Yes. There are photographs of the few people who have survived
exposure to traction systems on one of the railway safety sites. A
boy with one ear burnt off and one with very bad burns on his body
come to mind.

Bad burns on feet are common too, where the current exits via an arc
through the soles of the trainers, often burning off some toes.

And in India more likely barefoot;(...
--
Tony Sayer

Theres been a lot of debate over on UK Railway as to whether or not a
video such as depicted there should be used as a public info film to
warn of what can happen if you should touch those harmless looking
wires..

It's certainly an idea but not for "general release" maybe part of a
targeted campagne within schools in areas where playing on the electrified
railyway is a problem. I think the teachers would have to be told about
and consulted before hand and some form open discussion held afterwards to
talk about it.

Anyways lets hope he's at peace now .. poor sod;(..

If the footage could be used, he may not have died in vain.


My daughters have already seen it on facebook links and both seem not
bothered. Ones a rail user and commented if you will mess with power
lines then thats what you'd expect to happen..

Course she knows that "incident" normally means some poor sod under a
train somewhere in the Railtrack book of jargon;(...
--
Tony Sayer

In article , Colin
Wilson o.uk scribeth
thus
They are in so much mental turmoil that they want to kill
themselves. That is extremely sad and calling them selfish doesn't
help improve things.
Sympathising for those who are involved does not mean that one
should not also have sympathy for the disturbed too.

Hear hear !

Unless you've been in that position, you have no idea how bad they
must feel at that point - the strange thing is, to the person in that
position, the mind seems can seem perfectly clear and focussed, as
they often see no solution other than their own demise.

Spot on;!...
--
Tony Sayer

In article , Mike Tomlinson
scribeth thus
In article , tony sayer
writes

I sincerely hope Mike that you never suffer from depression which has to
be experienced to be believed.

I'm not unsympathetic to people that are ill, Tony, but why should
depressives inflict themselves on others?

You just don't understand the nature of a depressive illness Mike, very
few people have any idea at all what its like to feel so bad that doing
away with yourself is the only cure to your misery.

You just don't think rationally at all, otherwise you wouldn't be doing
it attempting it;!..

--
Tony Sayer

In article , PeterC
scribeth thus
On Sun, 7 Jun 2009 12:54:51 +0100, Mike Tomlinson wrote:

In article ,
ARWadsworth writes

Did you see the guy in China that was threatening to jump off a bridge and a
member of the public climbed up and shoved him?

Yes, I thought "good on you mate!" The backstory is that the bridge was
a popular spot for suicides and the traffic was stopped each time
someone decided to do themselves in, and the travelling public were
getting fed up with all the delays.

I've always though that those who jump off bridges, in front of trains,
etc. are selfish *******s. Someone's gotta clean up the mess, and I
feel sorry for train drivers that have that happen to them.

Also holds up the trains.

My last GF said that there's no point in trying to stop the train as the
wheels go through people very easily. She's had to try and repair the
damage on some who didn't make a proper job of it.

Some time ago there was a man round here who had terrible leg pain so
much so he put it on the line to have it cut off as the doctors couldn't
do anything about it such was his misery and desperation of long term
pain day in day out...
--
Tony Sayer

In article , Fredxx
scribeth thus

"jake" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 7 Jun 2009 11:26:05 +0100, "Fredxx" wrote:


"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
a.com...
http://tinypic.com/r/amvbbt/5

£50 says he will not be doing that again.

Adam



Sad that it's perfectly legal to download and watch this clip, yet a
similar
clip of young children running around on a beach would put you behind
bars.
One where someone dies is perfectly ok,
No-one said "it's perfectly ok". In fact the OP could have (and imho
should have) put a warning to the effect of the real content. An
irresponsible post because of this - yes. Many people will have been
affected in a bad way having witnessed this. Just take a look at the
followups and the number that have (as per human nature) tried to
trivialize or make a joke about it. Many of these are probably
shocked (no pun etc) and covering up with a macho comment.

I do not suggest that such a post should be "banned" btw - just that
warning of content should have been posted. What if some young kids
watched this?

As to photgraphing kids - yes it is a great shame when anyone who
enjoys watching kids play & growing in a totally innocent way - is an
instant pervert. This attitude is of course due to a) real perverts
b) the rabid feminist movement eg bbc etc. It is amazing how many of
the so-called "protectors" like priests and teachers have molested
kids.

The two event above are of course - unrelated.


Indeed..

