Bob F wrote:

I buy Roundup in premixed 5-liter hand-pump sprayer:

I use the concentrate. It is hugely less expensive purchased that way.

I don't use enough roundup to make it a real concern. I don't have a
lot of area (on a sq. footage basis) to nuke of all plant life. Due to
political retardation, concentrated roundup is not available at the
retail level where I am.

The pump sprayer is easily refillable.

You can buy concentrated roundup that comes in a pump sprayer?

Bob F wrote:

Why do you have your line-length set to 50-odd characters instead
of, say, 72?

Maybe because then it can go through a few cycles of not being trimed
by people following up before it starts making everyones newsreaders
add blank lines.

I reformat ALL of the text that I quote so that it remains properly
formatted.

AND - for those dumb-ass full-quoters, you shouldn't be dragging the
same text through multiple chain-replies anyways. These are not email
conversations were having. This is usenet, where the entire thread is
ALWAYS AVAILABLE and there is NO NEED TO DRAG OLD TEXT INTO SEVERAL
GENERATIONS OF REPLIES.

"Jon Danniken" wrote in message
...
On 07/14/2014 02:15 AM, philo wrote:
No way would I ever toxify my yard, I found that after a good rain it's
pretty easy to pull out the weeds roots and all.

A number of years ago garlic mustard took over and after a good rain,
those things came out with little effort and now that I've cleared the
yard , no more than three or four return each year.

Yep. A number of years ago I used some of the Weed-B-Gon on my yard to
get rid of a dandelion infestation. While it worked well, I noticed
that the local squirrels were acting a bit strange for a few weeks
afterwards. In the following years, I noticed a similar behavior
pattern near other neighbors who used the products.

the squirrels were acting squirrelly? How so?

Jon Danniken writes:

On 07/14/2014 02:15 AM, philo wrote:
No way would I ever toxify my yard, I found that after a good rain it's
pretty easy to pull out the weeds roots and all.

A number of years ago garlic mustard took over and after a good rain,
those things came out with little effort and now that I've cleared the
yard , no more than three or four return each year.

Yep. A number of years ago I used some of the Weed-B-Gon on my yard to
get rid of a dandelion infestation. While it worked well, I noticed
that the local squirrels were acting a bit strange for a few weeks
afterwards. In the following years, I noticed a similar behavior
pattern near other neighbors who used the products.

Squirrels acting strange?

Is there a punch line or was that it?

--
Dan Espen

On Monday, July 14, 2014 11:47:50 AM UTC-4, H o m e G u y wrote:
Full-quoting google-giggler piece of **** trader_4 wrote:



I buy Roundup in premixed 5-liter hand-pump sprayer:



That alone is proof enough that you're truly the village idiot.



For one thing you piece of ****, I buy it when it's sale ($20).



Wow, $20 for 5 litres of ready-to-use Roundup. What a great deal!
And you claim it's Americans that are dumb?



Second, the retail availability of various lawn-care products have been

drastically reduced (and in most cases, banned) here in Ontario, which

includes the concentrated version of Roundup.

Wow, how can that be? I thought Canada was perfect in every way.
I guess you must be too dumb to figure out how to order some online too.




The 5-liter (1.3 gallon)

ready-to-use spray is the largest I can buy. Since I don't have acres

and acres of real estate to nuke of all plant life, I don't have much of

a need for the concentrate anyways.



Got that - you dumb ****?

Yes, you're still the village idiot. Pre-spraying weeds with detergent?
What an idiot.

On 7/14/2014 8:04 AM, trader_4 wrote:
On Monday, July 14, 2014 7:58:12 AM UTC-4, Frank wrote:
On 7/13/2014 10:52 PM, HomeGuy wrote:

I mix concentrated Ortho Weed B Gon (Plus Grabgrass Control) with water

according to the label and use a 1-gallon handpump sprayer.



I suppose that it works, but I don't exactly see the spray "wetting" the

leaves and stems of the stuff I'm spraying. Looks more like most of it

beads up on the leaves and runs off.



I'm thinking that this stuff would be more effective if it "stuck" to

the leaves, and I think that's only going to happen if the surface

tension is reduced, possibly by pre-spraying the weeds with soapy water,

or alternatively maybe adding soap in with the weed killer and water.



Does anyone have a clue regarding if the effectiveness of water-soluble

weed killer is increased if a surface-tension reducing agent is used?



