I guess this is asked a lot, so please point
me in the right direction.

I want to drill some holes in large bathroom tiles,
to take screws for a grab bar in a shower.

I've been advised to buy a drill bit specific to this task -
what should I ask for, and what is different about these bits?
I'll be visiting South London Power Tools, which seems to have
a great range of these types of things. I'd like to display
some knowledge of what I'm after though!

Also, what sort of wall anchors are recommended?
The tiles are on the side of a shower stall, which is probably
made of plasterboard underneath.
I've got some spring toggles and some other expaning wall anchors.

John Hearns wrote:
I want to drill some holes in large bathroom tiles,
to take screws for a grab bar in a shower.

I've been advised to buy a drill bit specific to this task -
what should I ask for, and what is different about these bits?

Tile Drill -

For sinking red rawlplugs, I'd use a 6mm bit to get through the tile and a
5.5mm regular bit for the plaster/brick if that's what's underneath. Don't
do the complete hole with the tile bit as it will sh*g the bit.

It's preferable to have a fractional clearance through the tile so the
fixing won't crack it. A dab of silicon in the hole when assembling the
fitting won't go amiss.

If you need expanding fittings then beware of rust streaks in the shower if
using low cost metallic ones such as this.
http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...63267&id=12229

This is a picture of what you are after. High St price is probably about £5
each.
http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...62737&id=14054


--
Toby.

'One day son, all this will be finished'

On Mon, 17 Nov 2003 09:21:30 +0000, John Hearns wrote:

I've been advised to buy a drill bit specific to this task -
what should I ask for, and what is different about these bits?

Shape, they are pear or tear drop shaped rather than fluted twist
drill.

Also, what sort of wall anchors are recommended? The tiles are on
the side of a shower stall, which is probably made of plasterboard
underneath.

As this is for a grab rail the last thing you want is for the fixings
to rip through the plasterboard when someone does grab it with all
their weight... Try and find the studs that support the plasterboard
and fix into those with brass or stainless steel woodscrews (the rust
problem, which may or may not have occurred to me without the other
posting).

If you can't find the studs or they are really in the wrong place I
guess you are stuck with plastic, and brass/stainless screws. The
metallic fixing shown in the other posting is very good and solid as
it spreads the load over the plasterboard nicely but would probably
rust overtime in a shower.

They can be a bit of a begger to set on tiles as well, the little tang
on the top flange would normally dig into the plasterboard and stop
the fixing rotating while you set it. It can't do this into a tile, if
you simply remove it you can't hold the flange to stop it rotating...
I found that you need to flatten it a bit and cut a notch in the edge
of the hole to take it.

Plastic fixings such as Screwfix ref 69602 are quite good, if you have
the depth behind the board. The shank has to match fairly closely the
thickness of the board (and tiles) though, there are three shank
lengths available Screwfix only stock 2 and don't tell you the shank
length... 79612 I've not used but might be OK, if it doesn't stress
the back of the board to much.

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

"Toby" wrote in message
...
John Hearns wrote:
I want to drill some holes in large bathroom tiles,
to take screws for a grab bar in a shower.

I've been advised to buy a drill bit specific to this task -
what should I ask for, and what is different about these bits?

Tile Drill -

For sinking red rawlplugs, I'd use a 6mm bit to get through the tile and a
5.5mm regular bit for the plaster/brick if that's what's underneath. Don't
do the complete hole with the tile bit as it will sh*g the bit.

It's preferable to have a fractional clearance through the tile so the
fixing won't crack it. A dab of silicon in the hole when assembling the
fitting won't go amiss.

If you need expanding fittings then beware of rust streaks in the shower if
using low cost metallic ones such as this.
http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...63267&id=12229

This is a picture of what you are after. High St price is probably about £5
each.
http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...62737&id=14054


And (one of the best tips I was ever given) stick a piece of masking tape on the
tile where you are going to drill the holes. It keeps the drill from wandering
and stops the glaze from chipping

Peter

John Hearns wrote:

I guess this is asked a lot, so please point
me in the right direction.

I want to drill some holes in large bathroom tiles,
to take screws for a grab bar in a shower.

Others have described the "correct way" (i.e. tile drill) - having said
that I have always found a masonry drill works just fine. Use a bit of
tape to stop it wandering, and drill with a slow speed and no hammer
action.

