I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
this spot is.

Thanks so much for everybody's input!
Angie

"m35603" wrote in message
ups.com...
I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
this spot is.

Certainly looks like condensation. I'd say it is an insulation and/or
ventilation problem.

In article . com,
says...
I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
this spot is.

It's hard to tell, but it looks like the "spot" is frozen. If so
perhaps it's just frost? Maybe that section of the roof is getting
*better* air flow so it's staying cold longer. Frost on roofs
around here is a good sign. ...well not this week (record temps).

--
Keith

"krw" wrote in message
t...
In article . com,
says...
I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
this spot is.

It's hard to tell, but it looks like the "spot" is frozen. If so
perhaps it's just frost? Maybe that section of the roof is getting
*better* air flow so it's staying cold longer. Frost on roofs
around here is a good sign. ...well not this week (record temps).

--
Keith

Ya, but why would just that spot 'frost' and not the rest of the roof? I
doubt the rest of the roof is 'bad' and this one spot with frost is 'good'.
Obviously, there is a problem with moisture at that point on the roof.
Excess moisture in that spot is causing the frost. In the last round of
pics that were posted, it looked like the sheathing was sagging and damaged
as well. Could be caused by problems with venting. You really need to have
a pro look at this. One who can investigate the cause, and correct it.
There could be a boatload of mold up there as well.

The problem will not fix itself or go away, but it will get worse!

Good Luck!
J.A. Michel

J.A. Michel wrote:
Ya, but why would just that spot 'frost' and not the rest of the
roof? I doubt the rest of the roof is 'bad' and this one spot with
frost is 'good'. Obviously, there is a problem with moisture at that
point on the roof. Excess moisture in that spot is causing the frost.
In the last round of pics that were posted, it looked like the
sheathing was sagging and damaged as well. Could be caused by
problems with venting. You really need to have a pro look at this. One who
can investigate the cause, and correct it. There could be a
boatload of mold up there as well.
The problem will not fix itself or go away, but it will get worse!

Are you sure that the entire roof isn't frosting during the night and as soon as
the sun comes up it all melts except for that spot? Perhaps that spot has
better insulation. Does the house have cathedral ceilings (no attic)? That
would typically not be the case in bathrooms so they would still have a space
over them.

In article . com, "m35603" wrote:
I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

I'm going to go out on a limb here, and say that's perfectly normal. The frost
shows which parts of the space under the roof are properly insulated: every
place you see frost, the insulation is good. Where you don't see frost, the
insulation is inadequate: so much heat is escaping from the house in those
places that the roof is too warm to collect frost.

In a nutshell, the parts with the frost are OK. It's all the parts that
*don't* have frost that have a problem.

That's my guess, anyway.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

On 6 Jan 2007 18:42:27 -0800, "m35603" wrote:

I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
this spot is.

Thanks so much for everybody's input!
Angie

Frost forms when a surface cools to a temperature which is colder than
the dewpoint of the air next to the surface. The frosted area of the
roof must be cooler than the rest of the roof and has nothing to do
with moisture in the roof itself.

Doug Miller wrote:
In article . com, "m35603" wrote:
I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

I'm going to go out on a limb here, and say that's perfectly normal. The frost
shows which parts of the space under the roof are properly insulated: every
place you see frost, the insulation is good. Where you don't see frost, the
insulation is inadequate: so much heat is escaping from the house in those
places that the roof is too warm to collect frost.

In a nutshell, the parts with the frost are OK. It's all the parts that
*don't* have frost that have a problem.

That's my guess, anyway.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

but why isn't there frost on the eaves then?

m35603 wrote:
I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
this spot is.

Thanks so much for everybody's input!
Angie


The frost/snow is where it is the coldest. In
other words, all of the roof is colder than the
are where the frost is. The area where the frost
is either the area of best insulation or most
ventilation. Your neighbor should wish that all
of his roof look like what you call wet spots.

Edwin Pawlowski wrote:
"m35603" wrote in message
ups.com...
I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
this spot is.

Certainly looks like condensation. I'd say it is an insulation and/or
ventilation problem.


Take another look, the white stuff is frost on the
outside of the house, the black areas are where
the frost melted. There is no problem, unless you
consider all the are that isn't frost covered.

Take another look, the white stuff is frost on the
outside of the house, the black areas are where
the frost melted. There is no problem, unless you
consider all the are that isn't frost covered.

The black areas are there even in 100 degree temperature in the middle
of August. I think somebody suggested it could be mold.

Angie

The frost/snow is where it is the coldest. In
other words, all of the roof is colder than the
are where the frost is. The area where the frost
is either the area of best insulation or most
ventilation. Your neighbor should wish that all
of his roof look like what you call wet spots.

It *is* a wet spot when it's not below feezing. It is obvious that the
shingles are wet in this one spot in the morning. They dry durig the
day, but the next morning they are wet again.

Angie

Frost forms when a surface cools to a temperature which is colder than
the dewpoint of the air next to the surface. The frosted area of the
roof must be cooler than the rest of the roof and has nothing to do
with moisture in the roof itself.

