Hi All

Just received some 10 x 100mm Turbo Coach Screws from Screwfix.

The catalogue description reads:
"Make any job faster with Zinc-plated, Yellow-passivated Coach Screws,
combining the unique design of the Turbo Screw along with a self-cutting
point. (May require pilot holes in harder substrates.) Unique Rifled Shank
for Easier Driving & Reduced Splitting, Self-Drilling Point".

You simply cannot drive these into softwood without a large pilot hole!!!!
Let alone 'harder substrates'.

I tried with my 14.4v driver (loads of torque), a 350w mains driver and a
500w variable speed drill. No chance at all, they go in for about an inch
and thats it.

Screwfix have responded to the problem by offering a credit without
collection to be fair to them, but I'm still going to lose time on a large
decking job. I've ordered some 6.3 x 100 Exterior Timber Screws at double
the cost in the hope they will drive OK.

Never trust a catalogue description!


--
Dave
The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

The Medway Handyman wrote:
Hi All

Just received some 10 x 100mm Turbo Coach Screws from Screwfix.

The catalogue description reads:
"Make any job faster with Zinc-plated, Yellow-passivated Coach Screws,
combining the unique design of the Turbo Screw along with a self-cutting
point. (May require pilot holes in harder substrates.) Unique Rifled Shank
for Easier Driving & Reduced Splitting, Self-Drilling Point".

You simply cannot drive these into softwood without a large pilot hole!!!!
Let alone 'harder substrates'.

I tried with my 14.4v driver (loads of torque), a 350w mains driver and a
500w variable speed drill. No chance at all, they go in for about an inch
and thats it.

Screwfix have responded to the problem by offering a credit without
collection to be fair to them, but I'm still going to lose time on a large
decking job. I've ordered some 6.3 x 100 Exterior Timber Screws at double
the cost in the hope they will drive OK.

Never trust a catalogue description!


--
Dave
The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

I'm using the same coach screws from Screwfix (10x 160mm) and never
considered that they could be driven with anything else but the ratchet
thingy from my socket set.

When you consider that they are 10mm in diameter then it is hardly
reasonable in my reckoning asking an electric screwdriver to put them
in - I would actually say that I think Screwfix are being quite
reasonable in offering a credit as I think you have translated the
advert as you wanted to.

I'm screwing edge on into 100 x 50 softwood and again with that
diameter of screw I reckoned that a 5mm pilot hole and lubrication with
beeswax was good practice anyway and I've had no difficulties.

Rob

see somebody else thinks you are ******,

this is a diy group take your for profit questions somewhere else and stop
making money from our answers

You really expected a 10mm coach screw to self-tap?

I pilot drill anything over 5mm (less in hardwood), and I'm using a
cordless impact driver to drive them home.

In article ,
The Medway Handyman wrote:
Just received some 10 x 100mm Turbo Coach Screws from Screwfix.

The catalogue description reads: "Make any job faster with Zinc-plated,
Yellow-passivated Coach Screws, combining the unique design of the
Turbo Screw along with a self-cutting point. (May require pilot holes
in harder substrates.) Unique Rifled Shank for Easier Driving &
Reduced Splitting, Self-Drilling Point".

You simply cannot drive these into softwood without a large pilot
hole!!!! Let alone 'harder substrates'.

I tried with my 14.4v driver (loads of torque), a 350w mains driver and
a 500w variable speed drill. No chance at all, they go in for about
an inch and thats it.

I'm not surprised at 10mm diameter. Most drills will struggle with screws
half that size without a pilot.

--
*Black holes are where God divided by zero *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.

wrote:
You really expected a 10mm coach screw to self-tap?

I pilot drill anything over 5mm (less in hardwood), and I'm using a
cordless impact driver to drive them home.

I've used these (150mm x 10mm ones) and my elu 12v impact driver put
them into softwood fine without a pilot hole.

I've used these (150mm x 10mm ones) and my elu 12v impact driver put
them into softwood fine without a pilot hole.

That's good going, even for an impact driver. You're pushing the
whole150mm into the timber?

I use 6x100m and similar turbogold a lot, mostly in mahogany or oak,
predrill at 3-4mm (with a clearance hole in the attached timber) and my
14.4v bosch impact driver can start to slow. Pushing harder than that
and it's very possible to snap a screw. Lube helps a bit.