Another useful tip I found when using ordinary rawlplugs through tiles,
is to insert the plug so it is flush with the surface of the tile, then
insert the screw partially into the plug and gently hammer it so that
you push the body of the plug further into the wall below the tile. That
should ensure that when you fix the final item, any lateral expansion of
the rawlplug will not cause the tile to crack.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

"John Hearns" wrote in message
news
I guess this is asked a lot, so please point
me in the right direction.

I want to drill some holes in large bathroom tiles,
to take screws for a grab bar in a shower.

I've been advised to buy a drill bit specific to this task -
what should I ask for, and what is different about these bits?
I'll be visiting South London Power Tools, which seems to have
a great range of these types of things. I'd like to display
some knowledge of what I'm after though!

Also, what sort of wall anchors are recommended?
The tiles are on the side of a shower stall, which is probably
made of plasterboard underneath.
I've got some spring toggles and some other expaning wall anchors.


I supply a range of tile drills on my web site, if it of any help

Sorry there is a minimum order online of £10.00 but if you call me I will
send out a smaller order :-)

http://www.tradetiler.com/acatalog/Hole_Cutting.html

David

John Hearns wrote:

I want to drill some holes in large bathroom tiles,
to take screws for a grab bar in a shower.

I've been advised to buy a drill bit specific to this task -
what should I ask for, and what is different about these bits?
I'll be visiting South London Power Tools, which seems to have
a great range of these types of things. I'd like to display
some knowledge of what I'm after though!

Easiest way I found was to get a nail or srew or similar with a good
point and gently tap in the position of the hole. within a fer gentle
taps you'll break through the glaze, this enables your masonary bit to
go through the tile in a matter of seconds (No hammer action).
If you hit a batten (the drill stops penetratiing once past the
plasterboard, get a small screw driver/bradawl and push and twist,
you'll know whether you're into wood of a nail by feel.

If wood, don't bother with rawl lpugs, just screw straight into the wood.

Don't use cavity fixings, just a red rawl plug and don't screw too tightly.


--
http://gymratz.co.uk
The Worlds No1 Fitness & Gym Equipment/nutrition specialists.
http://www.water-rower.co.uk
The ultimate rowing simulator.

On Mon, 17 Nov 2003 14:51:46 +0000, David wrote:

I supply a range of tile drills on my web site, if it of any help

Sorry there is a minimum order online of £10.00 but if you call me I will
send out a smaller order :-)

http://www.tradetiler.com/acatalog/Hole_Cutting.html

Thanks for the reply.
I'm sorry I didn't wait for the advice :-(
I went out and bought an 8mm drill for 4.50.
Yours is cheaper.

I like the look of your Silifix Silicone Tool also
(there's another thread today on silicone sealants).
My flat is held together with white mastic and I reckon it'll be time
to reseal the shower sooner or later.

John Rumm wrote in message ...
John Hearns wrote:

I guess this is asked a lot, so please point
me in the right direction.

I want to drill some holes in large bathroom tiles,
to take screws for a grab bar in a shower.

Others have described the "correct way" (i.e. tile drill) - having said
that I have always found a masonry drill works just fine. Use a bit of
tape to stop it wandering, and drill with a slow speed and no hammer
action.

Another useful tip I found when using ordinary rawlplugs through tiles,
is to insert the plug so it is flush with the surface of the tile, then
insert the screw partially into the plug and gently hammer it so that
you push the body of the plug further into the wall below the tile. That
should ensure that when you fix the final item, any lateral expansion of
the rawlplug will not cause the tile to crack.


Another "incorrect way" that I always use is to use an automatic
centre punch to break through the glaze (to stop the bit wandering)
then use an ordinary masonry bit in a hammer drill (with the hammer
action on). I have never broken any tiles using this method but I
suspect it depends on how and to what they're fixed. I didn't know any
better the first time I needed to drill a tiled wall. It doesn't work
on loose tiles. Haven't tried it with the SDS yet.

Andrew

"John Rumm" wrote in message
...
John Hearns wrote:

I guess this is asked a lot, so please point
me in the right direction.

I want to drill some holes in large bathroom tiles,
to take screws for a grab bar in a shower.

