About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?


Steve

On Feb 12, 1:43*pm, wrote:
About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Buildup in the bottom of the tank is keeping the thermostat from
accurately reading the temperature of the water and heating it back up
when it cools off.

Had the same problem with mine. It was gas so there was no cleaning it
out. It was also 30 years old and on borrowed time. I replaced it.
Nice hot showers first time every time.

On Feb 12, 1:50*pm, wrote:
On Feb 12, 1:43*pm, wrote:

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Buildup in the bottom of the tank is keeping the thermostat from
accurately reading the temperature of the water and heating it back up
when it cools off.

Had the same problem with mine. It was gas so there was no cleaning it
out. It was also 30 years old and on borrowed time. I replaced it.
Nice hot showers first time every time.


Could be that, could be a heating element is out, could be a
thermostat is bad, could be your kids are taking too many showers
before you do. With so little info, who knows?

On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 10:50:10 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Feb 12, 1:43*pm, wrote:
About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Buildup in the bottom of the tank is keeping the thermostat from
accurately reading the temperature of the water and heating it back up
when it cools off.

Had the same problem with mine. It was gas so there was no cleaning it
out. It was also 30 years old and on borrowed time. I replaced it.
Nice hot showers first time every time.

Is the cold water in pipe warm? If so your dip tube may need
replacing.

wrote in message
...

I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Gas or electricity? E.g. gas burner jets may require periodical
cleaning, heating electrodes (usually two) of elec. heaters can
be replaced when they wear out (are masked by mineral deposits.)

--
Don Phillipson
Carlsbad Springs
(Ottawa, Canada)

On Feb 12, 12:43*pm, wrote:
About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Steve

Oh gee, a queston, why not turn up the temperature and see what
happens. Answer, it will get hotter, you should be happier.

"ransley" wrote in message
...
On Feb 12, 12:43 pm, wrote:
About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Steve

Oh gee, a queston, why not turn up the temperature and see what
happens. Answer, it will get hotter, you should be happier.




wow, that's a dumb answer.

Are dip tubes normally replaceable? Mine is shot and a plumber told me I
had to replace the whole heater to solve the problem. I sure would like
to just replace one part.

EJ in NJ

Jesse wrote:
On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 10:50:10 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Feb 12, 1:43 pm, wrote:
About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?
Buildup in the bottom of the tank is keeping the thermostat from
accurately reading the temperature of the water and heating it back up
when it cools off.

Had the same problem with mine. It was gas so there was no cleaning it
out. It was also 30 years old and on borrowed time. I replaced it.
Nice hot showers first time every time.

Is the cold water in pipe warm? If so your dip tube may need
replacing.

Theoretically, yes. In practice... how lucky do you feel?

Personally I wouldn't attempt the job before determining that my
checking account and/or credit card could cover the speedy installation
of a new water heater if things went bad.

nate

(been lucky on a few jobs like that.)

Ernie Willson wrote:
Are dip tubes normally replaceable? Mine is shot and a plumber told me I
had to replace the whole heater to solve the problem. I sure would like
to just replace one part.

EJ in NJ

Jesse wrote:
On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 10:50:10 -0800 (PST),
wrote:

On Feb 12, 1:43 pm, wrote:
About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?
Buildup in the bottom of the tank is keeping the thermostat from
accurately reading the temperature of the water and heating it back up
when it cools off.

Had the same problem with mine. It was gas so there was no cleaning it
out. It was also 30 years old and on borrowed time. I replaced it.
Nice hot showers first time every time.

Is the cold water in pipe warm? If so your dip tube may need
replacing.


--
replace "roosters" with "cox" to reply.
http://members.cox.net/njnagel

On 2/12/2009 1:19 PM Joe spake thus:

"ransley" wrote in message
...

On Feb 12, 12:43 pm, wrote:

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Oh gee, a queston, why not turn up the temperature and see what
happens. Answer, it will get hotter, you should be happier.

wow, that's a dumb answer.

What do you expect from "ransley"? He's an idiot.


--
Personally, I like Vista, but I probably won't use it. I like it
because it generates considerable business for me in consulting and
upgrades. As long as there is hardware and software out there that
doesn't work, I stay in business. Incidentally, my company motto is
"If this stuff worked, you wouldn't need me".

- lifted from sci.electronics.repair

"Ernie Willson" wrote in message
m...
Are dip tubes normally replaceable? Mine is shot and a plumber told me I
had to replace the whole heater to solve the problem. I sure would like to
just replace one part.


They are replaceable, available at a hardware store for about $5.