Now be warned that this site contains pix of naked boys and if that
offends you then DO NOT click on it).....

http://www.sutcliffe-gallery.co.uk/gallery_194448.html
--
Tony Sayer

On Sat, 06 Jun 2009 20:11:58 +0100, andrew wrote:

I would like to know how to snatch this video in case it is allowable as
a pts training video.

When I want to grab a copy of a flash video I keep my browser on the page
with the video in it (as if I were going to play it again) and look in my
temporary directory for the saved copy of the file. On my Linux systsem
that's easy: it's in /tmp and usually called FlashXYZABC or something
obvious like that, and also has a very recent timestamp. Then I copy that
to where I want it and convert it if I want to, to say divx avi with a
utility called flv2avi which I found somewhere but it's just a wrapper for
ffmpeg or mencoder (I forget which).

In windoze you'd have to look somewhere under C:\Documents and
Settiings\Temporary ... something or other. But the file converters should
be available for windows too.

--
John Stumbles

Time flies like an arrow
Fruit flies like a banana
Tits like coconuts

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...
In article , Colin
Wilson o.uk scribeth
thus
They are in so much mental turmoil that they want to kill
themselves. That is extremely sad and calling them selfish doesn't
help improve things.
Sympathising for those who are involved does not mean that one
should not also have sympathy for the disturbed too.

Hear hear !

Unless you've been in that position, you have no idea how bad they
must feel at that point - the strange thing is, to the person in that
position, the mind seems can seem perfectly clear and focussed, as
they often see no solution other than their own demise.

Spot on;!...
--

I don't think anyone was arguing that they couldn't see any solution than
their own demise, or that they weren't deserving of sympathy. To ruin (to
some extent) the life of a train driver by jumping out in front of him is
selfish, however and there are other solutions that don't involve this level
of hurt to others (although there will always be some hurt to others). A
recent suicide locally did not involve others in the act itself and was just
as certain and straightforward to accomplish.


--
Bob Mannix
(anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)

On Mon, 8 Jun 2009 09:26:37 +0100 someone who may be "Bob Mannix"
wrote this:-

I don't think anyone was arguing that they couldn't see any solution than
their own demise, or that they weren't deserving of sympathy. To ruin (to
some extent) the life of a train driver by jumping out in front of him is
selfish, however and there are other solutions that don't involve this level
of hurt to others (although there will always be some hurt to others).

That assumes a level of clarity which these poor people don't have,
a deliberate decision that they don't care what effect they have on
others.



--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

On Mon, 8 Jun 2009 00:33:00 +0100, geoff wrote:

If the footage could be used, he may not have died in vain.

And how do you think that those who are so poor that they have to travel
on train roofs are ever going to see such footage?

I was really thinking of use in this country. Mind you we could do with
eliminating the daft twonks that play on the railways from our gene
pool...

Dalits don't all have laptops and internet connections

True but there are education programmes that tour around giving
information of a given subject. Not that such a programme on the dangers
of power lines (rail and distribution) would have much effect. If the only
way you can afford to travel is on the roof that is where you will travel.
Or the only way to get bit of power is to connect to the lines then that
is what you do.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Mon, 8 Jun 2009 00:06:38 +0100, Fredxx wrote:

Riding on train roofs, hanging onto the outside of buses, driving like
maniacs is clearly insane behaviour from a culured & intelligent
nation.

It's simple. For centuries they believed in the caste system, where
individuals would be reborn, possibly into a better life. If you
believe you might be better off in the next life, this one doesn't
matter so much. Life is cheap in India, especially for the lower castes.

Aye the caste system is largely alive and well outside of the new
"affluent middle classes" (as in a western consumer definition) but even
they don't object to the lowest clearing blocked sewers with their bare
hands and nothing but a bit of cloth to protect their modesty.

As you say life is cheap. Some in here need to take the western blinkers
off and realise that the western life style is perched precariously on a
knife edge. It wouldn't take much to knock it off and the western
countries to starve. They'd starve in India as well but a much larger
proportion of the population would survive as they are already growing
most of their own food.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Sat, 06 Jun 2009 17:44:35 +0100, Grimly Curmudgeon
wrote:

We were somewhere around Barstow, on the edge of the desert, when the
drugs began to take hold. I remember "ARWadsworth"
saying something like:

http://tinypic.com/r/amvbbt/5

£50 says he will not be doing that again.

Smokin'!

**** slow and buggy site - liveleak's better
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=fc0_1243424473

tinypic didn't work for me so I followed your liveleak one.
Ye gods!!
To my surprise it did look like the others were trying to get him to
come down rather than join him. Obviously they're not thick.

