About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

--

8^)~ Sue (remove the x to email)
~~~~
I reserve the absolute right to be smarter today than I was
yesterday. -Adlai Stevenson

As seen on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=wacvet

http://www.suzanne-eckhardt.com/
http://www.intergnat.com/malebashing/
http://www.intergnat.com/pussygames/

Yes, provided it physically fits. If the fixture uses a dimmer, it would not
function unless you have a dimmable CF lamp




"Suzie-Q" wrote in message
...
About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

--

8^)~ Sue (remove the x to email)
~~~~
I reserve the absolute right to be smarter today than I was
yesterday. -Adlai Stevenson

As seen on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=wacvet

http://www.suzanne-eckhardt.com/
http://www.intergnat.com/malebashing/
http://www.intergnat.com/pussygames/

On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Yes, the rating on the fixture applies to the amount of current drawn and the
amount of heat it can dissipate. On both counts the "100-watt equivalent"
compact flourescant qualifies.



Robert Scott
Ypsilanti, Michigan

On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

Those new bulbs are supposed to last 8 years, but I've noticed a very
high failure rate. I've bought 20 and 10 of them failed either out of
the box or within 6 months. Keep your recieipts.

Also, the 100 watt ones produce less light than the 75 watt
incandescents.

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
...
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

If this is for a desk lamp on a desk that is used to provide light for
reading, I would forget the compact florescent for that application,
as it will be very hard on your eyes.

CWM

And why is that? If the desk lamp is shielded so you're not exposed to the
brightness of the bulb itself, then there shouldn't be a glare problem.
Newer CFLs don't flicker by design so the only thing left is color. Choose
a warm color CFL bulb that matches incandescent if you prefer.

There are some junk CFLs in the market. Buy CFLs that have the "Energy
Star" label to avoid short life, poor color and low output problems. Energy
Star bulbs are tested and guaranteed. Save the packaging and let Energy
Star know if you're not happy with the performance.

All of the CFLs that I installed in a new house 4 years ago are still
burning just fine.

TKM

On Apr 24, 6:53 am, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

You're not using a 100 watt bulb, you're using a 24 watt bulb, so it's
well
below the max.




Thanks in advance,

If this is for a desk lamp on a desk that is used to provide light for
reading, I would forget the compact florescent for that application,
as it will be very hard on your eyes.

CWM

On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Yes, because it's not a 100-watt bulb. It's a 24-watt bulb.

Thanks in advance,

"Suzie-Q" wrote in message
...
About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

--

You're getting confused--the 24 watt florescent will produce the same amount
of light (lumens) as a 100 watt incandescent bulb. Go by the wattage of the
bulb--
MLD

On Apr 24, 7:14 am, Suzie-Q wrote:
About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

I've put 75 watt equivalents in 60 watt fixtures with no problem. I
think the fixture recommendations are based on how much heat they can
tolerate and normal incandescent bulbs put out more heat than light.
Cfl's put more of the energy into light. You should base replacement
on lumens or light equivalent. Since cfl's take a while longer to
fire up, I think my wife bears through it to get more light. Only had
a couple of cfl's that emitted an annoying spectrum and these ended up
on the front porch. Their light is harsh. Otherwise, I've had no
problems and they have been long life.
Frank

On Apr 24, 7:14 am, Suzie-Q wrote:
About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

--

8^)~ Sue (remove the x to email)
~~~~
I reserve the absolute right to be smarter today than I was
yesterday. -Adlai Stevenson

As seen on YouTube:http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=wacvet

http://www.suzanne-eckhardt.com/http...om/pussygames/

Not to bash anyone, but can you say "fluorescent" light?
Dictionary will confirm.

Meanwhile, if you DAGS on, say, cfl you'll get multi-mega-hits.
Just ignore the "Canadial Football League" ones, or exclude such
in "advanced query."

Boosts s/n ratio.

J

"Suzie-Q" wrote in message
...
About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Sure you can, if the bulb will fit. cfls are quite a bit longer than
incandescents, and successively higher wattage bulbs are also successively
longer bulbs.

That's my only real complaint about the cfls. We have a lot of sconce-type
fixtures here, and even the lower wattage bulbs stick out all over the
place. It's not a nice effect, but I use cfls wherever possible, and have
only had one blow prematurely. That's in a closed fixture, and it didn't
burn out as prematurely as the incandescents that preceeded it.

Frank wrote:

On Apr 24, 7:14 am, Suzie-Q wrote:


About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?


I've put 75 watt equivalents in 60 watt fixtures with no problem. I
think the fixture recommendations are based on how much heat they can
tolerate and normal incandescent bulbs put out more heat than light.
Cfl's put more of the energy into light. You should base replacement
on lumens or light equivalent. Since cfl's take a while longer to
fire up, I think my wife bears through it to get more light. Only had
a couple of cfl's that emitted an annoying spectrum and these ended up
on the front porch. Their light is harsh. Otherwise, I've had no
problems and they have been long life.
Frank


I am using the 100 watters' everywhere in my home. - udarrell

--
WISDOM PRINCIPLE DIRECTED EMPOWERMENT COMMUNICATIONS -
THE REAL POLITICAL ISSUES and WISDOM BASED PEOPLE EMPOWERMENT
http://www.udarrell.com/
http://www.udarrell.com/my_pages2.htm
http://www.udarrell.com/recognizing_real_enemies.html
http://jesuschristsavior.net/Beatitudes.html
Reality Is Not An Easy Thing To Be Confronted With - Or to Accept!

In article . com,
wrote:

On Apr 24, 7:14 am, Suzie-Q wrote:
About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

--

8^)~ Sue (remove the x to email)
~~~~
I reserve the absolute right to be smarter today than I was
yesterday. -Adlai Stevenson