Others have described the "correct way" (i.e. tile drill) - having said
that I have always found a masonry drill works just fine. Use a bit of
tape to stop it wandering, and drill with a slow speed and no hammer
action.


That's how I did it, normal masonry drill bit, and I really can't emphasise
enough about the drill being at a slow speed. Like John says also - masking
tape too.

On Mon, 17 Nov 2003 09:21:30 +0000, "John Hearns"
wrote:

I guess this is asked a lot, so please point
me in the right direction.

I want to drill some holes in large bathroom tiles,
to take screws for a grab bar in a shower.

I've been advised to buy a drill bit specific to this task -
what should I ask for, and what is different about these bits?
I'll be visiting South London Power Tools, which seems to have
a great range of these types of things. I'd like to display
some knowledge of what I'm after though!

Also, what sort of wall anchors are recommended?
The tiles are on the side of a shower stall, which is probably
made of plasterboard underneath.
I've got some spring toggles and some other expaning wall anchors.
Use a new masonary drill push the drill onto the tile until you hear a
crispy noise then you can drill your hole very slowly.Spring toggles
are ok but I use umbrella clips same principal but when you take the
bolt out the base stays in the wall without falling out.T.R.

Strom scribbled :
Use a new masonary drill push the drill onto the tile until you hear a
crispy noise then you can drill your hole very slowly.Spring toggles
are ok but I use umbrella clips same principal but when you take the
bolt out the base stays in the wall without falling out.T.R.

Also make sure your drill is not on hammer, at least until you have gone
through the glaze fully.

--
Gary
Please remove #NOSPAM# if replying via email

"Strom" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 17 Nov 2003 09:21:30 +0000, "John Hearns"
wrote:

I guess this is asked a lot, so please point
me in the right direction.

I want to drill some holes in large bathroom tiles,
to take screws for a grab bar in a shower.

I've been advised to buy a drill bit specific to this task -
what should I ask for, and what is different about these bits?
I'll be visiting South London Power Tools, which seems to have
a great range of these types of things. I'd like to display
some knowledge of what I'm after though!

Also, what sort of wall anchors are recommended?
The tiles are on the side of a shower stall, which is probably
made of plasterboard underneath.
I've got some spring toggles and some other expaning wall anchors.
Use a new masonary drill push the drill onto the tile until you hear a
crispy noise then you can drill your hole very slowly.Spring toggles
are ok but I use umbrella clips same principal but when you take the
bolt out the base stays in the wall without falling out.T.R.



A slightly better way. Use a thick black fibre-tip to put a mark where you
want to drill the hole. Then use something like a tungston-carbide tipped
scribing tool and crack/craze the glaze where you want the hole. Re-mark the
hole and put some masking tape over it. You should be able to see the mark
through the tape which you can then repeat the mark on top of the tape.
Finally drill the hole with a masonary drill NOT in hammer mode - and as
slowly (at first at least) as the drilling machine will go. The mark will
allow you to get the exact point where you have crazed the glaze and the
tape will stop the drill sliding.Once you are established in the tile
increase the speed but DO NOT apply pressure or you will crack the tile. It
sometimes helps, dependent upon tile type and construction, if you wet the
drill tip as you go - it also cools the drill bit.


--
Woody

I bought a Carbide tipped tile drill bit (Triangular little thing)
after breaking all my other bits on my bathroom tiles. With the
Carbide bit, it still took all my weight and a lot of sweet, some
blood and continuous drilling (800W Bosch Hammer / twin speed bla bla)
for 15 mins to put 1 hole through 1 tile. I've put the shower head and
sink units in, but haven't got around to the Glass Shower thing
yet...I simply can't bare the thought of 60 minutes continuous
drilling to get fixing points in.

Any ideas what I'm doing wrong ? These are some imported tiles from
Italy with a reactive glaze..they're a sort of natural shape /
square'ish...got through the glaze no problem, it was the actual tile
that hurt.

Ant.

In uk.d-i-y, ANt wrote:
I bought a Carbide tipped tile drill bit (Triangular little thing)
after breaking all my other bits on my bathroom tiles. With the
Carbide bit, it still took all my weight and a lot of sweet, some
blood and continuous drilling (800W Bosch Hammer / twin speed bla bla)
for 15 mins to put 1 hole through 1 tile. ......

