I've got a 12x20 foot family room that already has gas logs in the
fireplace. The fireplace is suburbia standard-issue... flush with the
chimney brick and glass doors.

A few years ago we had an ice storm that knocked out power for almost there
days. Despite having the fireplace going all that time, the temperature in
the room never got above 55 deg. The fireplace damper was open, since the
logs came with the house and I'm not sure if they are the vented kind or
not.

I'd like to get a set of gas logs that will both look nice and actually put
out usable heat. My question is which type -- I'm leaning towards veneted,
but want to get a set that will not send most of the heat up the chimney.
I've read where there is a partially-vented type. Has anyone had any
experience with those?

Also, any brands to recommend?

I would never buy an unvented type. If they are not acceptable for a
bedroom they are not acceptable for my house.

The best product out there energy wise is an insert with ceramic glass. If
you decide to go with an insert, make sure it has ceramic glass and not
tempered glass. Ceramic glass can take the heat and stays closed all the
time. It has double walls internally and a fan that draws in air into a box
separate from the combustion. We had gas logs before and we love the
insert. Plus it is zero clearnance. Only disadvantage is that fan won't
work when power goes down. You still get heat but no circulation. It
lights without power with the flick of a switch but circulation won't have
fan power. 2 stainless steel tubes go up the chimney. One for fresh air
and the other for exhaust. No fumes get into the house. According to the
literature, it is as efficient as some furnaces.


"DesignGuy" wrote in message
news:952jf.368693$084.54504@attbi_s22...
I've got a 12x20 foot family room that already has gas logs in the
fireplace. The fireplace is suburbia standard-issue... flush with the
chimney brick and glass doors.

A few years ago we had an ice storm that knocked out power for almost
there
days. Despite having the fireplace going all that time, the temperature in
the room never got above 55 deg. The fireplace damper was open, since the
logs came with the house and I'm not sure if they are the vented kind or
not.

I'd like to get a set of gas logs that will both look nice and actually
put
out usable heat. My question is which type -- I'm leaning towards veneted,
but want to get a set that will not send most of the heat up the chimney.
I've read where there is a partially-vented type. Has anyone had any
experience with those?

Also, any brands to recommend?

"Art" wrote in message
link.net...
I would never buy an unvented type. If they are not acceptable for a
bedroom they are not acceptable for my house.
====
And if they are acceptable for a bedroom (which they are)?

http://tinyurl.com/7vdr7
====

The best product out there energy wise is an insert with ceramic glass.
If you decide to go with an insert, make sure it has ceramic glass and not
tempered glass. Ceramic glass can take the heat and stays closed all the
time. It has double walls internally and a fan that draws in air into a
box separate from the combustion. We had gas logs before and we love the
insert. Plus it is zero clearnance. Only disadvantage is that fan won't
work when power goes down. You still get heat but no circulation. It
lights without power with the flick of a switch but circulation won't have
fan power. 2 stainless steel tubes go up the chimney. One for fresh air
and the other for exhaust. No fumes get into the house. According to the
literature, it is as efficient as some furnaces.


"DesignGuy" wrote in message
news:952jf.368693$084.54504@attbi_s22...
I've got a 12x20 foot family room that already has gas logs in the
fireplace. The fireplace is suburbia standard-issue... flush with the
chimney brick and glass doors.

A few years ago we had an ice storm that knocked out power for almost
there
days. Despite having the fireplace going all that time, the temperature
in
the room never got above 55 deg. The fireplace damper was open, since the
logs came with the house and I'm not sure if they are the vented kind or
not.

I'd like to get a set of gas logs that will both look nice and actually
put
out usable heat. My question is which type -- I'm leaning towards
veneted,
but want to get a set that will not send most of the heat up the chimney.
I've read where there is a partially-vented type. Has anyone had any
experience with those?

Also, any brands to recommend?

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 19:36:37 GMT, "DesignGuy"
wrote:

I've got a 12x20 foot family room that already has gas logs in the
fireplace. The fireplace is suburbia standard-issue... flush with the
chimney brick and glass doors.

A few years ago we had an ice storm that knocked out power for almost there
days. Despite having the fireplace going all that time, the temperature in
the room never got above 55 deg. The fireplace damper was open, since the
logs came with the house and I'm not sure if they are the vented kind or
not.

I'd like to get a set of gas logs that will both look nice and actually put
out usable heat. My question is which type -- I'm leaning towards veneted,
but want to get a set that will not send most of the heat up the chimney.
I've read where there is a partially-vented type. Has anyone had any
experience with those?

Also, any brands to recommend?


There are three types, vented, unvented, and direct vent.

