Went to my daughter's flat this morning intending to flush out her
radiators. Stuck a hose on the drain cock and opened it a little, water
poured out around the screw. The cock is very close to the floor, so not
enough room for a container to catch the water, and in any case it was
coming out quite fast. Is this a normal scenario? I'm going to leave the job
for another day, but would welcome any advice as it will have to be done at
some time.

Ed.

On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 12:53:02 -0000, "Ed Rear"
wrote:

Went to my daughter's flat this morning intending to flush out her
radiators. Stuck a hose on the drain cock and opened it a little, water
poured out around the screw. The cock is very close to the floor, so not
enough room for a container to catch the water, and in any case it was
coming out quite fast. Is this a normal scenario? I'm going to leave the job
for another day, but would welcome any advice as it will have to be done at
some time.

Ed.


When you are able to drain the system, replace the drain cock with a
"heavy duty" type. These have an O-ring around the spindle inside
which prevents this from happening.



..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 12:53:02 -0000, "Ed Rear"
wrote:

Went to my daughter's flat this morning intending to flush out her
radiators. Stuck a hose on the drain cock and opened it a little, water
poured out around the screw. The cock is very close to the floor, so not
enough room for a container to catch the water, and in any case it was
coming out quite fast. Is this a normal scenario? I'm going to leave the job
for another day, but would welcome any advice as it will have to be done at
some time.

Ed.

It is fairly common for the spindle of the drain cock to unscrew in
the normal manner but for the actual sealing washer to remain firmly
stuck to the valve seating. In this scenario,the only passage for
water would be via the small central hole in the washer which
previously located it on the spindle.

In the past,and faced with similar circumstances,i have fastened the
hose on the drain cock with a jubilee clip,unscrewed the drain cock
spindle completely and very quickly dug out the washer and fitted a
ptfe'd 1/2 mbsp plug in place of the spindle. Having said that,I'm an
old hand at such tricks so it might be a bit risky for those who
havent practiced "live" plumbing before!!

Is there a tapping on top of the radiator into which you might screw a
new drain cock temporarily ,or maybe somewhere else in the house where
it can be drained from ?

joe

"Ed Rear" wrote in message
...
Went to my daughter's flat this morning intending to flush out her
radiators. Stuck a hose on the drain cock and opened it a little, water
poured out around the screw. The cock is very close to the floor, so not
enough room for a container to catch the water, and in any case it was
coming out quite fast. Is this a normal scenario? I'm going to leave the
job
for another day, but would welcome any advice as it will have to be done
at
some time.

Ed.


Don't forget to have a new washer to hand or be able to get to a supplier.

We had exactly the same problem this week in my neighbours house.

The sticking washer meant that it took hours to drain down the system.

My neighbour said that in his previous house the drain cocks were outside
the house. This sounds a damned good idea.

Don't forget to have a new washer to hand or be able to get to a supplier. I
know I said that earlier but it could be very inconvenient!

On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 15:38:10 -0000, "John Flax"
wrote:


Don't forget to have a new washer to hand or be able to get to a supplier.

We had exactly the same problem this week in my neighbours house.

The sticking washer meant that it took hours to drain down the system.

My neighbour said that in his previous house the drain cocks were outside
the house. This sounds a damned good idea.

Don't forget to have a new washer to hand or be able to get to a supplier. I
know I said that earlier but it could be very inconvenient!


Indeed,another method is to fit a tee at a low spot on the system and
run a pipe to outside with a gate valve on it,so ensuring speedy
drainage.

joe

In article , John Flax
writes

the house. This sounds a damned good idea.


When I replaced my central heating pipe work down stairs due to a
largish rebuild and moving of rads I ran two lengths of 22mm to the
outside world and a couple of gate valves, I can now drain the whole
system in a matter of minutes. I also put in a couple of valves so I
could isolate the upstairs and not have to drain that if it wasn't
needed.
It is a very good idea unless any one can say why not. I've certainly
found no problems with it yet.

--
-- Bill

"Ed Rear" wrote in message
...
Went to my daughter's flat this morning intending to flush out her
radiators. Stuck a hose on the drain cock and opened it a little, water
poured out around the screw. The cock is very close to the floor, so not
enough room for a container to catch the water, and in any case it was
coming out quite fast. Is this a normal scenario? I'm going to leave the
job
for another day, but would welcome any advice as it will have to be done
at
some time.

