"George E. Cawthon" wrote in message
...
Bob F wrote:
"Al Bundy" wrote in message
...
Oren wrote in
:

On Sun, 5 Nov 2006 17:30:01 -0500, "Charles Schuler"
wrote:

With an extension ladder, the top of the extension should be well
above the roof edge, so that you can comfortably swing your foot onto
the roof (your hips should be well above the roof edge).
With the ladder being well above the roof line; it gives me a sense of
security. I feel like I at least have something to hold on to for
that first step onto the roof.
Agree, but also can't help thinking that whatever weight I am putting
on
it is towards the roof and above the fulcrum of the ladder on the roof
edge. The result is more kickout force at the foot :-)

Don't step on the ladder above the roof. Step on the first step down.
Having the ladder several feet above the roof means your hands can
hold it and stabilize it as you step.

Or it can mean you push against it and kick the
bottom out and you fall to the ground as you step
down.

That would be a pretty silly thing to do.

Bob

On Sun, 5 Nov 2006 13:53:47 -0800, "Eigenvector"
wrote:

I was thinking that it would be easier to use a step ladder rather than an
extension ladder, at least with a step ladder you can step sideways off the
ladder and turn and sit down on the roof. It doesn't work that way with an
extension ladder.

A step ladder is unstable in any user position other than being
in-line with the ladder. I once was on the third step of a 6 foot
step ladder and leaned to the side to remove an electrical cord hung
on a nail. Before I knew it I was on the concrete floor yelling in
pain. My hip took the fall. The ladder had flipped. It was 20
minutes before the pain subsided enough for me to get up. Fortunately
no bones were broken. Run the possiblity of the ladder flipping
through your head. Its not hard to imagine the sequence of events.

On Sun, 05 Nov 2006 19:40:11 -0800, e. wrote:

On 5 Nov 2006 18:27:06 -0800, "RicodJour"
wrote:

Al Bundy wrote:
Oren wrote in

With the ladder being well above the roof line; it gives me a sense of
security. I feel like I at least have something to hold on to for
that first step onto the roof.

Agree, but also can't help thinking that whatever weight I am putting on
it is towards the roof and above the fulcrum of the ladder on the roof
edge. The result is more kickout force at the foot :-)

That's the point of the ladder stabilizer. It moves the uppermost
contact point inwards. It also keeps the ladder off of the gutter, is
useful for other ladder applications, weighs very little, and keeps
people from putting nails in their roofs.

http://www.snapmediaworks.com/250402...eLib/hmpg1.jpg

My 2x4 triangle works exactly the same way and costs nothing.

Maybe so, but I've tried that on the end of a 32' extension
ladder, and it's too heavy to control. A aluminum stabalizer
weighs about 1/3rd as much and only costs $20 or so.

While you're up there, before you move from the ladder
to the roof, consider driving a screw-eye under
the eve, and tying the ladder in place.

On Mon, 06 Nov 2006 03:54:34 GMT, "Toller" wrote:


"Eigenvector" wrote in message
...
I know the basic safety of ladder use. It's easy to get to the roof, but
here is where my fear of heights and mechanics get in the way.

How to step off the ladder onto the roof and then how to get back onto the
ladder without knocking it off the eaves?

Beats the hell out of me. I tried to go up on my roof to fix a piece of
trim that had come loose, but I couldn't do it. I simply couldn't get my
foot to go up on the roof. I had to ask a friend to do it. When he did he
disturbed some bees that were nesting under the molding; so there he is
running across the roof flailing his arms around, and I can't even get up
there. I felt so so, well I'm sure you know how I felt.

Mind you, I have climbed 1,000' cliffs in Yosemite, and been sky diving and
hang gliding; but I can't go up on my roof.

Good luck; if you figure something out, let me know.

Cut a hole in the roof, and install an openable skylight,
and then mount one of those folding attic stairs.

"Eigenvector" wrote in message
...

"Toller" wrote in message
...