Vented - most heat goes up the stack, you can get exchangers to try to
extract some but they are not all that effective in my view.

Unvented - heat stays in the room but they deplete oxygen and create
water vapor in the room, make your windows sweat and I don't think
most codes allow them in rooms where you sleep.

Direct vent - uses outside combustion air so no oxygen depletion nor
CO2 formation so no sweating, however this type has a permanently
closed glass door when operating. Has good heating quality, but
easiest and least costly installation is on an exterior wall.

For Vented I would recommend any of the brands made by Hargrove
Manufacturing, only because I know the owners and they are good
people. Don't know about unvented or direct vent.


Google the subject, you will learn a lot.

"Art" wrote

I would never buy an unvented type. If they are not acceptable for a
bedroom they are not acceptable for my house.


I see that posted all the time. Why?

I have ventless. I have had them for 12 years now. I have 2 CO detectors in
the same room as the fireplace and they have NEVER gone off. I don't get any
off-smells either (except if I let the tank run out and then that is
minimal).

The way I look at it, I'm getting almost 100% efficiency because all of the
heat is staying in the house and not going up a chimney.

Not saying you are wrong. Just don't understand why people say it. If they
were even SLIGHTLY dangerous, do you think companies would take the risk of
selling them. ESPECIALLY in this sue-happy world we live in today?

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 20:51:05 GMT, "Gini" wrote:


"Art" wrote in message
hlink.net...
I would never buy an unvented type. If they are not acceptable for a
bedroom they are not acceptable for my house.
====
And if they are acceptable for a bedroom (which they are)?

Sorry Gini. You seem to be missing a bit of info there. While the item
looks all nice and pretty you have forgotten to point out that:
The very first page of the instructions (which I dont seem to find)
will have enough warnings that you will think you just purchased a
nuclear bomb. Did you notice that "ODS"? That is an Oxygen Depletion
Sensor. Do you understand that your pretty little bedroom appliance
will deplete the oxygen? What will you breathe after the oxygen
disappears? Carbon Dioxide? Maybe Carbon Monoxide? Did you see in the
directions (oh yeah, they forgot those) where it tells you to open
your window while your unit is running? Hmmm, that sounds efficient.
I wouldnt burn a non vented appliance in my home for all the tea in
China..............much less in my bedroom. I usually like to wake up
in the morning.
Bubba

http://tinyurl.com/7vdr7
====

The best product out there energy wise is an insert with ceramic glass.
If you decide to go with an insert, make sure it has ceramic glass and not
tempered glass. Ceramic glass can take the heat and stays closed all the
time. It has double walls internally and a fan that draws in air into a
box separate from the combustion. We had gas logs before and we love the
insert. Plus it is zero clearnance. Only disadvantage is that fan won't
work when power goes down. You still get heat but no circulation. It
lights without power with the flick of a switch but circulation won't have
fan power. 2 stainless steel tubes go up the chimney. One for fresh air
and the other for exhaust. No fumes get into the house. According to the
literature, it is as efficient as some furnaces.


"DesignGuy" wrote in message
news:952jf.368693$084.54504@attbi_s22...
I've got a 12x20 foot family room that already has gas logs in the
fireplace. The fireplace is suburbia standard-issue... flush with the
chimney brick and glass doors.

A few years ago we had an ice storm that knocked out power for almost
there
days. Despite having the fireplace going all that time, the temperature
in
the room never got above 55 deg. The fireplace damper was open, since the
logs came with the house and I'm not sure if they are the vented kind or
not.

I'd like to get a set of gas logs that will both look nice and actually
put
out usable heat. My question is which type -- I'm leaning towards
veneted,
but want to get a set that will not send most of the heat up the chimney.
I've read where there is a partially-vented type. Has anyone had any
experience with those?

Also, any brands to recommend?

On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 23:38:14 GMT, "Dr. Hardcrab"
wrote:


"Art" wrote

I would never buy an unvented type. If they are not acceptable for a
bedroom they are not acceptable for my house.


I see that posted all the time. Why?

I have ventless. I have had them for 12 years now. I have 2 CO detectors in
the same room as the fireplace and they have NEVER gone off. I don't get any
off-smells either (except if I let the tank run out and then that is
minimal).

The way I look at it, I'm getting almost 100% efficiency because all of the
heat is staying in the house and not going up a chimney.

Not saying you are wrong. Just don't understand why people say it. If they
were even SLIGHTLY dangerous, do you think companies would take the risk of
selling them. ESPECIALLY in this sue-happy world we live in today?