And just for clarity, Ortho Weed B Gon contains:



2,4-D (Dimethylamine salt)

Quinclorac

Dicamba (dimethlamine salt)





I would assume the mix is formulated for maximum effectiveness and works

best when directions are followed.



I had a neighbor that had one of these jobs at DuPont and that is all he

did.

I have a lot of good info on this, but heh, why should I (or anyone else)
help out the jerk who constantly starts one off topic America bashing
thread after another? The more weeds he has in his lawn the better.


Missed him on his latest nym shift. Gotta admit he is on topic this
time. Canada might get gripped into a weed crisis. We should pass our
Mexican weed pickers on to them.

On Sunday, July 13, 2014 7:52:16 PM UTC-7, H o m e G u y wrote:
I mix concentrated Ortho Weed B Gon (Plus Grabgrass Control) with water

according to the label and use a 1-gallon handpump sprayer.



I suppose that it works, but I don't exactly see the spray "wetting" the

leaves and stems of the stuff I'm spraying. Looks more like most of it

beads up on the leaves and runs off.



I'm thinking that this stuff would be more effective if it "stuck" to

the leaves, and I think that's only going to happen if the surface

tension is reduced, possibly by pre-spraying the weeds with soapy water,

or alternatively maybe adding soap in with the weed killer and water.



Does anyone have a clue regarding if the effectiveness of water-soluble

weed killer is increased if a surface-tension reducing agent is used?



And just for clarity, Ortho Weed B Gon contains:



2,4-D (Dimethylamine salt)

Quinclorac

Dicamba (dimethlamine salt)

Try over in rec.gardens.

HB

On 7/14/2014 10:00 AM, Pico Rico wrote:
I wouldn't be sure.... depends how long the exposure.
Sodium causes heart problems, and vinegar can upset
the pH balance.


sodium doesn't go away either. It just stays
in your soil forever. Not for
me.

So, why is there not a foot of rock salt along
the side of the road?


--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
On 7/14/2014 10:00 AM, Pico Rico wrote:
I wouldn't be sure.... depends how long the exposure.
Sodium causes heart problems, and vinegar can upset
the pH balance.


sodium doesn't go away either. It just stays
in your soil forever. Not for
me.

So, why is there not a foot of rock salt along
the side of the road?

That probably runs down the gutter to the lake. But when the Romans were
putting an end to their enemies' foolishness, they salted their fields. If
they can't grow, they can't eat, and if they can't eat, they can't be a
nuisance to the Romans.

HomeGuy" "Home wrote:
Bob F wrote:

I buy Roundup in premixed 5-liter hand-pump sprayer:

I use the concentrate. It is hugely less expensive purchased that
way.

I don't use enough roundup to make it a real concern. I don't have a
lot of area (on a sq. footage basis) to nuke of all plant life. Due
to political retardation, concentrated roundup is not available at the
retail level where I am.

The pump sprayer is easily refillable.

You can buy concentrated roundup that comes in a pump sprayer?

Come-on. You can't really be that dumb.

On 7/14/2014 11:50 AM, Jon Danniken wrote:
Yep. A number of years ago I used some of the Weed-B-Gon on my yard to
get rid of a dandelion infestation. While it worked well, I noticed
that the local squirrels were acting a bit strange for a few weeks
afterwards. In the following years, I noticed a similar behavior
pattern near other neighbors who used the products.


Jon


How does a squirrel act strange?

Did you spray your neighbor?

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On 7/14/2014 12:51 PM, Dan Espen wrote:
Jon Danniken writes:
Yep. A number of years ago I used some of the Weed-B-Gon on my yard to
get rid of a dandelion infestation. While it worked well, I noticed
that the local squirrels were acting a bit strange for a few weeks
afterwards. In the following years, I noticed a similar behavior
pattern near other neighbors who used the products.

Squirrels acting strange?

Is there a punch line or was that it?


Aw, nuts. You asked before me.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

HomeGuy" "Home wrote:
Terry Coombs used improper usenet message composition style by
unnecessarily full-quoting:

FWIW and for anyone who cares , QUIT KILLING THE BEES !
Just about every one of those compounds for killing weeds has an
effect on our pollinators.

I think you're confusing herbicides and insecticides.

Herbicides have no designed or documented effects

* directly *

on insects
as far as I know, apart from reducing potential pollen sources from
flowering weeds.

