Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

On Feb 4, 8:36*am, " wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? * I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

Check here, lots of info about geothermal heat pumps
http://tinyurl.com/br4tr2

wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

Had one (recirculating ground loop) in E TN.

Most excellent ( ) -- was 1/3rd operating cost of air-exchange heat
pump it replaced.

Last I knew a couple years ago it was still working and pleasing new
homeowner which would have been about 15 years then...

I had nothing but good experience personally.

Oklahoma State University and TVA (TN Valley Authority) were two of best
information sources when was looking but I've not really kept up but I'd
suggest trying there.

Water Furnace (Canadian) was the manufacturer of our unit--they have one
of best reputations; I don't know anything specific about others for
comparisons.

--

On Feb 4, 8:36 am, " wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have one.

You need to find out if they are the "Air Transfer" heat pumps or if
they are actually geothermal heat pumps. That must be a hell of a big
house for three of them. I would want to see the electricity usage for
the last couple of winters before I would buy such a place.

Mine is an Air Transfer heat pump and it does not do a good job
heating the house when the temps get down in 20's. It uses a hell of a
lot of electricity too.

For cooling the house in the summer it uses less electricity than when
I used two window air conditioners.

Before next winter, I will be looking at trying to get a better
primary heat source for my house. I will see if the Oil furnace that
is still in the basement can still be hooked up to the existing heat
pump unit. I might be able to use the oil furnace as a back-up for the
heat pump and have it kick on when the temps get down to 30 degrees or
so.

David

On Feb 4, 7:36*am, " wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? * I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have no experiance with them. I would want to see utility and repair
bills, have the system reviewed by his installer maintenance guy and
someone else. I have heard of units poorly designed, maybe undersized
that never gave full comfort without expensive electric resistance
heat. I would want a home owner guarntee of some sort of performance
guide line. So I would know I would not need additional AC or
expensive heating, or a wood stove. His utility bills should tell all
but maybe they take 65f in winter and 82f in summer instead of running
it, the seller wont tell you all. Is there a well used wood stove
there.

On Feb 4, 9:14*am, Van Chocstraw
wrote:
wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? * I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I can tell you that they take quite a bit of electricity to run even
though the heat is free.

--
//--------------------\\
* * * * Van Chocstraw
*\\--------------------//


Which is nonsense. Geothermal may be expensive to install, but the
amount of electricity they take doesn't change the fact that they are
low cost to operate compared to nat gas, oil, electric, etc.

On Feb 4, 11:25*am, hibb wrote:
On Feb 4, 8:36 am, " wrote:

Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? * I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have one.

You need to find out if they are the "Air Transfer" heat pumps or if
they are actually geothermal heat pumps.

He said geothermal, which is NOT a traditonal air exchange heat pump.



That must be a hell of a big
house for three of them. I would want to see the electricity usage for
the last couple of winters before I would buy such a place.


Who the hell cares? Would it be so much better if it was heated with
oil, regardless of the size? I'd be happy to buy a house that was
fairly valued overall, with a geothermal system.


Mine is an Air Transfer heat pump and it does not do a good job
heating the house when the temps get down in 20's. It uses a hell of a
lot of electricity too.

No ****? Did you check the electric bills for the last 2 winters
before you bought a place with a heat pump and 20 deg winters?



For cooling the house in the summer it uses less electricity than when
I used two window air conditioners.

Before next winter, I will be looking at trying to get a better
primary heat source for my house. I will see if the Oil furnace that
is still in the basement can still be hooked up to the existing heat
pump unit. I might be able to use the oil furnace as a back-up for the
heat pump and have it kick on when the temps get down to 30 degrees or
so.

David

On Feb 4, 11:48*am, ransley wrote:
On Feb 4, 7:36*am, " wrote:

Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? * I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have no experiance with them. I would want to see utility and repair
bills, have the system reviewed by his installer maintenance guy and
someone else. I have heard of units poorly designed, maybe undersized
that never gave full comfort without expensive electric resistance
heat. I would want a home owner guarntee of some sort of performance
guide line. So I would know I would not need additional AC or
expensive heating, or a wood stove. His utility bills should tell all
but maybe they take 65f in winter and 82f in summer instead of running
it, the seller wont tell you all. Is there a well used wood stove
there.