Ed.



This type:

http://www.screwfix.com/sfd/i/cat/87/8712_l.jpg

are best for your set up. Screwfix part number is: 18712 @ £3.19 per unit.

This link should take you the

http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...18712&ts=08566

The one that's fitted has a plunger which is all in one with the actual seal
ring, so when you turn it to open it, the whole inside is being removed,
hence the leaking water around the top. The type above work like an
ordinary tap were the inside spindle and seal ring is lifted and lower to
allow water to pass.

On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 16:08:56 +0000, - wrote:

In article , John Flax
writes

the house. This sounds a damned good idea.


When I replaced my central heating pipe work down stairs due to a
largish rebuild and moving of rads I ran two lengths of 22mm to the
outside world and a couple of gate valves, I can now drain the whole
system in a matter of minutes. I also put in a couple of valves so I
could isolate the upstairs and not have to drain that if it wasn't
needed.
It is a very good idea unless any one can say why not. I've certainly
found no problems with it yet.

I think that the principle is good. The only thing is that gate
valves (if you mean the ones with the red wheel) are prone to seizing
and to seeping.

Lever ball valves are probably a better valve type to use and the
handle can be removed to prevent accidental operation.....



..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

On Sat, 01 Nov 2003 17:48:55 GMT, "BigWallop"
wrote:




This type:

http://www.screwfix.com/sfd/i/cat/87/8712_l.jpg

are best for your set up. Screwfix part number is: 18712 @ £3.19 per unit.

This link should take you the

http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...18712&ts=08566

The one that's fitted has a plunger which is all in one with the actual seal
ring, so when you turn it to open it, the whole inside is being removed,
hence the leaking water around the top. The type above work like an
ordinary tap were the inside spindle and seal ring is lifted and lower to
allow water to pass.


Agreed. I've used a number of them. It is best I think to remove
the centre before soldering them, but I found that the O-ring did
survive when I forgot to do this on one that I fitted.


..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Nov 2003 17:48:55 GMT, "BigWallop"
wrote:




This type:

http://www.screwfix.com/sfd/i/cat/87/8712_l.jpg

are best for your set up. Screwfix part number is: 18712 @ £3.19 per
unit.

This link should take you the

http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...18712&ts=08566

The one that's fitted has a plunger which is all in one with the actual
seal
ring, so when you turn it to open it, the whole inside is being removed,
hence the leaking water around the top. The type above work like an
ordinary tap were the inside spindle and seal ring is lifted and lower to
allow water to pass.


Agreed. I've used a number of them. It is best I think to remove
the centre before soldering them, but I found that the O-ring did
survive when I forgot to do this on one that I fitted.


.andy



Forgot to mention that bit Andy. Thank you for coming in with that.

I've never seen a compression version of these cocks, but I would think
someone must make them. Might have a little search around to see if one
pops its head up.

"tarquinlinbin" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 15:38:10 -0000, "John Flax"
wrote:


Don't forget to have a new washer to hand or be able to get to a
supplier.

We had exactly the same problem this week in my neighbours house.

The sticking washer meant that it took hours to drain down the system.

My neighbour said that in his previous house the drain cocks were outside
the house. This sounds a damned good idea.

Don't forget to have a new washer to hand or be able to get to a
supplier. I
know I said that earlier but it could be very inconvenient!


Indeed,another method is to fit a tee at a low spot on the system and
run a pipe to outside with a gate valve on it,so ensuring speedy
drainage.

Gate valve? Srop cock!


---
--

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.524 / Virus Database: 321 - Release Date: 06/10/2003

"BigWallop" wrote in message
...

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Nov 2003 17:48:55 GMT, "BigWallop"
wrote:




This type:

http://www.screwfix.com/sfd/i/cat/87/8712_l.jpg

are best for your set up. Screwfix part number is: 18712 @ £3.19 per
unit.

This link should take you the

http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...18712&ts=08566

The one that's fitted has a plunger which is all in one with the actual
seal
ring, so when you turn it to open it, the whole inside is being
removed,
hence the leaking water around the top. The type above work like an
ordinary tap were the inside spindle and seal ring is lifted and lower
to
allow water to pass.


