I had the privilege of watching a grey haired, experinced
electrician work. The task of the moment was replacing some
electrical sockets at the church. He had a "doctor bag" of
all kinds of fun items. He walked up to one socket that
needed to be replaced. Out of his bag of tricks, he pulled a
rig that was a junction box, with a neon bulb and a big
push button. This connected to about a foot of wire, and a
three bladed plug.

He put the plug into the socket, and the neon bulb lit up.
He took hold of the juncion box, and pushed the button. I
heard a circuit breaker go "KLUNK" down the hall, and the
neon bulb went off. I realized at that moment what happened,
he had shorted out the breakerr and now the socket was safe
to work on. Seriously kewl!

He counsells me that the push button needs to be at least 75
amp rated, or the contacts will burn off. I built such a
device with a 15 amp switch and neon bulb combination. That
didn't make it through one use, the contacts fused. My next
model was a good two dollar 20 amp toggle switch, but I lost
the neon bulb indicator. No loss, I just plug in my three
bulb tester in the other socket. I labelled the switch plate
"off" and "pop". I had it out for use, and a kid who was
watching asked "What's off and pop?" which is now the name
of the device.

This technique is not reccomended in buildings with Federal
Pacific Electric panels. I assume no responsibility for
people who build their own gadgets. I'm sure others have
described the Jesus Method, using a short length of
insulated wire. I won't describe it further. Less safe than
Off And Pop.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
I had the privilege of watching a grey haired, experinced
electrician work. The task of the moment was replacing some
electrical sockets at the church. He had a "doctor bag" of
all kinds of fun items. He walked up to one socket that
needed to be replaced. Out of his bag of tricks, he pulled a
rig that was a junction box, with a neon bulb and a big
push button. This connected to about a foot of wire, and a
three bladed plug.

He put the plug into the socket, and the neon bulb lit up.
He took hold of the juncion box, and pushed the button. I
heard a circuit breaker go "KLUNK" down the hall, and the
neon bulb went off. I realized at that moment what happened,
he had shorted out the breakerr and now the socket was safe
to work on. Seriously kewl!

He counsells me that the push button needs to be at least 75
amp rated, or the contacts will burn off. I built such a
device with a 15 amp switch and neon bulb combination. That
didn't make it through one use, the contacts fused. My next
model was a good two dollar 20 amp toggle switch, but I lost
the neon bulb indicator. No loss, I just plug in my three
bulb tester in the other socket. I labelled the switch plate
"off" and "pop". I had it out for use, and a kid who was
watching asked "What's off and pop?" which is now the name
of the device.

This technique is not reccomended in buildings with Federal
Pacific Electric panels. I assume no responsibility for
people who build their own gadgets. I'm sure others have
described the Jesus Method, using a short length of
insulated wire. I won't describe it further. Less safe than
Off And Pop.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
.

That is just an easy way to damage the breaker and possibly cause a fire if
it fails to trip. Why not just get a circuit tracer and do it correctly. You
can get one from HF for less money than you will spend in time and parts to
build that contraption you are describing.

On 2/14/2011 5:24 PM JIMMIE spake thus:

On Feb 14, 6:34 pm, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:

I had the privilege of watching a grey haired, experinced
electrician work. The task of the moment was replacing some
electrical sockets at the church. He had a "doctor bag" of all
kinds of fun items. He walked up to one socket that needed to be
replaced. Out of his bag of tricks, he pulled a rig that was a
junction box, with a neon bulb and a big push button. This
connected to about a foot of wire, and a three bladed plug.

He put the plug into the socket, and the neon bulb lit up. He took
hold of the juncion box, and pushed the button. I heard a circuit
breaker go "KLUNK" down the hall, and the neon bulb went off. I
realized at that moment what happened, he had shorted out the
breakerr and now the socket was safe to work on. Seriously kewl!

I used to have a device called a "fool killer" an extension cord that
the female end had been replaced with gator clips. I think your device
ranks right up there with that one.