Unlike
http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=9c1_1188968489
where they were trying to tap the overhead distribution cables.
Picture quality is poor but I found it more shocking (excuse pun!)

"David Hansen" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 8 Jun 2009 09:26:37 +0100 someone who may be "Bob Mannix"
wrote this:-

I don't think anyone was arguing that they couldn't see any solution than
their own demise, or that they weren't deserving of sympathy. To ruin (to
some extent) the life of a train driver by jumping out in front of him is
selfish, however and there are other solutions that don't involve this
level
of hurt to others (although there will always be some hurt to others).

That assumes a level of clarity which these poor people don't have,
a deliberate decision that they don't care what effect they have on
others.

On the contrary, most suicides, other than ones who are under the influence,
or raving, are very precise and deliberate in their decision. Many plan the
act and lead a normal day up until then. They have not gone mad but reached
what they view as an inevitable (and logical) conclusion that death is
preferable to anything life has to offer. They may drop their kids at school
and be acting "normally". I believe those who have thought about others in
life will do so in death and those who have been very self centred and
selfish in life will also be in death. Cheery subject but there you go ...


--
Bob Mannix
(anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...
In article , Fredxx
scribeth thus

"jake" wrote in message
. ..
On Sun, 7 Jun 2009 11:26:05 +0100, "Fredxx" wrote:


"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
ia.com...
http://tinypic.com/r/amvbbt/5


Sad that it's perfectly legal to download and watch this clip, yet a
similar
clip of young children running around on a beach would put you behind
bars.
One where someone dies is perfectly ok,
No-one said "it's perfectly ok". In fact the OP could have (and imho
should have) put a warning to the effect of the real content. An
irresponsible post because of this - yes. Many people will have been
affected in a bad way having witnessed this. Just take a look at the
followups and the number that have (as per human nature) tried to
trivialize or make a joke about it. Many of these are probably
shocked (no pun etc) and covering up with a macho comment.

I do not suggest that such a post should be "banned" btw - just that
warning of content should have been posted. What if some young kids
watched this?

As to photgraphing kids - yes it is a great shame when anyone who
enjoys watching kids play & growing in a totally innocent way - is an
instant pervert. This attitude is of course due to a) real perverts
b) the rabid feminist movement eg bbc etc. It is amazing how many of
the so-called "protectors" like priests and teachers have molested
kids.

The two event above are of course - unrelated.


Indeed..

Now be warned that this site contains pix of naked boys and if that
offends you then DO NOT click on it).....

http://www.sutcliffe-gallery.co.uk/gallery_194448.html

It'd be OK if at least one was killed through Darwinsm. Otherwise I'd be
petrified to click on the link.

"Dave Liquorice" wrote in message
ll.net...
On Mon, 8 Jun 2009 00:06:38 +0100, Fredxx wrote:

Riding on train roofs, hanging onto the outside of buses, driving like
maniacs is clearly insane behaviour from a culured & intelligent
nation.

It's simple. For centuries they believed in the caste system, where
individuals would be reborn, possibly into a better life. If you
believe you might be better off in the next life, this one doesn't
matter so much. Life is cheap in India, especially for the lower castes.

Aye the caste system is largely alive and well outside of the new
"affluent middle classes" (as in a western consumer definition) but even
they don't object to the lowest clearing blocked sewers with their bare
hands and nothing but a bit of cloth to protect their modesty.

As you say life is cheap. Some in here need to take the western blinkers
off and realise that the western life style is perched precariously on a
knife edge. It wouldn't take much to knock it off and the western
countries to starve. They'd starve in India as well but a much larger
proportion of the population would survive as they are already growing
most of their own food.

Don't count on it.. in that event it is a case of who has the best army that
will survive.

On 8 Jun 2009 08:19:37 GMT, John Stumbles wrote:

On Sat, 06 Jun 2009 20:11:58 +0100, andrew wrote:

I would like to know how to snatch this video in case it is allowable as
a pts training video.

When I want to grab a copy of a flash video I keep my browser on the page
with the video in it (as if I were going to play it again) and look in my
temporary directory for the saved copy of the file. On my Linux systsem
that's easy: it's in /tmp and usually called FlashXYZABC or something
obvious like that, and also has a very recent timestamp. Then I copy that
to where I want it and convert it if I want to, to say divx avi with a
utility called flv2avi which I found somewhere but it's just a wrapper for
ffmpeg or mencoder (I forget which).

In windoze you'd have to look somewhere under C:\Documents and
Settiings\Temporary ... something or other. But the file converters should
be available for windows too.

