The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.

I'd be willing to buy a power tool to do this, if it doesn't
cost more than $50 or so, and would do the job in 1/2-hour
or less. Does such a beast exist?

--
Thanks,
croy

On 12/14/12 7:01 PM, croy wrote:
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.

I'd be willing to buy a power tool to do this, if it doesn't
cost more than $50 or so, and would do the job in 1/2-hour
or less. Does such a beast exist?


These http://tinyurl.com/c4rzguo (link to Amazon)
I have no idea how well they work. I guess a rotary hammer is the
tool to use with these. Maybe a rental place would have something.
We use sledge hammers with pipes welded into the heads in place of
the wooden handles. The toughest one I did took maybe an hour. Or
twenty years in dog years.

I have had the same problem for years
until I saw someone drilling a hole
to place dynamite to bring down a rock cliff on TV.
My only problem is that after doing extensive research on Google
to find the 6’ drill bit that I saw
I was unable to find who makes or sells them.
I would greatly appreciate anyone that can help me with this.

"croy" wrote in message
...
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.


Ground rods will not keep a GFCI from tripping needlessy. Either it is
defective or there is a good reason for it to trip.

They do make tools like an electric jack hammer that will do the job. It
will cost much more than the $ 50. For a one time deal you may be able to
get some electrician to install the rod for you for that price. It may also
be possiable to rent one at a tool rental center.

In article ,
wrote:

I have had the same problem for years
until I saw someone drilling a hole
to place dynamite to bring down a rock cliff on TV.
My only problem is that after doing extensive research on Google
to find the 6¹ drill bit that I saw
I was unable to find who makes or sells them.
I would greatly appreciate anyone that can help me with this.

Google sez go he

http://drillbitwarehouse.com/home?pa...category_id=63

On 12/14/2012 7:01 PM, croy wrote:
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.

I'd be willing to buy a power tool to do this, if it doesn't
cost more than $50 or so, and would do the job in 1/2-hour
or less. Does such a beast exist?


You can rent a big hammer drill with a ground rod driver attachment or a
small electric jackhammer which will do a good job driving a ground rod. ^_^

TDD

croy wrote:
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.

I'd be willing to buy a power tool to do this, if it doesn't
cost more than $50 or so, and would do the job in 1/2-hour
or less. Does such a beast exist?


Whether you need another ?

Been over this before. If you don't hit any rock, all you need is some
water. The rod will go down with simple up down movement. Keep adding
water. I don't know if this works in sand or unusual soil types. Some use a
water hose.

Greg

On Dec 14, 7:01*pm, croy wrote:
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. *The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.

I'd be willing to buy a power tool to do this, if it doesn't
cost more than $50 or so, and would do the job in 1/2-hour
or less. *Does such a beast exist?

--
Thanks,
croy

A large 1" or larger electric drill and an auger should be rentable
from your local tool rental house. After you drill the hole, as you
put the rod down, add a lot of salt to the dirt you back-fill with to
increase the ground conductivity. Also use a hose to help moisten and
pack the dirt so that you have good conductivity between the rod and
ground.

gregz wrote:
croy wrote:
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.

I'd be willing to buy a power tool to do this, if it doesn't
cost more than $50 or so, and would do the job in 1/2-hour
or less. Does such a beast exist?


Whether you need another ?

Been over this before. If you don't hit any rock, all you need is some
water. The rod will go down with simple up down movement. Keep adding
water. I don't know if this works in sand or unusual soil types. Some use a
water hose.

Greg

Need a video ?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F0dyf-fibzg

Greg

Thank you Smitty Two
but I need a masonry bit
that’s at least six feet long
and those aren’t it.

On Dec 14, 10:03*pm, "hr(bob) "
wrote:
On Dec 14, 7:01*pm, croy wrote:





The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. *The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.

I'd be willing to buy a power tool to do this, if it doesn't
cost more than $50 or so, and would do the job in 1/2-hour
or less. *Does such a beast exist?

