Hi All,

A lady friend bought a 400 quid TFT TV for the bedroom a while ago
(~1yr?, probably against my advice at the time) and recently the
picture died (but still sound / channel controls etc though).

Yesterday she phoned threatning to dump it on me 'because you can fix
anything' hmmm and I managed to put her off phew (had it been
completely dead it *might* have been a fuse or summat but as it had
sound ..)?

She had tried to contact the supplier but they have since gone and
apparently the manufacturer wants 'silly money' even to have a look at
it, with repair guesstimates of around 200 quid ( near the current new
price of such items)?

So, I wondered if there was any 'proven / reaonable' repairer of such
things any one here may of used, or, if there are any real chances of
a d-i-y repair (for an electronics eng of sorts)? I suggested that
even if I was able to locate a faulty componed there was a good chance
*I* wouldn't be able to get one as a spare .. ?

And 'I know', there may be high voltages on the backlight inverters
and/or the SM PSU but I promise I will wear rubber .... (and not just
whilst working on the TV either probably ..) ;-)

All the best ..

T i m

"T i m" wrote in message
...
Hi All,

A lady friend bought a 400 quid TFT TV for the bedroom a while ago
(~1yr?, probably against my advice at the time) and recently the
picture died (but still sound / channel controls etc though).

Yesterday she phoned threatning to dump it on me 'because you can fix
anything' hmmm and I managed to put her off phew (had it been
completely dead it *might* have been a fuse or summat but as it had
sound ..)?

She had tried to contact the supplier but they have since gone and
apparently the manufacturer wants 'silly money' even to have a look at
it, with repair guesstimates of around 200 quid ( near the current new
price of such items)?

So, I wondered if there was any 'proven / reaonable' repairer of such
things any one here may of used, or, if there are any real chances of
a d-i-y repair (for an electronics eng of sorts)? I suggested that
even if I was able to locate a faulty componed there was a good chance
*I* wouldn't be able to get one as a spare .. ?

And 'I know', there may be high voltages on the backlight inverters
and/or the SM PSU but I promise I will wear rubber .... (and not just
whilst working on the TV either probably ..) ;-)

All the best ..

T i m


You are on a bit of a hiding to nothing here. In order to troubleshoot a TV
you really
need the technical manual, detailing voltages and waveforms. Also you might
benefit
from some spare components to plug in and try. Accordingly you really need
at least
a multimeter and oscilloscope, plus high-voltage probes. Also on the web
there is a
commercial website detailing the preferred failure mode database of lots of
TV's, but
it is a pay-site, if not a professional subscription site.

In summary, to take the back of the TV and poke around carries very little
chance of
success. If you want to do it, bear in mind there'll possibly be a bleeding
great capacitor
with 300V on it sat charged up on the pcb ( this may be different with flat
screen tv's
but don't count on it ). The only thing you can do without at the least a
circuit diagram is
look for toasted components, or ( with a bright light and a magnifying
glass ) bad solder
joints - they sometimes develop a circumferential crack which goes high
impedance.

Central libraries often carry TV circuit diagrams, though they may not carry
the one you want.
Again, without good test equipment and the possibility of testing by
substitution, that will only
improve your chances a little.

Worth a look on the offchance something fairly simple has gone wrong ( look
at connectors as well )
but don't waste a lot of time on it. One for the professionals I think.

Andy.

Andy wrote:

plus high-voltage probes.

It's a TFT. The highest voltage will be 200-300V powering the backlights.


--
Grunff

Grunff wrote:

Andy wrote:

plus high-voltage probes.

It's a TFT. The highest voltage will be 200-300V powering the backlights.


Silly thought, but the backlights are functioning?
That would give no (or a very dim) picture with sound!

Regards, Dan.

"T i m" wrote in message
...
Hi All,

A lady friend bought a 400 quid TFT TV for the bedroom a while ago
(~1yr?, probably against my advice at the time) and recently the
picture died (but still sound / channel controls etc though).

Yesterday she phoned threatning to dump it on me 'because you can fix
anything' hmmm and I managed to put her off phew (had it been
completely dead it *might* have been a fuse or summat but as it had
sound ..)?

