Pulled the Honda/Craftsman cord to start 'er up, and the cord has very
little tension on the return stroke.

http://i.cubeupload.com/q5oXeb.jpg

Pull stroke seems reasonably normal but the string won't rewind all the
way.

Leaves about a foot to a foot and a half loose.
What makes it go tight? Springs?

Pulled the cord, and the string doesn't go back.
I can coax it back most of the way, but then when I pull again, it doesn't
go back.

Any debugging hints?

Danny D. wrote:
Pulled the Honda/Craftsman cord to start 'er up, and the cord has very
little tension on the return stroke.
http://i.cubeupload.com/q5oXeb.jpg

Pull stroke seems reasonably normal but the string won't rewind all the
way.

Leaves about a foot to a foot and a half loose.
What makes it go tight? Springs?
Pulled the cord, and the string doesn't go back.
I can coax it back most of the way, but then when I pull again, it
doesn't
go back.

Any debugging hints?

Yes, there's a spring, obviously. The idea (starting fresh) is to wind
the spring up manually, hold it (tie it off) so you can attach the cord,
and then let it reel in the cord to see whether the tension was
appropriate. In your case, you obviously have the alternative choice to
shorten the cord--but do it right and re-install the cord as suggested
above. Probably a video of the process on youtube. Good luck!

Bill

On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 22:06:44 -0400, Bill wrote:

Yes, there's a spring, obviously. The idea (starting fresh) is to wind
the spring up manually, hold it (tie it off) so you can attach the cord,
and then let it reel in the cord to see whether the tension was
appropriate. In your case, you obviously have the alternative choice to
shorten the cord--but do it right and re-install the cord as suggested
above. Probably a video of the process on youtube. Good luck!

It's the first pull of the season out here in California after lots of
rain.

The thing was outside (no shed ... gotta build a shed some day) all winter.
Pulled it a hundred times, without it getting better (or worse).

What would make the spring give up the ghost from sitting idle all winter?

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 01:54:33 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

Pulled the Honda/Craftsman cord to start 'er up, and the cord has very
little tension on the return stroke.

http://i.cubeupload.com/q5oXeb.jpg

Pull stroke seems reasonably normal but the string won't rewind all the
way.

Leaves about a foot to a foot and a half loose.
What makes it go tight? Springs?

Pulled the cord, and the string doesn't go back.
I can coax it back most of the way, but then when I pull again, it doesn't
go back.

Any debugging hints?

Cords stretch. the recoil spring weakens. Pull the cowling and fix
both Huckleberry.

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 02:12:33 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

What would make the spring give up the ghost from sitting idle all winter?

My guess is that even spring steel gets weak, Huckleberry.

On 3/12/17 8:54 PM, Danny D. wrote:
Pulled the Honda/Craftsman cord to start 'er up, and the cord has very
little tension on the return stroke.
http://i.cubeupload.com/q5oXeb.jpg

Pull stroke seems reasonably normal but the string won't rewind all the
way.

Leaves about a foot to a foot and a half loose.
What makes it go tight? Springs?
Pulled the cord, and the string doesn't go back.
I can coax it back most of the way, but then when I pull again, it doesn't
go back.

Any debugging hints?

Maybe a good cleaning would help. Is the cord wet? Maybe it has
expanded a bit.

On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 19:25:34 -0700, Oren wrote:

What would make the spring give up the ghost from sitting idle all winter?

My guess is that even spring steel gets weak, Huckleberry.

I just got back inside after using it to mow the lawn a bit.

Even though I got it started, the cord was only half tight when the motor
was running, and then pulling it again to restart whenever I stopped showed
the same thing.

So it's not really the motor that winds the string, although when the motor
is running, the string is semi tighter.

On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 21:30:22 -0500, Dean Hoffman wrote:

Maybe a good cleaning would help. Is the cord wet? Maybe it has
expanded a bit.

Cord is dry as we've had days of dry weather, but I'll pull the cowling
tomorrow and snap a few pictures.

I'll also change the oil and dump the old gas out as it has been in there
all winter outside.

On 3/12/17 9:51 PM, Danny D. wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 21:30:22 -0500, Dean Hoffman wrote:

Maybe a good cleaning would help. Is the cord wet? Maybe it
has
expanded a bit.