David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 2/12/2009 1:19 PM Joe spake thus:

"ransley" wrote in message
...

On Feb 12, 12:43 pm, wrote:

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay
attention to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a
factor. But, a warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also
seem to remember the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it
possible that my water heater is dying a slow death?

Oh gee, a queston, why not turn up the temperature and see what
happens. Answer, it will get hotter, you should be happier.

wow, that's a dumb answer.

What do you expect from "ransley"? He's an idiot.

Huh? The water's not hot enough. There's a thermostat available.

What's the most sensible first step?

On Feb 12, 3:19*pm, "Joe" wrote:
"ransley" wrote in message

...
On Feb 12, 12:43 pm, wrote:

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Steve

Oh gee, a queston, why not turn up the temperature and see what
happens. Answer, it will get hotter, you should be happier.

wow, that's a dumb answer.

Its the smartest or most logical answer there is, if you Think about
it, and you didnt. You didnt THINK. Weather temps have nothing to do
with it unless his home is unheated. Water temps of inground pipes
take months to respond. .

"ransley" wrote in message
...
On Feb 12, 3:19 pm, "Joe" wrote:
"ransley" wrote in message

...
On Feb 12, 12:43 pm, wrote:

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Steve

Oh gee, a queston, why not turn up the temperature and see what
happens. Answer, it will get hotter, you should be happier.

wow, that's a dumb answer.

Its the smartest or most logical answer there is, if you Think about
it, and you didnt. You didnt THINK. Weather temps have nothing to do
with it unless his home is unheated. Water temps of inground pipes
take months to respond. .

as david pointed out, the op said, and I quote, "I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past".

don't bother responding.

plonk

On 2/12/2009 4:08 PM HeyBub spake thus:

Huh? The water's not hot enough. There's a thermostat available.

What's the most sensible first step?

OP says: "I also seem to remember the hot water being hotter in the
past." Didja miss that?


--
Personally, I like Vista, but I probably won't use it. I like it
because it generates considerable business for me in consulting and
upgrades. As long as there is hardware and software out there that
doesn't work, I stay in business. Incidentally, my company motto is
"If this stuff worked, you wouldn't need me".

- lifted from sci.electronics.repair

On Feb 12, 3:19*pm, "Joe" wrote:
"ransley" wrote in message

...
On Feb 12, 12:43 pm, wrote:

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Steve

Oh gee, a queston, why not turn up the temperature and see what
happens. Answer, it will get hotter, you should be happier.

wow, that's a dumb answer.

Was it tried, I bet not.[ Simple question, Simple conclusion, will be
cheapest.] [ a new quote by me]

On Feb 12, 3:19*pm, "Joe" wrote:
"ransley" wrote in message

...
On Feb 12, 12:43 pm, wrote:

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Steve

Oh gee, a queston, why not turn up the temperature and see what
happens. Answer, it will get hotter, you should be happier.

wow, that's a dumb answer.

Not at all, its old. Try it first and see.

On Feb 12, 10:43*am, wrote:
About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

Steve

More info would get you a better answer

gas or electric?
location? SoCal? Minnesota?
age of water heater?
hard water?
preventative maint or complete neglect?

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best
Last shower after multiples? or?

When I get hot showers they are fine (temp + time)
first shower of the day? after long recovery?

cheers
Bob

On Feb 12, 4:59*pm, Ernie Willson wrote:
Are dip tubes normally replaceable? Mine is shot and a plumber told me I
had to replace the whole heater to solve the problem. I sure would like
to just replace one part.

EJ in NJ



Really easy task. You need another plumber, if that's the advice he
gave you. I got mine for around $12-15 from a plumbing specialty
store. I have never seen them at the big box hardware stores.

JK

David Nebenzahl wrote:
On 2/12/2009 4:08 PM HeyBub spake thus:

Huh? The water's not hot enough. There's a thermostat available.

What's the most sensible first step?

OP says: "I also seem to remember the hot water being hotter in the
past." Didja miss that?

No, I didn't. But thanks for asking.

Shall I take from your declining to answer the question: "What's the most
sensible first step?" that in no case should one check the thermostat?

On 2/12/2009 8:40 PM HeyBub spake thus:

David Nebenzahl wrote:

On 2/12/2009 4:08 PM HeyBub spake thus:

Huh? The water's not hot enough. There's a thermostat available.

What's the most sensible first step?

OP says: "I also seem to remember the hot water being hotter in the
past." Didja miss that?

No, I didn't. But thanks for asking.

