I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

On Sun, 14 Jun 2015 10:34:57 +0100, rick wrote:

I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

I don't think it's the hardware you need to worry about; it's more
whether your floppy has retained data integrity since it was written.

On Sun, 14 Jun 2015 10:02:13 +0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jun 2015 10:34:57 +0100, rick wrote:

I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

I don't think it's the hardware you need to worry about; it's more
whether your floppy has retained data integrity since it was written.

I threw out my BBC collection some years back. The floppy is probably
unreadable, but if you have a linux computer, you could probably find
a means of getting the text from the disk.

DOS had a "dump" command or similar, that may be a way of dragging the
data off. I suspect it may be a little intolerant of none DOS
partitions though.


AB

On Sun, 14 Jun 2015 11:32:13 +0100, Archibald Tarquin Blenkinsopp wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jun 2015 10:02:13 +0000 (UTC), Cursitor Doom
wrote:

On Sun, 14 Jun 2015 10:34:57 +0100, rick wrote:

I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk
.........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

I don't think it's the hardware you need to worry about; it's more
whether your floppy has retained data integrity since it was written.

I threw out my BBC collection some years back. The floppy is probably
unreadable, but if you have a linux computer, you could probably find a
means of getting the text from the disk.

DOS had a "dump" command or similar, that may be a way of dragging the
data off. I suspect it may be a little intolerant of none DOS partitions
though.

The problem is that it was probably formatted with 1kB sectors, or
something like that.

On 14/06/2015 10:34, rick wrote:
I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

A quick google does suggest their are some pay-services that might get
this data off for you.
http://www.shlock.co.uk/Utils/OmniFlop/OmniFlop.htm

is one.

This site might be useful, I am sure there are many others:
http://www.shlock.co.uk/Utils/OmniFlop/OmniFlop.htm

In message
rick wrote:

I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

Try asking (nicely) in comp.sys.acorn.misc

--
Jim White
Wimbledon London England

In article ,
Fredxxx wrote:
On 14/06/2015 10:34, rick wrote:
I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

A quick google does suggest their are some pay-services that might get
this data off for you.
http://www.shlock.co.uk/Utils/OmniFlop/OmniFlop.htm

is one.

This site might be useful, I am sure there are many others:
http://www.shlock.co.uk/Utils/OmniFlop/OmniFlop.htm

Rick,
I'd suggest asking on comp.sys.acorn.misc where there are some
helpful folk unless Dave (sound) Plowman reads this on this group

John

--
John Mulrooney
NOTE Email address IS correct but might not be checked for a while.

On 14/06/15 12:21, Jim White wrote:
In message
rick wrote:

I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

Try asking (nicely) in comp.sys.acorn.misc

And cam.misc. Loads of ex acorn people in there many of whom are slf
appointed IT museums.

Not sire I don't have access to one here also, or maybe its an Apple II



--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

En el artículo , rick rick_hughes@_remo
ve_btconnect.com escribió:

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

You can read it using a PC with a floppy drive, there should be plenty
of those knocking around (or borrow an USB floppy.)

Then use software from this page to retrieve the files:

http://www.8bs.com/filecon.htm

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

On 14/06/2015 13:43, Huge wrote:
On 2015-06-14, rick wrote:
I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

If all else fails, have a word with the Computing Museum at Bletchley
Park. I gave them two ...

This bunch also maintain a warehouse full of kit and let people use it:

http://www.computinghistory.org.uk


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

rick wrote:
I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.
It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

I have Acorn computers with 3.5" drives that can most likely read
your disk (A5000, Master, DFS, ADFS, HADFS, DOSFS - a Compact is
likely to be ADFS). I could extract your data for postage. See my
website for my email address.

jgh - mdfs.net/portfolio

In article ,
John Mulrooney wrote:
I'd suggest asking on comp.sys.acorn.misc where there are some
helpful folk unless Dave (sound) Plowman reads this on this group

You could take that both ways. ;-)

If it's the normal ADFS, the floppy drive on my RPC certainly still works.
Must admit to not knowing what a BBC compact is, though.

