Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??

Red

On Dec 28, 3:05 pm, Red wrote:
....
... 2 PT 4x4x8's ... laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??
....

Pretty much in those circumstances, yes, not surprised. It's pretty
much useless for insect infestation afaict, only slightly enhanced
over untreated for wet.

--

Red wrote:
Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??

Red

Apparently the change in pressure treating chemicals to less toxic
materials might be the problem. Also may be a good idea to kill those
termites before they start munching on your house

"Red" wrote in message
...
Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??


Is there a warrantee on that wood?

On Dec 28, 4:41*pm, Frank wrote:


Apparently the change in pressure treating chemicals to less toxic
materials might be the problem. *Also may be a good idea to kill those
termites before they start munching on your house

The house perimeter has been termite treated. The wood pile is 60'
away from it.

My concern though is acq lumber used for fence posts and storage
buildings where it is in contact with the ground.

Red

".. 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!

obviously NOT the grade for "Ground Contact"

"Bob F" wrote in message
...



Is there a warrantee on that wood?



Unless these jokers have changed that warranty, only with original receipt
and those stupid little tags. Bet you never read the fine print!

So this guy is half way there.

Colbyt

Red wrote:
On Dec 28, 4:41 pm, Frank wrote:

Apparently the change in pressure treating chemicals to less toxic
materials might be the problem. Also may be a good idea to kill those
termites before they start munching on your house

The house perimeter has been termite treated. The wood pile is 60'
away from it.

My concern though is acq lumber used for fence posts and storage
buildings where it is in contact with the ground.

Red

I've got old stuff, in the ground that has held up for over 30 years.
It even survived a termite infestation where wood piles and stumps were
being eaten but not my flights of steps in the back yard. Neighbors
home was attacked and his treatment killed the nest(s).

I am somewhat familiar with the treatment chemicals and believe they
eliminated the old arsenicals that are highly toxic in favor of less
toxic copper or chlorinated organics. As others suggest, there may be
different grades of new lumber and maybe none have the durability of the
old treatments.

Frank

"Rudy" wrote in message
...

obviously NOT the grade for "Ground Contact"

This probably is the problem. They did not buy .40 ground contact lumber,
and bought .25 for above ground.

"Colbyt" wrote in message
m...

"Bob F" wrote in message
...



Is there a warrantee on that wood?



Unless these jokers have changed that warranty, only with original receipt and
those stupid little tags. Bet you never read the fine print!

So this guy is half way there.

I've got a collection of those tags.

On Dec 28, 5:16*pm, "Rudy" wrote:


obviously NOT the grade for "Ground Contact"

Yes they are, I just checked the labels. It says "ground contact ACQ .
40" Also states "lifetime limited warranty" but does not state what
limits are meant by "limited". Even if they replace them, I don't
know if I would trust using them again in a ground contact situation.

Red

"Red" wrote in message
...
On Dec 28, 5:16 pm, "Rudy" wrote:


obviously NOT the grade for "Ground Contact"

Yes they are, I just checked the labels. It says "ground contact ACQ .
40" Also states "lifetime limited warranty" but does not state what
limits are meant by "limited". Even if they replace them, I don't
know if I would trust using them again in a ground contact situation.

************************************************** ***************

It doesn't sound like a really high risk usage. Let them replace them.

On Dec 28, 3:05 pm, Red wrote:
Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??

Red

Thanks for the info. I have some PT wood left over from a fence job
that I have on my patio.

I will move them since they may be a "termite attractant."

Andy

On Mon 29 Dec 2008 04:37:30a, WhiteTea told us...

On Dec 28, 3:05 pm, Red wrote:
Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??

Red

Thanks for the info. I have some PT wood left over from a fence job
that I have on my patio.

I will move them since they may be a "termite attractant."

Andy


That seems odd. Are there different types of pressure treated wood? Some
years ago we had a raised bed built surrounding a patio using pressure
treated 6x6's laid directly on the ground, stacked to create the depth,
then filled with soil and planted. In 8 years of living there we never had
any deterioration. The only change was a darkening of the wood.

--
Wayne Boatwright
(correct the spelling of "geemail" to reply)
************************************************** **********************
Date: Monday, 12(XII)/29(XXIX)/08(MMVIII)
************************************************** **********************
Countdown till New Year's Eve
1dys 19hrs 19mins
************************************************** **********************
I don't want the world, I just want your half.
************************************************** **********************

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 11:45:38 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
wrote:

-snip-
That seems odd. Are there different types of pressure treated wood? Some
years ago we had a raised bed built surrounding a patio using pressure
treated 6x6's laid directly on the ground, stacked to create the depth,
then filled with soil and planted. In 8 years of living there we never had
any deterioration. The only change was a darkening of the wood.