--
Thanks,
croy

A large 1" or larger electric drill and an auger should be rentable
from your local tool rental house. *After you drill the hole, as you
put the rod down, add a lot of salt to the dirt you back-fill with to
increase the ground conductivity. *Also use a hose to help moisten and
pack the dirt so that you have good conductivity between the rod and
ground.

these days ground rods arent copper they are copper clad steel. rock
salt can make your new rod disappear........

On 12/14/12 8:54 PM, gregz wrote:
croy wrote:
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.

I'd be willing to buy a power tool to do this, if it doesn't
cost more than $50 or so, and would do the job in 1/2-hour
or less. Does such a beast exist?


Whether you need another ?

Been over this before. If you don't hit any rock, all you need is some
water. The rod will go down with simple up down movement. Keep adding
water. I don't know if this works in sand or unusual soil types. Some use a
water hose.

Greg


Have there been any studies done comparing the effectiveness of a
ground rod installed with water vs. hammering one in?

On Dec 14, 10:59*pm, Dean Hoffman wrote:
On 12/14/12 8:54 PM, gregz wrote:





croy wrote:
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. *The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.

I'd be willing to buy a power tool to do this, if it doesn't
cost more than $50 or so, and would do the job in 1/2-hour
or less. *Does such a beast exist?

Whether you need another ?

Been over this before. If you don't hit any rock, all you need is some
water. The rod will go down with simple up down movement. Keep adding
water. I don't know if this works in sand or unusual soil types. Some use a
water hose.

Greg

* * Have there been any studies done comparing the effectiveness of a
ground rod installed with water vs. *hammering one in?

i would assume a hammered one has beter contact with the soil, and is
a better ground

On 2012-12-15, The Daring Dufas wrote:

You can rent a big hammer drill with a ground rod driver attachment or a
small electric jackhammer which will do a good job driving a ground rod. ^_^

I once drilled though 2' of concrete with a homemade drillbit and a
1/2" drill. The drill bit was 1/2" pipe with carbide bits brazed to
the pipe's OD and a 1/2" rod to the other end. Slow, but worked. Use
a piece of rebar for the shaft/bit and put a carbide chip on the end.
I'd try water, first.

nb

One time I was asked to drive some rebar, to
reinforce some steps outdoors leading to a beach.
I ground the endsof the rebar to a point, on a
bench grinder. Seemed to help.

Does your ground rod have a point on the down
end?

Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"croy" wrote in message
...
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.

I'd be willing to buy a power tool to do this, if it doesn't
cost more than $50 or so, and would do the job in 1/2-hour
or less. Does such a beast exist?

--
Thanks,
croy

On Fri, 14 Dec 2012 20:37:46 -0500, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


"croy" wrote in message
.. .
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.


Ground rods will not keep a GFCI from tripping needlessy. Either it is
defective or there is a good reason for it to trip.

Well, something is sure causing them to trip. There's
nothing plugged into the circuit, and still they trip. New
ones do the same. Some one in this group said that if the
connection to earth is too far from the panel, that can
happen.

If that's not the cause, then the only thing I can think of
is induction along the run near other wires.

--
croy

"croy" wrote in message
...

Ground rods will not keep a GFCI from tripping needlessy. Either it is
defective or there is a good reason for it to trip.

Well, something is sure causing them to trip. There's
nothing plugged into the circuit, and still they trip. New
ones do the same. Some one in this group said that if the
connection to earth is too far from the panel, that can
happen.

If that's not the cause, then the only thing I can think of
is induction along the run near other wires.

--

Who ever said that if the ground was too far from the GFCI would cause them
to trip is wrong. The gound wire has nothing to do with the tripping. The
GFCI monitors the current in the hot and neutral wires. If there is an
unbalance , they will trip. The usual way is when the hot wire finds some
other path back to the neutral on the other side of the GFCI or ground path.

If they trip with nothing plugged in, it is time to look at the wiring. It
is also possiable for moisture to get into the outlets.

One other thing is that it could be wired wrong. Some one could have picked
off the neutral or hot wire to run somewhere without the other wrie.