I've got one of those things now. Just used it the other day.

*However*, I only use it in the privacy of my own home, and I would
never recommend that anyone else use such a killer device.

So it appears that the overwhelming consensus of opinion here is that
Stormie's electrician's little trick is pretty idiotic. No surprise there.


--
The phrase "jump the shark" itself jumped the shark about a decade ago.

- Usenet

On Mon, 14 Feb 2011 18:34:28 -0500, Stormin Mormon wrote:

I had the privilege of watching a grey haired, experinced
electrician work. The task of the moment was replacing some
electrical sockets at the church. He had a "doctor bag" of
all kinds of fun items. He walked up to one socket that
needed to be replaced. Out of his bag of tricks, he pulled a
rig that was a junction box, with a neon bulb and a big
push button. This connected to about a foot of wire, and a
three bladed plug.

He put the plug into the socket, and the neon bulb lit up.
He took hold of the juncion box, and pushed the button. I
heard a circuit breaker go "KLUNK" down the hall, and the
neon bulb went off. I realized at that moment what happened,
he had shorted out the breakerr and now the socket was safe
to work on. Seriously kewl!

He counsells me that the push button needs to be at least 75
amp rated, or the contacts will burn off. I built such a
device with a 15 amp switch and neon bulb combination. That
didn't make it through one use, the contacts fused. My next
model was a good two dollar 20 amp toggle switch, but I lost
the neon bulb indicator. No loss, I just plug in my three
bulb tester in the other socket. I labelled the switch plate
"off" and "pop". I had it out for use, and a kid who was
watching asked "What's off and pop?" which is now the name
of the device.

This technique is not reccomended in buildings with Federal
Pacific Electric panels. I assume no responsibility for
people who build their own gadgets. I'm sure others have
described the Jesus Method, using a short length of
insulated wire. I won't describe it further. Less safe than
Off And Pop.

I just do it hot. Last time I got bit I calmly let go and commented that it
was hot.

On 2/14/2011 5:34 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
I had the privilege of watching a grey haired, experinced
electrician work. The task of the moment was replacing some
electrical sockets at the church. He had a "doctor bag" of
all kinds of fun items. He walked up to one socket that
needed to be replaced. Out of his bag of tricks, he pulled a
rig that was a junction box, with a neon bulb and a big
push button. This connected to about a foot of wire, and a
three bladed plug.

He put the plug into the socket, and the neon bulb lit up.
He took hold of the juncion box, and pushed the button. I
heard a circuit breaker go "KLUNK" down the hall, and the
neon bulb went off. I realized at that moment what happened,
he had shorted out the breakerr and now the socket was safe
to work on. Seriously kewl!

He counsells me that the push button needs to be at least 75
amp rated, or the contacts will burn off. I built such a
device with a 15 amp switch and neon bulb combination. That
didn't make it through one use, the contacts fused. My next
model was a good two dollar 20 amp toggle switch, but I lost
the neon bulb indicator. No loss, I just plug in my three
bulb tester in the other socket. I labelled the switch plate
"off" and "pop". I had it out for use, and a kid who was
watching asked "What's off and pop?" which is now the name
of the device.

This technique is not reccomended in buildings with Federal
Pacific Electric panels. I assume no responsibility for
people who build their own gadgets. I'm sure others have
described the Jesus Method, using a short length of
insulated wire. I won't describe it further. Less safe than
Off And Pop.


I do believe I described the Jesus method of breaker tracing here
on several occasions. It's a good way to test the circuit breakers
too. The only other good way is to use a cascading load bank like
what is used to test generators.

TDD

On Feb 14, 11:34*pm, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
I had the privilege of watching a grey haired, experinced
electrician work. The task of the moment was replacing some
electrical sockets at the church. He had a "doctor bag" of
all kinds of fun items. He walked up to one socket that
needed to be replaced. Out of his bag of tricks, he pulled a
rig that was *a junction box, with a neon bulb and a big
push button. This connected to about a foot of wire, and a
three bladed plug.