"Eigenvector" wrote in message
. ..
I know the basic safety of ladder use. It's easy to get to the roof, but
here is where my fear of heights and mechanics get in the way.

How to step off the ladder onto the roof and then how to get back onto
the ladder without knocking it off the eaves?

Beats the hell out of me. I tried to go up on my roof to fix a piece of
trim that had come loose, but I couldn't do it. I simply couldn't get my
foot to go up on the roof. I had to ask a friend to do it. When he did
he disturbed some bees that were nesting under the molding; so there he
is running across the roof flailing his arms around, and I can't even get
up there. I felt so so, well I'm sure you know how I felt.

Mind you, I have climbed 1,000' cliffs in Yosemite, and been sky diving
and hang gliding; but I can't go up on my roof.

Good luck; if you figure something out, let me know.
Goddamn, and I was expecting this to be one of those "You moron" threads.
I actually mountain climb too, it took me a few trips to get used to
navigating ledges, and free climbs are simply impossible, but like we all
seem to be saying - taking that last step onto the roof seems to be
impossible.
A kindred spirit! I can't boulder more than 3' off the ground or I start
trembling.

Bob F wrote:
"George E. Cawthon" wrote in message
...
Bob F wrote:
"Al Bundy" wrote in message
...
Oren wrote in
:

On Sun, 5 Nov 2006 17:30:01 -0500, "Charles Schuler"
wrote:

With an extension ladder, the top of the extension should be well
above the roof edge, so that you can comfortably swing your foot onto
the roof (your hips should be well above the roof edge).
With the ladder being well above the roof line; it gives me a sense of
security. I feel like I at least have something to hold on to for
that first step onto the roof.
Agree, but also can't help thinking that whatever weight I am putting
on
it is towards the roof and above the fulcrum of the ladder on the roof
edge. The result is more kickout force at the foot :-)
Don't step on the ladder above the roof. Step on the first step down.
Having the ladder several feet above the roof means your hands can
hold it and stabilize it as you step.
Or it can mean you push against it and kick the
bottom out and you fall to the ground as you step
down.

That would be a pretty silly thing to do.

Bob


Accidents often happen when people do silly
things. What can happen is that the person looses
their balance as they are stepping down and they
grabs the ladder. If the ladder is low, maybe 1
foot above the roof line, that is less likely to
happen because the person will already be squatted
down against the roof.

'Course the safest solution is to have a person on
the ground steady the ladder and stand so that the
ladder feet can't kick out.

Eigenvector wrote:
I know the basic safety of ladder use. It's easy to get to the roof, but
here is where my fear of heights and mechanics get in the way.

How to step off the ladder onto the roof and then how to get back onto the
ladder without knocking it off the eaves?

First time I tried it the act of pushing off the ladder to put my other foot
onto the roof would have kicked the ladder down. So I'm sitting there,
swaying in the wind trying to picture the motion needed to do it. It
doesn't help that I'm mildly afraid of heights, and more realistically
afraid of falling down and hitting the pavement.

I was thinking that it would be easier to use a step ladder rather than an
extension ladder, at least with a step ladder you can step sideways off the
ladder and turn and sit down on the roof. It doesn't work that way with an
extension ladder.

As others have said, make sure the ladder extends a few feet above the
roofline to give you something to grab on to.

On my ladder the feet can be positioned so that they stick into the
ground a couple inches, one end of them is spiky for that. Otherwise,
to secure the bottom of the ladder, put a piece of 2X4 across behind
it, then use stakes, spikes, short pieces of pipe, etc. to keep the 2X4
in place. If on asphalt you can drive masonry nails through the wood
into the asphalt below. Or, prop the bottom of the ladder against
something sturdy like the tire of your car (just make sure other family
members don't drive it away then!). To secure the top of the ladder,
put a C-clamp on the gutter and tie it to that (or one on each side).

wrote:
"Eigenvector" wrote in message
. ..

wrote in message
oups.com...
I dont care for heights either. My other home had a spot where the roof
came together

Kinda of a L shape, I would go up there it still bothered me.