She had tried to contact the supplier but they have since gone and
apparently the manufacturer wants 'silly money' even to have a look at
it, with repair guesstimates of around 200 quid ( near the current new
price of such items)?

So, I wondered if there was any 'proven / reaonable' repairer of such
things any one here may of used, or, if there are any real chances of
a d-i-y repair (for an electronics eng of sorts)? I suggested that
even if I was able to locate a faulty componed there was a good chance
*I* wouldn't be able to get one as a spare .. ?

And 'I know', there may be high voltages on the backlight inverters
and/or the SM PSU but I promise I will wear rubber .... (and not just
whilst working on the TV either probably ..) ;-)

All the best ..

T i m



Shine a torch on it; if you see a faint picture, it's the back-light
inverter.
Getting the thing out is another story, that's why they charge so much for
the repairs.

T i m wrote:
Hi All,

A lady friend bought a 400 quid TFT TV for the bedroom a while ago
(~1yr?, probably against my advice at the time) and recently the
picture died (but still sound / channel controls etc though).


I wouldn't even consider this repair.

TFT sets have very few "reparable" components and what there is that
can be fixed would need technical manuals and/or a stack of working
spares to try out.

My experience of places that do fixed-price repairs of these sort of
things is that they replace entire units (PSU, display, main PCB etc.)
and bin the non-functional bits. They don't bother to repair any of the
major items - it's just not worth the time. Enough of the units need
very simple repairs (new PSU etc.) that they make up for the few that
take the most expensive components (probably in this case the main
display).

If you don't know how they work, and don't have the diagrams or at
least a stack of spares, then you are likely to be fiddling for hours
or days with only a relatively small chance of fixing it.

She had tried to contact the supplier but they have since gone and
apparently the manufacturer wants 'silly money' even to have a look at
it, with repair guesstimates of around 200 quid ( near the current new
price of such items)?

How did she pay ? - I wonder if she might have a case against a credit=20
card issuer as the goods were not of durable quality.

12 months on a =A3400 TV is hardly what i`d call a reasonable lifespan.

--=20
Please add the word "newsgroup" in the subject line of personal emails
**** My email address includes "ngspamtrap" and " ****

gg1000 wrote:
T i m wrote:

Hi All,

A lady friend bought a 400 quid TFT TV for the bedroom a while ago
(~1yr?, probably against my advice at the time) and recently the
picture died (but still sound / channel controls etc though).



I wouldn't even consider this repair.

TFT sets have very few "reparable" components and what there is that
can be fixed would need technical manuals and/or a stack of working
spares to try out.

My experience of places that do fixed-price repairs of these sort of
things is that they replace entire units (PSU, display, main PCB etc.)
and bin the non-functional bits. They don't bother to repair any of the
major items - it's just not worth the time. Enough of the units need
very simple repairs (new PSU etc.) that they make up for the few that
take the most expensive components (probably in this case the main
display).

If you don't know how they work, and don't have the diagrams or at
least a stack of spares, then you are likely to be fiddling for hours
or days with only a relatively small chance of fixing it.


Normally I'd agree, but in this specific case I reckon it's worthwhile
investigating the back-light - as mentioned earlier in the thread.

If the invertor has gone, or there's a single tube (unlikely) and that's
gone then this should be a reasonably straight forward repair.

If, however, the backlight is fine then repair is unlikely.

Mike

On Sat, 03 Sep 2005 21:20:09 GMT, T i m wrote:

Hi All,

A lady friend bought a 400 quid TFT TV for the bedroom a while ago
(~1yr?, probably against my advice at the time) and recently the
picture died (but still sound / channel controls etc though).

Yesterday she phoned threatning to dump it on me 'because you can fix
anything' hmmm and I managed to put her off phew (had it been
completely dead it *might* have been a fuse or summat but as it had
sound ..)?

She had tried to contact the supplier but they have since gone and
apparently the manufacturer wants 'silly money' even to have a look at
it, with repair guesstimates of around 200 quid ( near the current new
price of such items)?

