I'm trying to replicate a Art & Crafts finish and need a pigment
stain that contains Gilsonite (alphaltum or tar). However, any
stain I look at lists no ingrediants at all... So, how do I find
out for sure????

On 9 Oct 2004 15:54:22 -0700, (brian roth)
wrote:

I'm trying to replicate a Art & Crafts finish and need a pigment
stain that contains Gilsonite (alphaltum or tar).

I do use Gilsonite (which you can get from Liberon) but I can't think
of any A&C or even woodstain recipe that uses it. All the times I've
seen it (usually as Asphaltum) it has been for stove-enamel recipes on
metal, such as original Pontypool japan.

A fried recently gave me a Black Mirror, made from bitumen and
Gilsonite on the back of glass.

Avoid "tar" as a description - too many sorts. Some of them are
practically turpentine.

--
Roses are red, violets are blue,
your computer won't boot,
with Service Pack 2

In article , (brian roth) wrote:
I'm trying to replicate a Art & Crafts finish and need a pigment
stain that contains Gilsonite (alphaltum or tar). However, any
stain I look at lists no ingrediants at all... So, how do I find
out for sure????

Phil Laird posted his formula that might be something you can make up
yourself. I haven't seen any posts from him in a long time.

Stuart Johnson
Red Oak, Texas

---------------------------------------------------------

My standard mixture

4lt ( about 1 gal) Mineral turpentine
Small tin of brushable roofing tar ( 250/500g) I use a brand by the name of
"Ormanoid" This is basically runny bitumen used for sealin roofing and
gutters.

Mix some turps and afew dollops of tar together to form a slurry ( into a
2lt icecream container - remove ice cream first!) and pour into container of
turps.
Test for colour - darken by adding more goop - or lighten by adding more
turps.
About half a 500g tin ( thats 250g for those of you that have bother doing
sums ) should give a nice depth of finish to four litres of turps - If that
is more than you are likely to use,adjust accordingly.
Usually it stays in stasis but some sediment will form - I chuck some old
bolts into the container and shake him up a bitty.

This stuff sprays, wipes and brushes with very little wastage. The turps act
to soften and break down the tar goop and as a carrier which evaporates
off - leaving a nice coppery bronzed pigment when applied to light woods -
especilly Pine.

This will take any manner of finish - good with poly or resin based finishes
and remains colour fast.

Remember though if you are spraying it - This is atomised tar , either dont
breath for a goog hour or so, or wear a mask ( organic mist carbon filter
type - you know, a proper one.) The responsibiliy is yours.\

Aveago

Phil

I purchased the Rockler Mission gel stain. A friend of mine that is on the
local historical society said it was the closest stain he's seen to the
original stickly.
And while were on the subject, I saw David Marks the other evening and he
was fuming some white oak with amonia and he said to use Aqua Amonia 26%. I
called several print shops and newspaper and they said they don't use it any
more. I called a blueprinting service and the woman didn't know much but she
said they have #1 amonia 26%. Is that the same thing? I plan on building a
plate rack for SWMBO and was wanting to try fuming the wood.
Thanks, Mike
--

Mike

"brian roth" wrote in message
om...
I'm trying to replicate a Art & Crafts finish and need a pigment
stain that contains Gilsonite (alphaltum or tar). However, any
stain I look at lists no ingrediants at all... So, how do I find
out for sure????

On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 01:11:23 +0100, Andy Dingley
wrote:

On 9 Oct 2004 15:54:22 -0700, (brian roth)
wrote:

I'm trying to replicate a Art & Crafts finish and need a pigment
stain that contains Gilsonite (alphaltum or tar).

I do use Gilsonite (which you can get from Liberon) but I can't think
of any A&C or even woodstain recipe that uses it. All the times I've
seen it (usually as Asphaltum) it has been for stove-enamel recipes on
metal, such as original Pontypool japan.

A fried recently gave me a Black Mirror, made from bitumen and
Gilsonite on the back of glass.

Avoid "tar" as a description - too many sorts. Some of them are
practically turpentine.