I can stand on a ladder and do stuff pretty good........

but climbing on roof is tough


You know I could do that, put the ladder in the corner of the roofline,
that way I could step off sideways.

The biggest problem I had, and I mentioned this to the first poster, I was
using a borrowed ladder, a ladder that was rated for 200 lbs and I am NOT
200 lbs, plus the thing is like cooked spaghetti in that it wobbles all
around. So maybe just using a better ladder would be to my benefit. I
gotta get those damn gutters cleaned or I won't ever fix that water
problem...
Rueful Chuckle- I resemble that remark. I'm fat enough that class 1a is the
only thing I will buy or use more than 3 feet off the ground. Sams had a
good price on 24 foot, 50 bucks cheaper than the other place had 20 foot. 20
foot would be a lot easier to carry and spot, on this tall 1-story. Buy a
decent ladder, or hire a service to clean the gutters. Stuff that can kill
you, or take a long annoying time to heal up from, is NOT the place to cut
corners.

aem sends....

Consumer Reports did a thing on ladders recently, kind of an
eye-opener. They don't have the safety margin you'd expect from other
semi-regulated products. As I always suspected, if you weigh 200 lbs
and you're on a 200 lb ladder, a good thump with your foot will buckle
some of them. Their advice was basically to get the highest rated one
you can find, no matter what you weigh.

On 5 Nov 2006 19:16:18 -0800, "RicodJour"
wrote:


My newest ladder has flared legs/feet on both ends; not like the
picture, but the same idea.

Not really. The wider stance is more stable on the ground, and more
stable leaning against a wall, but it doesn't make it any more stable
when you're climbing onto a roof.

R

I agree. The flared legs can give a false sense of security. I like
them best for my comfort. I have been known to stabilize my ladder
with the bumper of my truck ( 28" ext on a slopped drive ). If I get
shaky and I do I come down...G
--
Oren

"Well, it doesn't happen all the time, but when it happens, it happens constantly."

On Sun, 5 Nov 2006 14:19:15 -0800, "Eigenvector"
wrote:


"RicodJour" wrote in message
oups.com...
Eigenvector wrote:
I know the basic safety of ladder use. It's easy to get to the roof, but
here is where my fear of heights and mechanics get in the way.

How to step off the ladder onto the roof and then how to get back onto
the
ladder without knocking it off the eaves?

First time I tried it the act of pushing off the ladder to put my other
foot
onto the roof would have kicked the ladder down. So I'm sitting there,
swaying in the wind trying to picture the motion needed to do it. It
doesn't help that I'm mildly afraid of heights, and more realistically
afraid of falling down and hitting the pavement.

I was thinking that it would be easier to use a step ladder rather than
an
extension ladder, at least with a step ladder you can step sideways off
the
ladder and turn and sit down on the roof. It doesn't work that way with
an
extension ladder.

Use a ladder stabilizer.

R


What do you mean? It was a borrowed ladder, so that is strike one against
me right there,

I borrowed a ladder when I painted my , and I was very picky then and
bought a pair of ladder mittens. I returned the ladder and borrowed
it again 10 years later. It had no mittens.

But in the intervening time, I found a ladder stabilizer in the
mini-storage that my friend lets me clean out once in a while, when
people move out and don't take all their stuff**. And that would be
in the way for my frriend if I returned the ladder with that on it,
plus I don't want to lose the thing.

So in short, I put the stabilizer one, and before I return the ladder,
I'm taking it off.

They are great. I'm surprised they don't get even more good publicity
and that I don't see them in use all the time.


**(I posted here at the time about where to buy square U-bolts, but of
course if you buy the whole thing, it will have that.)

Also, if your ladder is 4 feet above the gutter, it makes getting on
and off much easier.

Getting on the ladder to go down is much harder than going up.


but more to the point. A more steady ladder would help
greatly obviously, but being afraid of heights I need to picture the motion
in my head and I couldn't do it.