So, I wondered if there was any 'proven / reaonable' repairer of such
things any one here may of used, or, if there are any real chances of
a d-i-y repair (for an electronics eng of sorts)? I suggested that
even if I was able to locate a faulty componed there was a good chance
*I* wouldn't be able to get one as a spare .. ?

And 'I know', there may be high voltages on the backlight inverters
and/or the SM PSU but I promise I will wear rubber .... (and not just
whilst working on the TV either probably ..) ;-)

All the best ..

T i m



As said - sounds like it's possibly the back light tube(s) - try
turning the contrast and brightness up full and see if you can make
out the picture.

You can buy the tubes but having seen and handled them they are
extremely fragile and very easy to break.

Mark S.

On Sun, 04 Sep 2005 16:17:28 +0100, Mark S.
wrote:


As said - sounds like it's possibly the back light tube(s) - try
turning the contrast and brightness up full and see if you can make
out the picture.

You can buy the tubes but having seen and handled them they are
extremely fragile and very easy to break.

Mark S.

Thanks to all for the replies folks .. lots of good sense as usual ;-)

I do still have some tools (DMM, HF Scope, HF FC) but as mentioned,
probably not much in the way of spares (short of various molex
connectors possibly) but probably less chance of a diagram as it's
quite 'new' (I mean, for TTF TV's in general .. unlike yer old
Ferguson chassis gl).

I'lll get her to do the torch backlight test .. costs nothing and
might tell us something.

If it were mine I might at least take the back / bottom off and look
for burnt connectors (remember P8/9 PC AT power connectors burning in
the early days?) broken wires (at connector crimps)/ PCB cracks, dry
joints around the bigger pins / connectors etc but I hold little
hope. I'm not sure of the history of this TV .. I think it was bought,
stood on a wall bracket and from there untouched .. (ie. not moved
about a lot?).

I did ask her to text me the model details but nothing as yet ...?

I like the idea of her exploring the matter via her credit card .. I
know some PC TFT carry 3yr warantees?

All the best and thanks for your time again ..

T i m

In message , T i m
writes
On Sun, 04 Sep 2005 16:17:28 +0100, Mark S.
wrote:


I like the idea of her exploring the matter via her credit card .. I
know some PC TFT carry 3yr warantees?

All the best and thanks for your time again ..

T i m

Did I post this before ?

One of my HDD/DVD recorders is getting problematical with copying to DVD

I phoned Costco up

"I have a problem with my HDD/DVD recorder I bought sometime around
feb/march

I don't have the receipt or the box it came in"

"No problem, just bring it in, we'll give you your money back"

Now, that's what I call good service

It's going back tomorrow


--
geoff

On Sat, 03 Sep 2005 21:20:09 GMT, T i m wrote:

Hi All,

A lady friend bought a 400 quid TFT TV for the bedroom a while ago
(~1yr?, probably against my advice at the time) and recently the
picture died (but still sound / channel controls etc though).

FWIW she just sent me the following ..

Samsung 15 inch

Model code LW15M13CX/XEU
Model LW15M13C. S
Type No MU15EO

... via her 'BlackBerry Wireless Handheld' (apparently) .. this girl
loves her gadgets .. drives an Alpha 33 as well .. ;-)

T i m

FWIW she just sent me the following ..

Samsung 15 inch

Model code LW15M13CX/XEU
Model LW15M13C. S
Type No MU15EO

.. via her 'BlackBerry Wireless Handheld' (apparently) .. this girl
loves her gadgets .. drives an Alpha 33 as well .. ;-)


...........Then she can affort to buy a new one instead of trying to get you
to fix it on the cheap!

Alan.

T i m wrote:
I did ask her to text me the model details but nothing as yet ...?

When she does, name them and shame them here!

Also, if you enquire in sci.electronics.repair giving those details,
they may come up with a common fault and fix for that system.


I like the idea of her exploring the matter via her credit card .. I
know some PC TFT carry 3yr warantees?

All the best and thanks for your time again ..

T i m

On Sun, 4 Sep 2005 11:30:57 +0100, Colin Wilson
wrote:

She had tried to contact the supplier but they have since gone and
apparently the manufacturer wants 'silly money' even to have a look at
it, with repair guesstimates of around 200 quid ( near the current new
price of such items)?

