I have a load of decorating (tiling and paper hanging) to do at mum in laws
house and was think about purchasing a not too expensive laser level that
can be used to mark vertical and horizontal straight lines on walls and
ceilings.
There seem to be quite a few in the diy sheds. Do they produce a thin enough
line for decent accuracy (2mm), and how easy are they for getting a true
vertical or horizontal? Any opinions or recommendations please?
David.

On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 16:57:42 GMT, "DavidM"
wrote:

I have a load of decorating (tiling and paper hanging) to do at mum in laws
house and was think about purchasing a not too expensive laser level that
can be used to mark vertical and horizontal straight lines on walls and
ceilings.
There seem to be quite a few in the diy sheds. Do they produce a thin enough
line for decent accuracy (2mm), and how easy are they for getting a true
vertical or horizontal? Any opinions or recommendations please?
David.

If you live near Bristol, you can borrow mine?

On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 16:57:42 GMT, "DavidM"
wrote:

There seem to be quite a few in the diy sheds. Do they produce a thin enough
line for decent accuracy (2mm), and how easy are they for getting a true
vertical or horizontal?

They're pretty good. The sort with a beam-widening lens on the end of a
spot beam aren;t much good, as it's too hard to adjust the lens level.
They're really only for making a more visible horizontal marker when
adjust thin posts vertically.

The "flying spot" (whirling mirror) type is best for wallpapering. They
have a good "reach" and a very long usable line. Ideally they should be
self-levelling, some require manual levelling on a small bubble level.

The "projected cross" sort are best for tiling. They have a pendulum and
a pair of line-projector lights. The cross is easy to set up, but the
length of the useful line is relatively short (better in dim light) and
a bit shorter than ideal for wallpaper. I pai 50 quid for mine from
Screwfix and I notice they're now on offer at 30 quid from Axminster,
which is an excellent bargain.

--
Cats have nine lives, which is why they rarely post to Usenet.

DavidM wrote:
I have a load of decorating (tiling and paper hanging) to do at mum in laws
house and was think about purchasing a not too expensive laser level that
can be used to mark vertical and horizontal straight lines on walls and
ceilings.
There seem to be quite a few in the diy sheds. Do they produce a thin enough
line for decent accuracy (2mm), and how easy are they for getting a true
vertical or horizontal? Any opinions or recommendations please?
David.


I tried a level from B&Q. Width of line was about 4mm. I had hoped for a
razor sharp accurate line. No such luck. A distant memory from the
optics section of my engineering degree suggests it's to do with the
"mode" of operation of the laser. Maybe a high quality laser gives a
finer line.

Alternatively, for a few pounds, buy some clear tubing from the local
DIY store that's at least 10mm diameter. Fill with water and make sure
that there are no air bubbles. The miniscus of the water at either end
will be at the same height. This system can go around corners, down
stairs and back up again etc.

Simple.

On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 18:20:54 +0000, Rob Horton
wrote:

A distant memory from the
optics section of my engineering degree suggests it's to do with the
"mode" of operation of the laser.

You're nowhere near that limit. The limit in operation here is more
about the lens diameter and the near/far field transition.

Besides which, the better levels have a nice wide line for better
visibility and for better range (it's that near/far limit again).
However the edges of this line are sharp, parallel and well defined.
Although the illuminated area is wide, then useful accuracy is better
than this.

On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 16:57:42 GMT, DavidM wrote:

There seem to be quite a few in the diy sheds. Do they produce a
thin enough line for decent accuracy (2mm),

The £20 one with leveling base and tripod I have has aline width of
about 2mm but also a narrow dark line down the middle.

and how easy are they for getting a true vertical or horizontal?

Verticals still use a plumb bob but project that onto the wall with
the laser. Probably not much of an issue in a modern plasterboarded
box with flat walls but one of our bedroom walls is so bowed that to
get the 6' plumb line to hang freely it had to be at the end of a 2"
nail at the top and the weight was 4" away from the wall, the line
just clear of the bulge... The laser made it a doddle to accurately
transfer the vertical to the wall.

The accuracy of the bubbles and ease of use of the leveling head
leaves a little to be desired but to put a line around a room for a
border or dado rail it's worth spending the time as you are guaranteed
to get a plane not a spiral...

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 16:57:42 GMT, DavidM wrote:

There seem to be quite a few in the diy sheds. Do they produce a
thin enough line for decent accuracy (2mm),

The £20 one with leveling base and tripod I have has aline width of
about 2mm but also a narrow dark line down the middle.

and how easy are they for getting a true vertical or horizontal?

