I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs

In article ,
Ignoramus795 wrote:

I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs

Depending how long it's been leaking, could be very hard, as you might
open it up to add the drain and find that the thing is rotten from years
of leakage.

You could look into having someone build up the low spot with spray foam
roofing (or resurface the whole roof including building up the low spot,
depending how much $ you are blowing on heat out the roof.) If the
underside of the deck seems solid in the area, that might work well
enough for long enough. If it's clearly rotten all the way down, you
likely need to give up and have a real repair made before it gets worse.

--
Cats, coffee, chocolate...vices to live by
Please don't feed the trolls. Killfile and ignore them so they will go away.

On Saturday, September 28, 2013 9:29:34 PM UTC-4, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed

to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two

drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,

it leaks down into the warehouse.

i

How deep is the pool?

Where I used to work, they had additional roofing added to the original roof. The amount of material added caused the supporting beams to sag. But there were no problems until it snowed and then rained over the Christmas holiday.
A large part of the roof collapsed. They ended up tearing down the entire 100,000 square feet warehouse.

Dan

"Ignoramus795" wrote in message
...
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs

A depressed area usually means structural damage . Fix it right , and fix
it now . The longer you wait the more damage will occur - and standing water
will accelerate the damage . Doesn't necessarily mean a complete replacement
, it is possible to repair the damaged area only .
--
Snag

On 9/28/2013 9:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs


You can try to jack and sister the beams and boards first and take a
golf ball up on the roof and roll it around, put a drain in where it
stops rolling.

On Saturday, September 28, 2013 6:29:34 PM UTC-7, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed

to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two

drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,

it leaks down into the warehouse.



I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am

wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to

existing drains. Will that help?



i

who hates flat roofs



The last call you made didn't help?


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SVjFGOUPzF8

On 9/28/2013 8:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs

Every flat roof has low spots eventually...

Cheap fix is probably the more expensive in the longer run.

Part of the cost of doing business is the facility; spend the money and
get it done correctly is my advice.

--

On 2013-09-29, dpb wrote:
On 9/28/2013 8:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs

Every flat roof has low spots eventually...

Cheap fix is probably the more expensive in the longer run.

Part of the cost of doing business is the facility; spend the money and
get it done correctly is my advice.

--


And what would be the correct way?

i

On Sunday, September 29, 2013 10:38:33 AM UTC-4, Ignoramus11700 wrote:




Part of the cost of doing business is the facility; spend the money and

get it done correctly is my advice.

And what would be the correct way?



i

Kind of hard to say without a lot more details. How deep is the pooling? How big a surfare is the pool. What is the decking under the roof and what is supporting the decking.

You might be able to jack up the roof decking and then put on some sealant like they use on house trailers. But not a good idea for a very deep depression.

Or you might build up the depression using foam insulation and then cover that with EPDM Rubber Membrane.

Too many unknows.

Dan

"Ignoramus11700" wrote in message
...
On 2013-09-29, dpb wrote:
On 9/28/2013 8:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs

Every flat roof has low spots eventually...

Cheap fix is probably the more expensive in the longer run.

Part of the cost of doing business is the facility; spend the money and
get it done correctly is my advice.

--


And what would be the correct way?


Call a roofing company, you cheapskate.

On Sunday, September 29, 2013 10:26:29 AM UTC-7, PrecisionmachinisT wrote:
"Ignoramus11700" wrote in message

...

On 2013-09-29, dpb wrote:

On 9/28/2013 8:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:

I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed

to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two

drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,

it leaks down into the warehouse.



I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am

wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to

existing drains. Will that help?



i

who hates flat roofs



Every flat roof has low spots eventually...



Cheap fix is probably the more expensive in the longer run.



Part of the cost of doing business is the facility; spend the money and

get it done correctly is my advice.



--





And what would be the correct way?





Call a roofing company, you cheapskate.