How did she pay ? - I wonder if she might have a case against a credit=20
card issuer as the goods were not of durable quality.

12 months on a =A3400 TV is hardly what i`d call a reasonable lifespan.

flat sceens have a shorter lifespan than CRTs

On Sun, 4 Sep 2005 11:30:57 +0100, Colin Wilson
wrote:

She had tried to contact the supplier but they have since gone and
apparently the manufacturer wants 'silly money' even to have a look at
it, with repair guesstimates of around 200 quid ( near the current new
price of such items)?

How did she pay ? - I wonder if she might have a case against a credit
card issuer as the goods were not of durable quality.

12 months on a £400 TV is hardly what i`d call a reasonable lifespan.

Some of the projection TV's have a lamp, the replacement of which is a
£200++ item and have a service life of 2,000 Hrs.

Telly on 12 hrs/day, life expectancy =167 days = 5.5 months !

Actually I had assumed the OP was talking about a thin TFT TV. But
there's nothing in the post to say so.

Tim, the bulb's not gone has it?

http://forums.teamphoenixrising.net/...p/t-28023.html

DG

"Dan Mills" wrote in message
...
Grunff wrote:

Andy wrote:

plus high-voltage probes.

It's a TFT. The highest voltage will be 200-300V powering the backlights.


Silly thought, but the backlights are functioning?
That would give no (or a very dim) picture with sound!

Not quite, most panels blank the LCD if their is no tube power. Been there
done that, couldn't see a thing with the inverter disconnected. Connect
inverter supply 380V but disconnect tubes and you can see a faint pciture.
Oh the voltage only majorly tingles when touched, not recommended but you
will survive.

On Sat, 03 Sep 2005 21:20:09 GMT, T i m wrote:

She had tried to contact the supplier but they have since gone and
apparently the manufacturer wants 'silly money' even to have a look at
it, with repair guesstimates of around 200 quid ( near the current new
price of such items)?

Near-ish. Someone was offering a 17" TFT with tuner for about that, over
the bank holiday weekend.

I can't offer any advice beyond what you've already had, but would suggest
next time your friend seriously considers buying at John Lewis. They offer
a free 5-year guarantee on TVs. (Yes, they will be slightly above net
prices, but not by anywhere near the cost of the additional warranty.) I
don't think I'd accept the usual 12-month guarantee on technology which is
still fairly new, and/or on items which can't be economically repaired.

--
Nothing's worse than having an itch you can never scratch

On Mon, 05 Sep 2005 16:13:10 +0100, Derek ^
wrote:


Actually I had assumed the OP was talking about a thin TFT TV. But
there's nothing in the post to say so.

You are right but I'll try not to be clever with the subject in
future ;-(

"Repairing TFT TV (flat chance ..)"

All the best ..

T i m

On Mon, 05 Sep 2005 11:23:16 GMT, "Alan"
wrote:


FWIW she just sent me the following ..

Samsung 15 inch

Model code LW15M13CX/XEU
Model LW15M13C. S
Type No MU15EO

.. via her 'BlackBerry Wireless Handheld' (apparently) .. this girl
loves her gadgets .. drives an Alpha 33 as well .. ;-)


..........Then she can affort to buy a new one instead of trying to get you
to fix it on the cheap!

Well, that was one of my background thoughts but she has been a good
mate (ex workmate) ;-)

All the best ..

T i m

On 5 Sep 2005 05:43:02 -0700, wrote:


T i m wrote:
I did ask her to text me the model details but nothing as yet ...?

When she does, name them and shame them here!

;-)

Also, if you enquire in sci.electronics.repair giving those details,
they may come up with a common fault and fix for that system.

Thanks for the heads up on that one.

All the best ..

T i m

On Mon, 05 Sep 2005 20:11:01 +0100, John Laird
wrote:


I can't offer any advice beyond what you've already had, but would suggest
next time your friend seriously considers buying at John Lewis.

That's not the first time I have hears such advice John. Not just the
g'tee but generally good prices and service. Funny, must be the
marketing (or lack of) or that our nearest JL is 5 (traffic filled)
miles away but I just thever think of using them ..?