Then you'd best update your info , because glyphosate has been implicated
in CCD . You can bet your sweet ass I won't be using anything that hasn't
been PROVEN safe for bees , there's a pretty big investment sittin' out
there in the orchard .

--
Snag

trader_4 wrote:
On Monday, July 14, 2014 8:54:13 AM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:
trader_4 wrote:

On Monday, July 14, 2014 7:58:12 AM UTC-4, Frank wrote:

On 7/13/2014 10:52 PM, HomeGuy wrote:



I mix concentrated Ortho Weed B Gon (Plus Grabgrass Control) with

water



according to the label and use a 1-gallon handpump sprayer.







I suppose that it works, but I don't exactly see the spray

"wetting" the



leaves and stems of the stuff I'm spraying. Looks more like most

of it



beads up on the leaves and runs off.







I'm thinking that this stuff would be more effective if it "stuck"

to



the leaves, and I think that's only going to happen if the surface



tension is reduced, possibly by pre-spraying the weeds with soapy

water,



or alternatively maybe adding soap in with the weed killer and

water.







Does anyone have a clue regarding if the effectiveness of

water-soluble



weed killer is increased if a surface-tension reducing agent is

used?







And just for clarity, Ortho Weed B Gon contains:







2,4-D (Dimethylamine salt)



Quinclorac



Dicamba (dimethlamine salt)











I would assume the mix is formulated for maximum effectiveness and

works



best when directions are followed.







I had a neighbor that had one of these jobs at DuPont and that is

all he



did.



I have a lot of good info on this, but heh, why should I (or anyone

else) help out the jerk who constantly starts one off topic America

bashing thread after another? The more weeds he has in his lawn the

better.



FWIW and for anyone who cares , QUIT KILLING THE BEES ! Just about
every one

of those compounds for killing weeds has an effect on our
pollinators . Add

in the effects of neonic and other pesticides and you can end up
with colony

collapse disorder , where the bees just wander off apparently and
die .


Nice theory, except that so far, scientists investigating colony
collapse disorder haven't reached any conclusion as to the cause. If
they don't know, neither do you.




It wouldn't take a bomb to bring this country down , just one crop
sprayer

full of pesticides at the right time and right place could kill up
to 3/4 of

the bees in this country , and without them we'd starve ...

--

Snag

One crop sprayer? Really? Just how dumb do you think we are?
Good grief.

Did you know that 3/4 of the hives in the USA are in California while the
almond trees are blooming ? Didn't think so . There are beekeepers that
truck their hives all over the country hiring them out as pollinators .
Between varroa mites , tracheal mites , small hive beetles , American foul
brood and other problems it's been estimated we now have less than a third
of the beehives feral and domesticated we had 15 years ago .
And as far as CCD , the information I have is that it is PROBABLY a
combination of factors , including glyphosate exposure along with
neonicotinoid insecticides in sub lethal dosages and stress from cold
weather . Nothing is definite , true , but they learn more every day . Now
that we have invested in beekeeping , I'm VERY interested in anything that
can harm Our Ladies of the Hive .
--
Snag

Our go-to guy here was the Arkansas state bee inspector , has been in the
business for over 40 years , and has taught beekeeping classes all over the
world . I think I believe him ...

On 7/14/2014 8:17 PM, Terry Coombs wrote:
that we have invested in beekeeping , I'm VERY interested in anything that
can harm Our Ladies of the Hive .

226 lines.... anyone know how to trim?


--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Mon, 14 Jul 2014 10:20:55 -0700 (PDT), Higgs Boson
wrote:

On Sunday, July 13, 2014 7:52:16 PM UTC-7, H o m e G u y wrote:
I mix concentrated Ortho Weed B Gon (Plus Grabgrass Control) with water

according to the label and use a 1-gallon handpump sprayer.



I suppose that it works, but I don't exactly see the spray "wetting" the

leaves and stems of the stuff I'm spraying. Looks more like most of it

beads up on the leaves and runs off.



I'm thinking that this stuff would be more effective if it "stuck" to

the leaves, and I think that's only going to happen if the surface

tension is reduced, possibly by pre-spraying the weeds with soapy water,

or alternatively maybe adding soap in with the weed killer and water.



Does anyone have a clue regarding if the effectiveness of water-soluble

weed killer is increased if a surface-tension reducing agent is used?