If I wanted those sort of videos, I'd use portable Opera on a USB stick. It
puts a folder on to C:\Documents and Settiings\Temporary ... but wipes it
on exit, then use Eraser to overwrite the empty space. Opera'a cached files
don't have 'real' names or any extension anyway. Then there's OperaTor
Portable for the really paranoid/guilty.
--
Peter.
The head of a pin will hold more angels if
it's been flattened with an angel-grinder.

On Mon, 8 Jun 2009 13:25:01 +0100, dennis@home wrote:

Don't count on it.. in that event it is a case of who has the best army
that will survive.

And where is the support and logistics for an army at war going to come
from? OK the military are not 100% reliant on the civilian supply chain
but they are to some extent.

--
Cheers
Dave.

On Mon, 08 Jun 2009 00:04:02 +0100, Dave Liquorice wrote:
So even though he's walking along with his head about 6" from the wire
he's not likely to get zapped. His mistake was raising his hand and
attempting to hold the wire, presumably to maintain his balance.

I suspect it's entirely possible that he just didn't realise that those
wires were how the train got its power.

On Mon, 08 Jun 2009 08:19:37 +0000, John Stumbles wrote:
When I want to grab a copy of a flash video I keep my browser on the page
with the video in it (as if I were going to play it again) and look in my
temporary directory for the saved copy of the file. On my Linux systsem
that's easy: it's in /tmp and usually called FlashXYZABC or something
obvious like that, and also has a very recent timestamp.

Yep - what I normally do is kick the video off downloading and then do
'ls -l /tmp/Fl*' a couple of times so I can see which file is actually
being written to. Either wait until the filesize stops increasing, or the
progress bar has finished in the video player within the browser, then
copy / convert.

Youtube seem to be using a new flv format lately which trips up some
of the players (but still works with the embedded Adobe players) - I've
found that ffplay will handle them fine, but mplayer won't. I suspect
mplayer will catch up eventually.

In article et,
"Dave Liquorice" writes:
On Sun, 7 Jun 2009 14:01:51 +0100, tony sayer wrote:

Could it be that a circuit breaker opened and auto reclosed that
quickly?

Seems a tad quick for an auto recloser.

I rather think that the current flow wasn't that much, well on the scale
of the power that the OHL can supply.

I'm not thinking of a trip of the breaker due to overload but due to earth
leakage.

The circuit is earth return (track), so you can't measure earth leakage,
as it's not insulated from earth.

The auto recloser on the 11kV that feeds us trips on earth
leakage. One of the insulators starting tracking over on the top of the
pole outside, we wouldn't have known if we hadn't been oustide and heard
it crackling, enough to make the auto-recloser cycle through it's three
trips in x minutes = lock out. I think we would have been aware of the
noise from inside the house if it was overload that close causeing the
trip...

I used to have an 11kV insulator I found on a walk in the countryside.
It had a very thin metal flash line over the outside of it, and was
presumably disposed of into the nearest hedge by whoever replaced it.

Theres been a lot of debate over on UK Railway as to whether or not a
video such as depicted there should be used as a public info film to
warn of what can happen if you should touch those harmless looking
wires..

It's certainly an idea but not for "general release" maybe part of a
targeted campagne within schools in areas where playing on the electrified
railyway is a problem. I think the teachers would have to be told about
and consulted before hand and some form open discussion held afterwards to
talk about it.

A friend (who isn't Internet-savvy) had a teenage child who was about
to start riding a moped, and he wasn't happy about it. Several of us
talked about it at work. I went browsing on the Internet and found
several photos of motorcycle fatalities, the idea being that his dad
would only let him on the moped after he'd gone through some of these
with him, basically to show a teenager who (like any teenager) thinks
they're indestructable, just how fragile life really is. That was 4 or
5 years ago, and about 2 years afterwards, the teenager lost a friend
in a car crash (which he wasn't involved in). He remarked to his dad
that the session with the motorcycle fatality photos had quite an
impact on him, and he thought about it each time he saw a friend doing
something stupid on a bike. (The site was ogrish.com, but it's now
gone and the name points somewhere else.)

I can't help thinking that the wrapping people in cotton wool that we
do in this country (i.e. protecting them from images of such realities)
may well result in more such incidents due to widespread ignorance.

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

On 08 Jun 2009 16:14:23 GMT someone who may be
(Andrew Gabriel) wrote this:-

I can't help thinking that the wrapping people in cotton wool that we
do in this country (i.e. protecting them from images of such realities)
may well result in more such incidents due to widespread ignorance.