Agreed. I've used a number of them. It is best I think to remove
the centre before soldering them, but I found that the O-ring did
survive when I forgot to do this on one that I fitted.


.andy



Forgot to mention that bit Andy. Thank you for coming in with that.

I've never seen a compression version of these cocks, but I would think
someone must make them.

Conex do.


---
--

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.524 / Virus Database: 321 - Release Date: 06/10/2003

Thanks for all your help guys, but I still have to drain down before I can
fit a new cock! Looks like I'll have to put plenty of rags on the floor and
take out the plug, then block it with my finger till it has drained. Just
hope the plug comes out quickly!

Ed

On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 21:25:04 -0000, "Ed Rear"
wrote:

Thanks for all your help guys, but I still have to drain down before I can
fit a new cock! Looks like I'll have to put plenty of rags on the floor and
take out the plug, then block it with my finger till it has drained. Just
hope the plug comes out quickly!

Ed


It isn't a bad idea to put a jubilee clip around the hose and to
secure it before opening said cock. Sometimes water can escape from
the hose end depending on the type.

Then as you say, it's rags. If there is anything wooden or textile
nearby like a carpet, put some plastic sheet over it. The water
will stain if there is any iron compound in it and usuallyu there will
be

..andy

To email, substitute .nospam with .gl

"IMM" wrote in message
...

"tarquinlinbin" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 15:38:10 -0000, "John Flax"
wrote:


Don't forget to have a new washer to hand or be able to get to a
supplier.

We had exactly the same problem this week in my neighbours house.

The sticking washer meant that it took hours to drain down the system.

My neighbour said that in his previous house the drain cocks were
outside
the house. This sounds a damned good idea.

Don't forget to have a new washer to hand or be able to get to a
supplier. I
know I said that earlier but it could be very inconvenient!


Indeed,another method is to fit a tee at a low spot on the system and
run a pipe to outside with a gate valve on it,so ensuring speedy
drainage.

Gate valve? Srop cock!



I've had that "Gate Valve Srop Cock" complaint, and it isn't pleasant.
Still. The antibiotics cleared it up in no time. :-))

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 21:25:04 -0000, "Ed Rear"
wrote:

Thanks for all your help guys, but I still have to drain down before I
can
fit a new cock! Looks like I'll have to put plenty of rags on the floor
and
take out the plug, then block it with my finger till it has drained. Just
hope the plug comes out quickly!

Ed


It isn't a bad idea to put a jubilee clip around the hose and to
secure it before opening said cock. Sometimes water can escape from
the hose end depending on the type.

Then as you say, it's rags. If there is anything wooden or textile
nearby like a carpet, put some plastic sheet over it. The water
will stain if there is any iron compound in it and usuallyu there will
be

.andy



And try to take the whole body of the drain cock out and pop your thumb in
the top hole to bung it up and stop the leaks. Sorry Ed, forgot about the
most important bit. :-))

"BigWallop" wrote in message
...

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 01 Nov 2003 17:48:55 GMT, "BigWallop"
wrote:




This type:

http://www.screwfix.com/sfd/i/cat/87/8712_l.jpg

are best for your set up. Screwfix part number is: 18712 @ £3.19 per
unit.

This link should take you the

http://www.screwfix.com/app/sfd/cat/...18712&ts=08566

The one that's fitted has a plunger which is all in one with the actual
seal
ring, so when you turn it to open it, the whole inside is being
removed,
hence the leaking water around the top. The type above work like an
ordinary tap were the inside spindle and seal ring is lifted and lower
to
allow water to pass.


Agreed. I've used a number of them. It is best I think to remove
the centre before soldering them, but I found that the O-ring did
survive when I forgot to do this on one that I fitted.


.andy



Forgot to mention that bit Andy. Thank you for coming in with that.

I've never seen a compression version of these cocks, but I would think
someone must make them. Might have a little search around to see if one
pops its head up.

I've seen a few with 1/2" BSP male thread going into a Tee with a female
thread.

--
John Stumbles
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
-+
procrastinate now!

"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 16:08:56 +0000, - wrote:

In article , John Flax
writes

the house. This sounds a damned good idea.