Hey Doc,
You might want to go to coexperts.com and you might understand why
your CO detector doesnt alarm. I hope you also read the first two
warning pages of your owners manual for your unvented appliance/s.
Bubba

Just because it doesnt alarm does not mean its safe. Use a digital read
out unit and keep it visable, then learn about low level continous
exposure. Vented logs is best.

"Bubba" ReMoVe wrote


Hey Doc,
You might want to go to coexperts.com and you might understand why
your CO detector doesnt alarm. I hope you also read the first two
warning pages of your owners manual for your unvented appliance/s.
Bubba


So THAT'S why my penis fell off!!!!!

;-]


Hey! I never knew that. What the hell! Who reads the instructions anyway???

It does say not to install in a bedroom or bathroom (why a bathroom?). The
room that it IS installed in is 24 X 30 and we usually never close off the
rest of the house. We also never run it all night (just a couple hours in
the evening). Maybe that is why we haven't had any problems.

I think I will start cracking a window.

All of a sudden I feel dizzy......

I'll pour myself another one....

"Bubba" ReMoVe wrote in message
...
On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 20:51:05 GMT, "Gini" wrote:


"Art" wrote in message
thlink.net...
I would never buy an unvented type. If they are not acceptable for a
bedroom they are not acceptable for my house.
====
And if they are acceptable for a bedroom (which they are)?

Sorry Gini. You seem to be missing a bit of info there. While the item
looks all nice and pretty you have forgotten to point out that:
The very first page of the instructions (which I dont seem to find)
will have enough warnings that you will think you just purchased a
nuclear bomb. Did you notice that "ODS"? That is an Oxygen Depletion
Sensor. Do you understand that your pretty little bedroom appliance
will deplete the oxygen? What will you breathe after the oxygen
disappears? Carbon Dioxide? Maybe Carbon Monoxide? Did you see in the
directions (oh yeah, they forgot those) where it tells you to open
your window while your unit is running? Hmmm, that sounds efficient.
I wouldnt burn a non vented appliance in my home for all the tea in
China..............much less in my bedroom. I usually like to wake up
in the morning.
====
Oh good grief, Bubba--Get a grip. We've had a vent-free for 8 years now and
have awakened every morning just fine (and we live in a very tight newer
home). It's
also been very economical. We use it as our main heat source.
====
====

"Gini" wrote in message
news:lL8jf.824$s96.489@trndny01...

"Bubba" ReMoVe wrote in message
...
On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 20:51:05 GMT, "Gini" wrote:


"Art" wrote in message
rthlink.net...
I would never buy an unvented type. If they are not acceptable for a
bedroom they are not acceptable for my house.
====
And if they are acceptable for a bedroom (which they are)?

Sorry Gini. You seem to be missing a bit of info there. While the item
looks all nice and pretty you have forgotten to point out that:
The very first page of the instructions (which I dont seem to find)
will have enough warnings that you will think you just purchased a
nuclear bomb. Did you notice that "ODS"? That is an Oxygen Depletion
Sensor. Do you understand that your pretty little bedroom appliance
will deplete the oxygen? What will you breathe after the oxygen
disappears? Carbon Dioxide? Maybe Carbon Monoxide? Did you see in the
directions (oh yeah, they forgot those) where it tells you to open
your window while your unit is running? Hmmm, that sounds efficient.
I wouldnt burn a non vented appliance in my home for all the tea in
China..............much less in my bedroom. I usually like to wake up
in the morning.
====
Oh good grief, Bubba--Get a grip. We've had a vent-free for 8 years now
and
have awakened every morning just fine (and we live in a very tight newer
home). It's
also been very economical. We use it as our main heat source.

The fumes have caused you to have brain damage and be in denial.

"Oscar_Lives" wrote in message
news:6b9jf.610114$xm3.124831@attbi_s21...

"Gini" wrote in message
news:lL8jf.824$s96.489@trndny01...

"Bubba" ReMoVe wrote in message
...
On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 20:51:05 GMT, "Gini" wrote:


"Art" wrote in message
arthlink.net...
I would never buy an unvented type. If they are not acceptable for a
bedroom they are not acceptable for my house.
====
And if they are acceptable for a bedroom (which they are)?