He put the plug into the socket, and the neon bulb lit up.
He took hold of the juncion box, and pushed the button. I
heard a circuit breaker go "KLUNK" down the hall, and the
neon bulb went off. I realized at that moment what happened,
he had shorted out the breakerr and now the socket was safe
to work on. Seriously kewl!

He counsells me that the push button needs to be at least 75
amp rated, or the contacts will burn off. I built such a
device with a 15 amp switch and neon bulb combination. That
didn't make it through one use, the contacts fused. My next
model was a good two dollar 20 amp toggle switch, but I lost
the neon bulb indicator. No loss, I just plug in my three
bulb tester in the other socket. I labelled the switch plate
"off" and "pop". I had it out for use, and a kid who was
watching asked "What's off and pop?" which is now the name
of the device.

This technique is not reccomended in buildings with Federal
Pacific Electric panels. I assume no responsibility for
people who build their own gadgets. I'm sure others have
described the Jesus Method, using a short length of
insulated wire. I won't describe it further. *Less safe than
Off And Pop.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
*www.lds.org
.

The man is a half wit. Why not buy the proper instrument for the job?
Circuit breakers have only a limited operating life (ie under fault
conditions), he is detracting from it.

Very large CB on high voltage often only have a life of ten operations
or less under fault conditions for example. They however can be
repaired. The one in your house can't be.

I've heard those FPE panels weren't likely to trip, in any
case.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Frank" wrote in message
...

I wouldn't do it either. A few years ago when I got an
estimate for
transfer panel from electrical contractor he recommended
replacing my
main panel because it was known for not tripping when it
should.
I bounced this off a retired commercial electrician foreman
friend and
he agreed. He told me of an experience with this type panel
where they
were remodeling a store and electrician figured he would
just trip panel
with a shovel to a floor outlet and ended up welding the
shovel to the
floor.

I can't remember what that's also called. Test cord, or
something. Did you ever cook hot dogs with a couple nails?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"JIMMIE" wrote in message
...

I used to have a device called a "fool killer" an extension
cord that
the female end had been replaced with gator clips. I think
your device
ranks right up there with that one.

Jimmie

Of course, the "two hair dryers" method will
take out most breaker, if they aren't FPE.
We had a "two vacuum cleaners" breaker trip,
a couple weeks ago.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...

I do believe I described the Jesus method of breaker tracing
here
on several occasions. It's a good way to test the circuit
breakers
too. The only other good way is to use a cascading load bank
like
what is used to test generators.

TDD

You know, the breaker finder is another idea.
I've not used one of those, not sure how well
it works. Breaker finder is about $20 on sale,
and I paid about $4 for the parts to make
Off N Pop.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"ROANIN" wrote in message
...



That is just an easy way to damage the breaker
and possibly cause a fire if it fails to trip. Why
not just get a circuit tracer and do it correctly.
You can get one from HF for less money than
you will spend in time and parts to build that
contraption you are describing.

On Feb 15, 6:46*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
You know, the breaker finder is another idea.
I've not used one of those, not sure how well
it works. Breaker finder is about $20 on sale,
and I paid about $4 for the parts to make
Off N Pop.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
*www.lds.org
.

"ROANIN" wrote in message

...

That is just an easy way to damage the breaker
and possibly cause a fire if it fails to trip. Why
not just get a circuit tracer and do it correctly.
You can get one from HF for less money than
you will spend in time and parts to build that
contraption you are describing.

There is no defense for stupidity.

On Mon, 14 Feb 2011 22:46:40 -0600, The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 2/14/2011 5:34 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
I had the privilege of watching a grey haired, experinced
electrician work. The task of the moment was replacing some
electrical sockets at the church. He had a "doctor bag" of
all kinds of fun items. He walked up to one socket that
needed to be replaced. Out of his bag of tricks, he pulled a
rig that was a junction box, with a neon bulb and a big
push button. This connected to about a foot of wire, and a
three bladed plug.