Good grief! This from a guy that rants on the virtues of tankless
water heaters? What the hell is so controversial about the operating
costs of geothermal? Sure, they are more expensive to install, but
if he's getting a house with it, it's a non-issue. Unless you want
to argue that heat pumps are a poor choice with 50 deg water.

wrote in message
...
On Feb 4, 11:48 am, ransley wrote:
On Feb 4, 7:36 am, " wrote:

Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have no experiance with them. I would want to see utility and repair
bills, have the system reviewed by his installer maintenance guy and
someone else. I have heard of units poorly designed, maybe undersized
that never gave full comfort without expensive electric resistance
heat. I would want a home owner guarntee of some sort of performance
guide line. So I would know I would not need additional AC or
expensive heating, or a wood stove. His utility bills should tell all
but maybe they take 65f in winter and 82f in summer instead of running
it, the seller wont tell you all. Is there a well used wood stove
there.

Good grief! This from a guy that rants on the virtues of tankless
water heaters? What the hell is so controversial about the operating
costs of geothermal? Sure, they are more expensive to install, but
if he's getting a house with it, it's a non-issue. Unless you want
to argue that heat pumps are a poor choice with 50 deg water.

My Waterfurnace units (2 for approx 4000 sq. ft.) have been in service for
15 years. Electricity cost is well below neighbor who has standard heat pump
and smaller home.
Also, geo's pre-heat hot water so cost for hot H2O is down.

On Wed, 4 Feb 2009 05:36:16 -0800 (PST), "
wrote:

Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I know of a geothermal system just installed this summer. You get
a reduced electricity rate for the separate electric meter used with a
geothermal system. This particular system cost about $20,000 but
you do get a one time large tax break.

The first winter bill was $30. The last bill $50. This is 3500
square foot ranch including the basement in lower Michigan
where temps have been in single digits for quite some time now.

The house was formally heated with fuel oil at a cost of $3000 a
year. Total geothermal heating and cooling cost for a year are
projected to be around $500

On Feb 4, 12:51*pm, wrote:
On Feb 4, 11:48*am, ransley wrote:

On Feb 4, 7:36*am, " wrote:

Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? * I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have no experiance with them. I would want to see utility and repair
bills, have the system reviewed by his installer maintenance guy and
someone else. I have heard of units poorly designed, maybe undersized
that never gave full comfort without expensive electric resistance
heat. I would want a home owner guarntee of some sort of performance
guide line. So I would know I would not need additional AC or
expensive heating, or a wood stove. His utility bills should tell all
but maybe they take 65f in winter and 82f in summer instead of running
it, the seller wont tell you all. Is there a well used wood stove
there.

Good grief! * This from a guy that rants on the virtues of tankless
water heaters? *What the hell is so controversial about the operating
costs of geothermal? * Sure, they are more expensive to install, but
if he's getting a house with it, it's a non-issue. * Unless you want
to argue that heat pumps are a poor choice with 50 deg water.

Do you have a tankless WH, I guess no. I thought I was pointing out to
be sure it works right, improper instals dont, but you never heard of
that?

On Feb 4, 8:36*am, " wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? * I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

Check www.waterfurnace.com This is a great site for all things geo
with links to other sites as well.
WaterFurnace is based out of Ft. Wayne, Indiana.

"Bubba" wrote in message
...


ransley..........you're a ****ing idiot...........and you still havent
learned to spell.
Bubba

"havent" ? Haven't you learned punctuation yet?

Google Climatemaster. Highest Seer in the business. Variable
speed drives. Massive savings, much quieter, much cleaner.

http://www.climatemaster.com/

We are converting every school we own as fast as money and time
allow.



--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




wrote in message
...
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house
with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

hibb wrote in news:23e3ba03-0926-4361-b948-
:

On Feb 4, 8:36 am, " wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have one.

You have one what? Since subject is geothermal, you have a geothermal?
But below you say you have an Air Transfer heat pump. You have both? Just
what are you saying?


You need to find out if they are the "Air Transfer" heat pumps or if
they are actually geothermal heat pumps. That must be a hell of a big
house for three of them. I would want to see the electricity usage for
the last couple of winters before I would buy such a place.

Mine is an Air Transfer heat pump and it does not do a good job
heating the house when the temps get down in 20's.

This is ancient info. That's why they have heat strips. I personally
found it did not use much electricity since the heat strips rarely kicked
on. Depends on your climate and how well your system is running so the
heat strips don't kick on prematurely. Also, if you have a tendency to
bump it up more than a couple of degrees at a time instead of stages
that'll light up the strips.

