I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing is I don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows better could speak up?

Bob La Londe fired this volley in
:

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable.

Most any alloy that can be hardened (which is most) would work fine. You
can bet your bottom dollar those "included" stamped wrenches are made
from the cheapest stock they can muster.

The real issue is how much use it will get. If you plan to use it
frequently and a lot, invest in some real tool steel. If not, shrug...

Lloyd

On 08/08/13 16:12, Bob La Londe wrote:
I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing is I don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows better could speak up?

I like to have dedicated spanners for some tools and get the forged
single ended ones. Plenty of people selling them on ebay in a range of
sizes in metric and inch. Searching for "single ended spanner" (in the
UK anyway) or "DIN 894" after the DIN standard for them finds plenty.

On Thu, 8 Aug 2013 08:12:16 -0700 (PDT), Bob La Londe
wrote:

I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing is I don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows better could speak up?

Those things are almost always made of plain carbon steel. 1070 is
common for tools and other odds and ends that need strength with a
moderate amount of ductility.

You'd be suprised how *few* things that we think of as high-strength
are actually made from alloy steels. For example, the piston rods on
shock absorbers and struts: Plain carbon, 1070.

Quality wrenches often are made from a proprietary grade of
chrome-vanadium alloy. But the advantage in most practical uses is
slight.

--
Ed Huntress

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message
...

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable.

I make custom flat-stock tools from car leaf springs or dull circular
saw blades, annealed and hardened in the wood stove. A carpenter
friend gave me a stack of old blades when he cleaned out his truck.

Cold-rolled sheet is reasonably hard and machinable.

http://www.amazon.com/V8-Tools-Piece...670572-2730838

If you are an alarm wizard, who sells a good, reasonably priced
pan-and-tilt outdoor surveillance camera?

jsw2

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 11:40:27 -0400, Ed Huntress wrote:

On Thu, 8 Aug 2013 08:12:16 -0700 (PDT), Bob La Londe
wrote:

I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes
otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for
changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped out
of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one
wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill when
I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing is I
don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I
don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as
the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows
better could speak up?

Those things are almost always made of plain carbon steel. 1070 is
common for tools and other odds and ends that need strength with a
moderate amount of ductility.

You'd be suprised how *few* things that we think of as high-strength are
actually made from alloy steels. For example, the piston rods on shock
absorbers and struts: Plain carbon, 1070.

Quality wrenches often are made from a proprietary grade of
chrome-vanadium alloy. But the advantage in most practical uses is
slight.

That depends on what you see as "practical use". If it says "chrome
vanadium steel" on the outside, and that makes the wrench sell more
without you getting sued for false advertisement, isn't that a highly
practical use from the "let's make lots of money" point of view?

--
Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 11:53:17 -0500, Tim Wescott
wrote:

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 11:40:27 -0400, Ed Huntress wrote:

On Thu, 8 Aug 2013 08:12:16 -0700 (PDT), Bob La Londe
wrote:

I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes
otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for
changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped out
of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one
wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill when
I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing is I
don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I
don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as
the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows
better could speak up?

Those things are almost always made of plain carbon steel. 1070 is
common for tools and other odds and ends that need strength with a
moderate amount of ductility.

You'd be suprised how *few* things that we think of as high-strength are
actually made from alloy steels. For example, the piston rods on shock
absorbers and struts: Plain carbon, 1070.

Quality wrenches often are made from a proprietary grade of
chrome-vanadium alloy. But the advantage in most practical uses is
slight.

That depends on what you see as "practical use". If it says "chrome
vanadium steel" on the outside, and that makes the wrench sell more
without you getting sued for false advertisement, isn't that a highly
practical use from the "let's make lots of money" point of view?

Man, you're a cynic. g

I don't know what they're using now, but 30 years ago, quality
hand-tool makers -- Williams, Sears, Snap-On, etc., used either an
alloy like AISI 6118 (SAE J1268) or a similar proprietary, custom
steel grade.

The advantages are that they develop more hardness and strength with
less carbon, and they retain some ductility, or at least resistance to
brittle failure, even with high-strength heat-treatments.

But, again, those advantages are only meaningful in some
circumstances. If you're ham-fisted and you abuse and overstress your
hand tools, the alloys may save you some grief. But really, for most
uses, plain-carbon steel wiill give you plenty of strength and
hardness.

--
Ed Huntress

"Jim Wilkins" wrote in message
...
"Bob La Londe" wrote in message
...

