?

We didn't because it felt "dodgy" and sure enough Jimmy Carr hit the
headlines the following year

On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 09:01:37 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 16:31:16 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:

So why are they hired by the rich ?

Perhaps because the wealthy are too busy/not skilled enough to look
into options for themselves and consider it is worth them employing
someone to look into it for them[+]. I dunno but I do know that I
can/have taken legally permitted steps to mitigate my tax liability.
Anyone who does not is an idiot.


I expect that a large number of people who need to will have various
tax avoidance measures in place without seeking advice from an
accountant or tax lawyer.

I'm surprised if you don't for example.

I've got an ISA, but I didn't know I could save £3million on a jet by
claiming I was only using it for buisness and not for pleasure.

Not having £3million to spend its not something I thought about


didnlt know that if I took my girlfriend on the said plane to an island
for a holiday I could call it a business trip, did you klnow that ?

Not having a plane or a girlfriend its not something I thought about

Did yuo klnow that if you set upm a busness on a 'tax haven' and send
money to it you can then lend that money back and it's not clessed as
income ?

Not having enough money to do that, its not something I thought about.


So why doesn't everyone do that ?

They don't have enough money to make it worth thinking about?

I guess the truth of all this is that you are simply envious of those who
do have that kind of money; I, on the other hand, am not.

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 17:24:07 UTC, Andy Burns wrote:
whisky-dave wrote:

Did yuo klnow that if you set upm a busness on a 'tax haven' and
send money to it you can then lend that money back and it's not
clessed as income ?


Yes, our accountants mentioned that scheme a few years ago

so you did need an accountant to tell you, you couldn't work it out yourself.

can you do the same with a car or a coach or a train ?


So why doesn't everyone do that ?

We didn't because it felt "dodgy" and sure enough Jimmy Carr hit the
headlines the following year

He blammed his accountants, but didn't David Cameron criticise him and then it was found out that DC was also using tax aviodance sheme .

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 17:56:38 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
On Wed, 08 Nov 2017 09:01:37 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 16:31:16 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:

So why are they hired by the rich ?

Perhaps because the wealthy are too busy/not skilled enough to look
into options for themselves and consider it is worth them employing
someone to look into it for them[+]. I dunno but I do know that I
can/have taken legally permitted steps to mitigate my tax liability.
Anyone who does not is an idiot.


I expect that a large number of people who need to will have various
tax avoidance measures in place without seeking advice from an
accountant or tax lawyer.

I'm surprised if you don't for example.

I've got an ISA, but I didn't know I could save £3million on a jet by
claiming I was only using it for buisness and not for pleasure.

Not having £3million to spend its not something I thought about

I's not the amount, but the plane was brought on the pretence that it was for business purp[ose use ONLY and not for private holidays which would make it a taxable item.
So why not try it with a car see if yuo can claim back your tax on that.
Even I know that if you buy something for business it is tax deductable.



didnlt know that if I took my girlfriend on the said plane to an island
for a holiday I could call it a business trip, did you klnow that ?

Not having a plane or a girlfriend its not something I thought about

but you can do the same with a car or a boat or anything esle can't you.


Did yuo klnow that if you set upm a busness on a 'tax haven' and send
money to it you can then lend that money back and it's not clessed as
income ?

Not having enough money to do that, its not something I thought about.

Well maybe you'd have more money if you did think about it.


So why doesn't everyone do that ?

They don't have enough money to make it worth thinking about?

If they didn't pay so much tax they might have more money to think about.

Imagine if everyone that has ever brought a car could get the tax they paid on it given back to them because they only use it for busness.



I guess the truth of all this is that you are simply envious of those who
do have that kind of money; I, on the other hand, am not.

Not envious but I donlt like to think they aren't paying their share to the NHS or anything else.

On Thu, 09 Nov 2017 03:38:34 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 17:56:38 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
I guess the truth of all this is that you are simply envious of those
who do have that kind of money; I, on the other hand, am not.

