The roofing contractor hired a service to bring a dumpster to put the
old roof in (mostly the tiles). The dumpster people initially charged
about $350. The roofing company was supposed to pay it, but when the
guy asked for a check, we mistakenly payed it to him. The roofing
company was supposed to pay him, not us. Then the roofing company
reimbursed us the money for the dumpster. Then later on, when the
dumpster company guy came to pick up the dumpster, he said it was 4
tons overweight (4 tons beyond the limit) and wanted us to pay $145
extra. I told him that didn't sound right to me and anyway the roofing
company is responsible for paying. They left the dumpster that day, but
today they came again and took the dumpster away. I don't think they'll
be bothering us anymore. They never gave us a receipt for the money or
told us in advance about extra charges for extra weight.

Do you think they were trying to rip us off?
I don't see how our old roofing materials could be 8,000 pounds
overweight.
That sounds way too high. It's just a 3 bedroom house.
It seems to me that the total weight of the materials should be less
than 4 tons.
It's also not clear why they should charge $145 more even if it really
was 8,000 pounds overweight. We called the roofer and they said it was
bull**** too.
It seems like a scam. Why should we pay $500 just for them to bring a
dumpster and take it away? The $350 charge even seemed rather steep.

Then later on, when the
dumpster company guy came to pick up the dumpster, he said it was 4
tons overweight (4 tons beyond the limit) and wanted us to pay $145
extra.
So how did this guy know it was 4 tons overweight? Did he have a weigh
station with him?
Richard

Excellent question. I can see it being overweight (shingles are quite
heavy) maybe, but there's no way they could have known without driving
it to a scale somewhere first.

wrote:

It's also not clear why they should charge $145 more even if it really
was 8,000 pounds overweight. We called the roofer and they said it was
bull**** too.

Landfills charge by weight, weigh the truck coming in, and again going
out.

When I got dumpster service for my remodel, what I was throwing out was
part of the price, something like brick or masonry was more expensive
than general construction debris.

If they quoted based on expecting asphalt shingles, and got clay tiles
instead, that would be much heavier, and as a result more expensive.

"louie" wrote in message
oups.com...
Excellent question. I can see it being overweight (shingles are quite
heavy) maybe, but there's no way they could have known without driving
it to a scale somewhere first.

Not exactly true. When the load is brought up on to the truck, excess weight
is instantly noticed.

I had the same issue when I rented a container to move. I had space in the
back and all across the top. When they picked it up the guy was bitching
that it was to heavy. I asked him, "Now that it is half on and half off your
truck just what can I do about it?"

As for the number quoted. The guy could have been close. He picks these
containers up all day and drives to the dump where they are weighted.

louie wrote:
Excellent question. I can see it being overweight (shingles are quite
heavy) maybe, but there's no way they could have known without driving
it to a scale somewhere first.

The "tipping fee" is based on weight. How do you know the dumpster was
empty when he started on your roof?

SQLit wrote:

Not exactly true. When the load is brought up on to the truck, excess weight
is instantly noticed.

I had considered that, but the OP mentioned that they left the dumpster
there that day and didn't pick it up until the day after they had been
there demanding more money. So my thoughts we
#1 If they didn't pick it up, they couldn't know how much it weighed
#2 I've never heard of a driver demanding payment right then and there
for an unverified weight. I've had to rent these before, and the
companies have always billed after the dumpster was picked up. So they
could have been close, but... close enough to actually bill the
customer right there? I doubt it.