It's one of those things where you're afraid to do it but once you do it and
see how to do it it's no longer a big deal.

I wouldn't say that. It's still a problem for me. But this time,
with the stabilizer, I was only doing gutter spikes and didn't have
occasion to get on the roof. So I know it will be better but I don't
know how much.

I did go up on the roof twice while the roofer was here, once to look
at what he was doing and once to put a collar on my chimney**.
Because his ladder was about 3 feet taller than the gutter, it was
really easy.

I think the stabilizer alone would also be a big help. Get a
stabilizer and take it off when you return the ladder, or discuss it
with your friend. Maybe, probably he will want it, but he'll give it
back to you if you buy your own ladder. This would be a way of
thanking him for lending you the ladder. I really can't do the same
thing with my friend, because his parents have died (at the ages of 95
and 99) and that house is sold, and he's separated from his wife and
not living in that house. He keeps his ladder in a semi-public
building that has another ladder just as long.

**Almost all of the townhouses that I can see have a collar on each
chimney, but one or two in addition to one of mine don't. I went 22
years just using a lot of black caulk, but having the collar too is
better. I bought a universal one for about 10 or 20 dollars and
trimmed it to fit.

It was this way with me and
climbing into my attic. Again the act of stepping off the ladder and into
the attic was beyond me. It was only when I forced myself to do it once and
saw that it wasn't a big deal did it become a trivial task. By the way,
getting back down out of the attic was just as tough.

Once I knocked the ladder over, and had to jump down, avoiding the
closet shelf as best I could, and the clothes rod, and everything on
the floor of the closet** including the ladder which looked dangerous.
I didn't get hurt, but after that, I installed a phone in the attic
and promised myself I would leave the front door unlocked when I went
up there. Ooo, I should put the phone numbers of my neighbors up
there too.


**(wide and shallow with folding doors)

On 6 Nov 2006 12:28:26 -0800, "z" wrote:




Consumer Reports did a thing on ladders recently, kind of an
eye-opener. They don't have the safety margin you'd expect from other
semi-regulated products. As I always suspected, if you weigh 200 lbs

I suspected otherwise. I thought if it said 200, you could be 275!
Thanks for letting me know. I really mean that.

People may not like my remedy, but I went from 240 to 210 before I
borrowed the ladder. At 240, even if the ladder held, I would have
been hard to get myself up and down. I hit 184 this morning, and
have until February 1 or April 1 to get to 160. Then the hard part
comes which is not putting it on again. Even 184 (I'm 5'8" and 59
years old) is wonderful though. I have a little pot belly, but I feel
young again.

and you're on a 200 lb ladder, a good thump with your foot will buckle
some of them. Their advice was basically to get the highest rated one
you can find, no matter what you weigh.

Like you, I borrowed mine. I have nowhere indoors to store any ladder
over 7 foot. But I have decided that teenagers don't steal ladders
because they are only useful for work. Adults don't steal ladders
because they are hard to fence. Only people with houses would want to
steal a ladder, and none of my neighbors are (that kind of?) thief.

It does't look good underneath my backyard deck, but not so bad
either. And if it is stolen I will give my friend the choice of my
buying him a new one of the same brand, or my giving him the full
price of a new one. With friends, I don't believe in this
"depreciation" stuff. Even with strangers I don't think it is always
the right thing, but that's more complicated.

On Sun, 5 Nov 2006 18:02:16 -0500, "Charles Schuler"
wrote:


"Tony Hwang" wrote in message
news:H%t3h.259554$5R2.140527@pd7urf3no...
wrote:


Hmmm,
As a life long ham radio operator, I climbed towers, ladderss, worked on
2 story high roofs kazillion times but still height is not my favourite,
LOL!. Accident needs only split second to happen. If you don't feel like
climbing for the moment, don't.

One of my best ham friends ... WA3WJF ... fell from his tower and met his
maker. This has happened too many times to too many good people.

Wow.