Verticals still use a plumb bob but project that onto the wall with
the laser. Probably not much of an issue in a modern plasterboarded
box with flat walls but one of our bedroom walls is so bowed that to
get the 6' plumb line to hang freely it had to be at the end of a 2"
nail at the top and the weight was 4" away from the wall, the line
just clear of the bulge... The laser made it a doddle to accurately
transfer the vertical to the wall.

The accuracy of the bubbles and ease of use of the leveling head
leaves a little to be desired but to put a line around a room for a
border or dado rail it's worth spending the time as you are guaranteed
to get a plane not a spiral...

I'm sure numbers of people are hovering to buy, so please can we name
specific models that do (or don't) work well?


--
Ian White

On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 08:40:44 +0000, Ian White
wrote:

to get a plane not a spiral...

I'm sure numbers of people are hovering to buy, so please can we name
specific models that do (or don't) work well?

Seconded. I've been tempted by one of these for a while,

Cheers,

John

Ian White Wrote:
Dave Liquorice wrote:
On Sat, 19 Nov 2005 16:57:42 GMT, DavidM wrote:

There seem to be quite a few in the diy sheds. Do they produce a
thin enough line for decent accuracy (2mm),

The £20 one with leveling base and tripod I have has aline width of
about 2mm but also a narrow dark line down the middle.

and how easy are they for getting a true vertical or horizontal?

Verticals still use a plumb bob but project that onto the wall with
the laser. Probably not much of an issue in a modern plasterboarded
box with flat walls but one of our bedroom walls is so bowed that to
get the 6' plumb line to hang freely it had to be at the end of a 2"
nail at the top and the weight was 4" away from the wall, the line
just clear of the bulge... The laser made it a doddle to accurately
transfer the vertical to the wall.

The accuracy of the bubbles and ease of use of the leveling head
leaves a little to be desired but to put a line around a room for a
border or dado rail it's worth spending the time as you are guaranteed
to get a plane not a spiral...

I'm sure numbers of people are hovering to buy, so please can we name
specific models that do (or don't) work well?


--
Ian White

If you are levelling around a room I would really just use a good
quality spirit level, at least 1200mm long, and flip the level around
each time you mark the line so as to cancel out any innacuracies within
the level. I've used severall cheap laser's and I still dont think you
can beat a good spirit level used carefully. I've wasted so much time
trying to set up and re set up lasers, then checking and double
checking then finding its "out" a bit, re checking , re marking etc etc
etc. You get my drift. Do it carefully with a spirit level and you know
its right.
For distance levelling I always use a water level, again if you take
care it is 100% accurate, no question, and it'll go around corners,
into niches , cupboards etc.
I dont think you need to look towards new "fads" when the old ways do
the job as well if not better.


--
Nick H

"John Anderton" wrote in message
...
On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 08:40:44 +0000, Ian White
wrote:

to get a plane not a spiral...

I'm sure numbers of people are hovering to buy, so please can we name
specific models that do (or don't) work well?

Seconded. I've been tempted by one of these for a while,

Cheers,

John

I bought a Black & Decker level laser, it 'levels' by a
pendulum system but should be hung off a nail/screw -
I have difficulty inserting an appropriate nail or screw
_exactly_ where I need it in the hard-walls of my 'thirties' house.
Although the thing self-levels there's no mechanism for
vertical (heave) adjustment - other than a different nail/screw-
might work on plasterboard where one can pepper holes.
Still: holding the thing by hand, so the laser-line projects through
the pencil mark I've previously scribed, does enable a level-line to
be marked by someone else around a room and a picture
rail married up and didn't spiral - I wouldn't buy one these
again - but having acquired it; I'll keep it 'cos it's OK for
'Quick' levelling. but IMHE - it's a two-man job.
I later, purchased a gizmo off QVC which is a tripod mounted
level (switchable) and plumb (switchable) projector.
The cross hairs and the vertical (heave) adjustment on the tripod
mean that a pencilled mark can be matched exactly and the
rotating (yaw) projector head enables a line to be marked
around a room . It's dead handy for lining up pictures, mirrors,
architrave, curtain rails etc. etc. I'd definitely recommend the use
of one of these - it permits 'one-man' to mark off a room for
tiling etc. etc.

--

Brian

On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 10:37:59 GMT, John Anderton wrote:

I'm sure numbers of people are hovering to buy, so please can we
name specific models that do (or don't) work well?