On 12/16/2012 7:31 PM, croy wrote:
On Fri, 14 Dec 2012 20:37:46 -0500, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


"croy" wrote in message
...
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.


Ground rods will not keep a GFCI from tripping needlessy. Either it is
defective or there is a good reason for it to trip.

Well, something is sure causing them to trip. There's
nothing plugged into the circuit, and still they trip. New
ones do the same. Some one in this group said that if the
connection to earth is too far from the panel, that can
happen.

If that's not the cause, then the only thing I can think of
is induction along the run near other wires.


One of the companies we do work for has a national contract for
installing electrical power connections for Red Box DVD kiosks
and there was a lot of nuisance tripping with certain brands of
GFI breakers. The company has settled on Square D breakers since
there don't seem to be nuisance trips with them. Whatever you have
connected to the GFI could be causing the nuisance trips even though
the piece of gear is completely safe and a different brand of GFI
may be less sensitive to whatever anomaly is causing it to trip.
I just reread your post and you write there is nothing connected to
the circuit and the GFI trips. Have you inspected the GFI that's
tripping or is it more than one? It could be that the GFI has
corrosion or it could be damaged by voltage spikes coming in on the
power line. You didn't mention whether you've replaced any of the
GFI outlets. ^_^

TDD

"Ralph Mowery" wrote:
"croy" wrote in message
...

Ground rods will not keep a GFCI from tripping needlessy. Either it is
defective or there is a good reason for it to trip.

Well, something is sure causing them to trip. There's
nothing plugged into the circuit, and still they trip. New
ones do the same. Some one in this group said that if the
connection to earth is too far from the panel, that can
happen.

If that's not the cause, then the only thing I can think of
is induction along the run near other wires.

--

Who ever said that if the ground was too far from the GFCI would cause them
to trip is wrong. The gound wire has nothing to do with the tripping. The
GFCI monitors the current in the hot and neutral wires. If there is an
unbalance , they will trip. The usual way is when the hot wire finds some
other path back to the neutral on the other side of the GFCI or ground path.

If they trip with nothing plugged in, it is time to look at the wiring. It
is also possiable for moisture to get into the outlets.

One other thing is that it could be wired wrong. Some one could have picked
off the neutral or hot wire to run somewhere without the other wrie.

Good answer, but I was thinking of noise or similar that might fool the GFI
sense circuit to trip falsely, coming in from the power source.

Greg

On Sun, 16 Dec 2012 20:58:51 -0600, The Daring Dufas
wrote:

On 12/16/2012 7:31 PM, croy wrote:
On Fri, 14 Dec 2012 20:37:46 -0500, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


"croy" wrote in message
...
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.


Ground rods will not keep a GFCI from tripping needlessy. Either it is
defective or there is a good reason for it to trip.

Well, something is sure causing them to trip. There's
nothing plugged into the circuit, and still they trip. New
ones do the same. Some one in this group said that if the
connection to earth is too far from the panel, that can
happen.

If that's not the cause, then the only thing I can think of
is induction along the run near other wires.


One of the companies we do work for has a national contract for
installing electrical power connections for Red Box DVD kiosks
and there was a lot of nuisance tripping with certain brands of
GFI breakers. The company has settled on Square D breakers since
there don't seem to be nuisance trips with them. Whatever you have
connected to the GFI could be causing the nuisance trips even though
the piece of gear is completely safe and a different brand of GFI
may be less sensitive to whatever anomaly is causing it to trip.
I just reread your post and you write there is nothing connected to
the circuit and the GFI trips. Have you inspected the GFI that's
tripping or is it more than one?

Two. Both GFCI breakers are at the service entrance panel,
and both are on new circuits that I installed. The first
was installed about 5 years ago, and didn't trip for 3
years. Then it tripped at random intervals from 10 seconds
to 6 months. I bought the second GFCI breaker as a
replacement for the first, but the results were the same.
When I installed the second circuit, I put the first GFCI
breaker on it, but a few days later it tripped (nothing
plugged in), and continued to trip. I finally jerked them
both out and replaced them with standard breakers (for now).