As seen on YouTube:http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=wacvet

http://www.suzanne-eckhardt.com/http...ashing/http://
www.intergnat.cexom/pussygames/

Not to bash anyone, but can you say "fluorescent" light?
Dictionary will confirm.

My spellchecker told me that was wrong. I believed it.

Meanwhile, if you DAGS on, say, cfl you'll get multi-mega-hits.
Just ignore the "Canadial Football League" ones, or exclude such
in "advanced query."

Boosts s/n ratio.

J




--

8^)~ Sue (remove the x to email)
~~~~
I reserve the absolute right to be smarter today than I was
yesterday. -Adlai Stevenson

In article ,
mm wrote:

On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Yes, because it's not a 100-watt bulb. It's a 24-watt bulb.

Thanks in advance,


I was hoping it was that simple!

--

8^)~ Sue (remove the x to email)
~~~~
I reserve the absolute right to be smarter today than I was
yesterday. -Adlai Stevenson

As seen on YouTube: http://www.youtube.com/profile?user=wacvet

http://www.suzanne-eckhardt.com/
http://www.intergnat.com/malebashing/
http://www.intergnat.com/pussygames/

In article ,
TKM wrote:

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
.. .

EDIT FOR SPACE

If this is for a desk lamp on a desk that is used to provide light for
reading, I would forget the compact florescent for that application,
as it will be very hard on your eyes.

CWM

And why is that? If the desk lamp is shielded so you're not exposed to the
brightness of the bulb itself, then there shouldn't be a glare problem.
Newer CFLs don't flicker by design so the only thing left is color. Choose
a warm color CFL bulb that matches incandescent if you prefer.

There are some junk CFLs in the market. Buy CFLs that have the "Energy
Star" label to avoid short life, poor color and low output problems. Energy
Star bulbs are tested and guaranteed. Save the packaging and let Energy
Star know if you're not happy with the performance.

All of the CFLs that I installed in a new house 4 years ago are still
burning just fine.

I would like to add some bits:

1. Some dollar stores are selling some badly junky CFLs, and over 90% of
CFLs that I saw in dollar stores are so bad that I only purchased them so
that I can truthfully say "in my experience" when I say how bad they are.
I have so many complaints that I have more than one complaint of most of
the 57 "models" and 19 "brands" of dollar store CFLs that I have tested.

2. If you want a specific or non-usual color, I have some suggestions,
especially if you want something whiter than the usual warm color:

Mainly, for most home use, I really like the color referred to as 3500K.
This is something that I call a "whiter shade of warm white". Most
non-dolar-store CFLs are warm/incandescent-ish ones rated 2700K, some
3000, and a sparse few are rated 2800.
Higher still, such as 4100-6500, approximate sunlight or daylight in
overall color but easily produce a "dreary gray effect" at typical home
illumination levels less than the "office-bright/classroom-bright" levels
of somewhere around 100-180 footcandles or 1100-2000 lux.

Should you want to give 3500K a try:

* N:Vision "Bright White", available at many/most Home Depots in many
wattages. NOTE - in my experience with small sample sizes, N:PVision
units of wattages 27 watts or more audibly buzzed while ones 23 watts or
less did not, regardless of color.

* Sylvania "Daylight", which I have seen as 13 watt spirals
(approximating/approaching equivalence of 60 watt incandescent) at Lowes.
Note that "Daylight" elsewhere usually means an icy cold to outright
bluish shade of white for fluorescents.

* Westinghouse "medium white" - if you can find it at a hardware store as
I did once and usually can't.

* For pin-base industry-standard ballastless CFL "bulbs" - try
electrical/lighting supply shops and online lightbulb outfits - those may
be available, especially if they are 13 or 26 watt, since that color is
one of the fairly standard ones for those.

