Has anyone had any experiences with their SureStart, SureStart PLUS,
Integrity Roof, etc warranties. Interest in value, claims experience, etc.

I don't know anyonme who actually saw a dime from a shingle warranty.
Responsible roofing companies have come through but the homeowner usually
doesn't get much from the manufacturer.

"GaryRW" wrote in message
newspsem2bfc1zqpvr1@athlon04...
Has anyone had any experiences with their SureStart, SureStart PLUS,
Integrity Roof, etc warranties. Interest in value, claims experience,
etc.

Don't know about warranties but I got a 28% discount in my homeowners
insurance by putting on Class 4 hail resistant tile. I happen to live in
"hail alley". You need to check with your agent to see if that applies in
your area.

On 20 Sep 2004 19:10:15 GMT, (Greg) scribbled this
interesting note:

I don't know anyonme who actually saw a dime from a shingle warranty.
Responsible roofing companies have come through but the homeowner usually
doesn't get much from the manufacturer.

I do.

A couple of decades ago GAF had some issues with the manufacture of
their shingles. Without fail, whenever we recommended to our customers
that they should contact GAF for warranty service, it was honored.

This is a good recommendation for GAF, in my opinion. Other shingle
manufacturers aren't so happy when their shingles fail and usually try
to find any other minor item to blame the failure on instead of owning
up to the fact that they manufactured a defective product that
wouldn't perform as the warranty claimed.

Remember, the warranty from the manufacturer only covers the cost of
the materials, pro-rated for the length of service the customer
received, so the actual amount you may recover in any warranty service
will most likely be small since in asphalt composition roof shingles
manufacturing defect usually show up only in the last few years of the
warranty.


--
John Willis
(Remove the Primes before e-mailing me)

Remember, the warranty from the manufacturer only covers the cost of
the materials, pro-rated for the length of service the customer
received, so the actual amount you may recover in any warranty service
will most likely be small since in asphalt composition roof shingles
manufacturing defect usually show up only in the last few years of the
warranty.

My point exactly. Say you bought a 30 year roof. 15-20% of the price was the
wholesale cost of the shingles. It fails in 15 years. You get 7-10% of what it
cost you 15 years ago asssuming you can prove you did nothing to shorten the
life of the shingles.

On 21 Sep 2004 00:01:42 GMT, (Greg) scribbled this
interesting note:

Remember, the warranty from the manufacturer only covers the cost of
the materials, pro-rated for the length of service the customer
received, so the actual amount you may recover in any warranty service
will most likely be small since in asphalt composition roof shingles
manufacturing defect usually show up only in the last few years of the
warranty.

My point exactly. Say you bought a 30 year roof. 15-20% of the price was the
wholesale cost of the shingles. It fails in 15 years. You get 7-10% of what it
cost you 15 years ago asssuming you can prove you did nothing to shorten the
life of the shingles.

Which is my point about GAF. They had a manufacturing defect for a
period of time. It was corrected. But for those people who purchased
the defective product, they did exactly what their warranty said they
would do. This is something I've not seen any other shingle
manufacturer do in the way they have.

As for the rest, why should a manufacturer warrant someone else's
labor? They have no control over that. They specifically state in
their warranties that they are stating their product will perform to
certain standards and will replace the nominal cost to the original
purchaser the unused portion of the product (meaning they will pay on
a pro-rated basis the unused portion of the product.) This seems very
fair to me. And I work with these products every day. And I guarantee
our labor and would find it very odd if the shingle manufacturer did
too!:~)

Of course around here periodic hail storms take care of most roofs
well before any warranty would run out. Not that I'm in favor of hail
storms-I don't like that much work!:~)


--
John Willis
(Remove the Primes before e-mailing me)

Shingle manufacturers often have a habbit of going out of business making
the warranty useless.... like the shingles on my house.


"Greg" wrote in message
...
Remember, the warranty from the manufacturer only covers the cost of
the materials, pro-rated for the length of service the customer
received, so the actual amount you may recover in any warranty service
will most likely be small since in asphalt composition roof shingles
manufacturing defect usually show up only in the last few years of the
warranty.

My point exactly. Say you bought a 30 year roof. 15-20% of the price was
the
wholesale cost of the shingles. It fails in 15 years. You get 7-10% of
what it
cost you 15 years ago asssuming you can prove you did nothing to shorten
the
life of the shingles.

It's very common for the roof not to have the
minimum amount of ventilation, voiding the warrantee

Art wrote in message
ink.net...
Shingle manufacturers often have a habbit of going out of business making
the warranty useless.... like the shingles on my house.


"Greg" wrote in message
...
Remember, the warranty from the manufacturer only covers the cost of
the materials, pro-rated for the length of service the customer
received, so the actual amount you may recover in any warranty service
will most likely be small since in asphalt composition roof shingles
manufacturing defect usually show up only in the last few years of the
warranty.

My point exactly. Say you bought a 30 year roof. 15-20% of the price was
the
wholesale cost of the shingles. It fails in 15 years. You get 7-10% of
what it
cost you 15 years ago asssuming you can prove you did nothing to shorten
the
life of the shingles.

Additional info for discussion, comment, and recommendation:

CertainTeed's SureStart Plus warranty covers materials, labor, tearoff,
disposal, and workmanship for 15 or 50 yrs at it's highest level (5
Star). It is essentially a manufacturer's warranty covering everything
and is not prorated over that period. After that period, the material
only warranty is prorated. In order to even be able to offer this
coverage only the highest CertainTeed certified (SELECT Shingle Roofer)
qualify. Very few roofers listed on their website have the highest level
of certification. I'm aware that this could merely be a meaningless
certification that only means the roofer paid to be on the list rather
than being both tested and apprenticed. If it's run correctly it provides
insurance for the buyer that they're covered even if the roofer goes out
of business. For the beginning legitimate roofing companies it can offer
an equalizing sales position to well established roofers with good
reputations because it covers the risk to the buyer from the manufacturer
which is hopefully the least risky party of the equation.

