On Jun 18, 5:11*am, "Steve B" wrote:
wrote in message

...
On Jun 16, 11:18 pm, "Steve B" wrote:

wrote

The thing I saw said it was a computer malfunction. Don't remember
where I saw it.
Karl

What I saw was operator error, and I saw it in the video.

Steve, OSHA certified crane operator, land cranes and offshore drilling
platforms

Well that's what it looked like to me but I've never operated a crane.
Knowing you from this newsgroup I believe you over what they told the
owner. Aren't these things investigated to see who screwed up?
Found it:
"The crane company, Truck Crane Service, told the homeowner, who did
not want to be interviewed, that a computer error is to blame for the
mishap."
Here's the link:http://www.liveleak.com/view?i=aed_1...913&comments=1
Karl

Yeah, and almost every fire is attributed to a weldor.

I ran cranes for quite a while. *I have run a crane very similar to this
one, a Grove 12.5 ton. *From what I know, what I can see, what I measured,
and my real life experiences, the crane was boomed down too far, and the
boom was extended too far, and the load was too heavy. *If those things had
been correct, we wouldn't be talking about it right now. *The boom could
have been raised, or the boom extended in, and it wouldn't have happened.
But they wouldn't have been able to place the load where necessary.

A good crane operator knows the weight of the object he is lifting, and the
furthest he can boom down and safely pick up that object. *Most cranes do
not have any electronics to tell the operator that. *Just a plate that's
usually not there, dirty, or abraded to the point it can't be read. * *In
this case, that didn't happen, or they would have known they were operating
out of parameters. *When they say a "computer error", they may have been
talking about a faulty weight reading when test lifting the object. *Other
than that, computers have little to do with the actual controlling of the
crane, except sensing for out of parameter input and coordinating movements
produced by using more than one control at a time.

The comment of "some sound" has not been expounded upon a lot. *Perhaps
there was a jolt in the cable, even where it rolls over other coils on the
drum that gave the load enough moment to tip the balance for the slightest
time. *The crane DID tip over slowly, indicating it was a very small error
on the side of the load, enough to tip the machine. *Perhaps it hit
something enough to swing the load. *I do not think all the evidence is in
yet, or hasn't been published.

You must also remember that these are reports by layman. *Some sound.
Computer error. *A loose frammit. *That damned weldor.

I'd like to hear from a qualified person for the final evaluation. *What we
have is the crane owner explaining to the homeowner that it was because of a
computer error. *Too bad there wasn't a weldor there to blame it on. *Do you
think they are going to say, "I'm sorry. *We screwed up. *We were not set up
correctly, were boomed down too far, and had the boom extended too far for
the weight of the load." *Or, "We didn't get the weight of the load, and
didn't read the operating manual for load limits or look at the boom chart."

Can you say lawsuit?

What do you think the crane company is going to tell the homeowner? *I
believe the insurance company will have some far more probing and exact
questions, and are not just going to sign off and pay off with a two word
explanation from the crane's owner.

Three measurements are needed, which can then be sent to the manufacturers
of the crane for evaluation. *Weight of load (known), angle of boom relative
to level (known from the picture), and extension of boom (easily attainable
by simple tape measure). *The math would be undeniable.

I believe that's what the insurance company is going to go by. *A car crash
can be witnessed by four people on four different corners. *Each will tell a
slightly different story due to their different angles of observation. *And
some will include details that are not relevent to calculating the answer..
All we have here is witnesses who were so frightened, they were "shaking in
his boots", and were actually in an altered state of consciousness. *And
some, obviously, were not even qualified enough to correctly evaluate the
accident, yet the press jumps on their testimony.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Altered..._consciousness

Steve

Heart surgery pending?www.heartsurgerysurvivalguide.com
Heart Surgery Survival Guide

Thanks for the post.
Karl

Joseph Gwinn wrote:
In ,
"Steve wrote:

wrote

Part 2..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4v9N...eature=related

bigger crane to remove smaller crane from house.

Using a protractor, I come up with a boom angle of around 35 degrees. And
it looks like the boom is pretty much fully extended. I wonder how
experienced the operator and supervisor were. That's a rookie mistake.

There was a distinct SNAP! sound, followed hy the Holy ****! What was
the snap sound?