He said his truck had a scale in it.

wrote:
He said his truck had a scale in it.
I Googled that and it is possible but rare. It's also unusual for the
driver to demand payment on the spot. I live in Chicago and it reminds
me of the tow truck operators. I was comming out of an office and the
guy was getting ready to tow my car. He said "Well it would sure be a
shame to tow your car. I don't actually have it hooked up yet....." I
tried to hand him a $20. " No, no not so obvious, put it down there by
the bumper". I did. Reaching down to unhook my car and nab the bill,
"Well it looks like this car is legal after all, say any people in
there belong to these other cars?"
Da city dat works.
Richard

wrote:
The roofing contractor hired a service to bring a dumpster to put the
old roof in (mostly the tiles). The dumpster people initially charged
about $350. The roofing company was supposed to pay it, but when the
guy asked for a check, we mistakenly payed it to him. The roofing
company was supposed to pay him, not us. Then the roofing company
reimbursed us the money for the dumpster. Then later on, when the
dumpster company guy came to pick up the dumpster, he said it was 4
tons overweight (4 tons beyond the limit) and wanted us to pay $145
extra. I told him that didn't sound right to me and anyway the roofing
company is responsible for paying. They left the dumpster that day, but
today they came again and took the dumpster away. I don't think they'll
be bothering us anymore. They never gave us a receipt for the money or
told us in advance about extra charges for extra weight.

Do you think they were trying to rip us off?
I don't see how our old roofing materials could be 8,000 pounds
overweight.
That sounds way too high. It's just a 3 bedroom house.
It seems to me that the total weight of the materials should be less
than 4 tons.
It's also not clear why they should charge $145 more even if it really
was 8,000 pounds overweight. We called the roofer and they said it was
bull**** too.
It seems like a scam. Why should we pay $500 just for them to bring a
dumpster and take it away? The $350 charge even seemed rather steep.

They weigh the trucks at the landfill/incinerator/transfer station.

i think the weights are deliberately under for the size, but shingles
are heavy compared to standard construction debris

wrote:
The roofing contractor hired a service to bring a dumpster to put the
old roof in (mostly the tiles). The dumpster people initially charged
about $350. The roofing company was supposed to pay it, but when the
guy asked for a check, we mistakenly payed it to him. The roofing
company was supposed to pay him, not us. Then the roofing company
reimbursed us the money for the dumpster. Then later on, when the
dumpster company guy came to pick up the dumpster, he said it was 4
tons overweight (4 tons beyond the limit) and wanted us to pay $145
extra. I told him that didn't sound right to me and anyway the roofing
company is responsible for paying. They left the dumpster that day, but
today they came again and took the dumpster away. I don't think they'll
be bothering us anymore. They never gave us a receipt for the money or
told us in advance about extra charges for extra weight.

Do you think they were trying to rip us off?
I don't see how our old roofing materials could be 8,000 pounds
overweight.
That sounds way too high. It's just a 3 bedroom house.
It seems to me that the total weight of the materials should be less
than 4 tons.
It's also not clear why they should charge $145 more even if it really
was 8,000 pounds overweight. We called the roofer and they said it was
bull**** too.
It seems like a scam. Why should we pay $500 just for them to bring a
dumpster and take it away? The $350 charge even seemed rather steep.



Don't know where you live but here the charge is
typically by the size and the time you keep the
dumpster. And $350, is a lot. They 4-5 foot high
by 20 foot by 8 foot dumpster would typically cost
about $125 for a month.

I think it was a ripoff or collusion between the
roofer and the dumpster people. Shingle are heavy
but if the house is about 2000 square feet, you
couldn't possibly be 4 tons extra, I doubt you
could be 4 tons total.

In article ,
says...
I think it was a ripoff or collusion between the
roofer and the dumpster people. Shingle are heavy
but if the house is about 2000 square feet, you
couldn't possibly be 4 tons extra, I doubt you
could be 4 tons total.


Standard tile run around 800 lb per square, so 20 squares of roofing of
the tile alone would be 8 tons. A search of dumpster rental shows a 20
yard roll off (22x4.5x8) dumpster rents for $445 for 3 tons, 98/ton
over. Roofer may of contacted a company with a better price than listed
above and told the guy 20 sqaures of roofing material, an experienced
dumpster hauler probably knows the weight difference of mid range
composition shingles that weighs around 3 tons for that amount and what
tiles will weigh. When he got there realized it would cost so much extra
in his guesstimation... possibly left the dumpster to complain to the
roofer who reminded him of the quote he was given, by incompetent sales
staff and had to come by the next day and eat the difference..who knows.
--
Lar