You may remember that before I became a machinist I use to own a lot of rental property. Many of the multi-family buildings I owned had flat roofs. I never had a problem because I always stripped the roofs and redid them. I used membrane roofing. With a little training it's very easy to properly install a modified bitumen roof. We use to call it burn down roofing because you heat the rolls with a torch as you kick them along... of course an idiot like iggy would find away to set the building on fire. :) You also use a seam sealer as well. When the roofs were finished I always painted them with a special gray paint meant to protect them from UV rays. This was many years ago but I preferred to use GAF's modified bitumen roofing materials back then. I never had a leak and we did something like 30 roofs like this.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Membrane_roofing

"These three application types of membrane roofing show distinct advantages over the previously more common flat roofing method of asphalt and gravel. In asphalt and gravel application, it can be very difficult to create a proper seal at all seams and connection points. This can cause many roofs to leak early in its lifespan, and require much more maintenance. When installed correctly, newer materials are either seamless, or have seams as strong as the body. This eliminates much of the leakage concerns associated with flat roofing systems. Repairs for asphalt and gravel roofs can be hard, mainly because it is difficult to locate the exact point of a leak. Newer systems can be patched relatively easily, and breaks and leaks are easier to locate. Originally asphalt roofing required a layer of gravel above it for two reasons. First, asphalt with direct exposure to sunlight degrades much faster, mainly due to the expansion and contraction throughout a day, and also the damage created by UV rays. Second, asphalt needs weight above to hold it down, because it sits on the top of a building, instead of being attached to it. Each of the three newer types of membrane roofing systems contain materials that resist expansion and contraction, as well as reflect much of the UV rays. Also, because these membranes either lack seams or have strong seams, what expansion and contraction does occur does not create leaks and breaks at these seams. These newer roofing systems are also attached directly to the top of a building, which eliminates the need for excess weight above."

There is nothing wrong with flat roofs if you're not a clueless moron like iggy often shows himself to be.

On 9/28/2013 8:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs

You don't mention how your roof is made. We are all just guessing. I
suspect a flat deck made of exposed steel bar joists with metal deck and
3 or 5 ply roof on pearl board with gravel ballast.

A re-roof to current code will demand a minimum of 1/4 in 12 pitch.
This is usually accomplished with shaped Styrofoam. The popular
membranes now are Modified Bitumen or TPO.

Adding a roof drain is fairly easy, especially if you can travel in the
bar joists to an outside wall. I would think it would be hard to make
grade joining to another existing drain. The added roof drain does NOT
fix the roof, but it does get the weight off.

As someone else already noted, you should certainly have a roofer that
you trust and knows your roof.

--


___________________________________

Keep the whole world singing . . .
Dan G
remove the seven

"jon_banquer" wrote in message
...

There is nothing wrong with flat roofs if you're not a clueless moron like
iggy often shows himself to be.

Around here they slop hot tar onto a couple layers of tarpaper with a mop
and then top it off with a layer of course white rock chips, marble
probably.

If you don't use chips, the tar will crack similar to mud in a dry lake bed.

On Sunday, September 29, 2013 1:31:20 PM UTC-7, PrecisionmachinisT wrote:
"jon_banquer" wrote in message

...



There is nothing wrong with flat roofs if you're not a clueless moron like

iggy often shows himself to be.



Around here they slop hot tar onto a couple layers of tarpaper with a mop

and then top it off with a layer of course white rock chips, marble

probably.



If you don't use chips, the tar will crack similar to mud in a dry lake bed.

Connecticut and Illinois are a lot harder on hot tar roofs than Washington is. Extreme heat and extreme cold in both places. The problem with hot tar roofs is that while they are initially cheaper, they are very hard to fix because finding the source of a leak can be a bitch. They are also very messy to work with. I prefer to spend more money and put down a roof that's much more serviceable.

On 9/28/2013 6:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs


I'd try a down and dirty jack it up approach. Find the low spot, go
inside, and use a pipe or 4 x 4, and make a WELL MARKED column to get an
inch or so you need. Maybe more. Put some barrels or whatever around
it so forklifts would be less likely to hit it. It would also do double
duty if there is structural damage in that area to increase the snow
load the roof would be able to withstand. Might not be kosher, but if
it is temporary, and you didn't have to get anything else inspected, and
painted it to look like the rest, it might slide by. Or it might be
there forever. I would attach any horizontal members up there to
something so that if a fork took out the column, the upper stuff
wouldn't come crashing down. Maybe have a truss made of aluminum. You
know a couple of welders, don't you?

Steve

On Thu, 03 Oct 2013 08:54:12 -0700, SteveB
wrote:

On 9/28/2013 6:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs


I'd try a down and dirty jack it up approach. Find the low spot, go
inside, and use a pipe or 4 x 4, and make a WELL MARKED column to get an
inch or so you need. Maybe more. Put some barrels or whatever around
it so forklifts would be less likely to hit it. It would also do double
duty if there is structural damage in that area to increase the snow
load the roof would be able to withstand. Might not be kosher, but if
it is temporary, and you didn't have to get anything else inspected, and
painted it to look like the rest, it might slide by. Or it might be
there forever. I would attach any horizontal members up there to
something so that if a fork took out the column, the upper stuff
wouldn't come crashing down. Maybe have a truss made of aluminum. You
know a couple of welders, don't you?