Seconded. I've been tempted by one of these for a while,

The cheapies are mass produced in China and badged, they probably all
come form just one or two factories. I got mine off eBay it's badged
"Power Master". An identical looking model, with all the same
accessories, was for sale in Focus DIY under a different name. They
had shelves full of 'em for a week or three on "when it's gone it's
gone" sort of offer.

I wouldn't trust it's levels for anything particulary critical, after
all it does say on it 0.5mm/m... Which may only refer to the main
bubble not the laser part. With care it does make transfering
plumblines to walls more accurate and for marking out a plane for a
border/dado or even the bottom of a row of tiles irreplaceable.

--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

"DavidM" wrote in message
...
I have a load of decorating (tiling and paper hanging) to do at mum in
laws
house and was think about purchasing a not too expensive laser level that
can be used to mark vertical and horizontal straight lines on walls and
ceilings.
There seem to be quite a few in the diy sheds. Do they produce a thin
enough
line for decent accuracy (2mm), and how easy are they for getting a true
vertical or horizontal? Any opinions or recommendations please?
David.



When I came to do the bathroom tiling I thought about buying a laser and
changed my mind when I saw the prices of decent ones.
Instead I bought a good builders level for £20 and pencilled around the
walls. I then screwed battens under the line, this has given me a perfect
horizontal plane and of course being right-angled tiles I have also got
perfect verticals.

I have since used the level to wallpaper and that was fine.

The best is that I have also laid a patio with the level and I don't think
that could have been done using a laser.

Cheers
Steve

On Sun, 20 Nov 2005 11:19:44 +0000, Nick H wrote:

If you are levelling around a room I would really just use a good
quality spirit level, at least 1200mm long, and flip the level
around each time you mark the line so as to cancel out any
innacuracies within the level.

But doesn't allow you to compensate to innacuracies in the room. The
chances are that something that is dead level won't actually look
right. A laser enables you to mark a plane that looks right and be
close to true level.


--
Cheers
Dave. pam is missing e-mail

Has no one ever thought of glueing one of them laser lights on a normal
spirit level?

I have. :-)
--
Sir Benjamin Middlethwaite

snip
I tried a level from B&Q. Width of line was about 4mm. I had hoped for a
razor sharp accurate line. No such luck. A distant memory from the
optics section of my engineering degree suggests it's to do with the
"mode" of operation of the laser. Maybe a high quality laser gives a
finer line.


More likely to do with (deliberate lack of) collimation. The optics are
probably set up so that the beam diverges - otherwise, the laser might
take your eye out!

[Cordless Crazy]

Originally Posted by DavidM

I have a load of decorating (tiling and paper hanging) to do at mum in laws
house and was think about purchasing a not too expensive laser level that
can be used to mark vertical and horizontal straight lines on walls and
ceilings.
There seem to be quite a few in the diy sheds. Do they produce a thin enough
line for decent accuracy (2mm), and how easy are they for getting a true
vertical or horizontal? Any opinions or recommendations please?
David.

Cheap lasers are not accurate. Will need to spend 200GBP+

Get a horizontal line on every wall using a water level - very accurate.

Vertical lines - use a Stabila 1800mm level

On Mon, 28 Nov 2005 13:25:41 +0000, Cordless Crazy
wrote:

Cheap lasers are not accurate. Will need to spend 200GBP+

30 quid lasers are more accurate than my tiling. That leaves me 170 quid
to spend on drink and loose women.

"Andy Dingley" wrote in message
...
On Mon, 28 Nov 2005 13:25:41 +0000, Cordless Crazy
wrote:

Cheap lasers are not accurate. Will need to spend 200GBP+

30 quid lasers are more accurate than my tiling.


That leaves me 170 quid
to spend on drink and loose women.

That is Saturday night sorted then.

Adam

[Cordless Crazy]

Originally Posted by Andy Dingley

On Mon, 28 Nov 2005 13:25:41 +0000, Cordless Crazy
wrote:

Cheap lasers are not accurate. Will need to spend 200GBP+

30 quid lasers are more accurate than my tiling. That leaves me 170 quid
to spend on drink and loose women.

That is completely true! I like the cut of your jib!

Screw the tiling!

In article ,
Owain wrote:
For 170 quid you should be able to get a brace of virgins accompanied by
a string quartet.

URL?

--
*Never kick a cow pat on a hot day *

Dave Plowman London SW
To e-mail, change noise into sound.