Shall I take from your declining to answer the question: "What's the most
sensible first step?" that in no case should one check the thermostat?

No, you're right there. Guess it's possible that someone might have
turned down the control.


--
Personally, I like Vista, but I probably won't use it. I like it
because it generates considerable business for me in consulting and
upgrades. As long as there is hardware and software out there that
doesn't work, I stay in business. Incidentally, my company motto is
"If this stuff worked, you wouldn't need me".

- lifted from sci.electronics.repair

On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 10:43:14 -0800 (PST), wrote:

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get
hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a
warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?


Steve

That's the symptoms mine had before it died. Get ready. You can
flush it out and see if it improves.

David Nebenzahl wrote:

Huh? The water's not hot enough. There's a thermostat available.

What's the most sensible first step?

OP says: "I also seem to remember the hot water being hotter in the
past." Didja miss that?

No, I didn't. But thanks for asking.

Shall I take from your declining to answer the question: "What's the
most sensible first step?" that in no case should one check the
thermostat?

No, you're right there. Guess it's possible that someone might have
turned down the control.

Happened to me. Somebody turned down the thermostat ( or it just died of
shame).

I blamed the cat.

Fair enough. There must always be more to the story. It is a gas water
heater (40 gal...I think) of builder grade. The water heater is the
original from when the house was built in 2001. Ihave to admit, I have
been int the house for 3 years and have not had it serviced. I live
alone so there are no multiple shower issues. I don't know exactly how
hard the water is here in Georgia. It's not the worst I've seen, but
not the best either. After thinking about it some more, the water has
been a lot hotter in the past. Enough to scold you. But now, just hot
enough for a shower.


Steve


Ransley....please do not reply!



More info would get you a better answer

gas or electric?
location? *SoCal? *Minnesota?
age of water heater?
hard water?
preventative maint or complete neglect?

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best

Last shower after multiples? or?

When I get hot showers they are fine (temp + time)

first shower of the day? *after long recovery?

cheers
Bob

On Feb 12, 7:05*pm, Bubba wrote:
On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 17:59:04 -0500, Ernie Willson

wrote:
Are dip tubes normally replaceable? Mine is shot and a plumber told me I
had to replace the whole heater to solve the problem. I sure would like
to just replace one part.

EJ in NJ

Oh my. It appears your plumber told you just a slight little white
lie. Shame on him. Dip tubes are EASILY replaceable. While doing it,
you may wish to replace the anode rod too. And by all means, if you
have one of those stupid plastic drain valves in the bottom of the
tank, rip it out and put in a new brass drain valve while you are at
it.
All this can be done without soldering now with the available
compression fittings and flexible hoses.

Very true, but a threaded connection of 10-15 years might require some
large tools and a helper to break loose. I did do all of this stuff,
as well as replacing the T/P valve, to an 18 year old water heater but
needed a 3/4" drive breaker bar and a helper to get the anode rod out
(my 1/2" drive breaker bar was flexing alarmingly, and I didn't feel
like testing it to failure.) My basin wrench was showing similar
signs of abuse after removing the drain valve. This is why in my
previous post I suggested not attempting this unless one could
comfortably replace the heater on short notice. I got lucky, but I
knew I was taking a risk.

That said, my heater should be good for another 5-6 years now, and
when it eventually dies I'll be able to transfer the brass ball-type
drain valve over to its replacement, making preventative flushing much
easier and less risky.

nate

On Feb 13, 6:03*am, wrote:
Fair enough. There must always be more to the story. It is a gas water
heater (40 gal...I think) of builder grade. The water heater is the
original from when the house was built in 2001. Ihave to admit, I have
been int the house for 3 years and have not had it serviced. I live
alone so there are no multiple shower issues. I don't know exactly how
hard the water is here in Georgia. It's not the worst I've seen, but
not the best either. After thinking about it some more, the water has
been a lot hotter in the past. Enough to scold you. But now, just hot
enough for a shower.

Steve


Steve-

My best guess from your expanded description would be

attempt to flush sediment from drain valve, try this first...you might
get lucky
replace dip tub which I find to be a scary job since I've only done a
couple
(& anode while you're at it but anode replacement only extend life not
improve w/h performance)

I'd bet a little more on the dip tube being the problem since the
water heater behavior seems to be random / erratic.

A w/h new in 2001 isn't exactly a "oldster" but it really depends on
local water chemistry. If there are older homes using the same water
ask around.