Steve
He owns welders but hires weldors (duck and cover time)
---

Gerry :-)}
London,Canada

On 2013-09-29, DanG wrote:
On 9/28/2013 8:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs

You don't mention how your roof is made. We are all just guessing. I
suspect a flat deck made of exposed steel bar joists with metal deck and
3 or 5 ply roof on pearl board with gravel ballast.

A re-roof to current code will demand a minimum of 1/4 in 12 pitch.
This is usually accomplished with shaped Styrofoam. The popular
membranes now are Modified Bitumen or TPO.

Adding a roof drain is fairly easy, especially if you can travel in the
bar joists to an outside wall. I would think it would be hard to make
grade joining to another existing drain. The added roof drain does NOT
fix the roof, but it does get the weight off.

As someone else already noted, you should certainly have a roofer that
you trust and knows your roof.


What about "Foam roofing"? Where they spray foam on top of everything?
Is that a scam?

As for TPO vs bitumen, which one would you recommend for Illinois? I
am coming to a conclusion that I need to just redo the roof, instead
of half measures, and live happily thereafter.

i

Also, any idea how I can find roofers I can trust? I called a bunch,
and only one actually showed up, believe it or not.

i

On Sunday, October 6, 2013 2:01:08 PM UTC-7, Ignoramus18857 wrote:
Also, any idea how I can find roofers I can trust? I called a bunch,

and only one actually showed up, believe it or not.



i

When you want the job done right you learn how to do it yourself, bitch. Skip the usual half measures that you specialize in.

On Sun, 06 Oct 2013 16:01:08 -0500, Ignoramus18857
wrote:

Also, any idea how I can find roofers I can trust? I called a bunch,
and only one actually showed up, believe it or not.

i
Go find a building similar to the one you want to re roof that is in
the process of being re roofed. Get the name of the roofer from the
sign on the roofers truck. Wait 90 days after the roof is complete
then ask the people in the building about the quality of the roof and
the contractor. It took me two years to find a roofer when I needed to
repair my home.

On Sunday, October 6, 2013 3:14:39 PM UTC-7, wrote:
On Sun, 06 Oct 2013 16:01:08 -0500, Ignoramus18857

wrote:



Also, any idea how I can find roofers I can trust? I called a bunch,

and only one actually showed up, believe it or not.



i

Go find a building similar to the one you want to re roof that is in

the process of being re roofed. Get the name of the roofer from the

sign on the roofers truck. Wait 90 days after the roof is complete

then ask the people in the building about the quality of the roof and

the contractor. It took me two years to find a roofer when I needed to

repair my home.

One can easily learn how to do a "burn down" modified bitumen roof. Hardest part is doing the flashing and the seaming properly.

"Ignoramus18857" wrote in message
...
Also, any idea how I can find roofers I can trust? I called a bunch,
and only one actually showed up, believe it or not.

i

Try this guy
Celso Garcia.
I hope he's still in business.
20 years ago he stripped 4" of old asphalt off my flat roof and laid down a
rubber modified bitumen melt down roof that has not given me a lick of
trouble since. He was also the lowest bidder.

Pay for the silver coat.
GARCIA ROOFING INC
4860 W NEWPORT
Chicago, IL 60641
(773) 851-5244

Paul K. Dickman

On Sun, 06 Oct 2013 15:59:56 -0500, Ignoramus18857
wrote:
BIG SNIP
What about "Foam roofing"? Where they spray foam on top of everything?
Is that a scam?


Hey Iggy,

The foam is for insulation ONLY. It W I L L float off if it
isn't under the sealing material, or buried in stone.

And I recall going to a fairly new apartment building with new flat
roof where they had laid that 3" thick X 24 " X 48" fairly hard blue
insulation on top of the sealing stuff (sheet rubber???), and then
laid patio stones on top. The whole roof was floating around and the
wind had it crashing into stack vents and such. It was scaring the
tenants, and the building manager was scared of going up on the roof,
so he decided it must be one of the elevators and called me.

Take care. Good luck.

Brian Lawson.

ps...I think your first idea about adding a drain is a good idea.