It could be that the GFI has
corrosion or it could be damaged by voltage spikes coming in on the
power line. You didn't mention whether you've replaced any of the
GFI outlets. ^_^

If you mean outlets with the GFCI circitry built into them,
there are none of those. If you mean regular outlets on the
GFCI circuits, they are all new--either Cooper Arrow-Hart or
Leviton. I used all new 12 ga grounded cable when I
installed the circuits.

Panel and breakers are GE. Panel is close to 30 years old
now, but I'd think that it *should* be good for 30 more.
Panel was the choice of the installer I hired then. Not
sure it was a wise choice. I would try to clean the busses
where the breakers connect, but I'm not sure if they are
thinly plated copper, or worse. Doubtful they are pure
silver!

--
croy

On 12/17/2012 9:35 PM, croy wrote:
On Sun, 16 Dec 2012 20:58:51 -0600, The Daring Dufas
wrote:

On 12/16/2012 7:31 PM, croy wrote:
On Fri, 14 Dec 2012 20:37:46 -0500, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


"croy" wrote in message
...
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.


Ground rods will not keep a GFCI from tripping needlessy. Either it is
defective or there is a good reason for it to trip.

Well, something is sure causing them to trip. There's
nothing plugged into the circuit, and still they trip. New
ones do the same. Some one in this group said that if the
connection to earth is too far from the panel, that can
happen.

If that's not the cause, then the only thing I can think of
is induction along the run near other wires.


One of the companies we do work for has a national contract for
installing electrical power connections for Red Box DVD kiosks
and there was a lot of nuisance tripping with certain brands of
GFI breakers. The company has settled on Square D breakers since
there don't seem to be nuisance trips with them. Whatever you have
connected to the GFI could be causing the nuisance trips even though
the piece of gear is completely safe and a different brand of GFI
may be less sensitive to whatever anomaly is causing it to trip.
I just reread your post and you write there is nothing connected to
the circuit and the GFI trips. Have you inspected the GFI that's
tripping or is it more than one?

Two. Both GFCI breakers are at the service entrance panel,
and both are on new circuits that I installed. The first
was installed about 5 years ago, and didn't trip for 3
years. Then it tripped at random intervals from 10 seconds
to 6 months. I bought the second GFCI breaker as a
replacement for the first, but the results were the same.
When I installed the second circuit, I put the first GFCI
breaker on it, but a few days later it tripped (nothing
plugged in), and continued to trip. I finally jerked them
both out and replaced them with standard breakers (for now).


It could be that the GFI has
corrosion or it could be damaged by voltage spikes coming in on the
power line. You didn't mention whether you've replaced any of the
GFI outlets. ^_^

If you mean outlets with the GFCI circitry built into them,
there are none of those. If you mean regular outlets on the
GFCI circuits, they are all new--either Cooper Arrow-Hart or
Leviton. I used all new 12 ga grounded cable when I
installed the circuits.

Panel and breakers are GE. Panel is close to 30 years old
now, but I'd think that it *should* be good for 30 more.
Panel was the choice of the installer I hired then. Not
sure it was a wise choice. I would try to clean the busses
where the breakers connect, but I'm not sure if they are
thinly plated copper, or worse. Doubtful they are pure
silver!


I was working for an electrical supplier when the ground fault devices
for residential use first became a common item on the market. This was
around the same time CB radio took off and GFI devices were tripping
every time someone with a strong transmitter keyed the microphone. It
took a while for manufacturers to figure out and fix that one. I'm now
wondering if you may have something arcing in your electrical system or
something with a switching power supply somewhere that could be putting
spikes on your electrical system that could be affecting the GFI
breakers? O_o

TDD

The Daring Dufas wrote:
On 12/17/2012 9:35 PM, croy wrote:
On Sun, 16 Dec 2012 20:58:51 -0600, The Daring Dufas
wrote:

On 12/16/2012 7:31 PM, croy wrote:
On Fri, 14 Dec 2012 20:37:46 -0500, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


"croy" wrote in message
...
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.