--
*"I am " is reportedly the shortest sentence in the English language. *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Sunday, 14 June 2015 18:40:18 UTC+1, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
Must admit to not knowing what a BBC compact is, though.

An agreement to keep quiet about historic child abuse?

A soap opera from the early 1960s?

Or a "two-box" version of the BBC Micro with the power supply in the disc drive box. "No commercial software or utilities, others than those included on the Welcome disk were ever made available for the system."
http://www.computinghistory.org.uk/d...aster-compact/

Owain

The issue is finding the right software to emulate the drive format I'd
imagine. There used to be some dos software to do this back in the day.
Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"rick" wrote in message
...
I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

Yes indeed, I have lots of discs made on a Spectrum with various disc
formats, and most seem to be still readable, but the issue seems to be that
some more modern drives don't read them while others do.


Brian

--
From the Sofa of Brian Gaff Reply address is active
"Cursitor Doom" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 14 Jun 2015 10:34:57 +0100, rick wrote:

I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

I don't think it's the hardware you need to worry about; it's more
whether your floppy has retained data integrity since it was written.

In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
The issue is finding the right software to emulate the drive format I'd
imagine. There used to be some dos software to do this back in the day.

Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC. Called
ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on this RPC.


I'm not sure what other Acorn devices allowed.

--
*One tequila, two tequila, three tequila, floor.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 15/06/15 11:13, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
The issue is finding the right software to emulate the drive format I'd
imagine. There used to be some dos software to do this back in the day.

Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC. Called
ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on this RPC.



Mmm. Its also a bit of gamble on early devices as to whether or not
games were played to put ofd numbers of tracks and sectors on.

If not, then you should be able to dd the raw device and pick over the
data and recreate the filing system from that if you care to, but if the
drive uses bits that even dd doesnt recognise, all bets are off..





I'm not sure what other Acorn devices allowed.



--
New Socialism consists essentially in being seen to have your heart in
the right place whilst your head is in the clouds and your hand is in
someone else's pocket.

On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 12:19:48 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 15/06/15 11:13, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
The issue is finding the right software to emulate the drive format
I'd imagine. There used to be some dos software to do this back in the
day.

Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC.
Called ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on
this RPC.



Mmm. Its also a bit of gamble on early devices as to whether or not
games were played to put ofd numbers of tracks and sectors on.

If not, then you should be able to dd the raw device and pick over the
data and recreate the filing system from that if you care to, but if the
drive uses bits that even dd doesnt recognise, all bets are off..

In BSD at least, you can discover the sector numbers even if they are
strange ones. Can't use dd, but a simple program could get the sectors
off.

In article ,
rick wrote:
I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?


You don't seem to have come back to this, but I'd certainly be willing to
transfer it to a CD or whatever, if my RPC can read it.

Contact me by email - address at the bottom of the post and note the spam
trap.

--
*Reality? Is that where the pizza delivery guy comes from?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On 15/06/2015 11:13, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
The issue is finding the right software to emulate the drive format I'd
imagine. There used to be some dos software to do this back in the day.

Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC. Called
ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on this RPC.

The Sydex utilities off Simtel although ancient are of about the right
vintage to stand a chance of reading one on a suitably equipped PC.

You might be able to image the physical disk with that or Omniflop.

Try
http://www.retrocomputing.org/pages/...ograms-107.htm

But use exotic FD drivers with caution and at your own risk.


I'm not sure what other Acorn devices allowed.



--
Regards,
Martin Brown

In article , Bob Eager
writes
On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 12:19:48 +0100, The Natural Philosopher wrote:

On 15/06/15 11:13, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
The issue is finding the right software to emulate the drive format
I'd imagine. There used to be some dos software to do this back in the
day.

Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC.
Called ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on
this RPC.



Mmm. Its also a bit of gamble on early devices as to whether or not
games were played to put ofd numbers of tracks and sectors on.

If not, then you should be able to dd the raw device and pick over the
data and recreate the filing system from that if you care to, but if the
drive uses bits that even dd doesnt recognise, all bets are off..