Any ideas what I'm doing wrong ? These are some imported tiles from
Italy with a reactive glaze..they're a sort of natural shape /
square'ish...got through the glaze no problem, it was the actual tile
that hurt.

The carbide-tipped tile bit is what you should have used, with *no* hammer
action, *only* to break through the glaze. Then you should have swapped
to a nice fresh "ordinary" masonry bit to drill through the body of the
tile - me, I'd still not use the hammer action. Drilling revs relatively
low.

It may well be that using the hammer action (if that's what you did) and
pushing the carbide bit through the main body has dulled the tile drill
beyond any use - sorry.

That's my tup'th... HTH, Stefek

On 24 Nov 2003 05:39:33 -0800, ANt wrote:

I bought a Carbide tipped tile drill bit (Triangular little thing)
after breaking all my other bits on my bathroom tiles. With the
Carbide bit, it still took all my weight and a lot of sweet, some
blood and continuous drilling (800W Bosch Hammer / twin speed bla
bla) for 15 mins to put 1 hole through 1 tile.

I would have thought common sense would have told you that something
wasn't quite right after little or no impression after the first
minute.

How to drill a tile. Use a centre punch or similar to break the glaze
where you want the hole, the drill slowly with lubricant and no
hammer. Lubricant can be water sloshed or squirted on to the bit, keep
it wet at all times, not only does it wash out the "spoil" it also
cools the bit. Speed? 2 or 300 rpm max at a guess if the water starts
to spray even a little it's too fast.

After 15mins flat out what colour was the drill tip? Cherry red? Think
you'll almost certainly need a new bit... I've used the traditional
tile drill, flat pointed bit of carbide but last time I bought a
multipurpose drill anything from softwood to granite thing and it did
a pretty good job. I think it was Black 'n Decker branded possibly
"torpedo" it is very similar in apperance to an ordinary masonary
drill but has a little nipple at the centre.

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

(ANt) wrote in message . com...
I bought a Carbide tipped tile drill bit (Triangular little thing)
after breaking all my other bits on my bathroom tiles. With the
Carbide bit, it still took all my weight and a lot of sweet, some
blood and continuous drilling (800W Bosch Hammer / twin speed bla bla)
for 15 mins to put 1 hole through 1 tile. I've put the shower head and
sink units in, but haven't got around to the Glass Shower thing
yet...I simply can't bare the thought of 60 minutes continuous
drilling to get fixing points in.

Any ideas what I'm doing wrong ? These are some imported tiles from
Italy with a reactive glaze..they're a sort of natural shape /
square'ish...got through the glaze no problem, it was the actual tile
that hurt.

It sounds like these tiles may be porcelain tiles that are dense all
the way through rather than usual ceramic wall tiles where the main
body is porous and fairly light. From my experience, once you break
through the surface glaze on typical wall tiles, a tile bit will go
through the main tile very quickly. IME, good floor tiles are
porcelain based, wall tiles are usually ceramic.

I actually tried normal masonry bits as well, I was through the glaze
with the masonry bit before I went out and bought a tile bit because I
wasn't making any progress. I didn't use hammer action knowing that I
would have been more likely to crack the tile.

I kept the bit constantly lubricated with water by sticking some
plastesine below the hole to form a cup and kept that topped up so the
bit didn't overheat + I was using a slow speed after experimenting
with different speeds to see what was working best.

I guess these are just very tough tiles...perhaps I should send the
remainder to NASA.

Ant.

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message .1...
On 24 Nov 2003 05:39:33 -0800, ANt wrote:

I bought a Carbide tipped tile drill bit (Triangular little thing)
after breaking all my other bits on my bathroom tiles. With the
Carbide bit, it still took all my weight and a lot of sweet, some
blood and continuous drilling (800W Bosch Hammer / twin speed bla
bla) for 15 mins to put 1 hole through 1 tile.

I would have thought common sense would have told you that something
wasn't quite right after little or no impression after the first
minute.

How to drill a tile. Use a centre punch or similar to break the glaze
where you want the hole, the drill slowly with lubricant and no
hammer. Lubricant can be water sloshed or squirted on to the bit, keep
it wet at all times, not only does it wash out the "spoil" it also
cools the bit. Speed? 2 or 300 rpm max at a guess if the water starts
to spray even a little it's too fast.