Sure are. Even 20 yrs ago there was 'ok' PT and 'PT that wouldn't
die'. I don't remember the spec differences, but I remmeber checking
labels.

I don't remember when the new style PT started- 6-8yrs ago?- but it is
apparently inferior to all the old stuff. [unless your goal is to eat
hardware, which the new stuff does]

Jim

On Dec 29, 5:45*am, Wayne Boatwright
wrote:
On Mon 29 Dec 2008 04:37:30a, WhiteTea told us...





On Dec 28, 3:05 pm, Red wrote:
Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. *I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. *They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. *I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??

Red

Thanks for the info. I have some PT wood left over from a fence job
that I have on my patio.

I will move them since they may be a "termite attractant."

Andy

That seems odd. *Are there different types of pressure treated wood? *Some
years ago we had a raised bed built surrounding a patio using pressure
treated 6x6's laid directly on the ground, stacked to create the depth,
then filled with soil and planted. *In 8 years of living there we never had
any deterioration. *The only change was a darkening of the wood.

--
* * * * * * * * * * * * * * Wayne Boatwright * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * (correct the spelling of "geemail" to reply) * * * * * * *
************************************************** **********************
Date: * * * * * * Monday, 12(XII)/29(XXIX)/08(MMVIII)
************************************************** **********************
* * * * * * * * * * *Countdown till New Year's Eve * * * * * * * * * *
* * * * * * * * * * * * * *1dys 19hrs 19mins * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
************************************************** **********************
* * * * * * *I don't want the world, I just want your half. * * * * * *
************************************************** **********************- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

There was CCA Copper Chromium Arsenic, the new stuff eats metal
fasteners except stainless and certain galvanised,

On Dec 28, 3:05*pm, Red wrote:
Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. *I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. *They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. *I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??

Red

There are different grades of wood, maybe it was not treated right,
you have the lablel warranty and reciept? Your city architect or
engineer, free to talk to, may know if better quality is out there
that they use.

"Bob F" wrote in message
...

"Red" wrote in message
...
On Dec 28, 5:16 pm, "Rudy" wrote:


obviously NOT the grade for "Ground Contact"

Yes they are, I just checked the labels. It says "ground contact ACQ .
40" Also states "lifetime limited warranty" but does not state what
limits are meant by "limited". Even if they replace them, I don't
know if I would trust using them again in a ground contact situation.

************************************************** ***************

It doesn't sound like a really high risk usage. Let them replace them.



I just had 250 linear feet of wood fence installed a year ago. The fence
posts are 4x4 PT spaced every four feet. I poured 12"x12"x12" hole for
concrete and the 4x4 sits 8" deep in it. It's hot and humid termite heaven
Miami, I hope they will not rot away in 2 years I would be ****eddddddddd!

MC

Wayne Boatwright wrote:

That seems odd. Are there different types of pressure treated wood?

Sure. Some PT is rated for above ground, some for ground contact, some for
direct burial. It depends on the amount of goop injected...more goop = more
restance + higher price. The wood should be stamped or have a tag telling
the percentage. The normal Home Depot type is as low a percentage as it
gets.

--

dadiOH
____________________________

dadiOH's dandies v3.06...
....a help file of info about MP3s, recording from
LP/cassette and tips & tricks on this and that.
Get it at http://mysite.verizon.net/xico

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:47:41 -0500, "MiamiCuse"
wrote:

I just had 250 linear feet of wood fence installed a year ago. The fence
posts are 4x4 PT spaced every four feet. I poured 12"x12"x12" hole for
concrete and the 4x4 sits 8" deep in it. It's hot and humid termite heaven
Miami, I hope they will not rot away in 2 years I would be ****eddddddddd!

MC

Pour a tad of diesel fuel around base of the posts, and brush a little
at the base of the post.

Telephone poles have creosote for a reason

On Dec 29, 5:38�pm, Oren wrote:
On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:47:41 -0500, "MiamiCuse"

wrote:
I just had 250 linear feet of wood fence installed a year ago. �The fence
posts are 4x4 PT spaced every four feet. �I poured 12"x12"x12" hole for
concrete and the 4x4 sits 8" deep in it. �It's hot and humid termite heaven
Miami, �I hope they will not rot away in 2 years I would be ****eddddddddd!

MC

Pour a tad of diesel fuel around base of the posts, and brush a little
at the base of the post.

Telephone poles have creosote for a reason

creosote is no longer used, its illegal

On Dec 29, 4:46*pm, " wrote:
On Dec 29, 5:38 pm, Oren wrote:

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:47:41 -0500, "MiamiCuse"

wrote:
I just had 250 linear feet of wood fence installed a year ago. The fence
posts are 4x4 PT spaced every four feet. I poured 12"x12"x12" hole for
concrete and the 4x4 sits 8" deep in it. It's hot and humid termite heaven
Miami, I hope they will not rot away in 2 years I would be ****eddddddddd!