Cord is dry as we've had days of dry weather, but I'll pull the cowling
tomorrow and snap a few pictures.
I'll also change the oil and dump the old gas out as it has been in there
all winter outside.

There's a parts diagram he
http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Honda/Lawn%20Mower/0/HR216%20SXA%20LAWN%20MOWER,%20JPN,%20VIN%23%20MACR-1000001/RECOIL%20STARTER/parts.html

Or: http://alturl.com/fefnj

I didn't look to see if it's the same brand as yours. It's intended
just to show you
how they're made. I think they're pretty much alike.

On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 22:05:17 -0500, Dean Hoffman wrote:

There's a parts diagram he
http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Honda/Lawn%20Mower/0/HR216%20SXA%20LAWN%20MOWER,%20JPN,%20VIN%23%20MACR-1000001/RECOIL%20STARTER/parts.html

Or: http://alturl.com/fefnj

I didn't look to see if it's the same brand as yours. It's intended
just to show you
how they're made. I think they're pretty much alike.

Thanks for that parts diagram where I can see the coiled spring (item #8)
which is a sixteen-dollar part I can probably get at Sears. The sticker for
the Craftsman number seems gone so I will have to dig for paperwork to find
the right model.

The lawn mower was bought at either OSH or Sears, probably OSH, around 2012
or so.

Remaining stickers say it's a 161cm "Troy-Bilt" 21" self-propelled push
mower with a Honda label on top (if that's not an oxymoron).

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 01:54:33 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

Pulled the Honda/Craftsman cord to start 'er up, and the cord has very
little tension on the return stroke.

http://i.cubeupload.com/q5oXeb.jpg

Pull stroke seems reasonably normal but the string won't rewind all the
way.

Leaves about a foot to a foot and a half loose.
What makes it go tight? Springs?

Pulled the cord, and the string doesn't go back.
I can coax it back most of the way, but then when I pull again, it doesn't
go back.

Any debugging hints?
The spring is likely broken.. Either that or the clutch is gummed up.

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 02:12:33 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 22:06:44 -0400, Bill wrote:

Yes, there's a spring, obviously. The idea (starting fresh) is to wind
the spring up manually, hold it (tie it off) so you can attach the cord,
and then let it reel in the cord to see whether the tension was
appropriate. In your case, you obviously have the alternative choice to
shorten the cord--but do it right and re-install the cord as suggested
above. Probably a video of the process on youtube. Good luck!

It's the first pull of the season out here in California after lots of
rain.

The thing was outside (no shed ... gotta build a shed some day) all winter.
Pulled it a hundred times, without it getting better (or worse).

What would make the spring give up the ghost from sitting idle all winter?
RUST?. Try this before condeming the pring. Remove the spark plug and
rotate the engine backwards. Does the rope wind in? If so the clutch
id stiff. In either case the starter housing needs to come off. If
just stiff youcan lubricate it. DO NOT shorten the rope!!!

On 3/12/17 10:30 PM, Danny D. wrote:
On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 22:05:17 -0500, Dean Hoffman wrote:

There's a parts diagram he
http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Honda/Lawn%20Mower/0/HR216%20SXA%20LAWN%20MOWER,%20JPN,%20VIN%23%20MACR-1000001/RECOIL%20STARTER/parts.html


Or: http://alturl.com/fefnj

I didn't look to see if it's the same brand as yours. It's
intended just to show you
how they're made. I think they're pretty much alike.

Thanks for that parts diagram where I can see the coiled spring (item #8)
which is a sixteen-dollar part I can probably get at Sears. The sticker for
the Craftsman number seems gone so I will have to dig for paperwork to find
the right model.

Amazon and Ebay have the whole assemblies.

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 03:30:20 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 22:05:17 -0500, Dean Hoffman wrote:

There's a parts diagram he
http://www.boats.net/parts/search/Honda/Lawn%20Mower/0/HR216%20SXA%20LAWN%20MOWER,%20JPN,%20VIN%23%20MACR-1000001/RECOIL%20STARTER/parts.html

Or: http://alturl.com/fefnj

I didn't look to see if it's the same brand as yours. It's intended
just to show you
how they're made. I think they're pretty much alike.

