Can anyone explain how to wire up this 2-way switching?

The existing setup: A lounge with one ceiling light controlled by one
wall switch. Cables are twin & earth.

What I want to do is run a cable from the *ceiling rose* in the
lounge to an existing light switch in a hallway leading off from the
lounge.

I then want to replace the hall switch with a dual-gang switch. I want
one side of the new hall switch to control the hall light, and the
other side to control the lounge light. The original lounge switch
must behave as befo switching the lounge light on and off.

I'm guessing this is dead simple to do, but would be very grateful for
a link to the relevant wiring diagram, or alternatively, worded
instructions. Thank you in anticipation...

An alternative solution would be to run a cable from the lounge
ceiling rose to a second single-gang switch in the same room, so each
of teh two switches in teh room can then turn the light on and off.

Mike F

On 28/05/2007 11:28, Mike wrote:

Can anyone explain how to wire up this 2-way switching?

The existing setup: A lounge with one ceiling light controlled by one
wall switch. Cables are twin & earth.

What I want to do is run a cable from the *ceiling rose* in the
lounge to an existing light switch in a hallway leading off from the
lounge.

that might be what you want, but it isn't what you need ;-)
what you need, is a three core and earth cable between the existing
lounge switch and the existing hallway switch.

I then want to replace the hall switch with a dual-gang switch. I want
one side of the new hall switch to control the hall light, and the
other side to control the lounge light. The original lounge switch
must behave as befo switching the lounge light on and off.

look at the "alternative" method described here
http://www.diydata.com/planning/twow...wowaylight.php

I'm guessing this is dead simple to do, but would be very grateful for
a link to the relevant wiring diagram, or alternatively, worded
instructions. Thank you in anticipation...

An alternative solution would be to run a cable from the lounge
ceiling rose to a second single-gang switch in the same room, so each
of teh two switches in teh room can then turn the light on and off.

all your other suggestions would require replacing your wxisting twin
and earth cables

Can anyone explain how to wire up this 2-way switching?
The existing setup: A lounge with one ceiling light controlled by one
wall switch. Cables are twin & earth.

I might be barking up the wrong tree here, so wait to see if there are
any more elegant answers :-}

How many T&Es are in the existing switch ? (unless there are two, I
think this might be a non-starter - and even then...)

Basically you're looking to try to get this:

switch1 ___/--------------------\____ switch2
live from lamp \--------------------/ switch to lamp
*
....but you need a spare core to the first switch to act as the
"strap" to the second switch as you're wiring from the centre* not end
to end.

Then, if you can get a three-core&earth to the second switch from the
ceiling rose, two cores are the strap wires, the third being the
switched live - you can hopefully get creative with a connector strip
:-}

I wonder if anyone makes a more elegant solution in that the second
switch doesn't need wiring at all - it'd be a battery powered RF
device that signals the other to switch electronically...

In article ,
Mike wrote:
Can anyone explain how to wire up this 2-way switching?

The existing setup: A lounge with one ceiling light controlled by one
wall switch. Cables are twin & earth.

What I want to do is run a cable from the *ceiling rose* in the
lounge to an existing light switch in a hallway leading off from the
lounge.

I then want to replace the hall switch with a dual-gang switch. I want
one side of the new hall switch to control the hall light, and the
other side to control the lounge light. The original lounge switch
must behave as befo switching the lounge light on and off.

The switch circuit from the ceiling rose to the existing wall switch
consists of two wires (excluding earth). For two-way you need three.

I'm guessing this is dead simple to do, but would be very grateful for
a link to the relevant wiring diagram, or alternatively, worded
instructions. Thank you in anticipation...

Two-way switch A Two-way switch B

L1 L1
0===========0 0===========0============= Line
| \ / |
C 0================================O C
\ / \ /
0===========0 0===========0============= Switch return
L2 Optional L2
Intermediate
Switch


An alternative solution would be to run a cable from the lounge
ceiling rose to a second single-gang switch in the same room, so each
of teh two switches in teh room can then turn the light on and off.

Still won't work, I'm afraid.

--
*Just give me chocolate and nobody gets hurt

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

"Mike" wrote in message
...

Can anyone explain how to wire up this 2-way switching?