In BSD at least, you can discover the sector numbers even if they are
strange ones. Can't use dd, but a simple program could get the sectors
off.
The way I did it years ago to transfer a membership database was to
print out the records to a parallel/serial convertor, the other end of
which was connected to the RS232 port of the PC. I could then upload the
records into an MS Works database. Blank field separators had to be
chosen carefully.
--
bert

In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
The issue is finding the right software to emulate the drive format I'd
imagine. There used to be some dos software to do this back in the day.

Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC. Called
ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on this RPC.

But if you reformat them you will lose the data will you not?

I'm not sure what other Acorn devices allowed.


--
bert

"bert" wrote in message
...
In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
The issue is finding the right software to emulate the drive format I'd
imagine. There used to be some dos software to do this back in the day.
Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC. Called
ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on this RPC.
But if you reformat them you will lose the data will you not?
I'm not sure what other Acorn devices allowed.

If you have a drive that will read them, then the answer is to open them at
a low
level in binary and suck out the contents of all the blocks on the disc.

Then, at your leisure, you can decode the disc structure and recover what
you want.

In article ,
Martin Brown wrote:
Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC.
Called ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on
this RPC.

The Sydex utilities off Simtel although ancient are of about the right
vintage to stand a chance of reading one on a suitably equipped PC.

But do many PCs have floppies these days?

--
*If you must choose between two evils, pick the one you've never tried before

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
bert wrote:
Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC.
Called ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on
this RPC.

But if you reformat them you will lose the data will you not?

Oh indeed.

Point I was making was that an ADFS formatted floppy with text files won't
read on a PC.

A RPC will read both ADFS and DOS formatted floppies.

--
*Ham and Eggs: Just a day's work for a chicken, but a lifetime commitment

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 16:17:52 +0100, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC.
Called ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here
on this RPC.

The Sydex utilities off Simtel although ancient are of about the right
vintage to stand a chance of reading one on a suitably equipped PC.

But do many PCs have floppies these days?

I've got one right next to me. Mind, it is a 10yo XP machine... Can't
imagine it'd read a Beeb-formatted disk, though. If there's anything
readable on it after several decades.

On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 16:16:46 +0100, gareth wrote:

"bert" wrote in message
...
In article , "Dave Plowman (News)"
writes
In article ,
Brian-Gaff wrote:
The issue is finding the right software to emulate the drive format
I'd imagine. There used to be some dos software to do this back in
the day.
Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC.
Called ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on
this RPC.
But if you reformat them you will lose the data will you not?
I'm not sure what other Acorn devices allowed.

If you have a drive that will read them, then the answer is to open them
at a low level in binary and suck out the contents of all the blocks on
the disc.

Then, at your leisure, you can decode the disc structure and recover
what you want.

That does presuppose that the sector numbers and sector sizes are what
the low level driver expects. Some floppues can be formatted (for
example) with 4kB sectors.

On 15/06/2015 16:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
Martin Brown wrote:
Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC.
Called ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here on
this RPC.

The Sydex utilities off Simtel although ancient are of about the right
vintage to stand a chance of reading one on a suitably equipped PC.

But do many PCs have floppies these days?


I have a USB one and a drive in the yamaha.

In article ,
Adrian wrote:
On Mon, 15 Jun 2015 16:17:52 +0100, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:

Acorn floppies are usually formatted using a different FS to a PC.
Called ADFS. But they can also be formatted for DOS and Atari, here
on this RPC.

The Sydex utilities off Simtel although ancient are of about the right
vintage to stand a chance of reading one on a suitably equipped PC.

But do many PCs have floppies these days?

I've got one right next to me. Mind, it is a 10yo XP machine... Can't
imagine it'd read a Beeb-formatted disk, though. If there's anything
readable on it after several decades.

I've just checked some pretty ancient floppies on this RPC and they still
work. But they have been stored in a pukka box for floppies.

I'm trying to remember why Acorn used ADFS for their floppies when they
will read/write DOS too - even with pure Acorn file formats on them. I
think it gives more usable space.

A 1.44Mb DOS formatted disc will re-format to 1.6Mb ADFS.