And just for clarity, Ortho Weed B Gon contains:



2,4-D (Dimethylamine salt)

Quinclorac

Dicamba (dimethlamine salt)

Try over in rec.gardens.

HB
Not up here it doesn't. It contains chelated iron and some other
rather benign stuff that ALMOST kills the weeds.

On Mon, 14 Jul 2014 19:17:30 -0500, "Terry Coombs"
wrote:



Did you know that 3/4 of the hives in the USA are in California while the
almond trees are blooming ? Didn't think so . There are beekeepers that
truck their hives all over the country hiring them out as pollinators .
Between varroa mites , tracheal mites , small hive beetles , American foul
brood and other problems it's been estimated we now have less than a third
of the beehives feral and domesticated we had 15 years ago .
And as far as CCD , the information I have is that it is PROBABLY a
combination of factors , including glyphosate exposure along with
neonicotinoid insecticides in sub lethal dosages and stress from cold
weather . Nothing is definite , true , but they learn more every day . Now
that we have invested in beekeeping , I'm VERY interested in anything that
can harm Our Ladies of the Hive .
The neonics APPEAR to be the most serious problem at this point,
combined with the weather extremes

I quit using weed killer after barefoot grass killed all my rubarb Then I thought about the birds and rabbits and havent used any in at least 20 years, I think dandelions are pretty flowers

To kill poision ivy mix poision ivy killer 50 / 50 with roundup, it kills fast but does break some federal laws........

"bob haller" wrote in message
...
I quit using weed killer after barefoot grass killed all my rubarb Then I
thought about the birds and rabbits and havent used any in at least 20
years, I think dandelions are pretty flowers

To kill poision ivy mix poision ivy killer 50 / 50 with roundup, it kills
fast but does break some federal laws........


and what federal laws would those be?

trader_4 wrote:
On Monday, July 14, 2014 7:58:12 AM UTC-4, Frank wrote:
On 7/13/2014 10:52 PM, HomeGuy wrote:


I have a lot of good info on this, but heh, why should I
(or anyone
else) help out the jerk who constantly starts one off
topic America
bashing thread after another? The more weeds he has in
his lawn the
better.

+1
**** him, funny how he thinks we're all idiots, but asks us
to solve his problems.
Hell I'll send him some Dallisgrass and see how stumped he
gets trying to kill it
chuckle

On Monday, July 14, 2014 8:01:45 PM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:
HomeGuy" "Home wrote:

Terry Coombs used improper usenet message composition style by

unnecessarily full-quoting:



FWIW and for anyone who cares , QUIT KILLING THE BEES !

Just about every one of those compounds for killing weeds has an

effect on our pollinators.



I think you're confusing herbicides and insecticides.



Herbicides have no designed or documented effects



* directly *



on insects

as far as I know, apart from reducing potential pollen sources from

flowering weeds.



Then you'd best update your info , because glyphosate has been implicated

in CCD . You can bet your sweet ass I won't be using anything that hasn't

been PROVEN safe for bees , there's a pretty big investment sittin' out

there in the orchard .



Sure, if by "implicated" you mean that someone has merely put it on a long, long
list of possible causes, including other chemicals, viruses, bacteria, etc.
If you mean there is actual data from a study that shows cause and effect,
that I'd like to see....

On Monday, July 14, 2014 8:17:30 PM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:
trader_4 wrote:

On Monday, July 14, 2014 8:54:13 AM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:

trader_4 wrote:



On Monday, July 14, 2014 7:58:12 AM UTC-4, Frank wrote:



On 7/13/2014 10:52 PM, HomeGuy wrote:







I mix concentrated Ortho Weed B Gon (Plus Grabgrass Control) with



water







according to the label and use a 1-gallon handpump sprayer.















I suppose that it works, but I don't exactly see the spray



"wetting" the







leaves and stems of the stuff I'm spraying. Looks more like most



of it







beads up on the leaves and runs off.















I'm thinking that this stuff would be more effective if it "stuck"



to







the leaves, and I think that's only going to happen if the surface







tension is reduced, possibly by pre-spraying the weeds with soapy



water,







or alternatively maybe adding soap in with the weed killer and



water.















Does anyone have a clue regarding if the effectiveness of



water-soluble







weed killer is increased if a surface-tension reducing agent is



used?















