Donna Ohl writes:

Hi Dave,

Is this what probably happened in my "typical" oven fire?

0. Something (grease perhaps) was on the broil element in one spot
1. The grounded jacket thinned in that one spot, ever so slightly
2. Over time, that one spot cracked, ever so slightly
3. Over time, stress increased on the resistor core encased in concrete
4. At some point, the cantilever stress broke the inside resistive core

I don't think we know why the element failed. Oven elements routinely
get organic stuff (food) splattered or dripped on them, and the usual
result is a bit of smoke as the organics stuff gets burned to carbon or
ash, while the element is completely unhurt.

So, either your element was defective somehow (e.g. a gap in the
insulation somewhere, or it was subjected to some unusual stress at some
point. The initial failure could have been an open resistor core, but
it could equally well have been the core touching the grounded metal
jacket.

By the way, the insulating fill is not concrete - concrete contains lots
of water and doesn't like being red hot. It's some kind of
high-temperature insulator (e.g. a ceramic).

5. I heard a "sound" as the air gap ionized to a conductive plasma
6. The core melted, causing the plasma gap to expand (more sound)
7. The super-heated plasma conductivity extended to the metal jacket
8. The core-to-jacket arc melted the jacket "backward" in a spiral pattern

All of that's possible, though we don't know for certain.

9. I turned off the broiler but that only reduced to half the pressure
10. The other 120v pressure still allowed the plasma to remain heated
11. The plasma arc spiralled backward toward the remaining 120v pressure
12. Opening the house circuit eliminated the pressure & the "fire" went out

Substitute "voltage" for "pressure". Electrical voltage is in many ways
like fluid pressure, but they're not the same thing. This assumes you
turned off the switch, but the switch only interrupts one side of the
240 VAC line.

Yes, turning off the house breaker removed the voltage, and the arc
ceased. Turning off the circuit breaker for the stove alone would have
accomplished the same thing.

Is this what happened?
Did I miss any steps?

We don't know for sure what happened (at least I don't). But the
sequence is plausible.

Dave

On Fri, 10 Oct 2008 12:49:54 -0700 (PDT), wrote:
If all you need is how to replace the element, read Smitty two-bolts
and you'll be done in fifteen minutes.

The WB44T10009 GE broiler element finally arrived (see pic) so we can
continue the oven repair help tutorial.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/donnaohl/2950288617/

Warning to others (that I wish someone would have advised me)!

The hole for the temperature sensor screw in the new GE oven broiler heater
element is way TOO SMALL!

You have to widen the mounting hole in the new oven broiler heating element
for the temperature sensor in order for the screw to take hold.
http://www.flickr.com/photos/donnaohl/2950288625/

The temperature sensor screw itself won't go in no matter how hard you try.
So I had to start with a smaller screw and then take progressively larger
screws to stretch the hole in the new broiler heating element mounting
plate in order to finally fit the original screw in. It has to be just
right though, so be careful as it will not mount if you make the mounting
hole too wide!

On Oct 8, 3:38*am, "PanHandler" wrote:
"Wayne Boatwright" wrote in message

5.250...

On Tue 07 Oct 2008 10:10:56p, PanHandler told us...

I'll let others get into your questions, but the upper element is the
"broil" element. On some ovens with a "preheat" feature the broil
element will also come on to help bring the oven to the "bake"
temperature you have set more quickly, at which time the broil element
will shut off.

Some ovens, including GE IIRC, cycle the broil element while on the "bake"
setting, not just to preheat.

Wasn't aware of that. My 6 month old Frigidaire doesn't.

Comments said "SOME" ovens (use the broiler element to bring the
initial baking function of an oven up to temperature more quickly).
Over some 48 years, two homes and various makes of cooking stoves,
we've had both types.

On Fri, 17 Oct 2008 21:56:12 -0700, Donna Ohl wrote:
The hole for the temperature sensor screw in the new GE oven broiler heater
element is way TOO SMALL!

Longer term oven repair report.

The only major issue is that the stove top gets super hot now, almost to
the point of burning your hands should you touch it, even with just the
bake element on at 450 degrees F.

I don't remember the stove top getting that hot before so I'm wondering if
the new broiler element is somehow causing the bake element to heat up more
than it did before.

Or maybe the "thermostat" (where is it?) is cooked and it's telling the
bake element to heat up too much which might be what broke the broil
element in the first place.

I dont' think the oven wall insulation is still wet nor that the fire
extinguisher powder is causing the oven range top to be too hot, do you?

Anyone ever have a problem with the oven stove top being too hot?