That does make sense, but why are the shingles wet when it's not below
freezing? That's why I was thinking that it's this wetness that causes
the frost.

You all have some very interesting theories! My neighbor hasn't called
anybody yet to look at her house because of the holidays, but I hope
she will soon. She already had a leak in her roof in another spot last
year. She usually calls the guy who built the house, but I would think
this is not a good idea. If anything was in fact wrong with the
construction of the house, he sure wouldn't admit to it and fix it, he
would try to cover it up instead.

Glad it ain't my house!
Angie

Frost forms when a surface cools to a temperature which is colder than
the dewpoint of the air next to the surface...

Perhaps you mean "frostpoint" :-)

Nick

"marson" wrote in message
oups.com...

Doug Miller wrote:
In article . com,
"m35603" wrote:
I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

I'm going to go out on a limb here, and say that's perfectly normal. The
frost
shows which parts of the space under the roof are properly insulated:
every
place you see frost, the insulation is good. Where you don't see frost,
the
insulation is inadequate: so much heat is escaping from the house in
those
places that the roof is too warm to collect frost.

In a nutshell, the parts with the frost are OK. It's all the parts that
*don't* have frost that have a problem.

That's my guess, anyway.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

but why isn't there frost on the eaves then?

Frost is moisture from the air which condenses on objects which radiate heat
to become colder than the surrounding air. The eaves are exposed to the air
on both sides and stay warmer than a well insulated area which is exposed on
only one side.

SJF

"m35603" wrote in message
ups.com...
|I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
| wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
| feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:
|
| http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
| http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
| http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
| http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg
|
| What do y'all think?
|
| The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
| possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
| this spot is.
|
| Thanks so much for everybody's input!
| Angie
|



first of all
this house is a hip roof that has no ventilation on the hips
therefore the middle vented area takes longer to defrost.

2nd
this area is over a bathroom that may have poor insulation in the roof
allowing moisture to escape and causing condensation to freeze on the
roof.

In article , jm44316
@spamnotalltel.net says...

"krw" wrote in message
t...
In article . com,
says...
I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
this spot is.

It's hard to tell, but it looks like the "spot" is frozen. If so
perhaps it's just frost? Maybe that section of the roof is getting
*better* air flow so it's staying cold longer. Frost on roofs
around here is a good sign. ...well not this week (record temps).

--
Keith

Ya, but why would just that spot 'frost' and not the rest of the roof?

Perhaps that section of roof has better ventilation, so gets colder
faster. Perhaps worse so it warms slower. It's hard to tell, but
I see such things all the time.

I
doubt the rest of the roof is 'bad' and this one spot with frost is 'good'.

It could easily be that there is no 'good' or 'bad', just
'different'.

Obviously, there is a problem with moisture at that point on the roof.

No, it's not obvious at all. It certainly isn't moisture coming
out of the house freezing on the roof. Shingles aren't intended to
breathe.

Excess moisture in that spot is causing the frost.

*VERY* unlikely. The moisture would have to get through the
shingles.

In the last round of
pics that were posted, it looked like the sheathing was sagging and damaged
as well. Could be caused by problems with venting.

Didn't see them. If there is a problem, it's venting not moisture
coming through the shingles. If the sheathing is damaged (I can't
see it) it is a serious moisture problem.

You really need to have
a pro look at this. One who can investigate the cause, and correct it.
There could be a boatload of mold up there as well.

I *highly* doubt it, though anything can happen. I think you're
looking for a disaster.

The problem will not fix itself or go away, but it will get worse!

Not if there is no problem.

--
Keith

In article om,
says...

Frost forms when a surface cools to a temperature which is colder than
the dewpoint of the air next to the surface. The frosted area of the
roof must be cooler than the rest of the roof and has nothing to do
with moisture in the roof itself.

That does make sense, but why are the shingles wet when it's not below
freezing? That's why I was thinking that it's this wetness that causes
the frost.

When the temperature falls below the dew point, moisture (dew)
forms. If this temperature is below freezing the moisture
sublimates from its gaseous state directly to a solid (frost).

You all have some very interesting theories! My neighbor hasn't called
anybody yet to look at her house because of the holidays, but I hope
she will soon. She already had a leak in her roof in another spot last
year. She usually calls the guy who built the house, but I would think
this is not a good idea. If anything was in fact wrong with the
construction of the house, he sure wouldn't admit to it and fix it, he
would try to cover it up instead.

A call to an independent might help, if you can find one who wants
to get involved.

Glad it ain't my house!

ALL houses have issues. :-(

--
Keith

On 6 Jan 2007 22:34:23 -0800, "m35603" wrote:


The frost/snow is where it is the coldest. In
other words, all of the roof is colder than the
are where the frost is. The area where the frost
is either the area of best insulation or most
ventilation. Your neighbor should wish that all
of his roof look like what you call wet spots.

It *is* a wet spot when it's not below feezing. It is obvious that the
shingles are wet in this one spot in the morning. They dry durig the
day, but the next morning they are wet again.