Not envious but I donlt like to think they aren't paying their share to
the NHS or anything else.

We have already established you are a tax avoider so you are the same as
anyone else who seeks to avoid tax.

What you appear to be objecting to is the scale of the avoidance which
means you must have a degree of envy.

Tax evasion, of course, is an entirely different thing and it is tax
evasion that has caught out so many people in the past.

On Thursday, 9 November 2017 15:45:55 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
On Thu, 09 Nov 2017 03:38:34 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 17:56:38 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
I guess the truth of all this is that you are simply envious of those
who do have that kind of money; I, on the other hand, am not.

Not envious but I donlt like to think they aren't paying their share to
the NHS or anything else.

We have already established you are a tax avoider so you are the same as
anyone else who seeks to avoid tax.

How do you work that one out, or are you getting confused with evasion ?


What you appear to be objecting to is the scale of the avoidance which
means you must have a degree of envy.

Well £3 million will help more than £3 quid .
If I brought illegally imported alcohol I could avoid paying tax on it but that is illegal.


Tax evasion, of course, is an entirely different thing and it is tax
evasion that has caught out so many people in the past.

So what does say Lewis hamilton doing in this example when he brought a jet for business use for 16 million and he got the tax paid on it back ?
Even though the jet was being used for private use just like you would use yuor car for private use, so tell me why we can;t buy a car and say it;s for business use claim the tax back and then use it to go on family holidays ?

Ypou seem to think he has done nothing wrong but perhaps we should wait and see what the HM Revenue and Customs say.

Perhaps yuo could explain why the Isle of Man government has called in the British tax office, which will this month begin a review of 231 tax refunds issued to private jet owners since 2011, in a $1bn VAT giveaway.

Nothing to do with envy.

In article ,
Mark Allread wrote:
What you appear to be objecting to is the scale of the avoidance which
means you must have a degree of envy.

Tax evasion, of course, is an entirely different thing and it is tax
evasion that has caught out so many people in the past.

The two are often the same once regulations catch up with them. Same as
any scam. Con men are often one step ahead of the law.

Good to know you think it moral, though.

--
*The fact that no one understands you doesn't mean you're an artist

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
says...

On 07/11/2017 13:51, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Idly looked at all today's paper headlines while shopping today.

All were about tax avoidance in one form or another.

Except the Express. A headline about overseas aid. They certainly know
their target market.


No Maddie or Di news then?

Must have used the apocalyptical weather forecast headline already that
week...

On Thu, 09 Nov 2017 09:45:52 -0600, Mark Allread wrote:

We have already established you are a tax avoider so you are the same as
anyone else who seeks to avoid tax.

What you appear to be objecting to is the scale of the avoidance which
means you must have a degree of envy.

Indeed. Reminds me of:

Churchill: "Madam, would you sleep with me for five million pounds?"

Socialite: "My goodness, Mr. Churchill... Well, I suppose... we would
have to discuss terms, of course... "

Churchill: "Would you sleep with me for five pounds?"

Socialite: "Mr. Churchill, what kind of woman do you think I am?!"

Churchill: "Madam, we've already established that. Now we are haggling
about the price€�

--
My posts are my copyright and if @diy_forums or Home Owners' Hub
wish to copy them they can pay me £1 a message.
Use the BIG mirror service in the UK: http://www.mirrorservice.org
*lightning surge protection* - a w_tom conductor

On Thu, 09 Nov 2017 08:08:27 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Thursday, 9 November 2017 15:45:55 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
On Thu, 09 Nov 2017 03:38:34 -0800, whisky-dave wrote:

On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 17:56:38 UTC, Mark Allread wrote:
I guess the truth of all this is that you are simply envious of
those who do have that kind of money; I, on the other hand, am not.

Not envious but I donlt like to think they aren't paying their share
to the NHS or anything else.

We have already established you are a tax avoider so you are the same
as anyone else who seeks to avoid tax.