And just for clarity, Ortho Weed B Gon contains:















2,4-D (Dimethylamine salt)







Quinclorac







Dicamba (dimethlamine salt)























I would assume the mix is formulated for maximum effectiveness and



works







best when directions are followed.















I had a neighbor that had one of these jobs at DuPont and that is



all he







did.







I have a lot of good info on this, but heh, why should I (or anyone



else) help out the jerk who constantly starts one off topic America



bashing thread after another? The more weeds he has in his lawn the



better.







FWIW and for anyone who cares , QUIT KILLING THE BEES ! Just about

every one



of those compounds for killing weeds has an effect on our

pollinators . Add



in the effects of neonic and other pesticides and you can end up

with colony



collapse disorder , where the bees just wander off apparently and

die .





Nice theory, except that so far, scientists investigating colony

collapse disorder haven't reached any conclusion as to the cause. If

they don't know, neither do you.









It wouldn't take a bomb to bring this country down , just one crop

sprayer



full of pesticides at the right time and right place could kill up

to 3/4 of



the bees in this country , and without them we'd starve ...



--



Snag



One crop sprayer? Really? Just how dumb do you think we are?

Good grief.



Did you know that 3/4 of the hives in the USA are in California while the

almond trees are blooming ? Didn't think so .

I suspect that number is bogus, but I'd be happy to see the source.
And for you to explain how one terrorist crop duster is going to cover the
huge area of California that the bee hives are dispersed in. Plus there
are a hell of a lot of other bees in the USA, besides ones kept in hives.


There are beekeepers that

truck their hives all over the country hiring them out as pollinators .

Between varroa mites , tracheal mites , small hive beetles , American foul

brood and other problems it's been estimated we now have less than a third

of the beehives feral and domesticated we had 15 years ago .

And I thought glyphosate poisoning was "implicated" as the big problem.
I'd like to see a source for that too.....




And as far as CCD , the information I have is that it is PROBABLY a

combination of factors , including glyphosate exposure along with

neonicotinoid insecticides in sub lethal dosages and stress from cold

weather . Nothing is definite , true , but they learn more every day .

Now we're getting closer to the truth. I'd like to see a consensus where
those actually researching CCD say that glyphosate is on that short list.
You posting it is the first that I've heard of it and it sounds suspiciously
like stuff the hippie GMO crowd comes up with, as opposed to something that
actual bee researchers have said. Link please.

On 7/14/2014 11:59 PM, Pico Rico wrote:
"bob haller" wrote in message
...
I quit using weed killer after barefoot grass killed all my rubarb Then I
thought about the birds and rabbits and havent used any in at least 20
years, I think dandelions are pretty flowers

To kill poision ivy mix poision ivy killer 50 / 50 with roundup, it kills
fast but does break some federal laws........


and what federal laws would those be?

Those referred to on the pesticide label that say, "It is a violation
of federal law to use this product in a manner inconsistent with its
labeling". Since the label doesn't instruct the user to mix it with
another product, it's not being used in the prescribed manner.

This seems like nitpicking to some, but it is (sometimes) deadly
serious. People playing science experiment can mix up some hazardous
combinations. They can also end up killing more than the intended
targets. My favorite from working in the lawn and garden trade was the
idiot owner of the business, who used to just reach behind him to
whatever shelf he was leaning on, grab any bottle, and tell the
customer that it was the solution for whatever problem the customer
had. We'd get the angry phone calls later, after the customer had
applied the weedkiller to their apple tree, or sprayed their vegetable
garden with the systemic insecticide, rendering all the produce
inedible. That's when we'd quote that label directive to them. If they
had only read the label before applying it, they'd have discovered
that the owner was full of ****, and only cared about making a quick
buck. And never, never, take another person's word for what you can
use the product for. If it's not listed on the label, it hasn't been
tested for that purpose, meaning you are gambling - and like those
customers who trusted my boss, you might lose big.

"Moe DeLoughan" wrote in message
...
On 7/14/2014 11:59 PM, Pico Rico wrote:
"bob haller" wrote in message
...
I quit using weed killer after barefoot grass killed all my rubarb
Then I
thought about the birds and rabbits and havent used any in at least 20
years, I think dandelions are pretty flowers

To kill poision ivy mix poision ivy killer 50 / 50 with roundup, it
kills
fast but does break some federal laws........


and what federal laws would those be?

Those referred to on the pesticide label that say, "It is a violation of
federal law to use this product in a manner inconsistent with its
labeling". Since the label doesn't instruct the user to mix it with
another product, it's not being used in the prescribed manner.