--
*Few women admit their age; fewer men act it.

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

En el artículo , Dave Plowman (News)
escribió:

Point I was making was that an ADFS formatted floppy with text files won't
read on a PC.

Nonsense.

http://www.g7jjf.com/adfs_explorer.htm

I've used this extensively, works perfectly.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

En el artículo , Dave Plowman (News)
escribió:

I'm trying to remember why Acorn used ADFS for their floppies

Long filenames and extended attributes.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

In article ,
Mike Tomlinson wrote:
En el artículo , Dave Plowman (News)
escribió:

Point I was making was that an ADFS formatted floppy with text files
won't read on a PC.

Nonsense.

http://www.g7jjf.com/adfs_explorer.htm

I've used this extensively, works perfectly.

But why would I pay for software I'd never use?

--
*Despite the cost of living, have you noticed how it remains so popular?*

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

En el artículo , Dave Plowman (News)
escribió:

But why would I pay for software I'd never use?

Jeez.

You said, quote, "an ADFS formatted floppy with text files won't read on
a PC." I posted a link to software that allows this, disproving what you
said.

And this isn't for your benefit, it's for anyone in a similar situation,
wanting to access files on BBC micro discs in a PC.

--
(\_/)
(='.'=)
(")_(")

On 14/06/2015 11:02, Cursitor Doom wrote:
On Sun, 14 Jun 2015 10:34:57 +0100, rick wrote:

I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

I don't think it's the hardware you need to worry about; it's more
whether your floppy has retained data integrity since it was written.



won't know unless I have a drive to put it in :-)

Although 3.5" fdd is standard the BBC had its own Disk system ... not
compatible with a pc

On 14/06/2015 12:21, Jim White wrote:
In message
rick wrote:

I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

Try asking (nicely) in comp.sys.acorn.misc



I'll do that

Dave ... ref your reply below

Would you be willing to give it a go if I sent you the disk ?
Tech site states ADFS was used on Master Compact

If so ping me a PM

Rick

On 14/06/2015 18:32, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
John Mulrooney wrote:
I'd suggest asking on comp.sys.acorn.misc where there are some
helpful folk unless Dave (sound) Plowman reads this on this group

You could take that both ways. ;-)

If it's the normal ADFS, the floppy drive on my RPC certainly still works.
Must admit to not knowing what a BBC compact is, though.

In article ,
rick wrote:
On 14/06/2015 12:21, Jim White wrote:
In message
rick wrote:

I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

Try asking (nicely) in comp.sys.acorn.misc



I'll do that

I have a RISC PC and the floppy drive still works. Just tried.

email me directly

On 15/06/2015 14:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
rick wrote:
I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?


You don't seem to have come back to this, but I'd certainly be willing to
transfer it to a CD or whatever, if my RPC can read it.

Contact me by email - address at the bottom of the post and note the spam
trap.



the total files would be very small ... could simply email them to me
.... couple of hundred kb at most

In article ,
rick wrote:
On 15/06/2015 14:17, Dave Plowman (News) wrote:
In article ,
rick wrote:
I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?


You don't seem to have come back to this, but I'd certainly be willing
to transfer it to a CD or whatever, if my RPC can read it.

Contact me by email - address at the bottom of the post and note the
spam trap.



the total files would be very small ... could simply email them to me
... couple of hundred kb at most

No problem, then.

--
*If Barbie is so popular, why do you have to buy her friends? *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

In article ,
Charles Hope wrote:
In article ,
rick wrote:
On 14/06/2015 12:21, Jim White wrote:
In message
rick wrote:

I have a single 3.5" FD that was authored on a BBC compact.

It contains a few text files I would like to get off the disk .........
anybody have one of these pieces of history that still work?

Try asking (nicely) in comp.sys.acorn.misc



I'll do that

I have a RISC PC and the floppy drive still works. Just tried.

It was interesting others saying the floppies may have deteriorated. I
tried some of my very first ones with dates from the early 90s and they
all still worked.

--
*If a pig loses its voice, is it disgruntled?

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.