Ground rods will not keep a GFCI from tripping needlessy. Either it is
defective or there is a good reason for it to trip.

Well, something is sure causing them to trip. There's
nothing plugged into the circuit, and still they trip. New
ones do the same. Some one in this group said that if the
connection to earth is too far from the panel, that can
happen.

If that's not the cause, then the only thing I can think of
is induction along the run near other wires.


One of the companies we do work for has a national contract for
installing electrical power connections for Red Box DVD kiosks
and there was a lot of nuisance tripping with certain brands of
GFI breakers. The company has settled on Square D breakers since
there don't seem to be nuisance trips with them. Whatever you have
connected to the GFI could be causing the nuisance trips even though
the piece of gear is completely safe and a different brand of GFI
may be less sensitive to whatever anomaly is causing it to trip.
I just reread your post and you write there is nothing connected to
the circuit and the GFI trips. Have you inspected the GFI that's
tripping or is it more than one?

Two. Both GFCI breakers are at the service entrance panel,
and both are on new circuits that I installed. The first
was installed about 5 years ago, and didn't trip for 3
years. Then it tripped at random intervals from 10 seconds
to 6 months. I bought the second GFCI breaker as a
replacement for the first, but the results were the same.
When I installed the second circuit, I put the first GFCI
breaker on it, but a few days later it tripped (nothing
plugged in), and continued to trip. I finally jerked them
both out and replaced them with standard breakers (for now).


It could be that the GFI has
corrosion or it could be damaged by voltage spikes coming in on the
power line. You didn't mention whether you've replaced any of the
GFI outlets. ^_^

If you mean outlets with the GFCI circitry built into them,
there are none of those. If you mean regular outlets on the
GFCI circuits, they are all new--either Cooper Arrow-Hart or
Leviton. I used all new 12 ga grounded cable when I
installed the circuits.

Panel and breakers are GE. Panel is close to 30 years old
now, but I'd think that it *should* be good for 30 more.
Panel was the choice of the installer I hired then. Not
sure it was a wise choice. I would try to clean the busses
where the breakers connect, but I'm not sure if they are
thinly plated copper, or worse. Doubtful they are pure
silver!


I was working for an electrical supplier when the ground fault devices
for residential use first became a common item on the market. This was
around the same time CB radio took off and GFI devices were tripping
every time someone with a strong transmitter keyed the microphone. It
took a while for manufacturers to figure out and fix that one. I'm now
wondering if you may have something arcing in your electrical system or
something with a switching power supply somewhere that could be putting
spikes on your electrical system that could be affecting the GFI breakers? O_o

TDD

I don't know why they make things better. One day at the hospital, the
power went off. I now forget the scenario. They did manage to get something
back on line.
The switches went down in the power switchover room, or were tripped.
Manufacturer recommended no radios to be operated in area. So they labeled
one hallway, no cell phones, radio transmitters. I don't think it ever
happened again that I know of.

Greg

On Mon, 17 Dec 2012 19:35:09 -0800, croy
wrote:

On Sun, 16 Dec 2012 20:58:51 -0600, The Daring Dufas
wrote:

On 12/16/2012 7:31 PM, croy wrote:
On Fri, 14 Dec 2012 20:37:46 -0500, "Ralph Mowery"
wrote:


"croy" wrote in message
...
The last time I put in a ground rod at this house, it took
me a full day with a pipe-style post-pounder, and another
day to recover. The soil here is about an inch thich over
serious hardpan.

I've decided that I need another ground rod, closer to the
service entrance panel, to keep the GFCI breakers from
tripping needlessly.


Ground rods will not keep a GFCI from tripping needlessy. Either it is
defective or there is a good reason for it to trip.

Well, something is sure causing them to trip. There's
nothing plugged into the circuit, and still they trip. New
ones do the same. Some one in this group said that if the
connection to earth is too far from the panel, that can
happen.