Thanks for that parts diagram where I can see the coiled spring (item #8)
which is a sixteen-dollar part I can probably get at Sears. The sticker for
the Craftsman number seems gone so I will have to dig for paperwork to find
the right model.

The lawn mower was bought at either OSH or Sears, probably OSH, around 2012
or so.

Remaining stickers say it's a 161cm "Troy-Bilt" 21" self-propelled push
mower with a Honda label on top (if that's not an oxymoron).
TroyBuilt is now ( or has been) using Honda motors in place of
Tecumseh on some models -Troy Bilt is made now by MTD

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 01:54:33 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

Pulled the Honda/Craftsman cord to start 'er up, and the
cord has very
little tension on the return stroke.

http://i.cubeupload.com/q5oXeb.jpg

Pull stroke seems reasonably normal but the string won't
rewind all the
way.

Leaves about a foot to a foot and a half loose.
What makes it go tight? Springs?

Pulled the cord, and the string doesn't go back.
I can coax it back most of the way, but then when I pull
again, it doesn't
go back.

Any debugging hints?
The spring is likely broken.. Either that or the clutch is
gummed up.

When pulling the cord to start, do NOT pull the cord out
to the very end of its travel.

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 12:13:20 -0400, "Phil Kangas"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 01:54:33 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

Pulled the Honda/Craftsman cord to start 'er up, and the
cord has very
little tension on the return stroke.

http://i.cubeupload.com/q5oXeb.jpg

Pull stroke seems reasonably normal but the string won't
rewind all the
way.

Leaves about a foot to a foot and a half loose.
What makes it go tight? Springs?

Pulled the cord, and the string doesn't go back.
I can coax it back most of the way, but then when I pull
again, it doesn't
go back.

Any debugging hints?
The spring is likely broken.. Either that or the clutch is
gummed up.

When pulling the cord to start, do NOT pull the cord out
to the very end of its travel.
Which is why I said DO NOT shorten the rope!!

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 17:55:44 -0400, wrote:

When pulling the cord to start, do NOT pull the cord out
to the very end of its travel.
Which is why I said DO NOT shorten the rope!!

I took the top off:
http://i.cubeupload.com/bIuR7B.jpg

And then the coiled-spring assembly:
http://i.cubeupload.com/EUxywq.jpg

Nothing seems wrong other than there is too much friction.
I suspect the spring rusted being left outside all winter.
I suspect the rust is causing the friction.
Mea culpa.

On Sun, 12 Mar 2017 23:51:35 -0400, wrote:

RUST?. Try this before condeming the pring. Remove the spark plug and
rotate the engine backwards. Does the rope wind in? If so the clutch
id stiff. In either case the starter housing needs to come off. If
just stiff youcan lubricate it. DO NOT shorten the rope!!!

I just saw this, and I agree with you.
http://i.cubeupload.com/EUxywq.jpg

I can see rust on the end of the spring.

I'll put some oil in there and work it back and forth to see if that helps.

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 12:10:29 -0400, wrote:

TroyBuilt is now ( or has been) using Honda motors in place of
Tecumseh on some models -Troy Bilt is made now by MTD

Thanks for that motor-manufacturer information as I bought it, as I recall,
because I love Honda motors (I'm not too good with maintenance so I need a
better-built motor).

BTW, what do you think this hose-bib-like plastic socket is on the right of
the picture on the red deck of the lawn mower. What is that two-inch tall
plastic thing on the deck actually for?
http://i.cubeupload.com/cPHCDO.jpg

Likewise, what does the red plastic insert in the gas cap hole do?
http://i.cubeupload.com/S8NA9d.jpg

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 22:55:01 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 17:55:44 -0400, wrote:

When pulling the cord to start, do NOT pull the cord out
to the very end of its travel.
Which is why I said DO NOT shorten the rope!!