- Don Klipstein )

In , Charlie Morgan wrote:
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 13:27:03 GMT, "TKM" wrote:


"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
. ..
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

If this is for a desk lamp on a desk that is used to provide light for
reading, I would forget the compact florescent for that application,
as it will be very hard on your eyes.

CWM

And why is that?

Well, for openers, they emit UV which is VERY harmful to eyes,
especially if the source is as close as a desk lamp.

CWM

Light from CFLs has less UV of every kind/range of UV than an equivalent
amount of sunlight or daylight. Light from CFLs even has less UV than an
equivalent of daylight or sunlight that passed through a glass window.

- Don Klipstein )

In article . com,
wrote:
On Apr 24, 6:53 am, Charlie Morgan wrote:
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

You're not using a 100 watt bulb, you're using a 24 watt bulb, so it's
well below the max.

I have obtained one data point using a non-contact thermometer where a
42 watt CFL heats a fixture slightly more than a 60 watt incandescent
does.

How can that be if a CFL is more efficient at producing light than an
incandescent?

Answer - roughly half the heat from an incandescent is not
convected/conducted heat but resulting from infrared, while nearly all
energy going into a CFL that fails to become visible light becomes
non-radiant heat.

Meanwhile, CFLs are less tolerant of heat than incandescents.

I would not use a CFL over 26 watts in a fixture rated for 60 watt
incandescents.

Furthermore, some fixtures rated for 60 watt incandescents will even
significantly overheat 26 watt CFLs. Those would be:

* Downlights in general

* Worse still, recessed ceiling fixtures

* Small enclosed fixtures

I have some experience saying that 15 watt CFLs overheat mildly in
small enclosed fixtures, and I expect ones 20 watts or more to overheat
worse.

As for recessed ceiling fixtures, I would prefer to use CFLs
specifically rated for such heat hellholes. Such CFLs include Philips SLS
non-dimable models up to 23 watts, and not the 25 watt one, nor the
dimmable 23 watt one. In my experience, most dimmable CFL recessed
ceiling fixtures take pin-base ballastless CFLs and have special dimming
ballasts for such specific CFLs, which are normally widely available
industry-standard types such as "PL-13" and 26 watt quadtube.

- Don Klipstein )

On Apr 24, 7:19 am, deke wrote:
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

Those new bulbs are supposed to last 8 years, but I've noticed a very
high failure rate. I've bought 20 and 10 of them failed either out of
the box or within 6 months. Keep your recieipts.

Also, the 100 watt ones produce less light than the 75 watt
incandescents.


Have you seen the reports of the problem of disposal and especially
the danger in clean up if one breaks. One woman was quoted a $2000.00
for decontamination of her daughters bedroom. Seems they contain
mercury and it is a toxic material by EPA. So you are playing with
fire in using them. Yea I know the Green people are advocating them
but they aren't putting out the hazard of them either.
Jack

On 25 Apr 2007 05:54:31 -0700, Jack wrote:

Have you seen the reports of the problem of disposal and especially
the danger in clean up if one breaks. One woman was quoted a $2000.00
for decontamination of her daughters bedroom. Seems they contain
mercury and it is a toxic material by EPA. So you are playing with
fire in using them. Yea I know the Green people are advocating them
but they aren't putting out the hazard of them either.
Jack

There's as much energy in a gallon of gas
as there is in a stick of dynamite !

Be sure to store ALL gasoline at least a mile from your house.
( that includes the stuff in your autos gas tank )

..... I hear the sky is falling too !
rj

On Wed, 25 Apr 2007 07:25:21 -0700, "RJ"
wrote:

On 25 Apr 2007 05:54:31 -0700, Jack wrote:

Have you seen the reports of the problem of disposal and especially
the danger in clean up if one breaks. One woman was quoted a $2000.00
for decontamination of her daughters bedroom. Seems they contain
mercury and it is a toxic material by EPA. So you are playing with
fire in using them. Yea I know the Green people are advocating them
but they aren't putting out the hazard of them either.
Jack

There's as much energy in a gallon of gas
as there is in a stick of dynamite !

Be sure to store ALL gasoline at least a mile from your house.
( that includes the stuff in your autos gas tank )

.... I hear the sky is falling too !
rj

A Philips 25-watt Marathon CFL contains less than 3 mg of Hg -- 2.64
to be exact. To put this in perspective, my Honeywell thermostats
each contain 3,000 mg (my home has three). Sky falling? Now *that's*
something to worry about!

Cheers,
Paul

On Apr 24, 7:19 am, deke wrote:
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

Those new bulbs are supposed to last 8 years, but I've noticed a very
high failure rate. I've bought 20 and 10 of them failed either out of
the box or within 6 months. Keep your recieipts.