BAH!

On Mon, 14 Jul 2014 21:59:33 -0700, "Pico Rico"
wrote:


"bob haller" wrote in message
...
I quit using weed killer after barefoot grass killed all my rubarb Then I
thought about the birds and rabbits and havent used any in at least 20
years, I think dandelions are pretty flowers

To kill poision ivy mix poision ivy killer 50 / 50 with roundup, it kills
fast but does break some federal laws........


and what federal laws would those be?

Mis-use of listed chemicals -

wrote in message
...
On Mon, 14 Jul 2014 21:59:33 -0700, "Pico Rico"
wrote:


"bob haller" wrote in message
...
I quit using weed killer after barefoot grass killed all my rubarb Then
I
thought about the birds and rabbits and havent used any in at least 20
years, I think dandelions are pretty flowers

To kill poision ivy mix poision ivy killer 50 / 50 with roundup, it
kills
fast but does break some federal laws........


and what federal laws would those be?

Mis-use of listed chemicals -

I don't see the mis-use.

trader_4 wrote:

Now we're getting closer to the truth. I'd like to see a consensus
where those actually researching CCD say that glyphosate is on that
short list. You posting it is the first that I've heard of it and it
sounds suspiciously like stuff the hippie GMO crowd comes up with, as
opposed to something that actual bee researchers have said. Link
please.

Here's one .

http://www.gmoevidence.com/dr-huber-...-disorder-ccd/

--
Snag

On Tuesday, July 15, 2014 11:15:30 AM UTC-7, Terry Coombs wrote:
trader_4 wrote:



Now we're getting closer to the truth. I'd like to see a consensus

where those actually researching CCD say that glyphosate is on that

short list. You posting it is the first that I've heard of it and it

sounds suspiciously like stuff the hippie GMO crowd comes up with, as

opposed to something that actual bee researchers have said. Link

please.



Here's one .



http://www.gmoevidence.com/dr-huber-...-disorder-ccd/



--

Snag

A cite that starts with "GMO"? Really?

Harry K

On 7/15/2014 10:03 AM, Moe DeLoughan wrote:
Those referred to on the pesticide label that say, "It is a violation of
federal law to use this product in a manner inconsistent with its
labeling". Since the label doesn't instruct the user to mix it with
another product, it's not being used in the prescribed manner.

This seems like nitpicking to some, but it is (sometimes) deadly
serious. People playing science experiment can mix up some hazardous
combinations. They can also end up killing more than the intended
targets. My favorite from working in the lawn and garden trade was the
idiot owner of the business, who used to just reach behind him to
whatever shelf he was leaning on, grab any bottle, and tell the customer
that it was the solution for whatever problem the customer had. We'd get
the angry phone calls later, after the customer had applied the
weedkiller to their apple tree, or sprayed their vegetable garden with
the systemic insecticide, rendering all the produce inedible. That's
when we'd quote that label directive to them. If they had only read the
label before applying it, they'd have discovered that the owner was full
of ****, and only cared about making a quick buck. And never, never,
take another person's word for what you can use the product for. If it's
not listed on the label, it hasn't been tested for that purpose, meaning
you are gambling - and like those customers who trusted my boss, you
might lose big.


OT for weeds, but not OT for killer. Some infants and
toddlers have died when the well meaning doctor told
them to give a certain dose of Baby Tylenol, and got
it wrong. Pesticides, or pain pills. Read the directions
provided.

--
..
Christopher A. Young
Learn about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

On Tue, 15 Jul 2014 10:17:22 -0700, "Pico Rico"
wrote:


wrote in message
.. .
On Mon, 14 Jul 2014 21:59:33 -0700, "Pico Rico"
wrote:


"bob haller" wrote in message
...
I quit using weed killer after barefoot grass killed all my rubarb Then
I
thought about the birds and rabbits and havent used any in at least 20
years, I think dandelions are pretty flowers

To kill poision ivy mix poision ivy killer 50 / 50 with roundup, it
kills
fast but does break some federal laws........


and what federal laws would those be?

Mis-use of listed chemicals -

I don't see the mis-use.