MC

Pour a tad of diesel fuel around base of the posts, and brush a little
at the base of the post.

Telephone poles have creosote for a reason

creosote is no longer used, its illegal

Does anyone know what telephone poles use NOW?

On Mon 29 Dec 2008 01:49:54p, dadiOH told us...

Wayne Boatwright wrote:

That seems odd. Are there different types of pressure treated wood?

Sure. Some PT is rated for above ground, some for ground contact, some
for direct burial. It depends on the amount of goop injected...more
goop = more restance + higher price. The wood should be stamped or have
a tag telling the percentage. The normal Home Depot type is as low a
percentage as it gets.


That would explain it. We bought ours from a lumber yard and told them
that the bottom row of 6x6's would be partially imbedded in soil. They
obviously put us onto the right product.

--
Wayne Boatwright
(correct the spelling of "geemail" to reply)
************************************************** **********************
Date: Monday, 12(XII)/29(XXIX)/08(MMVIII)
************************************************** **********************
Countdown till New Year's Eve
1dys 2hrs 3mins
************************************************** **********************
Back to reality now where exactly did I PUT it?
************************************************** **********************

"Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message
...
On Dec 29, 4:46 pm, " wrote:
On Dec 29, 5:38 pm, Oren wrote:

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:47:41 -0500, "MiamiCuse"

wrote:
I just had 250 linear feet of wood fence installed a year ago. The fence
posts are 4x4 PT spaced every four feet. I poured 12"x12"x12" hole for
concrete and the 4x4 sits 8" deep in it. It's hot and humid termite heaven
Miami, I hope they will not rot away in 2 years I would be ****eddddddddd!

MC

Pour a tad of diesel fuel around base of the posts, and brush a little
at the base of the post.

Telephone poles have creosote for a reason

creosote is no longer used, its illegal

Does anyone know what telephone poles use NOW?

************************************************** ********

I believe the guys installing the pole down the street from me a month ago said
the used creosote.

"Bob F" wrote in message
...

"Too_Many_Tools" wrote in message
...
On Dec 29, 4:46 pm, " wrote:
On Dec 29, 5:38 pm, Oren wrote:

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:47:41 -0500, "MiamiCuse"

wrote:
I just had 250 linear feet of wood fence installed a year ago. The fence
posts are 4x4 PT spaced every four feet. I poured 12"x12"x12" hole for
concrete and the 4x4 sits 8" deep in it. It's hot and humid termite heaven
Miami, I hope they will not rot away in 2 years I would be ****eddddddddd!

MC

Pour a tad of diesel fuel around base of the posts, and brush a little
at the base of the post.

Telephone poles have creosote for a reason

creosote is no longer used, its illegal

Does anyone know what telephone poles use NOW?

************************************************** ********

I believe the guys installing the pole down the street from me a month ago
said the used creosote.


I should add, that the bottom of the pole where the creosote was was wrapped in
heavy green plastic, to cut down on transfers to the soil, and I assume, to the
workers.

Please show me any article that shows creosote being illegal or
restricted. Coal tar creosote treatment of wood ties, poles, etc
is not restricted to my knowledge.

--
______________________________
Keep the whole world singing . . . .
DanG (remove the sevens)




wrote in message
...
On Dec 29, 5:38?pm, Oren wrote:
On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 15:47:41 -0500, "MiamiCuse"

wrote:
I just had 250 linear feet of wood fence installed a year ago.
?The fence
posts are 4x4 PT spaced every four feet. ?I poured 12"x12"x12"
hole for
concrete and the 4x4 sits 8" deep in it. ?It's hot and humid
termite heaven
Miami, ?I hope they will not rot away in 2 years I would be
****eddddddddd!

MC

Pour a tad of diesel fuel around base of the posts, and brush a
little
at the base of the post.

Telephone poles have creosote for a reason

creosote is no longer used, its illegal

On Tue, 30 Dec 2008 05:39:34 -0600, "DanG" wrote:

Please show me any article that shows creosote being illegal or
restricted. Coal tar creosote treatment of wood ties, poles, etc
is not restricted to my knowledge.

Google
creosote "restricted use"

Federally [USA] it is a restricted use pesticide- which means that not
just anybody can go buy a gallon and slather it on.

state by state its usage is regulated differently- from outright bans-
to don't use in the water.

Jim

On Tue, 30 Dec 2008 07:17:57 -0500, Jim Elbrecht
wrote:

On Tue, 30 Dec 2008 05:39:34 -0600, "DanG" wrote:

Please show me any article that shows creosote being illegal or
restricted. Coal tar creosote treatment of wood ties, poles, etc
is not restricted to my knowledge.

Google
creosote "restricted use"

Federally [USA] it is a restricted use pesticide- which means that not
just anybody can go buy a gallon and slather it on.

state by state its usage is regulated differently- from outright bans-
to don't use in the water.