They offer
a free 5-year guarantee on TVs. (Yes, they will be slightly above net
prices, but not by anywhere near the cost of the additional warranty.) I
don't think I'd accept the usual 12-month guarantee on technology which is
still fairly new, and/or on items which can't be economically repaired.

Indded .. and probably the same argument I gave my friend when she
asked me which one to buy .. 'none' .. (she likes her gadgests but
hasn't really got the spare cash to spend on them) ;-(

All the best ...

T i m

In message , T i m
writes
On Mon, 05 Sep 2005 16:13:10 +0100, Derek ^
wrote:


Actually I had assumed the OP was talking about a thin TFT TV. But
there's nothing in the post to say so.

You are right but I'll try not to be clever with the subject in
future ;-(

"Repairing TFT TV (flat chance ..)"

Displaying a sensible attitude there

--
geoff

T i m wrote:

(ex workmate) ;-)


B&D? Grown up to become a fine router table?


--
Grunff

On Mon, 05 Sep 2005 23:33:22 +0100, Grunff wrote:

T i m wrote:

(ex workmate) ;-)


B&D? Grown up to become a fine router table?

Summat like that .. and funny you should say ... ;-)

I did a few diy jobs for her one day and whilst down the sheds I
mentioned 'we' didn't have a bench or anything to work on (cutting
sheets of chip / mdf).

I saw a pair of basic plastic folding trestles and she said 'let's get
them' ..

So after I had finished most of the list she has created I was given a
nice dinner and a pair of new trestles for my day's efforts ;-)

I did talk her through fault finding a problem with her washing
machine over the phone, she then (with help from me via good folk on
this list) ordered the spares (water diverter?) and fitted it herself
... ;-)

So she's willling to 'have a go' herself so I don't mind helping
anyone who thinks like that ;-)

All the best fella ..

T i m

She's a 'bigger lady' has a heart of gold, great sense of humour and I
would love to see her settle down with the perfect man .. shame (for
her) I'm taken sigh ;-)

John Laird wrote:
On Sat, 03 Sep 2005 21:20:09 GMT, T i m wrote:


She had tried to contact the supplier but they have since gone and
apparently the manufacturer wants 'silly money' even to have a look at
it, with repair guesstimates of around 200 quid ( near the current new
price of such items)?


Near-ish. Someone was offering a 17" TFT with tuner for about that, over
the bank holiday weekend.

I can't offer any advice beyond what you've already had, but would suggest
next time your friend seriously considers buying at John Lewis. They offer
a free 5-year guarantee on TVs. (Yes, they will be slightly above net
prices, but not by anywhere near the cost of the additional warranty.) I
don't think I'd accept the usual 12-month guarantee on technology which is

Hmm... Isn't the minimum warrenty in the Eu now 36 months? Up recently
from 24 months? Shouldn't the telley thus still be under warrenty...

I assumed that was why the local TV shop (Lakes) now advertises all
their tellys with a 3 year warrenty... (Wheras they used to be just 12
months when I bought mine about 4 years ago). [Nothing but good results
from buying from them BTW. Not a slong a warrenty as JL, but they are
specialist & have a lot more knowledge...].

still fairly new, and/or on items which can't be economically repaired.

On Thu, 08 Sep 2005 22:53:58 +0100, Hamie wrote:

Hmm... Isn't the minimum warrenty in the Eu now 36 months? Up recently
from 24 months? Shouldn't the telley thus still be under warrenty...

The legislation is woolly, as I understand it. However, one year would be
regarded as a very short "life" for a TV, so it's worth the argument, yes.

--
Support your right to keep and arm BEARS!

On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 12:25:58 +0100, Owain
wrote:

T i m wrote:
She's a 'bigger lady' has a heart of gold, great sense of humour and I
would love to see her settle down with the perfect man .. shame (for
her) I'm taken sigh ;-)

Timeshare?

Erm, although there *could* be some benifits I have enough trouble
with the one I've got thanks ;-)

All the best ..

T i m

On Fri, 09 Sep 2005 07:16:26 +0100, John Laird
wrote:

On Thu, 08 Sep 2005 22:53:58 +0100, Hamie wrote:

Hmm... Isn't the minimum warrenty in the Eu now 36 months? Up recently
from 24 months? Shouldn't the telley thus still be under warrenty...