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable.

I make custom flat-stock tools from car leaf springs or dull circular saw
blades, annealed and hardened in the wood stove. A carpenter friend gave
me a stack of old blades when he cleaned out his truck.

Cold-rolled sheet is reasonably hard and machinable.

http://www.amazon.com/V8-Tools-Piece...670572-2730838

If you are an alarm wizard, who sells a good, reasonably priced
pan-and-tilt outdoor surveillance camera?

Good AND reasonably priced huh? Can we go with good OR reasonably priced?
LOL.

Seriously, my standard weatherproof PTZ sells for around $2k. (+/-)
depending on the exact model. I have a number of commercial sites that use
them for safety, surveillance, and process management both indoors and
outdoors. That being said there are a number of pretty cheap PT (no Z)
cameras for sale on Fleabay that have a limited IR illumination range. I
use one in my back shop for a buddy in another state who I'll talk with on
the phone while I show him how to do something. I think it was around
$100-150. I have seen a few in the couple hundred range that claim to be
outdoor rated. Some claim to be PT(Z), but the Z is digital, not optical.
Might be ok for some uses, but if you really need zoom then you want optical
zoom. This drives up the price as it requires more expensive optics, and
more controls.

I think if you buy something within your "disposable" price range off
Fleabay or Super Circuits or SCD or Amazon or someplace like that you have
a pretty good chance of getting something that meets about 50-60% of its
claimed specs out of the box, and may last for a year or two.

"Wireless" megapixel+ IP cameras with an internal card slot are a good bet
for a lot of people. The higher the resolution the better chance you have
of getting useable video. One 3.1MP camera I have used (fairly expensive
for the one I use) will view an area of 2 gas pump islands with 2 pumps
each, and have enough resolution to read a license plate. Its not available
on Fleabay for a couple hundred bucks though, and its not even a Pan Tilt
model. Its fixed.

Notice I put wireless in quotes? That because wireless is not a magic cure
all to installation headaches. Wireless WiFi has a very limited range, and
it still requires power. There are also some very long range (not WiFi)
wireless solutions. I have one installed in Mexico that is shooting
standard composite video about 1.2 miles. (Sorry, my Mexican work visa has
expired so don't call me for those jobs guys. LOL). It still requires
power, and it was a fairly expensive point to point system.

For something in between for outdoor use I have often recommended simple
cable lockable game cameras. Low power. Limited video clip length.
Effective on spot trouble locations. Modestly inexpensive. Easy to
install. You just need to change the batteries regularly. BLM uses
variations of them in various camoed installations with large batteries to
prosecute vandals, dumpers, litterbugs, and other criminals in unmanned,
historic, camping, and remote trouble sites. Bear that in mind before you
bend your girl friend over at some remote Indian writings historic site for
a quicky. You just might be giving a BLM ranger an eye full. LOL.

If you want to chat about your application I'ld be glad to give a few
minutes of directed thought. (928) 782-9765. I assume all out of town
callers and unknown numbers are telemarketers until proven otherwise so I am
short with those calls when I answer.

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 13:17:30 -0400, Ed Huntress wrote:

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 11:53:17 -0500, Tim Wescott
wrote:

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 11:40:27 -0400, Ed Huntress wrote:

On Thu, 8 Aug 2013 08:12:16 -0700 (PDT), Bob La Londe
wrote:

I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes
otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for
changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped
out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one
wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill
when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing
is I don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I
don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as
the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows
better could speak up?

Those things are almost always made of plain carbon steel. 1070 is
common for tools and other odds and ends that need strength with a
moderate amount of ductility.

You'd be suprised how *few* things that we think of as high-strength
are actually made from alloy steels. For example, the piston rods on
shock absorbers and struts: Plain carbon, 1070.

Quality wrenches often are made from a proprietary grade of
chrome-vanadium alloy. But the advantage in most practical uses is
slight.

That depends on what you see as "practical use". If it says "chrome
vanadium steel" on the outside, and that makes the wrench sell more
without you getting sued for false advertisement, isn't that a highly
practical use from the "let's make lots of money" point of view?

Man, you're a cynic. g

I don't know what they're using now, but 30 years ago, quality hand-tool
makers -- Williams, Sears, Snap-On, etc., used either an alloy like AISI
6118 (SAE J1268) or a similar proprietary, custom steel grade.

