I've never hung a cistern before. Got a high level jobbie for hopefully a
better flush.

The hanging went well - it's dangling on 2 M8 stainless studs chemical
mortared into the wall (bloody celcon blocks - I don't trust plugs for such
a heavy load). Not going to fall off. Ever.

However - the flush pipe drop isn't quite right and looks like it needs the
cistern packing out at the bottom by about 15-20mm and about 10mm at the
top.

This could be achieved by a piece of batten across the back and some packers
betwixt the cistern and the wall around the bolts.

I don't see an issue with this - but having never done one before, is it
normal to have to shove bits of packing behind cisterns to bring them off
the wall?

Cheers

Tim

Tim S wrote:
I've never hung a cistern before. Got a high level jobbie for
hopefully a better flush.

The hanging went well - it's dangling on 2 M8 stainless studs chemical
mortared into the wall (bloody celcon blocks - I don't trust plugs
for such a heavy load). Not going to fall off. Ever.

However - the flush pipe drop isn't quite right and looks like it
needs the cistern packing out at the bottom by about 15-20mm and
about 10mm at the top.

This could be achieved by a piece of batten across the back and some
packers betwixt the cistern and the wall around the bolts.

I don't see an issue with this - but having never done one before, is
it normal to have to shove bits of packing behind cisterns to bring
them off the wall?

Cheers

Tim


The down pipe from the cistern should allow for cutting to the position of
the bowl. If the down pipe has been cut before, it may need lengthend on
the horizontal to match up with the pan in your new setting.

I was always asked, many years ago, when these were the normal flush loo's,
to replace the older cast pipes for new plastic pipe. The only way to do it
then, was to buy the length of pipe and a solvent weld natural bend. Not an
elbow. A swept bend. So when you're out buying the new pipe, ask the
merchant for a "90 degree Swept Bend" and a new rubber flush inlet gasket to
suit the size of the new pipework. (32mm or 40mm)

BigWallop coughed up some electrons that declared:

The down pipe from the cistern should allow for cutting to the position of
the bowl. If the down pipe has been cut before, it may need lengthend on
the horizontal to match up with the pan in your new setting.

I was always asked, many years ago, when these were the normal flush
loo's,
to replace the older cast pipes for new plastic pipe. The only way to do
it
then, was to buy the length of pipe and a solvent weld natural bend. Not
an
elbow. A swept bend. So when you're out buying the new pipe, ask the
merchant for a "90 degree Swept Bend" and a new rubber flush inlet gasket
to
suit the size of the new pipework. (32mm or 40mm)

Hi,

Slight misunderstanding... There's enough pipe (it's metal).

What's happening is the pipe isn't sitting parallel to the wall - it's
trying to push back into the wall. Something isn't straight (no surprise).

By packing the base of the cistern out, I'm changing the angle to allow the
pipe to swing forward without straining the pipe-flush valve coupling.

Ta

Tim

Tim S wrote:
BigWallop coughed up some electrons that declared:

The down pipe from the cistern should allow for cutting to the
position of the bowl. If the down pipe has been cut before, it may
need lengthend on the horizontal to match up with the pan in your
new setting.

I was always asked, many years ago, when these were the normal flush
loo's,
to replace the older cast pipes for new plastic pipe. The only way
to do it
then, was to buy the length of pipe and a solvent weld natural bend.
Not an
elbow. A swept bend. So when you're out buying the new pipe, ask
the merchant for a "90 degree Swept Bend" and a new rubber flush
inlet gasket to
suit the size of the new pipework. (32mm or 40mm)

Hi,

Slight misunderstanding... There's enough pipe (it's metal).

What's happening is the pipe isn't sitting parallel to the wall - it's
trying to push back into the wall. Something isn't straight (no
surprise).

By packing the base of the cistern out, I'm changing the angle to
allow the pipe to swing forward without straining the pipe-flush
valve coupling.

Ta

Tim


Ah Ha!! No surprise at things not be striaght, right enough. Can you put
an offset in the downpipe to allow it to sit properly? Does the downpipe
have an offset than can be manouvered to allow the thing to seat in better?

It will probably take a huge bending spring to make an offset, but easier if
you have access to a pile of sand? If you can get hold of enough dry sand,
seal the ends of the pipe after packing out the pipe tightly with the sand
and try to go for a bend. If you try this method, make sure the sand is
packed really tightly in the whole length of pipe.

Or seek the help of your blacksmith with a large pipe bender to make a sure
off set in the pipe for you.

BigWallop coughed up some electrons that declared:


Ah Ha!! No surprise at things not be striaght, right enough.

It's the joy of pottery products - the top is level, the bottom isn't - in
either plane. It's only a couple of mm out, but with a long pipe, that adds
up fast.

Wonder if I can get some 2" lead pipe and go fully retro like the bog I grew
up with...

Can you put
an offset in the downpipe to allow it to sit properly? Does the downpipe
have an offset than can be manouvered to allow the thing to seat in
better?

Well, There is some slop in the pipe to cistern joint - but it's right on
the limit.

It will probably take a huge bending spring to make an offset, but easier
if
you have access to a pile of sand? If you can get hold of enough dry
sand, seal the ends of the pipe after packing out the pipe tightly with
the sand
and try to go for a bend. If you try this method, make sure the sand is
packed really tightly in the whole length of pipe.

Or seek the help of your blacksmith with a large pipe bender to make a
sure off set in the pipe for you.

I like the sand idea (I have loads). Never thought of that. The pipe has a
swan neck double offset in it anyway - it would be a case of unsetting one
of those bends a couple of degrees.