Not used as per manufacturer's instructions = miss-use in the eyes of
"the law"

Harry K wrote:
On Tuesday, July 15, 2014 11:15:30 AM UTC-7, Terry Coombs wrote:
trader_4 wrote:



Now we're getting closer to the truth. I'd like to see a consensus

where those actually researching CCD say that glyphosate is on that

short list. You posting it is the first that I've heard of it and it

sounds suspiciously like stuff the hippie GMO crowd comes up with,
as

opposed to something that actual bee researchers have said. Link

please.



Here's one .



http://www.gmoevidence.com/dr-huber-...-disorder-ccd/



--

Snag

A cite that starts with "GMO"? Really?

Harry K

Did you check out the link , or are you just bustin' my ass without even
looking ? What the guy is sayin' makes sense ... and do you really think the
GMO crowd is going to tell us the truth if it impacts their profits ?
Monsanto wants to *OWN* the food supplies in this country , and hellyeah
they'll lie to protect profits . Check the guy out , check the science out .
Or is your google-fu busted ?
--
Snag
I'll bet you think
Obammy is the best
thing that ever happened
to this country too .

wrote in message
...
On Tue, 15 Jul 2014 10:17:22 -0700, "Pico Rico"
wrote:


wrote in message
. ..
On Mon, 14 Jul 2014 21:59:33 -0700, "Pico Rico"
wrote:


"bob haller" wrote in message
...
I quit using weed killer after barefoot grass killed all my rubarb
Then
I
thought about the birds and rabbits and havent used any in at least 20
years, I think dandelions are pretty flowers

To kill poision ivy mix poision ivy killer 50 / 50 with roundup, it
kills
fast but does break some federal laws........


and what federal laws would those be?

Mis-use of listed chemicals -

I don't see the mis-use.

Not used as per manufacturer's instructions = miss-use in the eyes of
"the law"

you are just making that up.

"Terry Coombs" writes:
Harry K wrote:
On Tuesday, July 15, 2014 11:15:30 AM UTC-7, Terry Coombs wrote:
trader_4 wrote:



Now we're getting closer to the truth. I'd like to see a consensus

where those actually researching CCD say that glyphosate is on that

short list. You posting it is the first that I've heard of it and it

sounds suspiciously like stuff the hippie GMO crowd comes up with,
as

opposed to something that actual bee researchers have said. Link

please.



Here's one .



http://www.gmoevidence.com/dr-huber-...-disorder-ccd/



--

Snag

A cite that starts with "GMO"? Really?

Harry K

Did you check out the link , or are you just bustin' my ass without even

From the About link:

"The GMO Evidence project is run by a group of citizens who have no direct connection with
the organisations or scientists"

Scott Lurndal wrote:
"Terry Coombs" writes:
Harry K wrote:
On Tuesday, July 15, 2014 11:15:30 AM UTC-7, Terry Coombs wrote:
trader_4 wrote:



Now we're getting closer to the truth. I'd like to see a
consensus

where those actually researching CCD say that glyphosate is on
that

short list. You posting it is the first that I've heard of it and
it

sounds suspiciously like stuff the hippie GMO crowd comes up with,
as

opposed to something that actual bee researchers have said. Link

please.



Here's one .



http://www.gmoevidence.com/dr-huber-...-disorder-ccd/



--

Snag

A cite that starts with "GMO"? Really?

Harry K

Did you check out the link , or are you just bustin' my ass without
even

From the About link:

"The GMO Evidence project is run by a group of citizens who have no
direct connection with the organisations or scientists"

Does that negate the validity of the findings of those scientists ? I'm not
sure if you're supporting me or ... there are a lot of questions in a lot of
people's minds about just how benign that stuff is . And again I say "Is
Monsanto going to be forthcoming about it if it impacts their bottom line?"
..
And the answer is "Of course not." .
--
Snag

On 7/15/2014 1:17 PM, Pico Rico wrote:


To kill poision ivy mix poision ivy killer 50 / 50 with roundup, it
kills
fast but does break some federal laws........


and what federal laws would those be?

Mis-use of listed chemicals -

I don't see the mis-use.



The Feds don't care what you see, only what they see.

Homeguy:

No, Ortho has some pretty good chemists working for them, and I expect the reason why the Weed B Gon is beading up on the leaves is that you're spraying way too much on.

You shouldn't prespray with a surfactant because the more water the leaf absorbs from the soapy water, the less chemical it will absorb from the herbicide you've sprayed.