Also, the 100 watt ones produce less light than the 75 watt
incandescents.

And keep in mind the hard lesson some have learned - when these bulbs
break, you have serious hazardous waste situation with the mercury
powder in the bulbs. For all the hysteria about how "eco-friendly"
these CF bulbs are, they are a homeowner's nightmare.

In a word, just say "no."

-intrepid

On 25 Apr 2007 09:07:48 -0700, wrote:

On Apr 24, 7:19 am, deke wrote:
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

Those new bulbs are supposed to last 8 years, but I've noticed a very
high failure rate. I've bought 20 and 10 of them failed either out of
the box or within 6 months. Keep your recieipts.

Also, the 100 watt ones produce less light than the 75 watt
incandescents.

And keep in mind the hard lesson some have learned - when these bulbs
break, you have serious hazardous waste situation with the mercury
powder in the bulbs. For all the hysteria about how "eco-friendly"
these CF bulbs are, they are a homeowner's nightmare.

In a word, just say "no."

Speaking of hysteria...

writes:

And keep in mind the hard lesson some have learned - when these bulbs
break, you have serious hazardous waste situation with the mercury
powder in the bulbs. For all the hysteria about how "eco-friendly"
these CF bulbs are, they are a homeowner's nightmare.

The powder in the bulbs is the phosphor. There is mercury, but it
should be in tiny little drops of liquid mercury. There's so little you
might not be able to see it at all (~4 mg).

Where do you get this information from?

Dave

On Wed, 25 Apr 2007 01:02:55 +0000 (UTC), (Don
Klipstein) wrote:

In article ,
TKM wrote:

"Charlie Morgan" wrote in message
. ..

EDIT FOR SPACE

If this is for a desk lamp on a desk that is used to provide light for
reading, I would forget the compact florescent for that application,
as it will be very hard on your eyes.

CWM

And why is that? If the desk lamp is shielded so you're not exposed to the
brightness of the bulb itself, then there shouldn't be a glare problem.
Newer CFLs don't flicker by design so the only thing left is color. Choose
a warm color CFL bulb that matches incandescent if you prefer.

There are some junk CFLs in the market. Buy CFLs that have the "Energy
Star" label to avoid short life, poor color and low output problems. Energy
Star bulbs are tested and guaranteed. Save the packaging and let Energy
Star know if you're not happy with the performance.

All of the CFLs that I installed in a new house 4 years ago are still
burning just fine.

I would like to add some bits:

1. Some dollar stores are selling some badly junky CFLs, and over 90% of
CFLs that I saw in dollar stores are so bad that I only purchased them so
that I can truthfully say "in my experience" when I say how bad they are.
I have so many complaints that I have more than one complaint of most of
the 57 "models" and 19 "brands" of dollar store CFLs that I have tested.

2. If you want a specific or non-usual color, I have some suggestions,
especially if you want something whiter than the usual warm color:

Mainly, for most home use, I really like the color referred to as 3500K.
This is something that I call a "whiter shade of warm white". Most
non-dolar-store CFLs are warm/incandescent-ish ones rated 2700K, some
3000, and a sparse few are rated 2800.
Higher still, such as 4100-6500, approximate sunlight or daylight in
overall color but easily produce a "dreary gray effect" at typical home
illumination levels less than the "office-bright/classroom-bright" levels
of somewhere around 100-180 footcandles or 1100-2000 lux.

Should you want to give 3500K a try:

* N:Vision "Bright White", available at many/most Home Depots in many
wattages. NOTE - in my experience with small sample sizes, N:PVision
units of wattages 27 watts or more audibly buzzed while ones 23 watts or
less did not, regardless of color.

* Sylvania "Daylight", which I have seen as 13 watt spirals
(approximating/approaching equivalence of 60 watt incandescent) at Lowes.
Note that "Daylight" elsewhere usually means an icy cold to outright
bluish shade of white for fluorescents.

* Westinghouse "medium white" - if you can find it at a hardware store as
I did once and usually can't.

* For pin-base industry-standard ballastless CFL "bulbs" - try
electrical/lighting supply shops and online lightbulb outfits - those may
be available, especially if they are 13 or 26 watt, since that color is
one of the fairly standard ones for those.

- Don Klipstein )

Here's a message somebody posted a way back, giving a link
to comparison study of CFL bulbs.

++++++++++++++++++++++++

On 19 Apr 2007 17:35:50 -0700, wrote:

On Apr 19, 5:16 pm, jJim McLaughlin
wrote:
Justin West wrote:


[...]