It uses a hell of a
lot of electricity too.

For cooling the house in the summer it uses less electricity than when
I used two window air conditioners.

Before next winter, I will be looking at trying to get a better
primary heat source for my house. I will see if the Oil furnace that
is still in the basement can still be hooked up to the existing heat
pump unit. I might be able to use the oil furnace as a back-up for the
heat pump and have it kick on when the temps get down to 30 degrees or
so.

David

Bubba wrote in
:

On Wed, 4 Feb 2009 12:05:31 -0800 (PST), ransley
wrote:

On Feb 4, 12:51*pm, wrote:
On Feb 4, 11:48*am, ransley wrote:

On Feb 4, 7:36*am, " wrote:

Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? * I looked at a house
with three of these things and I really dont know much about
them.

I have no experiance with them. I would want to see utility and
repair bills, have the system reviewed by his installer
maintenance guy and someone else. I have heard of units poorly
designed, maybe undersized that never gave full comfort without
expensive electric resistance heat. I would want a home owner
guarntee of some sort of performance guide line. So I would know I
would not need additional AC or expensive heating, or a wood
stove. His utility bills should tell all but maybe they take 65f
in winter and 82f in summer instead of running it, the seller wont
tell you all. Is there a well used wood stove there.

Good grief! * This from a guy that rants on the virtues of tankless
water heaters? *What the hell is so controversial about the
operating costs of geothermal? * Sure, they are more expensive to
install, but if he's getting a house with it, it's a non-issue. *
Unless you want to argue that heat pumps are a poor choice with 50
deg water.

Do you have a tankless WH, I guess no. I thought I was pointing out to
be sure it works right, improper instals dont, but you never heard of
that?

hehe. The guy has a question about Geo and ransley turns it into a
tankless water heater. You flippin dork-meat-head.
The only thing installed wrong is your brain. Someone stuck it in your
arse.
Bubba

[Bubba is wooing Ransley again. He's in the mood.]

Bubba wrote in
:

On Wed, 4 Feb 2009 08:48:31 -0800 (PST), ransley
wrote:

On Feb 4, 7:36*am, " wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? * I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have no experiance with them. I would want to see utility and repair
bills, have the system reviewed by his installer maintenance guy and
someone else. I have heard of units poorly designed, maybe undersized
that never gave full comfort without expensive electric resistance
heat. I would want a home owner guarntee of some sort of performance
guide line. So I would know I would not need additional AC or
expensive heating, or a wood stove. His utility bills should tell all
but maybe they take 65f in winter and 82f in summer instead of running
it, the seller wont tell you all. Is there a well used wood stove
there.

ransley..........you're a ****ing idiot...........and you still havent
learned to spell.
Bubba

[Trying the dirty talk approach]

On Feb 4, 2:48 pm, wrote:
On Feb 4, 11:25 am, hibb wrote:

On Feb 4, 8:36 am, " wrote:

Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have one.

You need to find out if they are the "Air Transfer" heat pumps or if
they are actually geothermal heat pumps.

He said geothermal, which is NOT a traditonal air exchange heat pump.

That must be a hell of a big
house for three of them. I would want to see the electricity usage for
the last couple of winters before I would buy such a place.

Who the hell cares? Would it be so much better if it was heated with
oil, regardless of the size? I'd be happy to buy a house that was
fairly valued overall, with a geothermal system.



Mine is an Air Transfer heat pump and it does not do a good job
heating the house when the temps get down in 20's. It uses a hell of a
lot of electricity too.

No ****? Did you check the electric bills for the last 2 winters
before you bought a place with a heat pump and 20 deg winters?



For cooling the house in the summer it uses less electricity than when
I used two window air conditioners.

Before next winter, I will be looking at trying to get a better
primary heat source for my house. I will see if the Oil furnace that
is still in the basement can still be hooked up to the existing heat
pump unit. I might be able to use the oil furnace as a back-up for the
heat pump and have it kick on when the temps get down to 30 degrees or
so.

David

What's your problem dude? Can't you write a post without the bull****
insults?

On Feb 4, 9:04 pm, Red Green wrote:
hibb wrote in news:23e3ba03-0926-4361-b948-
:

On Feb 4, 8:36 am, " wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house with
three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have one.