He put the plug into the socket, and the neon bulb lit up.
He took hold of the juncion box, and pushed the button. I
heard a circuit breaker go "KLUNK" down the hall, and the
neon bulb went off. I realized at that moment what happened,
he had shorted out the breakerr and now the socket was safe
to work on. Seriously kewl!

He counsells me that the push button needs to be at least 75
amp rated, or the contacts will burn off. I built such a
device with a 15 amp switch and neon bulb combination. That
didn't make it through one use, the contacts fused. My next
model was a good two dollar 20 amp toggle switch, but I lost
the neon bulb indicator. No loss, I just plug in my three
bulb tester in the other socket. I labelled the switch plate
"off" and "pop". I had it out for use, and a kid who was
watching asked "What's off and pop?" which is now the name
of the device.

This technique is not reccomended in buildings with Federal
Pacific Electric panels. I assume no responsibility for
people who build their own gadgets. I'm sure others have
described the Jesus Method, using a short length of
insulated wire. I won't describe it further. Less safe than
Off And Pop.


I do believe I described the Jesus method of breaker tracing here
on several occasions. It's a good way to test the circuit breakers
too. The only other good way is to use a cascading load bank like
what is used to test generators.

TDD

Why not just use a circuit tracer? They can be had for about $20.

http://www.harborfreight.com/circuit...ive-96934.html

On 2/15/2011 8:36 AM, Michael Dobony wrote:
On Mon, 14 Feb 2011 22:46:40 -0600, The Daring Dufas wrote:

On 2/14/2011 5:34 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
I had the privilege of watching a grey haired, experinced
electrician work. The task of the moment was replacing some
electrical sockets at the church. He had a "doctor bag" of
all kinds of fun items. He walked up to one socket that
needed to be replaced. Out of his bag of tricks, he pulled a
rig that was a junction box, with a neon bulb and a big
push button. This connected to about a foot of wire, and a
three bladed plug.

He put the plug into the socket, and the neon bulb lit up.
He took hold of the juncion box, and pushed the button. I
heard a circuit breaker go "KLUNK" down the hall, and the
neon bulb went off. I realized at that moment what happened,
he had shorted out the breakerr and now the socket was safe
to work on. Seriously kewl!

He counsells me that the push button needs to be at least 75
amp rated, or the contacts will burn off. I built such a
device with a 15 amp switch and neon bulb combination. That
didn't make it through one use, the contacts fused. My next
model was a good two dollar 20 amp toggle switch, but I lost
the neon bulb indicator. No loss, I just plug in my three
bulb tester in the other socket. I labelled the switch plate
"off" and "pop". I had it out for use, and a kid who was
watching asked "What's off and pop?" which is now the name
of the device.

This technique is not reccomended in buildings with Federal
Pacific Electric panels. I assume no responsibility for
people who build their own gadgets. I'm sure others have
described the Jesus Method, using a short length of
insulated wire. I won't describe it further. Less safe than
Off And Pop.


I do believe I described the Jesus method of breaker tracing here
on several occasions. It's a good way to test the circuit breakers
too. The only other good way is to use a cascading load bank like
what is used to test generators.

TDD

Why not just use a circuit tracer? They can be had for about $20.

http://www.harborfreight.com/circuit...ive-96934.html

I own two with a lot of accessories. :-)

TDD

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
I had the privilege of watching a grey haired, experinced
electrician work. The task of the moment was replacing some
electrical sockets at the church. He had a "doctor bag" of
all kinds of fun items. He walked up to one socket that
needed to be replaced. Out of his bag of tricks, he pulled a
rig that was a junction box, with a neon bulb and a big
push button. This connected to about a foot of wire, and a
three bladed plug.

He put the plug into the socket, and the neon bulb lit up.
He took hold of the juncion box, and pushed the button. I
heard a circuit breaker go "KLUNK" down the hall, and the
neon bulb went off. I realized at that moment what happened,
he had shorted out the breakerr and now the socket was safe
to work on. Seriously kewl!