Popular Mechanics just did a rating comparison on many brands,
compared to incandesant, Its free pmline to see. Its a good article.
Some cfls they rate better than incandesant, one brand, a top rated
is at HD and is cheap in a 4 pack. You will save especialy on lights
left on a long time and as JM said more in summer during AC operation.
Incandesants are actualy heaters putting out maybe only 10% of energy
used as light. So a 100 watt bulb puts out 90 watts heat, cfls convert
more energy used to light 75% more. incandesants should be outlawed.

Thanks a bunch for pointing to this rating comparison. Very useful.
I will replace some of my dim-bulb g cheapies with good bulbs.

Aspasia

++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++++

In article .com,
wrote:
On Apr 24, 7:19 am, deke wrote:
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

Those new bulbs are supposed to last 8 years, but I've noticed a very
high failure rate. I've bought 20 and 10 of them failed either out of
the box or within 6 months. Keep your recieipts.

Also, the 100 watt ones produce less light than the 75 watt
incandescents.

And keep in mind the hard lesson some have learned - when these bulbs
break, you have serious hazardous waste situation with the mercury
powder in the bulbs. For all the hysteria about how "eco-friendly"
these CF bulbs are, they are a homeowner's nightmare.

In a word, just say "no."

The powder is not mercury. The mercury is something else, in quantities
small enough for disposal by homeowners into regular household trash to be
perfectly legal in most jurisdictions. (However, using info from
www.lamprecycle.org is preferred.)

- Don Klipstein )

On Thu, 26 Apr 2007 02:24:02 +0000 (UTC), (Don
Klipstein) wrote:

In article .com,
wrote:
On Apr 24, 7:19 am, deke wrote:
On Tue, 24 Apr 2007 11:14:59 GMT, Suzie-Q
wrote:

About those new energy-saving light bulbs -- I think some are called
compact florescent?

Anyway, say I have a desk lamp with a small label that says that I
shouldn't use more than a 60-watt bulb. A new "60-watt" florescent
bulb uses only 13 watts of energy and doesn't get as hot as a
60-watt incandescent light bulb. A 100-watt florescent
would only use, say, 24 watts of energy (I don't know the exact
amount). So could I use a 100-watt florescent bulb in the desk lamp
that's rated for no higher than a 60-watt bulb?

Thanks in advance,

Those new bulbs are supposed to last 8 years, but I've noticed a very
high failure rate. I've bought 20 and 10 of them failed either out of
the box or within 6 months. Keep your recieipts.

Also, the 100 watt ones produce less light than the 75 watt
incandescents.

And keep in mind the hard lesson some have learned - when these bulbs
break, you have serious hazardous waste situation with the mercury
powder in the bulbs. For all the hysteria about how "eco-friendly"
these CF bulbs are, they are a homeowner's nightmare.

In a word, just say "no."

The powder is not mercury. The mercury is something else, in quantities
small enough for disposal by homeowners into regular household trash to be
perfectly legal in most jurisdictions. (However, using info from
www.lamprecycle.org is preferred.)

- Don Klipstein )

Bottom line, when they break, toss them in the trash and wash your
hands.

An incident talking about CF breakage can be found he

http://ellsworthmaine.com/site/index...46&Ite mid=31

Not hysteria. It's actually happened.

-intrepid



On Apr 25, 1:28 pm, (Dave Martindale) wrote:
writes:
And keep in mind the hard lesson some have learned - when these bulbs
break, you have serious hazardous waste situation with the mercury
powder in the bulbs. For all the hysteria about how "eco-friendly"
these CF bulbs are, they are a homeowner's nightmare.

The powder in the bulbs is the phosphor. There is mercury, but it
should be in tiny little drops of liquid mercury. There's so little you
might not be able to see it at all (~4 mg).

Where do you get this information from?

Dave

On 26 Apr 2007 08:27:25 -0700, wrote:

An incident talking about CF breakage can be found he

http://ellsworthmaine.com/site/index...46&Ite mid=31

Not hysteria. It's actually happened.

-intrepid

Here are the instructions for the safe clean-up and disposal of broken
fluorescent lamps, as provided by the U.S. DOE, NEMA, GE and Clean
Nova Scotia:

"Because there is such a small amount of mercury in CFLs, your
greatest risk if a bulb breaks is getting cut from glass shards.
Research indicates that there is no immediate health risk to you or
your family should a bulb break and it’s cleaned up properly. You can
minimize any risks by following these proper clean-up and disposal
guidelines:

* Sweep up - don’t vacuum - all of the glass fragments and fine
particles.

* Place broken pieces in a sealed plastic bag and wipe the area with
a damp paper towel to pick up any stray shards of glass or fine
particles. Put the used towel in the plastic bag as well.

* If weather permits, open windows to allow the room to ventilate.