When I replaced my central heating pipe work down stairs due to a
largish rebuild and moving of rads I ran two lengths of 22mm to the
outside world and a couple of gate valves, I can now drain the whole
system in a matter of minutes. I also put in a couple of valves so I
could isolate the upstairs and not have to drain that if it wasn't
needed.
It is a very good idea unless any one can say why not. I've certainly
found no problems with it yet.

I think that the principle is good. The only thing is that gate
valves (if you mean the ones with the red wheel) are prone to seizing
and to seeping.

Lever ball valves are probably a better valve type to use and the
handle can be removed to prevent accidental operation.....

I've used a washing machine connection valve so you can attach a normal 3/4"
BSP hose union to it to drain without leaks. I took the handle off the valve
so no-one would go 'what does this do?' :-)

--
John Stumbles
-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+-+
-+

On Sat, 01 Nov 2003 14:58:49 +0000, tarquinlinbin wrote:

On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 12:53:02 -0000, "Ed Rear"
wrote:

Went to my daughter's flat this morning intending to flush out her
radiators. Stuck a hose on the drain cock and opened it a little, water
poured out around the screw. The cock is very close to the floor, so not
enough room for a container to catch the water, and in any case it was
coming out quite fast. Is this a normal scenario? I'm going to leave the job
for another day, but would welcome any advice as it will have to be done at
some time.

Ed.

It is fairly common for the spindle of the drain cock to unscrew in
the normal manner but for the actual sealing washer to remain firmly
stuck to the valve seating. In this scenario,the only passage for
water would be via the small central hole in the washer which
previously located it on the spindle.

In the past,and faced with similar circumstances,i have fastened the
hose on the drain cock with a jubilee clip,unscrewed the drain cock
spindle completely and very quickly dug out the washer and fitted a
ptfe'd 1/2 mbsp plug in place of the spindle. Having said that,I'm an
old hand at such tricks so it might be a bit risky for those who
havent practiced "live" plumbing before!!

Is there a tapping on top of the radiator into which you might screw a
new drain cock temporarily ,or maybe somewhere else in the house where
it can be drained from ?


Quite a few places I've been to simply there is no drain point and so
modifying a radiator is the only way forward.

If (actually whenever) I meet a drain point with a cooked washer I try to get
rid of the pressure by bunging the vent & feed pipes up then I can dig out
the washer without heroics. If the drain point is outside then none of
these precautions is needed.

--
Ed Sirett - Property maintainer and registered gas fitter.
The FAQ for uk.diy is at www.diyfaq.org.uk
Gas fitting FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/GasFitting.html
Sealed CH FAQ http://www.makewrite.demon.co.uk/SealedCH.html

"John Stumbles" ] wrote in message
...
"Andy Hall" wrote in message
...
On Sat, 1 Nov 2003 16:08:56 +0000, - wrote:

In article , John Flax
writes

the house. This sounds a damned good idea.


When I replaced my central heating pipe work down stairs due to a
largish rebuild and moving of rads I ran two lengths of 22mm to the
outside world and a couple of gate valves, I can now drain the whole
system in a matter of minutes. I also put in a couple of valves so I
could isolate the upstairs and not have to drain that if it wasn't
needed.
It is a very good idea unless any one can say why not. I've certainly
found no problems with it yet.

I think that the principle is good. The only thing is that gate
valves (if you mean the ones with the red wheel) are prone to seizing
and to seeping.

Lever ball valves are probably a better valve type to use and the
handle can be removed to prevent accidental operation.....

I've used a washing machine connection valve so you can attach a normal
3/4"
BSP hose union to it to drain without leaks. I took the handle off the
valve
so no-one would go 'what does this do?' :-)

Best not use these sort of valves as people will eventually think an
appliance can be connected. And they will connect it.



---
--

Checked by AVG anti-virus system (http://www.grisoft.com).
Version: 6.0.524 / Virus Database: 321 - Release Date: 06/10/2003

A Wet and Dry Vacuum cleaner is helpful to catch fast drips / slow leaks until the
canister
is full - or freeze the pipe whilst you change the drain cock to one of those mentioned
with the O ring within......

Nick

I've never seen a compression version of these cocks, but I would think
someone must make them.

I've seen push fits.

Christian.