You have the option of turning off all the branch circuit breakers if
you don't know which one is for that circuit. Then testing to be sure
power is off. And checking BOTH the top and bottom of the outlet as
some outlets can be on two breakers (called a Multi-Wire Branch
Circuit).

Basically in some situations, you could turn off power to the top
outlet, but the bottom outlet is still hot because it is on another
breaker! Or other wires in the same electrical box may be on other
breakers!

So for that reason, it is good practice to turn off ALL the breakers.

If you can be 100% safe, then there is no reason to do anything other
than that...

Also never assume power is off if you turn off all the breakers. There
could be another breaker panel! So always test to be sure power is
off.

If you are doing work for someone else and they say the other power
must remain on (so they don't have to reset the clocks, can watch TV,
or whatever), then tell them they can find someone else to do the
work!

On Feb 15, 10:29*am, "Bill" wrote:
"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
I had the privilege of watching a grey haired, experinced
electrician work. The task of the moment was replacing some
electrical sockets at the church. He had a "doctor bag" of
all kinds of fun items. He walked up to one socket that
needed to be replaced. Out of his bag of tricks, he pulled a
rig that was *a junction box, with a neon bulb and a big
push button. This connected to about a foot of wire, and a
three bladed plug.

He put the plug into the socket, and the neon bulb lit up.
He took hold of the juncion box, and pushed the button. I
heard a circuit breaker go "KLUNK" down the hall, and the
neon bulb went off. I realized at that moment what happened,
he had shorted out the breakerr and now the socket was safe
to work on. Seriously kewl!

You have the option of turning off all the branch circuit breakers if
you don't know which one is for that circuit. Then testing to be sure
power is off. And checking BOTH the top and bottom of the outlet as
some outlets can be on two breakers (called a Multi-Wire Branch
Circuit).

Basically in some situations, you could turn off power to the top
outlet, but the bottom outlet is still hot because it is on another
breaker! Or other wires in the same electrical box may be on other
breakers!

So for that reason, it is good practice to turn off ALL the breakers.

If you can be 100% safe, then there is no reason to do anything other
than that...

Also never assume power is off if you turn off all the breakers. There
could be another breaker panel! So always test to be sure power is
off.

If you are doing work for someone else and they say the other power
must remain on (so they don't have to reset the clocks, can watch TV,
or whatever), then tell them they can find someone else to do the
work!


If you as a technician are unable to determine whether power wires you
will be working on or near in an electrical box are live or dead, and
you
need to shut off power to the entire panel or building to work on one
outlet location you shouldn't be doing this sort of work...

Stick to construction and let someone who knows more and able to
properly determine how to shut off only what needs to be powered
down to safely do the work required... Not many facilities are going
to be willing to allow you to randomly kill the power even if it is
only
for a few minutes to an entire panel or section...

If an electrician came to me and said he needed to power off an
entire panel it had better be to replace the main breaker in that
panel or because something needs to be rewired or a transformer
opened up and looked at... If he or his workmen needed to kill
power to an entire panel just to replace or work on one outlet on
one circuit then I would request different workmen or better trained
technicians...

~~ Evan

on the other hand, if the breaker really is defective and fails to on
a short..

isn't it better to find out that the breaker is bad during this "test"
rather than during an actual short?

maybe somekind of 75 Amp load would be better then a dead short...

Mark

On Feb 15, 2:29*pm, Mark wrote:
on the other hand, if the breaker really is defective and fails to on
a short..

isn't it better to find out that the breaker is bad during this "test"
rather than during an actual short?

maybe somekind of 75 Amp load would be better then a dead short...

Mark

Did you ever hear wires "lash" in a conduit from a dead short? This is
not the way you want to go.

On 2/15/2011 12:34 PM Bob Villa spake thus:

On Feb 15, 2:29 pm, Mark wrote:

on the other hand, if the breaker really is defective and fails to
on a short..

isn't it better to find out that the breaker is bad during this
"test" rather than during an actual short?

maybe somekind of 75 Amp load would be better then a dead short...