Ignoramus18857 wrote:

On 2013-09-29, DanG wrote:
On 9/28/2013 8:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs

You don't mention how your roof is made. We are all just guessing. I
suspect a flat deck made of exposed steel bar joists with metal deck and
3 or 5 ply roof on pearl board with gravel ballast.

A re-roof to current code will demand a minimum of 1/4 in 12 pitch.
This is usually accomplished with shaped Styrofoam. The popular
membranes now are Modified Bitumen or TPO.

Adding a roof drain is fairly easy, especially if you can travel in the
bar joists to an outside wall. I would think it would be hard to make
grade joining to another existing drain. The added roof drain does NOT
fix the roof, but it does get the weight off.

As someone else already noted, you should certainly have a roofer that
you trust and knows your roof.


What about "Foam roofing"? Where they spray foam on top of everything?
Is that a scam?

As for TPO vs bitumen, which one would you recommend for Illinois? I
am coming to a conclusion that I need to just redo the roof, instead
of half measures, and live happily thereafter.

i

I think you need to have the roof inspected by a reputable roofing
company if one exists. Just because you have a leak in one location does
not necessarily mean that the rest of the roof is at the end of its life
span, though it could be. Think of it like a vehicle, you might have a
bad rust spot where a rock chipped the paint - this doesn't mean you
need to replace the entire body of the vehicle. Similarly your roof
might have one spot that had a flaw when it was built, or it could have
been damaged when someone was working up there on A/C or something.

Raising the low spot (supports, shims etc from the underside/interior) would
prevent the water and snow melt from pooling.
Water freezing repeatedly in a leak path is only gonna make it worse.

Slap some sealer or membrane on the affected area and luck is your uncle.

--
WB
..........


"Ignoramus18857" wrote in message
...
On 2013-09-29, DanG wrote:
On 9/28/2013 8:29 PM, Ignoramus795 wrote:
I have a warehouse with a flat roof. It has two drains and is supposed
to be inclined uniformly towards the drains. However, between the two
drains, a depressed area appeared and water pools there. From there,
it leaks down into the warehouse.

I am looking for cheap workarounds to stave off roof replacement. I am
wondering how hard is it to add a roof drain and connect it to
existing drains. Will that help?

i
who hates flat roofs

You don't mention how your roof is made. We are all just guessing. I
suspect a flat deck made of exposed steel bar joists with metal deck and
3 or 5 ply roof on pearl board with gravel ballast.

A re-roof to current code will demand a minimum of 1/4 in 12 pitch.
This is usually accomplished with shaped Styrofoam. The popular
membranes now are Modified Bitumen or TPO.

Adding a roof drain is fairly easy, especially if you can travel in the
bar joists to an outside wall. I would think it would be hard to make
grade joining to another existing drain. The added roof drain does NOT
fix the roof, but it does get the weight off.

As someone else already noted, you should certainly have a roofer that
you trust and knows your roof.


What about "Foam roofing"? Where they spray foam on top of everything?
Is that a scam?

As for TPO vs bitumen, which one would you recommend for Illinois? I
am coming to a conclusion that I need to just redo the roof, instead
of half measures, and live happily thereafter.

i

On Sunday, October 6, 2013 7:25:28 PM UTC-4, Paul K. Dickman wrote:

Pay for the silver coat.

Amen to that. It'll more than pay for itself in cooling costs the first summer, And, it makes the rest of the materials last longer.

jon_banquer wrote:
On Sunday, September 29, 2013 1:31:20 PM UTC-7, PrecisionmachinisT wrote:
"jon_banquer" wrote in message

...



There is nothing wrong with flat roofs if you're not a clueless moron like

iggy often shows himself to be.



Around here they slop hot tar onto a couple layers of tarpaper with a mop

and then top it off with a layer of course white rock chips, marble

probably.



If you don't use chips, the tar will crack similar to mud in a dry lake bed.

Connecticut and Illinois are a lot harder on hot tar roofs than Washington is. Extreme heat and extreme cold in both places. The problem with hot tar roofs is that while they are initially cheaper, they are very hard to fix because finding the source of a leak can be a bitch. They are also very messy to work with. I prefer to spend more money and put down a roof that's much more serviceable.

The temp ranges here in Chicago are pretty extreme and any leaks get big
really fast. Looking up to see where the water is leaking followed by a
trip to the roof is going to answer where your leaks are.

One problem with old buildings here is the amount of junk up on the roof.
You can barely even walk around on some commerical buildings because of
all the footings from removed HVAC units, signs, and all the plumbing and
electrical junk related to that stuff.