If you don't understand it and don't want to run three core + E cable
between the switch points you can use RF switches to do the job.

http://www.letsautomate.com/index.cf...=lightswitches has a selection of
them (they may be cheaper elsewhere).

It also avoids any Part P problems as you aren't doing any new circuits.

"dennis@home" wrote in message
...

"Mike" wrote in message
...

Can anyone explain how to wire up this 2-way switching?

If you don't understand it and don't want to run three core + E cable
between the switch points you can use RF switches to do the job.

http://www.letsautomate.com/index.cf...=lightswitches has a selection
of them (they may be cheaper elsewhere).

It also avoids any Part P problems as you aren't doing any new circuits.

I forgot its cheaper using X10 but more prone to interference YMMV.

http://www.letsautomate.com/10030.cfm

dennis@home wrote:


It also avoids any Part P problems as you aren't doing any new circuits.

It would be a minor work in this case, since it is extending and
existing circuit and not in a special location or kitchen.

--
Cheers,

John.

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On Mon, 28 May 2007 11:48:52 +0100, Colin Wilson
o.uk wrote:

I might be barking up the wrong tree here, so wait to see if there are
any more elegant answers :-}

How many T&Es are in the existing switch ? (unless there are two, I
think this might be a non-starter - and even then...)

There is only one T&E from the existing switch. However, it would be
easy to add extra cable(s) going from the rose to the hall switch, as
the hall switch wires run down inside a wall cavity. (No chasing
required)

Basically you're looking to try to get this:

switch1 ___/--------------------\____ switch2
live from lamp \--------------------/ switch to lamp
*
...but you need a spare core to the first switch to act as the
"strap" to the second switch as you're wiring from the centre* not end
to end.

Then, if you can get a three-core&earth to the second switch from the
ceiling rose, two cores are the strap wires, the third being the
switched live - you can hopefully get creative with a connector strip
:-}

I wonder if anyone makes a more elegant solution in that the second
switch doesn't need wiring at all - it'd be a battery powered RF
device that signals the other to switch electronically...

I'll look into those. Thanks for the suggestion. Thanks also to the
others who responded.

Mike

On Mon, 28 May 2007 14:29:39 +0100, "dennis@home"
wrote:

http://www.letsautomate.com/index.cf...=lightswitches has a selection
of them (they may be cheaper elsewhere).

It also avoids any Part P problems as you aren't doing any new circuits.

I forgot its cheaper using X10 but more prone to interference YMMV.

http://www.letsautomate.com/10030.cfm

Thanks for the suggestion. I looked at the X10 switches at the above
URL, and could not find any mention of wireless control. Perhaps I am
missing something.

If I go for some kind of wireless switching, I'd like something that
could replace the existing lounge switch, such that I could have a
second switch that could override the new lounge switch by wireless
means. Can anyone post a link to such a pair of devices?

Mike

On 29/05/2007 09:36, Mike wrote:

There is only one T&E from the existing switch. However, it would be
easy to add extra cable(s) going from the rose to the hall switch

As the existing cable from rose to lounge switch is only 2core and earth
you can't get 2-way switching without either

1) Adding a new 3core and earth cable between the hall and lounge switches.

or

2) Replacing the existing cable from rose to lounge switch with 3core
and earth, and adding a new 3core and earth from rose to hall switch,
but you'll probably have 16 wires to terminate in the rose.

or

3) Investigate the wireless switch option.

On Tue, 29 May 2007 10:02:02 +0100, Mike
wrote:

Thanks for the suggestion. I looked at the X10 switches at the above
URL, and could not find any mention of wireless control. Perhaps I am
missing something.

Sorry - half the problem was that I didn't understand what X10 was.
http://tinyurl.com/2wjdez explains more about X10 switches. I'm still
trying to figure out exactly which components I'd need to do the job.

Mike

"Mike" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 28 May 2007 14:29:39 +0100, "dennis@home"
wrote:

http://www.letsautomate.com/index.cf...=lightswitches has a selection
of them (they may be cheaper elsewhere).

It also avoids any Part P problems as you aren't doing any new circuits.

I forgot its cheaper using X10 but more prone to interference YMMV.

http://www.letsautomate.com/10030.cfm

Thanks for the suggestion. I looked at the X10 switches at the above
URL, and could not find any mention of wireless control. Perhaps I am
missing something.