The few heaters that I replaced in Orange County, SoCal were pretty
old or VERY old 15, 17, 24, all over 10 years excpet ......one bad
one at 3 years!

cheers
Bob

On Fri, 13 Feb 2009 06:22:49 -0800 (PST), N8N
wrote:

On Feb 12, 7:05Â*pm, Bubba wrote:
On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 17:59:04 -0500, Ernie Willson

wrote:
Are dip tubes normally replaceable? Mine is shot and a plumber told me I
had to replace the whole heater to solve the problem. I sure would like
to just replace one part.

EJ in NJ

Oh my. It appears your plumber told you just a slight little white
lie. Shame on him. Dip tubes are EASILY replaceable. While doing it,
you may wish to replace the anode rod too. And by all means, if you
have one of those stupid plastic drain valves in the bottom of the
tank, rip it out and put in a new brass drain valve while you are at
it.
All this can be done without soldering now with the available
compression fittings and flexible hoses.

Very true, but a threaded connection of 10-15 years might require some
large tools and a helper to break loose. I did do all of this stuff,
as well as replacing the T/P valve, to an 18 year old water heater but
needed a 3/4" drive breaker bar and a helper to get the anode rod out
(my 1/2" drive breaker bar was flexing alarmingly, and I didn't feel
like testing it to failure.) My basin wrench was showing similar
signs of abuse after removing the drain valve. This is why in my
previous post I suggested not attempting this unless one could
comfortably replace the heater on short notice. I got lucky, but I
knew I was taking a risk.

That said, my heater should be good for another 5-6 years now, and
when it eventually dies I'll be able to transfer the brass ball-type
drain valve over to its replacement, making preventative flushing much
easier and less risky.

nate
And if you are replacing the dip tube, get the one with the ? hook on
the bottom - called a "turbulator" and you won't get deposits in the
bottom neerly as quickly.

I am with the plumber on this by the time you replace the dip tube,
anode/s and flush the tank likely requiring a new drain valve... If
your paying the plumber you will hate him if it leaks or fails to heat
well or starts leaking in the next year.

will have paid plumber a lot.

better to replace tank its a guaranteed fix

If your doing all this DIY its still marginal but parts arent that
costly. so your only out your time and not X hours of labor at what 80
bucks a hour?

On Thu, 12 Feb 2009 10:43:14 -0800 (PST), wrote:

About 1 out of every 4 or 5 showers is lukewarm at best. When I get

All the time, or at its hottest.

hot showers they are fine (temp + time). I have tried to pay attention
to weather temperatures to determine if it might be a factor. But, a

It's not the weather.

The water sits in the heater until it gets hot, unless the family is
using a lot of hot water. You don't mentino how many others use the
hot water.

warmer day does not always mean a hot shower. I also seem to remember
the hot water being hotter in the past. Is it possible that my water
heater is dying a slow death?

I've had water faucets that turn off by themselves even though they're
not designed to. Maybe something has effected your thermostat, or
like someone said, maybe there is an open circuit in one element.

YEAH, YOU SHOULD HAVE SAID GAS OR ELECTRIC. SOMETHING MADE ME ASSUME
ELECTRIC AND i WASTED TIME WRITING SOME OF WHAT FOLLOWS. bUT i'M
POSTING ANYHOE. tO HELP YOU REMEMBER NEXT TIME TO GIVE THE IMPORTANT
DETAILS.


It was some trouble, but I cut my 10 year old electric water heater
open after I took it out, before I threw it away.

There were almost no deposits in the bottom of the tank. Just 1/2"
deep at the center of the bowl-shaped bottom, and maybe 6" in
diameter, and of course at the edge the depth was almost zero. It was
6 or 7 inches from the bottom to the heating element, so at the rate I
was going, I wouldn't have hit the heating element for over 100 years.

I live in Baltiomre where our water comes from 3 reservoirs that
collect from the watershed of the streams they were built on, from the
rain. I don't know how much would be found in a water heater in
another location.

Whatever you find, you'll know for next time how great a problem
sediment is.

I didn't understand the to do over turning up the thermostat. Seems
like a good idea to me, although if the thermostat is erratic like you
seem to say, can those things stick at the contact points, or stick
open. At any rate, maybe just replace the thermostat.

A lot of water heaters have two elements and two thermostats, a cover
near the top and anotehr near the bottom of the heater. If you have
that, you should do some testing with a multimeter (careful, it's
220Volts) to figure out where the problem is. My previous wh had a
red light that went on when the top element was running, but the new
one from what seems like the same maker doesn't have this. Instead
they filled the area with styrofoam for insulation.


Steve