Oh, if only Noah would of been a bit more wise,
he surely would of swatted those two flies.

to email....get rid of the BUGS

Sounds like you got off light, asphalt roofing is very heavy and the new
trend is for the dumpster to have a max weight. When the dumpster was
delivered, someone had to sign a receipt which stated the weight limits. The
dumpster for my three bedroom roof cost me $900 with the overweight
wrote in message
oups.com...
The roofing contractor hired a service to bring a dumpster to put the
old roof in (mostly the tiles). The dumpster people initially charged
about $350. The roofing company was supposed to pay it, but when the
guy asked for a check, we mistakenly payed it to him. The roofing
company was supposed to pay him, not us. Then the roofing company
reimbursed us the money for the dumpster. Then later on, when the
dumpster company guy came to pick up the dumpster, he said it was 4
tons overweight (4 tons beyond the limit) and wanted us to pay $145
extra. I told him that didn't sound right to me and anyway the roofing
company is responsible for paying. They left the dumpster that day, but
today they came again and took the dumpster away. I don't think they'll
be bothering us anymore. They never gave us a receipt for the money or
told us in advance about extra charges for extra weight.

Do you think they were trying to rip us off?
I don't see how our old roofing materials could be 8,000 pounds
overweight.
That sounds way too high. It's just a 3 bedroom house.
It seems to me that the total weight of the materials should be less
than 4 tons.
It's also not clear why they should charge $145 more even if it really
was 8,000 pounds overweight. We called the roofer and they said it was
bull**** too.
It seems like a scam. Why should we pay $500 just for them to bring a
dumpster and take it away? The $350 charge even seemed rather steep.

George E. Cawthon wrote:

Don't know where you live but here the charge is
typically by the size and the time you keep the
dumpster. And $350, is a lot. They 4-5 foot high
by 20 foot by 8 foot dumpster would typically cost
about $125 for a month.

That depends _entirely_ on where the project is. If I had a guy ask
for $350 for a 20 yard dumpster I would write out the check so fast he
wouldn't have time to blink, much less reconsider the price. Around
here it would easily be 2-3 times that amount.

I think it was a ripoff or collusion between the
roofer and the dumpster people. Shingle are heavy
but if the house is about 2000 square feet, you
couldn't possibly be 4 tons extra, I doubt you
could be 4 tons total.

The OP said the roofing was tile, which usually is about 1000 pounds
per square. 20 square, 20,000 pounds. I have the suspicion that the
roofer told the carting company that it was a roof tearoff and
neglected to mention it was a tile roof. The carting company may have
assumed it was a more typical shingle roof.

If the OP hadn't erroneously paid for the dumpster removal in the first
place, he probably wouldn't have known what the dumpster cost and
wouldn't feel that the price is too high. The OP put himself in the
middle of a transaction where he had no business. In any event, the
roofer is responsible for the debris removal, so the OP has no reason
to feel he is getting ripped off unless the roofer is asking for more
money.

R

Lar wrote:
In article ,
says...
I think it was a ripoff or collusion between the
roofer and the dumpster people. Shingle are heavy
but if the house is about 2000 square feet, you
couldn't possibly be 4 tons extra, I doubt you
could be 4 tons total.


Standard tile run around 800 lb per square, so 20 squares of roofing of
the tile alone would be 8 tons. A search of dumpster rental shows a 20
yard roll off (22x4.5x8) dumpster rents for $445 for 3 tons, 98/ton
over. Roofer may of contacted a company with a better price than listed
above and told the guy 20 sqaures of roofing material, an experienced
dumpster hauler probably knows the weight difference of mid range
composition shingles that weighs around 3 tons for that amount and what
tiles will weigh. When he got there realized it would cost so much extra
in his guesstimation... possibly left the dumpster to complain to the
roofer who reminded him of the quote he was given, by incompetent sales
staff and had to come by the next day and eat the difference..who knows.