A guy I worked with, a rugged guy in his late 40's or early 50's, fell
1 1/2 stories off his split level house. His wife was doing dishes at
the sink, looking out the window, and saw him fly by. He was lucky
that he only broke his leg, but unlucky that his leg wouldn't heal.
He was on crutches for 6 months, a year, and still was when I changed
jobs. Every night he would plug himself in to some electromagnetic
radiation thing that promoted healing in most people (who didn't just
heal by themselves), but for him it was verrrrry slow.

e wrote:

JLT 22' is what I own. I consider it the best ladder on the planet.
I weight about 290 and this is the only step ladder I'll use..It is like
standing on a rock. There is absolutely no flex in this ladder.

http://www.jawsladders.com/whyjaws.html

I have the leg extender and a platform for tools, paint cans, etc.

I checked out the web site and don't see any appreciable differences
between that and the Little Giant ladder. The FORTY interlocking teeth
spiel is just that, a spiel. The odds of the steel pins that lock the
Little Giant shearing off are so remote it's not worth mentioning. The
different mechanisms, turn knobs vs. spring loaded pins, would seem to
be a trade off. Pins are marginally faster to lock. Jaws have more
positions. What are the benefits of the added positions? Where, for
instance, would you need a ladder that locks at say a 90 degree angle?

I also don't like their logic on the standing platform. Unless you're
in the habit of putting the platform on the very bottom rung (why would
you even bother breaking out such a serious ladder if you only have to
get a foot off of the ground?), the load applied to either platform
configuration will be inside of the legs and won't affect stability.
The advantage to the Little Giant platform is that the upper rung is
not in the way of your shins. The advantage to the Jaws platform is
that it is not in your way as you climb up and down the ladder.

The ladder is priced higher than the Little Giant, but I don't see a
major difference. I assume, due to your conviction of the superiority
of the Jaws, that you've been on a Little Giant as well. What are the
differences in use?

R

www.ladders.com

The Little Giant is the best ladder for people who are that worried
about climbing but still want to do things themselves. I bought model
26 but kind of wish I bought model 22. This thing feels really stable.
I would recommend purchasing the leg leveleler to go with it. It also
comes with a ladder stabalizer if you want to get it.

e wrote:

HUGE difference in stability for big men and I've spent time on both. JAWS
is the best step ladder bar none.
You have to get up 7-8 feet and FEEL the difference.
BTW Jaws is much heavier than the Little Giant. Not for women unless they
eat their wheaties..

Little Giant makes ladders with different ratings. The normal ladder
you see advertised is their 1A ladder. They make a 1AA which is what
you should be comparing it to.

I'm not sure what you mean about the Jaws ladder being heavier. From
their respective web sites it seems that the comparable Little Giant is
about 14 pounds heavier than the Jaws - that's a definite drawback.

In any event, seeing that I can't get up to your weight class in time
to make a convincing argument, I'll capitulate on the heavy weight
ladder recommendation. Consider yourself lucky. It doesn't happen
often.

R

mm wrote in
:

On Sun, 5 Nov 2006 18:02:16 -0500, "Charles Schuler"
wrote:


"Tony Hwang" wrote in message
news:H%t3h.259554$5R2.140527@pd7urf3no...
wrote:


Hmmm,
As a life long ham radio operator, I climbed towers, ladderss,
worked on 2 story high roofs kazillion times but still height is not
my favourite, LOL!. Accident needs only split second to happen. If
you don't feel like climbing for the moment, don't.

One of my best ham friends ... WA3WJF ... fell from his tower and met
his maker. This has happened too many times to too many good people.

Wow.

A guy I worked with, a rugged guy in his late 40's or early 50's, fell
1 1/2 stories off his split level house. His wife was doing dishes at
the sink, looking out the window, and saw him fly by. He was lucky
that he only broke his leg, but unlucky that his leg wouldn't heal.
He was on crutches for 6 months, a year, and still was when I changed
jobs. Every night he would plug himself in to some electromagnetic
radiation thing that promoted healing in most people (who didn't just
heal by themselves), but for him it was verrrrry slow.



looking out the window, and saw him fly by.