As I read the new CertainTeed SureStart 2004 Asphalt Shingle Products
Limited Warranty Form 20-20-1890 (which supercedes 20-20-1856), I see the
following issues:

A. Transferability (pg 2): Only first subsequent owner; 100% of
remaining SureStart warranty period. However, Lifetime warrantied products
are reduced to 50 yrs. "For product warranties transferred after the
SureStart period has elapsed, the remaining duration of the transferred
warranty will be limited to TWO years from the date of real estate
transfer."

So does this mean the maximum remaining 15 yrs prorated material warranty
is reduced to 2 yrs? What if the house is sold during the SureStart
warranty? Do you then have 15yrs prorated after SureStart or just two
years?

B. SureStart Protection (pg 2): "SureStart protection does not extend to
any shingles applied to any non-ventilated roof deck systems." This is
fine and proper, but is a full-length ridge vent sufficient, or do you
have to balance it with the properly sized under-eave or ventilated
dripstrip? What constitutes a minimally acceptable system?

C. Self-Sealing Strip (pg 3): "Shingles which do not receive direct
sunlight or which are not exposed to to adequate surface temperatures may
never seal and must be hand sealed at time of application." "Failure of
the shingles to seal under any circumstances is NOT a manufacturing defect
and CertainTeed will not be responsible for repairing, replacing or
hand-sealing any shingles under any such circumstances." This is
perfectly understandable but how do you hedge applying in, say, October
when there may not be sufficient warmth?


On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 18:44:02 GMT, GaryRW wrote:

Has anyone had any experiences with their SureStart, SureStart PLUS,
Integrity Roof, etc warranties. Interest in value, claims experience,
etc.

You are correct about ventilation. A full-length ridge vent is not enough
to maintain warranty. Installation instructions specify balanced airflow
and there's a formula for venting in/out. And gable vents don't qualify.
You need eave vents. If you don't have under-eave venting already, it is
expensive to retrofit. An alternative is a ventilated drip-edge. You
cutoff a section of the deck and install this as a replacement for the
lower deck.

Does anyone have any experience with a ventilated drip-edge? Obviously it
is a cheaper retrofit than under-eave, but does it compromise anything?
Only thing that comes to mind is possible water infiltration during
wind-driven rain. Are there better designs for drip-edges? Are there
under-eave venting retrofits that are cheaper and as effective as
effective as new-construction?

On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 21:54:44 -0400, Michael Baugh
wrote:

It's very common for the roof not to have the
minimum amount of ventilation, voiding the warrantee

Art wrote in message
ink.net...
Shingle manufacturers often have a habbit of going out of business
making
the warranty useless.... like the shingles on my house.


"Greg" wrote in message
...
Remember, the warranty from the manufacturer only covers the cost of
the materials, pro-rated for the length of service the customer
received, so the actual amount you may recover in any warranty
service
will most likely be small since in asphalt composition roof shingles
manufacturing defect usually show up only in the last few years of
the
warranty.

My point exactly. Say you bought a 30 year roof. 15-20% of the price
was
the
wholesale cost of the shingles. It fails in 15 years. You get 7-10% of
what it
cost you 15 years ago asssuming you can prove you did nothing to
shorten
the
life of the shingles.

Class action lawsuits tend to reform manufacturers and make them fly
right......

On Mon, 20 Sep 2004 17:29:19 -0500, John Willis
wrote:

On 20 Sep 2004 19:10:15 GMT, (Greg) scribbled this
interesting note:

I don't know anyonme who actually saw a dime from a shingle warranty.
Responsible roofing companies have come through but the homeowner
usually
doesn't get much from the manufacturer.

I do.

A couple of decades ago GAF had some issues with the manufacture of
their shingles. Without fail, whenever we recommended to our customers
that they should contact GAF for warranty service, it was honored.

This is a good recommendation for GAF, in my opinion. Other shingle
manufacturers aren't so happy when their shingles fail and usually try
to find any other minor item to blame the failure on instead of owning
up to the fact that they manufactured a defective product that
wouldn't perform as the warranty claimed.

Remember, the warranty from the manufacturer only covers the cost of
the materials, pro-rated for the length of service the customer
received, so the actual amount you may recover in any warranty service
will most likely be small since in asphalt composition roof shingles
manufacturing defect usually show up only in the last few years of the
warranty.


--
John Willis
(Remove the Primes before e-mailing me)

The big problem is that only a limited time, if any, of the shingle
warranty is transferred to a new owner. It's like a muffler warranty.
Because of this limitation, it's not even very valuable in resale value.

Certainteed offers their SureStart Plus warranty that offers 100% of the
cost of materials, labor, disposal, workmanship, etc for 15 yrs and it is
transferrable 100% to the first new owner. However, after the 15 yrs is
up only an additional 2 yrs of the remaining 15 yrs is in effect. By the
way, this SureStart Plus Warranty is a work and material warranty
independent of contractor. So if your roofer goes bust, you still have
coverage. It is only available through only some Certainteed certified
roofers. This was introduced because the public's general view of roofers
is that they are highly suspect. New roofing contractors can compete with
established reputable roofers by offering this SureStart Plus Warranty.
Only a very few roofers hold this level of certification.

I'm sure other shingle manufacturers will have similar warranties, if not
already.

On 20 Sep 2004 19:10:15 GMT, Greg wrote:

I don't know anyonme who actually saw a dime from a shingle warranty.
Responsible roofing companies have come through but the homeowner usually
doesn't get much from the manufacturer.