10mm is unlikely to snap, but what about it simply locking solid (and
unwilling to reverse out) before fully inserted?

How close to an edge can you go with 10mm, without pre-drilling? Did
you lube them? Did you get any cracking along the grain?

wrote:

I use 6x100m and similar turbogold a lot,

Thats quite a screw.


NT

I use 6x100m and similar turbogold a lot,

Thats quite a screw.

Have a look at how modern timber windows are made. They often scarfe
the profiles to each other and use very large screws to secure them -
no fancy wood joints. One advantage is that all the parts can be fully
treated on all sides before assembly - so the end grain is protected if
moisture eventually creeps in.

Alex wrote:
see somebody else thinks you are ******,

Thank you for your considered and informative opinion.

this is a diy group take your for profit questions somewhere else and
stop making money from our answers

Were you not of obviously limited intelect you would have noticed that I
contribute regularly to this group, especially in areas where I have
expertise - like the Pressure Washer FAQ and the soon to be finished Carpet
Cleaning FAQ. I don't make a profit when I do this.

And your positive contribution would be?

Oh, I just noticed - bugger all.

****wit


--
Dave
The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

wrote:
I use 6x100m and similar turbogold a lot,

Thats quite a screw.

Have a look at how modern timber windows are made. They often scarfe
the profiles to each other and use very large screws to secure them -
no fancy wood joints. One advantage is that all the parts can be fully
treated on all sides before assembly - so the end grain is protected if
moisture eventually creeps in.

100m screws may be a little big for that though.

NT

From the Trada website:

The majority of Scandinavian window manufacturers no longer use tenon
joints for the sub-frames. The jambs and mullions are end cut to match
the sill profile, but the connection often consists of a glued joint
and long screws driven through the sill from the underside into the
ends of the vertical members. This simplifies manufacture and reduces
the length of timber necessary for the vertical members because of the
omission of the projecting tenon. These screwed connections are
sufficiently strong for handling, and once the sub-frame is installed
and fixed, there is little strain on the joints.

http://www.trada.co.uk/techinfo/asse...sign%2Cdesigns

On 1 Jul 2006 10:06:07 -0700, wrote:

I use 6x100m and similar turbogold a lot,

Thats quite a screw.

Have a look at how modern timber windows are made. They often scarfe
the profiles to each other and use very large screws to secure them -

That's quite a window frame that can take a 100m screw.

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

In message , Alex
writes
see somebody else thinks you are ******,

this is a diy group take your for profit questions somewhere else and stop
making money from our answers


I'm sorry

Who are you ?

--
geoff

That's quite a window frame that can take a 100m screw.

Damn - has taken me a while to see my typo.

wrote:
That's good going, even for an impact driver. You're pushing the
whole150mm into the timber?

Yes, of course.


I use 6x100m and similar turbogold a lot, mostly in mahogany or oak,
predrill at 3-4mm (with a clearance hole in the attached timber) and my
14.4v bosch impact driver can start to slow. Pushing harder than that
and it's very possible to snap a screw. Lube helps a bit.

This was softwood, as I deliberately mentioned. I have no doubt it
would be a very different story in hardwood. Hang on ...

Right, tried it on a bit of beech - it got about two inches in and
seized solid. So I tried it on some softwood to make sure I hadn't just
forgotten drilling pilot holes. It worked - I had to to back up a
couple of inches about three times to get a 'run-up' and presumably
clear the 'drilling' edges (more than I'd remembered doing, although I
do recall doing that for last inch or so).

10mm is unlikely to snap, but what about it simply locking solid (and
unwilling to reverse out) before fully inserted?

That just happened on the beech - had to use a spanner to free it up.

How close to an edge can you go with 10mm, without pre-drilling? Did
you lube them? Did you get any cracking along the grain?

What I'd previously done was attaching a 3 by 2 to a 4 by 2, through the
2 inch faces, right in the middle. No lube and no cracking. The
beech I just did right at the end of a plank, about 15mm in. A crack
was developing along the grain.

The Medway Handyman wrote in message
. uk...
Hi All

Just received some 10 x 100mm Turbo Coach Screws from Screwfix.


You simply cannot drive these into softwood without a large pilot hole!!!!
Let alone 'harder substrates'.

And you are surprised by this ?
You need an impact driver,
but not the type you whack on the end with a hammer !