Sorry Gini. You seem to be missing a bit of info there. While the item
looks all nice and pretty you have forgotten to point out that:
The very first page of the instructions (which I dont seem to find)
will have enough warnings that you will think you just purchased a
nuclear bomb. Did you notice that "ODS"? That is an Oxygen Depletion
Sensor. Do you understand that your pretty little bedroom appliance
will deplete the oxygen? What will you breathe after the oxygen
disappears? Carbon Dioxide? Maybe Carbon Monoxide? Did you see in the
directions (oh yeah, they forgot those) where it tells you to open
your window while your unit is running? Hmmm, that sounds efficient.
I wouldnt burn a non vented appliance in my home for all the tea in
China..............much less in my bedroom. I usually like to wake up
in the morning.
====
Oh good grief, Bubba--Get a grip. We've had a vent-free for 8 years now
and
have awakened every morning just fine (and we live in a very tight newer
home). It's
also been very economical. We use it as our main heat source.

The fumes have caused you to have brain damage and be in denial.
===
Damn. I always blamed that brain damage thing on the 60s.
===

for emergency use remember to open the kitchen window an inch or two
and turn on the unvented natural gas oven with the oven door closed and
battery operated CO detectors tested and working.

your existing fireplace may just be rated as decorative.
vented natural gas heat is always required to avoid health problems
including asthma.
inserts are made in many different sizes, you'll want to get the
largest BTU that will fit into the fireplace opening size.

"Gini" wrote in message
news:Ap9jf.830$s96.700@trndny01...

"Oscar_Lives" wrote in message
news:6b9jf.610114$xm3.124831@attbi_s21...

"Gini" wrote in message
news:lL8jf.824$s96.489@trndny01...

"Bubba" ReMoVe wrote in message
...
On Tue, 29 Nov 2005 20:51:05 GMT, "Gini" wrote:


"Art" wrote in message
. earthlink.net...
I would never buy an unvented type. If they are not acceptable for a
bedroom they are not acceptable for my house.
====
And if they are acceptable for a bedroom (which they are)?

Sorry Gini. You seem to be missing a bit of info there. While the item
looks all nice and pretty you have forgotten to point out that:
The very first page of the instructions (which I dont seem to find)
will have enough warnings that you will think you just purchased a
nuclear bomb. Did you notice that "ODS"? That is an Oxygen Depletion
Sensor. Do you understand that your pretty little bedroom appliance
will deplete the oxygen? What will you breathe after the oxygen
disappears? Carbon Dioxide? Maybe Carbon Monoxide? Did you see in the
directions (oh yeah, they forgot those) where it tells you to open
your window while your unit is running? Hmmm, that sounds efficient.
I wouldnt burn a non vented appliance in my home for all the tea in
China..............much less in my bedroom. I usually like to wake up
in the morning.
====
Oh good grief, Bubba--Get a grip. We've had a vent-free for 8 years now
and
have awakened every morning just fine (and we live in a very tight newer
home). It's
also been very economical. We use it as our main heat source.

The fumes have caused you to have brain damage and be in denial.
===
Damn. I always blamed that brain damage thing on the 60s.

See-- that denial problem has you refusing to admit that the fumes from the
fireplace are causing your problem!

In article ,
Bubba ReMoVe wrote:
I wouldnt burn a non vented appliance in my home for all the tea in
...snipped...
Bubba

Like a gas stove?

--

Larry Wasserman Baltimore, Maryland

On Wed, 30 Nov 2005 18:10:20 GMT, (Lawrence
Wasserman) wrote:

In article ,
Bubba ReMoVe wrote:
I wouldnt burn a non vented appliance in my home for all the tea in
...snipped...
Bubba

Like a gas stove?

Exactly like a gas stove. I have one. It has spark ignition and right
above the stove is the exhaust fan that vents OUTSIDE. I dont run the
stove without it. I dont heat with space heaters or Kerosene heaters
either. Those homes smell like ****.
Dont you remember going into your grandmas house years ago when she
had a stove with 5 constantly burning pilots? Did you ever wonder why
her house always smelled "funny/different"? That wasnt her ****ed on
bathroom floor you smelled.
Bubba

Current NC code requires a fresh air vent for your laundry room if you have
a gas dryer. I am not sure about the gas stove.


"Bubba" wrote in message
...
On Wed, 30 Nov 2005 18:10:20 GMT, (Lawrence
Wasserman) wrote:

In article ,
Bubba ReMoVe wrote:
I wouldnt burn a non vented appliance in my home for all the tea in
...snipped...
Bubba

Like a gas stove?

Exactly like a gas stove. I have one. It has spark ignition and right
above the stove is the exhaust fan that vents OUTSIDE. I dont run the
stove without it. I dont heat with space heaters or Kerosene heaters
either. Those homes smell like ****.
Dont you remember going into your grandmas house years ago when she
had a stove with 5 constantly burning pilots? Did you ever wonder why
her house always smelled "funny/different"? That wasnt her ****ed on
bathroom floor you smelled.
Bubba