Source:
http://www.energystar.gov/ia/partner...et_Mercury.pdf


"Safe cleanup precautions: If a CFL breaks in your home, open nearby
windows to disperse any vapor that may escape, carefully sweep up the
fragments (do not use your hands) and wipe the area with a disposable
paper towel to remove all glass fragments. Do not use a vacuum. Place
all fragments in a sealed plastic bag and follow disposal instructions
above."

Source:
http://www.nema.org/lamprecycle/epafactsheet-cfl.pdf


"Fluorescent lamps contain mercury. Mercury at atmospheric pressure is
a silver colored liquid that tends to form balls. Mercury is a
hazardous substance. When one lamp is broken, the best thing to do is
to wear chemical resistant glove to clean it up. The gloves can be
vinyl, rubber, PVC, or neoprene. The gloves you buy in the supermarket
for household cleaning are sufficient. The gloves protect your skin
from absorbing mercury and from getting cut by the glass. The remains
of one lamp can be disposed as normal waste since the amount of
mercury is small. However, for future reference, when large quantities
of lamps are being disposed you must follow your state and the federal
regulation for disposing of mercury-containing lamps."

Source:
http://www.gelighting.com/na/busines...faqs/cfl.htm#6


"In the unlikely event your bulb breaks, be certain to sweep up -
don't vacuum - all of the glass fragments and phosphor powder. Place
the broken pieces in a plastic bag and wipe the area with a damp paper
towel to pick up any stray shards of glass or fine particles. Put the
used towel in the plastic bag as well. Like paint, batteries,
thermostats and other hazardous household items, CFLs should be
disposed of properly. Check with your municipal waste management
program for proper disposal. If none exist, place in regular waste
container. It is good practice to always clean up any products
containing mercury with care and common sense."

Source:
http://www.clean.ns.ca/images/Docume...ct%20sheet.pdf

Cheers,
Paul

On 26 Apr 2007 08:27:25 -0700, wrote:

An incident talking about CF breakage can be found he

http://ellsworthmaine.com/site/index...46&Ite mid=31

Not hysteria. It's actually happened.

-intrepid


Hysteria. THe homeowner decided there should be a problem,
and kept trying until she managed to create one.

On 26 Apr 2007 08:27:25 -0700, wrote:

An incident talking about CF breakage can be found he

http://ellsworthmaine.com/site/index...46&Ite mid=31

Not hysteria. It's actually happened.

-intrepid

I believe it actually happened, but sad to say, she made a mistake
when she called the DEP or when she believed the instruction not to
clean it herself. It's hard to know when you shoudl do what others
say and when you shouldn't, but it's a complicated world. And it
wouldn't be surprising if someone gave her bad advice and then lied
about what they said later.

The article does refer to it as mercury powder, and I think that shows
a mistake in there somewhere. AIUI, the powder is the same kind of
phosphor that has been in fluorescent bulbs for ?? 80 years, more or
less.

I'm not generally anti-government, but one shouldn't just love the
governemnt either. It's employees are no more competent than we are,
and since not everyone is the same level of compentence, some of them
are less.

Those tv shows where they get children to give evidence against their
parents, not about child abuse but other things, really scare me. The
ones where the parents let their children be questioned alone. The
notion that if the truth comes out, everything will be for the best,
isn't always true.




On Apr 25, 1:28 pm, (Dave Martindale) wrote:
writes:
And keep in mind the hard lesson some have learned - when these bulbs
break, you have serious hazardous waste situation with the mercury
powder in the bulbs. For all the hysteria about how "eco-friendly"
these CF bulbs are, they are a homeowner's nightmare.

The powder in the bulbs is the phosphor. There is mercury, but it
should be in tiny little drops of liquid mercury. There's so little you
might not be able to see it at all (~4 mg).

Where do you get this information from?

Dave

The whole point of this is that we are being pushed into these
"better" lightbulbs, but being pushed into a solution that creates a
hazardous waste situation if I break a lighbulb - even for the small
4mg of mercury involved - is on the high side of ludicrous.My evil,
old incandescent bulbs has - let me think - NO mercury, so this isn't
an issue, is it? But we dare not say anything in favor of incandscent
bulbs, because it just isn't PC these days.

An individual shouldn't have to be expected to study hazardous waste
disposal merely for breaking a lightbulb. I realize that the old bulb
thermometers and thermostats have much more mercury than a CF bulb,
but then again I don't think I have to worry too much about a
thermostat hitting the floor, breaking, and spreading mercury all over
the place..

-intrepid





On Apr 26, 12:05 pm, mm wrote:
On 26 Apr 2007 08:27:25 -0700, wrote:

An incident talking about CF breakage can be found he

http://ellsworthmaine.com/site/index...tent&task=view...

Not hysteria. It's actually happened.