If I go for some kind of wireless switching, I'd like something that
could replace the existing lounge switch, such that I could have a
second switch that could override the new lounge switch by wireless
means. Can anyone post a link to such a pair of devices?

You need three bits of X10.

One switch to replace the existing switch plate Part no: 10031 on the link
above
(note that this is a dimmer and doesn't work with fluorescents, LV
halogens.. use 10030 which is just a switch but may need a neutral wire
running)
There are other X10 modules that fit bayonet sockets and 13A sockets if you
look around).

One RF switch http://www.letsautomate.com/10185.cfm
an one RF receiver http://www.letsautomate.com/11024.cfm

The RF receiver is also a switch unit which can be operated by the RF switch
above.

On Tue, 29 May 2007 10:16:40 +0100, Mike
wrote:


On reading further, (if I understand the description correctly), the
"X10 2-way switch bundle" at: http://tinyurl.com/2wjdez appears to do
exactly what I need. I presume that no batteries are required with
these, which seems a definite plus.

Mike

"Mike" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 29 May 2007 10:16:40 +0100, Mike
wrote:


On reading further, (if I understand the description correctly), the
"X10 2-way switch bundle" at: http://tinyurl.com/2wjdez appears to do
exactly what I need. I presume that no batteries are required with
these, which seems a definite plus.

There is a battery in the unit with the buttons.
They last a couple of years IME.

On Tue, 29 May 2007 10:20:00 +0100, "dennis@home"
wrote:

You need three bits of X10.

One switch to replace the existing switch plate Part no: 10031 on the link
above
(note that this is a dimmer and doesn't work with fluorescents, LV
halogens.. use 10030 which is just a switch but may need a neutral wire
running)
There are other X10 modules that fit bayonet sockets and 13A sockets if you
look around).

One RF switch http://www.letsautomate.com/10185.cfm
an one RF receiver http://www.letsautomate.com/11024.cfm

The RF receiver is also a switch unit which can be operated by the RF switch
above.

Many thanks! The offerings at the above URLs seem a lot cheaper than
others I was looking at.

Mike

On Tue, 29 May 2007 10:34:38 +0100, "dennis@home"
wrote:

There is a battery in the unit with the buttons.
They last a couple of years IME.

Yes, I realise in retrospect that one item would need a battery. Not
really a problem, especially if they last a couple of years.

It sounds like you have 1st-hand experience of these devices. Have you
noted any problems?

Thans again,

Mike

"Mike" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 29 May 2007 10:34:38 +0100, "dennis@home"
wrote:

There is a battery in the unit with the buttons.
They last a couple of years IME.

Yes, I realise in retrospect that one item would need a battery. Not
really a problem, especially if they last a couple of years.

It sounds like you have 1st-hand experience of these devices. Have you
noted any problems?

I built a home automation demonstration for the company I worked for.
It worked fine but it was problematic in that I was working in an industrial
environment using power rails that were on different phases.
X10 doesn't cross phases so I had to rearrange a lot of the under floor
outlets to get it to work.

Once it was working it could be controlled using a flash application running
over the web and included AV, TVoD, etc.
I use homeseer software for the basic control as it has a programming
interface.

On Mon, 28 May 2007 15:52:05 +0100, John Rumm
wrote:

It also avoids any Part P problems as you aren't doing any new circuits.

It would be a minor work in this case, since it is extending and
existing circuit and not in a special location or kitchen.

Hi, Thanks for the input. Could you please clarify... if I install an
x10 dimmer switch in place of the regular light switch in my lounge,
would that be notifiable if I do it myself? If so, I'm rather amazed.

Mike

Mike wrote:

It also avoids any Part P problems as you aren't doing any new circuits.
It would be a minor work in this case, since it is extending and
existing circuit and not in a special location or kitchen.

Hi, Thanks for the input. Could you please clarify... if I install an
x10 dimmer switch in place of the regular light switch in my lounge,
would that be notifiable if I do it myself? If so, I'm rather amazed.

It would not be notifiable. The stuff that is notifiable includes things
like running complete new circuits from the consumer unit (CU), changing
the CU, or extending existing circuits in bathrooms. Even "like for
like" replacements of switches in bathrooms is permitted as a minor work.

--
Cheers,

John.

/================================================== ===============\
| Internode Ltd - http://www.internode.co.uk |
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