I would bet that the support for the outriggers was defective but I
cannot see the condition of them in the video. It is not uncommon for
the outriggers to sink when they are not on solid firm ground. If that
happens the crane is going over if the load is not near the ground.
The operator should have had a measurement of how far he was going out
with that load because that is the most important dimension. The crane
should have been placed closer to the garage to decrease the distance
where they were installing the pool. He should have also made a test
pick at a distance from the center of rotation to where the pool was
going plus another 5 feet to make sure he was not exceeding the limits
of the crane. HIgh loads are a bitch if they are swung too fast.
Centrpedal force will add to the moment on the boom and can topple the
crane. Once it starts to go with a high load, hang on cause you're
going over.
At least they were smart enough to use two other cranes to remove the
crane from the house, one just to keep it from slamming down after the
other crane picked up on the boom. Weight times distance, very simple
highschool physics, and then check the charts that are supposed to be
inside the cab of the crane.

John


Joe Gwinn

"john" wrote in message
...
Joseph Gwinn wrote:
In ,
"Steve wrote:

wrote

Part 2..

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=A4v9N...eature=related

bigger crane to remove smaller crane from house.

Using a protractor, I come up with a boom angle of around 35 degrees.
And
it looks like the boom is pretty much fully extended. I wonder how
experienced the operator and supervisor were. That's a rookie mistake.

There was a distinct SNAP! sound, followed hy the Holy ****! What was
the snap sound?


I would bet that the support for the outriggers was defective but I
cannot see the condition of them in the video. It is not uncommon for
the outriggers to sink when they are not on solid firm ground. If that
happens the crane is going over if the load is not near the ground. The
operator should have had a measurement of how far he was going out with
that load because that is the most important dimension. The crane should
have been placed closer to the garage to decrease the distance where they
were installing the pool. He should have also made a test pick at a
distance from the center of rotation to where the pool was going plus
another 5 feet to make sure he was not exceeding the limits of the crane.
HIgh loads are a bitch if they are swung too fast. Centrpedal force will
add to the moment on the boom and can topple the crane. Once it starts to
go with a high load, hang on cause you're going over.
At least they were smart enough to use two other cranes to remove the
crane from the house, one just to keep it from slamming down after the
other crane picked up on the boom. Weight times distance, very simple
highschool physics, and then check the charts that are supposed to be
inside the cab of the crane.

John


Joe Gwinn

I think that the cracking or snaping sound heard in the video was the
concrete driveway suddenly failing under the rear outriggers of the crane.
In the second video, in several of the frames it looks like the driveway is
crushed under the outriggers. It's hard to see because unfortunatly there
is a big damn cardboard box in the way. As the load was moved farther away
from the crane the load on the rear outriggers would constantly increase
until the, typically, thin concrete of the driveway suddenly failed. This
sudden "lurch" could then have initiated the tipping over of the crane.

http://tinyurl.com/678lzbq
[Open in new window]

Courtesy tiny URL for folks who can't get the long URL.
What a mistake! The pool was obviously heavy, shame the
crane went down.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"James Waldby" wrote in message
...

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/northamerica/usa/8575579/Pool-delivery-goes-wrong-as-crane-lands-on-house.html?utm_source=tmg&utm_medium=TD_8575579&ut m_campaign=video1606pm

"Taking delivery of a brand new outdoor swimming pool, a
builder films
as a crane operator attempts to hoist the ready-made
structure over the
new owner's house and into the garden." "...the man behind
the lens
can be heard to exclaim "watch out for the chimney" as the
delicate
operation progresses."

--
jiw

Here's another in the "series" about cranes and rigging. The operator
of the closest one should try out for the Olympics. High hurdles
maybe???

http://current.com/entertainment/comedy/92987977_how-not-to-launch-your-boat.htm

And contrary to what the message said when I got this in an email
which suggested there was "no damage to the boat", I bet there was. At
least enough to have it hauled out for a survey (preferably by a
different company??).

Take care. THINK helps too.

Brian Lawson,
Bothwell, Ontario.

On Wed, 22 Jun 2011 10:50:17 -0400, Brian Lawson
wrote:


Here's another in the "series" about cranes and rigging. The operator
of the closest one should try out for the Olympics. High hurdles
maybe???

http://current.com/entertainment/comedy/92987977_how-not-to-launch-your-boat.htm

And contrary to what the message said when I got this in an email
which suggested there was "no damage to the boat", I bet there was. At
least enough to have it hauled out for a survey (preferably by a
different company??).

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Qv8W4W-iJvE even worse.


Take care. THINK helps too.

Stands for?

--
"Human nature itself is evermore an advocate for liberty.
There is also in human nature a resentment of injury, and
indignation against wrong. A love of truth and a veneration
of virtue. These amiable passions, are the latent spark. If
the people are capable of understanding, seeing and feeling
the differences between true and false, right and wrong,
virtue and vice, to what better principle can the friends of
mankind apply than to the sense of this difference?"
--John Adams