On Oct 8, 3:19*pm, wrote:
On Oct 7, 9:47*pm, Donna Ohl wrote:

Can I just replace the bake element (or is the oven really kaput)?
Can anyone tell me what actually caused the fire (it wasn't food)?http://www.flickr.com/photos/donnaohl/2923845906/)

Listen ditszy,

Save yourself some money and replace the entire stove. You're worrying
your pretty little head over a very common occurrance. Most broil oven
elements only last three to five years so you're lucky you got as much
as you did out of the one you have. When you turned off the heat, in
your blonde moment (probably all the time) you turned it back on or
hit the wrong dial because the arcing would have stopped then and
there.

And, the fire extinguisher didn't put out the arcing because it was
still arcing and if was the top element (broil you ditz, not bake).
Here you are spraying powder on an upside down fire. Think about it.
The powder smothers the fire only if it lands on the fire. You would
have to turn the entire oven upside down for the fire extinguisher to
work, you idiot.

As for the part numbers, your oven is a GE Spectra white. Take the WH
off the part number BTW, it stands for white. That oven has to be at
least five to ten years old so fat chance you'll ever find the part at
GE for that. If you do find it, expect to pay upwards of $70 for it
(PN WB44T10009 for the top broil and PN WB44T100010 for the bottom
bake element).

What happened is you were dumb enough to have a splat of grease on the
element, which over time weakened the steel casing which over time
melted which over time exposed the inner resistive wire which over
time moved enough to get close to the ungrounded case of the oven
which arced frightfully (for you) which then cracked when you splashed
water or fire extinguisher on it which opened the circuit which killed
the arcing.

I have no idea what the "whoosh" sound was ..... probably the air
leaving your head as you concentrated on ruining your oven.

You can replace the element for a few hundred bucks with a service
call, or, if you do it yourself, you will almost certainly drop the
wires in the back as you unscrew them off the element so that you'll
have to pay a technician a few hundred bucks to take the oven apart to
get to the wires you dropped.

Anyway, if you like, call GE and they'll confirm everything I said (I
used to work for GE by the way).
GE tech support 800-626-2005
GE customer service 800-432-2737
GE oven appliances 800-386-1215
GE appliance parts 800-626-2002
GE *troubleshooting 800-626-2000
GE Spectra JBP24B0B4 upper broil element P/N: WB44T10009
GE Spectra JBP24B0B4 lower bake element P/N: WB44T10010

Respectfully yours

Um, it's ditzy... No s. But I wouldn't expect decent grammar or typing
skills from someone with enough gall to respond "You're worrying your
pretty little head over a very common occurrance(sp)." Is your wife
barefoot and pregnant in the kitchen? Probably not. I wouldn't expect
a woman to fall for a sad sap with a protruding neanderthalic forehead
and a job with his name on his shirt, but people amaze me. Next time
you feel kind enough to respond to someone's question, keep your can
of crap to yourself and try to help without being a complete asshole,
you foreskin wrinkle.

On Tuesday, October 7, 2008 at 9:47:47 PM UTC-7, Donna Ohl wrote:
The top element of my 6-year-old General Electric GE JBP24B0B4WH oven went
on electrical fire and the top bake element broke open when the fire
department put it out.

Pictures at http://www.flickr.com/photos/donnaohl

I need advice since this is the first time my oven went on fire all by
itself.

The fire department said replace the oven.

Coworkers told me I can just replace the burned out top bake oven element..
Whose advice should I follow?

Can I just replace the bake element (or is the oven really kaput)?
Can anyone tell me what actually caused the fire (it wasn't food)?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/donnaohl/2923845906/

Wow! You get all kinds of advice on the internet! Oven fires are frightening no doubt. When the heating element goes, it's a magnesium fire that burns at about 5,500F. It looks like the old 4th of July sparklers because the same thing is burning. The fire starts because an area of the element gets bumped, cracked or is improperly manufactured and that causes more resistance at that point which causes more heat at that point. When you get over 5,500F it starts a chain reaction that works all the way down the heating element until it cracks apart (usually a couple of feet of element get burnt before this happens).