I think the same way too.

However, the showing of a film in school which showed the true
effect of motor vehicle crashes on humans did not stop one pupil in
my year riding a motorcycle into a horse at high speed. It was fatal
for him (and I imagine the horse). That does not mean the film was
ineffective by the way, only that it was not 100% effective.



--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

In article ,
Mike Tomlinson writes:
In article , David Hansen
writes

However, since the 1960s 25kV AC has
been used and all lines will be/have been converted to this.

Thank you.

Since the body is mostly water, that's gonna be a hell of a current. In
that clip, there's a bright reddish flash surrounding the body as he
touches the wire. I wonder: is that a camera artifact, or would someone
there have actually seen it?

The body just acts to start the arc flash-over outside the body.
The arc is much lower impedance than the body so most of the
current flows in the arc, not through the body. The arc is very
high energy -- usually into the 10's of MW, and being at point
blank range, that will probably be fatal even without any
electrocution current.

This is same effect as the pop and bright flash you sometimes
get when a filament lamp dies. The filament breaks and initially
creates a spark between the ends. The arc is much lower impedance
than the filament, so the two ends of the arc rapidly run in the
opposite direction down the filament until it's completely shorted
out, which is what causes the bright flash and blows a fuse (in
the lamp base or consumer unit).

--
Andrew Gabriel
[email address is not usable -- followup in the newsgroup]

Andrew Gabriel wrote:
In article et,
"Dave Liquorice" writes:
On Sun, 7 Jun 2009 14:01:51 +0100, tony sayer wrote:

Could it be that a circuit breaker opened and auto reclosed that
quickly?
Seems a tad quick for an auto recloser.
I rather think that the current flow wasn't that much, well on the scale
of the power that the OHL can supply.
I'm not thinking of a trip of the breaker due to overload but due to earth
leakage.

The circuit is earth return (track), so you can't measure earth leakage,
as it's not insulated from earth.

The auto recloser on the 11kV that feeds us trips on earth
leakage. One of the insulators starting tracking over on the top of the
pole outside, we wouldn't have known if we hadn't been oustide and heard
it crackling, enough to make the auto-recloser cycle through it's three
trips in x minutes = lock out. I think we would have been aware of the
noise from inside the house if it was overload that close causeing the
trip...

I used to have an 11kV insulator I found on a walk in the countryside.
It had a very thin metal flash line over the outside of it, and was
presumably disposed of into the nearest hedge by whoever replaced it.

Theres been a lot of debate over on UK Railway as to whether or not a
video such as depicted there should be used as a public info film to
warn of what can happen if you should touch those harmless looking
wires..
It's certainly an idea but not for "general release" maybe part of a
targeted campagne within schools in areas where playing on the electrified
railyway is a problem. I think the teachers would have to be told about
and consulted before hand and some form open discussion held afterwards to
talk about it.

A friend (who isn't Internet-savvy) had a teenage child who was about
to start riding a moped, and he wasn't happy about it. Several of us
talked about it at work. I went browsing on the Internet and found
several photos of motorcycle fatalities, the idea being that his dad
would only let him on the moped after he'd gone through some of these
with him, basically to show a teenager who (like any teenager) thinks
they're indestructable, just how fragile life really is. That was 4 or
5 years ago, and about 2 years afterwards, the teenager lost a friend
in a car crash (which he wasn't involved in). He remarked to his dad
that the session with the motorcycle fatality photos had quite an
impact on him, and he thought about it each time he saw a friend doing
something stupid on a bike. (The site was ogrish.com, but it's now
gone and the name points somewhere else.)

Wow, some really shocking images on there weren't there!
http://web.archive.org/web/200406160...://ogrish.com/

Owain wrote:
geoff wrote:
Its not a question of not allowing them, its a matter of how do you
stop them

tasteless

Electric fence along the edge of the roof.

Cow catcher type of scraper at the entrance to the tunnels! ;-)

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Sun, 07 Jun 2009 14:13:56 +0100, tony sayer wrote:

In article , Mike Tomlinson
scribeth thus
In article ,
ARWadsworth writes

Did you see the guy in China that was threatening to jump off a bridge
and a member of the public climbed up and shoved him?

Yes, I thought "good on you mate!" The backstory is that the bridge was
a popular spot for suicides and the traffic was stopped each time
someone decided to do themselves in, and the travelling public were
getting fed up with all the delays.