Did you ever hear wires "lash" in a conduit from a dead short?

Yes, and when it's on a 277 volt circuit, you really hear them. (DAMHIKT)

This is not the way you want to go.

Definitely not.


--
The phrase "jump the shark" itself jumped the shark about a decade ago.

- Usenet

On Tue, 15 Feb 2011 06:06:45 -0800 (PST), Bob Villa
wrote:

There is no defense for stupidity.

Sure there is.

_The Defense Never Rests_ by F. Lee Bailey

book cover pic:

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/51RJ77JFNSL._SL500_AA300_.jpg

I'd be worried if they were FPE. But, Square D tend to work
fairly well. It's a good thought.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Mark" wrote in message
...
on the other hand, if the breaker really is defective and
fails to on
a short..

isn't it better to find out that the breaker is bad during
this "test"
rather than during an actual short?

maybe somekind of 75 Amp load would be better then a dead
short...

Mark

On 2/15/2011 5:36 PM, David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 2/15/2011 12:34 PM Bob Villa spake thus:

On Feb 15, 2:29 pm, Mark wrote:

on the other hand, if the breaker really is defective and fails to
on a short..

isn't it better to find out that the breaker is bad during this
"test" rather than during an actual short?

maybe somekind of 75 Amp load would be better then a dead short...

Did you ever hear wires "lash" in a conduit from a dead short?

Yes, and when it's on a 277 volt circuit, you really hear them. (DAMHIKT)

This is not the way you want to go.

Definitely not.


Ever seen a cable tray in an industrial setting do the overload dance? :-)

TDD

Only when it had to pee real bad.

Hey, I find out the breakers at church are Square
D bolt on type. Should I work with the system
hot, or go find the big breaker to turn off the sub
panel? And, therefore, work in the dark by
flashlight?

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...

Ever seen a cable tray in an industrial setting do the
overload dance? :-)

TDD

One vote for the hot swap.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"Michael Dobony"
wrote in message
. ..

I just do it hot. Last time I got bit I calmly let go
and commented that it was hot.

On Feb 16, 7:15*am, "Stormin Mormon"
wrote:
One vote for the hot swap.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
*www.lds.org
.

"Michael Dobony"
wrote in messagenews:1sud9pko6m070$.18swe895t7mqw$.dlg@40tu de.net...

I just do it hot. Last time I got bit I calmly let go
and commented that it was hot.

Once an ass (and top-poster) always an...

On 2/16/2011 7:14 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Only when it had to pee real bad.

Hey, I find out the breakers at church are Square
D bolt on type. Should I work with the system
hot, or go find the big breaker to turn off the sub
panel? And, therefore, work in the dark by
flashlight?


I've worked them hot but you might consider killing the power
to the panel and use a headlamp. I have a cute light that clips
on the bill of my cap. I have a headlight or two and a ball cap
that has LED's built into the bill. The screws/bolts that attach
the breaker to the buss bar are usually captive and won't fall
out but don't count on it so you must be careful. :-)

TDD

On Feb 16, 9:47*am, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
On 2/16/2011 7:14 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Only when it had to pee real bad.

Hey, I find out the breakers at church are Square
D bolt on type. Should I work with the system
hot, or go find the big breaker to turn off the sub
panel? And, therefore, work in the dark by
flashlight?

I've worked them hot but you might consider killing the power
to the panel and use a headlamp. I have a cute light that clips
on the bill of my cap. I have a headlight or two and a ball cap
that has LED's built into the bill. The screws/bolts that attach
the breaker to the buss bar are usually captive and won't fall
out but don't count on it so you must be careful. :-)

TDD

He was being sarcastic, DD.

On 2/16/2011 10:12 AM, Bob Villa wrote:
On Feb 16, 9:47 am, The Daring
wrote:
On 2/16/2011 7:14 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Only when it had to pee real bad.

Hey, I find out the breakers at church are Square
D bolt on type. Should I work with the system
hot, or go find the big breaker to turn off the sub
panel? And, therefore, work in the dark by
flashlight?