-intrepid

I believe it actually happened, but sad to say, she made a mistake
when she called the DEP or when she believed the instruction not to
clean it herself. It's hard to know when you shoudl do what others
say and when you shouldn't, but it's a complicated world. And it
wouldn't be surprising if someone gave her bad advice and then lied
about what they said later.

The article does refer to it as mercury powder, and I think that shows
a mistake in there somewhere. AIUI, the powder is the same kind of
phosphor that has been in fluorescent bulbs for ?? 80 years, more or
less.

I'm not generally anti-government, but one shouldn't just love the
governemnt either. It's employees are no more competent than we are,
and since not everyone is the same level of compentence, some of them
are less.

Those tv shows where they get children to give evidence against their
parents, not about child abuse but other things, really scare me. The
ones where the parents let their children be questioned alone. The
notion that if the truth comes out, everything will be for the best,
isn't always true.





On Apr 25, 1:28 pm, (Dave Martindale) wrote:
writes:
And keep in mind the hard lesson some have learned - when these bulbs
break, you have serious hazardous waste situation with the mercury
powder in the bulbs. For all the hysteria about how "eco-friendly"
these CF bulbs are, they are a homeowner's nightmare.

The powder in the bulbs is the phosphor. There is mercury, but it
should be in tiny little drops of liquid mercury. There's so little you
might not be able to see it at all (~4 mg).

Where do you get this information from?

Dave- Hide quoted text -

- Show quoted text -

On 26 Apr 2007 13:22:53 -0700, wrote:

The whole point of this is that we are being pushed into these
"better" lightbulbs, but being pushed into a solution that creates a
hazardous waste situation if I break a lighbulb - even for the small
4mg of mercury involved - is on the high side of ludicrous.My evil,
old incandescent bulbs has - let me think - NO mercury, so this isn't
an issue, is it? But we dare not say anything in favor of incandscent
bulbs, because it just isn't PC these days.


That's what you get for caring about what's PC.

An individual shouldn't have to be expected to study hazardous waste
disposal merely for breaking a lightbulb. I realize that the old bulb
thermometers and thermostats have much more mercury than a CF bulb,
but then again I don't think I have to worry too much about a
thermostat hitting the floor, breaking, and spreading mercury all over
the place..

Tunsten is toxic, too. Whatcha gonna do about that?

In article , mm wrote:

I believe it actually happened, but sad to say, she made a mistake
when she called the DEP or when she believed the instruction not to
clean it herself. It's hard to know when you shoudl do what others
say and when you shouldn't, but it's a complicated world. And it
wouldn't be surprising if someone gave her bad advice and then lied
about what they said later.

The article does refer to it as mercury powder, and I think that shows
a mistake in there somewhere. AIUI, the powder is the same kind of
phosphor that has been in fluorescent bulbs for ?? 80 years, more or
less.

1. The phosphor in "regular" fluorescents has changed. It was something
really nasty way back when, maybe the 1950's. But at since at least the
1970's they used something else known as halophosphate for the "old tech"
(my words) phosphor.

2. CFLs (with few exceptions that include most dollar store ones) contain
something even different, known as triphosphor, and as I understand it
that was first used in the 1970's with halophosphate being in wide use by
then.

- Don Klipstein )

Jack wrote:
Have you seen the reports of the problem of disposal and especially
the danger in clean up if one breaks. One woman was quoted a $2000.00
for decontamination of her daughters bedroom. Seems they contain
mercury and it is a toxic material by EPA. So you are playing with
fire in using them.

In a saner time years back, I broke a real thermometer with real mercury
in it; I could see it bead up on the floor. Remembering that someone
told me it was toxic, I called a poison control center for instructions.
The person on the other end acted like I was crazy to waste her time;
she told me to pick it up any way possible without a lot of skin contact,
and implied that I should quit bothering her with nonsense.

--
Music hath charms to soothe the savage breast.
That's why stereo has two channels.

On Fri, 27 Apr 2007 00:44:56 -0500, clifto wrote:

Jack wrote:
Have you seen the reports of the problem of disposal and especially
the danger in clean up if one breaks. One woman was quoted a $2000.00
for decontamination of her daughters bedroom. Seems they contain
mercury and it is a toxic material by EPA. So you are playing with
fire in using them.

In a saner time years back, I broke a real thermometer with real mercury
in it; I could see it bead up on the floor. Remembering that someone
told me it was toxic, I called a poison control center for instructions.
The person on the other end acted like I was crazy to waste her time;

I've told this story before, but when my upstairs neighbor swallowed
bleach, I looked in my two first aid booklets' poison section and
found nothing, and called the poison control center, and her book
didn't say anything either. She asked a doctor who said no problem. I
guess I had told them that she hadn't swallowed much of it, but years
later I found out that bleach is a posion of some sort if you swallow
maybe a cup.

she told me to pick it up any way possible without a lot of skin contact,
and implied that I should quit bothering her with nonsense.