I think just bringing the bottom of the cistern forward a bit to re-align
the angles might be easier - just wondered if it was the done thing?

Cheers

Tim

Tim S wrote:
BigWallop coughed up some electrons that declared:


Ah Ha!! No surprise at things not be striaght, right enough.

It's the joy of pottery products - the top is level, the bottom isn't
- in either plane. It's only a couple of mm out, but with a long
pipe, that adds up fast.

Wonder if I can get some 2" lead pipe and go fully retro like the bog
I grew up with...

Can you put
an offset in the downpipe to allow it to sit properly? Does the
downpipe have an offset than can be manouvered to allow the thing to
seat in better?

Well, There is some slop in the pipe to cistern joint - but it's
right on the limit.

It will probably take a huge bending spring to make an offset, but
easier if
you have access to a pile of sand? If you can get hold of enough dry
sand, seal the ends of the pipe after packing out the pipe tightly
with the sand
and try to go for a bend. If you try this method, make sure the
sand is packed really tightly in the whole length of pipe.

Or seek the help of your blacksmith with a large pipe bender to make
a sure off set in the pipe for you.

I like the sand idea (I have loads). Never thought of that. The pipe
has a swan neck double offset in it anyway - it would be a case of
unsetting one of those bends a couple of degrees.

I think just bringing the bottom of the cistern forward a bit to
re-align the angles might be easier - just wondered if it was the
done thing?

Cheers

Tim


It seems it is going to have to be the done thing in this case. But you can
hide a small block of timber at the back of the cistern, so it doesn't have
to be a full length batten sticking out at either side. I hope. It is just
to re-align the cistern to match the pipe, right?
...

BigWallop coughed up some electrons that declared:


It seems it is going to have to be the done thing in this case. But you
can hide a small block of timber at the back of the cistern, so it doesn't
have
to be a full length batten sticking out at either side. I hope. It is
just to re-align the cistern to match the pipe, right?

Yes - that's what I was thinking. I eased the mounting holes out with a
diamond file before the first hanging (they weren't straight either) so
it's got a little bit of pivot on the M8 studs.

That's what I'll do then - a bit of 18mm hidden behind the lower back and
frame packers on the studs to tweak it until it's right. It's probably a
good thing to pull it up against plastic and wood rather than plaster if
it's not perfectly regular. And a bit of air flow behind it should avoid
condensation.

The gap won't be at all obvious as it's of a design that doesn't sit tight
to the wall at the edges anyway.

BTW I'm rejoicing at using resin studs - makes demounting and remounting a
trivial excercise

I made a nice template out of a scrap of 4x2" with 2 square-on 8mm holes to
locate the studs whilst the resin set. The 4x2 was held on to two temporary
battens on the wall (making lining up a breeze and ensuring the studs were
square and mm perfect. I'll be using that trick again.

Thanks

Tim

Tim S wrote:
BigWallop coughed up some electrons that declared:


It seems it is going to have to be the done thing in this case. But
you can hide a small block of timber at the back of the cistern, so
it doesn't have
to be a full length batten sticking out at either side. I hope. It
is just to re-align the cistern to match the pipe, right?

Yes - that's what I was thinking. I eased the mounting holes out with
a diamond file before the first hanging (they weren't straight
either) so it's got a little bit of pivot on the M8 studs.

That's what I'll do then - a bit of 18mm hidden behind the lower back
and frame packers on the studs to tweak it until it's right. It's
probably a good thing to pull it up against plastic and wood rather
than plaster if it's not perfectly regular. And a bit of air flow
behind it should avoid condensation.

The gap won't be at all obvious as it's of a design that doesn't sit
tight to the wall at the edges anyway.

BTW I'm rejoicing at using resin studs - makes demounting and
remounting a trivial excercise

I made a nice template out of a scrap of 4x2" with 2 square-on 8mm
holes to locate the studs whilst the resin set. The 4x2 was held on
to two temporary battens on the wall (making lining up a breeze and
ensuring the studs were square and mm perfect. I'll be using that
trick again.

Thanks

Tim


You're becoming more than a DIYer, Tim, me man. Starting to use jigs to
line things up is starting to get into the professional arena. :-) lol

A couple of millimetres either way in any project is always a sign of
perfection.
...

BigWallop wibbled:


You're becoming more than a DIYer, Tim, me man. Starting to use jigs to
line things up is starting to get into the professional arena. :-) lol

Hehe

A couple of millimetres either way in any project is always a sign of
perfection.
..

Actually it was more so the studs would actually even go through the 2 holes
in the cistern at all[1] I was expecting to do some percussive
adjustment on the studs, but it just slid on - that was good

I had some M6 A2 stainless stud as a fall back, but it felt rather bouncy so
I aimed to make the M8 work. Not sure why people spend £££ for "proper"
stainless stud fixings when a metre of A2 threaded bar can be had from
Toolstation for a few pounds...

Cheers

Tim

Tim S wrote:
BigWallop wibbled:


You're becoming more than a DIYer, Tim, me man. Starting to use
jigs to line things up is starting to get into the professional
arena. :-) lol

Hehe

A couple of millimetres either way in any project is always a sign of
perfection.
..

Actually it was more so the studs would actually even go through the
2 holes in the cistern at all[1] I was expecting to do some
percussive adjustment on the studs, but it just slid on - that was
good

I had some M6 A2 stainless stud as a fall back, but it felt rather
bouncy so I aimed to make the M8 work. Not sure why people spend £££
for "proper" stainless stud fixings when a metre of A2 threaded bar
can be had from Toolstation for a few pounds...

Cheers

Tim


So we can look forward to you being "Flush" now then? :-) lol