Never trust a catalogue description!

never trust a .................



-

The Medway Handyman wrote:
Hi All

Just received some 10 x 100mm Turbo Coach Screws from Screwfix.

The catalogue description reads:
"Make any job faster with Zinc-plated, Yellow-passivated Coach Screws,
combining the unique design of the Turbo Screw along with a self-cutting
point. (May require pilot holes in harder substrates.) Unique Rifled Shank
for Easier Driving & Reduced Splitting, Self-Drilling Point".

You simply cannot drive these into softwood without a large pilot hole!!!!
Let alone 'harder substrates'.

I tried with my 14.4v driver (loads of torque), a 350w mains driver and a
500w variable speed drill. No chance at all, they go in for about an inch
and thats it.

Screwfix have responded to the problem by offering a credit without
collection to be fair to them, but I'm still going to lose time on a large
decking job. I've ordered some 6.3 x 100 Exterior Timber Screws at double
the cost in the hope they will drive OK.

Never trust a catalogue description!

I've just built a pergola using M8x150 Turbo Coach Screws from
Screwfix. They went straight in to treated softwood using a variable
speed mains drill. I did final tightening (1/2 turn or so) by hand
using a socket & ratchet. No problem there.
My cheap 16V battery drill wouldn't look at them but I didn't expect it
to. The mains drill did get hot so I had to cool it by either running
off load for a minute every couple of screws or arranging my work to
give it time between uses. A two speed gearbox driven drill would
probably have coped better.

John

"The Medway Handyman" wrote in message
. uk...
Hi All

Just received some 10 x 100mm Turbo Coach Screws from Screwfix.
snip

You simply cannot drive these into softwood without a large pilot hole!!!!
Let alone 'harder substrates'.

Where on earth do you get your luck from Dave? On 8x1.5's from the screwfix
ranges that claim no pilot hole all I seem to get is split f**king wood - so
much so that I've given up and gone back to Pilot Holes and
Quicksilvers....seems that lady luck ain't on my side much ;-)

Cheers
Dan.

John wrote:

I've just built a pergola using M8x150 Turbo Coach Screws from
Screwfix. They went straight in to treated softwood using a variable
speed mains drill. I did final tightening (1/2 turn or so) by hand
using a socket & ratchet. No problem there.

My 500w Skill wouldn't have it. What size drill?


. A two speed gearbox driven drill
would probably have coped better.

I'll try with my 700w two speed PP and see what happens. Thanks


--
Dave
The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

My 500w Skill wouldn't have it. What size drill?

An old B&D 500W. D143V, 3000 RPM.
I was driving M8 remember so the torque required for M10 is 25% more.
Add to that the extra friction due to extra surface area and you may
need up to 40% more torque. A gearbox drill should give that though.

John

Dan delaMare-Lyon wrote:
"The Medway Handyman" wrote in message
. uk...

Just received some 10 x 100mm Turbo Coach Screws from Screwfix.

You simply cannot drive these into softwood without a large pilot hole!!!!
Let alone 'harder substrates'.

Where on earth do you get your luck from Dave? On 8x1.5's from the screwfix
ranges that claim no pilot hole all I seem to get is split f**king wood - so
much so that I've given up and gone back to Pilot Holes and
Quicksilvers....seems that lady luck ain't on my side much ;-)


If I'm going pilot-hole-less I'll use the thinnest screw I can. Less
work and less splits.


NT

Dan delaMare-Lyon wrote:

Where on earth do you get your luck from Dave? On 8x1.5's from the
screwfix ranges that claim no pilot hole all I seem to get is split
f**king wood - so much so that I've given up and gone back to Pilot
Holes and Quicksilvers....seems that lady luck ain't on my side much
;-)

I'm not sure if they are the same animal but I tend to use Wickes 'Easy
Drive' screws. I've put 4" x 10 straight into softwood with no problem and
no splitting at all. 1.5" x 8 go into anything with no splitting.

Are they the same as the Screwfix ones?


--
Dave
The Medway Handyman
www.medwayhandyman.co.uk
01634 717930
07850 597257

John wrote:

The Medway Handyman wrote:
Hi All

Just received some 10 x 100mm Turbo Coach Screws from Screwfix.