When I was a kid I used to get rashes on my hands whenever I went to a public swimming pools because of the additional chlorine added to the water in the pool. It occured to me that the problem was that my skin was absorbing chlorine from the water, and that's what was causing the rash. To solve the problem, my mother used to have me dip my hands in a pan of distilled water for about 10 minutes before I went into the pool, and that solved the problem. My skin would absorb the distilled water, and then when it was exposed to the chlorinated water, it wouldn't absorb nearly as much chlorine.

I expect it'd be exactly the same thing if you sprayed with soapy water first, or sprayed your weeds with herbicide shortly after a rain storm. The plants will absorb moisture from whatever source they can get it first, and then absorb considerably less from any other source once the plant's stem and leaf cells are saturated with water.

On Tuesday, July 15, 2014 6:08:07 PM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:


"The GMO Evidence project is run by a group of citizens who have no

direct connection with the organisations or scientists"



Does that negate the validity of the findings of those scientists ?

You asked us if we read the link you provided, but apparently you
didn't read it yourself. If so, you'd know that the reference you gave
is not to "scientists" but to just one scientist. And if you read what he
actually wrote, there is absolutely nothing there that even comes close
to implicating glyphosate in CCD. All he does is suggest that it's a
possible cause based on speculation. He has absolutely nothing showing
cause and effect. And he's note that he's a plant scientist, not an entomologist working with bees.

And yeah, when the one link you find to try to pin CCD on glyphosate comes
from an anti-GM website that has nothing to do with CCD, it raises
suspicions.





I'm not

sure if you're supporting me or ... there are a lot of questions in a lot of

people's minds about just how benign that stuff is . And again I say "Is

Monsanto going to be forthcoming about it if it impacts their bottom line?"

.

And the answer is "Of course not." .

--

Snag

There are a lot of questions in a lot of people's minds about a lot of
things. None of which have anything to do with implicating glyphosate in
CCD. If you asked anyone associated with that website anything about
glyphosate, they'd probably blame it for everything from bad breath to
alzheimers.

trader_4 wrote:

There are a lot of questions in a lot of people's minds about a lot of
things. None of which have anything to do with implicating
glyphosate in
CCD. If you asked anyone associated with that website anything about
glyphosate, they'd probably blame it for everything from bad breath to
alzheimers.


How about we just agree to disagree on this subject ? It's apparent we
both have strong opinions , and neither is going to be argued out of what we
think . I have seen several articles about glyphosate , and it's not as
benign as they would have you think . And it's everywhere ...
--
Snag

On Wednesday, July 16, 2014 11:37:47 AM UTC-4, Terry Coombs wrote:
trader_4 wrote:



There are a lot of questions in a lot of people's minds about a lot of

things. None of which have anything to do with implicating

glyphosate in

CCD. If you asked anyone associated with that website anything about

glyphosate, they'd probably blame it for everything from bad breath to

alzheimers.





How about we just agree to disagree on this subject ? It's apparent we

both have strong opinions , and neither is going to be argued out of what we

think . I have seen several articles about glyphosate , and it's not as

benign as they would have you think . And it's everywhere ...

--

Snag

The strong opinion I have here is that if you're going to make some
claim, it should be based on fact. And that if you start jumping to
conclusions based on conjecture and what's in people's minds, as opposed
to scientific proof, it can lead to bad things. I see nothing that
"implicates" glyphosate in CCD. All you have is one paper by one plant
scientist, not a bee researcher working on CCD, that raises it as a possibility. And I'd also note that in
the paper he says "This proposal is initiated to determine if glyphosate
is a contributing factor in CCD by analyzing exposure of bees to this
chemical....." That isn't implicating anything. All he's done is raise glyphosate as one more possibility worthy of investigation and suggest that
it actually be investigated. I would hope you can see the difference
between someone theorizing that glyphosate *might* play a role and your
claim that it has been "implicated".

"J Burns" wrote in message ...
On 7/14/14, 8:21 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
On 7/14/2014 8:07 AM, wrote:
For killing oily weeds like poison ivey, some people fing adding a
few spoonfulls of diesel fuel does the trick - it acts as a
surfactant, wetting the leaves more effectively


I can imagine diesel and ivy oil mixing, but
that doesn't make it a surfactant.

In many cases, I've found clipping effective. The leaves won't hurt
you. It's the sap. Hedge shears give a nice reach and can be rinsed
afterward.

Brushing against leaves is all it takes around here.