The advantages are that they develop more hardness and strength with
less carbon, and they retain some ductility, or at least resistance to
brittle failure, even with high-strength heat-treatments.

But, again, those advantages are only meaningful in some circumstances.
If you're ham-fisted and you abuse and overstress your hand tools, the
alloys may save you some grief. But really, for most uses, plain-carbon
steel wiill give you plenty of strength and hardness.

My understanding of the whole alloy-steel thing (which may be faulty) is
that the alloys don't really change the ultimate strength to which you
can heat treat in a thin section, but they make it easier (sometimes
vastly so) to attain that strength in a piece where you can't get fast
cooling everywhere.

So things that are fairly constant sections, and get made in massive
enough quantities that you can afford to really fine-tune your heat-treat
process, can get made with plain high-carbon steel.

Forged wrenches, OTOH, have massive sections sitting right by thin
sections, and would benefit from some alloying.

--

Tim Wescott
Wescott Design Services
http://www.wescottdesign.com

"Bob La Londe" wrote in message
...
"Jim Wilkins" wrote in message
...

Good AND reasonably priced huh? Can we go with good OR reasonably
priced? LOL.

A trail cam hasn't detected anyone but me, so I can't justify spending
a lot. I just want an idea of the tradeoffs and possibilities. I've
challenged a few neighbors to locate the (nonexistant) cameras up on
trees to keep them and their drinking buddies honest.
jsw

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 12:31:33 -0500, Tim Wescott
wrote:

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 13:17:30 -0400, Ed Huntress wrote:

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 11:53:17 -0500, Tim Wescott
wrote:

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 11:40:27 -0400, Ed Huntress wrote:

On Thu, 8 Aug 2013 08:12:16 -0700 (PDT), Bob La Londe
wrote:

I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes
otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for
changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped
out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one
wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill
when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing
is I don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I
don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as
the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows
better could speak up?

Those things are almost always made of plain carbon steel. 1070 is
common for tools and other odds and ends that need strength with a
moderate amount of ductility.

You'd be suprised how *few* things that we think of as high-strength
are actually made from alloy steels. For example, the piston rods on
shock absorbers and struts: Plain carbon, 1070.

Quality wrenches often are made from a proprietary grade of
chrome-vanadium alloy. But the advantage in most practical uses is
slight.

That depends on what you see as "practical use". If it says "chrome
vanadium steel" on the outside, and that makes the wrench sell more
without you getting sued for false advertisement, isn't that a highly
practical use from the "let's make lots of money" point of view?

Man, you're a cynic. g

I don't know what they're using now, but 30 years ago, quality hand-tool
makers -- Williams, Sears, Snap-On, etc., used either an alloy like AISI
6118 (SAE J1268) or a similar proprietary, custom steel grade.

The advantages are that they develop more hardness and strength with
less carbon, and they retain some ductility, or at least resistance to
brittle failure, even with high-strength heat-treatments.

But, again, those advantages are only meaningful in some circumstances.
If you're ham-fisted and you abuse and overstress your hand tools, the
alloys may save you some grief. But really, for most uses, plain-carbon
steel wiill give you plenty of strength and hardness.

My understanding of the whole alloy-steel thing (which may be faulty) is
that the alloys don't really change the ultimate strength to which you
can heat treat in a thin section, but they make it easier (sometimes
vastly so) to attain that strength in a piece where you can't get fast
cooling everywhere.

Well, that's one type of alloy steel, or a range of types, which are
formulated to harden at slower quench rates -- the slowest being the
air-hardening punching grades, like the A-Series.

There are many reasons for alloying steel. That's why there are so
many types. But your basic idea that many of them are no stronger, but
are easier to quench without damage, is correct. Carbon steel will
achieve hardness and ultimate strength that is as good as those of
most alloys, and fairly close to those that are formulated
specifically for maximum hardness and tensile strength. But if you
have to harden a piece that varies markedly in thickness --
particularly something like a stick punch -- it can crack right off
where the thickness transition occurs, just from quenching it. This
was a big problem in the early says of press-tooling manufacture, when
there wasn't much else besides what is, today, the W-Series of
water-hardening, plain-carbon steels.

Steel metallurgy is a very involved subject, and the field is full of
myths.


So things that are fairly constant sections, and get made in massive
enough quantities that you can afford to really fine-tune your heat-treat
process, can get made with plain high-carbon steel.