I wonder how big a city one has to live in to keep one person in the
poison control center busy for 80% of an 8 hours shift.

clifto wrote:
Jack wrote:
Have you seen the reports of the problem of disposal and especially
the danger in clean up if one breaks. One woman was quoted a $2000.00
for decontamination of her daughters bedroom. Seems they contain
mercury and it is a toxic material by EPA. So you are playing with
fire in using them.


what a bunch of crap

Moron woman with no common sense asks a gov't plebe with no common sense
and this is the answer

I have lost all respect for Radley Balko for publishing this crap

On Fri, 27 Apr 2007 03:13:30 -0400, mm
wrote:

On Fri, 27 Apr 2007 00:44:56 -0500, clifto wrote:

Jack wrote:
Have you seen the reports of the problem of disposal and especially
the danger in clean up if one breaks. One woman was quoted a $2000.00
for decontamination of her daughters bedroom. Seems they contain
mercury and it is a toxic material by EPA. So you are playing with
fire in using them.

In a saner time years back, I broke a real thermometer with real mercury
in it; I could see it bead up on the floor. Remembering that someone
told me it was toxic, I called a poison control center for instructions.
The person on the other end acted like I was crazy to waste her time;

I've told this story before, but when my upstairs neighbor swallowed
bleach, I looked in my two first aid booklets' poison section and
found nothing, and called the poison control center, and her book
didn't say anything either. She asked a doctor who said no problem. I
guess I had told them that she hadn't swallowed much of it, but years
later I found out that bleach is a posion of some sort if you swallow
maybe a cup.

she told me to pick it up any way possible without a lot of skin contact,
and implied that I should quit bothering her with nonsense.

I wonder how big a city one has to live in to keep one person in the
poison control center busy for 80% of an 8 hours shift.



Bleach is not a poison, it's a caustic agent.
(Stomach acid is mostly HCl, just in fairly dilute form)
The accidental ingestion rules should be on the bottle,
and IIRC, are to drink water and/or milk, in order to
dilute the acid to a level your stomach can cope with.

On Fri, 27 Apr 2007 15:09:45 -0400, Goedjn wrote:


I've told this story before, but when my upstairs neighbor swallowed
bleach, I looked in my two first aid booklets' poison section and
found nothing, and called the poison control center, and her book
didn't say anything either. She asked a doctor who said no problem. I
guess I had told them that she hadn't swallowed much of it, but years
later I found out that bleach is a posion of some sort if you swallow

I did call it a poison so you were right to correct me.

maybe a cup.

Bleach is not a poison, it's a caustic agent.

I should have called a caustic agent control center.

(Stomach acid is mostly HCl, just in fairly dilute form)
The accidental ingestion rules should be on the bottle,

This was 25 years ago, and I don't think there were any remedied
listed, but in addition, they didn't have the bottle. One roommate
poured the bleach into a plastic or cardboard milk carton, the second
roommmate came home and found the "milk" on the table so she put it in
the refrigerator, and the third girl took it out of the fridge and
drank some. Then she came downstairs to see me.

and IIRC, are to drink water and/or milk, in order to
dilute the acid to a level your stomach can cope with.

clifto wrote:
Jack wrote:
Have you seen the reports of the problem of disposal and especially
the danger in clean up if one breaks. One woman was quoted a $2000.00
for decontamination of her daughters bedroom. Seems they contain
mercury and it is a toxic material by EPA. So you are playing with
fire in using them.

In a saner time years back, I broke a real thermometer with real mercury
in it; I could see it bead up on the floor. Remembering that someone
told me it was toxic, I called a poison control center for instructions.
The person on the other end acted like I was crazy to waste her time;
she told me to pick it up any way possible without a lot of skin contact,
and implied that I should quit bothering her with nonsense.

My seventh grade science teacher (back in 1956) made a game whereby we
were supposed to pass a glob of mercury hand to hand to see if it could
get around the class without dropping. We all survived, AFAIK. At
least, speaking for myself, my forked tail is not too uncomfortable when
I'm seated, and my horn hides nicely under my baseball cap.

Paul in San Francisco

In article , Goedjn wrote:

Bleach is not a poison, it's a caustic agent.
(Stomach acid is mostly HCl, just in fairly dilute form)
The accidental ingestion rules should be on the bottle,
and IIRC, are to drink water and/or milk, in order to
dilute the acid to a level your stomach can cope with.

Bleach is not an acid - its main non-water ingredient is sodium
hypochlorite, which is caustic because it is an oxidizing agent.

- Don Klipstein )