Classic skit used on Married With Children with the patio door. Always
funny as hell in that context.

On Sun, 05 Nov 2006 14:42:27 -0800, Oren wrote:

On Sun, 5 Nov 2006 17:30:01 -0500, "Charles Schuler"
wrote:

With an extension ladder, the top of the extension should be well above the
roof edge, so that you can comfortably swing your foot onto the roof (your
hips should be well above the roof edge).

With the ladder being well above the roof line; it gives me a sense of
security. I feel like I at least have something to hold on to for
that first step onto the roof.

I think you not only feel that way, you DO have something to hold
onto.

I think you not only have a sense of security, you actually do have
more security when the ladder extends well above the roof line.

I mention this because in the last few months quite a few politicians
and administrators have talked just the way you did here, except from
a different perspective.

I heard more than one person on the radio saying that their goal, or
the goal of the agency or part of an agency they administer, or the
program they were voting for, that the goal was to give Americans a
sense of security. They didn't say that they were improving our actual
security, only our sense of security. It was very depressing**. You
are not depressing, because you're talking about your own security or
sense of it, not mine, and because you're evaluating, not discussing
your goal.

**Depressing partly because of the way they talk, and partly because
there are so many areas where security could be improved, ship cargo,
for just one example.

So retrospectively you're downplaying how much benefit the tall ladder
gives you; and that's probably a good thing, because you're
recommending a tall ladder to others, but you don't want to promise to
them, or even claim for yourself, more than you're sure of. You're
not a liar.

But these politicians and administrators, whose job is to increase our
actual security, not just our sense of it, have, if you accept what
they say, downgraded their goals to increasing only our sense of
security.

Coming down I grab the ladder and then
step down.

I really fell better when someone is holding the bottom.

Try to roll when you fall.

IMO, that's not just about feeling better either. If the helper has
his feet planted right at the base of the ladder and is leaning his
weight on the ladder to keep it in place, you are safer.

On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 17:34:19 -0500, mm
wrote:

Try to roll when you fall.

I'm not really planning on falling, because landing on my head makes
it hard to roll. Paratroopers are taught to roll when they land. This
is a good point.

IMO, that's not just about feeling better either. If the helper has
his feet planted right at the base of the ladder and is leaning his
weight on the ladder to keep it in place, you are safer.

I help a friend with work now and then. He knows I hate ladder work,
but we were putting up molding today on 16 ' ceilings.

His "policy" is that "if you fall, you are fired before you hit the
ground (grin)" .
--
Oren

"Well, it doesn't happen all the time, but when it happens, it happens constantly."

On Sun, 5 Nov 2006 16:14:20 -0800, "Eigenvector"
wrote:


With the ladder being well above the roof line; it gives me a sense of
security. I feel like I at least have something to hold on to for
that first step onto the roof.

Agree, but also can't help thinking that whatever weight I am putting on
it is towards the roof and above the fulcrum of the ladder on the roof
edge. The result is more kickout force at the foot :-)

That's EXACTLY what I was thinking at the time I tried it. I felt like a
little scaredy cat standing on that ladder wondering how painful it would be
to jump down to the ground if the ladder fell while stepping on to the roof.

Some people screw in a big eyebolt and tie the ladder to it as soon as
they get to the top.

On Sun, 5 Nov 2006 18:39:04 -0800, "Eigenvector"
wrote:


"RicodJour" wrote in message
oups.com...
Al Bundy wrote:
Oren wrote in

With the ladder being well above the roof line; it gives me a sense of
security. I feel like I at least have something to hold on to for
that first step onto the roof.

Agree, but also can't help thinking that whatever weight I am putting on
it is towards the roof and above the fulcrum of the ladder on the roof
edge. The result is more kickout force at the foot :-)

That's the point of the ladder stabilizer. It moves the uppermost
contact point inwards. It also keeps the ladder off of the gutter, is
useful for other ladder applications, weighs very little, and keeps
people from putting nails in their roofs.

http://www.snapmediaworks.com/250402...eLib/hmpg1.jpg

R

Thank you very much for the clarification, I initially misinterpreted what
you said about "ladder stabilizer" Now that I've seen it I totally
understand how that would help.