One of the woodworking magazines (wood or woodsmith I believe) had an
article on using this to make an arts and crafts look stain. Looked
really good. Although I read it recently, it could have been from
current to 5 years or so ago...I'm a little behind on my reading!

If the OP can't turn it up, email me and I'll scrabble around for it.

Paul


(you know what to leave out)

What or who exactly is "fried".....mjh

"Andy Dingley" wrote in message
...
On 9 Oct 2004 15:54:22 -0700, (brian roth)
wrote:

I'm trying to replicate a Art & Crafts finish and need a pigment
stain that contains Gilsonite (alphaltum or tar).

I do use Gilsonite (which you can get from Liberon) but I can't think
of any A&C or even woodstain recipe that uses it. All the times I've
seen it (usually as Asphaltum) it has been for stove-enamel recipes on
metal, such as original Pontypool japan.

A fried recently gave me a Black Mirror, made from bitumen and
Gilsonite on the back of glass.

Avoid "tar" as a description - too many sorts. Some of them are
practically turpentine.

--
Roses are red, violets are blue,
your computer won't boot,
with Service Pack 2

I use asphaltum all the time and have been for at least the last 30 years .
You never hear about it because it is such a good stain and so cheap the
likes of minwax etc cant compete against it ...........mjh

--
http://members.tripod.com/mikehide2
"brian roth" wrote in message
om...
I'm trying to replicate a Art & Crafts finish and need a pigment
stain that contains Gilsonite (alphaltum or tar). However, any
stain I look at lists no ingrediants at all... So, how do I find
out for sure????

In article IS0ad.363984$Fg5.355603@attbi_s53,
"Mike Hide" wrote:

who exactly is "fried"

One of the threesome: Fried, Toasted and Pickled.

I, personally, haven't seen 'em since my college days.

--
Owen Lowe and his Fly-by-Night Copper Company
____

The problem in this country is that the bar is constantly being lowered;
we then cheer clearing the bar as a great accomplishment and achievment.

In article ,
"Mike S." wrote:

I saw David Marks the other evening and he
was fuming some white oak with amonia and he said to use Aqua Amonia 26%. I
called several print shops and newspaper and they said they don't use it any
more. I called a blueprinting service and the woman didn't know much but she
said they have #1 amonia 26%. Is that the same thing? I plan on building a
plate rack for SWMBO and was wanting to try fuming the wood.

Yep, likely the same thing: Aqueous Ammonia. I got mine at a blueprint
supply. I only bought a gallon and it's lasted several years now. After
the fuming process you can pour any remaining ammonia back into the
container to conserve the stuff.

Be careful when working with it. Wear eye protection and only do it in
an area that, should a spill occur, you and others can evacuate the area
quickly and also ventilate it quickly. Secure all kids and pets out of
the area before uncapping the ammonia. It's nasty stuff - the vapors
when pouring it out and placing the fuming dishes will make you feel
*every* nick and scratch on your body in very short order.

Don't let the warnings scare you away from trying it tho - just use
common sense, eye protection and prepare for accidental spills. Fuming
white oak and cherry is one of my favorite techniques.

--
Owen Lowe and his Fly-by-Night Copper Company
____

The problem in this country is that the bar is constantly being lowered;
we then cheer clearing the bar as a great accomplishment and achievment.

In article , brian
roth wrote:

I'm trying to replicate a Art & Crafts finish and need a pigment
stain that contains Gilsonite (alphaltum or tar). However, any
stain I look at lists no ingrediants at all... So, how do I find
out for sure????
This site has some info about Gilsonite, they claim boiled linseed oil,
Gilsonite and turpentine became Danish Oil. Lots of information on
their information page about finishing, no affiliation.
http://www.homesteadfinishing.com/ht...mentStains.htm

--
http://sawdustmaking.com

Well here goes, Asphaltum has been used for well over a hundred years as far
I know. I buy gallon cans of it and basically a gallon will last a life time
.. Take a dollop put it in a coffee can or similar container and thin it with
mineral spirits, you then have a basic stain the depth of which depends on
the amount of mineral spirits you mix with it.