Generally true. It's also true that carbon steels are typically a bit
more tolerant of imprecise temperatures for initial heating to the
transition temperature, and they'll do different things,
satisfactorly, through a range of tempering temperatures. IOW, they're
*usually* a bit more forgiving of imprecise heat-treatment.

Any steel will suffer damage if you quench it too fast. The thing
about plain carbon is that you MUST quench it fast, or it doesn't
harden. O1 can be quenched more slowly. A1 can be quenched by just
letting it lay on the bench, cooling in ambient air. That is, if it
isn't too thick.


Forged wrenches, OTOH, have massive sections sitting right by thin
sections, and would benefit from some alloying.

No doubt that's part of it, but the big issue is the inherent
ductility of the alloy -- or its impact resistance, or other ability
to withstand overloading.

--
Ed Huntress

I've made a few open end wrenches. A couple for the spindle on my
horizontal mill (1", 1-1/4 or so). I just used 3/16 mild steel.
They're about 8 - 10" long, so it's not possible to put a lot of torque
on the jaws. But on occasion I've whacked one with a lead hammer
without ill effect.

YMMV, of course.

Bob

Tim Wescott wrote:
On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 11:40:27 -0400, Ed Huntress wrote:

On Thu, 8 Aug 2013 08:12:16 -0700 (PDT), Bob La Londe
wrote:

I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes
otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for
changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped out
of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one
wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill when
I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing is I
don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I
don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as
the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows
better could speak up?

Those things are almost always made of plain carbon steel. 1070 is
common for tools and other odds and ends that need strength with a
moderate amount of ductility.

You'd be suprised how *few* things that we think of as high-strength are
actually made from alloy steels. For example, the piston rods on shock
absorbers and struts: Plain carbon, 1070.

Quality wrenches often are made from a proprietary grade of
chrome-vanadium alloy. But the advantage in most practical uses is
slight.

That depends on what you see as "practical use". If it says "chrome
vanadium steel" on the outside, and that makes the wrench sell more
without you getting sued for false advertisement, isn't that a highly
practical use from the "let's make lots of money" point of view?

I've seen some pretty dubious tools with markings like this.

finish quality is a pretty good sign of what you're dealing with. If the
nickel plating is flaking off and the thing has never been used, you can
bet the rest of the thing is no better.

On Thu, 8 Aug 2013 08:12:16 -0700 (PDT), Bob La Londe
wrote:

I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing is I don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows better could speak up?
Do what the average mechanic does when he needs a wrench to fit
where a normal one doesn't. Modify an existing wrench. Bend, grind,
cut, whatever is necessary.

On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 21:02:38 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 8 Aug 2013 08:12:16 -0700 (PDT), Bob La Londe
wrote:

I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing is I don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows better could speak up?
Do what the average mechanic does when he needs a wrench to fit
where a normal one doesn't. Modify an existing wrench. Bend, grind,
cut, whatever is necessary.

I have a whole 'set' of those, including a 4" long 12" crescent
wrench. I prefer using a 7" angle grinder over a rotary grinder for
thinning open end wrenches. They're quicker and it's easier to keep
the result flat and parallel.

In another life, I made a Chebby distributor wrench from a 1/2"
Chiwanese box wrench, some 3/8" barstock, and a coat hanger (rod), and
a car battery. T'warnt purty.

(Jus'cuz it was all available and nobody was open Sunday night.)

--
Tomorrow is the most important thing in life. Comes into us at midnight
very clean. It's perfect when it arrives and it puts itself in our hands.
It hopes we've learned something from yesterday.
-- John Wayne

"Larry Jaques" wrote in message
...
On Thu, 08 Aug 2013 21:02:38 -0400, wrote:

On Thu, 8 Aug 2013 08:12:16 -0700 (PDT), Bob La Londe
wrote:

I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes
otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for
changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped out
of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one
wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill when
I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing is I
don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I
don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as the
cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows better
could speak up?
Do what the average mechanic does when he needs a wrench to fit
where a normal one doesn't. Modify an existing wrench. Bend, grind,
cut, whatever is necessary.

I have a whole 'set' of those, including a 4" long 12" crescent
wrench. I prefer using a 7" angle grinder over a rotary grinder for
thinning open end wrenches. They're quicker and it's easier to keep
the result flat and parallel.

In another life, I made a Chebby distributor wrench from a 1/2"
Chiwanese box wrench, some 3/8" barstock, and a coat hanger (rod), and
a car battery. T'warnt purty.