I sincerely hope Mike that you never suffer from depression which has to
be experienced to be believed. Not just the ****ed off 'cos I have to go
into work when I don't want, or my teams lost the footer but full blown
clinical depression.

People in their normal state of mind just don't deliberately kill
themselves.


I'm with you, *but* in the China case AIUI it was more of a protest than
a genuine suicide attempt. And he did push him off safely into a waiting
airbag, which the 'jumper' could have avoided if he jumped off under his
own steam...

On Mon, 08 Jun 2009 14:46:19 +0100, Dave Liquorice wrote:

On Mon, 8 Jun 2009 13:25:01 +0100, dennis@home wrote:

Don't count on it.. in that event it is a case of who has the best army
that will survive.

And where is the support and logistics for an army at war going to come
from? OK the military are not 100% reliant on the civilian supply chain
but they are to some extent.

...and even if they do manage to fight, what makes you think they'll be
fighting to get food for *you*?

Various events such as drinking water contamination have convinced me
that 'we're only four meals away from anatchy' is as true now as it ever
was.

Last time I saw it you could drive 15 minutes to get as much fresh water
as you liked, but there were still punchups in the supermarkets and grown
men pulling water bottles off old ladies...

"PCPaul" wrote in message
m...
On Mon, 08 Jun 2009 14:46:19 +0100, Dave Liquorice wrote:


Various events such as drinking water contamination have convinced me
that 'we're only four meals away from anatchy' is as true now as it ever
was.


Anatchy sounds a serious tummy bug!

On Mon, 08 Jun 2009 19:36:02 +0100, Fredxx wrote:

"PCPaul" wrote in message
m...
On Mon, 08 Jun 2009 14:46:19 +0100, Dave Liquorice wrote:


Various events such as drinking water contamination have convinced me
that 'we're only four meals away from anatchy' is as true now as it
ever was.


Anatchy sounds a serious tummy bug!

Damn keybroad.

In message ,
ARWadsworth writes
http://tinypic.com/r/amvbbt/5

£50 says he will not be doing that again.

Just had an idea for a business opportunity

Set one of these up by the river in Varanasi and, hey presto - DIY
cremations. Get the angle right and they just tip into the Ganges

--
geoff

In message , John
Rumm writes
Owain wrote:
geoff wrote:
Its not a question of not allowing them, its a matter of how do you
stop them
tasteless
Electric fence along the edge of the roof.

Cow catcher type of scraper at the entrance to the tunnels! ;-)


I was thinking that, but tunnels are rare - they cost money, and not
required by the terrain



--
geoff

In message , Fredxx
writes

"jake" wrote in message
.. .
On Sun, 7 Jun 2009 11:26:05 +0100, "Fredxx" wrote:


"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
a.com...
http://tinypic.com/r/amvbbt/5

£50 says he will not be doing that again.

Adam



Sad that it's perfectly legal to download and watch this clip, yet a
similar
clip of young children running around on a beach would put you behind
bars.
One where someone dies is perfectly ok,
No-one said "it's perfectly ok". In fact the OP could have (and imho
should have) put a warning to the effect of the real content. An
irresponsible post because of this - yes. Many people will have been
affected in a bad way having witnessed this. Just take a look at the
followups and the number that have (as per human nature) tried to
trivialize or make a joke about it. Many of these are probably
shocked (no pun etc) and covering up with a macho comment.

I do not suggest that such a post should be "banned" btw - just that
warning of content should have been posted. What if some young kids
watched this?

As to photgraphing kids - yes it is a great shame when anyone who
enjoys watching kids play & growing in a totally innocent way - is an
instant pervert. This attitude is of course due to a) real perverts
b) the rabid feminist movement eg bbc etc. It is amazing how many of
the so-called "protectors" like priests and teachers have molested
kids.

The two event above are of course - unrelated.

To be fair to the OP, there was a mention of electrocution and anyone with
any intelligence would suss out what was going to happen from the first few
seconds of the clip.

The point I made was that even given a warning, I can legally download a
clip watching someone die.

However, if the OP pointed to a link and said something like "Children
playing nude on a beach", and I had downloaded the clip, at the very least
if the authorities knew, I would lose my PC for months or possibly years. I
would most likely be threatened with at least a caution or further
prosecution.

Haven't there been some attempted prosecutions under the terrorism act
of people having visited various sites?

This means that you could maybe hear "ricin" mentioned on the news,
looked it up, looked at a site containing bomb making information etc
and get a knock on the door

yes, madness mixed with paranoia


--
geoff

On Jun 8, 11:18*am, "Bob Mannix" wrote:
I believe those

I know you are wrong (in at least one case).

who have thought about others in
life will do so in death and those who have been very self centred and
selfish in life will also be in death.