Here's a video of the event: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ieslf3aB-KQ

Here's how to fix it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgkPWkVUcF8

Probably no need to get a new oven but if you don't do the repair yourself, the service repair man will charge you an arm and a leg to run the oven through its paces and verify that all the electrical connections are putting out the proper voltage. So, decide if the $ is worth your peace of mind. Otherwise a new heating element is probably less than $20.

http://www.amazon.com/General-Electr...oiler+elements

My recommendation is this: MAKE SURE THE OVEN IS 100% off and the circuit breaker to it is off as well. Take out the old element. Inspect the oven for any damaged porcelain (chipped paint) on the interior. If there is none you should be good to put the new element in and use your oven. Of course use your judgement and if you don't feel you can do the job, hire a professional.

wrote:
On Tuesday, October 7, 2008 at 9:47:47 PM UTC-7, Donna Ohl wrote:
The top element of my 6-year-old General Electric GE JBP24B0B4WH
oven went on electrical fire and the top bake element broke open
when the fire department put it out.

Pictures at http://www.flickr.com/photos/donnaohl

I need advice since this is the first time my oven went on fire all
by itself.

The fire department said replace the oven.

Coworkers told me I can just replace the burned out top bake oven
element. Whose advice should I follow?

Can I just replace the bake element (or is the oven really kaput)?
Can anyone tell me what actually caused the fire (it wasn't food)?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/donnaohl/2923845906/

Wow! You get all kinds of advice on the internet! Oven fires are
frightening no doubt. When the heating element goes, it's a
magnesium fire that burns at about 5,500F. It looks like the old 4th
of July sparklers because the same thing is burning. The fire starts
because an area of the element gets bumped, cracked or is improperly
manufactured and that causes more resistance at that point which
causes more heat at that point. When you get over 5,500F it starts a
chain reaction that works all the way down the heating element until
it cracks apart (usually a couple of feet of element get burnt before
this happens).

Here's a video of the event:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ieslf3aB-KQ

Here's how to fix it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgkPWkVUcF8

Probably no need to get a new oven but if you don't do the repair
yourself, the service repair man will charge you an arm and a leg to
run the oven through its paces and verify that all the electrical
connections are putting out the proper voltage. So, decide if the $
is worth your peace of mind. Otherwise a new heating element is
probably less than $20.

http://www.amazon.com/General-Electr...oiler+elements

My recommendation is this: MAKE SURE THE OVEN IS 100% off and the
circuit breaker to it is off as well. Take out the old element.
Inspect the oven for any damaged porcelain (chipped paint) on the
interior. If there is none you should be good to put the new element
in and use your oven. Of course use your judgement and if you don't
feel you can do the job, hire a professional.

An appliance parts place told me never use an extinguisher on an oven fire. Just
close the oven door.

On 11/23/2015 10:02 PM, wrote:
On Tuesday, October 7, 2008 at 9:47:47 PM UTC-7, Donna Ohl wrote:
The top element of my 6-year-old General Electric GE JBP24B0B4WH oven went
on electrical fire and the top bake element broke open when the fire
department put it out.

Pictures at http://www.flickr.com/photos/donnaohl

I need advice since this is the first time my oven went on fire all by
itself.

The fire department said replace the oven.

Coworkers told me I can just replace the burned out top bake oven element.
Whose advice should I follow?

Can I just replace the bake element (or is the oven really kaput)?
Can anyone tell me what actually caused the fire (it wasn't food)?
http://www.flickr.com/photos/donnaohl/2923845906/

Wow! You get all kinds of advice on the internet! Oven fires are frightening no doubt. When the heating element goes, it's a magnesium fire that burns at about 5,500F. It looks like the old 4th of July sparklers because the same thing is burning. The fire starts because an area of the element gets bumped, cracked or is improperly manufactured and that causes more resistance at that point which causes more heat at that point. When you get over 5,500F it starts a chain reaction that works all the way down the heating element until it cracks apart (usually a couple of feet of element get burnt before this happens).

Here's a video of the event: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ieslf3aB-KQ

Here's how to fix it: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=zgkPWkVUcF8

Probably no need to get a new oven but if you don't do the repair yourself, the service repair man will charge you an arm and a leg to run the oven through its paces and verify that all the electrical connections are putting out the proper voltage. So, decide if the $ is worth your peace of mind. Otherwise a new heating element is probably less than $20.

http://www.amazon.com/General-Electr...oiler+elements

My recommendation is this: MAKE SURE THE OVEN IS 100% off and the circuit breaker to it is off as well. Take out the old element. Inspect the oven for any damaged porcelain (chipped paint) on the interior. If there is none you should be good to put the new element in and use your oven. Of course use your judgement and if you don't feel you can do the job, hire a professional.

Since the OP was in 2008, I was a bit surprised to
find the picture page still there, on Flicker. Really
astounding. Wonder what the OP did with the oven,
and if it had another fire?

-
..
Christopher A. Young
learn more about Jesus
.. www.lds.org
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