I've worked them hot but you might consider killing the power
to the panel and use a headlamp. I have a cute light that clips
on the bill of my cap. I have a headlight or two and a ball cap
that has LED's built into the bill. The screws/bolts that attach
the breaker to the buss bar are usually captive and won't fall
out but don't count on it so you must be careful. :-)

TDD

He was being sarcastic, DD.

I wasn't. :-)

TDD

On Feb 16, 1:17*pm, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
On 2/16/2011 10:12 AM, Bob Villa wrote:



On Feb 16, 9:47 am, The Daring
wrote:
On 2/16/2011 7:14 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Only when it had to pee real bad.

Hey, I find out the breakers at church are Square
D bolt on type. Should I work with the system
hot, or go find the big breaker to turn off the sub
panel? And, therefore, work in the dark by
flashlight?

I've worked them hot but you might consider killing the power
to the panel and use a headlamp. I have a cute light that clips
on the bill of my cap. I have a headlight or two and a ball cap
that has LED's built into the bill. The screws/bolts that attach
the breaker to the buss bar are usually captive and won't fall
out but don't count on it so you must be careful. :-)

TDD

He was being sarcastic, DD.

I wasn't. :-)

TDD

I knew.^L^

You are so right -- don't count on captive screws.
I just heard back, they are giving the job to a retired
electrician who is serving as full time missionary.
He'll do fine, I'm sure. I'd enjoy the chance to kill
that wing of the building, and work with battery
lights. Chance to play with my toys. The panel box
is in a shaftway, which is in the back of the chapel.
No exposure to outdoor light.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...

I've worked them hot but you might consider killing the
power
to the panel and use a headlamp. I have a cute light that
clips
on the bill of my cap. I have a headlight or two and a ball
cap
that has LED's built into the bill. The screws/bolts that
attach
the breaker to the buss bar are usually captive and won't
fall
out but don't count on it so you must be careful. :-)

TDD

Those cap lights are good. I've got a couple of
them. My hybrid Frankenstein strap on head
lamp from HF is my favorite. I got the black and
yellow lamp from HF, and put in a Nite Ize
Mini-Mag module. Bright, comfortable to wear,
and also uses AA cells.

I was being silly, about the cables that shudder.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...


I've worked them hot but you might consider killing the
power
to the panel and use a headlamp. I have a cute light that
clips
on the bill of my cap. I have a headlight or two and a
ball cap
that has LED's built into the bill. The screws/bolts that
attach
the breaker to the buss bar are usually captive and won't
fall
out but don't count on it so you must be careful. :-)

TDD

He was being sarcastic, DD.

I wasn't. :-)

TDD

On 2/16/2011 2:33 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Those cap lights are good. I've got a couple of
them. My hybrid Frankenstein strap on head
lamp from HF is my favorite. I got the black and
yellow lamp from HF, and put in a Nite Ize
Mini-Mag module. Bright, comfortable to wear,
and also uses AA cells.

I was being silly, about the cables that shudder.


I've worked in industrial settings and have seen a lot of things
that people would be surprised about. High voltage, high current
industrial power systems have little in common with your home's
electrical system. I've seen conduits and cable trays jump like
a mongoose after a cobra. An industrial short circuit is quite a
spectacular event. ^_^

TDD

As with many fields, there are newbies like me with
electric. And there are experienced guys who know what they
are doing. The old guy at church seems like the experienced
type. Actually, and you also.

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...

I've worked in industrial settings and have seen a lot of
things
that people would be surprised about. High voltage, high
current
industrial power systems have little in common with your
home's
electrical system. I've seen conduits and cable trays jump
like
a mongoose after a cobra. An industrial short circuit is
quite a
spectacular event. ^_^

TDD

On 2/16/2011 5:42 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
As with many fields, there are newbies like me with
electric. And there are experienced guys who know what they
are doing. The old guy at church seems like the experienced
type. Actually, and you also.