The mother of a friend of mine committed suicide by jumping in front
of a train (in her seventies). She was one of the least self-centred
people I knew, and in normal circumstances she wouldn't have /dreamed/
of inconveniencing the large number of people that were affected by
the line closure. She was severely depressed by the death of her
husband the previous year.

Cheery subject but there you go ...
Absolutely!

On 8 June, 17:32, David Hansen
wrote:
On 08 Jun 2009 16:14:23 GMT someone who may be
(Andrew Gabriel) wrote this:-

I can't help thinking that the wrapping people in cotton wool that we
do in this country (i.e. protecting them from images of such realities)
may well result in more such incidents due to widespread ignorance.


US used to have a policy in the 50`s and early 60`s of showing
teenagers graphic footage of fatal car accidents.
Forgetting of course that teenagers like gore and being teenagers are
immortal and can disconnect from the imagery as not applicable to
them.

I think the same way too.

Public executions used to pull a good crowd.

However, the showing of a film in school which showed the true
effect of motor vehicle crashes on humans did not stop one pupil in
my year riding a motorcycle into a horse at high speed.

Deliberately rode into a horse? not one Evel Kneivel had thought of
thats for sure.
Been quite a series, 6 in one month, of car-deer collisions on A1
between Edinburgh and Berwick

It was fatal
for him (and I imagine the horse). That does not mean the film was
ineffective by the way, only that it was not 100% effective.

perhaps should show the deer some videos...

Used to know the guys at Leadburn Garage, they had contract for towing
wrecks from the Peebles road, by nature a very high speed road.
He told me he learned pretty quickly to let the ambulances from
Edinburgh arrive on scene first.

Ayrshire used to leave wrecks where they landed in the field beside
accident blackspots, pretty effective reminder and somewhere to tie
the flowers nowadays.

Keep smiling

Adam


--
* David Hansen, Edinburgh
*I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
*http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

On Mon, 8 Jun 2009 14:57:32 -0700 (PDT) someone who may be Adam
Aglionby wrote this:-

Public executions used to pull a good crowd.

They did, but I didn't suggest them.

Deliberately rode into a horse?

I didn't claim he did.

Ayrshire used to leave wrecks where they landed in the field beside
accident blackspots, pretty effective reminder and somewhere to tie
the flowers nowadays.

I am in favour of that.




--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

jake wrote:


I do not suggest that such a post should be "banned" btw - just that
warning of content should have been posted. What if some young kids
watched this?

Which part of the word "electrocution" did you not comprehend?


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

geoff wrote:
In message , Fredxx
writes

"jake" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 7 Jun 2009 11:26:05 +0100, "Fredxx" wrote:


"ARWadsworth" wrote in message
om...
http://tinypic.com/r/amvbbt/5

£50 says he will not be doing that again.

Adam



Sad that it's perfectly legal to download and watch this clip, yet a
similar
clip of young children running around on a beach would put you behind
bars.
One where someone dies is perfectly ok,
No-one said "it's perfectly ok". In fact the OP could have (and imho
should have) put a warning to the effect of the real content. An
irresponsible post because of this - yes. Many people will have been
affected in a bad way having witnessed this. Just take a look at the
followups and the number that have (as per human nature) tried to
trivialize or make a joke about it. Many of these are probably
shocked (no pun etc) and covering up with a macho comment.

I do not suggest that such a post should be "banned" btw - just that
warning of content should have been posted. What if some young kids
watched this?

As to photgraphing kids - yes it is a great shame when anyone who
enjoys watching kids play & growing in a totally innocent way - is an
instant pervert. This attitude is of course due to a) real perverts
b) the rabid feminist movement eg bbc etc. It is amazing how many of
the so-called "protectors" like priests and teachers have molested
kids.

The two event above are of course - unrelated.

To be fair to the OP, there was a mention of electrocution and anyone
with
any intelligence would suss out what was going to happen from the
first few
seconds of the clip.

The point I made was that even given a warning, I can legally download a
clip watching someone die.

However, if the OP pointed to a link and said something like "Children
playing nude on a beach", and I had downloaded the clip, at the very
least
if the authorities knew, I would lose my PC for months or possibly
years. I
would most likely be threatened with at least a caution or further
prosecution.

Haven't there been some attempted prosecutions under the terrorism act
of people having visited various sites?