I could have explained it too, but I didn't think to.

What did you think a ladder stabilizer was? I'm curious.

Anything to do with gyroscopes?

On Wed, 08 Nov 2006 11:36:50 -0800, e wrote:

JLT 22' is what I own. I consider it the best ladder on the planet.
I weight about 290 and this is the only step ladder I'll use..It is like
standing on a rock. There is absolutely no flex in this ladder.

http://www.jawsladders.com/whyjaws.html

I have the leg extender and a platform for tools, paint cans, etc.

I read and this ladder is made of marine alloy. My little giant is
aircraft Aluminum. I don't know the difference; technically as to
which is stronger.

BTW I saw LG ladders for sale today at the orange store.
--
Oren

"Well, it doesn't happen all the time, but when it happens, it happens constantly."

"mm" wrote in message
Like you, I borrowed mine. I have nowhere indoors to store any ladder
over 7 foot. But I have decided that teenagers don't steal ladders
because they are only useful for work. Adults don't steal ladders
because they are hard to fence. Only people with houses would want to
steal a ladder, and none of my neighbors are (that kind of?) thief.


Have you looked at the scrap value of aluminum recently? They
are stealing aluminum guard rails from bridges and roads. What do
they use those for?

A Chain and lock can help.

Bob

"mm" wrote in message
**(I posted here at the time about where to buy square U-bolts, but of
course if you buy the whole thing, it will have that.)

Where did you get them?

Bob

"mm" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 5 Nov 2006 18:39:04 -0800, "Eigenvector"
wrote:


"RicodJour" wrote in message
roups.com...
Al Bundy wrote:
Oren wrote in

With the ladder being well above the roof line; it gives me a sense
of
security. I feel like I at least have something to hold on to for
that first step onto the roof.

Agree, but also can't help thinking that whatever weight I am putting
on
it is towards the roof and above the fulcrum of the ladder on the roof
edge. The result is more kickout force at the foot :-)

That's the point of the ladder stabilizer. It moves the uppermost
contact point inwards. It also keeps the ladder off of the gutter, is
useful for other ladder applications, weighs very little, and keeps
people from putting nails in their roofs.

http://www.snapmediaworks.com/250402...eLib/hmpg1.jpg

R

Thank you very much for the clarification, I initially misinterpreted what
you said about "ladder stabilizer" Now that I've seen it I totally
understand how that would help.

I could have explained it too, but I didn't think to.

What did you think a ladder stabilizer was? I'm curious.

Anything to do with gyroscopes?

No, I presumed he was talking about those feet extenders that you put on
ladders to make the base more stable on uneven terrain.

No, I presumed he was talking about those feet extenders that you
put on ladders to make the base more stable on uneven terrain.

I solved my whole roof/ladder problem when I found an inside corner
where I could put the ladder and them climb up and get off *sideways*.

"Bert Byfield" wrote in message
. 167...
No, I presumed he was talking about those feet extenders that you
put on ladders to make the base more stable on uneven terrain.

I solved my whole roof/ladder problem when I found an inside corner
where I could put the ladder and them climb up and get off *sideways*.

My favorite choice also.

Bob

I solved my whole roof/ladder problem when I found an inside corner
where I could put the ladder and them climb up and get off *sideways*.

My favorite choice also.

Bob

or add a opening skylight, come on roof thru attic.

this should be REQUIRED in places like new orleans that can flood fast
so someone trapped in a attic has a way out in a flood..........

this should be REQUIRED in places like new orleans that can flood fast
so someone trapped in a attic has a way out in a flood..........