The catalogue description reads:
"Make any job faster with Zinc-plated, Yellow-passivated Coach Screws,
combining the unique design of the Turbo Screw along with a self-cutting
point. (May require pilot holes in harder substrates.) Unique Rifled Shank
for Easier Driving & Reduced Splitting, Self-Drilling Point".

You simply cannot drive these into softwood without a large pilot hole!!!!
Let alone 'harder substrates'.

I tried with my 14.4v driver (loads of torque), a 350w mains driver and a
500w variable speed drill. No chance at all, they go in for about an inch
and thats it.

Screwfix have responded to the problem by offering a credit without
collection to be fair to them, but I'm still going to lose time on a large
decking job. I've ordered some 6.3 x 100 Exterior Timber Screws at double
the cost in the hope they will drive OK.

Never trust a catalogue description!

I've just built a pergola using M8x150 Turbo Coach Screws from
Screwfix. They went straight in to treated softwood using a variable
speed mains drill. I did final tightening (1/2 turn or so) by hand
using a socket & ratchet. No problem there.
My cheap 16V battery drill wouldn't look at them but I didn't expect it
to. The mains drill did get hot so I had to cool it by either running
off load for a minute every couple of screws or arranging my work to
give it time between uses. A two speed gearbox driven drill would
probably have coped better.

I use those 8mm coach screws as well in similar material. 8x100 and
8x120 in my case. Like you I haven't found pilot holes necessary, I'm
using a Metabo 12v cordless to drive them which I chose specifically
because it can deliver up to 50Nm of torque.

--
Chris Green

On Sat, 01 Jul 2006 09:08:27 GMT, "The Medway Handyman"
wrote:

Hi All

Just received some 10 x 100mm Turbo Coach Screws from Screwfix.

The catalogue description reads:
"Make any job faster with Zinc-plated, Yellow-passivated Coach Screws,
combining the unique design of the Turbo Screw along with a self-cutting
point. (May require pilot holes in harder substrates.) Unique Rifled Shank
for Easier Driving & Reduced Splitting, Self-Drilling Point".

You simply cannot drive these into softwood without a large pilot hole!!!!
Let alone 'harder substrates'.

I tried with my 14.4v driver (loads of torque), a 350w mains driver and a
500w variable speed drill. No chance at all, they go in for about an inch
and thats it.

Screwfix have responded to the problem by offering a credit without
collection to be fair to them, but I'm still going to lose time on a large
decking job. I've ordered some 6.3 x 100 Exterior Timber Screws at double
the cost in the hope they will drive OK.

Never trust a catalogue description!

Hi,

Better to drill a pilot hole as any splitting can let in water and the
decking rots from inside.

However few people know this, so you're OK using anything.

cheers,
Pete.

Alex wrote:
see somebody else thinks you are ******,

this is a diy group take your for profit questions somewhere else
and stop making money from our answers

What's your problem, Alex? Dave is a valued contributor here.

Pete C wrote:
On Sat, 01 Jul 2006 09:08:27 GMT, "The Medway Handyman"
wrote:

Hi All

Just received some 10 x 100mm Turbo Coach Screws from Screwfix.

The catalogue description reads:
"Make any job faster with Zinc-plated, Yellow-passivated Coach Screws,
combining the unique design of the Turbo Screw along with a self-cutting
point. (May require pilot holes in harder substrates.) Unique Rifled Shank
for Easier Driving & Reduced Splitting, Self-Drilling Point".

You simply cannot drive these into softwood without a large pilot hole!!!!
Let alone 'harder substrates'.

I tried with my 14.4v driver (loads of torque), a 350w mains driver and a
500w variable speed drill. No chance at all, they go in for about an inch
and thats it.

Screwfix have responded to the problem by offering a credit without
collection to be fair to them, but I'm still going to lose time on a large
decking job. I've ordered some 6.3 x 100 Exterior Timber Screws at double
the cost in the hope they will drive OK.

Never trust a catalogue description!

Hi,

Better to drill a pilot hole as any splitting can let in water and the
decking rots from inside.

However few people know this, so you're OK using anything.

cheers,
Pete.


Try soaping the threads first. This usually reduces friction enough for
them to drive straight in.. And use some welly on the screwdriver.

I've found nearly any screw can be whacked through almost anything given
enough torque. The limiting factor is the screw shears or the cross head
rips out. Or both..

If all else fails hammer them in and use a screwdriver on the last few
turns.

Even on hardened oak its normally possible to not use a pilot hole.