The color of the stain is pure brown ,no red whatsoever, being mixed with
mineral spirits it is slow drying and thus very easy to work with. You never
see it advertised in paint shops because it is so cheap I suppose they
cannot make a profit on it .

I have used it for thirty odd years ,and it can be used under practically
any finish .

I use it in two ways ,as a basic stain and as a glaze,primarily the latter.
As a stain it will tone mahogany to a walnut color [which is handy because
wide walnut boards are nonexistent these days ] and is good for oak and ash
and walnut as they stay brown [no redness]. As I make mainly antique repros
these days I use it as a glaze to give that antique look . I shun
brutalizing pieces with chains and the like . My process is to stain the
piece with a conventional stain to get the base color you want, then seal
the stain in with a couple of sealer coats ,perhaps shellac or sand and
sealer. Then cover the whole thing in a heavy [dark] coat of asphaltum. Now
wipe it off with a rag, after which you will see that the basic stain color
is a shade or two darker,so bear this in mind when you do the initial basic
staining. what you will be left with is asphaltum stain in the wood pores
and any crevices. You will note that the moldings will be more noticeable
and any details will also show. You can experiment with how much you leave
on the piece so you get the desired effect. let it dry and then overcoat it
with a clear finish . Prior to overcoating if you think it is too dark take
a clean rag with mineral spirits and most will come right off and you can
repeat the process.

I forgot, if you question this procedure take two pieces do it on one and
not the other and you will see the one has that much more depth and
character than the other.

My logic, if you think about it people like antiques because how the look .
most of these pieces have lived in dwellings that have had coal fires in the
winter with the ensuing coal dust .If you ever lived in this environment the
ceilings needed to be repainted almost every year due to the soot generated
by the fire . Every time the furniture was dusted or polished this dust was
ingrained into the surfaces and left in crevices and moldings .......mjh

--
http://members.tripod.com/mikehide2
"Frank Campbell" wrote in message
...
In article , brian
roth wrote:

I'm trying to replicate a Art & Crafts finish and need a pigment
stain that contains Gilsonite (alphaltum or tar). However, any
stain I look at lists no ingrediants at all... So, how do I find
out for sure????
This site has some info about Gilsonite, they claim boiled linseed oil,
Gilsonite and turpentine became Danish Oil. Lots of information on
their information page about finishing, no affiliation.
http://www.homesteadfinishing.com/ht...mentStains.htm

--
http://sawdustmaking.com

mjh responds:


Well here goes, Asphaltum has been used for well over a hundred years as far
I know. I buy gallon cans of it and basically a gallon will last a life time
. Take a dollop put it in a coffee can or similar container and thin it with
mineral spirits, you then have a basic stain the depth of which depends on
the amount of mineral spirits you mix with it.

snip of good treatise.

I'll be trying this as soon as some spare time rears up and bites me.

Thanks.

Charlie Self
"The modern conservative is engaged in one of man's oldest exercises in moral
philosophy; that is, the search for a superior moral justification for
selfishness." John Kenneth Galbraith

The last issue of Woodsmith has an article on Old Fashioned Finishes.

It mentions Asphaltum Varnish Stain, made by "mixing equal parts of
boiled linseed oil and asphaltum varnish. Asphaltum varnish is nothing
more than Gilsonite (asphault) and mineral spirits..."

It then suggests Letterhead Sign Supply as a source for Aspaltum
varnish. www.letterheadsignsupply.com

dickm

On Sun, 10 Oct 2004 06:24:06 GMT, Frank Campbell
wrote:

In article , brian
roth wrote:

I'm trying to replicate a Art & Crafts finish and need a pigment
stain that contains Gilsonite (alphaltum or tar). However, any
stain I look at lists no ingrediants at all... So, how do I find
out for sure????
This site has some info about Gilsonite, they claim boiled linseed oil,
Gilsonite and turpentine became Danish Oil. Lots of information on
their information page about finishing, no affiliation.
http://www.homesteadfinishing.com/ht...mentStains.htm