Some times you read what you want instead of what
is actually there. Yep I missed the tile, or
dismissed it, and was thinking composition. I
never heard of anyone tearing off tile, so that is
why I dismissed it. Lots of rebuilds but they
remove and stack the tile and reuse it. Unless of
course someone just wants a change.

Right, we don't know what happened. Anyone I have
talked to has said they would price it with and
without a tear off, but none of the cost were ever
itemized. The OP erred, as he admits, in paying
for the dumpster. Unless specific to the contract
that was his concern. If the roofer bid the
project and wrote the contract incorrectly he
would just have to eat any error he made. But
did the OP have a contract and a final cost in
written form?

RicodJour wrote:
George E. Cawthon wrote:

Don't know where you live but here the charge is
typically by the size and the time you keep the
dumpster. And $350, is a lot. They 4-5 foot high
by 20 foot by 8 foot dumpster would typically cost
about $125 for a month.


That depends _entirely_ on where the project is. If I had a guy ask
for $350 for a 20 yard dumpster I would write out the check so fast he
wouldn't have time to blink, much less reconsider the price. Around
here it would easily be 2-3 times that amount.


I think it was a ripoff or collusion between the
roofer and the dumpster people. Shingle are heavy
but if the house is about 2000 square feet, you
couldn't possibly be 4 tons extra, I doubt you
could be 4 tons total.


The OP said the roofing was tile, which usually is about 1000 pounds
per square. 20 square, 20,000 pounds. I have the suspicion that the
roofer told the carting company that it was a roof tearoff and
neglected to mention it was a tile roof. The carting company may have
assumed it was a more typical shingle roof.

If the OP hadn't erroneously paid for the dumpster removal in the first
place, he probably wouldn't have known what the dumpster cost and
wouldn't feel that the price is too high. The OP put himself in the
middle of a transaction where he had no business. In any event, the
roofer is responsible for the debris removal, so the OP has no reason
to feel he is getting ripped off unless the roofer is asking for more
money.

R


Yep I knew I was sticking my foot in my mouth for
talking about costs. But I did say here. Based
on what I read in this newsgroup, our costs for
many thing are way below a lot of other places,
but if the costs weren't low, the people would
move away because wages here are not high either
except for the top layer.

I agree with all the rest you said, and I was
thinking asphalt not tile. Don't see much tile
because of the expense, but tile is suppose to
(does) last a long time.

George E. Cawthon wrote:

Yep I knew I was sticking my foot in my mouth for
talking about costs. But I did say here. Based
on what I read in this newsgroup, our costs for
many thing are way below a lot of other places,
but if the costs weren't low, the people would
move away because wages here are not high either
except for the top layer.

I agree with all the rest you said, and I was
thinking asphalt not tile. Don't see much tile
because of the expense, but tile is suppose to
(does) last a long time.

It's also a regional thing. In this area the higher end homes have
slate. Either tile or slate, you'd better make sure that the rafters
can take the big increase in weight.

R

If corp or company specific, those trucks or the dumpster itself usually
have a phone number on them. Or at least the trademark name.
Allegations of weight overage should be referred to them and how this was
surmised specifically to your case. In fact, all the pricing specifics
could be gotten from them. Since its not your responsibility, I wouldn't
worry about it.

I would concern myself in the future about paying a contractors' sub for
him/her by mistake.

Big dumpster I hired only had a requirement that the debris could not exceed
the top of the dumpster, and hazmat could not be deposited. I burned the
wood scraps, all else was put in the dumpster. That burning saved me one
hauling fee.
--
Jonny
wrote in message
oups.com...
The roofing contractor hired a service to bring a dumpster to put the
old roof in (mostly the tiles). The dumpster people initially charged
about $350. The roofing company was supposed to pay it, but when the
guy asked for a check, we mistakenly payed it to him. The roofing
company was supposed to pay him, not us. Then the roofing company
reimbursed us the money for the dumpster. Then later on, when the
dumpster company guy came to pick up the dumpster, he said it was 4
tons overweight (4 tons beyond the limit) and wanted us to pay $145
extra. I told him that didn't sound right to me and anyway the roofing
company is responsible for paying. They left the dumpster that day, but
today they came again and took the dumpster away. I don't think they'll
be bothering us anymore. They never gave us a receipt for the money or
told us in advance about extra charges for extra weight.