Angie

Whether wet or frosted the area in question is cooler than the rest
of the roof. When this section gets cooler than the dewpoint then
either dew or frost will form. The majority of the roof usually never
gets cold enough for frost or dew to form because the majority of the
roof is warmed by the escaping heat from the house.

The area in question does no receive as much escaping heat as the
majority of the roof. This small section is insulated or sealed from
the rest of the house better than the majority of the roof.

In article om, "m35603" wrote:

Frost forms when a surface cools to a temperature which is colder than
the dewpoint of the air next to the surface. The frosted area of the
roof must be cooler than the rest of the roof and has nothing to do
with moisture in the roof itself.

That does make sense, but why are the shingles wet when it's not below
freezing? That's why I was thinking that it's this wetness that causes
the frost.

Same reason. The only difference between dew and frost is the temperature.

--
Regards,
Doug Miller (alphageek at milmac dot com)

It's time to throw all their damned tea in the harbor again.

"m35603" wrote in message
I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
this spot is.

Thanks so much for everybody's input!

Without an actual inspection, one can only go by the pictures you posted of
just one side of the roof.

Initial observations a
Two power vents located on other areas of the structure, which don't come
on during winter. I see no other forms of hip/ridge ventilation, and no
other pod type vents. The bathroom soil stacks are noted, but no vents for
exhaust fans in area (In my area, codes prohibit routing fans directly to
attic area, and to soffit areas.)

Just some thoughts. Since it's a cathedral ceiling, the insulation is
packed in cavity, keeping very well insulated, allowing the frost to remain
on roof in this area, vs more heat loss in other areas.

It looks wet when no other areas are, probably because it is. It could be
improper installation of insulation (no baffles) and/or lack of proper deck
venting, and/or lack of proper routing of bathroom venting to the exterior.

Also noted is what appears to be buckling of shingles (curls) in this area,
indicating lack of proper ventilation.

m35603 wrote:

I posted a question last week or so about my neighbor's roof having a
wet spot on it. Two days ago, I took a few more pictures. It was below
feezing overnight and at 7:30 am the neighbor's roof looked like this:

http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1605.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1604.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1603.jpg
http://i133.photobucket.com/albums/q...3/HPIM1602.jpg

What do y'all think?

The main suggestion under the other post were that it is caused by a
possible ventilation problem. The bathroom that is right there where
this spot is.

Thanks so much for everybody's input!
Angie

Hi,
How about go upto the roof and down in the attic and look?
Is it such a chore?

m35603 wrote:
Take another look, the white stuff is frost on the
outside of the house, the black areas are where
the frost melted. There is no problem, unless you
consider all the are that isn't frost covered.

The black areas are there even in 100 degree temperature in the middle
of August. I think somebody suggested it could be mold.

Angie


No. the black areas are just the shingles.

m35603 wrote:
The frost/snow is where it is the coldest. In
other words, all of the roof is colder than the
are where the frost is. The area where the frost
is either the area of best insulation or most
ventilation. Your neighbor should wish that all
of his roof look like what you call wet spots.

It *is* a wet spot when it's not below feezing. It is obvious that the
shingles are wet in this one spot in the morning. They dry durig the
day, but the next morning they are wet again.

Angie


Yes, that is what happens. I suggest you take a
course in what happens to roofs by looking around
at your neighborhood roofs after it snows and as
the snow disappears and after frosty nights; note
the aspect (direction of the roof slope). You
might want to note whether there is or is not
frost or condensed water on the windshields of
cars pointed north. Note that water can't pass
through windshields, so whether is water or frost
on the outside windshield surface has nothing to
do with ventilation in the car.

m35603 wrote:
Frost forms when a surface cools to a temperature which is colder than
the dewpoint of the air next to the surface. The frosted area of the
roof must be cooler than the rest of the roof and has nothing to do
with moisture in the roof itself.

That does make sense, but why are the shingles wet when it's not below
freezing? That's why I was thinking that it's this wetness that causes
the frost.

Because condensation can occur above the freezing
point; look for dew on the grass every morning.


You all have some very interesting theories! My neighbor hasn't called
anybody yet to look at her house because of the holidays, but I hope
she will soon. She already had a leak in her roof in another spot last
year. She usually calls the guy who built the house, but I would think
this is not a good idea. If anything was in fact wrong with the
construction of the house, he sure wouldn't admit to it and fix it, he
would try to cover it up instead.

Glad it ain't my house!
Angie

What you are seeing is a natural phenomenon that
occurs when there is nothing wrong with a roof.
I assume you are real, but you sound like a troll.
Next you will think something is wrong if snow
melts off the roof on the south side but stays on
the north side.

We had a moderate frost here this morning and I looked at a lot of roofs
on the way to work. Nearly every one had a frost pattern similar to the
pictures. There may well be problems with the neighbor's roof, but the
frost neither proves nor disproves anything. The roof-- and the house
itself-- don't look that old, so my guess is that this is much ado about
nothing. Larry