FWIW, I don't think the problem in NO was that the flooding
was FAST, so much as it that, once the water's high enough
to convince you you'd rather be on the roof, it's already
too deep to go outside. And if you're going to
mandate a roof hatch, are you going to mandate a little
rubber raft, too? And little bottle of iodine tablets
and two cans of spam?

On Fri, 10 Nov 2006 10:40:11 -0500, Goedjn wrote:



this should be REQUIRED in places like new orleans that can flood fast
so someone trapped in a attic has a way out in a flood..........

FWIW, I don't think the problem in NO was that the flooding
was FAST, so much as it that, once the water's high enough
to convince you you'd rather be on the roof, it's already
too deep to go outside. And if you're going to
mandate a roof hatch, are you going to mandate a little
rubber raft, too? And little bottle of iodine tablets
and two cans of spam?


And suicide pills for when you realize that you can't wait forever to
be rescued :-)

On Fri, 10 Nov 2006 20:39:33 -0600, Sam E
wrote:

On Fri, 10 Nov 2006 10:40:11 -0500, Goedjn wrote:



this should be REQUIRED in places like new orleans that can flood fast
so someone trapped in a attic has a way out in a flood..........

FWIW, I don't think the problem in NO was that the flooding
was FAST, so much as it that, once the water's high enough
to convince you you'd rather be on the roof, it's already
too deep to go outside. And if you're going to
mandate a roof hatch, are you going to mandate a little
rubber raft, too? And little bottle of iodine tablets
and two cans of spam?


And a laptop computer with newsgroup access, in case you need more
spam....... Such as "Work at home"..... That would give you something
to eat and something to do while you drown. This laptop should also
have web access to ebay, for bidding on plane tickets and fake
memorbilia from the remains of your city.



And suicide pills for when you realize that you can't wait forever to
be rescued :-)


If I was trapped in an attic that was flooding, I sure as hell would
bust a hole thru the roof or gable end.. Some people just dont seem
to have any common sense......

In article .com,
wrote:

I solved my whole roof/ladder problem when I found an inside corner
where I could put the ladder and them climb up and get off *sideways*.

My favorite choice also.

Bob

or add a opening skylight, come on roof thru attic.

this should be REQUIRED in places like new orleans that can flood fast
so someone trapped in a attic has a way out in a flood..........


Or in places (a) where houses have basements and (b) are
located near a nuclear plant -- in case of meltdown (easily
accomplished, apparantely, by eg driving boats into water
intake valves if site is on river).

Why?

Well, with all the fallout, you can escape it only by
lying on basement floor, where the path to ground surface
goes through enough ground and subterrainian (sp?) rocks
strongly dimishes the rays.

*EXCEPT* for the roof -- whatever falls up there will
radiate down at you. So you have to get rid of that
fallout.

How? With a hand-held leaf-blower -- given that you
can get *onto* the roof (quickly!, on and off).

For that, some kind of trap-door onto the roof, from
the attic, would be a help -- a big help.

Of course, the leaf-blower would have to be
gasoline-powered (meltdown means no more electric
power).


Early on, you'd go up there every hour or two, I guess,
to blow the stuff off the roof.


David

In article ,
(David Combs) wrote:


Well, with all the fallout, you can escape it only by
lying on basement floor, where the path to ground surface
goes through enough ground and subterrainian (sp?) rocks
strongly dimishes the rays.

*EXCEPT* for the roof -- whatever falls up there will
radiate down at you. So you have to get rid of that
fallout.

How? With a hand-held leaf-blower -- given that you
can get *onto* the roof (quickly!, on and off).

For that, some kind of trap-door onto the roof, from
the attic, would be a help -- a big help.

Of course, the leaf-blower would have to be
gasoline-powered (meltdown means no more electric
power).


Early on, you'd go up there every hour or two, I guess,
to blow the stuff off the roof.


I would suspect that a water sprinkler on the roof would wash the dust
off easier & better and could be operated from the basement. You might
need a battery operated pump, but there is a good chance water pressure
will last longer than electricity.

--
Free men own guns - www.geocities/CapitolHill/5357/ (add .com after geocities)