The legislation is woolly, as I understand it. However, one year would be
regarded as a very short "life" for a TV, so it's worth the argument, yes.

Unfortunatly the shop she bought itself has since gone and the makers
(Samsung) don't seem to want to know? ;-(

I have had stuff go wrong within the yeah and even though we couldn't
find the receipt had it repaied under warantee becuse it was *made*
less than a year ago? You would have thought Samsung might had done
the same?

Maybe had she threatned a 'legal fuss' they might have done somthing
for her .. and she still might ned to but ....

However, I got this from her yesterday after I asked her to do the
'check it in bright light' thing ..


"Well, B****r me!

I forgot to do this when I got home last night, but then I woke up at
3.30 this morning and thought that I may as well try it as it is a
good time with it being dark etc.

So I switch on the TV, and blow me down if it didn't work!

Now, before you say anything, I had tried it several times over a
period of a few weeks and could not get it to do anything, I had tried
adjusting all sorts of things and had even followed the destruction
manual for this type of fault, but could not get it to work.... "



Strange eh?

All the best ..

T i m

On Fri, 09 Sep 2005 11:37:21 GMT, T i m wrote:

On Fri, 09 Sep 2005 07:16:26 +0100, John Laird
wrote:

On Thu, 08 Sep 2005 22:53:58 +0100, Hamie wrote:

Hmm... Isn't the minimum warrenty in the Eu now 36 months? Up recently
from 24 months? Shouldn't the telley thus still be under warrenty...

The legislation is woolly, as I understand it. However, one year would be
regarded as a very short "life" for a TV, so it's worth the argument, yes.

Unfortunatly the shop she bought itself has since gone and the makers
(Samsung) don't seem to want to know? ;-(

I did have a brief look at Samsung's UK site to see if they had any standard
warranty terms. I certainly had a Samsung CRT a few years ago that had a
3-year rtb warranty, and it was nowhere near as expensive as a TFT TV.

But they are at the cheaper end of the price spectrum. There's a lot of
truth in the dictum "you gets what you pays for".

--
Fortunately Chancellor Baldrick had a cunning plan...

In message , T i m
writes
On Fri, 09 Sep 2005 07:16:26 +0100, John Laird
wrote:

On Thu, 08 Sep 2005 22:53:58 +0100, Hamie wrote:

Hmm... Isn't the minimum warrenty in the Eu now 36 months? Up recently
from 24 months? Shouldn't the telley thus still be under warrenty...

The legislation is woolly, as I understand it. However, one year would be
regarded as a very short "life" for a TV, so it's worth the argument, yes.

Unfortunatly the shop she bought itself has since gone and the makers
(Samsung) don't seem to want to know? ;-(

I have had stuff go wrong within the yeah and even though we couldn't
find the receipt had it repaied under warantee becuse it was *made*
less than a year ago? You would have thought Samsung might had done
the same?

Maybe had she threatned a 'legal fuss' they might have done somthing
for her .. and she still might ned to but ....

However, I got this from her yesterday after I asked her to do the
'check it in bright light' thing ..


"Well, B****r me!

I forgot to do this when I got home last night, but then I woke up at
3.30 this morning and thought that I may as well try it as it is a
good time with it being dark etc.

So I switch on the TV, and blow me down if it didn't work!

Now, before you say anything, I had tried it several times over a
period of a few weeks and could not get it to do anything, I had tried
adjusting all sorts of things and had even followed the destruction
manual for this type of fault, but could not get it to work.... "


Could be a bad ribbon connector or solder joint then

give it her back, take the kisses and run

--
geoff

In message , T i m
writes
On Tue, 06 Sep 2005 12:25:58 +0100, Owain
wrote:

T i m wrote:
She's a 'bigger lady' has a heart of gold, great sense of humour and I
would love to see her settle down with the perfect man .. shame (for
her) I'm taken sigh ;-)

Timeshare?

Erm, although there *could* be some benifits I have enough trouble
with the one I've got thanks ;-)

You wouldn't make a good moslem then ...


--
geoff