After 15mins flat out what colour was the drill tip? Cherry red? Think
you'll almost certainly need a new bit... I've used the traditional
tile drill, flat pointed bit of carbide but last time I bought a
multipurpose drill anything from softwood to granite thing and it did
a pretty good job. I think it was Black 'n Decker branded possibly
"torpedo" it is very similar in apperance to an ordinary masonary
drill but has a little nipple at the centre.

On 25 Nov 2003 02:04:03 -0800, ANt wrote:

I actually tried normal masonry bits as well, I was through the
glaze with the masonry bit before I went out and bought a tile bit
because I wasn't making any progress. I didn't use hammer action
knowing that I would have been more likely to crack the tile.

I kept the bit constantly lubricated with water by sticking some
plastesine below the hole to form a cup and kept that topped up so
the bit didn't overheat + I was using a slow speed after
experimenting with different speeds to see what was working best.

Now why did you give us all the useful and relevant information in the
first place? Would have avoided all the speculation and "Hello,
another prat who..." thoughts. B-)

I guess these are just very tough tiles...

Must be. Guess you just have to grin a bear it.

perhaps I should send the remainder to NASA.

Should make a tidy profit, 465million USD + after Columbia putting
things right... be nice just to get 0.01% of that. B-)

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

For f**cs sake. Just get a bog standard masonary bit and drill the f****ng
hole. Simple. No water, no silly platicene, no problems.

(MarkM) wrote
(ANt) wrote
I bought a Carbide tipped tile drill bit (Triangular little thing)
after breaking all my other bits on my bathroom tiles. With the
Carbide bit, it still took all my weight and a lot of sweet, some
blood and continuous drilling (800W Bosch Hammer / twin speed bla bla)
for 15 mins to put 1 hole through 1 tile.

It sounds like these tiles may be porcelain tiles that are dense all
the way through

Yup, reminds me of the porcelain sink I just put a hole through. It
took me 3 *nights* to get through it.

My little Bosch /drill/ was cherry red, never mind the bit ;-)

Cheers,

Paul.

On 26 Nov 2003 07:41:25 -0800, (Zymurgy)
wrote:

Yup, reminds me of the porcelain sink I just put a hole through. It
took me 3 *nights* to get through it.

I assume you really meant to put a hole through that porcelain sink?


PoP

From my experience firmly anchoring this kind of furniture on plasterboard
is not easy.
First many fitments have anchorage holes very close together, quite
impossible to achieve in plasterboard - so pick the right kind. Even then
something as sturdy as a grab bar needs reliable fixing and I would suggest
mounting it on a substantial wooden base that is first secured to the wall
Drilling into tile is not difficult, use a piece of masking tape to reduce
the masonry drill slipping and do not press too hard, just sufficient to
cut. Whatever screw/anchor you decide on it must not put any significant
pressure on the tile, or it will crack, I cut the tile hole slightly larger
than the mounting hole or this reason.
To use toggles requires a very large hole


The tiles are on the side of a shower stall, which is probably
made of plasterboard underneath.
I've got some spring toggles and some other expaning wall anchors.
Use a new masonary drill push the drill onto the tile until you hear a
crispy noise then you can drill your hole very slowly.Spring toggles
are ok but I use umbrella clips same principal but when you take the
bolt out the base stays in the wall without falling out.T.R.

PoP wrote ..
(Zymurgy) wrote:

Yup, reminds me of the porcelain sink I just put a hole through. It
took me 3 *nights* to get through it.

I assume you really meant to put a hole through that porcelain sink?


Foolishly I neglected to tell the supplier i'd be using 2 taps :-/

Top tip - Get someone else to do the holes :-)

It'll also prevent sending the neighbours doolally & them potentially
getting the EHO round due to the screeching noise !

Cheers,

Paul.

Use masking tape if you want but I just twist a masonary drill bit
with my hand to get through the glaze then insert it into the drill
and etc etc - job done.

"StealthUK" wrote in message
om...
Use masking tape if you want but I just twist a masonary drill bit
with my hand to get through the glaze then insert it into the drill
and etc etc - job done.

Exactly!