I took the top off:
http://i.cubeupload.com/bIuR7B.jpg

And then the coiled-spring assembly:
http://i.cubeupload.com/EUxywq.jpg

Nothing seems wrong other than there is too much friction.
I suspect the spring rusted being left outside all winter.
I suspect the rust is causing the friction.
Mea culpa.
Sprat the "clutch", the pivot/axle and the spring with something like
PB Blaster and work it in Then something like fluid film - or mabee
LPS2 - a light grease to keep it dry and free.

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 23:02:58 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 12:10:29 -0400, wrote:

TroyBuilt is now ( or has been) using Honda motors in place of
Tecumseh on some models -Troy Bilt is made now by MTD

Thanks for that motor-manufacturer information as I bought it, as I recall,
because I love Honda motors (I'm not too good with maintenance so I need a
better-built motor).

BTW, what do you think this hose-bib-like plastic socket is on the right of
the picture on the red deck of the lawn mower. What is that two-inch tall
plastic thing on the deck actually for?
http://i.cubeupload.com/cPHCDO.jpg

I can't open the pictures but I suppose you are likely looking at the
washout port on the deck.

Likewise, what does the red plastic insert in the gas cap hole do?
http://i.cubeupload.com/S8NA9d.jpg
Again, can't open the picture but suspect you are seeing the baffle
that stops guel from sloshing at the filler and also makes it easier
to see how full the gas is. - also possibly a filter. (on my Bolton
Ghi-Honda clone it's a filter.

Later TroyBilts are now using Power-Mor engines - designed by MTD and
built in China - apparently not BAD engines, but not Hondas.

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 22:41:16 -0400, wrote:

Sprat the "clutch", the pivot/axle and the spring with something like
PB Blaster and work it in Then something like fluid film - or mabee
LPS2 - a light grease to keep it dry and free.

I got this post too late, as I already glooped plenty of motor oil in the
spring assembly, and pulled it a few dozen times. I works pretty well now,
almost like when new, but not quite. So you were right about the rust!
http://i.cubeupload.com/gtScGb.jpg

I don't do much maintenance on the thing, for example, I've never replaced
the blade, nor sharpened it, but it still seems to work nonetheless:
http://i.cubeupload.com/WTRUVl.jpg

I dumped out the gasoline and wanted to change the oil, but I couldn't for
the life of me see the oil change bolt unless it's buried here somewhe
http://i.cubeupload.com/Qp7d3S.jpg

Since I was already dumping out the gas, I just flipped the thing over and
drained the oil the really old fashioned way, using upside-down gravity:
http://i.cubeupload.com/UYYmnv.jpg

I still don't know what this thing does:
http://i.cubeupload.com/Ob4CCl.jpg

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 22:41:16 -0400, wrote:

I took the top off:
http://i.cubeupload.com/bIuR7B.jpg

And then the coiled-spring assembly:
http://i.cubeupload.com/EUxywq.jpg

Nothing seems wrong other than there is too much friction.
I suspect the spring rusted being left outside all winter.
I suspect the rust is causing the friction.
Mea culpa.

Sprat the "clutch", the pivot/axle and the spring with something like
PB Blaster and work it in Then something like fluid film - or mabee
LPS2 - a light grease to keep it dry and free.

Of monkey grease doesn't work; replace the cord and/or the coil
spring.

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 22:49:43 -0400, wrote:

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Subject: Never disassembled lawn mower - what makes the cord go slack?
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On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 23:02:58 -0000 (UTC), "Danny D."
wrote:

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 12:10:29 -0400, wrote:

TroyBuilt is now ( or has been) using Honda motors in place of
Tecumseh on some models -Troy Bilt is made now by MTD

Thanks for that motor-manufacturer information as I bought it, as I recall,
because I love Honda motors (I'm not too good with maintenance so I need a
better-built motor).

BTW, what do you think this hose-bib-like plastic socket is on the right of
the picture on the red deck of the lawn mower. What is that two-inch tall
plastic thing on the deck actually for?
http://i.cubeupload.com/cPHCDO.jpg

I can't open the pictures but I suppose you are likely looking at the
washout port on the deck.