Well- maybe not bans. I thought it was banned in NY but it can still
be used on railroad ties and utility poles-
http://www.state.ny.us/governor/press/0726072.html

Jim

on 12/28/2026 12:58 PM (ET) wrote the following:
On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 07:47:22 -0500, Jim Elbrecht
wrote:



Why did you post this message with a date of 2026?

--

Bill
In Hamptonburgh, NY
In the original Orange County. Est. 1683
To email, remove the double zeroes after @

Hey Bill-- it is 2008 where I am. [for a bit]

On Tue, 30 Dec 2008 20:21:03 -0500, wrote:

On Tue, 30 Dec 2008 11:36:12 -0500, Jim Elbrecht

Agent must read something differently than T-bird does. I just hit
reply and it reads as 2008 here.

Jim

On Sun, 28 Dec 2008 13:05:33 -0800 (PST), Red
wrote:

Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??

Red


Treated lumber should last 10 years or more. I wonder if the planks
purchased "missed" the proper treatment.

Phisherman wrote:
On Sun, 28 Dec 2008 13:05:33 -0800 (PST), Red
wrote:

Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??

Red


Treated lumber should last 10 years or more. I wonder if the planks
purchased "missed" the proper treatment.

You are thinking of the old CCA treated lumber which did and still
does last for years. The new ACQ treated lumber is still in the
trial stages.

I wish that I had bought a bunch of the old stuff, and still may if
I can find some somewhere.

--
Robert Allison
Rimshot, Inc.
Georgetown, TX

On Jan 1, 8:08�pm, Robert Allison wrote:
Phisherman wrote:
On Sun, 28 Dec 2008 13:05:33 -0800 (PST), Red
wrote:

Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. �I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. �They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. �I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??

Red

Treated lumber should last 10 years or more. � I wonder if the planks
purchased "missed" the proper treatment.

You are thinking of the old CCA treated lumber which did and still
does last for years. �The new ACQ treated lumber is still in the
trial stages.

I wish that I had bought a bunch of the old stuff, and still may if
I can find some somewhere.

--
Robert Allison
Rimshot, Inc.
Georgetown, TX- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

one day guys in moon suits will be busy nationwide removing treated
wood, it will be asbestos crews, after they run out of asbestos to
remove

just a matter of time

On Jan 1, 5:33*pm, Phisherman wrote:
On Sun, 28 Dec 2008 13:05:33 -0800 (PST), Red
wrote:

Two years ago I had more firewood than would fit under my shed so I
bought 2 PT 4x4x8's from Lowes, laid them on the ground, stacked the
firewood on them, and covered the wood with a tarp. *I just used the
last of the wood (all good BTW) and went to move the 4x4's. *They were
eaten up and rotted from the ground side up. Termite tunnels were
readily apparent.
Two years on the ground, not in it, and they were completely useless!
They still had the tags stapled on the ends so the staples didn't even
have time to rust off. *I knew it wouldn't last as long as the old PT
lumber, but not even 2 years??

Red

Treated lumber should last 10 years or more. * I wonder if the planks
purchased "missed" the proper treatment.

I wonder who's definition of "proper" treatment the manufacturer goes
by? Now days it is common for pressure treatment to pressure the
chemicals some depth into the surface, but not necessarily to the
center. Then the wood commonly develops cracks. If the crack extends
beyond the treated depth, there is nothing to prevent termites &
moisture/rot from getting to the untreated portion of the wood and
hollowing it out. I believe that is what caused the problem I
experienced. Bad thing is that there is no way of telling how
"properly" the lumber is treated without cutting off a portion of it.

Red

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 07:47:22 -0500, Jim Elbrecht
wrote:

On Mon, 29 Dec 2008 11:45:38 GMT, Wayne Boatwright
wrote:

-snip-
That seems odd. Are there different types of pressure treated wood? Some
years ago we had a raised bed built surrounding a patio using pressure
treated 6x6's laid directly on the ground, stacked to create the depth,
then filled with soil and planted. In 8 years of living there we never had
any deterioration. The only change was a darkening of the wood.

Sure are. Even 20 yrs ago there was 'ok' PT and 'PT that wouldn't
die'. I don't remember the spec differences, but I remmeber checking
labels.

I don't remember when the new style PT started- 6-8yrs ago?- but it is
apparently inferior to all the old stuff. [unless your goal is to eat
hardware, which the new stuff does]

Jim


If you go to a marine contractor supply you can get the good old CCA
stuff. Just swear up and down you are using it in salt water.
..80 is pretty good but they go as high as 2.65 CCA. That stuff will be
here when the concrete buildings crumble to dust. I used this for a
deck in Florida where the stringers are actually on/in the dirt.
They are still solid 25 years later.