This means that you could maybe hear "ricin" mentioned on the news,
looked it up, looked at a site containing bomb making information etc
and get a knock on the door

yes, madness mixed with paranoia

Indeed. I wonder how many people still have a copy of the insert name
of old internet text file of making stuff that goes bang at home here
sat on their machine having downloaded it many years ago, read a few
bits out of interest, and then forgot all about it...


--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
|-----------------------------------------------------------------|
| John Rumm - john(at)internode(dot)co(dot)uk |
\================================================= ================/

On Tue, 09 Jun 2009 00:09:27 +0100 someone who may be John Rumm
wrote this:-

Indeed. I wonder how many people still have a copy of the insert name
of old internet text file of making stuff that goes bang at home here
sat on their machine having downloaded it many years ago, read a few
bits out of interest, and then forgot all about it...

The abuse of staff and students by Nottingham University is an
example of the persecution of people for the "crime" of having
something on their computers which can be downloaded from the US
State Department website.

http://www.guardian.co.uk/commentisfree/libertycentral/2009/feb/23/hicham-yezza



--
David Hansen, Edinburgh
I will *always* explain revoked encryption keys, unless RIP prevents me
http://www.opsi.gov.uk/acts/acts2000/00023--e.htm#54

Adam Aglionby wrote:
SNIP

Used to know the guys at Leadburn Garage, they had contract for towing
wrecks from the Peebles road, by nature a very high speed road.
He told me he learned pretty quickly to let the ambulances from
Edinburgh arrive on scene first.

Ayrshire used to leave wrecks where they landed in the field beside
accident blackspots, pretty effective reminder and somewhere to tie
the flowers nowadays.

Every year before Xmas our local plod place a totally wrecked car on every
local rondabout with a big sign warning about drinking & driving. Dunno if
it works or not.


--
Dave - The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk

In article .
com, Martin Bonner scribeth thus
On Jun 8, 11:18*am, "Bob Mannix" wrote:
I believe those

I know you are wrong (in at least one case).

who have thought about others in
life will do so in death and those who have been very self centred and
selfish in life will also be in death.

The mother of a friend of mine committed suicide by jumping in front
of a train (in her seventies). She was one of the least self-centred
people I knew, and in normal circumstances she wouldn't have /dreamed/
of inconveniencing the large number of people that were affected by
the line closure.

Nature of the condition..

She was severely depressed by the death of her
husband the previous year.

And if you know anyone in that state then for Christ sakes don't just
tell them to "cheer up" or "pull yourself together" don't you just think
thats when they desperately -want- to do .. but simply cannot do?.

Depression is a very difficult subject for most anyone to comprehend let
alone deal with, just make sure that they are seeing a doctor or are or
are being treated for it..

And just hope you don't suffer from what is the most awful of mental
afflictions;(...


And strictly one illness where its highly advised not to do DIY
treatments;!..

Other than that ;-)..


--
Tony Sayer

"tony sayer" wrote in message
...
In article .
com, Martin Bonner scribeth thus
On Jun 8, 11:18 am, "Bob Mannix" wrote:
I believe those

I know you are wrong (in at least one case).

who have thought about others in
life will do so in death and those who have been very self centred and
selfish in life will also be in death.

The mother of a friend of mine committed suicide by jumping in front
of a train (in her seventies). She was one of the least self-centred
people I knew, and in normal circumstances she wouldn't have /dreamed/
of inconveniencing the large number of people that were affected by
the line closure.

Nature of the condition..

She was severely depressed by the death of her
husband the previous year.

And if you know anyone in that state then for Christ sakes don't just
tell them to "cheer up" or "pull yourself together" don't you just think
thats when they desperately -want- to do .. but simply cannot do?.

AFAICR I don't think anyone suggested otherwise...

Depression is a very difficult subject for most anyone to comprehend let
alone deal with, just make sure that they are seeing a doctor or are or
are being treated for it..

Ditto

And just hope you don't suffer from what is the most awful of mental
afflictions;(...

Ditto

And strictly one illness where its highly advised not to do DIY
treatments;!..

Well indeed - suicide is clearly one treatment and clearly DIY but
ill-advised (at least from the outsider's perspective).

The tragedy is that the only "cure" is often a change of circumstances, the
circumstances that have led to the depresssion. This is often impossible (in
the case of bereavement) or impractical and medical treatment essentially
papers over the cracks until there is a change or time does its stuff (or
worse happens). Not ideal but the best current society can offer.

Depressing (in the general sense) thread this is!


--
Bob Mannix
(anti-spam is as easy as 1-2-3 - not)