If that's not the cause, then the only thing I can think of
is induction along the run near other wires.


One of the companies we do work for has a national contract for
installing electrical power connections for Red Box DVD kiosks
and there was a lot of nuisance tripping with certain brands of
GFI breakers. The company has settled on Square D breakers since
there don't seem to be nuisance trips with them. Whatever you have
connected to the GFI could be causing the nuisance trips even though
the piece of gear is completely safe and a different brand of GFI
may be less sensitive to whatever anomaly is causing it to trip.
I just reread your post and you write there is nothing connected to
the circuit and the GFI trips. Have you inspected the GFI that's
tripping or is it more than one?

Two. Both GFCI breakers are at the service entrance panel,
and both are on new circuits that I installed. The first
was installed about 5 years ago, and didn't trip for 3
years. Then it tripped at random intervals from 10 seconds
to 6 months. I bought the second GFCI breaker as a
replacement for the first, but the results were the same.
When I installed the second circuit, I put the first GFCI
breaker on it, but a few days later it tripped (nothing
plugged in), and continued to trip. I finally jerked them
both out and replaced them with standard breakers (for now).


It could be that the GFI has
corrosion or it could be damaged by voltage spikes coming in on the
power line. You didn't mention whether you've replaced any of the
GFI outlets. ^_^

If you mean outlets with the GFCI circitry built into them,
there are none of those. If you mean regular outlets on the
GFCI circuits, they are all new--either Cooper Arrow-Hart or
Leviton. I used all new 12 ga grounded cable when I
installed the circuits.

Panel and breakers are GE. Panel is close to 30 years old
now, but I'd think that it *should* be good for 30 more.
Panel was the choice of the installer I hired then. Not
sure it was a wise choice. I would try to clean the busses
where the breakers connect, but I'm not sure if they are
thinly plated copper, or worse. Doubtful they are pure
silver!

If outlets are subject to high humidity, the circuit may fault. Try
obtaining a ground fault receptacle and put at the first outlet as
feed thru. If it trips, move to next outlet and on until problem
location is identified. I have found Leviton to be fairly reliable.
--
Mr.E

On Saturday, 15 December 2012 08:34:32 UTC-5, bob haller wrote:
On Dec 14, 10:59*pm, Dean Hoffman wrote:
* * Have there been any studies done comparing the effectiveness of a
ground rod installed with water vs. *hammering one in?

i would assume a hammered one has beter contact with the soil, and is
a better ground

Code here sez ground rods must be driven, not buried; but can be driven at up to a 45-degree angle to avoid bedrock when needed. http://bit.ly/TzFX7C

No mention of watering the ground, but if it erodes earth away from the rod it's probably increasing your ground resistance.

But ground *plates* can be buried. I hadn't heard of such a thing until last summer when I decided I wanted a ground outside the house for a new TV antenna mast (rather than running the ground wire directly into the house to get to the ground lug on the water pipe). Cheap, and the kids briefly found that watching Dad dig a hole in the yard was a viable alternative to YouTube, though they seemed to expect me to whack myself with the shovel.

Like others, I doubt that lack of a proper ground is behind your GFI problem. My guess is that you've got a partial short on the circuit that first caused the breaker to trip, maybe from a nail in the wall or maybe from a flaky connection; and repeated tripping weakened that breaker. Try putting a new known-good GFI breaker on that second circuit. If it works properly for a while, move it to the circuit that first caused the tripping. If it starts to trip, you've got a real problem on that circuit. If it works ok on that circuit, you've got no problem at all, just had a couple of bad breakers..

A neutral-to-ground short, even one with some resistance, will trip a GFI since the return current will split itself partly to the ground wire, and the GFI will see it missing from the neutral. Maybe somewhere on that circuit an outlet or switch has shifted to the point where the neutral screw is touching the grounded box. Of course, if there is truly zero load on that circuit, that wouldn't explain it. If there is really no load at all then the fault must involve the hot leg, and that's something you really should track down.

Chip C
Toronto