Here's a closer shot of what you think may be a "washout port":
http://i.cubeupload.com/Ob4CCl.jpg

Seems like overkill for something that can be flipped over like this:
http://i.cubeupload.com/Qp7d3S.jpg

Likewise, what does the red plastic insert in the gas cap hole do?
http://i.cubeupload.com/S8NA9d.jpg
Again, can't open the picture but suspect you are seeing the baffle
that stops guel from sloshing at the filler and also makes it easier
to see how full the gas is. - also possibly a filter. (on my Bolton
Ghi-Honda clone it's a filter.

The red baffle is too big and only half round, so it's not a filter, but it
might be an anti-slosher.

I hate those gas can nozzles (as I'm sure you do too), so I just remove
them and pour into a funnel and make a mess no matter how I pour the gas.

Later TroyBilts are now using Power-Mor engines - designed by MTD and
built in China - apparently not BAD engines, but not Hondas.

I have a few Honda tool engines, and I think they're great!
I'm a believer in both Honda and Husqvarna.

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 19:56:05 -0700, Oren wrote:

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 22:41:16 -0400, wrote:

I took the top off:
http://i.cubeupload.com/bIuR7B.jpg

And then the coiled-spring assembly:
http://i.cubeupload.com/EUxywq.jpg

Nothing seems wrong other than there is too much friction.
I suspect the spring rusted being left outside all winter.
I suspect the rust is causing the friction.
Mea culpa.

Sprat the "clutch", the pivot/axle and the spring with something like
PB Blaster and work it in Then something like fluid film - or mabee
LPS2 - a light grease to keep it dry and free.

Of monkey grease doesn't work; replace the cord and/or the coil
spring.
Replacing the spring and cord without lubricating the pivot won't
make it any better - - -

On Mon, 13 Mar 2017 23:16:42 -0400, wrote:

Replacing the spring and cord without lubricating the pivot won't
make it any better - - -

In hind sight, leaving it outside in the rain all winter wasn't a good
idea.

What happened is, as you had surmised, I think, is that the spring rusted,
causing friction.

Adding copious amounts of motor oil made it work nicely, but maybe I put
too much oil as it's a dirty environment (time will tell); but it's working
beautifully now.
http://i.cubeupload.com/gtScGb.jpg

Thanks!

On Sunday, March 12, 2017 at 8:57:26 PM UTC-5, Danny D. wrote:
Pulled the Honda/Craftsman cord to start 'er up, and the cord has very
little tension on the return stroke.

http://i.cubeupload.com/q5oXeb.jpg

Pull stroke seems reasonably normal but the string won't rewind all the
way.

Leaves about a foot to a foot and a half loose.
What makes it go tight? Springs?

Pulled the cord, and the string doesn't go back.
I can coax it back most of the way, but then when I pull again, it doesn't
go back.

Any debugging hints?

Go to Harbor Freight and get a cheap tarp and cover the lawnmower with it. OR, a giant washtub upside down over the motor would help.

On Tue, 14 Mar 2017 20:39:44 -0700 (PDT), wrote:

On Sunday, March 12, 2017 at 8:57:26 PM UTC-5, Danny D. wrote:
Pulled the Honda/Craftsman cord to start 'er up, and the cord has very
little tension on the return stroke.

http://i.cubeupload.com/q5oXeb.jpg

Pull stroke seems reasonably normal but the string won't rewind all the
way.

Leaves about a foot to a foot and a half loose.
What makes it go tight? Springs?

Pulled the cord, and the string doesn't go back.
I can coax it back most of the way, but then when I pull again, it doesn't
go back.

Any debugging hints?

Go to Harbor Freight and get a cheap tarp and cover the lawnmower with it. OR, a giant washtub upside down over the motor would help.
Better yet, a small shed.

On Wed, 15 Mar 2017 16:13:31 -0400, wrote:

Any debugging hints?

Go to Harbor Freight and get a cheap tarp and cover the lawnmower with it. OR, a giant washtub upside down over the motor would help.

Better yet, a small shed.

For some folks. I ripped out all my lawn turf, got money from the
water district then filled the yard with rocks. I just let the last
300 sq. ft. die in the back for a future garden area. Now I have a
lawn mover for sell.

Neighbor took all his grass out, got the rebate and installed
artificial turf. It looks real.

_Xeriscaping_

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Xeriscaping

To hell with cuittin' grass :-)