(Jus'cuz it was all available and nobody was open Sunday night.)


Its funny. I grew up in a rural area and my dad owned a country hardware
and autoparts store. I could get anything there from fish hooks, to spare
ammo, to nuts and bolts, to plumbing for just about anything, to power
tools, to whatever. Now that I live in town I find myself having to visit 5
different stores for a single project, and then still having to order
something that I think should be a stock item in order to finish a project.

What really kills me is the bulk bolt bins in all the stores are grade 2 at
best, but our main bulk bolt bins were all grade 5. We only stocked a few
grade 2 in certain sizes for farmers that used them as shear pins on
equipment. We also had bulk bolt bins of grade 8. Every time I see the
fastener aisle in a big box store all I can think is Hillman sucks.

"Bob La Londe" fired this volley in news:bYcNt.119471
:

We only stocked a few
grade 2 in certain sizes for farmers that used them as shear pins on
equipment.

ditto... I use 1/2" x 5" grade 2 for shear pins in my bush hog's PTO
shaft. Not fer nothin' else... (but they're as expensive as grade 8,
now, if you buy them from a hardware store!)

LLoyd

On 8/8/2013 11:12 AM, Bob La Londe wrote:
I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes
otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for
changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped
out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for
one wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the
mill when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The
thing is I don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable.
I don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner
as the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who
knows better could speak up?




I've made a boatload of wrenches and such from O-1 ground stock. I'll
harden the working area and draw it back to very dark straw to blue. I
can't remember breaking of deforming one in decades. Easy and cheap!

"Tom Gardner" Mars@Tacks wrote in message
...
On 8/8/2013 11:12 AM, Bob La Londe wrote:
I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes
otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for
changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped
out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for
one wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the
mill when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The
thing is I don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable.
I don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner
as the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who
knows better could speak up?




I've made a boatload of wrenches and such from O-1 ground stock. I'll
harden the working area and draw it back to very dark straw to blue. I
can't remember breaking of deforming one in decades. Easy and cheap!

Where are you buying your O-1? I have a few pieces I picked up for making
punches and punch dies, but it wasn't cheap.

On 8/10/2013 12:54 AM, Bob La Londe wrote:
"Tom Gardner" Mars@Tacks wrote in message
...
On 8/8/2013 11:12 AM, Bob La Londe wrote:
I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes
otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for
changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped
out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for
one wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the
mill when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The
thing is I don't know what steel to use.

How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable.
I don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner
as the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who
knows better could speak up?




I've made a boatload of wrenches and such from O-1 ground stock. I'll
harden the working area and draw it back to very dark straw to blue.
I can't remember breaking of deforming one in decades. Easy and cheap!

Where are you buying your O-1? I have a few pieces I picked up for
making punches and punch dies, but it wasn't cheap.

There are a couple of service centers I use for quantity but I buy at
McMasters if I want it now or ebay. Should be $3-$5/lb in bulk, ground
stock is more but still reasonable, for the times.

On Thursday, August 8, 2013 9:12:16 AM UTC-6, Bob La Londe wrote:
I am sure you are familiar with them. The flat black (sometimes otherwise coated) wrenches that come with a lot of power tools for changing blades, bits, discs, etc. They look like they are stamped out of sheet. I am certainly not going to make a stamping die for one wrench, but I am sure I could cut one out of flat stock on the mill when I need one and a regular mechanics wrench won't fit. The thing is I don't know what steel to use. How about an inexpensive alloy that might be easily heat treatable. I don't think surface hardening would help for a wrench or a spanner as the cross section would still be softer, but maybe somebody who knows better could speak up?

Pays to be a scrounger. I've seen bins of this stuff in pawn shops and "bargin" stores, collect a few sorts and grind to fit whatever you have. For one-offs, some of the regular-style wrenches can be collected and cut/welded/brazed to whatever location some twisted engineer figured out where to put a bolthead or nut. My dad had a bucket of such tools that he collected from LOLs, estate sale residue and the like. Came in handy. Vertical belt grinders make short work of widening wrench gaps to fit.

If you need something a little more formal, O1 makes a decent tool, ground flat stock is available, if not as cheap as it once was. Then there's chunks of OCS if you're in scrounger mode. But it may take you a lot longer than just modifying an existing wrench. Dunk it in purple paint, grind off the markings, restamp it or something so you don't grab it sometime thinking it's the size wrench that's marked and finding out that it truly isn't so....

Stan