You have one what? Since subject is geothermal, you have a geothermal?
But below you say you have an Air Transfer heat pump. You have both? Just
what are you saying?

Sorry, I should have been more clear. I have an Air Transfer heat pump
that my idiot nephew in law talked me into letting him install 3 years
ago.

I guess the waste of money on this thing has made it a bit of a hot
button issue for me so I must have seen "heat pump" and jumped right
in.





You need to find out if they are the "Air Transfer" heat pumps or if
they are actually geothermal heat pumps. That must be a hell of a big
house for three of them. I would want to see the electricity usage for
the last couple of winters before I would buy such a place.

Mine is an Air Transfer heat pump and it does not do a good job
heating the house when the temps get down in 20's.

This is ancient info. That's why they have heat strips. I personally
found it did not use much electricity since the heat strips rarely kicked
on. Depends on your climate and how well your system is running so the
heat strips don't kick on prematurely. Also, if you have a tendency to
bump it up more than a couple of degrees at a time instead of stages
that'll light up the strips.

It uses a hell of a

lot of electricity too.

For cooling the house in the summer it uses less electricity than when
I used two window air conditioners.

Before next winter, I will be looking at trying to get a better
primary heat source for my house. I will see if the Oil furnace that
is still in the basement can still be hooked up to the existing heat
pump unit. I might be able to use the oil furnace as a back-up for the
heat pump and have it kick on when the temps get down to 30 degrees or
so.

David

hibb wrote in
:

On Feb 4, 9:04 pm, Red Green wrote:
hibb wrote in news:23e3ba03-0926-4361-b948-
:

On Feb 4, 8:36 am, " wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house
with three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have one.

You have one what? Since subject is geothermal, you have a
geothermal? But below you say you have an Air Transfer heat pump. You
have both? Just what are you saying?

Sorry, I should have been more clear. I have an Air Transfer heat pump
that my idiot nephew in law talked me into letting him install 3 years
ago.

I guess the waste of money on this thing has made it a bit of a hot
button issue for me so I must have seen "heat pump" and jumped right
in.


I was brought up in the northeast and never even saw a heat pump until I
was 39 (errr, correction, 50). First time I owned a place that had one
was NC. I swore the thing was broke. Frikkin air is not even a hundred
degrees coming out! :-) Takes some getting used to.

Heat pumps have their place and can be a money saver providing they a

- Used in the right climate.
- Properly sized
- Have a properly matched coil
- Have a proper air handler.
- Have proper ductwork
- Been properly maintained.
- Not being used when it's near it's last leg.

If any of these are out of whack the whole thing will appear to be a
lemon. I've seen units where the air filter is never/rarely changed.
Thing just burns itself up overworking. Then there's the ones who run it
without a filter. Frikkin coil is like so crudded up you can grow veggies
in it.

I am no HVAC guy by any means. I'm more HAC(k) when it comes to this.
Just passing along what I've learned from an experienced 25yr HVAC
company owner. There's some experienced HVAC people in this group who
would be quick to correct anything I've said that is BS though.

Where are you located? Other people around have heat pumps that seem to
work OK?





You need to find out if they are the "Air Transfer" heat pumps or
if they are actually geothermal heat pumps. That must be a hell of
a big house for three of them. I would want to see the electricity
usage for the last couple of winters before I would buy such a
place.

Mine is an Air Transfer heat pump and it does not do a good job
heating the house when the temps get down in 20's.

This is ancient info. That's why they have heat strips. I personally
found it did not use much electricity since the heat strips rarely
kicked on. Depends on your climate and how well your system is
running so the heat strips don't kick on prematurely. Also, if you
have a tendency to bump it up more than a couple of degrees at a time
instead of stages that'll light up the strips.

It uses a hell of a

lot of electricity too.

For cooling the house in the summer it uses less electricity than
when I used two window air conditioners.

Before next winter, I will be looking at trying to get a better
primary heat source for my house. I will see if the Oil furnace
that is still in the basement can still be hooked up to the
existing heat pump unit. I might be able to use the oil furnace as
a back-up for the heat pump and have it kick on when the temps get
down to 30 degrees or so.

David

On Feb 4, 10:27 pm, Red Green wrote:
hibb wrote :



On Feb 4, 9:04 pm, Red Green wrote:
hibb wrote in news:23e3ba03-0926-4361-b948-
:

On Feb 4, 8:36 am, " wrote:
Anybody know about geothermal heat pumps? I looked at a house
with three of these things and I really dont know much about them.