What? An old guy just because I was born in the middle of the
last century? :-)

TDD

On Feb 16, 4:22*pm, The Daring Dufas
wrote:
On 2/16/2011 2:33 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Those cap lights are good. I've got a couple of
them. My hybrid Frankenstein strap on head
lamp from HF is my favorite. I got the black and
yellow lamp from HF, and put in a Nite Ize
Mini-Mag module. Bright, comfortable to wear,
and also uses AA cells.

I was being silly, about the cables that shudder.

I've worked in industrial settings and have seen a lot of things
that people would be surprised about. High voltage, high current
industrial power systems have little in common with your home's
electrical system. I've seen conduits and cable trays jump like
a mongoose after a cobra. An industrial short circuit is quite a
spectacular event. ^_^

TDD


Yes... They are spectacular...

I love a good medium voltage arc flash or short to ground...

Its like a baby sized lightning strike...

I have seen a couple of nice 13,800 flashes when the fire
department uses a pumper truck on a burning house very
close to overhead power lines...

~~ Evan

On 2/16/2011 8:36 PM, Evan wrote:
On Feb 16, 4:22 pm, The Daring
wrote:
On 2/16/2011 2:33 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:

Those cap lights are good. I've got a couple of
them. My hybrid Frankenstein strap on head
lamp from HF is my favorite. I got the black and
yellow lamp from HF, and put in a Nite Ize
Mini-Mag module. Bright, comfortable to wear,
and also uses AA cells.

I was being silly, about the cables that shudder.

I've worked in industrial settings and have seen a lot of things
that people would be surprised about. High voltage, high current
industrial power systems have little in common with your home's
electrical system. I've seen conduits and cable trays jump like
a mongoose after a cobra. An industrial short circuit is quite a
spectacular event. ^_^

TDD


Yes... They are spectacular...

I love a good medium voltage arc flash or short to ground...

Its like a baby sized lightning strike...

I have seen a couple of nice 13,800 flashes when the fire
department uses a pumper truck on a burning house very
close to overhead power lines...

~~ Evan

The underground power at the missile range where I worked was only
4160 because the largest island was only 3 miles long but everything
we used was rated at 15kv because we were around water. The splices
are down in manholes that will get flooded. Every now and then one
of those splices will leak and explode. Don't be standing on the
manhole cover when it happens because you will reach escape velocity
rather quickly. ^_^

TDD

Bang your cane on the floor if you want me to talk
louder....

(In your case, age comes with wisdom. I may tease you, but
gently so, and with great respect.)

--
Christopher A. Young
Learn more about Jesus
www.lds.org
..


"The Daring Dufas" wrote in
message ...
On 2/16/2011 5:42 PM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
As with many fields, there are newbies like me with
electric. And there are experienced guys who know what
they
are doing. The old guy at church seems like the
experienced
type. Actually, and you also.


What? An old guy just because I was born in the middle of
the
last century? :-)

TDD

On 2/17/2011 6:52 AM, Stormin Mormon wrote:
Bang your cane on the floor if you want me to talk
louder....

(In your case, age comes with wisdom. I may tease you, but
gently so, and with great respect.)


Speak up boy! Quit mumbling! You kids get off my lawn!

TDD

"Stormin Mormon" wrote in message
...
Only when it had to pee real bad.

Hey, I find out the breakers at church are Square
D bolt on type. Should I work with the system
hot, or go find the big breaker to turn off the sub
panel? And, therefore, work in the dark by
flashlight?


If you have the option to NOT work with live electricity, then that is
the BEST option! If you need to use flashlights or rent a generator,
and that might save your life, it is well worth it.

Many electrical contractors have a policy of never working with live
electricity period. They don't have to.

And the problem is an accidental slip. You are using a wrench or a
screwdriver and placing pressure on it, then it slips and your hand or
the tool touches something live. This may not happen but once every 5
years, but once is enough to kill you. Thus the reason for the never
working with live electricity policies.

If you never work with live electricity, there will never be an
accident...