Do you think they were trying to rip us off?
I don't see how our old roofing materials could be 8,000 pounds
overweight.
That sounds way too high. It's just a 3 bedroom house.
It seems to me that the total weight of the materials should be less
than 4 tons.
It's also not clear why they should charge $145 more even if it really
was 8,000 pounds overweight. We called the roofer and they said it was
bull**** too.
It seems like a scam. Why should we pay $500 just for them to bring a
dumpster and take it away? The $350 charge even seemed rather steep.

Jim wrote:

Big dumpster I hired only had a requirement that the debris could not exceed
the top of the dumpster, and hazmat could not be deposited. I burned the
wood scraps, all else was put in the dumpster. That burning saved me one
hauling fee.

you didn't burn any treated lumber did you?

) said...

[snip]
Then later on, when the dumpster company guy came to pick up the dumpster,
he said it was 4 tons overweight (4 tons beyond the limit) and wanted us to
pay $145 extra.

This sounds fishy to me for three reasons:

- 4 tons OVER the limit sounds rather high for a roofing job

- how can the driver determine this without actually weighing the load?

And the one that really has me thinking this guy is scamming some
quick cash:

- around here, tipping fees are in the $80 per ton range, so four
extra tons would have me expecting another $320

Sometimes, asking for a low amount can highlight a greedy *******! ;-)

--
Calvin Henry-Cotnam
"Never ascribe to malice what can equally be explained by incompetence."
- Napoleon
-------------------------------------------------------------------------
NOTE: if replying by email, remove "remove." and ".invalid"

"chickenwing" wrote in message
oups.com...

Jim wrote:

Big dumpster I hired only had a requirement that the debris could not
exceed
the top of the dumpster, and hazmat could not be deposited. I burned
the
wood scraps, all else was put in the dumpster. That burning saved me
one
hauling fee.

you didn't burn any treated lumber did you?


Yes, very little though. Had an awesome color to it. Intense heat from
hard/soft woods already burning assured its demise. Plats out here are 5,
10, and 20 acres.

--
Jonny

It is unlikely he had onboard scales on the truck. If he did the
dumpster would have had to been loaded all the way on and it would be
best it it were on level ground.

On 29 Dec 2005 10:01:11 -0800, wrote:

He said his truck had a scale in it.

On 29 Dec 2005 07:36:49 -0800, wrote:

The roofing contractor hired a service to bring a dumpster to put the
old roof in (mostly the tiles). The dumpster people initially charged
about $350. The roofing company was supposed to pay it, but when the
guy asked for a check, we mistakenly payed it to him. The roofing
company was supposed to pay him, not us. Then the roofing company
reimbursed us the money for the dumpster. Then later on, when the
dumpster company guy came to pick up the dumpster, he said it was 4
tons overweight (4 tons beyond the limit) and wanted us to pay $145
extra. I told him that didn't sound right to me and anyway the roofing
company is responsible for paying. They left the dumpster that day, but
today they came again and took the dumpster away. I don't think they'll
be bothering us anymore. They never gave us a receipt for the money or
told us in advance about extra charges for extra weight.

Do you think they were trying to rip us off?
I don't see how our old roofing materials could be 8,000 pounds
overweight.
That sounds way too high. It's just a 3 bedroom house.
It seems to me that the total weight of the materials should be less
than 4 tons.
It's also not clear why they should charge $145 more even if it really
was 8,000 pounds overweight. We called the roofer and they said it was
bull**** too.
It seems like a scam. Why should we pay $500 just for them to bring a
dumpster and take it away? The $350 charge even seemed rather steep.
All most all of the dumpster people seem to be a rip off. They all try
to get the most they can. Be sure you get all the if,s ,ands, But's
first Chao!



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