How do you work that one out, or are you getting confused with evasion ?

You have an ISA - you said so earlier; had you forgotten?


What you appear to be objecting to is the scale of the avoidance which
means you must have a degree of envy.

Well £3 million will help more than £3 quid .
If I brought illegally imported alcohol I could avoid paying tax on it
but that is illegal.

We are not discussing tax evasion but tax avoidance - something that you
and many others do.


Tax evasion, of course, is an entirely different thing and it is tax
evasion that has caught out so many people in the past.

So what does say Lewis hamilton doing in this example when he brought a
jet for business use for 16 million and he got the tax paid on it back ?
Even though the jet was being used for private use just like you would
use yuor car for private use, so tell me why we can;t buy a car and say
it;s for business use claim the tax back and then use it to go on family
holidays ?

Ypou seem to think he has done nothing wrong but perhaps we should wait
and see what the HM Revenue and Customs say.

I've never said that anywhere. If he has evaded tax he is guilty of a
crime.


Perhaps yuo could explain why the Isle of Man government has called in
the British tax office, which will this month begin a review of 231 tax
refunds issued to private jet owners since 2011, in a $1bn VAT giveaway.


I've no idea as I am a) not in the IoM government nor b) in the HMRC

Nothing to do with envy.

OK so you are not envious of those who like you are tax avoiders (but
have managed to do so with greater sums of money that you have) nor, like
everyone else, do you support tax evasion.

So why are you getting so wound up about those who legitimately avoid tax?

On Thu, 09 Nov 2017 16:32:07 +0000, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

In article ,
Mark Allread wrote:
What you appear to be objecting to is the scale of the avoidance which
means you must have a degree of envy.

Tax evasion, of course, is an entirely different thing and it is tax
evasion that has caught out so many people in the past.

The two are often the same once regulations catch up with them. Same as
any scam. Con men are often one step ahead of the law.

If its a scam its illegal. Nothing difficult about that.


Good to know you think it moral, though.

Tax avoidance is indeed perfectly legal. You are the one who has
introduced morality into it. Maybe you find it difficult to separate
legal from moral in the same way that some have difficulty in
understanding the difference between avoidance and evasion.

I'm gratified to learn from your comments that you have never had any tax
avoidance measures in place - you must be one of the very few who have
never bought anything duty free on overseas holidays nor had one of the
various tax exempt savings accounts.

Do/Did you take advantage of the tax free allowances when being paid -
presumably not if you think tax avoidance is immoral.

On Thu, 09 Nov 2017 18:22:03 +0000, Bob Eager wrote:

On Thu, 09 Nov 2017 09:45:52 -0600, Mark Allread wrote:

We have already established you are a tax avoider so you are the same
as anyone else who seeks to avoid tax.

What you appear to be objecting to is the scale of the avoidance which
means you must have a degree of envy.

Indeed. Reminds me of:

Churchill: "Madam, would you sleep with me for five million pounds?"

Socialite: "My goodness, Mr. Churchill... Well, I suppose... we would
have to discuss terms, of course... "

Churchill: "Would you sleep with me for five pounds?"

Socialite: "Mr. Churchill, what kind of woman do you think I am?!"

Churchill: "Madam, we've already established that. Now we are haggling
about the price€�

That recollection had flashed across my mind also :-)

whisky-dave posted
On Wednesday, 8 November 2017 17:24:07 UTC, Andy Burns wrote:

We didn't because it felt "dodgy" and sure enough Jimmy Carr hit the
headlines the following year

He blammed his accountants, but didn't David Cameron criticise him and
then it was found out that DC was also using tax aviodance sheme .

No, it wasn't. What happened was that the Guardian slung a lot of mud
about Cameron's father's offshore investment fund, deliberately
confusing the various meanings of the word "trust" to imply that Cameron
was avoiding tax. Finally it became clear that he wasn't, and the
guardian had to climb down and talk about "ill-advised" and "unnecessary
secrecy" blah blah.

--
Jack