I have one.

You have one what? Since subject is geothermal, you have a
geothermal? But below you say you have an Air Transfer heat pump. You
have both? Just what are you saying?

Sorry, I should have been more clear. I have an Air Transfer heat pump
that my idiot nephew in law talked me into letting him install 3 years
ago.

I guess the waste of money on this thing has made it a bit of a hot
button issue for me so I must have seen "heat pump" and jumped right
in.

I was brought up in the northeast and never even saw a heat pump until I
was 39 (errr, correction, 50). First time I owned a place that had one
was NC. I swore the thing was broke. Frikkin air is not even a hundred
degrees coming out! :-) Takes some getting used to.

Heat pumps have their place and can be a money saver providing they a

- Used in the right climate.
- Properly sized
- Have a properly matched coil
- Have a proper air handler.
- Have proper ductwork
- Been properly maintained.
- Not being used when it's near it's last leg.

If any of these are out of whack the whole thing will appear to be a
lemon. I've seen units where the air filter is never/rarely changed.
Thing just burns itself up overworking. Then there's the ones who run it
without a filter. Frikkin coil is like so crudded up you can grow veggies
in it.

I am no HVAC guy by any means. I'm more HAC(k) when it comes to this.
Just passing along what I've learned from an experienced 25yr HVAC
company owner. There's some experienced HVAC people in this group who
would be quick to correct anything I've said that is BS though.

Where are you located? Other people around have heat pumps that seem to
work OK?


I'm in lower Michigan about 30 mile north of Indiana.

I don't know if anyone around here has an air transfer heat pump. My
niece's husband (now ex husband) had a reputation for being a good
heating/air conditioning guy. They lived down in Indiana and I was
getting tired of paying so much for heating oil for the old stove. He
recommended a heat pump. Due to all the crap he has pulled on my niece
after she caught him with the neighbor lady, I don't think I want him
around any more.

What I really need is a good back-up system for when it gets under 40
degrees. I think the air transfer heat pump will work fine at higher
temps than that. My plan right now is before next winter to get the
local guy out that always worked on my old oil furnace and see if it
can be hooked back up in the system or at least see what he
recommends.

BTW, here is exactly what I have. I live in an old farm house that was
first built in 1910 but has been added on to several times since. The
downstairs has a great room with the living room and kitchen. Off that
is the bed room and off that is the bathroom/laundry room.

The pellet stove does a good job heating the living room and kitchen
but not enough heat gets to the bedroom and bathroom. Also, the pellet
stove need service from time to time. I moved the thermostat for the
heat pump to the bedroom so the heat from the pellet stove would not
effect it.

If I could depend on the pellet stove all the time, I would not have
as much of a problem. But it breaks down sometimes when I am not home
or in the middle of the night. Last night I came home about 7:30 to
find that the pellet stove had malfunctioned. It was about 7 degrees
outside and only 58 degrees in the living room and 63 degrees in the
bedroom where the heat pump thermostat is. By the time I got the
pellet stove running again and got the house back up to a comfortable
temp, it was after midnight.

The think I like about the heat pump is that it is a damn good and
efficient air conditioning unit. Which is why I want to keep it so I
don't lose my investment in that end. I think that if I had my oil
furnace working again, it would keep the pellet stove from having to
work so much and the pellet stove would help keep the furnace oil
usage down to an affordable level.

David

wrote:
....
Check www.waterfurnace.com This is a great site for all things geo
with links to other sites as well.
WaterFurnace is based out of Ft. Wayne, Indiana.

But they're a totally-owned subsidiary of a Canadian corporation,
WaterFurnace Renewable Energy, Inc.’s (formerly WFI Industries Ltd.)

From annual report--

"The Company is incorporated under the laws of Canada. Its subsidiary
companies, WaterFurnace International, Inc. (WaterFurnace) and
LoopMaster International, Inc. (LoopMaster), are incorporated in Indiana."

• Current Trading Price on the Toronto Stock Exchange
Trading Symbol = WFI
CUSIP Number = 9415EQ108

which is why I have referred to them as Canadian.

Why, specifically, they have chosen this corporate organization I
haven't been able to discern although I presume there is a tax advantage.

My experience w/ their distributors, approved/registered installer and
factory support was excellent and recommend them and their product based
on that as well worth exploring.

--